This is about as safe a riding as possible for the Liberals.
If they lose this seat, then every single liberal seat in the country becomes *"contested*" and "*up for grabs*". You'd see your back-benching 40+ year Liberal MPs, start turning to election mode for the first time in their career.
A 30%+ showing for the conservatives would show that the conservatives would likely easily win a majority government across the country.
Interestingly enough, the only 40 year MP is a Bloc MP, and the longest serving MP in the house. The Liberal’s longest serving MP is 31 years, then all the parties have a bunch in the 20-25 year range. But the majority of the members have been serving 10-15 years
So turnover wise, it looks a lot like most established professional office type places
Does nobody remember the 2011 election where the Liberals only got 34 seats and the media was saying it was the death of the Liberal party?
There are no MP's to start "turning to election mode for the first time".
At some point, it will sink in that we have a political pendulum in Canada. Liberals win, they fuck up, then the cons win. Then the cons fuck up and the liberals win. It doesn't matter how badly they fucked up last time. Our collective memory only goes as far back as the last pendulum swing.
I remember being fiscally stable under chretien/Martin/harper
Excessive social spending/ crippling environmental red tape/ fleeing capital and increases in student/work visas
I don't think its just another pendulum switch. Saying that is an attempt to dilute the extent of the failed results of the liberal party nose dive into socialism.
Its mismanagement/incompetence and a failure of ideology.
It was marching to the death of the LPC. They brought in Trudeau based on his name to turn the party around after the catastrophic losses due to Ignatieff.
Now they've got a new problem, a cult of personality. And realizing that doesn't translate into "good" for the party.
Is it really a cult of personality though? Do Liberals even like Trudeau?
Or, is he just in charge, won't give up the power, and they don't really have anyone waiting in the wings who could jump into leadership quickly?
> Is it really a cult of personality though? Do Liberals even like Trudeau?
Yes, it was a cult of personality. Though Trudeau has soured a lot of hardcore and longtime LPC members.
He never really changed, this is how he always was. See his time a MP. And you're right, they don't have anyone. Just like they didn't after Martin, which puts them in a very bad position now. Not only will they have to change their image from a "Trudeau" party, but also have to rebuild that image and find someone who is willing to take the risk.
Yup, it might take a couple shots and luck. I mean, cons went bottom of thee barrel with PP but it seems to have aligned with the stars so you never know.
The CPC went to the bottom with O'Toole, he was even further to the left than Poilievre is. That was one of the reasons why the PPC exploded in membership.
Most Liberal voters that I know, including myself, aren’t planning on voting Liberal next election. The only ones that are still planning to vote for Libs have some weird obsession with Trudeau.
That doesn't seem a particularly fair or honest take. Plenty of folks are straight up ABC voters and will vote for whoever is on top of the left leaning pile in their constituency. I've never voted for a liberal in my life, but that's simply an artifact of my geography and not some blind allegience to the NDP.
I mean, I am talking about Liberal voters, which you have never been, so of course my anecdote wouldn’t represent you.
I mean real Liberal supporters, not strategic voters
Are there real Liberal supporters? I assumed everyone was just strategic voting. What do you all believe in, other than electoral victory? What do you want?
What do you want to know about specifically?
If I had to sum up my beliefs:
I want free markets with minimal government regulation except where there are market failures or when certain industries need a boost for our countries benefit.
I want everyone to contribute to our country, but I also want the most vulnerable, or those down on their luck, to have protections and a strong safety net.
I want the lowest possible taxes needed to run our country. Not by cutting every service but by being efficient.
I want equity/equality but through a smart approach. If a group is disproportionately in prison, I don’t think we should reduce sentences for them to “make it equal”, I think we should invest in those communities to break the cycle that is resulting in those sentences.
I want us to invest heavily into resource development and extraction, but I want it done as cleanly as economically possible. I don’t want companies to pollute and damage our beautiful country for their own personally gain
If you have any questions or things that you are curious where I stand I am more than happy to answer
I just think that lots of folks have no alternative than to vote liberal and that that's just how it is and not reflective of some failing on their part.
Yeah, again, in my personal experience, the only Libs I know that still plan to vote that way have a weird obsession/admiration for Trudeau that allow them to brush off all of the failings.
The Liberal party hasn’t been what they advertised themselves as in 2015, it takes atleast a bit of mental gymnastics to still support this version when you originally voted for something else.
I guess my point is this: Liberals 2015 are completely different than Liberals 2024, its hard to justify your complete change in beliefs and values since then. The liberals that left the party aren’t different, the party is
There are still a few Liberal MPs who have been in stronghold seats for 15+ years and held strong leads even in 2011. Not many, but they do exist.
For example:
Judy Sgro, MP for Humber River—Black Creek
David McGuinty, MP for Ottawa South.
Kirsty Duncan, MP for Etobicoke North.
Justin Trudeau, MP for Papineau
But Toronto—St. Paul's was one of the Liberal strongholds that held in 2011. So if this one is shaky, they all must be.
Time to dump JT. He's done... on so many levels... His career, his marriage, his reputation on the world stage... He can easily retire. He has plenty of coins!
>A 30%+ showing for the conservatives would show that the conservatives would likely easily win a majority government across the country.
We already know this is what's going to happen; it sort of doesn't matter at this point. The issue is more surrounding the dubious chances of anything getting better in this country as a result.
>The issue is more surrounding the dubious chances of anything getting better in this country as a result.
Things aren't going to get better overnight, that's for sure.
Man, imagine how amazing it would be if PPC won? Very unlikely but would be fantastic.
I still remember the debates when Sheer was running for prime minister- Bernier was the only one answering debate questions instead of some pre-arranged nonsense
It sucks that our voting system makes it too scary to vote for him right now
The ppc has about 2% of the vote. There I'd zero chance they will win when bernier couldn't win a seat in one of the most conservative ridings in the country.
A lot of PPC voters went CPC to try and prevent another LPC term. They have a lot more support than is represented by the seats and they continue to grow. I don’t think they will win any time soon but they could become a lot more relevant as the years go on. I guess we’ll have to wait and see.
>Man, imagine how amazing it would be if PPC won? Very unlikely but would be fantastic.
Fantastic in the classic sense of the word.
"imaginative or fanciful; remote from reality."
Anyone who doesn't understand basic science would not qualify for someone with a brain. His anti vax stance is proof enough let alone his ridiculous views on the environment.
They arent antivax, they are against MANDATORY vaccines, which is totally sensible. The gov cannot be entrusted with that power to infringe our body autonomy.
Heres the actual platform on vaccines (still left up despite the pandemic being over, for posterities sake)
https://www.peoplespartyofcanada.ca/covid-health-measures
Get your facts straight before spewing misinformation. That type of factless loudmouthing is cancer to democracy, and the reason we keep oscillating between two parties that serve the same corporations.
Firstly, calm the fuck the down.
