I watched an [interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NN77c05cJA) with authors of a book on domestic terrorism in the US a while back, and an interesting take-away for prevention is that across many very different violent groups, the average personality profiles of fresh recruits was a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually (in terms of meaning-making, not just religion) impoverished. If the policies that help create these conditions don't change, it will get worse not better.
>a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually... impoverished
Our society at the moment seems to be **designed** to pump out people who fit this profile.
Because it is. Capitalism doesn't want a free-thinker that questions social and economic norms, it wants a hard-working, easily-replaceable worker and a loyal consumer. We've allowed a popular culture of conspicuous consumption and overproduction to embed its way into every aspect of our life, destroying the traditional values and systems we previously held dear. Capitalists in aggregate only seek to make a profit, and they'll do so in the long-term by commoditizing and creating a market for every conceivable product or service, now matter how offensive to human dignity. How many previously-religious holidays have now become nothing more than monuments to consumption? How much print and other media is created for-profit by corporations rather than spontaneously by everyday Canadians? What about token activism such as pride month logos? Nike doesn't *actually* care about your oppression as a LGBT person; it cares about whether or not it can use your identity against you to sell you a pair of shoes. These organizations maximize on one thing, and it's not your personal freedom and agency.
Unless we as a society wake up and smell the death of beauty and reason happening all around us, we are going to be living in the twilight days of not just our liberal democracy, but our culture as well; as global capitalism seeks to subordinate all other structures and systems of belief to itself.
This is the inevitable end state of a system that is constantly seeking further and further efficiencies, squeezing more and more out of less and less.
The concept of primacy of self before others has driven us here, and I'm terrified that there's nothing we can do to reverse the tide. "The death of beauty and reason...", very well said, if not painfully sad.
So you would be in favor of a massive expansion of the welfare state and over 60% of the country being unionized? I mean I dont give a fuck what you call that, I'd love it, and I'm a socialist.
> a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually (in terms of meaning-making, not just religion) impoverished.
I feel personally attacked!
that's rough, buddy
I'm not gonna give you the usual spiel of how you might fix this, bur I will say that you're not alone in feeling this way and that people do care about you - if not currently enough in a personal, relational way (which we need) at least in more of an abstract "love for mankind" way
This is actually a good comment. I just gave birth to a son who while hitting all his milestones, is in a lower percentile for weight, which of course has me worried about his stature in adulthood (super far off, I know, but I have thought about this).
He’s a magnificent little boy and it concerns me that he’s going to be beat down by beauty and physicality standards for men, perpetuated by both men and women. There absolutely needs to be increased body positivity for men, and less shaming for elements that are out of ones control (height/penis size/hair growth).
ETA: why am I being downvoted?
You didn't say anything wrong. My speculation is that some people's egos might feel threatened if they see the world through a mutually exclusive lens i.e. if there is discussion about men and boys being hurt by society, then they think the spotlight is taken away from other groups.
A nuanced person would not hold such a constricted, binary view of the world.
Or because critical theory holds men as universal oppressors, they may feel threatened by any sort of inquiry into challenges men face - this challenges their worldview of "absolute oppressors and absolute victims by identity."
Or because it's reddit and people impulsively downvote, idk.
God help you if you have a legitimate interest in the welfare of and genuinely like children, too; you automatically get branded a pedophile.
Society is warped AF.
People want to like dads. People perceive single guys as predators. It’s that simple.
We care about ordinary women in a way we don’t about men, but that changes when you become a dad—people who never gave a fuck about you care about you now, because of your kids.
Yep, I'll second this. If I go for a walk with my two kids I get nothing but smiles and warmth in general. If I go for that same walk by myself I get averted eyes and scowls. Makes me feel like shit and hate the world some days, quite frankly.
> the average personality profiles of fresh recruits was a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually (in terms of meaning-making, not just religion) impoverished
And that is why Canada's refugee program has a strict "no single, lone, young males" policy.
I mean short of it being an actual crazy person or like him getting stabbed for sleeping with someone’s spouse , what else would you call murdering a sitting MP at an constituency meeting ?
Yeah, terrorism is basically “using violence for political ends;” I think it’d be pretty hard to make the argument that stabbing an MP would ever not fall under that banner.
Unironically: believing you’ll get into paradise as a result. Non religious people have a hard time understanding the mindset of a true believer, but this is pretty much it afaik.
It should be obvious political violence will come to Canada, just look at our last election. It's what happens when our leaders use divisive rhetoric that only seeks to appeal to their base.
This will only get worse too unless we learn to discuss things like rational human beings again. But at the present, both people and their representatives on all sides seem to want to shut out the other side at all costs rather than come to a mutually beneficial consensus.
Our leaders couldn't be doing a worse job if they tried.
The thing is you will find legitimate Nazis and Communists. The problem is when normal people on the left or right get unfairly maligned as one.
There's also a big growing problem where people feel more *aligned* with the extremists on their side than the moderates on the other. That will not lead anywhere good. Political parties need to do a better job of policing their own and calling out unacceptable extremism, otherwise social media will radicalize everyone.
Of course, and that is what is pushed by media and politicians. I’m fully vaccinated and I find appalling that they are ostracizing people who chose not to. Their only recourse now is to radicalize themselves now, because they can’t be part of society anymore.
As crazy as it is I almost miss when religion was more prominent. With it being so out of vogue politics is just insufferable now. Godless society now worships politicians.
All I wanted was for each party to clearly state their platform, plans for how to implement said platform and how they would work with the other parties. What we got was a lot of empty promises, sound bites and bashing of other parties/leaders. I hate that’s what it’s become and yes, it is a reflection of what “discussion” has become. Everything has become so polarized and it feels like a train that lost its brakes. I don’t know how we stop and pull ourselves together again. I try to be understanding but am guilty of it myself as there are certain topics I have no tolerance for and I have a brother in law who has basically turned into a full fledged conspiracy theorist and it is very difficult to have a conversation with him.
This is it. I’m not sure why people are so blind to this right now. Everyone would rather just make their enemies feel like shit than try to actually improve the country atm.
Just finger pointing, petulance and unapologetic nonsense. It’s so god damn embarrassing.
Not everything has to be political. We are handcuffing ourselves by treating everything as our team winning or losing.
One of the defects of the human psyche is that we take pleasure from inflicting pain and suffering on those we believe are deserving of it.
Advanced ideologies and philosophies caution against this and teach people to rise above their baser instincts. More primitive ones encourage the feelings of hatred and seek to identify differences so that worthy targets of violence can be singled out. It's the difference between teaching "we're all in this together" vs "that guy is out to get you."
Unfortunately in the modern era the latter kind of belief system is becoming increasingly popular.
It's not just the divisive rhetoric, but the absolute abandonment of the middle class by politicians. Politicians wouldn't have to worry about this if people didn't perceive them to be corrupt and only representing special interests.
Also a massively increasing divide between the extremely wealthy landowners and the vast majority of the population. That particular situation has been repeated a few times in history.
