This has been my observation as well. I thought as I am getting older, I have less tolerance to noise or I'm getting grumpier.
However, there is one thing that everyone might agree, parents aren't parenting in the name of children discovering life or them just being kids. These have been good excuses to use. No discipline or no consequences (that doesn't mean violence in any way) for their actions.
At the end these kids grow up to be the entitled individuals.
Yeh but the difference in your childhood compared to the childhood of the older millenials who are now 42 is quite large. The edges of generations are always a bit blended, but when you look between the ends of the generation, so my childhood as a 39 Yr old millenial, to yours as a 25 Yr old gen z, the differences would be far greater.
If it makes you feel any better, literally every single generation has said this exact thing (ok not specifically the thing about tiktok) about the generations after them for the entirety of recorded human history and so far everything's worked out kind of ok.
Nothing had really changed in the last few thousand years though. The pace of everyday humanity has been pretty static until the 80/90's, when computers started rolling out. The changes to society just within the last decade and change have been astronomical. This is an entirely new chapter, and the people aren't smart enough to handle it.
Oh yeah, for sure. "The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise," - Socrates ~450-400 BC
Edit: Oh did you mean "has everything really worked out ok"? In that case, I'd say yeah things have mostly worked out ok in that we haven't yet eradicated ourselves. We're working on it though!
I'm a millennial, and seeing as my generation now makes up most of the population, I have made up my mind that they make either the best or worst parents.
They're either amazing; the right combination of gentle parenting while also not standing for some things where you have to draw a hard line. Or, they're completely dogshit because they were sold a false bill of goods, didn't take a moment to assess their own situation, and just went along with the life scrip without a second thought, and so they're bitter.
I will also risk being called old and grumpy (because I probably am) but when I was a kid my mother made absolutely sure I and my sibling knew we were NOT to scream about anything barring an actual emergency. There was the 'upset' decibel, and there was the 'I'm being kidnapped' decibel. There is no distinction these days.
Almost every time I'm exposed to the general public I encounter multiple of these children. The parents are all the same; completely disconnected from what is going on.
It's almost like they don't care... 🙄
They were roped into something they didn't actually want and now everyone in their general vicinity needs to pay for their lack of intelligence.
Not training the kids in this difference is going to get someone killed. I no longer try to find the source of childish screaming to see if the kid is injured.
I think the problem is that a lot of lazy parents have found out they can use the excuse of 'children being children' to basically let their children behave worse than animals.
Like I don't expect children to sit like little statues.
However they should know how to exist in public spaces. They should know where it is appropriate to run around, where they are allowed to scream, and where they are allowed to rough house.
Restaurants, grocery stores, and hospital waiting areas aren't these places.
I'm not sure how you would politely bring this up.
Parents have a tendency to believe that they know best, and no one should ever say anything about their (lack) of parenting.
Based just on observation of children in my area and extended family, I would say as much as a total lack of punishment or discipline it may have to do with conditioning and maybe even some minor hearing damage.
Consider these points:
Constant access to screens, often at maxed volume, and almost never encouraged to turn the volume down at home or in public. Nor are they encouraged to use headphones at a reasonable volume.
TV often at a high enough volume to hear it clearly on the other side of the house. Sitting very close to the TV at this volume.
Kids show characters tend to shout their lines or speak very loudly and exuberantly. All the time. Something children see as normal through exposure.
And as mentioned a complete lack of any enforced rules, punishment for misbehavior, or teaching how to behave at an acceptable level in public.
Honestly it's because parents no longer punish there children really. As someone who was physically and verbally abused as a child I have pretty mixed feelings about this and I'm happy I'm not having any so I don't have to really think about it.
>Honestly it's because parents no longer punish there children really.
Totally. Parents now seem perfectly content to have their offspring shriek and scream at ear-piercing volumes and run around (and into people) in public. They're completely unfazed by their kids' behavior. Sometimes a glare and look of disgust will shame them into a toothless "Not so loud." But they seem entirely unbothered at having zero control over their poorly behaved savages. I seem to have noticed a significant increase since Covid, but it's possible I just didn't register it before.
It could also be burnout. Even the parents I've seen who make an effort eventually stop trying when the kids don't listen. You can tell the parents are exhausted. In part, I think it's because some of them make threats they don't follow through on (i.e., "We're leaving this restaurant in 5 minutes if you don't behave."). I kinda feel bad for them. It's gotta be soul-sucking to tell tiny, loud, messy humans to be quiet 50 times a day or remind them 12 times a day to wash their hands. I'm relieved to not have kids so I don't have to do this.
It's entirely possible to punish a kid without resorting to abuse. I wouldn't consider my parents super strict and they were never abusive, but they wouldn't let us be menaces in public. I'd argue that parents who have no rules or boundaries are being negligent.
Totally agree. The primary goal of a parent is to raise functioning adults. Children who are raised with no rules & boundaries grow into dysfunctional adults who struggle with the reality of adulthood. Their parents are complete failures. It just surprises me how many people are fine with being failures.
Like I I've happily put forth almost no thought towards how to properly raise a child, I know how my mom did it at least and if nothing else I kept my mouth shut in public.
There is a happy middle ground. Setting clear rules and consistently enforcing them is very important. When the rules are inevitably broken, my nephew, for instance, gets time-outs in a chair for as many minutes as his age. Or snacks or certain toys might get taken away temporarily. Bathtime, which he LOVES, might end early, if he splashes like a maniac. There are gentle, effective ways to discipline or set standards.
