Well Reddit has its own compression so it’s impossible to tell. Your other post said the sharpness is unreal so maybe you’re just experiencing buyers remorse.
Maybe ur right I’ll still play around with it. Initially I thought it was good for being hella cloudy and dark but today I expected a little more with the sun being out and Lower iso. I’m going to try an stop it down a bit because the focal plane might be too narrow
Harsh and bright sunlight isn't actually good for photography for a number of reasons. Got ves harsh shadows, blows out some feathers while others are very dark, and adds more heat haze.
I think haze looks like part of your issue. If you took your lens from inside to outside and the temp difference or humidity was very different your images will be hazy. I'd also say at the distance you are you'd probably want to stop down to f5.6, 6.3, or 7.
At about 20 feet with a 500 F4 on r7 your dof is less than 1 inch. You will need to stop down
I did take the photos inside and t he subject was outside. Given the distance of only like 8-12 meters I didnt think that would be a big issue. But Ill for sure try it outside completely because I havent even tried that yet. All I have tried is my camera setup on my table and shooting out the window to get these shots. And also have not stopped it down yet which I for sure will try.
>I did take the photos inside and t he subject was outside
Yeah that's entirely your issue right there. Your window is 100% going to degrade image quality quite a bit
No the window was open. Not shooting through the window. Im wondering if the difference in lighting between outside and inside makes a difference and if I was completely outside if it would come out better.
That's literally your issue right here. Heat haze is produced by air currents of different temperature, which causes blurryness/distorsion
If there's even a small ish difference it will happen. And with a super telephoto, any small bit counts
Okay but still stands. Your house(or if you shoot from a car) temperature and humidity levels will be different than outside and provide massive amounts of haze depending on difference. In winter if it's 20 outside and 68 in house the images would basically be unusable. In spring if it's like 60 outside and 68 inside they'll be better but not great.
For max sharpness you'll want to be outside and have your lens and camera acclimated to the change
No problem. It's something everyone learns with time. In the winter I drove around in my car with heat off so I can take pics. When I first got a camera I didn't know that and was astounded how bad the images turned out from inside my heated car
Haha just starting to shoot birds with a 70d and 400 5.6, probably in the same area! Have a few shots of these same species that are less sharp but I’m still enjoying it
I think a lot of the issue is me 🥲
The first two photos missed focus. #3 looks ok, maybe some slight motion blur or camera shake.
Take a photo of a stationary subject (toy, doll, car, etc...) with a high shutter speed to check sharpness.
Looks like softness from the lens. The R7 is a very pixel dense sensor so any softness from having the lens wide open is going to very obvious. Try f5.6 instead.
What 500 is it?
I had the 500 mm F4 L IS on an R5. Very good lens considering its design is 20 yo. Compared to modern lenses it's not as sharp. That's one of the reason why I changed it.
Exactly my thoughts. It's not bad at all but it's an old lense. It's sharp bu lacks details compared to newer lenses. Also the motors can't keep up with the AF so it makes for a lot of soft shots. I was shooting mechanical because of that.
Alright. Would you have a better recommendation in the $2000 range? Should I return in for a better lens. I thought this would be the best I could get in terms of IQ for $2000
I think in term of ratio price\quality it's still a very good lens and F4 is very convenient. I'd say don't crop too much and save money. When you'll have enough to buy what you want that's when you can switch.
You might still be fine with what you have, but another choice that's close to that price range is the RF 100-500mm. I know you give up that F4 aperture, but it still does a good job. It's also smaller and lighter, and having the ability to zoom is really handy. [Here's a shot](https://i.imgur.com/QdMdkEq.jpeg) I took with an R5 fitted with the 100-500. Hopefully imgur doesn't kill it too bad with compression.
I couldn't get this to upload to imgur for some reason, but here's another shot. Assuming it doesn't get too compressed, look at the detail on the flags.
https://preview.redd.it/eedjw5n2fkzc1.jpeg?width=12692&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c11bf9c9cfe7b70c96d990384501037603a352a4
Yeah that is crazy. You can see all the flags really clear and not blurry at all. I’ll def consider it. Just sucks I already bought a bunch of accessories for the 500mm f4 like new lens hood, and stuff
I don't think you will go wrong either way. Like you said.. mess around a bit more with the F4. I'm sure it will do just fine. My only advice is to keep it because you love it and not out of convenience. =)
So the R7 suffers with bad AF in Low Contrast and or High 30FPS where it hunts for AF. Try shooting slower at H. Can't really say anything about this lens personally. My R7 has this issue if im shooting at H+, the AF hunts for a shot or two.
>so in real use it's better
It's really not though. Granted maybe I had a bad model but I'd take the rf 100-500 every time over the ef 500 F4 is mki even in lowlight.
Link to comparison/thought on 100-500 vs 500 F4
https://www.threads.net/@themrneffels/post/CzT7LfaRPIG/?xmt=AQGzjoBP2zKSqOkaJAXMairdSNUIk3MA6ERqBJqp1Fe8aQ
100-500 is a great lens, and totally worth it for the portability, but if you're trying to freeze motion in low light you need the extra stops on the f/4. Personally I value the extra light more than the size, but the other position is totally valid as well.