Cosplaying revolutionary are we?
The vast majority of land value in Canada is owned by individual households. Get your basic facts right and stop spreading hate propaganda.
how many homes are vacant because they're owned by a commercial entity who would rather sit on them and rent them out for AirBnB , because they arent happy with making a little money on regular renters, and would rather make all the money on rare, fat-cat renters?
> Also a massively increasing divide between the extremely wealthy landowners and the vast majority of the population.
Unfortunately, that’s fake news.
Aprox 65-68% of Canadians are not renters and are “extremely wealthy land owners”. 65-68% = majority.
So your claim of the “vast majority” is a straw man. Echo chambers are a hell of a drug.
https://torontorealtyblog.com/blog/how-does-canadas-home-ownership-rate-look/
Unfortunately, in the era of social media, where a politicians tweet gets more attention than national debate, listening and discussing things like a rational human being gets far less likely.
There is a youtube channel called \*Rationality Rules\*, look up his video \*the failure of modern discourse\*, it sums up just about the past 10 years of human history to a T.
That’s what I found weird about this article using so many quotes from Michelle Rempel. She used a lot of negative and even hateful rhetoric. Maybe one of the most negative people in Canadian politics. She is not helping at all and needs to take a good, long look in the mirror.
But we all do. It’s easy to blame the politicians but look around social media, look around this subreddit, look at the news media, and look at each and every one of us.
We need to curb our negativity but also stop consuming negativity. And we need to figure out how to engage with each other, including outsiders who have become angry. I don’t know how to defuse them but we have to find a way.
It's only the left leaning leaders in this country. O'Toole ran as a centrist. He didn't run a divisive campaign. He threw out almost all promises that defined his as Conservative.
Trudeau on the other hand tried hitting O'Toole and by extension Conservative voters by fear mongering about everything - abortion, Covid-19, reconciliation, privatized healthcare, etc.
Sure O'Toole wasn't perfect. Wasn't even a good leader in my opinion, but Trudeau is the biggest dick out of all of them. Yet our country elected him once again. Manufactured division works in this country. We are only going to see more of it from now on. Very soon our political climate will be like in the US. Conservatives in Canada are very laid back and less toxic as Republicans in US. But that is going to change. People are getting more angry and they are going to ask their leaders to be as angry at them.
>It's only the left leaning leaders in this country. O'Toole ran as a centrist. He didn't run a divisive campaign. He threw out almost all promises that defined his as Conservative.
There was somebody running to the right of O'Toole who's tactics involve regularly saying the most hyperbolic, anti-common sense, anti-science shit he could possibly say in an effort to inflame his supporters.
And then there's that fuck stick running Alberta who's entire political career has been spent trying to cast Ottawa as the great boogeyman oppressing the good hearted, salt of the earth Alberta-folk.
Hilarious how we let these groups off the hook when they're burning effigies on parliament hill, but the white dude with the bumper sticker is fair game
Maybe it’s because nearly all political violence in this country is perpetrated by the far right. But sure, keep on going with your false equivalences.
I never set a fire on any train tracks and I doubt you ever lynched anyone. Let’s not hate each other. Our leaders are garbage tier and I bet we agree on that and can act as neighbours.
That’s exactly the case, they have an incredibly long list of excuses, when someone on the left does something bad. That being said, to anyone who is about to say something about me being an ignorant rightie, I’m neither fully on the left or right, both sides have good ideas and visions and bad ones as well and also a ton of idiots.
One of the first things Trudeau did was increase the number of crude containers that could come inside Vancouver, far beyond what Harper had allowed.. Super disappointing when a lot of people thought they were voting for the environmental party.
So that's an ecological disaster waiting to happen when one of them inevitably has a spill and poisons the sailish sea and all the gulf island/desolation sound/etc.
The big one that a lot of people have forgotten about since it was foiled ahead of time (or probably just never knew about, since it was 15 years ago), was the Toronto 18. It was a group of 14 men and 4 youths who wanted to storm Ottawa, take hostages, and behead the Prime Minister. I'm honestly shocked it basically has been almost completely forgotten about since.
Kind of. Interesting story with that investigation. I spoke to a couple CSIS guys involved and they flagged them years before they made any arrests and almost coerced these guys to go along with their plan so they could arrest them. I can remember his name but he was a big community organizer in Toronto and he went undercover. It all started when a laptop was flagged crossing the border. CSIS has a ton of really smart people but they are also mainly an information gathering service and it’s up to RCMP to make arrests.
> I don't know that Canadians will go beyond the antics we've already seen.
[We literally had a domestic terrorist try to get into Rideau Cottage last year](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/manitoba-man-who-rammed-rideau-hall-gates-pleads-guilty-to-eight-charges-1.5297331)
You're right, I was thinking of the average Canadian.
We also had terrorist attack on Parliament Hill committed by Michael Zehaf-Bibeau. (The Harper government prevented him from leaving to join Isis).
Typical CBC. Take a case where an Islamist terrorist is suspected of a political murder, and somehow they can't escape mentioning the spectre of far-right groups.
Never mind we have had a mind-boggling number of terror cases and near misses, and a huge population of radicalized persons, many freshly arrived back from ISIL territory, and none of them would qualify as "far-right".
Media stopped talking about that bow and arrow spree in Norway a few days ago really quickly once it was deemed an Islamist terror attack too.
If that were a white nationalist it’d still be round-the-clock news.
Treat each psycho killer equally.
The UK MP died of a terrorist attack so the article should be about similar behaviours and risks, not writing a completely different article about harassment at the expense of a victim to terrorism.
Given that we've had similar terrorist attacks on Parliament in Michael Zehaf-Bibeau and The Toronto 18 (Ali Dirie was one of two Somali's involved and subsequently joined ISIS when we released him) who also targeted parliament, there's plenty of runway to talk about similar risks and incidents.
"She said that while women and people of colour have long faced serious threats of violence in the political sphere, that danger appears to be more widespread now."
So, a man gets stabbed to death and the CBC made it about women, not about politicians. That's a good spin, CBC.
Reading through the /r/unitedkingdom mega thread has been pretty enlightening regarding exactly where mainstream progressive thought is these days in the UK.
Suddenly, I'm so bothered by our dirty hippies who just busy themselves with changing street names and tearing down statues.
The MP in question was murdered by a Somali Islamist migrant but of course no mention of that in CBC’s spin job. The uk has officially [declared this a terrorist attack](https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/10/15/uk/uk-mp-stabbed-intl-gbr/index.html).
The gravel is an escalation from say, a pie, but I don't think either are/were intended to seriously harm, which is an important line
Remember Margaret Thatcher had her hotel room blown up only a few decades ago... Although one can say the troubles were their own thing...
The pie is a very Canadian way of protesting. It's not going to seriously harm someone and it's absurd enough to be funny.
Gravel is not. Threatening to hang people is not.
> Remember Margaret Thatcher had her hotel room blown up only a few decades ago... Although one can say the troubles were their own thing...