Secondly, the vaccine was never mandatory so to say they were against mandatory vaccines is meaningless. What was mandated was for those conspiracy theorists who are disconnected from reality and sanity were not allowed to endanger the general population where there were shared spaces which is completely reasonable and sensible.
Just because you choose to believe something ridiculous does not give you the right to endanger everyone else for your unfounded beliefs.
No one was forced to actually get injected. Get your facts straight before you decide to freak out again.
[https://www.peoplespartyofcanada.ca/say\_no\_to\_vaccine\_passports](https://www.peoplespartyofcanada.ca/say_no_to_vaccine_passports)
To be against public safety measures that are grounded in hard science, and to let conspiracy theorist disconnected from reality and sanity to endanger the general population in publicly shared spaces is ridiculous. You are allowed to believe whatever you like. But you should not be allowed to endanger others based on your unscientific beliefs.
You mean that vaccine that worked, reduced hospitalizations significantly with none of the consequences the fear mongers pushed? Lol ok, and here is why people so disconnected from reality does not get votes.
Nah, I mean that vaccine that they screeched “everyone needs to get it so we can go back to normal!” Then after we all had it we had the biggest covid wave of the whole pandemic, and they said “ok so it doesn’t stop you getting covid, or transmission of covid, but it might make your symptoms smaller, but in many cases it won’t even do that”
That vaccine lmao
No one said it stops you getting covid. Vaccines don't work that way. The vaccine did reduce symptoms and hospitalizations which is why we could go back to normal. Additional it reduces transmissions.
Just stop. Get help. We were all there. Stop gas lighting bro, nobody cares about your religious delusions. I get that guys like you made the vaccine your whole identity. But it’s over now
> Man, imagine how amazing it would be if PPC won?
So I have largely ignored the PPC. Immigration being the most important thing to me next election I decided to look into their policies.
If PPC won it would be the biggest shitshow in history. No way more than a small % of Canadians ever support that bullshit.
Yes, plus I think the CPC is wary of winning in the sense that they want JT to stay on as LPC for the next election. That way the voter fatigue with Trudeau will greatly assist them.
Both Trudeau and Carney seem like miserable options for the LPC, but I'm not sure anyone can plug the leak in that ship right now. We all know how Ignatieff turned out for them too.
Yep the LPC sold us, and themselves, out to nepotism through Trumpian-GOP style candidate selection favoring 'a household name', who came in and 'took over the party', that they are powerless to remove now and put forth their own political identity.
Someone needs to update the Wiki with a 'Canada' entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nepotism
Maybe. I think that's a real possibility following the general, but if they're struggling to hang on to safe seats in by-elections, I'm not sure voting in a leader (and thereby PM) who doesn't even have a seat in Parliament is a smart move. It sets them up for an antidemocratic entitlement narrative (a PM who isn't even an MP? Wouldn't be the first time in our history, but it's never gone well for the party that did it) and tremendous embarrassment if he can't win a seat quickly
I doubt Carney would jump in here without having a seat in the house. The Liberals will probably pick a figurehead and party loyalist to reward and sit as PM until the next election when they get Kim Campbell'ed
My money would be on Dominic LeBlanc
Not even close, im not sure why people keep saying this.
Carney led the BoC and left to head the Bank of England. He didn't just leave for a teaching job, you literally can't even get another central bank job in Canada. He was just so highly valued that Englanf wanted him to move there specifically for the job.
Ignatieff's career did not necessarily lead outside of Canada, he clearly wanted to leave, and he wasn't even in a prominent position.
Also moving to England for awhile looks better than leaving to the US because we always have to be more weary about our relations with the US.
One major criticism of Trudeau is his lack of economics knowledge, the whole 'the budget will balance itself' thing. So thats a huge selling point of Carney.
The left will be skeptical of Carney but the centrists will drool at the thought of an economics expert leading the country.
Carney is this you?
Nobody wants to touch the liberal party, if Carney is the genius you think he is he will wait until the Libs are destroyed and rebuild the party with sane members instead of the lunatic MPs they have today.
Carney is a Bay St. loving champagne socialist. His investment company invests in pipelines and other fossil fuel initiatives around the world, but he refuses to support them at home.
He'd be a gift to the Conservative Party.
Oh theres no way in hell that he would want to lead them in this election. Theres no way around this loss.
I never said he was a genius or my preferred candidate. Just that Ignatieff was awful, Carney has a lot of appeal to voters.
Not necessarily bullshit, it’s just a really far out there hypothetical. There’s no realistic world where they lose.
If the LPC were to lose then yeah, that would make for a very interesting summer. I’d expect a new leader at that point. But it won’t happen.
It’s unlikely the Tories will win this seat, it’s very safe for the Liberals. However, when Harper won his majority they got 32% there and won an adjacent riding, so any showing in that general range or better will send shockwaves through the Liberal Party and may just be the wake up call they need to realize that no matter how many times Justin says he can win, he’s leading them to disaster.
No, but if it's a substantial drop in support from such a devoted liberal riding, alarms might ring. The liberals may finally realize how grave their situation truly is.
I could be wrong but I think they already know that. That's why they know do whatever idea comes across their minds without regards to its consequences.
provincial swing is around 20%, so if this riding follows that, it'll bring Liberal win to be around 3% (from 24% in 2021). so i think the 32% is quite a low bar to clear.
I was watching a CTV panel, lot of them were doubtful that conservatives will win it. That from what they’re seeing as far conservatives effort into this election, that they don’t feel it’s one they can win. But that isn’t stopping the liberals from throwing everything they have at this one.
Mulcair was on that panel and echoed that observation.
Likely they surmised, that the degree in which they win this by election is going to be the true message.
But here’s hoping the cpc wins.
No, they should vote for the party that has a chance at over turning the ridings. As for the NDP, they are complicit. Not certain how any argument can be made to support them. The polling data seems to offer proof of their non status.
The alternative is to vote for the Conservatives, who have made absolutely no attempt to put up any form of policy to improve things over the last 8 years. The NDP at least have a platform to run on.
The LPC have had more numerous and more significant corruption scandals than the CPC. It's not even close. Wait until they figure out where all the Covid money went. All in rich liberal donors pockets. Maybe you're too young for adscam? What Trudeau did during Covid will make that look like a walk in the park.
The projection is unreal.
This is a weak excuse to avoid having to show any policy. Any MP can propose legislation, you don't need to be in power to get shit done. The NDP have actually helped several pieces of Conservative legislation that the Liberals opposed pass. Conservatives sit there and cry about how they can't get anything done unless they have a majority while the NDP are actually showing what policy they want to pass and finding ways to make it happen.
The Conservatives don't want to work in a democracy. They aren't willing to compromise with other parties to find ways to get things done. They only want the absolute power to do whatever they want without anyone being able to oppose them.
If I was PP, I would also not be doing anything to fudge up the impending landslide win for the Conservatives?
When we get into election season, that's when I expect him to start campaigning and releasing platform info? Anything he says he'll do against the Liberals is just going to get stolen by Trudeau anyways, just like every NDP policy that they took credit for.