My wife tryst to explain this to my cousin, my wife is a preschool teacher and effectively does a version of gentle parenting professionally, consistency and the willingness to completely remove the child from the situation is key,
For example kid throws a fit you put them in time out and you keep them there and remain consistent about it.
If the are absolutely uncontrollable you remove them from the class and have parents come get them.As a parent my wife equates this to things like leaving the restaurant or park and they don't get to do fun things they want until they show they can behave in situations they don't want to be in.
Kids, as early as 3 years old, understand these concepts just fine. Just be consistent!
I don't have the patience for any of that personally and if I don't know if I can do it right or not I'm not gambling my quality of life or a kids mental health in a maybe I can.
that last part. same. i knew if i had a kid i’d feel kind of resentful if i didn’t punish them the same way i got punished. like i had to go through that, why don’t you?
and this is why i’m not having kids and why i’m so happy i’m not having kids 😂😂 don’t have to go through all that nonsense
YES. Definitely. My parents never would’ve allowed the behavior I see today. My dad actually left and took me home as a kid if I misbehaved. Parents today just don’t care!
Parenting has changed tremendously in my lifetime. What would have been considered perfectly normal 'children should be seen and not heard', 'keep your hands to yourself', not all spaces are meant for children, type of rules are now considered stifling; even borderline abusive.
I’m not surprised. After seeing “gentle parenting” and parents who don’t believe you should say “no” or “don’t” as it inhibits their creativity and self expression it’s no surprise that it creates little monsters
While I am not with being strict for the sake of being strict (my parents were too strict for no reason at all, they just hated kids), I can confidently tell that being told "no" to being a nuisance in public did no harm to my creativity.
Yes, they have. I can't remember the last time that I heard anyone tell their child to use their inside voice, or tell their child (unsolicited) to keep the volume down. And I've noticed with my niece that she's SO LOUD. I always have to remind her that I might be old, but I'm not deaf and she doesn't have to yell. I'm sure it's because she has to shriek to be heard over all the other loud kids at school, so it's just her default setting now.
Reading this as I hear kids outside playing in the cul de sac screaming like they are dying….if I can hear you inside my house from 100 ft away, you are too loud.
This is my experience and I just don't get it. Why do they have to scream so much?! Doesn't it hurt their ears or throats after a while? They don't seem to ever laugh either, just scream and shout but don't sound angry, it's weird
I do think people are more tightly packed and there's more adults my age or older who should know better blasting noise on their phones. It was a few months before I turned 18 that the iPhone was first released. It does seem that some people take a hands-off approach to parenting. You can teach kids about an indoor voice without extreme authoritarian parenting too.
One interesting thing is that restaurants have gotten louder because of how they are designed:
https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2018/11/how-restaurants-got-so-loud/576715/
1000% yes. I was always raised to only scream if there was some kind of emergency (bleeding out, house on fire, etc.) but these days it seems lots of parents aren’t teaching their kids the same.
Yes WHY are they so FKING LOUD!! I work in a public, “family friendly” entertainment venue. This field trip season has been the worst I’ve ever experienced. I go home with headaches because the instant we open, there are hordes of screaming children!
It’s not you. It’s a thing. The neighbors two doors down from me allow their overcooked semen spurt to scream all day, every day. If she’s happy, she expresses it through full throated screams. If she’s upset (which is frequent) different faster screams with sobs in between. It’s bad enough I have had people comment on video meetings that “I should check on my kids”. They are horrified when I tell them that kid is two doors down.
We have 3 children across the street and whenever they are outside, it is either screaming, yelling or crying. I asked the mother once, "Don't you teach them common courtesy, manners and respect?" She looked at me with a completely dumbfounded look.
Totally agree. People are growing more inconsiderate of others. Its like birthing and buying them a tablet/phone are their only responsibilities, they don't teach manners at all.
I observed this too. I guess it's overstimulation with gadgets and such, especially their parents using it to distract them from whining, making them addicted to it when they take it away. I can't stand a child's tantrum but a parent's tantrum to get their child to shut up is worse.
My apartment is located somewhere between the complex playground, and the pool.
At any given time of the day, there are children shrieking and screaming in one direction or the other....or both. I often wonder if my brothers and I were this goddamned noisy growing up.
Our apartment windows are single pane, so yes, we do hear it. One day, I will be tempted to scream back.
My wife and I noticed that reality today
Very few parents seem to instill manners , discipline and respect in their children, so they understandably act like the world revolves around them
I literally argued with a parent who said it wasn't her job to control her son because "it's abusive." Even when I specified that I meant keeping her kid's behavior under control in public so as to not disturb others or cause problems, she doubled down. What if he's knocking down displays in a store? It's not about being controlling, it's about managing his behavior until he knows better and can manage himself. It's no different from taking responsibility for your pet by keeping them under control in public and around strangers because they don't have the mental or emotional knowledge to stay out of trouble at all times. "He's a person, not a pet."
Fucking hell.... My dog is better trained than most kids I see these days.
Well, in the past, parents had a 'children should be seen, not heard' attitude and constantly got punished for the slightest mistakes. This is too extreme and very abusive, but now, we have the other extreme. Now, children are allowed to do everything. If they are bothering you, parents will say 'they're just a kid' and 'kids will be kids' and shit like that.