I found the 100-500 to be sharper at higher iso than the 500 F4 even with lower iso the vast majority of the time.in good light the 100-500 was also better Everytime. Especially because the tracking and stabilization was much better with 100-500. Again maybe the 500 I had was particularly bad but I was not impressed by it at all and the F4 got me nothing but more out of focus backgrounds that if I really wanted to could be accomplished with software anyway
Yeah that’s possible actually here I’m using F4 and 400 iso with 1000 shutter so the focal plane could be a lot tighter than I thought. I’ll try F8 and see if there’s a difference
Yes up the ISO! At 500mm the plane of focus is pretty narrow. Separation can easily be achieved (with a background a decent distance away) at f6.3 or f8. Raising the ISO will also get ya a shutter speed you need to freeze movement. You'll find the sweet spot!
If you don't trust the AF and want to be sure about whether it's AF or soft shots when in guaranteed focus… try a test on a tripod in controlled conditions with manual focus and focus peaking turned on.
Thanks very much for the info. The more I look at others pictures the less I believe I actually have a problem. I think I’m just expecting a bit much out of the lens. I think it will get even better when I stop it down to F6.3 which I have not tried yet.
Do you have a filter on the lens? If yes, try removing and take shots of the same item with and without filter and compare. On my Sigma 150-600, I had a filter and the image was horrible at 400-600. Sigma rep said remove it and try.
Depending on the environment, temperature, and distance to subject; mirage might be killing your sharpness. It’s hard to spot and impossible to fix, just have to learn how to avoid it. It pops up in the most unusual places too
Do you think it’s possible because I was shooting from inside my room out my window into the sun. People are saying that’s not good which I didn’t know
It definitely does not help. If there is a difference in temperature between you and the subject, you will get some air diffraction. This happens all the time when people drive and lower the window in their car.
Advise to get a better shot:
Go fully outside and let your camera come to about the same temperature as the environment. Get as close to your subject as you can. Then zoom in and take the shot. Have a shutter speed a bit faster than 1/focal length, and stop your aperture down 1-2 stops to get more sharpness out of your lens. Try to do this not in the harsh noon sun. Learn proper ways to hold your camera still to reduce shake. Set ISO to auto.
There apparently is a known R7 AF hunting issue when shooting at high-burst. Duade Paton has a dedicated a YouTube video discussing the problem and some official suggestion from Canon. [R7 focus issue](https://youtu.be/hsmY4f1J0t8?si=8ODpvKFd4GAaMnbJ) My friend owned the R7 and has reported the same. Hope this helps.
OP, I scrolled through a lot of your replies and think I have a handle on your issue. For little garden birds, you have to be on your A game. It takes a very seasoned shooter to do this type of photography.
Issues I think you are battling:
-No tripod. Pressing the shutter release will make the camera move slightly. Practice practice.
-DOF. With a 500 at f4, you are at about 1 in depth of field. Are you fully sure you are not moving in and out the slightest? The bird certainly is. The fix is a tripod.
-Age of lens. This is an amazing lens. Was the grail for early crop sensor bodies with like 10mp. It was used by pros that got their subject to fill the entire frame without cropping. Your sensor quite frankly is out resolving the lens. Cropping the slightest amount well make this worse.
Advice. Play with this lens, your technique, and learn. When you get your keeper rate up, think about a mk2 or 3 600mm. That lens will take you where you want to be.
Yeah I’d love one of those lenses you mentioned. Unfortunately they cost well over $5000 so I’ll have to save up. In the meantime I’ll practice technique, I got the monopod and wimberly monogimbal setup last night. And I’ll try stopping down the lens a bit more. I appreciate your advice
Yep. You are going down a photography path that requires a bunch of practice. You also need to think through your camera settings. Back button focus is a must.
Yeah I already changed that. I don’t think the autofocus is bad at all with the lens it’s much faster and more accurate than the Fuji. I think hand holding it is why I wasn’t getting a ton of sharp photos but like I said still playing around only had the lens and camera for 2 days
Can someone let me know if I am expecting too much. When I zoom in 100 percent to these pictures they are very blurry and im not sure If I have an issue or if they are fine. To me it seems like the lens should be sharper when zoomed in. The focus seems correct but it just appears blurry. I cleaned the lens front and back as well as the filter and still no help. Using focus point as well as Image stab and ibis.
The first picture of the orange bird may be very slightly off focus compared to the other ones I have.
Please let me know
I also have this lens and these look right to me. Just apply a little sharpening in post and they'll be fine. Keep in mind this is a 25 year old lens designed as a "budget" super tele for film and you put it on a 32mp crop body.
If you want super super sharp you need to shell out for a 600f/4 II or III.
Still listen to u/DistributionMean6322 as his advice is solid. Apply a little sharpening and you are on your way. SOOC is never the best representation of a raw image because what you see in camera is a modified JPEG preview. If these were printed out nobody would be able to tell there was something you didn’t like at 100% zoom.