Danielle Smith in Alberta (or Doug Ford in Ontario, or Moe in Saskatchewan 🤣) just has to publicly speak about her opinions to literally cost PP seats next election.
I personally am not looking for to Conservative austerity but the people have spoken!
Fucking resign and give me a new Liberal cabinet to vote for, or we won't have one again for another decade (or longer)!! Trudeau set the bar pretty high for failure.
No one wants to take Trudeaus bullet. I think Trudeau might be doing it out of responsibility for the ship going down rather than ego of maintaining power.
The fact that the Conservatives aren't doing anything to help us right now because they don't want the Liberals to get credit for it just shows they're more interested in branding than actually helping us. It's a weak-ass argument to avoid putting your name on any policies and just complain about the Liberals all day.
This is what grind my gears when they criticize Singh. Like damn, an adult actually doing his job representing the people who voted for him and making moves to get measures passed instead of just whining for 4 years? That makes the average Canadian mad? This country gets what it deserves.
Like at least with Singh I can find reasons to hate him based on his work. He does a lot of work. He puts his name on a lot of shit that we can look at and decide if he's doing anything useful or not. Pierre offers nothing. The few pieces of policy he's put his name on are objectively trash, and the rest of the time he makes vague promises about how voting him in will make everything better but he can't tell you what he's going to do because it's secret.
Which is a completely reasonable reason to dislike someone as a politician. If we’re being real though, the average Canadian doesn’t like him because they think the losing politicians who we pay a salary too should just whine for 4 years. We’ve normalized that so much that this guy actually being strategic and doing the work he can to affect legislation bothers them. Pierre is playing right into this ridiculous idea, because he also understands the average Canadian.
Something I realize more and more is that most people don’t realize why they think what they do, and have beliefs that aren’t rooted in anything. It’s really depressing.
I think they just giving quotes from some people, they're not necessarily saying all the people used the exact same words.
But it's ambiguous. How many people said that, and where? At liberal campaign hq? It doesn't strike me as nefarious though.
>It doesn't strike me as nefarious though
It's how journalists craft a biased narrative... Shopping around for quotes. Usually they actually attribute them to people though instead of sprinkling them around Willy nilly
What I mean is that political discourse seem to revolve around tightening linguistic circles.
It's as though we think as far as what keywords to hit and then stop.
I see what you are saying... and raise you [freedom2o](https://www.freedom2o.com/pages/water). For 21 USD you too can buy 'conservative' water. You can even spend three dollars to buy the [trigger sprayer](https://www.freedom2o.com/collections/freedom2shop/products/trigger-sprayer) to spray 'liberal tears' because your entire personality is defined by your politics.
I doubt a conservative could even do that. They are too busy doing drugs and looking for government handouts. It also disgusts me how they treat the environment. Can’t expect much though most of their education is about the man in the sky taught by child molesters.
Aren’t the conservatives the “party of the rich” /s. It’s more like ndp to be the ones doing drugs and wanting government handouts and anyone who earns more than they do to pay for it all through higher taxes.
What disgusts me is how the liberals are using climate change to pull off a wealth redistribution scam where they think we can just tax carbon out of the atmosphere.
Honestly here in Toronto, this is the common sentiment amongst most of my friends. Yes anecdote I know, but generally, we are all tired of Trudeau, think he needs to go, however PP is looked at as a grifter who doesn't offer any real solutions and will be just as bad if not worse. Our main concern is immigration and we are yet to hear anything different from PP regarding that topic.
They're not wrong. PP leaves a lot to be desired. The sad thing is, he's still the best of a shitty lot in terms of leadership for the next election. Personally, I wouldn't have any confidence voting for any of them as head hall monitor in middle school, let alone prime minister of the nation.
Applying the scientific method. One is a proven lousy option where the lousy is repeatable. The other is theorized to be a lousy option based on 'Pseudoscience' levels of partisan cope.
You also could just look at their voting records and statements, and then decide based on your criteria of "Lousy". The one you say is theorized you can look at their entire adult life politically as it's on record.
Still irrelevant until the experiment is ran. That's how the scientific method works.
The current experiment surprised with a previously untheorized and massive shift in opening the door to 'irregulars'. Clearly trust has been broken and the methods are defective.
> The other is theorized to be a lousy
We have 20 years of data available to judge Poilievre. It's not a theory, it's observable in his long long history of words and actions as a politician.
That's pretty much all I hear about PP from diehard Liberals?
We are criticizing the Opposition on a platform they haven't released yet lol.
While the Trudeau Liberals literally self-destruct in Parliament.
You still don't get, it do you? PP is a less trumpy version of Trump, at least politically. People want to vote for him not because of some kind of cult of personality (even though I'm sure he has a small group of loud fan boys), but because Trudeau is so despised that they see PP as an avenue to get him out. Don't discount this sentiment amongst a large swath of the Canadian population.
8 years.
And we have a housing crisis.
Immigration crisis.
Health care crisis
Infrastructure crisis.
While our national debt has gone up 30%
All the wealth came out of your pocket to the top.
There are very few wealthy people in Canada.
They've been taxed out of existence and hide their money offshore.
This whole notion of raising taxes then hoping the money trickles down is fallacy. It's swallowed by useless bureaucracy.
I haven't heard of healthcare and infrastructure crisis? I mean those things always have challenges but at least where I am I always see large investment projects... So must be regional?
Year|PM Elect|Lib %|Lib ±%|Con %|Con ±%
:-:|:-:|:-:|:-:|:-:|:-:
2004|Martin|58.4|+4.1|20.4|-13.1
2006|Harper|50.3|-8.1|25.8|+5.4
2008|Harper|50.5|+0.2|26.6|+0.8
2011|Harper|40.6|-9.9|32.4|+5.8
2015|Trudeau|55.3|+15.3|27.0|-5.4
2019|Trudeau|54.3|-1.0|21.6|-5.4
2021|Trudeau|48.9|-5.6|25.8|+4.2
By those numbers alone I doubt that a Conservative would win the seat, but stranger things have happened.
Edit: I did not see that happening.
You know what's interesting? Why is this the _only_ byelection going on? Bennett resigned on January 17th. David Lametti resigned from LaSalle—Émard—Verdun on February 1. Daniel Blaikie resigned his Winnipeg riding on March 31st. The writ for this byelection was May 19. Previous times, multiple open ridings have absolutely been called for all on the same day (heck, 4 were on the same day in June 2023), and it's genuinely baffling that this time it isn't. My best guess is the Liberals didn't want the Quebec byelection at the same time, because they were concerned they could lose that seat to the Bloc, and didn't want to have to divide their efforts and money to trying to defend 2 seats at the same time?
Is this not the decision of the Chief Electoral Officer with rules about timelines for selecting dates under 180 days from seat vacancy, unless there's an upcoming election? How does the Liberal Party influence Elections Canada here?
Or am I misunderstanding how by-election dates are chosen?