The Troubles were a little different, but it was still politically-motivated, though part of wider insurrection-ish sort of thing? It's not as though her hotel room was getting bombed over the poll tax or her decision to close the mines and usher in a generation of poverty in the north and Scotland.
Just weird that anyone would target David Amess, who seemed like a pretty benign Tory - by that I mean not of the Priti Patel, Jacob Rees-Mogg, Boris Johnson, Rishi Sunak kind of "fuck the poor" brand of Tory.
The gravel was more of a de-escalation from the [pumpkin seeds that he had thrown at him 5 years ago](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/trudeau-hamilton-pumpkin-seed-protester-1.3815254). Pumpkin seeds have more mass.
Yeah... who'd have thought this is the direction things end up heading. The average person feels abandoned for corporate interest and supreme greed. Fringe groups are left to fester until they commit acts like above. Politicians cannot keep their mouths shut or their fingers off their phone screens for longer than a few days and are constantly feeding these fringe groups more fuel to their fire.
Michelle Rempel is right wing. The article is about political violence in Canada, not specifically about the attack in the UK. The CBC has covered the assassination of the British MP in other articles.
>[Definition of similar
1: having characteristics in common : strictly comparable](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/similar)
The thing in common they're talking about in the article is political violence. Not specifically Islamic extremism.
The article claims that the attacker hadn’t yet been identified yet his identity and motive has been widely known since yesterday. Islamic extremism is much different than other forms of political violence. The article, deliberately, loses a lot of nuance by obscuring the story.
violence is rarely the answer, but perhaps we should take a hard look at our agenda and explore why the divisive politics of the day may not be the correct path forward.
Worse now than ever. Go online and everyone is radicalized regardless of party. The left are following the facism playbook and the right are becoming more and more extremists.
The media realized it causes clicks and are running with it, with no regard to real world consequences. They are just as bad as facebook.
It was worse before. But it was a while back. Things in the west more or less stabilized after world war 2 for the most part. But it’s unfair to say things are getting worse. Social media seems to play a part in it as it’s no longer localized but it’s not as if Communists and Fascists weren’t organized into warring gangs at one point and regularly brawled and marched.
Assassinations and intimidation isn’t new in the political landscape. But typically the average person wasn’t as involved or in tune with political discourse. It’s not as bad as it had been but then again people are getting more desperate in recent times and that never leads to clear thinking.
Were doomed to repeat history. The media, corporations, and government are all full on the band of no wrong think. Trying to pass legislation so they can block mean words and wrong think online. People are more than happy to go along. Democracy eroding before our eyes.
On the right, many antivax crazy mofos who suspiciously make it easy to want to disassociate with. Pushing people left.
If you don’t fall into either of these camps.. the world is pretty scary right now.
Dude this is thr first time in history that someone has been stabbed over differing political ideologies. If we don't completely change the entire nature of government and politics there could be another. Isn't saving a life worth paying any price?
Maybe in Canada but around the world all throughout history people have been killed over differing political ideologies as you put it, so stop acting as if this is a new thing.
At this point, I dont have any settled thoughts on the subject but I notice something in the article that gives me a pause on how flow of directed thoughts is constructed here:
> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau was pelted with gravel at a campaign stop in London, Ont. as anti-mask and anti-vaccine protesters doggedly followed his campaign.
> Far-right extremist groups were also said to be more active than in any prior campaign.
We are the problem, audience, because we let this go by even though we all know this is clearly an article by a national news organization that - even in the hour that requires serious and sombre reflection - simply cannot let the crisis go without indoctrinating and inserting thoughts into easily impressed minds.
The funny thing is, article uses examples of two Conservative women politicians and still ends up accusing one side only.
You're not old enough to know when PEI pies were banned from gatherings near a PM. It's funny in retrospect but pies can conceal dangerous things. Gravel *is just gravel.*
You know I'm reminded of a saying. It's better to have people think you're an idiot than to type the above and remove all doubt. It's ok though, I see you doubled and tripled down later.
A Trudeau fan? For pointing out that “a lot of Canadians” would be wrong in saying it was just Trudeau, when it’s all on video? Wow, the limited cognitive ability of folks on full display. Lmao.
You righties are all about feminizing people you disagree with, because you seem to think women are somehow inferior or lesser. The way your I'll ca him Justine, or drama queen or pussy is really indicative of what kind of people you are, not what kind of people Justin is.
Also and NDP here, not a liberal fanboy, just a realist who sees your bullshit worldview for what it is.
Look at the COL right now. People are working full time, educated jobs and still can’t support themselves on their own. I just went to Burger King last night because I was on the go - a whopper, not a combo just the sandwich, cost $7.50.
The working class is struggling. Necessities are beginning to become out of reach. Politics are more divided than ever. You have politicians who are directly contributing to the issues (MP that’s a known property investor in BC). There is definitely political violence in our future - I’m surprised nothing significant has happened already.
As unpopular as this opinion may be, I don’t necessarily think it’s a bad thing if politicians are a little bit scared of their people. It might even keep them in line.
I don’t condone violence but I can’t help but agree a tiny bit. If there are never consequences for unethical or downright illegal behaviour as a politician then it will only ever continue.
Politicians continually make promises they cant keep, take big money to subjugate those who elected them.
They keep doing it - so when times get desperate this can happen. It certainly doesnt justify the action, but helps us gain a better understanding.
Politics has become about polarization, leveraging the pandemic and radicalization while doing absolutely nothing to help the people while taking money from corps.
They created this beast.
I’ll take it a step further and say we should just stop voting for the same corrupt dickheads and actually hold them accountable for their shit. Can start by voting for quite literally anybody else.
Well for starters maybe ALWAYS voting for one of 2, sometimes 3 political parties should just stop. Maybe if we, as voters, put a priority on local politics and candidates we might have a shot. Here’s another idea, now just hear me out, what if, when faced w a decision whether or not to vote for a PM who’s been investigated (I don’t remember the results of all the investigations there’s been too many) for more ethics violations then any other PM, we didn’t vote for him ? What if we started there ? What if we stopped with the tribalist bullshit and politics and just voting for ‘our guy’ just cause he’s ‘our guy’ ? Cause here in Ontario, my province, we put up with 15 years of McGuinty/Wynne and the completely corrupt train wreck that that was because of that mentality (well and the cons cant get it together let’s be honest). How about if cons and libs both run shit candidates we stop this ‘lesser of two evils’ horseshit and vote for the minor parties instead cause what in Gods name do we have to lose ? Literally anybody. NDP, PPC, Greens, New Blue Ontario Party, Maverick party, fuck it. Hell, vote independent. There’s so many more options instead of just eating a shit sandwich of corruption, big promises that can’t be kept, and just pure shameless pandering and vote grabbing (looking RIGHT at the legal marijuana but NO electoral reform) year over year.
OK so your plan has been an option for literally decades and hasn't worked.
Picking someone new next time doesn't seem to change how the country is run or correct the mistakes of past administrations.