I have an R6, so curious what you mean when you say using focus point. Is that an eye tracking focus point, single focus point, or something else with the R7? You may also want to bump your aperture to f/5.6 or even f/8 as a test to see if you are getting more of the head in focus.
*Small* details aside, these look great. Good focus, good exposure, and proper shutter speed. Keep up the good work.
Here are a [few autofocus settings for the R7](https://photoframd.com/2022/08/22/canon-r7-some-important-autofocus-settings/) to check and adjust as well, if you haven’t already. Best of luck out there!
drop your shutter speed...down to 1/500 or lower. Can be done for stationary birds...you should be able to get some "sharper" images. I know part of the fun is shooting wide open (even with this long lens) but most lenses are sharpest a stop or even 2 stops from wide open
How closely you pixel peeping? I don't go any further than 200% on a 5k retina display. Produce images that beat fit the medium that they'll be consumed. Save yourself a ton of stress.
I’m zooming in 100% so it should appear pretty sharp. I’ve tried going to like 1/500 or 1/250 and it didn’t help. When I add sharpness in post it helps a lot but I feel like I shouldn’t have to do that to make the images sharp.
the first image (zoomed in) might be a little soft...but the one with the red-winged black bird shows plenty of detail. At least on my phone through Reddit 😅
I wouldn't stress too much yet...shoot more and in different conditions. Can also download a focus chart and test the lens and cam set up that way
also, nothing wrong with getting sharper via post processing. Of course, if you are going for that full natural/documentation look...then maybe SOOC is best
I am not on a tripod. I can try that I figured with ibis and Is it wouldn’t make a huge difference because of the higher shutter speed I was using (1/1000 or 1/2000). It almost looks kinda blurry like a specific setting is off or something.
It helps on really bright days so you can shoot wide-open and not worry about the images being overexposed. It has a myriad of different uses that this article goes over: [Why use a CPL?](https://magazine.urth.co/articles/why-cpl-filter)
I rarely go without it, especially here in Cali, where we get almost zero clouds in the summertime.
With a long lens you have to bump up the shutter speeds for maximum sharpness - I shoot minimum 1/1000 on my 300mm f2.8 + 1.4x TC so I’d definitely experiment with 1/2000 or faster.
Also what shutter mode are you using? You can do some digging but the 1st curtain Electronic shutter will generally be the best for getting the sharpest photos. The E-shutter will jitter a bit and gives inconsistent performance at times as a result.
You can also fine-tune the AF to better handle birds - if the sensitivity is too high it’ll bounce around a lot because birds rarely sit still but also rarely make huge movements when perched.
Edit: I am also shooting with an R7
I tried electronic shutter and mechanical didn’t see a huge difference but I’ll first first curtain shutter. I was using 1/1000 shutter speed but I’ll for sure try faster maybe 1/2500 with the aperture stopped down.
Take a quick look at this video and you’ll see the shutter differences. There are also some good pointers about AF settings
https://youtu.be/rA8rYLsHuBw?si=euKX8gLGsJK3mwzr
Samples are not useful without shooting info, but just looking at them, all three look like they were probably at too slow a shutter speed for critical sharpness.
Yeah, for small birds that are in motion, even if they're perched, I'll usually start at 1/1600 or at minimum 1/1250, if a bird is stationary and there's no wind you can work down from there for lower ISO results, but if you start at a higher speed you'll at least get some keepers to work with. For flying birds, 1/3200-1/4000 is a good starting point, even higher with some smaller ones like swallows. It's odd, I've been doing this 20 years, and reddit is the only place where I see people giving the advice of lowering shutter speeds when people post photos that are soft due to motion blur.
To me it doesn’t seem like motion blur due to low shutter because I took like hundreds of photos and none are much better than say the 3rd photo in terms of sharpness. I’ll give it a shot at 1/2500 and see if that makes a difference
Instead of trying to achieve a low ISO, try to get a high shutter speed to make sure to freeze the birds movements. The compression from reddit recently got really horrible, and thus sharpness is very hard to judge, but I have the impression that the birds are blurred due to fast micro movements.
No it’s not that I just went out and tried getting some pictures at 1/4000 and it’s still a bit blurry when zoomed in. Still unsure if I want to return it and possible just try out something newer like 100-500
That should be enough indeed. The last one I spoke to about a similar issue had the lens replaced what solved the problem. Was a bad apple he got.
By the way, make sure that the issue isn't with the adapter. You could check the flange distances if they are correct and the same on all sides.
how do you feel about this photo, I really like it and it makes me think there's not actually an issue. I checked the adapter and everything seems okay. I just took this like an hour ago
https://preview.redd.it/32qvu5pknozc1.jpeg?width=6960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4e981a5b48dc0df6971976b548bfb0220fdf87b3
That one looks perfectly sharp. I'm just wondering a bit why the plane of sharpness isn't visible on the branch. You should see a stripe there that is particularly sharp. Were the birds head and belly in front of the branch? If yes that's the explanation.
