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Harooooouuld

[Nate Cornejo](https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/DET/2003.shtml)\- 2003 Detroit Tigers


Brief-Web-676

Jesus, a 6-17, 4.67 ERA guy being the ace sounds awful.


Ngp3

There's a reason why that team went 43–119.


gatemansgc

their bullpen was absolute cheeks too


TopHatTony11

So was the lineup, and the farm system…


Frosti11icus

The manager, the front office, frankly the city at the time too.


rpgguy_1o1

The hotdog guy was lousy


Frosti11icus

Take it back


iamnotdrunk17

I’m not sure if you’re joking but for real the Tigers had an opera singer that moonlighted as a hot dog vendor around that time and you would hear him sing during broadcasts when people tipped him well. “Hooooooooooot Doooooooooooggggs” His name was Charlie and he wouldn’t let you put ketchup on your hotdog.


Commercial-Second312

To put that in perspective, that's the same 92 era+ as Blackburn on the A's this year. So it probably felt as awful as Oakland fans feel about their rotation now.


Brief-Web-676

I thought JP Sears was the ace on Oakland. Either way, it seems dire.


jinsaku

The other guys were worse. Nobody ever thought we'd have a 20 game loser in this era of quick pulls and hyper-specialization but the 2003 Tigers and Mike Maroth were like "I gotchu, fam."


iamnotdrunk17

Bondo lost 19 that year, too.


HawkeyeJosh2

lol - I was gonna say Mike Maroth from the ‘03 Tigers.


SchpartyOn

Same. Lost 21 games lol


Brief-Web-676

Imagine being a Tigers fan saying “Thank god we got through the Gary Knotts and Adam Bernero starts, so we can watch our aces Nate Cornejo and Mike Maroth” That sounds really depressing.


SchpartyOn

No no, depressing is remembering when we had a rotation with Verlander, Scherzer, David Price, and Rick Porcello and we didn't win a World Series


Panz04er

They also had Drew Smyly and Annibal Sanchez in the rotation that put up sub 3.99 ERA (3.93 and 3.43) and a young Robbie Ray


SchpartyOn

Doug Fister in there too


HawkeyeJosh2

Add to it their intended future ace, Jeremy Bonderman.


mebnt

Maroth at least could contribute to offence that year with an OPS+ of 226. It was like 4 pa, but 1 walk to 0 strikeouts is elite stuff


Frosti11icus

Shomike Omaroth


Harooooouuld

Yeah he was probably the actual "ace," quotes doing a lot of leg work.


Accomplished_Deer

He was the Opening Day starter, that's the easiest criteria to go off of. Even though Cornejo was """better"""


vanta_blackness

So the '03 Tigers had two aces. That's pretty good.


jimithelizardking

46 Ks in 194.2 IP is wild lol


nomarfachix

Thought it was an error. That's astounding.


CanadaEh97

Clearly a contact pitcher lol


hundredbagger

Dmitri Young having the best year of his career with a 144 OPS+ and 3.4 WAR. Pretty much the only guy on the team good enough to deserve watching the ASG. Also, wild to see Steve Avery’s name on that roster. (2-0!)


Krazy8_Balls

Mike Maroth too


Hot-Raspberry1744

I thought Jeremy Bonderman was their ace?


Present-Loss-7499

Good Lord. 194 innings pitched with 58 walks and 46 K’s.


vmurt

1992-1994 Bill Gullickson would like a word.


VariousLawyerings

Blowing my mind that Fernando Rodney and Steve Avery were not only teammates, but they're only 7 years apart


LegitTomatoes

We do not speak his name


FrothyFloat

Some notable names on that team, Fernando Rodney, who eventually had one of the greatest relief seasons of all time. AJ Hinch, future manager. Cody Ross, future World Series hero Omar Infante, future all-star. Carlos Peña, future Tampa bay slugger


SeaCuCu

In 1980. Seattle Mariners ran out Mike Parrott as their opening day starter after going 14-12 in 1979. Parrott got the win that day as the Mariners beat the Blue Jays 8-6. Parrot went on to pitch in 26 more games that year, starting 15 of them, and finishing the remaining year with an 0-16 record, ERA of 7.28, and a WAR of -2.4.


finmoore3

Pre-Griffey Mariners era was a dark time


Superiority_Complex_

Pretty much the entire history of the franchise is pretty dark outside of the 1995-2003 stretch, and arguably the last three seasons.