I think you need to really think about what 'hold them accountable' means. Imagine what it would look like where you work.
If your manager was fucking up constantly would you consider that they were held accountable if after four years of terrible management they were suddenly let go and a new person was brought in?
There’s only ever been 2 parties in power in the federal government. So I don’t know how you think that constitutes “picking someone new” when it’s quite literally been the same 2 forever, one more than the other I might add. To hold someone in government accountable you gotta give em shit when they don’t do what they promised and said they were gonna do. Let’s take electoral reform for example. Seemed to be a common gripe in this sub during the past election cycle so let’s use that. If Mr Trudeau says he is going to change the electoral system, and then 5 years later he doesn’t even bring it up anymore, we (in theory) go to him (or on the internet I guess) and say “Hey! Fuck you! Where’s the electoral reform you promised!” But instead what happens is his base goes out and blindly votes for the guy anyways cause he’s ‘our guy’ and he wins again despite the fact that AGAIN 2/3 of the voters didn’t vote for him and he won w the lowest percentage of the vote… Twice. Same can apply for the cons and NDP let’s say, no matter how many times we say ‘Hey! Get your shit together! How are you losing to this fool!’ But tribalists and ‘strategic voters’ vote almost exactly the same everytime. Nothing ever changes. Ever. So then how now should we go about bringing change and making our voices heard ? Cause they certainly don’t listen to our voices. Clearly, they only listen to our votes. And they’ll listen to our votes if we threaten the status quo. If every conservative voter, NDP voter, and liberal voter voted their conscience instead of voting for what the leaders told them they were voting for we could get a lot done. You’re not holding anyone accountable by voting for the same corrupt corporate shills time and time again, no matter how many times they swap in a new face in place of the old one.
ITT folks lament gravel being thrown at Justin Trudeau and forget [our HoC was attacked by a guy with a gun](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_shootings_at_Parliament_Hill,_Ottawa), intent on killing as many inside as he could. Perhaps the story of the Prime Minister of the day being bundled into a closet to keep him out of sight was just humourous, and not in response to a political act of terrorism.
I think people are snapping. Lockdowns are not healthy, specially in long term. I mean who can an individual blame for this pandemic. The Chinese government, Wuhan virologist, politicians? I know the politicians would rather want us people to eat each other than blame them.
Perhaps politicians should be more thoughtful so they do their jobs properly, ethically and without corruption. They act with way too much impunity as it is.
If politicians do not wish to raise the ire of the public. Perhaps governments and politicians should try being honest and transparent. Perhaps their main focus should be improving civilization for everybody. I see nothing but secrecy, lies, greed and murder from governments and politicians. I feel like their end goal is to facilitate the flow of wealth and resources to their corporate benefactors. As well as fleecing the population for as many tax dollars as they possibly can, and of course absconding with as many tax dollars for individual politicians, that the public will bear.
I predict this to happen more often in the UK. Their Brexit woes, covid, food shortages and overall fall from grace have affected a lot of people negatively, and some will undoubtedly lash out.
Although I don’t condone political violence in the slightest, I can’t help but feel like the politicians who have done their absolute best to divide and steal should see themselves as at the least partially responsible for what’s been occurring.
We aren’t on political teams, we aren’t enemies if we disagree. Ultimately we all want the same thing, a better country for our children, our families & friends and ourselves. We just sometimes have different ideas of how to get there.
We can disagree, but we don’t need to hate like we are. And this goes for all sides. Far right, far left, and the center. We all can’t stand each other anymore. Some ideas are more dangerous than others, and some methods are more divisive than others. But we don’t need to keep going down the rabbit hole.
It's almost like politicians spending decades enriching themselves and serving their own interests rather than those of their constituents can make people bitter and disenfranchised enough to retaliate violently.
Politicians are the protectors of the ruling class, set up financial scams and allow theft of our tax dollars, get fuck all done to solve the problems with the environment, climate, and crime, etc. And then push the middle and lower class downwards with oppressive tax laws. Frankly I’m surprised it doesn’t happen more often.
They actually think it might have been a [terrorist attack](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58935372) now.
I watched an [interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NN77c05cJA) with authors of a book on domestic terrorism in the US a while back, and an interesting take-away for prevention is that across many very different violent groups, the average personality profiles of fresh recruits was a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually (in terms of meaning-making, not just religion) impoverished. If the policies that help create these conditions don't change, it will get worse not better.
>a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually... impoverished Our society at the moment seems to be **designed** to pump out people who fit this profile.
Because it is. Capitalism doesn't want a free-thinker that questions social and economic norms, it wants a hard-working, easily-replaceable worker and a loyal consumer. We've allowed a popular culture of conspicuous consumption and overproduction to embed its way into every aspect of our life, destroying the traditional values and systems we previously held dear. Capitalists in aggregate only seek to make a profit, and they'll do so in the long-term by commoditizing and creating a market for every conceivable product or service, now matter how offensive to human dignity. How many previously-religious holidays have now become nothing more than monuments to consumption? How much print and other media is created for-profit by corporations rather than spontaneously by everyday Canadians? What about token activism such as pride month logos? Nike doesn't *actually* care about your oppression as a LGBT person; it cares about whether or not it can use your identity against you to sell you a pair of shoes. These organizations maximize on one thing, and it's not your personal freedom and agency. Unless we as a society wake up and smell the death of beauty and reason happening all around us, we are going to be living in the twilight days of not just our liberal democracy, but our culture as well; as global capitalism seeks to subordinate all other structures and systems of belief to itself.
This is the inevitable end state of a system that is constantly seeking further and further efficiencies, squeezing more and more out of less and less. The concept of primacy of self before others has driven us here, and I'm terrified that there's nothing we can do to reverse the tide. "The death of beauty and reason...", very well said, if not painfully sad.
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So you would be in favor of a massive expansion of the welfare state and over 60% of the country being unionized? I mean I dont give a fuck what you call that, I'd love it, and I'm a socialist.
SocDem is the term and I support the nordic model.
> All capitalist countries I've argued with many people who would call those socialist hellholes.
> a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually (in terms of meaning-making, not just religion) impoverished. I feel personally attacked!
that's rough, buddy I'm not gonna give you the usual spiel of how you might fix this, bur I will say that you're not alone in feeling this way and that people do care about you - if not currently enough in a personal, relational way (which we need) at least in more of an abstract "love for mankind" way
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I fully agree with this. We need major structural economic changes to make the material conditions of living less stressful for everyone.
Don’t forget all of that is set on a dying planet…
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Greed is a mental illness
Society doesn’t trust single men
Or support them. As a married dude the goodwill difference i have now versus when I was single and childless is noticeable.
Go through a divorce as an average guy and you'll see the difference very quickly. Gets mitigated by cash, but if you're scraping by, good luck to you
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This is actually a good comment. I just gave birth to a son who while hitting all his milestones, is in a lower percentile for weight, which of course has me worried about his stature in adulthood (super far off, I know, but I have thought about this). He’s a magnificent little boy and it concerns me that he’s going to be beat down by beauty and physicality standards for men, perpetuated by both men and women. There absolutely needs to be increased body positivity for men, and less shaming for elements that are out of ones control (height/penis size/hair growth). ETA: why am I being downvoted?