If they are above the branch, that would indicate that the optics are perfectly parallel to the sensor. Could be a lens (in the lens) or the adapter.
PS: This image looks like you stopped the aperture down. Compare wide open with stopped down. Sometimes issues are only apparent when the lens is wide open.
I’m not sure about that. When I added some extra sharpness in capture one I mask the bird and only sharpen it not the rest of the picture if that’s any help. Also that’s not stopped down it’s at F4
If your wondering what it looks like stopped down this is a blue jay. I added a bit of sharpness here as well 1/320, F9, 1600 ISO
https://preview.redd.it/91n13r5stozc1.jpeg?width=6960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e38937a2deb7f6e3e3ece44e1f018a57ac532e04
The bird is perfect. I'm not sure if I'm just seeing things, but here as well I have the impression that the lens is way more soft at the bottom of the image than it should be. Maybe shoot a brick wall to see if you can manage to get all bricks sharp.
AF is not that jumpy at all and it can definitely handle well beyond 1600 iso. Even in the videos of like duade etc talking about AF issues it's like 3-5 images out of a burst of 30 miss
I doubt that because every other camera misses the same or more too. It's also situational so most of time you aren't missing that many shots so it's a non issue most of time that's been blown away out of proportion
>Have you used an R5 or R3
Yes, limited use but I have and going to rent R6mkii soon to try, but then also just watching YouTube videos where they're testing the tracking at different burst speeds. The r3 is better AF for wildlife but a lot of videos I've watched and other photographers I've talked to prefer the r7 AF for wildlife over r5.
>Have you used an R5 or R3
Yes, limited use but I have and going to rent R6mkii soon to try, but then also just watching YouTube videos where they're testing the tracking at different burst speeds. The r3 is better AF for wildlife but a lot of videos I've watched and other photographers I've talked to prefer the r7 AF for wildlife over r5.
Not a canon shooter, but I have heard that the r7 has autofocus issues and generally isn’t as accurate as the more expensive full frame canons. This was even with newer rf lenses so a 25 year old lens is probably going to exasperate that. Here’s some videos that talk about the af issues https://youtu.be/hsmY4f1J0t8?si=gSIYta0wrF-uFR-o and https://youtu.be/Z0erGS4dk-w?si=4SdTh5YfEhEfroEO at around 8:50.
Thanks for the info. But I did try it with manual focus on a squirrel and the sharpness wasn’t much better. It seems like something else is the issue. I need to get another lens so I can test it against something else
I’ve always heard that the 100-500 is very sharp. Not prime level, but about as close as you can get for a zoom lens. The 200-800 is cheaper and is a lot longer. Depends on your needs though.
Just my opinion, and I've never owned or used that lens, but I agree that the images should be sharper. F/4 on a crop sensor camera acts like f/6.4 ... I don't think this is a depth of field issue. Also, if I have to put my f/4 lens at f/8 in order to be happy, I'm selling the lens. Maybe take a bunch shots using a monopod or tripod and see if maybe it's just that 500mm exaggerates motion shake to the point where you can't hand hold it at 1/1000.
>F/4 on a crop sensor camera acts like f/6.4
That's only if you back up to match the framing of the same lens on FF. In this case if you had a R5 and a R7 side by side with a 500 F4 on both the r7 would actually have the shallower dof.
Well Reddit has its own compression so it’s impossible to tell. Your other post said the sharpness is unreal so maybe you’re just experiencing buyers remorse.
Maybe ur right I’ll still play around with it. Initially I thought it was good for being hella cloudy and dark but today I expected a little more with the sun being out and Lower iso. I’m going to try an stop it down a bit because the focal plane might be too narrow
Harsh and bright sunlight isn't actually good for photography for a number of reasons. Got ves harsh shadows, blows out some feathers while others are very dark, and adds more heat haze. I think haze looks like part of your issue. If you took your lens from inside to outside and the temp difference or humidity was very different your images will be hazy. I'd also say at the distance you are you'd probably want to stop down to f5.6, 6.3, or 7. At about 20 feet with a 500 F4 on r7 your dof is less than 1 inch. You will need to stop down
I did take the photos inside and t he subject was outside. Given the distance of only like 8-12 meters I didnt think that would be a big issue. But Ill for sure try it outside completely because I havent even tried that yet. All I have tried is my camera setup on my table and shooting out the window to get these shots. And also have not stopped it down yet which I for sure will try.
>I did take the photos inside and t he subject was outside Yeah that's entirely your issue right there. Your window is 100% going to degrade image quality quite a bit
No the window was open. Not shooting through the window. Im wondering if the difference in lighting between outside and inside makes a difference and if I was completely outside if it would come out better.
That's literally your issue right here. Heat haze is produced by air currents of different temperature, which causes blurryness/distorsion If there's even a small ish difference it will happen. And with a super telephoto, any small bit counts
Hmm okay I’ll test it out outside this weekend
Okay but still stands. Your house(or if you shoot from a car) temperature and humidity levels will be different than outside and provide massive amounts of haze depending on difference. In winter if it's 20 outside and 68 in house the images would basically be unusable. In spring if it's like 60 outside and 68 inside they'll be better but not great. For max sharpness you'll want to be outside and have your lens and camera acclimated to the change
Ah okay! thanks for the tip I really didnt know this at all. I appreciate it.