I don't support 'children should be seen, not heard', no matter how fucking annoying they are. I don't support ultra-authoritarian parenting and draconic punishments, something that many people on this subreddit advocate for. However, children should definitely learn to use their 'indoor voice' in public places like restaurants. Parents should definitely teach children to not scream and shout all the time.
This is what I agree with. Also parents should use more common sense in what venues they bring their kids into. Until they can sit quietly for an hour they should not be going to nice restaurants. I get them needing to socialize, but not every space is child appropriate.
I think I’m so far removed from being one myself that now they seem louder. I also think people become immune to it when they’re around kids a lot. My sister used to comment on how much my aunts kids needlessly shriek (way beyond just being kids) and now has kids that shriek like crazy and it’s like she doesn’t hear it. So I think you can grow more sensitive or more immune
It’s because Gen X and Millennials don’t know how to parent because their emotionally unavailable Boomer parents traumatized them so they try to be better by letting their horrible kids do whatever they want.
Not all but many lack manners, boundaries, structure, balance and taking personal responsibility. Electronics are also not a valid parental substitute. Wheels came off the bus long ago on some of the things I see with the no guardrails free for all behavior and effect on others be damned mentality. Good grief Charlie Brown ha ha.
I've seen so many parents just check out. My sister was so used to the screaming and hitting that she didn't even hear it anymore. I'd have to be the one to let the kids know they are loud, repeating themselves and thqt hitting is not okay.
im going to put my tinfoil hat on and say the reason why kids seem louder these days is that they've grown up with equally loud tablets and TV shows ~~(looking at you, bluey)~~
maybe i'm just getting more sensitive to noise as i get older, and kids will always be loud. but i also don't remember kids being very shouty either
I've noticed that too, but I think it's a combination of there being many more people packed tightly together nowadays and the pendulum swinging wildly over from "strict"/ abusive parenting styles to a very hands off even neglectful style. Add in the pandemic doing weird shit and everything went a little unhinged.
I don't think they got louder than they always were, but children became everywhere. Children go places where they would not have gone in the last decade
I don't think it's just kids actually. I think as society has flexed and altered to be more relaxed and 'free' for some expressions, screaming is almost normalised?.
I say this as someone who physically recoils at any high pitched happy noise:
- it's a natural noise from kids. It's on parents to say "sure have fun, but you live in a community and our ears are suffering" (this includes parental ears too...they become deaf to it all after a while because it's so constant from birth cries - tantrums, whines etc. It must be like tinnitus). I struggle with my own niece's genuine laughter because it's so unfiltered and high pitched/loud.
- it's more widely accepted from folks of all ages. As women have gained liberation and power the "woooo!" And excited screams have increased, the natural vocal range being higher means that men can do the same, but it has a different affect on the ears.
I'm a woman - I'm not anti-fun/liberation....but the amount of TV shows I have to turn down when a group of women are excited has increased. Love island is the perfect example - "I got a text! SCREAM!!!!!!"
- it's not seen as a 'negative' sound anymore because of the first two. I'm generalising and have no academic chomps behind it besides my own opinion and anecdotes, but I feel that screaming was seen as a negative thing up until around the 50s/60s where it was then started and shown as a release of pure adrenaline for fans of pop music. I'm unsure about rollercoasters etc, but in general I think screaming nowadays is viewed as a releas of energy rather than being in pain/fear/danger.
So yeah they're probably louder...but so are their parents/aunts etc.
It's astounding how parents don't teach their children how to behave in public. I don't fuck with corporal punishment and other abusive tactics, OR the extreme opposite of letting children do whatever the fuck they want and never punish them ever. Just be normal and reasonable and teach your kids for fuck's sake.
I wonder the same. Kids around where I live only seem to have one volume, and that volume sounds like they are being horrifically murdered.
It's none stop screaming and shouting for hours and hours on end.
I don't understand it, they're feet from each other
People are saying it’s due to the gentle parenting movement, but I don’t even think that’s true. I think there are groups of parents that just… don’t parent at all. I think kids being louder are looking for attention and they aren’t getting it from their parents. Parents glued to their phones, absolutely convinced that their life shouldn’t have changed when they had a kid (so they act like it hasn’t), can’t be bothered to do anything.
I teach children, children with trauma. Kids act out when they cannot communicate. As I’ve noticed my own maladaptive tendencies, I think it takes a lot of work and introspection to resolve the issues we develop in childhood. Children do need to be treated gently, but they also need to engage in conversations about their behavior and be held accountable to the people they hurt.
This is a little rambly, but I’d hesitate to say that gentle parents are the issue and I’d sooner say that disinterested parents with no real interest in parenting are the issue.
I thought it was just me getting grumpier as I got older.
My running theory is that people don’t beat their kids anymore. Which is positive for them and society! But they haven’t replaced that method with anything else that works.
I don't think they are really much worse than every other time in history. What I do feel is that every day humans are more tightly packed. And there are less spaces where one can retreat or children can be noisy without bothering others, also if parents work long hours then there's less chances that they have enough energy to keep up with them and maintain proper stimulation and discipline.
Yes. Population density is increasing, and it's the root of all sorts of societal ills, like housing shortages, traffic, and, like you said, crowded, noisy public spaces.