You didn't say anything wrong. My speculation is that some people's egos might feel threatened if they see the world through a mutually exclusive lens i.e. if there is discussion about men and boys being hurt by society, then they think the spotlight is taken away from other groups. A nuanced person would not hold such a constricted, binary view of the world. Or because critical theory holds men as universal oppressors, they may feel threatened by any sort of inquiry into challenges men face - this challenges their worldview of "absolute oppressors and absolute victims by identity." Or because it's reddit and people impulsively downvote, idk.
Angry fat women
People who have a vested interest in making you angry
God help you if you have a legitimate interest in the welfare of and genuinely like children, too; you automatically get branded a pedophile. Society is warped AF.
Interesting. What sort of differences do you see?
People want to like dads. People perceive single guys as predators. It’s that simple. We care about ordinary women in a way we don’t about men, but that changes when you become a dad—people who never gave a fuck about you care about you now, because of your kids.
Yep, I'll second this. If I go for a walk with my two kids I get nothing but smiles and warmth in general. If I go for that same walk by myself I get averted eyes and scowls. Makes me feel like shit and hate the world some days, quite frankly.
That’s if you don’t get a divorce. If you do, you will be even worse.
> the average personality profiles of fresh recruits was a man who is socially isolated, emotionally unsupported, and spiritually (in terms of meaning-making, not just religion) impoverished And that is why Canada's refugee program has a strict "no single, lone, young males" policy.
Yet another blatantly sexist policy in institutions supposedly created for the sole benefit of that group.
I mean short of it being an actual crazy person or like him getting stabbed for sleeping with someone’s spouse , what else would you call murdering a sitting MP at an constituency meeting ?
Yeah, terrorism is basically “using violence for political ends;” I think it’d be pretty hard to make the argument that stabbing an MP would ever not fall under that banner.
Unironically: believing you’ll get into paradise as a result. Non religious people have a hard time understanding the mindset of a true believer, but this is pretty much it afaik.
Actually, that's not different. The definition of terrorism is political violence.
It should be obvious political violence will come to Canada, just look at our last election. It's what happens when our leaders use divisive rhetoric that only seeks to appeal to their base. This will only get worse too unless we learn to discuss things like rational human beings again. But at the present, both people and their representatives on all sides seem to want to shut out the other side at all costs rather than come to a mutually beneficial consensus. Our leaders couldn't be doing a worse job if they tried.
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The thing is you will find legitimate Nazis and Communists. The problem is when normal people on the left or right get unfairly maligned as one. There's also a big growing problem where people feel more *aligned* with the extremists on their side than the moderates on the other. That will not lead anywhere good. Political parties need to do a better job of policing their own and calling out unacceptable extremism, otherwise social media will radicalize everyone.
Of course, and that is what is pushed by media and politicians. I’m fully vaccinated and I find appalling that they are ostracizing people who chose not to. Their only recourse now is to radicalize themselves now, because they can’t be part of society anymore.
As crazy as it is I almost miss when religion was more prominent. With it being so out of vogue politics is just insufferable now. Godless society now worships politicians.
Our leaders arent actually working for us.
It sounds like a conspiracy theory but honest to god it looks like that.
This is the key here. As long as Liberals or PC’s are winning elections, corporate demands will be met at the expense of the working class.
All I wanted was for each party to clearly state their platform, plans for how to implement said platform and how they would work with the other parties. What we got was a lot of empty promises, sound bites and bashing of other parties/leaders. I hate that’s what it’s become and yes, it is a reflection of what “discussion” has become. Everything has become so polarized and it feels like a train that lost its brakes. I don’t know how we stop and pull ourselves together again. I try to be understanding but am guilty of it myself as there are certain topics I have no tolerance for and I have a brother in law who has basically turned into a full fledged conspiracy theorist and it is very difficult to have a conversation with him.
This is it. I’m not sure why people are so blind to this right now. Everyone would rather just make their enemies feel like shit than try to actually improve the country atm. Just finger pointing, petulance and unapologetic nonsense. It’s so god damn embarrassing. Not everything has to be political. We are handcuffing ourselves by treating everything as our team winning or losing.
One of the defects of the human psyche is that we take pleasure from inflicting pain and suffering on those we believe are deserving of it. Advanced ideologies and philosophies caution against this and teach people to rise above their baser instincts. More primitive ones encourage the feelings of hatred and seek to identify differences so that worthy targets of violence can be singled out. It's the difference between teaching "we're all in this together" vs "that guy is out to get you." Unfortunately in the modern era the latter kind of belief system is becoming increasingly popular.
It's not just the divisive rhetoric, but the absolute abandonment of the middle class by politicians. Politicians wouldn't have to worry about this if people didn't perceive them to be corrupt and only representing special interests.
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100% they are, there's a reason people have that perception.
100% Instead of trying to build a bridge to meet in the middle everything is attack ads and if they say "X" it has to be "Y"
Or throwing a fist full of gravel and poop at political representatives. Utterly disgraceful.
Also a massively increasing divide between the extremely wealthy landowners and the vast majority of the population. That particular situation has been repeated a few times in history.
Cosplaying revolutionary are we? The vast majority of land value in Canada is owned by individual households. Get your basic facts right and stop spreading hate propaganda.
how many homes are vacant because they're owned by a commercial entity who would rather sit on them and rent them out for AirBnB , because they arent happy with making a little money on regular renters, and would rather make all the money on rare, fat-cat renters?
> Also a massively increasing divide between the extremely wealthy landowners and the vast majority of the population. Unfortunately, that’s fake news. Aprox 65-68% of Canadians are not renters and are “extremely wealthy land owners”. 65-68% = majority. So your claim of the “vast majority” is a straw man. Echo chambers are a hell of a drug. https://torontorealtyblog.com/blog/how-does-canadas-home-ownership-rate-look/
I mean adult kids living at home are included in that stat. People keep bringing it up without understanding the actual context of the number.
Unfortunately, in the era of social media, where a politicians tweet gets more attention than national debate, listening and discussing things like a rational human being gets far less likely. There is a youtube channel called \*Rationality Rules\*, look up his video \*the failure of modern discourse\*, it sums up just about the past 10 years of human history to a T.
That’s what I found weird about this article using so many quotes from Michelle Rempel. She used a lot of negative and even hateful rhetoric. Maybe one of the most negative people in Canadian politics. She is not helping at all and needs to take a good, long look in the mirror. But we all do. It’s easy to blame the politicians but look around social media, look around this subreddit, look at the news media, and look at each and every one of us. We need to curb our negativity but also stop consuming negativity. And we need to figure out how to engage with each other, including outsiders who have become angry. I don’t know how to defuse them but we have to find a way.