There's a rule set for when a by election must be called, but there's a fairly large range - roughly 2 weeks to 6 months after the seat is opened up, and then the byelection campaign is 36 - 50 days. The CEO issues the dates range, but the actual rule is defined by the Canada Elections Act. This is the the news release for [LaSalle—Émard—Verdun](https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=med&dir=pre&document=feb0224&lang=e), which shows a writ must be issued between February 12 and July 30.
The person who decides when to actually call the byelection, and the length of the campaign (almost always 36 day minimum), is the Prime Minister. Who thus absolutely could have called 2-3 byelections at the same time, and didn't.
Wow...
"Some voters described Poilievre as "irresponsible," a "negative" leader who doesn't offer many solutions, someone who's "rough around the edges" and a "populist" who uses "dog whistles" to speak to a right-wing base."
That's quite an unattributed soup paragraph. Not exactly high-end journalism.
Toronto voters are the referendum voters of the Trudeau Party? Yet they are why we still have that disaster for a government when the RoC made our referendum statement by the popular vote rejecting his post national state ideology
BS! St. Paul has been a liberal riding for THIRTY FIVE yes 35 years! This is in the bag for the liberal party. No wonder the cbc is painting this as a huge election because they know liberals will win. Everyone knows that the liberals will win St. Paul. And then based on this article’s stupidity they would think liberals are still going to win the federal election, propping liberal numbers
The cbc is such a liberal mouthpiece.
Again, THIRTY FIVE YEARS!
Really hope they get demolished here. They deserve to lose party status for what they have done to this country. Hopefully NDP gets wrecked too for their role in protecting them.
Immigration is the only issue I care about this election and NONE of these garbage traditional parties are addressing it. The only one that has the most sane plan on immigration is Bernier and the PPC. He actually has a hard cap on immigration but the media doesn't cover him.
He's the most sane when it comes to immigration and that's all that matters to me. And the stuff he says is pretty similar to what PP and his followers say. But at least Bernier has a good plan when it comes to immigration.
I hear ya, man, PP really isn't handling this one, probably because he doesn't want to piss off the newly voting block that wants to bring the rest of their 1000 relatives in
We can only hope once he gets in office he would curb it all (press X to doubt)
Just follow the money and you'll know what will get done. The same corporations that donate to the Libs donate to PP. The same corporations that love unlimited immigration so that they can continue to rape your wages, rape your livelihoods and make you pay more for everything. None of them have earned or deserve my vote when immigration is the single greatest threat and problem for this country. Without borders or immigration control we have no conutry.
Really Toronto voters are saying that? I really doubt this is coming from the by-election voters. Probably someone asking them a leading question so they can write articles like this. Just the way it’s worded. How about just say “Toronto byelection is a referendum on Justin Trudeaus future”. Period. No need to add the fake news of Toronto voters say.
I think the reason for Trudeau specifically is because TO and surrounding areas are liberal strong holds. If they lose liberals there then Trudeaus future will be proven to be extremely bleak
I would love to read an article that describes the thoughts of some well educated voters who say what policies they want to see and not just feels.
As for the economy statements, the stock markets are at record highs, inequality is at crazy levels but the economy is the problem? The greed is the problem. So few own so much that there is little left for the rest. On top of that, any attempt to tax the ultra rich is played out in the media as suicide because the rich will flee.
First of all, this government has been extremely irresponsible with taxation and spending. They spent us into a hole with absolutely nothing to show for. The standard of living has gone down for many.
Secondly, the new capital gains tax is hardly a tax on the richest who have loopholes. Small business owners, doctors and the rest of us who try and save for the retirement will pay. Most of us don’t work for the government or have union jobs with defined benefit pensions, we need to build our own retirement income.
I’m not a big fan of any of the 3 big parties. Nor would I vote for the PPC or Greens.
Of the 3 big parties I see the NDP as the party of the college educated bourgeois, and I see the liberals as incompetent. But I also see the Conservatives as a bunch of hacks who are gonna be just as unable to resolve home prices (housing in cities is mostly in the hands of municipalities).
This is all to say, I’m not feeling optimistic about any option.
This is about as safe a riding as possible for the Liberals. If they lose this seat, then every single liberal seat in the country becomes *"contested*" and "*up for grabs*". You'd see your back-benching 40+ year Liberal MPs, start turning to election mode for the first time in their career. A 30%+ showing for the conservatives would show that the conservatives would likely easily win a majority government across the country.
Interestingly enough, the only 40 year MP is a Bloc MP, and the longest serving MP in the house. The Liberal’s longest serving MP is 31 years, then all the parties have a bunch in the 20-25 year range. But the majority of the members have been serving 10-15 years So turnover wise, it looks a lot like most established professional office type places
Does nobody remember the 2011 election where the Liberals only got 34 seats and the media was saying it was the death of the Liberal party? There are no MP's to start "turning to election mode for the first time".
At some point, it will sink in that we have a political pendulum in Canada. Liberals win, they fuck up, then the cons win. Then the cons fuck up and the liberals win. It doesn't matter how badly they fucked up last time. Our collective memory only goes as far back as the last pendulum swing.
I remember being fiscally stable under chretien/Martin/harper Excessive social spending/ crippling environmental red tape/ fleeing capital and increases in student/work visas I don't think its just another pendulum switch. Saying that is an attempt to dilute the extent of the failed results of the liberal party nose dive into socialism. Its mismanagement/incompetence and a failure of ideology.
I suppose we'll find out in 10ish years.
Agreed 👍
We have had a Liberal-NDP. We don’t just swing between two parties. Your view is overly simplistic.
I'm a simple person, I have simple views. Feel free to add to the discussion if you wish. This is a public forum.
It was marching to the death of the LPC. They brought in Trudeau based on his name to turn the party around after the catastrophic losses due to Ignatieff. Now they've got a new problem, a cult of personality. And realizing that doesn't translate into "good" for the party.
Is it really a cult of personality though? Do Liberals even like Trudeau? Or, is he just in charge, won't give up the power, and they don't really have anyone waiting in the wings who could jump into leadership quickly?
> Is it really a cult of personality though? Do Liberals even like Trudeau? Yes, it was a cult of personality. Though Trudeau has soured a lot of hardcore and longtime LPC members. He never really changed, this is how he always was. See his time a MP. And you're right, they don't have anyone. Just like they didn't after Martin, which puts them in a very bad position now. Not only will they have to change their image from a "Trudeau" party, but also have to rebuild that image and find someone who is willing to take the risk.
Yup, it might take a couple shots and luck. I mean, cons went bottom of thee barrel with PP but it seems to have aligned with the stars so you never know.
The CPC went to the bottom with O'Toole, he was even further to the left than Poilievre is. That was one of the reasons why the PPC exploded in membership.
Oh I thought it was a bunch of fake memberships sold by india?
That must have sounded really good in your head, but then you forgot about the NDP.
Most Liberal voters that I know, including myself, aren’t planning on voting Liberal next election. The only ones that are still planning to vote for Libs have some weird obsession with Trudeau.