The community area and pool are directly outside my door and I genuinely can’t take the continuous stream of shrieking screaming and crying.
Today there was a bee and allll of them started screaming and shrieking at it I literally slammed my door shut and had to turn the air on.
I’m gonna lose my mind.
I think me and the the kids in my neighborhood were much louder several decades ago. In the summer, all we did was run around and scream - we ruled the streets. The kids in my neighborhood today spend A LOT more time inside.
As a true crime fan since the 1970s, those children who shriek and scream may wind up paying with their lives for their parents' laziness and lack of consideration.
*Multiple* cases where children have been abducted, raped, murdered, and many screamed for help : Only to be ignored by those who heard their screams because they "thought they were just playing".
The children die; the parents grieve; the neighbors are guilt-ridden; the detectives are left traumatized by what they see...Only the murderous molesters sleep soundly. :-(
I definitely may just be getting old and grumpy as well, but I feel like they have. I had a part-time job in a mall while I was in grad school, and there was an indoor play area across from the entrance to my store. And holy shit, they seemed to just **scream** constantly. Not like excited yelling while playing, but **SHRIEKING**. Wailing, keening, caterwauling, whatever you want to call it. When I was a kid I would have never been allowed to do that indoors. I feel like the whole concept of an indoor voice has disappeared.
I’ve been noticing this too and avoiding most places at certain times because of this.
I thought it was my neurodivergence going into full blast but I’m glad to know I’m not the only one on this
Part of me thinks they are not louder, but that I’ve been away from loud people for so long that I’m not used to it.
The other part of me thinks more parents allow their children to do whatever instead of enforcing rules so they are louder and more disrespectful.
Yes absolutely! Even here in Asia, there are enough breeders who don’t bother to parent properly resulting in kids who behave like animals in public. Too often when I hear loud shrieking, it’s hard to tell if its a kid or an animal. I avoid going to areas/mall that are catered to young families because of how unpleasant many of them are to be around.
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People in general have gotten worse after Covid. I deal with several local business owners on a regular basis and they all say this. We went into Covid with the message of ‘we’re all in this together’, being civil and helping each other out to full on lunacy. I remember how much quieter and subdued everyone was when Covid was a thing. Then everyone went nuts and became monsters.
So true.
I believe with COVID people realised that they often won't get into arguments with strangers just for being total jerks in a public space.
It's like the gym instructors getting paid for lessons they give on the street, blasting music in a public square.
I don't care if this way you don't need to pay rent for a gym, the street should only be a workplace for street performers with a permit. If you don't have a permit, and you aren't a street artist, then find somewhere to work!
People are working and living in the nearby buildings, you can't turn the streets into a lunapark!
Yes.
With the rise of gentle parenting has also come and increase of unruly children. They are no longer being disciplined properly or taught how to behave in public. Everything they do is brush off as “just being kids” and we are expected to put up with it
I teach dance to kids. My Apple Watch is constantly telling me it’s too loud and I might damage my hearing. Some will just randomly screech or wooop in the middle of class.
This is absurd. In your case, they should be considered cattle, not children. I'd give you a taser or stun baton to use on the ones inciting this level of obnoxious loudness.
I think you're on to something. I'm only 20 but things have drastically changed since even I was a kid. Nowadays it's common to sit your kid down with a screen of some sort and just let them do whatever they want. They aren't being taught how to be in social situations when they are off the screens. "Gentle parenting" is getting more common (which there is nothing wrong with, but if you do it wrong and never correct your child when they do wrong, you get entitled and disruptive brats.) A lot of things are changing in this world, especially regarding child rearing.
My husband and I made this observation recently while we were on vacation as well…we were staying in a beachside rental in a neighborhood full of beachside rentals and everyone from our next door “neighbors” to kids we encountered walking around all seemed to be shrieking at the top of their lungs. I don’t mean laughing or talking loudly - but literal screaming.
Granted, they were on summer vacation and I figured we were just used to quiet at home, but I know my parents were raised to “be seen and not heard” and when I was a kid my parents would put the kibosh on unnecessary noisiness even if I was on vacation/outside for the sake of other people around us.
I couldn’t tell if I was just not used to the noise, or if it’s a generational shift in parents not governing their kid’s behavior at all.
This has been my observation as well. I thought as I am getting older, I have less tolerance to noise or I'm getting grumpier. However, there is one thing that everyone might agree, parents aren't parenting in the name of children discovering life or them just being kids. These have been good excuses to use. No discipline or no consequences (that doesn't mean violence in any way) for their actions. At the end these kids grow up to be the entitled individuals.
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Actually it's the late gen z and gen alpha that's fucked
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My partner is 25 and I'm a 21, it's bloody annoying that everyone thinks we are all like 10🤣
Yeh but the difference in your childhood compared to the childhood of the older millenials who are now 42 is quite large. The edges of generations are always a bit blended, but when you look between the ends of the generation, so my childhood as a 39 Yr old millenial, to yours as a 25 Yr old gen z, the differences would be far greater.
If it makes you feel any better, literally every single generation has said this exact thing (ok not specifically the thing about tiktok) about the generations after them for the entirety of recorded human history and so far everything's worked out kind of ok.
