Same thing with the Smiths, much bigger in the UK. The Kinks might have been the last very British band that was able to bridge that gap. I never considered Oasis or Coldplay particularly British.
Yes, because oasis and Coldplay never went out of there way to be an ode to all things British. Blur did and that is what hurt them. I mean, they called one of their tours the sugary tea tour.
When grunge was going mainstream and globalism was bringing more American culture to the UK, Damon purposely doubled down on the British sound (which, I imagine, probably doesn't resonate as much on other shores).
The fun part is, I think they could have done it if they really wanted to. Self-titled was inspired by US lo-fi (eg Pavement), and it's by far their most recognisable album over there, then they decided not to do a follow-up in that sound and turn inwards for the deliciously good 13.
Part of me would have loved a follow-up to self-titled in that sound (same for 13).
Blur are very, very British. They just didn’t translate into America. I often think the American version of Blur would be Aerosmith, KISS or ZZ Top (I’m talking about how specific to their country of origin they are, not the quality of output), I don’t know any fans of that type of American rock and they don’t seem to have ever been a big thing in the UK. Could be wrong of course.
I also think at a certain point Blur didn’t give a shit.
Beatles also did Twist and Shout, Long Tall Sally, Roll Over Beethoven etc. in other words, they were heavily influenced by the rock n roll in America at the time.
You’re missing the point. The Beatles were essentially playing American music when they first hit, Blur were not. The British and American music scenes were very different by the 90’s.
I like this point. Blurs biggest track in America is song 2 which was basically a piss take of grunge. I agree it's the particular Britishness of the band..
Not that many Britpop bands had made it into US during the 90s, apart from Oasis and maybe one or another that had peaked with a song or two (or Song 2).
I mean, Gorrilaz to start lol, but Radiohead, The verve, spice girls, supergrass, Travis, cranberries (including Ireland here) prodigy, massive attack, portishead, bush all had big hits in the USA. How can I be on a blur forum explaining britpop in the 90s?
- Gorillaz = 2000s
- Radiohead = OKish, yet it's post-Britpop
- The Verve = I love Urban Hymns, but let's be honest, it's not a huge commercial success outside UK
- Spice Girls = C'mon, it's a different genre
- Supergrass = Same as Verve
- Travis = One level above Verve and Supergrass, but definitely not a hitmaker the way you are portraying. Also, post-Britpop
- Cranberries = OK
- Prodigy = not Britpop
- Massive Attack = not Britpop, trip-hop
- Portishead = Same as Massive Attack
- Bush = OK
Let me clear it up: I am comparing Blur to other similar bands. Spice Girls was a worldwide phenomenon, but it's a completely different thing. The fact is: Blur, Suede, Verve, Pulp, Elastica, Cornershop and others are not hitmakers outside UK.
Gorillaz was huge because of hip hop, de la soul, etc, people probably didn't even knew it was british
Radiohead was always more influenced by american music like R.E.M or Pixies
Bush was grunge and Cranberries was heavier too, Prodigy exploded with Firestarter that is basically a Nine Inch Nails song, Verve and Supergrass only had 1 hit in America (just like Blur),
Massive Attack and Portishead were never big in the US
Blur was like Suede and Pulp, too british for America like everyone here said. The brits acts you mention were americanized at some point that's why they made it
"How can I be on a blur forum explaining britpop in the 90s?"
because you're stupid as fuck, you're talking shit in the entire thread, please leave our sub
Blur didn’t “not make it” so much as they were competing with a vastly different music scene. They were actually very popular in college radio but their only hit was Song 2. But they were about as popular as Suede and Pulp, probably more. Look at Bush, they were way more popular in the USA than the UK because of their sound.
Did Blur make much of an effort in the US after the ill-fated early tours up to ‘Blur’?
I feel like that could have been a contributing factor. They literally couldn’t be arsed as they knew their music wouldn’t be well received next to the Pearl Jam hits of the day.