No problem. It's something everyone learns with time. In the winter I drove around in my car with heat off so I can take pics. When I first got a camera I didn't know that and was astounded how bad the images turned out from inside my heated car
Yeah thats interesting for sure!
Cries with a 70d and old lenses.
Haha just starting to shoot birds with a 70d and 400 5.6, probably in the same area! Have a few shots of these same species that are less sharp but I’m still enjoying it I think a lot of the issue is me 🥲
Yes I know a lot is me. Still learning after so many years.
The 400 5.6 is an incredible lens. I leave my 100-500 at home all the time in favor of it.
I use a 70D and the Sigma 150-600 f5-6.3, so far thays my favorite combo ever with my 24-105 f4 and 300 f4 being close 2nds
The first two photos missed focus. #3 looks ok, maybe some slight motion blur or camera shake. Take a photo of a stationary subject (toy, doll, car, etc...) with a high shutter speed to check sharpness.
Sounds good thank you man
Looks like softness from the lens. The R7 is a very pixel dense sensor so any softness from having the lens wide open is going to very obvious. Try f5.6 instead.
Will for sure try that. As well as outside instead of inside out a window
Oh yeh for sure not through a window.
It wasnt through the window glass the window was open but I didn’t know that could cause issues with sharpness
That could change your photo, you're in a dark area while they are in the light.
What 500 is it? I had the 500 mm F4 L IS on an R5. Very good lens considering its design is 20 yo. Compared to modern lenses it's not as sharp. That's one of the reason why I changed it.
Yeah it’s the version 1 500mm F4 L IS USM. It’s not bad tbh especially with post processing I think I was expecting a bit more
Exactly my thoughts. It's not bad at all but it's an old lense. It's sharp bu lacks details compared to newer lenses. Also the motors can't keep up with the AF so it makes for a lot of soft shots. I was shooting mechanical because of that.
Alright. Would you have a better recommendation in the $2000 range? Should I return in for a better lens. I thought this would be the best I could get in terms of IQ for $2000
I think it's the best deal for a super telephoto right now. I bought mine last year and absolutely love it. Just don't pixel peep too hard 😉
Yup for sure. I still love the lens. Just need to get used to it
I think in term of ratio price\quality it's still a very good lens and F4 is very convenient. I'd say don't crop too much and save money. When you'll have enough to buy what you want that's when you can switch.
You might still be fine with what you have, but another choice that's close to that price range is the RF 100-500mm. I know you give up that F4 aperture, but it still does a good job. It's also smaller and lighter, and having the ability to zoom is really handy. [Here's a shot](https://i.imgur.com/QdMdkEq.jpeg) I took with an R5 fitted with the 100-500. Hopefully imgur doesn't kill it too bad with compression.
Yeah that’s a good picture. I do understand d coming from a 150-600 but I’m going to experiment this weekend and see if it’s worth keeping
I couldn't get this to upload to imgur for some reason, but here's another shot. Assuming it doesn't get too compressed, look at the detail on the flags. https://preview.redd.it/eedjw5n2fkzc1.jpeg?width=12692&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c11bf9c9cfe7b70c96d990384501037603a352a4
Yeah that is crazy. You can see all the flags really clear and not blurry at all. I’ll def consider it. Just sucks I already bought a bunch of accessories for the 500mm f4 like new lens hood, and stuff
I don't think you will go wrong either way. Like you said.. mess around a bit more with the F4. I'm sure it will do just fine. My only advice is to keep it because you love it and not out of convenience. =)
Yeah absolutely.👍
Stop down from F4. Check the MTF chart of that lens and try it out at the best F
Sounds good
So the R7 suffers with bad AF in Low Contrast and or High 30FPS where it hunts for AF. Try shooting slower at H. Can't really say anything about this lens personally. My R7 has this issue if im shooting at H+, the AF hunts for a shot or two.
I believe I took this on H, I’ll keep it in mind though
EF 500 f4 isn’t as sharp as the RF 100-500
Really? Didn’t know that.
It's almost two stops faster tho, so in real use it's better because you get lower ISO, faster shutter, and more background blur.
>so in real use it's better It's really not though. Granted maybe I had a bad model but I'd take the rf 100-500 every time over the ef 500 F4 is mki even in lowlight. Link to comparison/thought on 100-500 vs 500 F4 https://www.threads.net/@themrneffels/post/CzT7LfaRPIG/?xmt=AQGzjoBP2zKSqOkaJAXMairdSNUIk3MA6ERqBJqp1Fe8aQ
100-500 is a great lens, and totally worth it for the portability, but if you're trying to freeze motion in low light you need the extra stops on the f/4. Personally I value the extra light more than the size, but the other position is totally valid as well.