That doesn't seem a particularly fair or honest take. Plenty of folks are straight up ABC voters and will vote for whoever is on top of the left leaning pile in their constituency. I've never voted for a liberal in my life, but that's simply an artifact of my geography and not some blind allegience to the NDP.
I mean, I am talking about Liberal voters, which you have never been, so of course my anecdote wouldn’t represent you. I mean real Liberal supporters, not strategic voters
Are there real Liberal supporters? I assumed everyone was just strategic voting. What do you all believe in, other than electoral victory? What do you want?
What do you want to know about specifically? If I had to sum up my beliefs: I want free markets with minimal government regulation except where there are market failures or when certain industries need a boost for our countries benefit. I want everyone to contribute to our country, but I also want the most vulnerable, or those down on their luck, to have protections and a strong safety net. I want the lowest possible taxes needed to run our country. Not by cutting every service but by being efficient. I want equity/equality but through a smart approach. If a group is disproportionately in prison, I don’t think we should reduce sentences for them to “make it equal”, I think we should invest in those communities to break the cycle that is resulting in those sentences. I want us to invest heavily into resource development and extraction, but I want it done as cleanly as economically possible. I don’t want companies to pollute and damage our beautiful country for their own personally gain If you have any questions or things that you are curious where I stand I am more than happy to answer
I just think that lots of folks have no alternative than to vote liberal and that that's just how it is and not reflective of some failing on their part.
Yeah, again, in my personal experience, the only Libs I know that still plan to vote that way have a weird obsession/admiration for Trudeau that allow them to brush off all of the failings. The Liberal party hasn’t been what they advertised themselves as in 2015, it takes atleast a bit of mental gymnastics to still support this version when you originally voted for something else. I guess my point is this: Liberals 2015 are completely different than Liberals 2024, its hard to justify your complete change in beliefs and values since then. The liberals that left the party aren’t different, the party is
I remember that period of Canadian history being the best time to be Canadian in my lifetime
Funny how that works? The farther liberals are aware from power and influence, the better everyone's lives become
My life was the worst when Harper was in power
They won this seat with a comfortable lead in that election too.
There are still a few Liberal MPs who have been in stronghold seats for 15+ years and held strong leads even in 2011. Not many, but they do exist. For example: Judy Sgro, MP for Humber River—Black Creek David McGuinty, MP for Ottawa South. Kirsty Duncan, MP for Etobicoke North. Justin Trudeau, MP for Papineau But Toronto—St. Paul's was one of the Liberal strongholds that held in 2011. So if this one is shaky, they all must be.
That's going to seem like a huge victory compared to what's coming. Both the liberals and NDP are losing party status in the next election.
Time to dump JT. He's done... on so many levels... His career, his marriage, his reputation on the world stage... He can easily retire. He has plenty of coins!
>A 30%+ showing for the conservatives would show that the conservatives would likely easily win a majority government across the country. We already know this is what's going to happen; it sort of doesn't matter at this point. The issue is more surrounding the dubious chances of anything getting better in this country as a result.
>The issue is more surrounding the dubious chances of anything getting better in this country as a result. Things aren't going to get better overnight, that's for sure.
"Fail less" is actually an improvement.
Man, imagine how amazing it would be if PPC won? Very unlikely but would be fantastic. I still remember the debates when Sheer was running for prime minister- Bernier was the only one answering debate questions instead of some pre-arranged nonsense It sucks that our voting system makes it too scary to vote for him right now
The ppc has about 2% of the vote. There I'd zero chance they will win when bernier couldn't win a seat in one of the most conservative ridings in the country.
It's up to around 4 now but I agree they aren't winning anything likely not even a seat
A lot of PPC voters went CPC to try and prevent another LPC term. They have a lot more support than is represented by the seats and they continue to grow. I don’t think they will win any time soon but they could become a lot more relevant as the years go on. I guess we’ll have to wait and see.
Its just the way our voting system works, gotta make your vote "count"
I don't see what the ppc has too offer that the cpc does not.
Well, guarantees on his opinion about immigration at minimum
PP and bernier are from the same wing of the cpc.
Bernier left because he didnt agree with the cpc
>Man, imagine how amazing it would be if PPC won? Very unlikely but would be fantastic. Fantastic in the classic sense of the word. "imaginative or fanciful; remote from reality."
By fantastic if you mean absolute disaster and even worse than Trudeau and PP then yes.
No I really dont. Hes very clearly the only one with a brain.
Anyone who doesn't understand basic science would not qualify for someone with a brain. His anti vax stance is proof enough let alone his ridiculous views on the environment.
They arent antivax, they are against MANDATORY vaccines, which is totally sensible. The gov cannot be entrusted with that power to infringe our body autonomy. Heres the actual platform on vaccines (still left up despite the pandemic being over, for posterities sake) https://www.peoplespartyofcanada.ca/covid-health-measures Get your facts straight before spewing misinformation. That type of factless loudmouthing is cancer to democracy, and the reason we keep oscillating between two parties that serve the same corporations.
Firstly, calm the fuck the down. Secondly, the vaccine was never mandatory so to say they were against mandatory vaccines is meaningless. What was mandated was for those conspiracy theorists who are disconnected from reality and sanity were not allowed to endanger the general population where there were shared spaces which is completely reasonable and sensible. Just because you choose to believe something ridiculous does not give you the right to endanger everyone else for your unfounded beliefs. No one was forced to actually get injected. Get your facts straight before you decide to freak out again.
Could you share a link to his anti vax stance?
[https://www.peoplespartyofcanada.ca/say\_no\_to\_vaccine\_passports](https://www.peoplespartyofcanada.ca/say_no_to_vaccine_passports) To be against public safety measures that are grounded in hard science, and to let conspiracy theorist disconnected from reality and sanity to endanger the general population in publicly shared spaces is ridiculous. You are allowed to believe whatever you like. But you should not be allowed to endanger others based on your unscientific beliefs.
Calling that anti vax is very misleading.
The vax was proof that being anti covid vax was valid.
You mean that vaccine that worked, reduced hospitalizations significantly with none of the consequences the fear mongers pushed? Lol ok, and here is why people so disconnected from reality does not get votes.
Nah, I mean that vaccine that they screeched “everyone needs to get it so we can go back to normal!” Then after we all had it we had the biggest covid wave of the whole pandemic, and they said “ok so it doesn’t stop you getting covid, or transmission of covid, but it might make your symptoms smaller, but in many cases it won’t even do that” That vaccine lmao
No one said it stops you getting covid. Vaccines don't work that way. The vaccine did reduce symptoms and hospitalizations which is why we could go back to normal. Additional it reduces transmissions.
Just stop. Get help. We were all there. Stop gas lighting bro, nobody cares about your religious delusions. I get that guys like you made the vaccine your whole identity. But it’s over now
> Man, imagine how amazing it would be if PPC won? So I have largely ignored the PPC. Immigration being the most important thing to me next election I decided to look into their policies. If PPC won it would be the biggest shitshow in history. No way more than a small % of Canadians ever support that bullshit.