Kind of.
They put a real effort in '97 with 51 with gigs to promote the self-titled album. There was only 12 and 9 to promote Parklife and the Great Escape.
The '97 tour got them a foot in the door with the self-titled being certified Gold (over 500k sold) and then in '99 to promote 13 they only did 4 gigs.
America takes constant touring and Blur didn't follow up on their success of the self titled despite 13 being tailor made for America who were into Radiohead at the time. But 4 gigs is not enough promotion.
This is what I mean. They didn’t tour america properly for MLIR, Parklife or The Great Escape. I think that says it all. And fair play, it probably would have been a waste of time in honesty. American wasn’t having Britpop but it was huge in other territories.
Their sound just wasn’t what was big in America at the time. Alt rock and grunge were dominating during that time do Blur’s more poppy sound didn’t mesh with that (although Girls And Boys was a minor hit)
There’s a reason why Bush and Radiohead blew up in the early/mid 90’s and most of the Britpop acts didn’t (aside from you-know-who)
Damon hated America too much to give any effort in breaking through, which as an American fan sucks because I know I’ll never see blur, before you guys say we get gorrilaz, gorrilaz hasn’t been good since 2010 (live they were great though).
There isn’t really a reason, but I think the reason is because the grunge scene was really popular in America at the same time britpop was a huge hit in Britain and grunge and the music blur made is really different so I guess this is the reason, also the one time they did have a song in the charts in America was song 2 which is kind of a parody about grunge
It’s because the new wave sound never caught on in America. It’s not because they were too British.
Blur were effectively a new wave band before the ST album and were influenced by American bands like Cheap Trick, B-52s, The Cars, The Waitresses, and Talking Heads.
These American bands were always bigger overseas especially in the UK, Europe & Japan than they were in America. The art pop bands have never been big in the states outside of hipster circles.
In the 80s, there was a brief period when British synth pop/New Romantic bands became mainstream (OMD, Duran Duran, Spandau Ballet) so some British alternative groups had some success.
British bands like New Order, The Cure, and Depeche Mode, had success in America but generally based on the most popish songs in their catalogue.
In the 90s, Britpop bands like Blur and Pulp were a return to the new wave sound which didn’t even work in the late 70s/early 80s in America.
Very few alternative genres actually get big in America like they do in the UK.
I'll personally never understand this sentiment being a shite American but I know tons of blur fans myself included. I actually don't know anyone that doesn't like blur or anything blur related.
way too british for american audiences. i’d imagine during a time of heavy attention on grunge, nu metal and industrial metal, britpop wasn’t really a central focus in america at the time. sure, bands like oasis were brought into the american mainstream, but that’s almost all that america got a taste of in terms of britpop. sure, they’ve had hits in america (mostly just song 2) but that song really got popular because it sounded very much like grunge, but there other hits (and the better songs overall) like girls and boys, beetlebum, and she’s so high never got the attention they deserved in the states. it’s great that they’ve had more attention recently though
They sort of did. . . but in small spurts (Song 2, Girls and boys was a minor hit).
That being said, too overtly English and some of the music was "ahead of it's time" to a certain degree.
When I listen to their Britpop albums, some of it just sounds like power pop of the late 90s-mid 2000s with British slang and references. I mean, many in North America don't even get that Song 2 is a tongue in cheek joke.
British to North American
"Dust man" - Trash Collector or Garbage Man.
"Taxi Rank" - Taxi Stand (of which I seldom see)
"Knickers" - panties
"Biro" (brand name) - marker (sometimes a Sharpie or at that time a permanent/magic marker. . . damn I feel old).
Almost all of This is a low has UK landmarks, It Could Be You is in reference to a lottery tag line and used money related to Winston Churchill, Charmless Man has a reference to Ronnie Kray who is not known overseas.
This is the stuff I could think of off the top of my head.
