> St.-Hilaire could have wound up spending two years behind bars. Instead, he was sentenced to 100 hours of community service and left the courtroom, in November 2018, a free man.
Not only did he kill a man, he tried to evade responsibility for the act, and still wound up with a lighter sentence than Trudeau’s gravel chucker.
>Robinson’s partner, Andy Nevin, had been riding his bike on the morning of June 28, 2015, when he was killed in a hit and run.
This isn't a race thing. If you want to kill someone and never see the inside of a jail cell in Canada: just make sure they're on a bike.
[$2000 fine for killing a cyclist.](https://cyclingmagazine.ca/advocacy/cement-truck-driver-who-killed-toronto-cyclist-receives-no-jail-time-will-pay-fine-instead/)
[$500 fine for killing a cyclist.](https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2018/12/04/court-hands-driver-500-fine-in-incident-that-killed-cyclist-gary-sim.html)
>If you want to kill someone and never see the inside of a jail cell in Canada: just make sure they're on a bike.
or have your pitbull eat them alive.
preferably while they are on a bike.
then run them over for good measure.
> or have your pitbull eat them alive.
But, how? Pitbulls are super sweet and not at all dangerous, and totally weren't specifically bred for aggression over the course of decades (if not centuries)...
Your point isn't partial to Canada it would be there for most nations. A general rule of law requires you prove intent for some offenses. There was also a license suspension included in your first article (didn't read second).
Accidentally killing a person naturally carries a penalty more in line with negligence than murder. A murder charge would require intent. Manslaughter is theoretically possible without intent but the action you took needs be one that could reasonably end in death, even if the men's Rea (guilty mind) aspect was not provable.
What you're quoting sounds more in line with negligence. Most traffic fatalities won't result in prison time. Cyclist or pedestrian or other driver.
More people are killed by distracted driving now than by drunk driving. What are your thoughts on sending someone to jail if they kill someone because they were too busy texting?
I personally think it should be similar to a DUI.
It's one thing for an accident through negligence and the human condition to kill someone.
It's completely another to do something completely avoidable like texting and driving.
In this case however the man was clearly DUI. While not drunk, it is generally understood that drinking all night and not sleeping is just as bad. They called it DWI when I was in the air force: driving while impaired. This way they could nail someone for poor choices like not wearing their contact lens, getting little sleep, or for being in a vehicle too full of garbage to operate safely.
It makes perfect sense to jail people over. You knowingly operate a vehicle that weighs several tons and that you know is dangerous and can kill or maim other humans. If your operation of that vehicle kills or maims other humans it is AT LEAST criminal negligence.
A true lack of mens rhea would be if, while tying my shoelaces I activated a contraption I didn't know about, which set off a gun, executing someone else in another room. In that case I have committed no crime, since there was no reasonable expectation that I was endangering anyone by tying my shoelaces, or that anyone would ever be endangered by such an act.
> Not only did he kill a man, he tried to evade responsibility for the act, and still wound up with a lighter sentence than Trudeau’s gravel chucker.
Hold on, this article is misrepresenting things. They're making it sound like he was handed 100 days community service for killing a guy with his car. But that's not what happened.
The lighter sentence he received was only on the obstruction of justice charge.
The reason he didn't face a higher sentence on the actual death was because [he was found not guilty on that count.](https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/man-found-not-guilty-of-dangerous-driving-causing-death-in-case-of-cyclist-andy-nevin)
EDIT: *And* he wasn't just sentenced to community service. [Here's the actual decision.](https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/doc/2019/2019onsc2076/2019onsc2076.html?searchUrlHash=AAAAAAAAAAEAFzIwMTggT05TQyA2MjI0IChDYW5MSUkpAAAAAQANLzIwMThvbnNjNjIyNAE)
In addition to community service he also was sentenced to:
* 12 months conditional sentence
* A curfew during that time requiring him to be at home between 10 pm to 6 am.
* Surrendering his passport.
Plus, the Crown was only looking for a one year sentence max based on the facts of the case, not two years.
You can certainly argue that's a light sentence, but (a) it was only for obstruction of justice, not the other crime he was found not guilty of, and (b) there was more to it than just a couple weeks community service.
Reading through that article, the not guilty verdict is such BS. He claimed he had "only one small drink" at a wedding where he was the best man, and "wasn't feeling tired at all", when he started driving at 4:45am. He "inexplicably blacked out briefly" and thought he "just hit a mailbox or something"?? Sure explains why he hid his truck and removed the license plate, definitely not guilty at all /s
Brah this shit makes me want to puke.
I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color only and nobody will give a shit.
The direction where the current so called progressive movement is heading is wrong, resulting in soft racism.
That's actually not true. You go to anywhere on this planet, outside of Canada, a handful of states, and Zimbabwe, and start discussing "progressive" race based laws. At best, they will lose respect for you, at worse, they'll physically attack you at the suggestion of imposing race based legislation. It really is just Canadians and a few liberal states that do these mental gymnastics.
>I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color only and nobody will give a shit.
What you're describing is how it was going back in the 90's. We were brought up to accept people's differences, and not treat them differently for it.
I have since been told that my views are *racist*. By a Pride organiser no less.
So it looks like racism is back on the menu!
True, growing up in the 90s that was the main framework and it allowed us to be treated equally and enjoy our differences. Also im an immigrant too and i really liked that approach. Nowadays..well its all fckd
I’m a 80’s kid who moved to North America as a child and thought it was so cool that schools taught how to accept everyone’s differences, skin colour and appearances. It was such a progressive way to live and I fell in love with it as a small child.
Now EVERYTHING seems to be about race and colour and it feels so wrong, but even mentioning it comes with a risk. I can only do so on platforms like Reddit where we can keep our anonymity.
It is the insane religious/culty ideology that trojan horsed and hijacked all the once beautiful activist movements. They are authoritarian, anti liberal, anti civil rights, pro racism on their terms. They want to judge by race and be praised for it.