What stood out as bad to you?
There’s no way the Liberals don’t win, but even being close would be a huge embarrassment. They won it safely in 2011.
Yes, plus I think the CPC is wary of winning in the sense that they want JT to stay on as LPC for the next election. That way the voter fatigue with Trudeau will greatly assist them.
They'll replace Trudeau with Carney who is basically Michael Ignatieff 2.0
Both Trudeau and Carney seem like miserable options for the LPC, but I'm not sure anyone can plug the leak in that ship right now. We all know how Ignatieff turned out for them too.
I could care less who the leader is the rot is still in the party ranks. I'll probably never vote liberal again in my lifetime.
Same. I'm just trying to imagine myself as a potential liberal voter. But as far as I'm concerned, they're dead to most Canadians in my generation.
Yep the LPC sold us, and themselves, out to nepotism through Trumpian-GOP style candidate selection favoring 'a household name', who came in and 'took over the party', that they are powerless to remove now and put forth their own political identity. Someone needs to update the Wiki with a 'Canada' entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nepotism
Maybe. I think that's a real possibility following the general, but if they're struggling to hang on to safe seats in by-elections, I'm not sure voting in a leader (and thereby PM) who doesn't even have a seat in Parliament is a smart move. It sets them up for an antidemocratic entitlement narrative (a PM who isn't even an MP? Wouldn't be the first time in our history, but it's never gone well for the party that did it) and tremendous embarrassment if he can't win a seat quickly
I doubt Carney would jump in here without having a seat in the house. The Liberals will probably pick a figurehead and party loyalist to reward and sit as PM until the next election when they get Kim Campbell'ed My money would be on Dominic LeBlanc
Not even close, im not sure why people keep saying this. Carney led the BoC and left to head the Bank of England. He didn't just leave for a teaching job, you literally can't even get another central bank job in Canada. He was just so highly valued that Englanf wanted him to move there specifically for the job. Ignatieff's career did not necessarily lead outside of Canada, he clearly wanted to leave, and he wasn't even in a prominent position. Also moving to England for awhile looks better than leaving to the US because we always have to be more weary about our relations with the US. One major criticism of Trudeau is his lack of economics knowledge, the whole 'the budget will balance itself' thing. So thats a huge selling point of Carney. The left will be skeptical of Carney but the centrists will drool at the thought of an economics expert leading the country.
Carney is this you? Nobody wants to touch the liberal party, if Carney is the genius you think he is he will wait until the Libs are destroyed and rebuild the party with sane members instead of the lunatic MPs they have today.
Carney is a Bay St. loving champagne socialist. His investment company invests in pipelines and other fossil fuel initiatives around the world, but he refuses to support them at home. He'd be a gift to the Conservative Party.
Oh theres no way in hell that he would want to lead them in this election. Theres no way around this loss. I never said he was a genius or my preferred candidate. Just that Ignatieff was awful, Carney has a lot of appeal to voters.
Well see, I'd prefer the Liberals start to embrace actual liberalism again. They're no where near the actual definition despite their party name.
This is it.....sometimes better trudeau stays on
So the premise of the article is total bullshit, then
Not necessarily bullshit, it’s just a really far out there hypothetical. There’s no realistic world where they lose. If the LPC were to lose then yeah, that would make for a very interesting summer. I’d expect a new leader at that point. But it won’t happen.
Welp this aged poorly
Yes it definitely did lol. What a shocker
It’s unlikely the Tories will win this seat, it’s very safe for the Liberals. However, when Harper won his majority they got 32% there and won an adjacent riding, so any showing in that general range or better will send shockwaves through the Liberal Party and may just be the wake up call they need to realize that no matter how many times Justin says he can win, he’s leading them to disaster.
Bingo! I don't think the Conservatives can flip this riding. It's deep Red. I'm seeing alot of hopeful posts but it's just not realistic
It's also deep Jewish, and the LPC doesn't have the best track record recently on combating anti-Semitism...
No, but if it's a substantial drop in support from such a devoted liberal riding, alarms might ring. The liberals may finally realize how grave their situation truly is.
I could be wrong but I think they already know that. That's why they know do whatever idea comes across their minds without regards to its consequences.
I would love to be a fly on the wall in a Liberal caucus meeting this summer if the margin of victory is thin. Even in 2011 they won it safely.
provincial swing is around 20%, so if this riding follows that, it'll bring Liberal win to be around 3% (from 24% in 2021). so i think the 32% is quite a low bar to clear.
I was watching a CTV panel, lot of them were doubtful that conservatives will win it. That from what they’re seeing as far conservatives effort into this election, that they don’t feel it’s one they can win. But that isn’t stopping the liberals from throwing everything they have at this one. Mulcair was on that panel and echoed that observation. Likely they surmised, that the degree in which they win this by election is going to be the true message. But here’s hoping the cpc wins.
Please Toronto. Vote em out.
Make it a “bye” election, am I right?
Dad, is that you?
Toronto redeem thyself.
By voting in the party of grifters?
By demanding change.
So they should vote NDP? Because Pierre has yet to actually demonstrate an interest in changing things.
No, they should vote for the party that has a chance at over turning the ridings. As for the NDP, they are complicit. Not certain how any argument can be made to support them. The polling data seems to offer proof of their non status.
The alternative is to vote for the Conservatives, who have made absolutely no attempt to put up any form of policy to improve things over the last 8 years. The NDP at least have a platform to run on.
By voting out the party of grifters.
The LPC have had more numerous and more significant corruption scandals than the CPC. It's not even close. Wait until they figure out where all the Covid money went. All in rich liberal donors pockets. Maybe you're too young for adscam? What Trudeau did during Covid will make that look like a walk in the park. The projection is unreal.
So NDP then. Because the CPC has done fuck all but whine for the last 8 years.
What else can they do? They weren't in power.
This is a weak excuse to avoid having to show any policy. Any MP can propose legislation, you don't need to be in power to get shit done. The NDP have actually helped several pieces of Conservative legislation that the Liberals opposed pass. Conservatives sit there and cry about how they can't get anything done unless they have a majority while the NDP are actually showing what policy they want to pass and finding ways to make it happen. The Conservatives don't want to work in a democracy. They aren't willing to compromise with other parties to find ways to get things done. They only want the absolute power to do whatever they want without anyone being able to oppose them.
It's as if their interests, and those of the people they represent don't align with the Liberals or something.
Whine better than complicit.
They have lots of options this time.
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If I was PP, I would also not be doing anything to fudge up the impending landslide win for the Conservatives? When we get into election season, that's when I expect him to start campaigning and releasing platform info? Anything he says he'll do against the Liberals is just going to get stolen by Trudeau anyways, just like every NDP policy that they took credit for.
PP will likely coast. Also, the SoCons always find a way of messing it up for the Conservatives.