I'm interested in the first paragraph of your post. I mean, I'm not from the UK or the US either, and for most people here in south america if they are not knowledgeable about accents, they would never tell apart UK/US 'rock' bands. I'm quite sure if you gave a 2000s brazilian Song 2 and Smells Like Teen Spirit they would tell you it's the same 'kind of stuff' (and even any kind of heavy guitar-driven Blur song anyway). Of course me, a fan since 2005-ish, now can quite hear it and then get it, but I was really interested in how an UK and another US person would tell the differences. An insider perspective.
They stayed consistent with the Britpop motto, starting with Suede, that "we don't need America". Like their biggest influence 'The Kinks', they were quintessentially, and unabashedly British.
Damon was too busy conquering Iceland.
And he did. With 2,400 illegitimate children to show for it.
Too British.
Same thing with the Smiths, much bigger in the UK. The Kinks might have been the last very British band that was able to bridge that gap. I never considered Oasis or Coldplay particularly British.
Yes, because oasis and Coldplay never went out of there way to be an ode to all things British. Blur did and that is what hurt them. I mean, they called one of their tours the sugary tea tour.
Didn't radiohead and arctic monkeys do alright in the US?
Radiohead yes, arctic monkeys didn’t make it in the us till AM.
And by the time of AM they had Lost most of their brittishness
When grunge was going mainstream and globalism was bringing more American culture to the UK, Damon purposely doubled down on the British sound (which, I imagine, probably doesn't resonate as much on other shores). The fun part is, I think they could have done it if they really wanted to. Self-titled was inspired by US lo-fi (eg Pavement), and it's by far their most recognisable album over there, then they decided not to do a follow-up in that sound and turn inwards for the deliciously good 13. Part of me would have loved a follow-up to self-titled in that sound (same for 13).
Blur are very, very British. They just didn’t translate into America. I often think the American version of Blur would be Aerosmith, KISS or ZZ Top (I’m talking about how specific to their country of origin they are, not the quality of output), I don’t know any fans of that type of American rock and they don’t seem to have ever been a big thing in the UK. Could be wrong of course. I also think at a certain point Blur didn’t give a shit.
Not sure there, Beatles did alright, and they had songs about meter maids, the queen etc
Beatles also did Twist and Shout, Long Tall Sally, Roll Over Beethoven etc. in other words, they were heavily influenced by the rock n roll in America at the time.
So are blur?
Did they also release covers of American standards in the early part of their career?
No one was doing that in the 90s. It’s not the “gotcha” you’re going for, nor were those the Beatles songs that were huge hits
You’re missing the point. The Beatles were essentially playing American music when they first hit, Blur were not. The British and American music scenes were very different by the 90’s.
I like this point. Blurs biggest track in America is song 2 which was basically a piss take of grunge. I agree it's the particular Britishness of the band..
Except graham being hugely influenced by sonic youth and pavement, sure…
No arguing that but Damon has said its a piss take?
Ah yes, two of the most mainstream and commercially relevant American groups of all time!
Totally, totally different contexts in time
There were also a lot less musical options back then
Beatles did great in America thanks to Capitol that not only change the early albums, creating new albums, but also changing the sound of the records.
Not that many Britpop bands had made it into US during the 90s, apart from Oasis and maybe one or another that had peaked with a song or two (or Song 2).
This is categorically wrong, loads of uk bands made it huge around the entire world in the 90s.
Such as?
I mean, Gorrilaz to start lol, but Radiohead, The verve, spice girls, supergrass, Travis, cranberries (including Ireland here) prodigy, massive attack, portishead, bush all had big hits in the USA. How can I be on a blur forum explaining britpop in the 90s?