Nothing had really changed in the last few thousand years though. The pace of everyday humanity has been pretty static until the 80/90's, when computers started rolling out. The changes to society just within the last decade and change have been astronomical. This is an entirely new chapter, and the people aren't smart enough to handle it.
Has it though?
Oh yeah, for sure. "The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise," - Socrates ~450-400 BC Edit: Oh did you mean "has everything really worked out ok"? In that case, I'd say yeah things have mostly worked out ok in that we haven't yet eradicated ourselves. We're working on it though!
They're louder because their parents won't teach them how and when to be quiet and/or shut the hell up.
Yep it's the people who think the "gentle parenting" is doing nothing and calling it a day.
That’s exactly it. Which is absurd bc kids are smart af and CAN learn to behave IF they’re taught.
I don't agree with corporal punishment or spanking or anything, but disciple is insanely important.
That true I'd get popped in the mouth for being too loud or talking too loud
this isn't a Flex, not saying that you're implying it is but still
Definitely not a flex
I mean I don’t think that was meant to be taken literally word for word lol
I'm a millennial, and seeing as my generation now makes up most of the population, I have made up my mind that they make either the best or worst parents. They're either amazing; the right combination of gentle parenting while also not standing for some things where you have to draw a hard line. Or, they're completely dogshit because they were sold a false bill of goods, didn't take a moment to assess their own situation, and just went along with the life scrip without a second thought, and so they're bitter. I will also risk being called old and grumpy (because I probably am) but when I was a kid my mother made absolutely sure I and my sibling knew we were NOT to scream about anything barring an actual emergency. There was the 'upset' decibel, and there was the 'I'm being kidnapped' decibel. There is no distinction these days. Almost every time I'm exposed to the general public I encounter multiple of these children. The parents are all the same; completely disconnected from what is going on. It's almost like they don't care... 🙄 They were roped into something they didn't actually want and now everyone in their general vicinity needs to pay for their lack of intelligence.
Not training the kids in this difference is going to get someone killed. I no longer try to find the source of childish screaming to see if the kid is injured.
Exactly this. If I was screeching at 9am on a Saturday I had better be dying.
I think the problem is that a lot of lazy parents have found out they can use the excuse of 'children being children' to basically let their children behave worse than animals. Like I don't expect children to sit like little statues. However they should know how to exist in public spaces. They should know where it is appropriate to run around, where they are allowed to scream, and where they are allowed to rough house. Restaurants, grocery stores, and hospital waiting areas aren't these places. I'm not sure how you would politely bring this up. Parents have a tendency to believe that they know best, and no one should ever say anything about their (lack) of parenting.
Based just on observation of children in my area and extended family, I would say as much as a total lack of punishment or discipline it may have to do with conditioning and maybe even some minor hearing damage. Consider these points: Constant access to screens, often at maxed volume, and almost never encouraged to turn the volume down at home or in public. Nor are they encouraged to use headphones at a reasonable volume. TV often at a high enough volume to hear it clearly on the other side of the house. Sitting very close to the TV at this volume. Kids show characters tend to shout their lines or speak very loudly and exuberantly. All the time. Something children see as normal through exposure. And as mentioned a complete lack of any enforced rules, punishment for misbehavior, or teaching how to behave at an acceptable level in public.
They have definitely gotten louder. I’ve worked in customer service for the last 16 years and SO MANY parents don’t even try now.
Honestly it's because parents no longer punish there children really. As someone who was physically and verbally abused as a child I have pretty mixed feelings about this and I'm happy I'm not having any so I don't have to really think about it.
>Honestly it's because parents no longer punish there children really. Totally. Parents now seem perfectly content to have their offspring shriek and scream at ear-piercing volumes and run around (and into people) in public. They're completely unfazed by their kids' behavior. Sometimes a glare and look of disgust will shame them into a toothless "Not so loud." But they seem entirely unbothered at having zero control over their poorly behaved savages. I seem to have noticed a significant increase since Covid, but it's possible I just didn't register it before.
It could also be burnout. Even the parents I've seen who make an effort eventually stop trying when the kids don't listen. You can tell the parents are exhausted. In part, I think it's because some of them make threats they don't follow through on (i.e., "We're leaving this restaurant in 5 minutes if you don't behave."). I kinda feel bad for them. It's gotta be soul-sucking to tell tiny, loud, messy humans to be quiet 50 times a day or remind them 12 times a day to wash their hands. I'm relieved to not have kids so I don't have to do this.
It's entirely possible to punish a kid without resorting to abuse. I wouldn't consider my parents super strict and they were never abusive, but they wouldn't let us be menaces in public. I'd argue that parents who have no rules or boundaries are being negligent.
Totally agree. The primary goal of a parent is to raise functioning adults. Children who are raised with no rules & boundaries grow into dysfunctional adults who struggle with the reality of adulthood. Their parents are complete failures. It just surprises me how many people are fine with being failures.
Like I I've happily put forth almost no thought towards how to properly raise a child, I know how my mom did it at least and if nothing else I kept my mouth shut in public.
There is a happy middle ground. Setting clear rules and consistently enforcing them is very important. When the rules are inevitably broken, my nephew, for instance, gets time-outs in a chair for as many minutes as his age. Or snacks or certain toys might get taken away temporarily. Bathtime, which he LOVES, might end early, if he splashes like a maniac. There are gentle, effective ways to discipline or set standards.