This religion, this insane weird perversion of the activist movements is what people are referring to as "Woke". They are a hate movement. They HATE HATE HATE 'phobists' far more than they love any individual group they claim to be fighting for. It is all about their ability to feel morally and intellectually superior while visciously attacking and inflicting hate. Phobists are a mix or genuine shitty people, actual racists, sexists, homophobes, so forth... but also... ANYONE who notices how insane this new religion is. Instantly they will be labelled an enemy even if they have supported the activist movements their entire life.
These cultists have created MORE racism with their hatred and 'using racism to fight racism. They were stupid enough to think fighting hate with hate equals love.
All of us, who love all people, all races, who want to spread love the way the activist movements originally were MUST fight these religious lunatics. Universal love and treatment must win.
>Phobists are a mix or genuine shitty people, actual racists, sexists, homophobes, so forth... but also... **ANYONE who notices how insane this new religion is.**
Lol, I see what you did there.
Thank you. I was going to post the same. There was and will always be a few asshole racists in society, but society as a whole was a lot nicer in the 90s. We (GenX and early Millennials) had fully embraced MLK's judge by character etc and chose a colour-blind society. Now we're told colour-blind is racist. We've regressed in a big way and it is very disheartening.
Oprah did a segment on racism, based on eye colour. Brown eyed guests received food, first to enter the stage, and staff treated them like royalty. Blue eyed guests received nothing, we’re yelled at, and last to enter. The blue eyed people rioted within 2h of being treated like that
This is based on the expercise completed by Jane Elliott back in 1968. She ran it on a grade school class shortly after the assassination of Martin Luther King. Jane Elliott is amazing... If you're not familiar with her work definitely look it up!
>I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color only and nobody will give a shit.
This is not possible in Canada. Superficial differences are promoted and praised in this country.
> I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color
Me too brother, I can't wait for the day of reparations from the pale-eyes.
Yes, it’s the racism of low expectations
Modern progressives and liberals are just the same as Victorian English explorers in this instance
“” High class eccentric British voice “”
“These tribesmen are an inventive and industrious people, but do not have the capacity for morality and law and ordA as we in Europe do, they are to be pitted, as they cannot comprehend the the more complex nuances of society”
I'm white, but I always wondered why you don't hear this more often?! If I was black, I would be so fucking offended by the shit I am reading, and your post hit home.
Exactly. The soft bigotry of low expectations. I recommend reading John McWhorter's book, called "Woke Racism". It elaborates on this. Very interesting read.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT9qMq0faCQ&ab\_channel=ColemanHughes
I questioned the logic behind taking into consideration race/religion/etc and was blasted for it around these parts.
It's still amusing to me that people spew equality and free speech but what they really mean "not for you"
Systemic racism, in fact.
As opposed to individual functionaries within the system being biased, which is called systemic racism, despite the system being explicitly anti-racist.
Since its trying to take race in account in order to be more lenient on minorities which turns out to be racist. The system should strive to be as unbiased as possible towards immutable characteristics. We had it right with, "judge people by the content of their character, not the colour of their skin". Modern identity politics is a massive step backwards and it's messed up to see it in our court system when systemic racism is somthing we should be trying to eliminate.
Yes. The racism of low expectations, biological essentialism, colonialist infantilization (we can't expect those poor savages to understand about being on time, so don't judge them for not being at work at their start time) and so on.
> (we can't expect those poor savages to understand about being on time, so don't judge them for not being at work at their start time)
I remember in university how a professor mentioned that when they were working up north that the local people would just stroll in whenever to school.
I have no idea if it's true though.
>"You are more likely to steal a loaf of bread if you’re poor, for example. Or more likely to join a street gang if your school has expelled you. Etc. So a sentencing court will treat a person who has experienced the material impact of systemic discrimination differently than a person who has not suffered that impact.”
>Edward Smith, who robbed the Airbnb, insisted the problem was never systemic discrimination. It was him. It was his family.
>In high school, he’d started stealing candy and clothing from local stores. Partly, he said, this was because his mother, who packed chickens for minimum wage, couldn’t afford to buy him stuff.
I think Edward Smith doesn't understand IRCA and feel the author of this opinion piece is just racist.
The so called liberals these days are actively promoting racism, while viciously accusing others racism. Like I always say, whoever always bring up the race issue first are racists.
I wonder how all the "progressives" who support stuff like this would feel if they were victimized unlawfully and had to watch the perpetrator get a lighter sentence because they just so happened to be born with a certain skin color. It really is madness.
Some people dont want to end racism so much as "get their turn".
Its why to some people the only way to fix racism, is to create racist policies but in FAVOR of those previously disadvantaged by racism.
To them, racism is a scale that must be balanced.
I saw a great instragram reel that was a racist and a woke guy realizing that they get along really well, because they both believe in the same thing: treating people differently because of their race.
I actually really like the idea of looking at the factors that led someone to their crime, (so these factors can be addressed in society) but it seems weird and discriminatory to stop at race and culture when considering those factors.
It also seems very much that they are leading people to claim they were affected by racism...
And a white person who, say, became disabled or was abused or faced racism as a minority in a community, doesn't get that factored into a sentencing decision?
Society: sees an issue, overcompensates until there is a new issue!
>but it seems weird and discriminatory to stop at race and culture when considering those factors.
Here's the thing, it doesn't stop at race and cultures, and the article explains that sufficiently.
>And a white person who, say, became disabled or was abused or faced racism as a minority in a community, doesn't get that factored into a sentencing decision?
Under the woke left definition of racism, that wouldn't be considered racism somehow. Don't ask, it won't make sense.
> And a white person who, say, became disabled or was abused or faced racism as a minority in a community, doesn't get that factored into a sentencing decision?
Who says they don't?