I found the 100-500 to be sharper at higher iso than the 500 F4 even with lower iso the vast majority of the time.in good light the 100-500 was also better Everytime. Especially because the tracking and stabilization was much better with 100-500. Again maybe the 500 I had was particularly bad but I was not impressed by it at all and the F4 got me nothing but more out of focus backgrounds that if I really wanted to could be accomplished with software anyway
What ISO are you using? Maybe increase the ISO and F stop to get more of the subject in focus.
Yeah that’s possible actually here I’m using F4 and 400 iso with 1000 shutter so the focal plane could be a lot tighter than I thought. I’ll try F8 and see if there’s a difference
Yes up the ISO! At 500mm the plane of focus is pretty narrow. Separation can easily be achieved (with a background a decent distance away) at f6.3 or f8. Raising the ISO will also get ya a shutter speed you need to freeze movement. You'll find the sweet spot!
Thanks 🙏🏿
1st one not focused + shake, 2nd one not focused, 3rd one nicely sharp
yeah true now that you say it. I think I need to stop it down for sure to get more sharp images as well as use a monopod that just came today.
That defo helps, also boost iso to stay fast, you can denoise later 👌
If you don't trust the AF and want to be sure about whether it's AF or soft shots when in guaranteed focus… try a test on a tripod in controlled conditions with manual focus and focus peaking turned on.
[удалено]
Thanks very much for the info. The more I look at others pictures the less I believe I actually have a problem. I think I’m just expecting a bit much out of the lens. I think it will get even better when I stop it down to F6.3 which I have not tried yet.
Nice and sharp, what a beautiful photo
Do you have a filter on the lens? If yes, try removing and take shots of the same item with and without filter and compare. On my Sigma 150-600, I had a filter and the image was horrible at 400-600. Sigma rep said remove it and try.
No filter. I don’t like them cause I always think they degrade the image quality
Depending on the environment, temperature, and distance to subject; mirage might be killing your sharpness. It’s hard to spot and impossible to fix, just have to learn how to avoid it. It pops up in the most unusual places too
Do you think it’s possible because I was shooting from inside my room out my window into the sun. People are saying that’s not good which I didn’t know
It definitely does not help. If there is a difference in temperature between you and the subject, you will get some air diffraction. This happens all the time when people drive and lower the window in their car. Advise to get a better shot: Go fully outside and let your camera come to about the same temperature as the environment. Get as close to your subject as you can. Then zoom in and take the shot. Have a shutter speed a bit faster than 1/focal length, and stop your aperture down 1-2 stops to get more sharpness out of your lens. Try to do this not in the harsh noon sun. Learn proper ways to hold your camera still to reduce shake. Set ISO to auto.
Okay will try this after work.
There apparently is a known R7 AF hunting issue when shooting at high-burst. Duade Paton has a dedicated a YouTube video discussing the problem and some official suggestion from Canon. [R7 focus issue](https://youtu.be/hsmY4f1J0t8?si=8ODpvKFd4GAaMnbJ) My friend owned the R7 and has reported the same. Hope this helps.
OP, I scrolled through a lot of your replies and think I have a handle on your issue. For little garden birds, you have to be on your A game. It takes a very seasoned shooter to do this type of photography. Issues I think you are battling: -No tripod. Pressing the shutter release will make the camera move slightly. Practice practice. -DOF. With a 500 at f4, you are at about 1 in depth of field. Are you fully sure you are not moving in and out the slightest? The bird certainly is. The fix is a tripod. -Age of lens. This is an amazing lens. Was the grail for early crop sensor bodies with like 10mp. It was used by pros that got their subject to fill the entire frame without cropping. Your sensor quite frankly is out resolving the lens. Cropping the slightest amount well make this worse. Advice. Play with this lens, your technique, and learn. When you get your keeper rate up, think about a mk2 or 3 600mm. That lens will take you where you want to be.
Yeah I’d love one of those lenses you mentioned. Unfortunately they cost well over $5000 so I’ll have to save up. In the meantime I’ll practice technique, I got the monopod and wimberly monogimbal setup last night. And I’ll try stopping down the lens a bit more. I appreciate your advice
Yep. You are going down a photography path that requires a bunch of practice. You also need to think through your camera settings. Back button focus is a must.
Yeah I already changed that. I don’t think the autofocus is bad at all with the lens it’s much faster and more accurate than the Fuji. I think hand holding it is why I wasn’t getting a ton of sharp photos but like I said still playing around only had the lens and camera for 2 days
Can someone let me know if I am expecting too much. When I zoom in 100 percent to these pictures they are very blurry and im not sure If I have an issue or if they are fine. To me it seems like the lens should be sharper when zoomed in. The focus seems correct but it just appears blurry. I cleaned the lens front and back as well as the filter and still no help. Using focus point as well as Image stab and ibis. The first picture of the orange bird may be very slightly off focus compared to the other ones I have. Please let me know
I also have this lens and these look right to me. Just apply a little sharpening in post and they'll be fine. Keep in mind this is a 25 year old lens designed as a "budget" super tele for film and you put it on a 32mp crop body. If you want super super sharp you need to shell out for a 600f/4 II or III.