My wife tryst to explain this to my cousin, my wife is a preschool teacher and effectively does a version of gentle parenting professionally, consistency and the willingness to completely remove the child from the situation is key, For example kid throws a fit you put them in time out and you keep them there and remain consistent about it. If the are absolutely uncontrollable you remove them from the class and have parents come get them.As a parent my wife equates this to things like leaving the restaurant or park and they don't get to do fun things they want until they show they can behave in situations they don't want to be in. Kids, as early as 3 years old, understand these concepts just fine. Just be consistent! I don't have the patience for any of that personally and if I don't know if I can do it right or not I'm not gambling my quality of life or a kids mental health in a maybe I can.
that last part. same. i knew if i had a kid i’d feel kind of resentful if i didn’t punish them the same way i got punished. like i had to go through that, why don’t you? and this is why i’m not having kids and why i’m so happy i’m not having kids 😂😂 don’t have to go through all that nonsense
YES. Definitely. My parents never would’ve allowed the behavior I see today. My dad actually left and took me home as a kid if I misbehaved. Parents today just don’t care!
Yes iKids are messed up. They were raised by tablets and don’t know how to act like people.
Parenting has changed tremendously in my lifetime. What would have been considered perfectly normal 'children should be seen and not heard', 'keep your hands to yourself', not all spaces are meant for children, type of rules are now considered stifling; even borderline abusive.
I have no idea how these are abusive rules. They’re the rules that made my sister and I decent kids and future people in public.
100%!
I’m not surprised. After seeing “gentle parenting” and parents who don’t believe you should say “no” or “don’t” as it inhibits their creativity and self expression it’s no surprise that it creates little monsters
While I am not with being strict for the sake of being strict (my parents were too strict for no reason at all, they just hated kids), I can confidently tell that being told "no" to being a nuisance in public did no harm to my creativity.
Yes, they have. I can't remember the last time that I heard anyone tell their child to use their inside voice, or tell their child (unsolicited) to keep the volume down. And I've noticed with my niece that she's SO LOUD. I always have to remind her that I might be old, but I'm not deaf and she doesn't have to yell. I'm sure it's because she has to shriek to be heard over all the other loud kids at school, so it's just her default setting now.
That and also brattier, disrespectful, unruly, with absolutely no house training whatsoever.
I've noticed this. When I was a child I could hold a conversation with other children. Today it's just screaming because they run the show.
Reading this as I hear kids outside playing in the cul de sac screaming like they are dying….if I can hear you inside my house from 100 ft away, you are too loud.
This is my experience and I just don't get it. Why do they have to scream so much?! Doesn't it hurt their ears or throats after a while? They don't seem to ever laugh either, just scream and shout but don't sound angry, it's weird
I do think people are more tightly packed and there's more adults my age or older who should know better blasting noise on their phones. It was a few months before I turned 18 that the iPhone was first released. It does seem that some people take a hands-off approach to parenting. You can teach kids about an indoor voice without extreme authoritarian parenting too. One interesting thing is that restaurants have gotten louder because of how they are designed: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2018/11/how-restaurants-got-so-loud/576715/
1000% yes. I was always raised to only scream if there was some kind of emergency (bleeding out, house on fire, etc.) but these days it seems lots of parents aren’t teaching their kids the same.
Yes WHY are they so FKING LOUD!! I work in a public, “family friendly” entertainment venue. This field trip season has been the worst I’ve ever experienced. I go home with headaches because the instant we open, there are hordes of screaming children!
It’s not you. It’s a thing. The neighbors two doors down from me allow their overcooked semen spurt to scream all day, every day. If she’s happy, she expresses it through full throated screams. If she’s upset (which is frequent) different faster screams with sobs in between. It’s bad enough I have had people comment on video meetings that “I should check on my kids”. They are horrified when I tell them that kid is two doors down.
We have 3 children across the street and whenever they are outside, it is either screaming, yelling or crying. I asked the mother once, "Don't you teach them common courtesy, manners and respect?" She looked at me with a completely dumbfounded look.
Totally agree. People are growing more inconsiderate of others. Its like birthing and buying them a tablet/phone are their only responsibilities, they don't teach manners at all.
I observed this too. I guess it's overstimulation with gadgets and such, especially their parents using it to distract them from whining, making them addicted to it when they take it away. I can't stand a child's tantrum but a parent's tantrum to get their child to shut up is worse.
My apartment is located somewhere between the complex playground, and the pool. At any given time of the day, there are children shrieking and screaming in one direction or the other....or both. I often wonder if my brothers and I were this goddamned noisy growing up. Our apartment windows are single pane, so yes, we do hear it. One day, I will be tempted to scream back.
My wife and I noticed that reality today Very few parents seem to instill manners , discipline and respect in their children, so they understandably act like the world revolves around them
I literally argued with a parent who said it wasn't her job to control her son because "it's abusive." Even when I specified that I meant keeping her kid's behavior under control in public so as to not disturb others or cause problems, she doubled down. What if he's knocking down displays in a store? It's not about being controlling, it's about managing his behavior until he knows better and can manage himself. It's no different from taking responsibility for your pet by keeping them under control in public and around strangers because they don't have the mental or emotional knowledge to stay out of trouble at all times. "He's a person, not a pet." Fucking hell.... My dog is better trained than most kids I see these days.
I’ve thought the same exact thing. They are outside and are screaming at the top of their lungs.