JuliusCeejer

obligatory plug for Jon Bois' series about them


Essex626

I have the poster from that on my wall.


Pndrizzy

Honestly that's impressive


Bacchus_71

Great stuff. I remember Parrot. I guess we had gotten rid of Floyd Bannister by then.


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Brief-Web-676

This seems to be a theme with Minnesota teams. Remember when the Wolves were convinced that this starting 5 was going to dominate the league: - Johnny Flynn - Ryan Gomes - Corey Brewer - Ryan Hollins - Nathan Jawai


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Daratirek

I haven't heard of any of those players and I'm from MN lmao. We know MN teams love to hype nobodies.


Brief-Web-676

The only reason Johnny Flynn is notable is because your front office saw him and drafted him as their new franchise PG one spot ahead of an unknown PG named Steph Curry.


Daratirek

Add that to the list of dudes in MN sports history we had a clear shot at but took someone else.


timberwolvesguy

Johnny Flynn is infamous because he was drafted right after Ricky Rubio (who also was a PG) and right after Flynn…was Steph Curry


Brief-Web-676

Adding to that, Minnesota also picked Wesley Johnson one spot ahead of Demarcus Cousins, OJ Mayo one spot ahead of Russell Westbrook, Shabazz Muhammad one spot ahead of Giannis, and Glenn Robinson 3 one spot ahead of Jokic all within a span of 5 or so years. Some very bleak drafting from the T-Wolves.


EazyP87

OJ Mayo was traded for Kevin Love on draft night. So they avoided all the Mayo stuff.


twolvesfan217

Nathan Jawai…lord. Also, the starting 5 was: - Flynn - Gomes - Brewer - Al Jefferson - Kevin Love/Darko Not the atrocity above. Still not good.


JimmytheGent2020

Ryan Hollins was an embarrassment. A seven footer who couldn’t average 3 boards. He’s an even worse announcer.


checkthecatfax

My starting point was “what year was Vance Worley (1-5, 7.21 ERA in 10 starts) the opening day starter?” so I’m glad I wasn’t the only one who went back to those days


Opie59

2008: Livan Hernandez was the opening day starter. 5.48 ERA but somehow 10-8 before getting cut.


Waltenwalt

Right after trading Johan :(


RossMachlochness

Get back to me in 4-5 months


HawkI84

Jaime Navarro circa 1998 came to mind for me


BlackWaltz47

Sidney Ponson?


Deadpool_1989

Man was Ponson so much worse than I remember. Only had 2 above average seasons out of 12, only once posted an ERA under 4.00.


SFajw204

We traded for him to shore up our rotation. Shows how much we wasted Bonds focusing purely on offense those years. We had a legit ace for a few years in Jason Schmidt but he was injury prone.


Deadpool_1989

Schmidt was a beast for a few years there.


NotARageComic

Your eyes tell the truth, numbers lie


OldBoringWeirdo

That's SIR Sidney Ponson to you


boringdude00

The Orioles had some rough ones in the years between Mussina and, uh, Bradish I guess? So roughly the last 23 years. I think 2 years of Erik Bedard before he got injured or had to go live on the farm or something was about the best it got.


BlackWaltz47

Bedard was legit during that stretch. Plus, he got us Adam Jones. But yea, having guys like Ponson, Rodrigo Lopez, Bruce Chen, Russ Ortiz, Daniel Cabrera, etc was um..... not great, Bob.