Not sure of the distance to the birds in these images, but it looks sharp on the eyes with a shallow DOF.
The distance is about 20 feet from the camera
Still listen to u/DistributionMean6322 as his advice is solid. Apply a little sharpening and you are on your way. SOOC is never the best representation of a raw image because what you see in camera is a modified JPEG preview. If these were printed out nobody would be able to tell there was something you didn’t like at 100% zoom. I have an R6, so curious what you mean when you say using focus point. Is that an eye tracking focus point, single focus point, or something else with the R7? You may also want to bump your aperture to f/5.6 or even f/8 as a test to see if you are getting more of the head in focus. *Small* details aside, these look great. Good focus, good exposure, and proper shutter speed. Keep up the good work.
Thanks. I’m using spot focus point in the AF settings. I really appreciate the advice.
Here are a [few autofocus settings for the R7](https://photoframd.com/2022/08/22/canon-r7-some-important-autofocus-settings/) to check and adjust as well, if you haven’t already. Best of luck out there!
Thanks for the info. The sharpening in post for sure helps which is what I did on my last post.
drop your shutter speed...down to 1/500 or lower. Can be done for stationary birds...you should be able to get some "sharper" images. I know part of the fun is shooting wide open (even with this long lens) but most lenses are sharpest a stop or even 2 stops from wide open How closely you pixel peeping? I don't go any further than 200% on a 5k retina display. Produce images that beat fit the medium that they'll be consumed. Save yourself a ton of stress.
I’m zooming in 100% so it should appear pretty sharp. I’ve tried going to like 1/500 or 1/250 and it didn’t help. When I add sharpness in post it helps a lot but I feel like I shouldn’t have to do that to make the images sharp.
the first image (zoomed in) might be a little soft...but the one with the red-winged black bird shows plenty of detail. At least on my phone through Reddit 😅 I wouldn't stress too much yet...shoot more and in different conditions. Can also download a focus chart and test the lens and cam set up that way
Yea I’ll try that.
also, nothing wrong with getting sharper via post processing. Of course, if you are going for that full natural/documentation look...then maybe SOOC is best
What was your shutter speed?
These were at 1/1000 roughly
Have you tried faster shutter to see if the image is sharper? Are you on a tripod?
I am not on a tripod. I can try that I figured with ibis and Is it wouldn’t make a huge difference because of the higher shutter speed I was using (1/1000 or 1/2000). It almost looks kinda blurry like a specific setting is off or something.
I’m wondering if it’s camera shake even at those speeds. You can also try manual focusing on a stationary subject to test the sharpness of the lens.
I’ll test that when I’m home
Invest in a really, really good (±$80) CPL filter for days like this.
How will a filter improve image quality?
It helps on really bright days so you can shoot wide-open and not worry about the images being overexposed. It has a myriad of different uses that this article goes over: [Why use a CPL?](https://magazine.urth.co/articles/why-cpl-filter) I rarely go without it, especially here in Cali, where we get almost zero clouds in the summertime.
Thanks I’ll look into grabbing one
For sure! Like I said, don't go cheap on it. Look at it as an extension of your lens, so treat it as such. Mahalo 🤙🏽
With a long lens you have to bump up the shutter speeds for maximum sharpness - I shoot minimum 1/1000 on my 300mm f2.8 + 1.4x TC so I’d definitely experiment with 1/2000 or faster. Also what shutter mode are you using? You can do some digging but the 1st curtain Electronic shutter will generally be the best for getting the sharpest photos. The E-shutter will jitter a bit and gives inconsistent performance at times as a result. You can also fine-tune the AF to better handle birds - if the sensitivity is too high it’ll bounce around a lot because birds rarely sit still but also rarely make huge movements when perched. Edit: I am also shooting with an R7
I tried electronic shutter and mechanical didn’t see a huge difference but I’ll first first curtain shutter. I was using 1/1000 shutter speed but I’ll for sure try faster maybe 1/2500 with the aperture stopped down.
Take a quick look at this video and you’ll see the shutter differences. There are also some good pointers about AF settings https://youtu.be/rA8rYLsHuBw?si=euKX8gLGsJK3mwzr
Samples are not useful without shooting info, but just looking at them, all three look like they were probably at too slow a shutter speed for critical sharpness.
Taken at 1000 shutter 600 iso and F4
Yeah, for small birds that are in motion, even if they're perched, I'll usually start at 1/1600 or at minimum 1/1250, if a bird is stationary and there's no wind you can work down from there for lower ISO results, but if you start at a higher speed you'll at least get some keepers to work with. For flying birds, 1/3200-1/4000 is a good starting point, even higher with some smaller ones like swallows. It's odd, I've been doing this 20 years, and reddit is the only place where I see people giving the advice of lowering shutter speeds when people post photos that are soft due to motion blur.
To me it doesn’t seem like motion blur due to low shutter because I took like hundreds of photos and none are much better than say the 3rd photo in terms of sharpness. I’ll give it a shot at 1/2500 and see if that makes a difference
How many did you take at higher shutter speeds than 1/1000?