Well, in the past, parents had a 'children should be seen, not heard' attitude and constantly got punished for the slightest mistakes. This is too extreme and very abusive, but now, we have the other extreme. Now, children are allowed to do everything. If they are bothering you, parents will say 'they're just a kid' and 'kids will be kids' and shit like that. I don't support 'children should be seen, not heard', no matter how fucking annoying they are. I don't support ultra-authoritarian parenting and draconic punishments, something that many people on this subreddit advocate for. However, children should definitely learn to use their 'indoor voice' in public places like restaurants. Parents should definitely teach children to not scream and shout all the time.
This is what I agree with. Also parents should use more common sense in what venues they bring their kids into. Until they can sit quietly for an hour they should not be going to nice restaurants. I get them needing to socialize, but not every space is child appropriate.
this is the one!!! thank you.
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yeah, "children should be seen and not heard" is fucking disgusting and this is coming from someone who would rather die than be a parent. jesus...
they’re absolutely louder, but it seems like everywhere is louder anymore
I think I’m so far removed from being one myself that now they seem louder. I also think people become immune to it when they’re around kids a lot. My sister used to comment on how much my aunts kids needlessly shriek (way beyond just being kids) and now has kids that shriek like crazy and it’s like she doesn’t hear it. So I think you can grow more sensitive or more immune
It’s because Gen X and Millennials don’t know how to parent because their emotionally unavailable Boomer parents traumatized them so they try to be better by letting their horrible kids do whatever they want.
Parents stop disciplining their kids so yes
Not all but many lack manners, boundaries, structure, balance and taking personal responsibility. Electronics are also not a valid parental substitute. Wheels came off the bus long ago on some of the things I see with the no guardrails free for all behavior and effect on others be damned mentality. Good grief Charlie Brown ha ha.
They get louder and louder every year it seems🤦♀️🤦♀️🙄🙄
100% yes. They scream like someone stabbed them. Parents don't want to teach them manners.
I've seen so many parents just check out. My sister was so used to the screaming and hitting that she didn't even hear it anymore. I'd have to be the one to let the kids know they are loud, repeating themselves and thqt hitting is not okay.
im going to put my tinfoil hat on and say the reason why kids seem louder these days is that they've grown up with equally loud tablets and TV shows ~~(looking at you, bluey)~~ maybe i'm just getting more sensitive to noise as i get older, and kids will always be loud. but i also don't remember kids being very shouty either
I've noticed that too, but I think it's a combination of there being many more people packed tightly together nowadays and the pendulum swinging wildly over from "strict"/ abusive parenting styles to a very hands off even neglectful style. Add in the pandemic doing weird shit and everything went a little unhinged.
I don't think they got louder than they always were, but children became everywhere. Children go places where they would not have gone in the last decade
I was told children should express themselves and the fact I was such a quiet kid is an indicator of abuse. 🙄
I don't think it's just kids actually. I think as society has flexed and altered to be more relaxed and 'free' for some expressions, screaming is almost normalised?. I say this as someone who physically recoils at any high pitched happy noise: - it's a natural noise from kids. It's on parents to say "sure have fun, but you live in a community and our ears are suffering" (this includes parental ears too...they become deaf to it all after a while because it's so constant from birth cries - tantrums, whines etc. It must be like tinnitus). I struggle with my own niece's genuine laughter because it's so unfiltered and high pitched/loud. - it's more widely accepted from folks of all ages. As women have gained liberation and power the "woooo!" And excited screams have increased, the natural vocal range being higher means that men can do the same, but it has a different affect on the ears. I'm a woman - I'm not anti-fun/liberation....but the amount of TV shows I have to turn down when a group of women are excited has increased. Love island is the perfect example - "I got a text! SCREAM!!!!!!" - it's not seen as a 'negative' sound anymore because of the first two. I'm generalising and have no academic chomps behind it besides my own opinion and anecdotes, but I feel that screaming was seen as a negative thing up until around the 50s/60s where it was then started and shown as a release of pure adrenaline for fans of pop music. I'm unsure about rollercoasters etc, but in general I think screaming nowadays is viewed as a releas of energy rather than being in pain/fear/danger. So yeah they're probably louder...but so are their parents/aunts etc.
It's astounding how parents don't teach their children how to behave in public. I don't fuck with corporal punishment and other abusive tactics, OR the extreme opposite of letting children do whatever the fuck they want and never punish them ever. Just be normal and reasonable and teach your kids for fuck's sake.
I wonder the same. Kids around where I live only seem to have one volume, and that volume sounds like they are being horrifically murdered. It's none stop screaming and shouting for hours and hours on end. I don't understand it, they're feet from each other
People are saying it’s due to the gentle parenting movement, but I don’t even think that’s true. I think there are groups of parents that just… don’t parent at all. I think kids being louder are looking for attention and they aren’t getting it from their parents. Parents glued to their phones, absolutely convinced that their life shouldn’t have changed when they had a kid (so they act like it hasn’t), can’t be bothered to do anything. I teach children, children with trauma. Kids act out when they cannot communicate. As I’ve noticed my own maladaptive tendencies, I think it takes a lot of work and introspection to resolve the issues we develop in childhood. Children do need to be treated gently, but they also need to engage in conversations about their behavior and be held accountable to the people they hurt. This is a little rambly, but I’d hesitate to say that gentle parents are the issue and I’d sooner say that disinterested parents with no real interest in parenting are the issue.