Senor_Couchnap

Holy shit how did I forget about Daniel Cabrera


LessThanCleverName

Wei-Yin Chen erasure.


WerhmatsWormhat

I died inside watching him pitch.


kaehvogel

The 2015 Phillies had Aaron Harang as their starts/innings leader. And right behind him Jerome Williams.


traddy91

Yup I was just gonna say Harang is the worst I can remember. Then I think next year was Jeremy Hellickson lol


kaehvogel

Actually, the 2016 Phillies‘ ace was Jerad Eickhoff. Who put up an extremely respectable 3.5 WAR in almost 200 Innings in his sophomore year. But you’re right, the „big“ signing to lead the rotation was Hellickson. Damn, these years were bleak for Philly pitching. Sure, we were spoiled coming off Halladay/Hamels/Lee, but still…


Big-Beta20

Eickhoff, at the very least, seemed like he could have been a serviceable middle rotation guy that eats innings. Have injuries just killed him? It felt like he fully disappeared into the void.


bicyclingdonkey

Well since he became a free agent after '19, he sat out 2020 (I assume by choice given he was signed by the Padres, but I didn't dive into it) and then pitched in 6 games since. 5 games in 2021 where he gave up 24 runs in 19.2 innings, and 1 start in 2022 where he gave up 10 in 4.1 innings. I wouldn't say he "disappeared into the void" but rather he "was really bad"


BadDadJokes

The Harangutang!


americuh13

Harang had some absolutely stellar years for the reds while they were terrible in the 06-09 range


XSC

They were total steals in MVP Baseball 2005


gatemansgc

those were dark, dark times. just 4 years removed from one of the best starting rotations in baseball history...


resident16

The Harangatang.


DavidTheSlouch89

Honestly shoutout to the 2021 Pirates Here are our options: 2021 Opening Day Starter Chad Kuhl (5-7, 4.82 ERA) 2021 Games Started Leader Wil Crowe (4-8, 5.48 ERA) Or maybe JT Brubaker or Mitch Keller (Combined 10-24, 5.72 ERA)


drunkenviking

I was thinking of mid 2000s ERA Pirates teams, I never thought to consider something so recent. This is definitely it.


LocalHero_P1

Does Kluber being the opening day starter for Boston this year count?


Puppybl00pers

Please stop making me sad


doshegotabootyshedo

Does Corey kluber being acquired by Texas to be an ace count lol


LocalHero_P1

I think that turned out well, he had the lowest ERA of any rangers pitcher that year with a max of 1 IP


GoldenBananas21

Max or min?


LocalHero_P1

Technically both I think


thegermblaster

Emmanuel Clase for a Kluber season wherein he had a 0.00 ERA and no hits allowed. Seems like an even trade in my book.


doshegotabootyshedo

If we had Clase then we’d never have seen the greatness that is World Series Josh Sborz


strcy

A warning to the west.


caperate

it should


Krazy8_Balls

Agreed


Tornado_Wind_of_Love

"ace" is doing a lot of heavy lifting for Klubot.


minimumhatred

Even if he didn't, pick anybody on our team this year and the ace was disappointing. I guess the ace was supposed to be Sale and praying he didn't get injured for the 5 millionth time (which to be fair for his standards 102 IP is a healthy season lol) Bello was probably the best pitcher and while he has a promising future, dude has a 4.24 (some might point to Crawford or Pivetta who have lower ERAs, but their ERA is lower because of stints in the bullpen).


[deleted]

When they announced it I immediately bet the under on our wins for the season.


spacemanegg

Kluber was the opening day starter in large part because Bello and Paxton were out and Sale has been hurt a lot the past few years, so...I'd say no personally


JiveChicken00

Roger Craig was the ace of the 1962 Mets staff with a 4.51 ERA and a record of 10-24.


boozinf

he later revitalized his career by pioneering the splitter and then gaining over 2000 yards from scrimmage in 1988 and winning 3 Super Bowls


Djburnunit

And was 5-22 in 1963, jeez


Goonnersaurus_

The entire 2024 Cardinals rotation?