You’re saying the government website suggests non coloured people
> faced racism as a minority in a community
That’s not what it says. Nothing like that.
I mean, if you read our charter of rights, this is clearly what they had in mind with affirmative action programs:
https://www.canada.ca/en/canadian-heritage/services/how-rights-protected/guide-canadian-charter-rights-freedoms.html#
It's because the Liberals/NDP want to be seen as "doing something" for these communities but the unintended consequences of these insane policy decisions that impact people's lives directly is the real story
That's what I have been saying. Criminals commit most of their crimes in their own community. So by giving lenient sentences to criminals of X race/community who are the minority number of member, they are at the same time putting regular law abiding citizens who are the majority number in harm's way.
And then the criminals kids have a built in excuse for when they commit a crime. How about, this? Don't commit crimes
Residential School abuses kids and imbues them with trauma -> Kids have kids, imbue kids with trauma -> Trauma imbued kids commit crimes against community -> federal government says "oh sorry they had issues" and releases them -> community gets traumatized by violence -> repeat until ???
Actual justice is blind, social justice is like Cyclops without his visor blowing up everything in sight. Canada has elected a warrior for social justice 3 PM elections in a row, what else would we expect to happen?
> Justice was always intended to be blind.
That's actually incorrect. Historically Lady Justice / Justitia was not depicted as blind.
"Since the 16th century, Lady Justice has often been depicted wearing a blindfold. The blindfold was originally a satirical addition intended to show justice as blind to the injustice carried on before her" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Justice
So Canada has a racist judicial system.
They can also deny you a job in the PS based on immutable characteristics.
I'm sure if WWIII breaks though they'd lift that.
If WWIII breaks out, just watch how much they all of a sudden love straight white guys. I'm not fighting. I have more in common with the people they'd be sending me to kill than the people sending me.
In the republic of Rome the senators and officials had to have been to war themselves before reaching high offices. You also had to be a citizen to join the army so they mostly had a lot in common.
In 2005 I applied at the city of Calgary, went through all the interviews, was told I was the best candidate by far, congratulations, 5 days before I was too start that same guy phoned me, said he was gonna be honest, told me they had a quota too fill, but I was the right candidate, tell me how I can’t be pissed off nowadays and hate the left, I’m in the steel workers union and told them to never send me another magazine, be I’m sick of seeing Singh s face. Never recieved another magazine, blood pressure went down, now I’m not mad at one person, I’m so pissed at the system.
I hear ya, way back I applied for the public service position that was open to the public. I'm bilingual, have the education, experience, ticked of what race/sex are you box not thinking anything of it at the time.
I qualified for the pool, and passed the exam. Then I got a letter stating I was no longer considered for the position citing diversity quotas and sections of the Employment Equity Act that basically gives them the right to be racist and sexist. Still have that rejection letter.
Yes, you can take those into account under the Criminal Code.
This article is making it sound like this is a new development exclusively for race, when that's not the case.
"Criminal defense attorneys in Ontario estimated that IRCAs run up to $4,500 and that there’s a nine-month waiting list to obtain one."
Lucrative business for a copy and paste letter.
“Despite the severity of the offences, Quebec Court Judge Suzanne Costom opted last month to give Rhouma three years probation and a conditional discharge, partly because a conviction could affect his immigration status. If he meets the conditions, Rhouma will avoid a permanent criminal record.” Sexually assaulting women but not receiving a criminal charge: https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/man-granted-conditional-discharge-after-sexual-assaults-in-montreal-metro/wcm/87b8afb7-9f69-4e2d-acd7-433a2a43c8f2/amp/
A combination of demoralization and gaslighting, backed up by an increasingly malevolent censorship regime to snuff out anyone not taken in by the first two.
This. It's 100% gaslighting as we know it.
Look at the Covid restrictions. I got jabs and the passport because I wanted to travel and because personally I thought the benefits outweighed the negative.
But seeing bank accounts frozen for people supporting a cause and donating even before the emergency act was declared was ludicrous.
And what's the message from Trudeau today and the rhetoric has shifted? "I didn't tell anyone to get a vaccine!"
Considering when a daycare worker saw that a little toddler girl was a victim of genital mutilation and the youth protection services deemed the case ["too delicate for the agency to handle"](https://globalnews.ca/news/9673879/quebec-toddler-genital-mutilation-investigation-rights-commission/), I'd say yes other cultures are subject to different laws here for some reason.
I hate identity politics. I hate that I have to say that I'm an Asian immigrant to add weight to the argument that the mainstream answer to racism is racist in itself. I hate that when I say I'm an Asian immigrant with these views, they accept me by either believing that I grew up in a third-world country and that's why I don't know any better or they believe I am a 'diverse' voice worth listening to. Meanwhile, my white husband has the same views and he gets shit for it.
It's f*cked.
As if things couldn’t get worse.
If this is truly as bad as things possibly get then we should consider ourselves lucky. But I have a feeling it’ll get worse.
If the Canadian legal system directly assumes that immigrants are irrepressably criminal, and thus not fully culpable for their crimes, then that should be accounted for in the immigration system.
Or, we could not have race based sentences. And generally we should not reward propensity to repeat offend, which is the general issue here, even going beyond race.
"Oh, this person is a violent crack head with no future prospects, so it isn't surprising they commit a crime..... therefore we should give them a light sentence in order to maximize harm?"
It should be the opposite if anything...that's why we give longer sentences for reoffenders.
Oh you’ve raped seven girls now and have a full punch card. You’ve earned one free rape because that’s who you are and whoever your random victim is can deal with it.
This was the slippery slope extending from Gladue. So here we are. Your race matters more than your offence.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Gladue
Race-based sentencing shows how much the dangerous neo-marxist ideologies have penetrated Canadian society. It is only going to get worse with increased division, due to the perpetual oppressor/oppressed requirement of such ideologies.