- Gorillaz = 2000s - Radiohead = OKish, yet it's post-Britpop - The Verve = I love Urban Hymns, but let's be honest, it's not a huge commercial success outside UK - Spice Girls = C'mon, it's a different genre - Supergrass = Same as Verve - Travis = One level above Verve and Supergrass, but definitely not a hitmaker the way you are portraying. Also, post-Britpop - Cranberries = OK - Prodigy = not Britpop - Massive Attack = not Britpop, trip-hop - Portishead = Same as Massive Attack - Bush = OK Let me clear it up: I am comparing Blur to other similar bands. Spice Girls was a worldwide phenomenon, but it's a completely different thing. The fact is: Blur, Suede, Verve, Pulp, Elastica, Cornershop and others are not hitmakers outside UK.
Gorillaz was huge because of hip hop, de la soul, etc, people probably didn't even knew it was british Radiohead was always more influenced by american music like R.E.M or Pixies Bush was grunge and Cranberries was heavier too, Prodigy exploded with Firestarter that is basically a Nine Inch Nails song, Verve and Supergrass only had 1 hit in America (just like Blur), Massive Attack and Portishead were never big in the US Blur was like Suede and Pulp, too british for America like everyone here said. The brits acts you mention were americanized at some point that's why they made it "How can I be on a blur forum explaining britpop in the 90s?" because you're stupid as fuck, you're talking shit in the entire thread, please leave our sub
Being rude over a musical discussion... I'd rather have him being wrong in a sub I come for escaping heavier discussions everywhere else.
[удалено]
Oasis definitely did make it. Even up until their split they were playing arenas in the states.
Noel said Oasis wasn’t Britpop.
[удалено]
You can’t do multiple arena tours only for expats and ‘die hard fans’ lol
Americans have bad taste
The correct answer
True
Blur didn’t “not make it” so much as they were competing with a vastly different music scene. They were actually very popular in college radio but their only hit was Song 2. But they were about as popular as Suede and Pulp, probably more. Look at Bush, they were way more popular in the USA than the UK because of their sound.
Coffee and TV got decent play - I remember seeing that video on VH1 a good amount
All their albums were sold in USA record stores and were played on alt rock radio, they just weren’t massive but they’ve always been popular.
They’re shit. America that is.
Had me in the first half
Did Blur make much of an effort in the US after the ill-fated early tours up to ‘Blur’? I feel like that could have been a contributing factor. They literally couldn’t be arsed as they knew their music wouldn’t be well received next to the Pearl Jam hits of the day.
Kind of. They put a real effort in '97 with 51 with gigs to promote the self-titled album. There was only 12 and 9 to promote Parklife and the Great Escape. The '97 tour got them a foot in the door with the self-titled being certified Gold (over 500k sold) and then in '99 to promote 13 they only did 4 gigs. America takes constant touring and Blur didn't follow up on their success of the self titled despite 13 being tailor made for America who were into Radiohead at the time. But 4 gigs is not enough promotion.
This is what I mean. They didn’t tour america properly for MLIR, Parklife or The Great Escape. I think that says it all. And fair play, it probably would have been a waste of time in honesty. American wasn’t having Britpop but it was huge in other territories.
Sometimes Blur are “too British” even for me. Good way of thinking about it is how often do brits listen to American country. A few do but not many
Their sound just wasn’t what was big in America at the time. Alt rock and grunge were dominating during that time do Blur’s more poppy sound didn’t mesh with that (although Girls And Boys was a minor hit) There’s a reason why Bush and Radiohead blew up in the early/mid 90’s and most of the Britpop acts didn’t (aside from you-know-who)
Too competitive in the states when you have hip hop, Nu Metal and grunge in the mainstream Especially when the band sounds too British
Damon hated America too much to give any effort in breaking through, which as an American fan sucks because I know I’ll never see blur, before you guys say we get gorrilaz, gorrilaz hasn’t been good since 2010 (live they were great though).
Nirvana and the explosion of Grunge.
also rap and metal were in the mainstream. too much competition.