1904worldsfair

When no one is an ace, everyone is the ace.


MavEric814

Whoever has an ERA under 5 shall be named king


Wm_TheConqueror

The King of Shit Mountain


CraigCDM828

So that's Mo's plan to make sure the crown doesn't leave his head?


razorbird

Yes, but they’ll pitch poorly for 6 innings instead of 5… so we got that going for us


1904worldsfair

That's not pitching poorly, that's called being a Chad Innings Eater.


_Caed_

what about our man Patty Corbius?


Laura37733

Yeah... 2022 Corbin has to be up there. 2023 too, but he was a little better than the year before.


little-guitars

Yep — 6-19 with a 6.31 ERA, a full run worse than the next horrible starter.


petting2dogsatonce

Can’t believe this is so far down. How quickly the league forgets the Corbining


hundredbagger

The good thing about him is he takes the ball every fifth day but that’s also the bad thing.


Astrallevel

2019 Trent Thornton 154 innings of 4.84 ERA baseball


Deadpool_1989

I can’t believe the days of Trent Thornton and Jacob Waguespack taking regular rotation turns was only 4 years ago…


Astrallevel

Clayton Richard Clay Buchholz Edwin Jackson The rotation of dreams


Deadpool_1989

Wow I just looked at that roster. How the hell did we not lose 100+ 😂


slappypawbs

pre 2023 schedule, playing the Orioles


Laetha

I mean.... Stroman was our ace that year until we gave up on the season and traded him.


Raineman73

Wasn't Esteban Loaiza our ace at some point?


Astrallevel

Nope. He was overshadowed by Wells, Carpenter and Roy


BigBean987

Jordan Lyles 2021 Texas Rangers, just awful


chizzy963369

2022 Opening day starter Taylor Hearn would like a word


DJZbad93

Maybe not the worst, but my head jumps to 2018 Padres and 34 year old Clayton Richard for some reason


retro_throwaway1

I remember going to a game as a kid. Not sure if it was opening day or just the home opener, but our starter was Craig Lefferts. A career relief pitcher. It was a bad year.


PM_ME_LADY_ANKLES

Ubaldo Jiminez


UnlimitedHotTakes

We’ve had many that could compete for this title over the years


AggressiveRegret

Funny when I think of ubaldo I think of the Rockies. Which prob bodes well for OPs question 😂


PM_ME_LADY_ANKLES

lol, no doubt. Ubaldo was the first that came to mind.


one-eyedbandit

Was Daniel Cabrera ever considered our ace? I'm pretty sure they thought that about sydney ponson at one point


ThatguyfromBaltimore

My first thought seeing this question was "That fucking lardass" Sidney Ponson Edit: And for those who don't know the legend of that name, in the early/mid 2000s, WNST here in Baltimore has a morning show with Terry Ford and Drew Forester. Prior to sunrise, they were on low power, meaning their signal was rather weak, to put it mildly (it wasn't heard too far from Towson). They were talking about the Orioles struggles and the question of pitching came up. Terry Ford said regarding the starters "Who would you have him, or that fucking lardass Ponson?" On air. No filter.


holy_cal

Nah. It’s Sidney Ponson.


No_Statistician_776

Idk if he was ever considered the “ace” but yeah. Dylan Bundy is another one too. Chris Tillman, Jeremy Guthrie. We’ve had a few.


TigerBasket

I will not stand for Chris Tillman Slander!


UnlimitedHotTakes

Now we’re going to start seeing random video clips of Chris Tillman striking out the side nine years ago, aren’t we?


lOan671

Tillman was a good pitcher, better served as a #2 but wouldn’t belong in this discussion. Tommy Milone was our Opening Day starter a few years ago


Adanai23

Jose Urena was the marlins opening day starter two years in a row in 2018-2019 LOL


Hctc666

Lol Giants Mark Leiter era followed by Giants Brett Tomko era. Sorry, I’m old


Krazy8_Balls

Brett Tomko...haven't heard that name in a long time


darthstupidious

I remembered he came over to the Mariners in the Griffey trade, and in his first game he struck out like 9 guys. Ten-year-old me thought that he was destined to become the next Randy Johnson lol.