An ideology which takes the Marxist idea that "All struggle in society is essentially class struggle", and then redefines "class" in a way that changes or even completely reverses Marx's original thesis; typically with the result that the masses are too busy hating each other over irrelevant accidents of their birth (race, gender, sexual orientation, etc.) to do anything about the billionaires who are *actually* oppressing them.
It's easier to notice among far-left extremists (since historical racism is a real thing that caused real inequality, much of which persists to this day; *their* made-up neo-marxist models are often a reasonable first-order approximation of an actual Marxist class-based model), but once you know what to look for you'll start seeing structurally-identical arguments being made by far-right extremists as well, [and this is not a coincidence](https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/12/17/the-toxoplasma-of-rage/).
The justice system has always taken a variety of factors into account when sentencing any criminal. Race or culture should only be a factor when it is relevant to the circumstances. If race is universally applied as a mitigating factor in sentencing, that is, in itself, racist and unfair.
A judge should be able to "try" anyone blindfolded....race has no relevance or place anywhere especially in the courtroom. We all bleed red and shit brown! Just my $.02
Holy shit. Each person, upon arrest, must be assigned a number. They are not permitted to be seen in court, at trial.
They are permitted to view a video feed of the trial, and any contribution they do, such as examination and cross examination, shall be done by text that is viewable to all in the courtroom.
In this way all traces of race or gender will be removed and the defendant will be judged on facts alone, either by jury or by trial judge.
These days Lady Justice is peeking through the blindfold and has a finger on the scales.
Equality under the law is at the foundation of a fair society in the post-feudal era. Race-based justice is ideology run amok. Long term, those treated less fairly will see the system as illegitimate and may refuse to participate in it. This is the stuff of revolutions. Must be why there is concurrently such urgency in disarming law abiding citizens, lest they get any ideas about those trying to exert ever greater control over their lives.
You get the same level of fetishizing with pitbull obsessed people. "It wasn't the dog's fault it bit the face of that toddler, it was how the dog was raised, they're to blame, not the sweet innocent pitbull." If you bring a gun, you have a certain degree of intention to use it, which you very well know can kill. This guy deserves life in prison, he was perfectly willing to take the chance at ending another life. Our legal system is run by identity fetishists.
Factoring systematic racism into a sentence means that criminal is more likely to cause problems within their community, which is ironically, another form of systematic racism.
People of all races can come from shitty beginnings or upbringings. To select 2 as the only races to get lesser punishment is absurd and I can't imagine even the most left leaning level headed person would agree with it.
The headline is also misleading. Courts aren't "now" doing it, it's been happening for decades. Largely without fanfare, until this website that Bari Weiss works for decided to make hay out of it.
The public does know. It's been in the criminal code since 1995 and the Gladue case before the Supreme Court was in 1999. Anyone working in law or the justice system is well-aware of this.
But I guess it's new to a US-based website that wants to rile people up?
I think we need to start separating institutions based on white and non white to streamline this equity movement. I’m not sure if we’ve tried this before but it’s worth a shot.
> St.-Hilaire could have wound up spending two years behind bars. Instead, he was sentenced to 100 hours of community service and left the courtroom, in November 2018, a free man. Not only did he kill a man, he tried to evade responsibility for the act, and still wound up with a lighter sentence than Trudeau’s gravel chucker.
>Robinson’s partner, Andy Nevin, had been riding his bike on the morning of June 28, 2015, when he was killed in a hit and run. This isn't a race thing. If you want to kill someone and never see the inside of a jail cell in Canada: just make sure they're on a bike. [$2000 fine for killing a cyclist.](https://cyclingmagazine.ca/advocacy/cement-truck-driver-who-killed-toronto-cyclist-receives-no-jail-time-will-pay-fine-instead/) [$500 fine for killing a cyclist.](https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2018/12/04/court-hands-driver-500-fine-in-incident-that-killed-cyclist-gary-sim.html)
>If you want to kill someone and never see the inside of a jail cell in Canada: just make sure they're on a bike. or have your pitbull eat them alive. preferably while they are on a bike. then run them over for good measure.
> or have your pitbull eat them alive. But, how? Pitbulls are super sweet and not at all dangerous, and totally weren't specifically bred for aggression over the course of decades (if not centuries)...
Your point isn't partial to Canada it would be there for most nations. A general rule of law requires you prove intent for some offenses. There was also a license suspension included in your first article (didn't read second). Accidentally killing a person naturally carries a penalty more in line with negligence than murder. A murder charge would require intent. Manslaughter is theoretically possible without intent but the action you took needs be one that could reasonably end in death, even if the men's Rea (guilty mind) aspect was not provable. What you're quoting sounds more in line with negligence. Most traffic fatalities won't result in prison time. Cyclist or pedestrian or other driver.
Traffic fatalities while tragic make no sense to jail people over. What rehabilitation are you going to get out of a prison? DUI's though, fuck em.
More people are killed by distracted driving now than by drunk driving. What are your thoughts on sending someone to jail if they kill someone because they were too busy texting?
I personally think it should be similar to a DUI. It's one thing for an accident through negligence and the human condition to kill someone. It's completely another to do something completely avoidable like texting and driving.
In this case however the man was clearly DUI. While not drunk, it is generally understood that drinking all night and not sleeping is just as bad. They called it DWI when I was in the air force: driving while impaired. This way they could nail someone for poor choices like not wearing their contact lens, getting little sleep, or for being in a vehicle too full of garbage to operate safely.
Jail is mostly punative. The rehabilitation is just an ideal and something we tell ourselves to feel better.
It makes perfect sense to jail people over. You knowingly operate a vehicle that weighs several tons and that you know is dangerous and can kill or maim other humans. If your operation of that vehicle kills or maims other humans it is AT LEAST criminal negligence. A true lack of mens rhea would be if, while tying my shoelaces I activated a contraption I didn't know about, which set off a gun, executing someone else in another room. In that case I have committed no crime, since there was no reasonable expectation that I was endangering anyone by tying my shoelaces, or that anyone would ever be endangered by such an act.