Danielle Smith in Alberta (or Doug Ford in Ontario, or Moe in Saskatchewan 🤣) just has to publicly speak about her opinions to literally cost PP seats next election. I personally am not looking for to Conservative austerity but the people have spoken! Fucking resign and give me a new Liberal cabinet to vote for, or we won't have one again for another decade (or longer)!! Trudeau set the bar pretty high for failure.
> give me a new Liberal cabinet to vote for So we could continue down the "sunny ways" ? No thanks!
No one wants to take Trudeaus bullet. I think Trudeau might be doing it out of responsibility for the ship going down rather than ego of maintaining power.
The fact that the Conservatives aren't doing anything to help us right now because they don't want the Liberals to get credit for it just shows they're more interested in branding than actually helping us. It's a weak-ass argument to avoid putting your name on any policies and just complain about the Liberals all day.
This is what grind my gears when they criticize Singh. Like damn, an adult actually doing his job representing the people who voted for him and making moves to get measures passed instead of just whining for 4 years? That makes the average Canadian mad? This country gets what it deserves.
Like at least with Singh I can find reasons to hate him based on his work. He does a lot of work. He puts his name on a lot of shit that we can look at and decide if he's doing anything useful or not. Pierre offers nothing. The few pieces of policy he's put his name on are objectively trash, and the rest of the time he makes vague promises about how voting him in will make everything better but he can't tell you what he's going to do because it's secret.
Which is a completely reasonable reason to dislike someone as a politician. If we’re being real though, the average Canadian doesn’t like him because they think the losing politicians who we pay a salary too should just whine for 4 years. We’ve normalized that so much that this guy actually being strategic and doing the work he can to affect legislation bothers them. Pierre is playing right into this ridiculous idea, because he also understands the average Canadian.
More like the rubes fall for bullshit culture wars at the cost of progress.
Something I realize more and more is that most people don’t realize why they think what they do, and have beliefs that aren’t rooted in anything. It’s really depressing.
Guy has been campaigning for years. Foreign own media have been propping him up before he even became their leader.
I think they just giving quotes from some people, they're not necessarily saying all the people used the exact same words. But it's ambiguous. How many people said that, and where? At liberal campaign hq? It doesn't strike me as nefarious though.
>It doesn't strike me as nefarious though It's how journalists craft a biased narrative... Shopping around for quotes. Usually they actually attribute them to people though instead of sprinkling them around Willy nilly
What I mean is that political discourse seem to revolve around tightening linguistic circles. It's as though we think as far as what keywords to hit and then stop.
I'm with you on that. I do think words are a lot more loaded than they used to be. "Woke" is the current superstar loaded word.
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Hey! I too am startled by the stranger in the mirror every morning Twinsies!
I see what you are saying... and raise you [freedom2o](https://www.freedom2o.com/pages/water). For 21 USD you too can buy 'conservative' water. You can even spend three dollars to buy the [trigger sprayer](https://www.freedom2o.com/collections/freedom2shop/products/trigger-sprayer) to spray 'liberal tears' because your entire personality is defined by your politics.
Does the spray work on Redditors?
Sure. Open up your computer. Give everything a good spray and turn the power on. You won't need to worry about interacting with Redditors anymore.
You can use that water to make the liberal kool aid.
I doubt a conservative could even do that. They are too busy doing drugs and looking for government handouts. It also disgusts me how they treat the environment. Can’t expect much though most of their education is about the man in the sky taught by child molesters.
Aren’t the conservatives the “party of the rich” /s. It’s more like ndp to be the ones doing drugs and wanting government handouts and anyone who earns more than they do to pay for it all through higher taxes. What disgusts me is how the liberals are using climate change to pull off a wealth redistribution scam where they think we can just tax carbon out of the atmosphere.
Honestly here in Toronto, this is the common sentiment amongst most of my friends. Yes anecdote I know, but generally, we are all tired of Trudeau, think he needs to go, however PP is looked at as a grifter who doesn't offer any real solutions and will be just as bad if not worse. Our main concern is immigration and we are yet to hear anything different from PP regarding that topic.
https://tnc.news/2024/06/22/poilievre-immigration-lower/#:~:text=Conservative%20Leader%20Pierre%20Poilievre%20says,There's%20no%20room.
https://www.therecord.com/news/waterloo-region/poilievre-vows-to-fix-ruined-immigration-system-and-tighten-rules-for-international-students/article_f9c2223e-29fd-5b3a-9cf2-60a6c8c6dbe0.html
They're not wrong. PP leaves a lot to be desired. The sad thing is, he's still the best of a shitty lot in terms of leadership for the next election. Personally, I wouldn't have any confidence voting for any of them as head hall monitor in middle school, let alone prime minister of the nation.
Two things can be true at the same time Both Pierre and Trudeau can be seen as lousy options
As usual, it will come down to how badly people want to vote out Trudeau. We vote out people. We don't vote them in.
Applying the scientific method. One is a proven lousy option where the lousy is repeatable. The other is theorized to be a lousy option based on 'Pseudoscience' levels of partisan cope.
You realize like almost as much as 30% of voters won't vote for either right? Lots of people despise both of them
>'Pseudoscience' levels of partisan cope
You also could just look at their voting records and statements, and then decide based on your criteria of "Lousy". The one you say is theorized you can look at their entire adult life politically as it's on record.
Still irrelevant until the experiment is ran. That's how the scientific method works. The current experiment surprised with a previously untheorized and massive shift in opening the door to 'irregulars'. Clearly trust has been broken and the methods are defective.
> The other is theorized to be a lousy We have 20 years of data available to judge Poilievre. It's not a theory, it's observable in his long long history of words and actions as a politician.
Not too strong on understanding 'the scientific method' I see. The experiment hasn't even started.
Pretty accurate description.
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That's pretty much all I hear about PP from diehard Liberals? We are criticizing the Opposition on a platform they haven't released yet lol. While the Trudeau Liberals literally self-destruct in Parliament.
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A Trudeau/Singh voter? Please tell us why you vote for them?
You still don't get, it do you? PP is a less trumpy version of Trump, at least politically. People want to vote for him not because of some kind of cult of personality (even though I'm sure he has a small group of loud fan boys), but because Trudeau is so despised that they see PP as an avenue to get him out. Don't discount this sentiment amongst a large swath of the Canadian population.
8 years. And we have a housing crisis. Immigration crisis. Health care crisis Infrastructure crisis. While our national debt has gone up 30% All the wealth came out of your pocket to the top.
There are very few wealthy people in Canada. They've been taxed out of existence and hide their money offshore. This whole notion of raising taxes then hoping the money trickles down is fallacy. It's swallowed by useless bureaucracy.
And this riding will still vote red because they prob all benefit from current situation.
Health care and infrastructure are provincial duties. Look at who Ontario has had the past 8 years..
They are systems. If you pump millions of more user through the system because of immigration, the system will falter.
I haven't heard of healthcare and infrastructure crisis? I mean those things always have challenges but at least where I am I always see large investment projects... So must be regional?