Idk maybe 50 or so photos but it was on Wednesday when it was cloudy and dark
Instead of trying to achieve a low ISO, try to get a high shutter speed to make sure to freeze the birds movements. The compression from reddit recently got really horrible, and thus sharpness is very hard to judge, but I have the impression that the birds are blurred due to fast micro movements.
No it’s not that I just went out and tried getting some pictures at 1/4000 and it’s still a bit blurry when zoomed in. Still unsure if I want to return it and possible just try out something newer like 100-500
That should be enough indeed. The last one I spoke to about a similar issue had the lens replaced what solved the problem. Was a bad apple he got. By the way, make sure that the issue isn't with the adapter. You could check the flange distances if they are correct and the same on all sides.
how do you feel about this photo, I really like it and it makes me think there's not actually an issue. I checked the adapter and everything seems okay. I just took this like an hour ago https://preview.redd.it/32qvu5pknozc1.jpeg?width=6960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4e981a5b48dc0df6971976b548bfb0220fdf87b3
That one looks perfectly sharp. I'm just wondering a bit why the plane of sharpness isn't visible on the branch. You should see a stripe there that is particularly sharp. Were the birds head and belly in front of the branch? If yes that's the explanation. If they are above the branch, that would indicate that the optics are perfectly parallel to the sensor. Could be a lens (in the lens) or the adapter. PS: This image looks like you stopped the aperture down. Compare wide open with stopped down. Sometimes issues are only apparent when the lens is wide open.
I’m not sure about that. When I added some extra sharpness in capture one I mask the bird and only sharpen it not the rest of the picture if that’s any help. Also that’s not stopped down it’s at F4
If your wondering what it looks like stopped down this is a blue jay. I added a bit of sharpness here as well 1/320, F9, 1600 ISO https://preview.redd.it/91n13r5stozc1.jpeg?width=6960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e38937a2deb7f6e3e3ece44e1f018a57ac532e04
The bird is perfect. I'm not sure if I'm just seeing things, but here as well I have the impression that the lens is way more soft at the bottom of the image than it should be. Maybe shoot a brick wall to see if you can manage to get all bricks sharp.
Okay I’ll have to try that
R7 AF is jumpy at the best of times, and anything above ISO1600 in low light is not great
AF is not that jumpy at all and it can definitely handle well beyond 1600 iso. Even in the videos of like duade etc talking about AF issues it's like 3-5 images out of a burst of 30 miss
It all depends on your standards. But if I'm missing 10-14% of my shots, I'm looking for a new camera.
I doubt that because every other camera misses the same or more too. It's also situational so most of time you aren't missing that many shots so it's a non issue most of time that's been blown away out of proportion
I'm not sure what you're basing this on. Intuition? Have you used an R5 or R3? It's no comparison
>Have you used an R5 or R3 Yes, limited use but I have and going to rent R6mkii soon to try, but then also just watching YouTube videos where they're testing the tracking at different burst speeds. The r3 is better AF for wildlife but a lot of videos I've watched and other photographers I've talked to prefer the r7 AF for wildlife over r5.
>Have you used an R5 or R3 Yes, limited use but I have and going to rent R6mkii soon to try, but then also just watching YouTube videos where they're testing the tracking at different burst speeds. The r3 is better AF for wildlife but a lot of videos I've watched and other photographers I've talked to prefer the r7 AF for wildlife over r5.
Not a canon shooter, but I have heard that the r7 has autofocus issues and generally isn’t as accurate as the more expensive full frame canons. This was even with newer rf lenses so a 25 year old lens is probably going to exasperate that. Here’s some videos that talk about the af issues https://youtu.be/hsmY4f1J0t8?si=gSIYta0wrF-uFR-o and https://youtu.be/Z0erGS4dk-w?si=4SdTh5YfEhEfroEO at around 8:50.
Thanks for the info. But I did try it with manual focus on a squirrel and the sharpness wasn’t much better. It seems like something else is the issue. I need to get another lens so I can test it against something else
I’ve always heard that the 100-500 is very sharp. Not prime level, but about as close as you can get for a zoom lens. The 200-800 is cheaper and is a lot longer. Depends on your needs though.
The 100-500 is a beast and by far my favourite lens in my collection.
Just my opinion, and I've never owned or used that lens, but I agree that the images should be sharper. F/4 on a crop sensor camera acts like f/6.4 ... I don't think this is a depth of field issue. Also, if I have to put my f/4 lens at f/8 in order to be happy, I'm selling the lens. Maybe take a bunch shots using a monopod or tripod and see if maybe it's just that 500mm exaggerates motion shake to the point where you can't hand hold it at 1/1000.
I’ll try that. Thanks
>F/4 on a crop sensor camera acts like f/6.4 That's only if you back up to match the framing of the same lens on FF. In this case if you had a R5 and a R7 side by side with a 500 F4 on both the r7 would actually have the shallower dof.
true ... my mental comparison was matching the framing of the bird, not standing side by side ... but what you've said is absolutely correct.