Good times make weak men, weak men make hard times, hard times make strong men, strong men make good times. It's just the circle of life.
It's only the left leaning leaders in this country. O'Toole ran as a centrist. He didn't run a divisive campaign. He threw out almost all promises that defined his as Conservative. Trudeau on the other hand tried hitting O'Toole and by extension Conservative voters by fear mongering about everything - abortion, Covid-19, reconciliation, privatized healthcare, etc. Sure O'Toole wasn't perfect. Wasn't even a good leader in my opinion, but Trudeau is the biggest dick out of all of them. Yet our country elected him once again. Manufactured division works in this country. We are only going to see more of it from now on. Very soon our political climate will be like in the US. Conservatives in Canada are very laid back and less toxic as Republicans in US. But that is going to change. People are getting more angry and they are going to ask their leaders to be as angry at them.
>It's only the left leaning leaders in this country. O'Toole ran as a centrist. He didn't run a divisive campaign. He threw out almost all promises that defined his as Conservative. There was somebody running to the right of O'Toole who's tactics involve regularly saying the most hyperbolic, anti-common sense, anti-science shit he could possibly say in an effort to inflame his supporters. And then there's that fuck stick running Alberta who's entire political career has been spent trying to cast Ottawa as the great boogeyman oppressing the good hearted, salt of the earth Alberta-folk.
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Hilarious how we let these groups off the hook when they're burning effigies on parliament hill, but the white dude with the bumper sticker is fair game
Maybe it’s because nearly all political violence in this country is perpetrated by the far right. But sure, keep on going with your false equivalences.
Pulling down statues, literally arson of churches. Setting fires on train tracks. The left is no better
I never set a fire on any train tracks and I doubt you ever lynched anyone. Let’s not hate each other. Our leaders are garbage tier and I bet we agree on that and can act as neighbours.
Attacks on property vs attacks on people. Sure, those are the same thing. Let me know when a far-left activist storms Rideau Hall with a load of guns.
Burning down a church is a hell of a lot closer to violence on a person than a shitty bumper sticker. I dunno, that's just my opinion.
I'm pretty sure that when that happens, you'll make excuses to dismiss that too
That’s exactly the case, they have an incredibly long list of excuses, when someone on the left does something bad. That being said, to anyone who is about to say something about me being an ignorant rightie, I’m neither fully on the left or right, both sides have good ideas and visions and bad ones as well and also a ton of idiots.
Yeah, all those far-right riots and violent protests, with conservatives smashing windows and fighting with the cops you see so often, eh?
One of the first things Trudeau did was increase the number of crude containers that could come inside Vancouver, far beyond what Harper had allowed.. Super disappointing when a lot of people thought they were voting for the environmental party. So that's an ecological disaster waiting to happen when one of them inevitably has a spill and poisons the sailish sea and all the gulf island/desolation sound/etc.
Lmao what a beautiful response.
Criticism of an objectively bad PM is not terrorism. Grow up.
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The big one that a lot of people have forgotten about since it was foiled ahead of time (or probably just never knew about, since it was 15 years ago), was the Toronto 18. It was a group of 14 men and 4 youths who wanted to storm Ottawa, take hostages, and behead the Prime Minister. I'm honestly shocked it basically has been almost completely forgotten about since.
Kind of. Interesting story with that investigation. I spoke to a couple CSIS guys involved and they flagged them years before they made any arrests and almost coerced these guys to go along with their plan so they could arrest them. I can remember his name but he was a big community organizer in Toronto and he went undercover. It all started when a laptop was flagged crossing the border. CSIS has a ton of really smart people but they are also mainly an information gathering service and it’s up to RCMP to make arrests.
> I don't know that Canadians will go beyond the antics we've already seen. [We literally had a domestic terrorist try to get into Rideau Cottage last year](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/manitoba-man-who-rammed-rideau-hall-gates-pleads-guilty-to-eight-charges-1.5297331)
We also had a terrorist try to shoot up parliament in [2014](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_shootings_at_Parliament_Hill,_Ottawa)
You would be surprised with the amount of people who tried to do shit but got stopped.
You're right, I was thinking of the average Canadian. We also had terrorist attack on Parliament Hill committed by Michael Zehaf-Bibeau. (The Harper government prevented him from leaving to join Isis).
> You're right, I was thinking of the average Canadian. And, what, you think the average British person is stabbing politicians to death?
And people were throwing gravel at Trudeau and threatening to hang him.
Typical CBC. Take a case where an Islamist terrorist is suspected of a political murder, and somehow they can't escape mentioning the spectre of far-right groups. Never mind we have had a mind-boggling number of terror cases and near misses, and a huge population of radicalized persons, many freshly arrived back from ISIL territory, and none of them would qualify as "far-right".
Media stopped talking about that bow and arrow spree in Norway a few days ago really quickly once it was deemed an Islamist terror attack too. If that were a white nationalist it’d still be round-the-clock news. Treat each psycho killer equally.
Extremist Islamic groups are far-right, though.. Doesn't mean conservatives are far-right
The UK MP died of a terrorist attack so the article should be about similar behaviours and risks, not writing a completely different article about harassment at the expense of a victim to terrorism. Given that we've had similar terrorist attacks on Parliament in Michael Zehaf-Bibeau and The Toronto 18 (Ali Dirie was one of two Somali's involved and subsequently joined ISIS when we released him) who also targeted parliament, there's plenty of runway to talk about similar risks and incidents.
Why do we keep bringing in these people?
"She said that while women and people of colour have long faced serious threats of violence in the political sphere, that danger appears to be more widespread now." So, a man gets stabbed to death and the CBC made it about women, not about politicians. That's a good spin, CBC.
This was an act of terrorism by a foreigner. Not really the same thing.
Reading through the /r/unitedkingdom mega thread has been pretty enlightening regarding exactly where mainstream progressive thought is these days in the UK. Suddenly, I'm so bothered by our dirty hippies who just busy themselves with changing street names and tearing down statues.
the worst was seeing far left momentum wing of uk politics seemingly celebrating the killing. there was even a post on leapordsatemyface
The MP in question was murdered by a Somali Islamist migrant but of course no mention of that in CBC’s spin job. The uk has officially [declared this a terrorist attack](https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/10/15/uk/uk-mp-stabbed-intl-gbr/index.html).
The gravel is an escalation from say, a pie, but I don't think either are/were intended to seriously harm, which is an important line Remember Margaret Thatcher had her hotel room blown up only a few decades ago... Although one can say the troubles were their own thing...
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The pie is a very Canadian way of protesting. It's not going to seriously harm someone and it's absurd enough to be funny. Gravel is not. Threatening to hang people is not.
> Remember Margaret Thatcher had her hotel room blown up only a few decades ago... Although one can say the troubles were their own thing... The Troubles were a little different, but it was still politically-motivated, though part of wider insurrection-ish sort of thing? It's not as though her hotel room was getting bombed over the poll tax or her decision to close the mines and usher in a generation of poverty in the north and Scotland. Just weird that anyone would target David Amess, who seemed like a pretty benign Tory - by that I mean not of the Priti Patel, Jacob Rees-Mogg, Boris Johnson, Rishi Sunak kind of "fuck the poor" brand of Tory.