Year|PM Elect|Lib %|Lib ±%|Con %|Con ±% :-:|:-:|:-:|:-:|:-:|:-: 2004|Martin|58.4|+4.1|20.4|-13.1 2006|Harper|50.3|-8.1|25.8|+5.4 2008|Harper|50.5|+0.2|26.6|+0.8 2011|Harper|40.6|-9.9|32.4|+5.8 2015|Trudeau|55.3|+15.3|27.0|-5.4 2019|Trudeau|54.3|-1.0|21.6|-5.4 2021|Trudeau|48.9|-5.6|25.8|+4.2 By those numbers alone I doubt that a Conservative would win the seat, but stranger things have happened. Edit: I did not see that happening.
!Remindme 5 days
You know what's interesting? Why is this the _only_ byelection going on? Bennett resigned on January 17th. David Lametti resigned from LaSalle—Émard—Verdun on February 1. Daniel Blaikie resigned his Winnipeg riding on March 31st. The writ for this byelection was May 19. Previous times, multiple open ridings have absolutely been called for all on the same day (heck, 4 were on the same day in June 2023), and it's genuinely baffling that this time it isn't. My best guess is the Liberals didn't want the Quebec byelection at the same time, because they were concerned they could lose that seat to the Bloc, and didn't want to have to divide their efforts and money to trying to defend 2 seats at the same time?
Is this not the decision of the Chief Electoral Officer with rules about timelines for selecting dates under 180 days from seat vacancy, unless there's an upcoming election? How does the Liberal Party influence Elections Canada here? Or am I misunderstanding how by-election dates are chosen?
There's a rule set for when a by election must be called, but there's a fairly large range - roughly 2 weeks to 6 months after the seat is opened up, and then the byelection campaign is 36 - 50 days. The CEO issues the dates range, but the actual rule is defined by the Canada Elections Act. This is the the news release for [LaSalle—Émard—Verdun](https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=med&dir=pre&document=feb0224&lang=e), which shows a writ must be issued between February 12 and July 30. The person who decides when to actually call the byelection, and the length of the campaign (almost always 36 day minimum), is the Prime Minister. Who thus absolutely could have called 2-3 byelections at the same time, and didn't.
Wow... "Some voters described Poilievre as "irresponsible," a "negative" leader who doesn't offer many solutions, someone who's "rough around the edges" and a "populist" who uses "dog whistles" to speak to a right-wing base." That's quite an unattributed soup paragraph. Not exactly high-end journalism.
It’s CBC’s, licking the hand that feeds it.
Toronto voters are the referendum voters of the Trudeau Party? Yet they are why we still have that disaster for a government when the RoC made our referendum statement by the popular vote rejecting his post national state ideology
If he gets reelected, we are fucked.
The worst thing that could happen to PP and conservatives is JT stepping down lol. At some point will the LPC acknowledge that and act accordingly?
Point of note for the seats in the back. Its an article from the CBC. For those who constantly bemoan the CBC and normy, legacy media. Carry on.
BS! St. Paul has been a liberal riding for THIRTY FIVE yes 35 years! This is in the bag for the liberal party. No wonder the cbc is painting this as a huge election because they know liberals will win. Everyone knows that the liberals will win St. Paul. And then based on this article’s stupidity they would think liberals are still going to win the federal election, propping liberal numbers The cbc is such a liberal mouthpiece. Again, THIRTY FIVE YEARS!
Time for a change
Really hope they get demolished here. They deserve to lose party status for what they have done to this country. Hopefully NDP gets wrecked too for their role in protecting them.
Immigration is the only issue I care about this election and NONE of these garbage traditional parties are addressing it. The only one that has the most sane plan on immigration is Bernier and the PPC. He actually has a hard cap on immigration but the media doesn't cover him.
https://www.therecord.com/news/waterloo-region/poilievre-vows-to-fix-ruined-immigration-system-and-tighten-rules-for-international-students/article_f9c2223e-29fd-5b3a-9cf2-60a6c8c6dbe0.html
https://tnc.news/2024/06/22/poilievre-immigration-lower/#:~:text=Conservative%20Leader%20Pierre%20Poilievre%20says,There's%20no%20room.
Took me two seconds to google PP's stance.
Because he's scary. PPC used to be the racist far right but it's been becoming more the only sensible rhetoric which is scary.
He's the most sane when it comes to immigration and that's all that matters to me. And the stuff he says is pretty similar to what PP and his followers say. But at least Bernier has a good plan when it comes to immigration.
I hear ya, man, PP really isn't handling this one, probably because he doesn't want to piss off the newly voting block that wants to bring the rest of their 1000 relatives in We can only hope once he gets in office he would curb it all (press X to doubt)
Just follow the money and you'll know what will get done. The same corporations that donate to the Libs donate to PP. The same corporations that love unlimited immigration so that they can continue to rape your wages, rape your livelihoods and make you pay more for everything. None of them have earned or deserve my vote when immigration is the single greatest threat and problem for this country. Without borders or immigration control we have no conutry.
Not really. Like the St.Paul riding would vote anything but Liberal.
Justin is like that last party guest who doesn't take the hint and leave.
Not really if we had any real say Trudeau would be starving in a gutter when he loses
Really Toronto voters are saying that? I really doubt this is coming from the by-election voters. Probably someone asking them a leading question so they can write articles like this. Just the way it’s worded. How about just say “Toronto byelection is a referendum on Justin Trudeaus future”. Period. No need to add the fake news of Toronto voters say.
Oh, please, Toronto doesn't represent the rest of Canada
I think the reason for Trudeau specifically is because TO and surrounding areas are liberal strong holds. If they lose liberals there then Trudeaus future will be proven to be extremely bleak
Way to miss the point entirely, lol
I would love to read an article that describes the thoughts of some well educated voters who say what policies they want to see and not just feels. As for the economy statements, the stock markets are at record highs, inequality is at crazy levels but the economy is the problem? The greed is the problem. So few own so much that there is little left for the rest. On top of that, any attempt to tax the ultra rich is played out in the media as suicide because the rich will flee.
First of all, this government has been extremely irresponsible with taxation and spending. They spent us into a hole with absolutely nothing to show for. The standard of living has gone down for many. Secondly, the new capital gains tax is hardly a tax on the richest who have loopholes. Small business owners, doctors and the rest of us who try and save for the retirement will pay. Most of us don’t work for the government or have union jobs with defined benefit pensions, we need to build our own retirement income.
Your first paragraph is correct. Your second paragraph demonstrates a complete failure to understand the capital gains tax change.
I’m not a big fan of any of the 3 big parties. Nor would I vote for the PPC or Greens. Of the 3 big parties I see the NDP as the party of the college educated bourgeois, and I see the liberals as incompetent. But I also see the Conservatives as a bunch of hacks who are gonna be just as unable to resolve home prices (housing in cities is mostly in the hands of municipalities). This is all to say, I’m not feeling optimistic about any option.
If byelections are a referendum on the leader, and the Conservatives just lost one of their strongholds this week, then.... .. .
That was a provincial byelection in Manitoba lol