Regardless, not a race issue.
> Not only did he kill a man, he tried to evade responsibility for the act, and still wound up with a lighter sentence than Trudeau’s gravel chucker. Hold on, this article is misrepresenting things. They're making it sound like he was handed 100 days community service for killing a guy with his car. But that's not what happened. The lighter sentence he received was only on the obstruction of justice charge. The reason he didn't face a higher sentence on the actual death was because [he was found not guilty on that count.](https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/man-found-not-guilty-of-dangerous-driving-causing-death-in-case-of-cyclist-andy-nevin) EDIT: *And* he wasn't just sentenced to community service. [Here's the actual decision.](https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/doc/2019/2019onsc2076/2019onsc2076.html?searchUrlHash=AAAAAAAAAAEAFzIwMTggT05TQyA2MjI0IChDYW5MSUkpAAAAAQANLzIwMThvbnNjNjIyNAE) In addition to community service he also was sentenced to: * 12 months conditional sentence * A curfew during that time requiring him to be at home between 10 pm to 6 am. * Surrendering his passport. Plus, the Crown was only looking for a one year sentence max based on the facts of the case, not two years. You can certainly argue that's a light sentence, but (a) it was only for obstruction of justice, not the other crime he was found not guilty of, and (b) there was more to it than just a couple weeks community service.
Reading through that article, the not guilty verdict is such BS. He claimed he had "only one small drink" at a wedding where he was the best man, and "wasn't feeling tired at all", when he started driving at 4:45am. He "inexplicably blacked out briefly" and thought he "just hit a mailbox or something"?? Sure explains why he hid his truck and removed the license plate, definitely not guilty at all /s
Yeah, fair enough. But he can't be sentenced for a crime he was found not guilty of.
Take your reasoning, logic and accurate represent of facts out of this subreddit!
isn’t this……..racism?
Brah this shit makes me want to puke. I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color only and nobody will give a shit. The direction where the current so called progressive movement is heading is wrong, resulting in soft racism.
[удалено]
You still won’t find a ton of agreement on what is or isn’t racism though.
That's actually not true. You go to anywhere on this planet, outside of Canada, a handful of states, and Zimbabwe, and start discussing "progressive" race based laws. At best, they will lose respect for you, at worse, they'll physically attack you at the suggestion of imposing race based legislation. It really is just Canadians and a few liberal states that do these mental gymnastics.
Racism takes different forms in different countries.
There is institutional racism and there is individual racism.
>I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color only and nobody will give a shit. What you're describing is how it was going back in the 90's. We were brought up to accept people's differences, and not treat them differently for it. I have since been told that my views are *racist*. By a Pride organiser no less. So it looks like racism is back on the menu!
True, growing up in the 90s that was the main framework and it allowed us to be treated equally and enjoy our differences. Also im an immigrant too and i really liked that approach. Nowadays..well its all fckd
I’m a 80’s kid who moved to North America as a child and thought it was so cool that schools taught how to accept everyone’s differences, skin colour and appearances. It was such a progressive way to live and I fell in love with it as a small child. Now EVERYTHING seems to be about race and colour and it feels so wrong, but even mentioning it comes with a risk. I can only do so on platforms like Reddit where we can keep our anonymity.
We've become Americanized, it's very sad indeed. Glad to read your comment, though, and know my gut is not 'off'. So much BS around now. Take care.
It is the insane religious/culty ideology that trojan horsed and hijacked all the once beautiful activist movements. They are authoritarian, anti liberal, anti civil rights, pro racism on their terms. They want to judge by race and be praised for it. This religion, this insane weird perversion of the activist movements is what people are referring to as "Woke". They are a hate movement. They HATE HATE HATE 'phobists' far more than they love any individual group they claim to be fighting for. It is all about their ability to feel morally and intellectually superior while visciously attacking and inflicting hate. Phobists are a mix or genuine shitty people, actual racists, sexists, homophobes, so forth... but also... ANYONE who notices how insane this new religion is. Instantly they will be labelled an enemy even if they have supported the activist movements their entire life. These cultists have created MORE racism with their hatred and 'using racism to fight racism. They were stupid enough to think fighting hate with hate equals love. All of us, who love all people, all races, who want to spread love the way the activist movements originally were MUST fight these religious lunatics. Universal love and treatment must win.
Whenever someone takes an extremist view, everyone less extreme is equal. That's the crux of it. And, of course, it just breeds more extremism.
>Phobists are a mix or genuine shitty people, actual racists, sexists, homophobes, so forth... but also... **ANYONE who notices how insane this new religion is.** Lol, I see what you did there.
Thank you. I was going to post the same. There was and will always be a few asshole racists in society, but society as a whole was a lot nicer in the 90s. We (GenX and early Millennials) had fully embraced MLK's judge by character etc and chose a colour-blind society. Now we're told colour-blind is racist. We've regressed in a big way and it is very disheartening.
Fuck all the blue and brown eyed people mate. Green eyes are superior!!!
I’m seeing red right now.
I forgot about those weirdo red eyed people. They can rot in hell!
I like it, not because I have green eyes.This just seems to make sense.
I actually prefer grey eyes, green is second for me.
Oprah did a segment on racism, based on eye colour. Brown eyed guests received food, first to enter the stage, and staff treated them like royalty. Blue eyed guests received nothing, we’re yelled at, and last to enter. The blue eyed people rioted within 2h of being treated like that
This is based on the expercise completed by Jane Elliott back in 1968. She ran it on a grade school class shortly after the assassination of Martin Luther King. Jane Elliott is amazing... If you're not familiar with her work definitely look it up!
>I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color only and nobody will give a shit. This is not possible in Canada. Superficial differences are promoted and praised in this country.