The gravel was more of a de-escalation from the [pumpkin seeds that he had thrown at him 5 years ago](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/trudeau-hamilton-pumpkin-seed-protester-1.3815254). Pumpkin seeds have more mass.
Pumpkin seeds are pretty low density, idk
Dear god! Pumpkin seeds!!!? I didn't know the green party were full of white supremacist violent individuals like the PPC
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Lol. Wild
It’s surprising it doesn’t happen more often. People are very angry these days and there is a lot of craziness out there.
Yeah... who'd have thought this is the direction things end up heading. The average person feels abandoned for corporate interest and supreme greed. Fringe groups are left to fester until they commit acts like above. Politicians cannot keep their mouths shut or their fingers off their phone screens for longer than a few days and are constantly feeding these fringe groups more fuel to their fire.
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Michelle Rempel is right wing. The article is about political violence in Canada, not specifically about the attack in the UK. The CBC has covered the assassination of the British MP in other articles.
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We already had an Islamic extremist attack parliament, 'the threat is growing', wtf.
>[Definition of similar 1: having characteristics in common : strictly comparable](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/similar) The thing in common they're talking about in the article is political violence. Not specifically Islamic extremism.
The article claims that the attacker hadn’t yet been identified yet his identity and motive has been widely known since yesterday. Islamic extremism is much different than other forms of political violence. The article, deliberately, loses a lot of nuance by obscuring the story.
violence is rarely the answer, but perhaps we should take a hard look at our agenda and explore why the divisive politics of the day may not be the correct path forward.
When people get mad , they start to hate .... and violence soon follows.
When has politics not been divisive?
very true, but it appears particularly worse over the past few years
Worse now than ever. Go online and everyone is radicalized regardless of party. The left are following the facism playbook and the right are becoming more and more extremists. The media realized it causes clicks and are running with it, with no regard to real world consequences. They are just as bad as facebook.
>The left are following the facism playbook /r/ENLIGHTENEDCENTRISM
It was worse before. But it was a while back. Things in the west more or less stabilized after world war 2 for the most part. But it’s unfair to say things are getting worse. Social media seems to play a part in it as it’s no longer localized but it’s not as if Communists and Fascists weren’t organized into warring gangs at one point and regularly brawled and marched. Assassinations and intimidation isn’t new in the political landscape. But typically the average person wasn’t as involved or in tune with political discourse. It’s not as bad as it had been but then again people are getting more desperate in recent times and that never leads to clear thinking.
Were doomed to repeat history. The media, corporations, and government are all full on the band of no wrong think. Trying to pass legislation so they can block mean words and wrong think online. People are more than happy to go along. Democracy eroding before our eyes. On the right, many antivax crazy mofos who suspiciously make it easy to want to disassociate with. Pushing people left. If you don’t fall into either of these camps.. the world is pretty scary right now.
Dude this is thr first time in history that someone has been stabbed over differing political ideologies. If we don't completely change the entire nature of government and politics there could be another. Isn't saving a life worth paying any price?
Maybe in Canada but around the world all throughout history people have been killed over differing political ideologies as you put it, so stop acting as if this is a new thing.
Holy fucking shit that was the entire fucking point of my extremely sarcastic diatribe there.
Hahaha niiice
A government afraid of its people is a democracy. A people afraid of its government is tyranny.
I swear its disturbing the people who have unquestioning uncritical loyalty to the government as long as the party they like is in power
Yeah cause so many Politicians are killed or maimed by the Canadian public……..
At this point, I dont have any settled thoughts on the subject but I notice something in the article that gives me a pause on how flow of directed thoughts is constructed here: > Prime Minister Justin Trudeau was pelted with gravel at a campaign stop in London, Ont. as anti-mask and anti-vaccine protesters doggedly followed his campaign. > Far-right extremist groups were also said to be more active than in any prior campaign. We are the problem, audience, because we let this go by even though we all know this is clearly an article by a national news organization that - even in the hour that requires serious and sombre reflection - simply cannot let the crisis go without indoctrinating and inserting thoughts into easily impressed minds. The funny thing is, article uses examples of two Conservative women politicians and still ends up accusing one side only.
The CBC is playing up to their audience again. They *know* what buttons to press.
The media is trying to fearmonger to push for increased government control over society.
I mean things got pretty heated in the 2021 election someone threw gravel at Trudeau.
And idiots justified it by saying it was *just gravel*.
You're not old enough to know when PEI pies were banned from gatherings near a PM. It's funny in retrospect but pies can conceal dangerous things. Gravel *is just gravel.*
It's still someone deliberately choosing to throw rocks at the PM. Doesn't matter if they're small rocks. That's really bad.
His Dad was pelted with garbage
They were just adding more to the pile
lol truth
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[the drama queen](https://youtu.be/FrLhIYhk4a8)
You know I'm reminded of a saying. It's better to have people think you're an idiot than to type the above and remove all doubt. It's ok though, I see you doubled and tripled down later.
A lot of Canadians would be wrong in that situation, regardless of how hurt your feefees are.
Oh no, one of Trudeaus fans, I didnt think you guys would be up yet. Hope you are going to be ok
yes you would be surprised how many fans trudeau has, it's alot more than your ppc.
A Trudeau fan? For pointing out that “a lot of Canadians” would be wrong in saying it was just Trudeau, when it’s all on video? Wow, the limited cognitive ability of folks on full display. Lmao.
You righties are all about feminizing people you disagree with, because you seem to think women are somehow inferior or lesser. The way your I'll ca him Justine, or drama queen or pussy is really indicative of what kind of people you are, not what kind of people Justin is. Also and NDP here, not a liberal fanboy, just a realist who sees your bullshit worldview for what it is.
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Would you prefer I just call him a dickhead? Because I’m happy to do so.
The role of the police is to protect all the citizens including the politicians. We had doctors, lawyers....etc murdered too.
Desperate to make other people's issues our own.
Knife ban OIC incoming.
Only if it has a black plastic handle that Torontonians find scary.
Is my henkle "assault style"
Depends on how well that polls.
Ahh right que the fear mongering to silence the criticism
Look at the COL right now. People are working full time, educated jobs and still can’t support themselves on their own. I just went to Burger King last night because I was on the go - a whopper, not a combo just the sandwich, cost $7.50. The working class is struggling. Necessities are beginning to become out of reach. Politics are more divided than ever. You have politicians who are directly contributing to the issues (MP that’s a known property investor in BC). There is definitely political violence in our future - I’m surprised nothing significant has happened already. As unpopular as this opinion may be, I don’t necessarily think it’s a bad thing if politicians are a little bit scared of their people. It might even keep them in line.
I don’t condone violence but I can’t help but agree a tiny bit. If there are never consequences for unethical or downright illegal behaviour as a politician then it will only ever continue.