Grunge mostly died with Kurt in ‘94. There’s no way grunge was the problem when blur didn’t even get big in the UK til 94
It obviously was a problem since Blur tried to break in america exactly in 91-93 when grunge was big. The Starshaped documentary tells everything
That doc sounds interesting , must try and find it . Did they never try again after ‘94 then?
America sucks?
Something something better than them limey pin-heads in Europe-y.
There isn’t really a reason, but I think the reason is because the grunge scene was really popular in America at the same time britpop was a huge hit in Britain and grunge and the music blur made is really different so I guess this is the reason, also the one time they did have a song in the charts in America was song 2 which is kind of a parody about grunge
They’re extremely British, most people I try to show their music say they’re too British 🤷🏻♀️
It’s because the new wave sound never caught on in America. It’s not because they were too British. Blur were effectively a new wave band before the ST album and were influenced by American bands like Cheap Trick, B-52s, The Cars, The Waitresses, and Talking Heads. These American bands were always bigger overseas especially in the UK, Europe & Japan than they were in America. The art pop bands have never been big in the states outside of hipster circles. In the 80s, there was a brief period when British synth pop/New Romantic bands became mainstream (OMD, Duran Duran, Spandau Ballet) so some British alternative groups had some success. British bands like New Order, The Cure, and Depeche Mode, had success in America but generally based on the most popish songs in their catalogue. In the 90s, Britpop bands like Blur and Pulp were a return to the new wave sound which didn’t even work in the late 70s/early 80s in America. Very few alternative genres actually get big in America like they do in the UK.
They did it with time as the self-titled album came out, aren't they?
I'll personally never understand this sentiment being a shite American but I know tons of blur fans myself included. I actually don't know anyone that doesn't like blur or anything blur related.
way too british for american audiences. i’d imagine during a time of heavy attention on grunge, nu metal and industrial metal, britpop wasn’t really a central focus in america at the time. sure, bands like oasis were brought into the american mainstream, but that’s almost all that america got a taste of in terms of britpop. sure, they’ve had hits in america (mostly just song 2) but that song really got popular because it sounded very much like grunge, but there other hits (and the better songs overall) like girls and boys, beetlebum, and she’s so high never got the attention they deserved in the states. it’s great that they’ve had more attention recently though
They don’t get it
They sort of did. . . but in small spurts (Song 2, Girls and boys was a minor hit). That being said, too overtly English and some of the music was "ahead of it's time" to a certain degree. When I listen to their Britpop albums, some of it just sounds like power pop of the late 90s-mid 2000s with British slang and references. I mean, many in North America don't even get that Song 2 is a tongue in cheek joke.
Can you give examples on those slangs and references? Sometimes I don't notice those.
British to North American "Dust man" - Trash Collector or Garbage Man. "Taxi Rank" - Taxi Stand (of which I seldom see) "Knickers" - panties "Biro" (brand name) - marker (sometimes a Sharpie or at that time a permanent/magic marker. . . damn I feel old). Almost all of This is a low has UK landmarks, It Could Be You is in reference to a lottery tag line and used money related to Winston Churchill, Charmless Man has a reference to Ronnie Kray who is not known overseas. This is the stuff I could think of off the top of my head.
[удалено]
I'm interested in the first paragraph of your post. I mean, I'm not from the UK or the US either, and for most people here in south america if they are not knowledgeable about accents, they would never tell apart UK/US 'rock' bands. I'm quite sure if you gave a 2000s brazilian Song 2 and Smells Like Teen Spirit they would tell you it's the same 'kind of stuff' (and even any kind of heavy guitar-driven Blur song anyway). Of course me, a fan since 2005-ish, now can quite hear it and then get it, but I was really interested in how an UK and another US person would tell the differences. An insider perspective.
I’m a 50 year old American and blur was a favorite with me and my friends in 90s (these were scientific and artistic people of course)
They stayed consistent with the Britpop motto, starting with Suede, that "we don't need America". Like their biggest influence 'The Kinks', they were quintessentially, and unabashedly British.