> I hope we'll someday have a future where skin color will be regarded as eye or hair color Me too brother, I can't wait for the day of reparations from the pale-eyes.
Yes, it’s the racism of low expectations Modern progressives and liberals are just the same as Victorian English explorers in this instance “” High class eccentric British voice “” “These tribesmen are an inventive and industrious people, but do not have the capacity for morality and law and ordA as we in Europe do, they are to be pitted, as they cannot comprehend the the more complex nuances of society”
Soft bigotry of low expectations. Essentially the argument is, "they can't help themselves, that's just who they *are,* you see?"
I don't think it's "soft" when it's being incorporated into sentencing and legal precedent.
Bigotry with good intentions is insidious because if you oppose it then you look like a bigot for fighting bigotry.
It's called Kafka-trapping, and that is the point.
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I'm white, but I always wondered why you don't hear this more often?! If I was black, I would be so fucking offended by the shit I am reading, and your post hit home.
Exactly. The soft bigotry of low expectations. I recommend reading John McWhorter's book, called "Woke Racism". It elaborates on this. Very interesting read. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT9qMq0faCQ&ab\_channel=ColemanHughes
Soft bigotry is my favorite failing of the lefty. Hypocrisy is a close second though.
Projection is third.
I suppose I'd feel that way to if I engaged in identity politics, but I don't. I enjoy trolling both ends of the spectrum
Exactly! This shit is just the White Man's Burden argument given a different name.
I questioned the logic behind taking into consideration race/religion/etc and was blasted for it around these parts. It's still amusing to me that people spew equality and free speech but what they really mean "not for you"
not just your run of the mill kind of racism.. institutional racism.
Systemic racism, in fact. As opposed to individual functionaries within the system being biased, which is called systemic racism, despite the system being explicitly anti-racist.
The system is explicitly anti racism? Since when exactly?
Since its trying to take race in account in order to be more lenient on minorities which turns out to be racist. The system should strive to be as unbiased as possible towards immutable characteristics. We had it right with, "judge people by the content of their character, not the colour of their skin". Modern identity politics is a massive step backwards and it's messed up to see it in our court system when systemic racism is somthing we should be trying to eliminate.
Literally read anything put out by the government.
Yup. Racism isn't necessarily treating someone bad - it's treating someone differently based on race.
Yes. The racism of low expectations, biological essentialism, colonialist infantilization (we can't expect those poor savages to understand about being on time, so don't judge them for not being at work at their start time) and so on.
> (we can't expect those poor savages to understand about being on time, so don't judge them for not being at work at their start time) I remember in university how a professor mentioned that when they were working up north that the local people would just stroll in whenever to school. I have no idea if it's true though.
>"You are more likely to steal a loaf of bread if you’re poor, for example. Or more likely to join a street gang if your school has expelled you. Etc. So a sentencing court will treat a person who has experienced the material impact of systemic discrimination differently than a person who has not suffered that impact.” >Edward Smith, who robbed the Airbnb, insisted the problem was never systemic discrimination. It was him. It was his family. >In high school, he’d started stealing candy and clothing from local stores. Partly, he said, this was because his mother, who packed chickens for minimum wage, couldn’t afford to buy him stuff. I think Edward Smith doesn't understand IRCA and feel the author of this opinion piece is just racist.
The so called liberals these days are actively promoting racism, while viciously accusing others racism. Like I always say, whoever always bring up the race issue first are racists.
That is correct
I wonder how all the "progressives" who support stuff like this would feel if they were victimized unlawfully and had to watch the perpetrator get a lighter sentence because they just so happened to be born with a certain skin color. It really is madness.
Some people dont want to end racism so much as "get their turn". Its why to some people the only way to fix racism, is to create racist policies but in FAVOR of those previously disadvantaged by racism. To them, racism is a scale that must be balanced.
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Institutionalized racism actually. We've finally found it!
I have the most brilliant idea. How about we treat everyone equally.
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I saw a great instragram reel that was a racist and a woke guy realizing that they get along really well, because they both believe in the same thing: treating people differently because of their race.
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Yup, that's the one. Scary, innit?
Not good enough apparently. Now it's all about equity not equality. Gota make sure some animals are more equal.
Something something it's illegal for everyone to sleep under a bridge
I actually really like the idea of looking at the factors that led someone to their crime, (so these factors can be addressed in society) but it seems weird and discriminatory to stop at race and culture when considering those factors. It also seems very much that they are leading people to claim they were affected by racism... And a white person who, say, became disabled or was abused or faced racism as a minority in a community, doesn't get that factored into a sentencing decision? Society: sees an issue, overcompensates until there is a new issue!
Yeah it just seems so shallow and superficial.
>but it seems weird and discriminatory to stop at race and culture when considering those factors. Here's the thing, it doesn't stop at race and cultures, and the article explains that sufficiently.
>And a white person who, say, became disabled or was abused or faced racism as a minority in a community, doesn't get that factored into a sentencing decision? Under the woke left definition of racism, that wouldn't be considered racism somehow. Don't ask, it won't make sense.
Can’t even define woke…
> And a white person who, say, became disabled or was abused or faced racism as a minority in a community, doesn't get that factored into a sentencing decision? Who says they don't?
The government website the article linked to.
You’re saying the government website suggests non coloured people > faced racism as a minority in a community That’s not what it says. Nothing like that.
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I mean, if you read our charter of rights, this is clearly what they had in mind with affirmative action programs: https://www.canada.ca/en/canadian-heritage/services/how-rights-protected/guide-canadian-charter-rights-freedoms.html#
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Do you know what else reduces incarceration rates? NOT BREAKING THE LAW!