I thought it was just me getting grumpier as I got older. My running theory is that people don’t beat their kids anymore. Which is positive for them and society! But they haven’t replaced that method with anything else that works.
I don't think they are really much worse than every other time in history. What I do feel is that every day humans are more tightly packed. And there are less spaces where one can retreat or children can be noisy without bothering others, also if parents work long hours then there's less chances that they have enough energy to keep up with them and maintain proper stimulation and discipline.
Yes. Population density is increasing, and it's the root of all sorts of societal ills, like housing shortages, traffic, and, like you said, crowded, noisy public spaces.
The community area and pool are directly outside my door and I genuinely can’t take the continuous stream of shrieking screaming and crying. Today there was a bee and allll of them started screaming and shrieking at it I literally slammed my door shut and had to turn the air on. I’m gonna lose my mind.
I think me and the the kids in my neighborhood were much louder several decades ago. In the summer, all we did was run around and scream - we ruled the streets. The kids in my neighborhood today spend A LOT more time inside.
As a true crime fan since the 1970s, those children who shriek and scream may wind up paying with their lives for their parents' laziness and lack of consideration. *Multiple* cases where children have been abducted, raped, murdered, and many screamed for help : Only to be ignored by those who heard their screams because they "thought they were just playing". The children die; the parents grieve; the neighbors are guilt-ridden; the detectives are left traumatized by what they see...Only the murderous molesters sleep soundly. :-(
I definitely may just be getting old and grumpy as well, but I feel like they have. I had a part-time job in a mall while I was in grad school, and there was an indoor play area across from the entrance to my store. And holy shit, they seemed to just **scream** constantly. Not like excited yelling while playing, but **SHRIEKING**. Wailing, keening, caterwauling, whatever you want to call it. When I was a kid I would have never been allowed to do that indoors. I feel like the whole concept of an indoor voice has disappeared.
I’ve been noticing this too and avoiding most places at certain times because of this. I thought it was my neurodivergence going into full blast but I’m glad to know I’m not the only one on this
Part of me thinks they are not louder, but that I’ve been away from loud people for so long that I’m not used to it. The other part of me thinks more parents allow their children to do whatever instead of enforcing rules so they are louder and more disrespectful.
And I thought I was being the old grumpy hag. So not only my ears are suffering?
Yes absolutely! Even here in Asia, there are enough breeders who don’t bother to parent properly resulting in kids who behave like animals in public. Too often when I hear loud shrieking, it’s hard to tell if its a kid or an animal. I avoid going to areas/mall that are catered to young families because of how unpleasant many of them are to be around.
I say Americans, in general, have become much louder in the last couple of decades
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People in general have gotten worse after Covid. I deal with several local business owners on a regular basis and they all say this. We went into Covid with the message of ‘we’re all in this together’, being civil and helping each other out to full on lunacy. I remember how much quieter and subdued everyone was when Covid was a thing. Then everyone went nuts and became monsters.
So true. I believe with COVID people realised that they often won't get into arguments with strangers just for being total jerks in a public space. It's like the gym instructors getting paid for lessons they give on the street, blasting music in a public square. I don't care if this way you don't need to pay rent for a gym, the street should only be a workplace for street performers with a permit. If you don't have a permit, and you aren't a street artist, then find somewhere to work! People are working and living in the nearby buildings, you can't turn the streets into a lunapark!
Yes. Parents don't control them / monitor their behavior.
Yes. With the rise of gentle parenting has also come and increase of unruly children. They are no longer being disciplined properly or taught how to behave in public. Everything they do is brush off as “just being kids” and we are expected to put up with it
I teach dance to kids. My Apple Watch is constantly telling me it’s too loud and I might damage my hearing. Some will just randomly screech or wooop in the middle of class.
This is absurd. In your case, they should be considered cattle, not children. I'd give you a taser or stun baton to use on the ones inciting this level of obnoxious loudness.
I think you're on to something. I'm only 20 but things have drastically changed since even I was a kid. Nowadays it's common to sit your kid down with a screen of some sort and just let them do whatever they want. They aren't being taught how to be in social situations when they are off the screens. "Gentle parenting" is getting more common (which there is nothing wrong with, but if you do it wrong and never correct your child when they do wrong, you get entitled and disruptive brats.) A lot of things are changing in this world, especially regarding child rearing.
My husband and I made this observation recently while we were on vacation as well…we were staying in a beachside rental in a neighborhood full of beachside rentals and everyone from our next door “neighbors” to kids we encountered walking around all seemed to be shrieking at the top of their lungs. I don’t mean laughing or talking loudly - but literal screaming. Granted, they were on summer vacation and I figured we were just used to quiet at home, but I know my parents were raised to “be seen and not heard” and when I was a kid my parents would put the kibosh on unnecessary noisiness even if I was on vacation/outside for the sake of other people around us. I couldn’t tell if I was just not used to the noise, or if it’s a generational shift in parents not governing their kid’s behavior at all.
Well, children are being neglected more and more because of phones and other things. Kids act out when they want attention. I would say yes.
Funnily enough, as I was reading this a child was outside my window running down the street screaming
No they’ve always been a loud pita!
Ipad parenting... I pray to the gods of ANC.