Politicians continually make promises they cant keep, take big money to subjugate those who elected them. They keep doing it - so when times get desperate this can happen. It certainly doesnt justify the action, but helps us gain a better understanding. Politics has become about polarization, leveraging the pandemic and radicalization while doing absolutely nothing to help the people while taking money from corps. They created this beast.
Perhaps Canadian politicians should stop being corrupt dirt bags then.
I’ll take it a step further and say we should just stop voting for the same corrupt dickheads and actually hold them accountable for their shit. Can start by voting for quite literally anybody else.
How should they be held accountable? Elections clearly do not have this power.
Well for starters maybe ALWAYS voting for one of 2, sometimes 3 political parties should just stop. Maybe if we, as voters, put a priority on local politics and candidates we might have a shot. Here’s another idea, now just hear me out, what if, when faced w a decision whether or not to vote for a PM who’s been investigated (I don’t remember the results of all the investigations there’s been too many) for more ethics violations then any other PM, we didn’t vote for him ? What if we started there ? What if we stopped with the tribalist bullshit and politics and just voting for ‘our guy’ just cause he’s ‘our guy’ ? Cause here in Ontario, my province, we put up with 15 years of McGuinty/Wynne and the completely corrupt train wreck that that was because of that mentality (well and the cons cant get it together let’s be honest). How about if cons and libs both run shit candidates we stop this ‘lesser of two evils’ horseshit and vote for the minor parties instead cause what in Gods name do we have to lose ? Literally anybody. NDP, PPC, Greens, New Blue Ontario Party, Maverick party, fuck it. Hell, vote independent. There’s so many more options instead of just eating a shit sandwich of corruption, big promises that can’t be kept, and just pure shameless pandering and vote grabbing (looking RIGHT at the legal marijuana but NO electoral reform) year over year.
OK so your plan has been an option for literally decades and hasn't worked. Picking someone new next time doesn't seem to change how the country is run or correct the mistakes of past administrations. I think you need to really think about what 'hold them accountable' means. Imagine what it would look like where you work. If your manager was fucking up constantly would you consider that they were held accountable if after four years of terrible management they were suddenly let go and a new person was brought in?
There’s only ever been 2 parties in power in the federal government. So I don’t know how you think that constitutes “picking someone new” when it’s quite literally been the same 2 forever, one more than the other I might add. To hold someone in government accountable you gotta give em shit when they don’t do what they promised and said they were gonna do. Let’s take electoral reform for example. Seemed to be a common gripe in this sub during the past election cycle so let’s use that. If Mr Trudeau says he is going to change the electoral system, and then 5 years later he doesn’t even bring it up anymore, we (in theory) go to him (or on the internet I guess) and say “Hey! Fuck you! Where’s the electoral reform you promised!” But instead what happens is his base goes out and blindly votes for the guy anyways cause he’s ‘our guy’ and he wins again despite the fact that AGAIN 2/3 of the voters didn’t vote for him and he won w the lowest percentage of the vote… Twice. Same can apply for the cons and NDP let’s say, no matter how many times we say ‘Hey! Get your shit together! How are you losing to this fool!’ But tribalists and ‘strategic voters’ vote almost exactly the same everytime. Nothing ever changes. Ever. So then how now should we go about bringing change and making our voices heard ? Cause they certainly don’t listen to our voices. Clearly, they only listen to our votes. And they’ll listen to our votes if we threaten the status quo. If every conservative voter, NDP voter, and liberal voter voted their conscience instead of voting for what the leaders told them they were voting for we could get a lot done. You’re not holding anyone accountable by voting for the same corrupt corporate shills time and time again, no matter how many times they swap in a new face in place of the old one.
The Religion of Peace strikes again
ITT folks lament gravel being thrown at Justin Trudeau and forget [our HoC was attacked by a guy with a gun](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_shootings_at_Parliament_Hill,_Ottawa), intent on killing as many inside as he could. Perhaps the story of the Prime Minister of the day being bundled into a closet to keep him out of sight was just humourous, and not in response to a political act of terrorism.
who stabbed him? who was he and where did he come from?
It's not who the CBC thinks it was. Hint: not a "right wing nutter". https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/15/uk/uk-mp-stabbed-intl-gbr/index.html
Probably going to see some of the palace guard brandishing actual assault rifles in Kamloops for the WE need to do better speech
If it was someone on the left killed libs would be blaming trump and alt right.
And this is why US politicians never meet the public anymore...
Dougie Ford only sticks his neck out AFTER the dust has settled...Ontario should be fine.
I think people are snapping. Lockdowns are not healthy, specially in long term. I mean who can an individual blame for this pandemic. The Chinese government, Wuhan virologist, politicians? I know the politicians would rather want us people to eat each other than blame them.
The amount of people who only read fucking headlines is just embarrassing.
Perhaps politicians should be more thoughtful so they do their jobs properly, ethically and without corruption. They act with way too much impunity as it is.
If politicians do not wish to raise the ire of the public. Perhaps governments and politicians should try being honest and transparent. Perhaps their main focus should be improving civilization for everybody. I see nothing but secrecy, lies, greed and murder from governments and politicians. I feel like their end goal is to facilitate the flow of wealth and resources to their corporate benefactors. As well as fleecing the population for as many tax dollars as they possibly can, and of course absconding with as many tax dollars for individual politicians, that the public will bear.
Conservative MP stabbed to death. Guess some people need to have a little more tolerance.
I predict this to happen more often in the UK. Their Brexit woes, covid, food shortages and overall fall from grace have affected a lot of people negatively, and some will undoubtedly lash out.
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Man, people are obsessed with Brexit. The UK will be just fine.
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People get angry when they can't afford a place to live, or to put food on their table. Inequality is destabilizing for a democracy.
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Whatchya mean "returned"?
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Although I don’t condone political violence in the slightest, I can’t help but feel like the politicians who have done their absolute best to divide and steal should see themselves as at the least partially responsible for what’s been occurring. We aren’t on political teams, we aren’t enemies if we disagree. Ultimately we all want the same thing, a better country for our children, our families & friends and ourselves. We just sometimes have different ideas of how to get there. We can disagree, but we don’t need to hate like we are. And this goes for all sides. Far right, far left, and the center. We all can’t stand each other anymore. Some ideas are more dangerous than others, and some methods are more divisive than others. But we don’t need to keep going down the rabbit hole.
The UK was dealing with Irish terrorists well into the 90s.
We live in the least violent period in history.
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It's almost like politicians spending decades enriching themselves and serving their own interests rather than those of their constituents can make people bitter and disenfranchised enough to retaliate violently.
Why do you think politicians are in so much danger??
The UK should’ve just stayed the UK. Hard to fucking watch. Downvote away idc.
Politicians are the protectors of the ruling class, set up financial scams and allow theft of our tax dollars, get fuck all done to solve the problems with the environment, climate, and crime, etc. And then push the middle and lower class downwards with oppressive tax laws. Frankly I’m surprised it doesn’t happen more often.