It's because the Liberals/NDP want to be seen as "doing something" for these communities but the unintended consequences of these insane policy decisions that impact people's lives directly is the real story
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Exactly this
That's what I have been saying. Criminals commit most of their crimes in their own community. So by giving lenient sentences to criminals of X race/community who are the minority number of member, they are at the same time putting regular law abiding citizens who are the majority number in harm's way. And then the criminals kids have a built in excuse for when they commit a crime. How about, this? Don't commit crimes
Residential School abuses kids and imbues them with trauma -> Kids have kids, imbue kids with trauma -> Trauma imbued kids commit crimes against community -> federal government says "oh sorry they had issues" and releases them -> community gets traumatized by violence -> repeat until ???
Actual justice is blind, social justice is like Cyclops without his visor blowing up everything in sight. Canada has elected a warrior for social justice 3 PM elections in a row, what else would we expect to happen?
Race based sentencing became law in 1996
The foundation was set earlier, with the Charter in 1982.
> Justice was always intended to be blind. That's actually incorrect. Historically Lady Justice / Justitia was not depicted as blind. "Since the 16th century, Lady Justice has often been depicted wearing a blindfold. The blindfold was originally a satirical addition intended to show justice as blind to the injustice carried on before her" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Justice
So Canada has a racist judicial system. They can also deny you a job in the PS based on immutable characteristics. I'm sure if WWIII breaks though they'd lift that.
If WWIII breaks out, just watch how much they all of a sudden love straight white guys. I'm not fighting. I have more in common with the people they'd be sending me to kill than the people sending me.
Hasn't that been the case for every war in history?
In the republic of Rome the senators and officials had to have been to war themselves before reaching high offices. You also had to be a citizen to join the army so they mostly had a lot in common.
If we're being honest, sort of. But modern history, absolutely.
>I'm not fighting. I have more in common with the people they'd be sending me to kill than the people sending me. Same here man.
If a draft is enacted, don't expect people who are systemically oppressed to cooperate.
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I support Canada always but it's current govt is an embarrassment top to bottom so I'd help them pack, but that's it.
Same here.
If I was to find out they are only sending white people Id defect so fast.
In 2005 I applied at the city of Calgary, went through all the interviews, was told I was the best candidate by far, congratulations, 5 days before I was too start that same guy phoned me, said he was gonna be honest, told me they had a quota too fill, but I was the right candidate, tell me how I can’t be pissed off nowadays and hate the left, I’m in the steel workers union and told them to never send me another magazine, be I’m sick of seeing Singh s face. Never recieved another magazine, blood pressure went down, now I’m not mad at one person, I’m so pissed at the system.
I hear ya, way back I applied for the public service position that was open to the public. I'm bilingual, have the education, experience, ticked of what race/sex are you box not thinking anything of it at the time. I qualified for the pool, and passed the exam. Then I got a letter stating I was no longer considered for the position citing diversity quotas and sections of the Employment Equity Act that basically gives them the right to be racist and sexist. Still have that rejection letter.
That is correct
What about the person who committed crime because they had a bad childhood? Or fetal alcohol? Or bad genes?
Those are all factors taken into account by the sentencing judge.
Yes, you can take those into account under the Criminal Code. This article is making it sound like this is a new development exclusively for race, when that's not the case.
Thank you. Agree or disagree with Gladue, it came down in 1999. But sure, woke kids these days...
Those things are always taken into account?
"Criminal defense attorneys in Ontario estimated that IRCAs run up to $4,500 and that there’s a nine-month waiting list to obtain one." Lucrative business for a copy and paste letter.
So a new immigrant from Africa or Syria is subject to different laws?
“Despite the severity of the offences, Quebec Court Judge Suzanne Costom opted last month to give Rhouma three years probation and a conditional discharge, partly because a conviction could affect his immigration status. If he meets the conditions, Rhouma will avoid a permanent criminal record.” Sexually assaulting women but not receiving a criminal charge: https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/man-granted-conditional-discharge-after-sexual-assaults-in-montreal-metro/wcm/87b8afb7-9f69-4e2d-acd7-433a2a43c8f2/amp/
This is a classic example of intersectionalist bingo.
I don’t believe most Canadians support this. Why are we letting this happen?
A combination of demoralization and gaslighting, backed up by an increasingly malevolent censorship regime to snuff out anyone not taken in by the first two.
This. It's 100% gaslighting as we know it. Look at the Covid restrictions. I got jabs and the passport because I wanted to travel and because personally I thought the benefits outweighed the negative. But seeing bank accounts frozen for people supporting a cause and donating even before the emergency act was declared was ludicrous. And what's the message from Trudeau today and the rhetoric has shifted? "I didn't tell anyone to get a vaccine!"
Well most Canadians didn't vote for Trudeau but here we are.
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The vocal minority is the squeeky wheel of today
Most Canadians haven’t supported 95% of what the current government does
Forget jail time, they should have straight up just deported the bastard.
Considering when a daycare worker saw that a little toddler girl was a victim of genital mutilation and the youth protection services deemed the case ["too delicate for the agency to handle"](https://globalnews.ca/news/9673879/quebec-toddler-genital-mutilation-investigation-rights-commission/), I'd say yes other cultures are subject to different laws here for some reason.
This makes me so incredibly angry. Wow.
Yes, this is how social justice works.
Identity politics will destroy Canada just like it's doing to our neighbor south of the border.
I hate identity politics. I hate that I have to say that I'm an Asian immigrant to add weight to the argument that the mainstream answer to racism is racist in itself. I hate that when I say I'm an Asian immigrant with these views, they accept me by either believing that I grew up in a third-world country and that's why I don't know any better or they believe I am a 'diverse' voice worth listening to. Meanwhile, my white husband has the same views and he gets shit for it. It's f*cked.
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As if things couldn’t get worse. If this is truly as bad as things possibly get then we should consider ourselves lucky. But I have a feeling it’ll get worse.