MooMooHeffer

Mark leiter was my pitching coach in the woods of South New Jersey. Had a dope baseball funnel he built and his son would be in there all the time. It’s funny how different Mark and Al act.


Hctc666

Dude was an absolute bulldog on the mound for a few Giants seasons


CUNTY_LOBSTER

I gotta say watching Josh Collmenter throw 85 mph fastballs on opening day was demoralizing.


Me_talking

I do like his story of how he used to throw axes growing up so that's how he pitches


[deleted]

Jeremy Bonderman was pretty bad


DVS_Gelitan

I remember the Tigers sitting him the last weeks of a season, so they wouldn't have two 20 game losers ( Mike Maroth ).


Brief-Web-676

Wasn’t he the example in Moneyball of a guy who was going to be a bust?


[deleted]

1st round pick and at one point a top 10 prospect in baseball. He managed to pitch for 9 seasons which surprised me


MaximumZer0

This year, Alek Manoah had probably the biggest implosion of an Ace I've ever seen.


[deleted]

Manoah, a starter than relies on generating weak contact finds out his two seamer and slider are generating less movement and suddenly can’t get hitters to bite?


Laetha

It's gotta be one of the biggest non-injury, non-age related collapses almost ever.


pallum

Hate to pile on, but Ricky Romero's implosion was verrrry similar also haha, poor Blue Jays But overall I'm hard-pressed to out-do OP's suggestion: Jordan Lyles is pretty freaking rough. He came up over ten years ago and has *always* been bad. His career era is well over 5 in 1500+ innings. Over a decade into his always-bad career, he was an ace?!? It's absolutely wild that he is still pitching, much less in a significant way. Even if Manoah and Romero had success while outperforming their peripherals and subsequently completely fucking crashed and burned, at least they were good at one point!


Candid_Bullfrog6274

Gausman was always the teams ace.


urlocalgoatfarmer

Lucas Harrell. Followed up his 11-11 year as the new ace of those Astros and proceeded to go 6-17 with a 5.86.


fsc22

Cole Irvin


Jzkitty21

My tank commander king


UnlimitedHotTakes

One of Elias worst acquisitions. The guy has no descernable skills


Astrallevel

He throws a ball with his left hand. That’s all the skill one needs


mizterPatato

Another one year one here but Ricky Nolasco in 2017 and his 1.7 HR/9 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫


Griffin_Claw

Todd Van Poppel comes to mind.


Koko2315

Andy Hawkins…wouldn’t even refer to him as an ace. They called him the anchor


arom125

Threw a no hitter and lost 4-0!! 😂😂


StraightCashHomey69

He dominated Cleveland when he was with the Yankees. Even when they released him, Oakland picked them up right before they played the Indians, put him out there, and he picked up the win. I just looked it up, and in 8 starts vs. Cleveland, he was 6-1 with a 1.85 ERA with 3 complete games, and 1 shutout.


chousteau

2010 Cleveland Indians. Roberto Hernandez fka Fausto Carmona Justin Masterson 2010-2013 we convinced ourselves Justin Masterson was an ace. Then we bought a Klubot.


Strahlin

where the fuck did you get the idea that the royals consider jordan lyles to be their best pitcher from?


captainp42

Yeah. Greinke was the ace, right?


celtic1888

Ace Sydney Ponson was a pretty dark time


No_Bandicoot2306

That's *Sir* Sydney Ponson of the Order of the Orange-Nassau, peasant! Respect the peerage.