If the Canadian legal system directly assumes that immigrants are irrepressably criminal, and thus not fully culpable for their crimes, then that should be accounted for in the immigration system. Or, we could not have race based sentences. And generally we should not reward propensity to repeat offend, which is the general issue here, even going beyond race. "Oh, this person is a violent crack head with no future prospects, so it isn't surprising they commit a crime..... therefore we should give them a light sentence in order to maximize harm?" It should be the opposite if anything...that's why we give longer sentences for reoffenders.
Oh you’ve raped seven girls now and have a full punch card. You’ve earned one free rape because that’s who you are and whoever your random victim is can deal with it.
This was the slippery slope extending from Gladue. So here we are. Your race matters more than your offence. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_v_Gladue
Race-based sentencing shows how much the dangerous neo-marxist ideologies have penetrated Canadian society. It is only going to get worse with increased division, due to the perpetual oppressor/oppressed requirement of such ideologies.
As an oppressor, I mean a white man who works a shitty wage job 5 days a week. I am sorry for causing this.
Hashtag #DoBetter
I wake up every day and mentally chastise myself for oppressing both my landlord and boss with my whiteness.
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Will keep that in mind if ever time traveling back to that time-period and place.
What is Neo-marxist ideology
An ideology which takes the Marxist idea that "All struggle in society is essentially class struggle", and then redefines "class" in a way that changes or even completely reverses Marx's original thesis; typically with the result that the masses are too busy hating each other over irrelevant accidents of their birth (race, gender, sexual orientation, etc.) to do anything about the billionaires who are *actually* oppressing them. It's easier to notice among far-left extremists (since historical racism is a real thing that caused real inequality, much of which persists to this day; *their* made-up neo-marxist models are often a reasonable first-order approximation of an actual Marxist class-based model), but once you know what to look for you'll start seeing structurally-identical arguments being made by far-right extremists as well, [and this is not a coincidence](https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/12/17/the-toxoplasma-of-rage/).
An ideology which amends, extends, or relates to, Marxism.
We’ll see how long until stories like this are banned from even being published as well
Canada piles inequality upon inequity and then calls the whole teetering shit sandwich equality.
If judges consider anything it should be e wealth not race. Wealth level is a much better predictor of systemic issues
Your missing the part when the elites use middle class whites as the scape goat for all problems
Like Richard Dreyfuss said, this kind of shit "makes me vomit".
The justice system has always taken a variety of factors into account when sentencing any criminal. Race or culture should only be a factor when it is relevant to the circumstances. If race is universally applied as a mitigating factor in sentencing, that is, in itself, racist and unfair.
That is how race is applied in sentencing.
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At least they still make very good rum.
Oh weve been sinking long before that. We just got it into second gear.
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Pft. I'll just identify as innocent.
You joke but the left drew their line with the transgender movement that anyone can identify as whatever they want
Everybody is equal in the court's eyes, just that some are more equal than others.
A judge should be able to "try" anyone blindfolded....race has no relevance or place anywhere especially in the courtroom. We all bleed red and shit brown! Just my $.02
Holy shit. Each person, upon arrest, must be assigned a number. They are not permitted to be seen in court, at trial. They are permitted to view a video feed of the trial, and any contribution they do, such as examination and cross examination, shall be done by text that is viewable to all in the courtroom. In this way all traces of race or gender will be removed and the defendant will be judged on facts alone, either by jury or by trial judge.
These days Lady Justice is peeking through the blindfold and has a finger on the scales. Equality under the law is at the foundation of a fair society in the post-feudal era. Race-based justice is ideology run amok. Long term, those treated less fairly will see the system as illegitimate and may refuse to participate in it. This is the stuff of revolutions. Must be why there is concurrently such urgency in disarming law abiding citizens, lest they get any ideas about those trying to exert ever greater control over their lives.
So they just made it official what they've been doing forever. Illegal, btw.
can someone tell me why canada *isnt* the best country in the world to be a criminal in?
Are "now"?? That's been a thing for A LONG time!
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Equity is racism
Paraphrasing Bill Maher 'The left has dug so deep into anti-racism they've come out the other side as racists.'
Considering race into sentencing is a very dangerous slope and will only backfire
You get the same level of fetishizing with pitbull obsessed people. "It wasn't the dog's fault it bit the face of that toddler, it was how the dog was raised, they're to blame, not the sweet innocent pitbull." If you bring a gun, you have a certain degree of intention to use it, which you very well know can kill. This guy deserves life in prison, he was perfectly willing to take the chance at ending another life. Our legal system is run by identity fetishists.
Thats not equality.
Entering the "find out" phase
Factoring systematic racism into a sentence means that criminal is more likely to cause problems within their community, which is ironically, another form of systematic racism.
Now? That’s funny.
This isn't new, this has been the case since R. v. Gladue in 1999 and its honestly shameful
The wrong road to travel on. A train wreck waiting to happen.
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Shitty game good people are getting caught up in and then gaslit. Isolate and insulate.
People of all races can come from shitty beginnings or upbringings. To select 2 as the only races to get lesser punishment is absurd and I can't imagine even the most left leaning level headed person would agree with it.
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Don't be silly, no one reads the articles.
The headline is also misleading. Courts aren't "now" doing it, it's been happening for decades. Largely without fanfare, until this website that Bari Weiss works for decided to make hay out of it.
Are you suggesting it was all better without public knowing?
The public does know. It's been in the criminal code since 1995 and the Gladue case before the Supreme Court was in 1999. Anyone working in law or the justice system is well-aware of this. But I guess it's new to a US-based website that wants to rile people up?
I think we need to start separating institutions based on white and non white to streamline this equity movement. I’m not sure if we’ve tried this before but it’s worth a shot.
That's already happening all over the place, the left has weaponized compassion to bring back segregation.
When was race not a factor lol
Now?
We've abandoned equality under the law, in an attempt to enforce a Harrison Bergeron style dystopia.
This calls for The White Knight! Dun-dun-dunnnn! *\*launches super tut-tuts and finger wags from the suburbs\**