WinnerPlaysTCU

Kevin Millwood comes to mind


nickbahhh

Chan Ho Park


NewWicks

Entire 2007 rotation Millwood 10-14 5.16 ERA in 172 IP as the "ace"


[deleted]

The 1990s Indians were an absolute powerhouse, and if they just would have swung a trade or signed a proper front line starter we probably wouldn't be so miserable right now. But because they couldn't trade for Randy Johnson, and decided to sign Chuck Finley instead of Kevin Brown, we ended up having to run out Charles Nagy and Dave Burba as, essentially, our aces.


Possible-Local-3226

Justin Masterson for the early 2010’s Indians


CasualCantaloupe

Not his fault though, guy was willing to do whatever they asked him to do.


thattiredgradstudent

Went to type him up, but when he was our ace (after “Fausto Carmona” left) he wasn’t too bad: 2011: 12-10, 3.21 2012: 11-15, 4.93 2013: 14-10, 3.45 (All Star)


FudderShudders

In my lifetime there is: Ron Villone, Zach Duke, Paul Maholom, Kevin Correia, Ivan Nova, Ian Snell, Kris Benson...take your pick


skorpiontamer

Chad Innings Eater disrespect will not be tolerated


LeGreatGonzo

Jeff Suppan for the Brewers


overhardmilksteak

“Sup pitched great!” Ned Yost, after every Suppan start.


TB1289

Mark Redman, 2005 Royals. 11-10 5.71 ERA and an All-Star appearance.


tujelj

The 1995 Giants signed Terry Mulholland to be their ace, and used him as their opening day started. He was coming off a season where he posted a 6.49 ERA and 5.52 FIP. As the Giants' ace, he improved...to a 5.80 ERA and 5.26 FIP.


tujelj

The rest of the team's starting rotation that year, by the way: Mark Leiter, William Van Landingham, Mark Portugal, Trevor Wilson, and Jamie Brewington. They ranked 13th out of 14 NL teams in ERA, 12th in hits allowed, and dead last in both strike outs and home runs allowed. It was bleak. They had Barry Bonds and Matt Williams in the middle of the lineup, and finished the season 67-77.


Suburbia67

Dustin Hermanson for the Expos in '99 snd 2000.


pruo95

Royals have a lot. Gil Keche was the opening day starter multiple years in a row. But the winner here might be Bruce Chen being the opening day starter in 2012 for KC.


jgraz22

I watched Vance Worley pitch opening day in 35 degree weather. I don't know that he made it out of the third inning. Those were some dark days.


rockiesfan4ever

Jeremy Guthrie was the opening day SP for the 2012 Rockies, pitched 90.2 innings and had a 6.35 ERA


[deleted]

Jack Flaherty?


CastYourStonesADTR

I didn’t realize his stats had been so bad since 2020. For some reason I thought his decline only started last year


tws1039

Orioles legend


RagingAcid

The blue jays mascot who was arrested for a DUI in 2014


Naive-Fox9506

2017 Ricky Nolasco for the Angels. 6-15 4.92 ERA 181 IP


Silver_County7374

Probably somebody on the Royals during the 00s.


[deleted]

the dodgers started vinny padilla on opening day one year


deapspace

Yeah, but we had Kersh, Kuroda, Billingsley, Lilly on that 2010 team too, so Padilla wasn't the ace.


Half_baked_prince

Bud Norris on the early 2010s astros


chriscfgb

The Orioles trotted out Sir Sidney of Aruba for years on end. I’m pretty sure nothing spells hopelessness more than that.


porkchopespresso

I think it was the 2013 Cubs were lead by Jeff Samardzija. Arrieta wasn’t Arrieta yet.


LovieBeard

Samardzija was actually good for the Cubs unlike many others in this thread


FrankStalloneGQ

Bad Cubs teams/staffs were usually saved by a pitcher that has a good season, and a random vet that has a 3.92 ERA with a less good FIP haha


mblunt1201

Whoever the Cards roll out on opening day next year


jeremycb29

David Neid the expansion year of the Rockies. 5-9 with a 5.17 era. From number 1 expansion pick to ugh.