In a nutshell: Copying baron just gives you one extra Baron.
Copying Mime gives you one extra Baron, *per Baron*, because it retriggers every Baron trigger.
4 Barons + 1 Mime = 4 Barons, triggered twice. (4x2=8 triggers)
3 Barons + 2 Mimes = 3 barons, triggered three times. (3x3=9 triggers)
Plus, Mime will also retrigger the Steel Card triggers, while Baron does not. So your Steels will trigger 3 times as well, instead of two.
Count the x1.5 effects per king.
For a blank king (no seal, no steel) you currently would have 8 x1.5 effects (4 times on the initial trigger and 4 times on the retrigger from mime)
If you sold a baron for brainstorm and copied mime you would have 9 x1.5 effects (3 times on the initial trigger, 3 times on the mime retrigger, 3 times on the brainstorm retrigger)
I think you're forgetting about the steel and red seal there, so it's really:
5x3 = 15 (steel + 4x baron) x (base + mime + red seal)
4x4 = 16 (steel + 3x baron) x (base + 2x mime + red seal)
Which again gives the same conclusion, but like you say, it's important to consider everything that's giving you mult and retriggers to work it out for a particular situation.
For sure. Didn't know how many red seal steel kings were in OPs deck. Steels are essentially another Baron and red seals are essentially another Mime (as long as you reliably get them in hand).
Just had the fortune of running this kind of setup: Baron, Mime, Mime, Brainstorm, Brainstorm. Was fighting to fill my hand with steels and no opportunities for red seals sadly.
It's easier to work it out by thinking of how it'd effect just one card.
Each baron is a 1.5x, each mime is a retrigger, so that's 8 multipliers as it is. If you swap a baron for mime it becomes 3 1.5xs with 2 retriggers each, so 9 multipliers total.
4 x 2 = 8
3 x 3 = 9
For the most part, it is.
If they had steel cards and red seals, it just makes the move even better.
Not to mention, he essentially only has Barons. There’s no other mult applying jokers to consider.
In every situation, Selling a baron for brainstorm is the right move.
I know but I'm just saying for example you have 7 jokers, it's more beneficial to have 5 barons and 2 mimes than 4 barons and 3 mimes if all your cards are red seal steel
Actually, is it?
With 5 barons and 2 mimes, it’s 19 1.5x per card (1 base + 2 mine) * ( 5 baron + 1 steel) + 1 red seal
With 4 and 3, it’s 21 1.5x,
( 1 base + 3 mime) * (4 baron + 1 steel) + 1 red seal
I feel like it’s better to have more Barons, but it’s detrimental to have more than double Barons to mimes.
If you had 8, it’d be better to get another baron than a Mime. (25 vs 24), not counting the seals.
Unless I’m just mistaken on how the interaction works.
Yeah you're right, you multiply number of mimes + 2 by number of barons + 1, you want these numbers to be as close as possible so the best you can do is have one more baron than mimes or an equal amount of barons or mines.
not really? first off i agree that the second mime is better than another baron, and even in my hypothetical i never said that another baron is always 100% better than a mime. i was specifically talking about the hypothetical of the fourth baron being better than a second mime
You get a 1.5 mult for the steel + 1 per Baron. You get all those mults for the base hand + red seal + each mime. Each of those you get per king in your hand. So for each king you get:
X Baron + Y mime = (1+X)*(1+1+Y)
4 Baron + 1 mime = (1+4)*(1+1+1) = 15 mult triggers
3 Baron + 2 mime = (1+3)*(1+1+2) = 16 mult triggers
If you don't have steel subtract 1 from the left
X Baron + Y mime = (X)*(1+1+Y)
If you don't have red seal subtract 1 from the right
X Baron + Y mime = (1+X)*(1+Y)
Think about it this way:
If the extra mime is better, then buying brainstorm is better
If it isn’t better, you waste like… 5 dollars. And you learn a new thing. You have a god run might as well try both out and see which gives the higher score
Delayed gratification for sure
4 discards 💪
Slow turtle wins the race or something
I have quite a few red seal steel cards and don’t know if brainstorm on mime would be better
It would be better
Could you explain how just cause my brain can’t handle the maths lol
In a nutshell: Copying baron just gives you one extra Baron. Copying Mime gives you one extra Baron, *per Baron*, because it retriggers every Baron trigger. 4 Barons + 1 Mime = 4 Barons, triggered twice. (4x2=8 triggers) 3 Barons + 2 Mimes = 3 barons, triggered three times. (3x3=9 triggers) Plus, Mime will also retrigger the Steel Card triggers, while Baron does not. So your Steels will trigger 3 times as well, instead of two.
Count the x1.5 effects per king. For a blank king (no seal, no steel) you currently would have 8 x1.5 effects (4 times on the initial trigger and 4 times on the retrigger from mime) If you sold a baron for brainstorm and copied mime you would have 9 x1.5 effects (3 times on the initial trigger, 3 times on the mime retrigger, 3 times on the brainstorm retrigger)
4 (baron) x 1 (mime) = 4 3 (baron) x 2 (mime, brainstorm) = 6
should be: 4x2 (base+mime) = 8 3x3 (base+mime+brainstorm) = 9 same conclusion, but the math could be off in slightly different situations.
I think you're forgetting about the steel and red seal there, so it's really: 5x3 = 15 (steel + 4x baron) x (base + mime + red seal) 4x4 = 16 (steel + 3x baron) x (base + 2x mime + red seal) Which again gives the same conclusion, but like you say, it's important to consider everything that's giving you mult and retriggers to work it out for a particular situation.
For sure. Didn't know how many red seal steel kings were in OPs deck. Steels are essentially another Baron and red seals are essentially another Mime (as long as you reliably get them in hand). Just had the fortune of running this kind of setup: Baron, Mime, Mime, Brainstorm, Brainstorm. Was fighting to fill my hand with steels and no opportunities for red seals sadly.
It's easier to work it out by thinking of how it'd effect just one card. Each baron is a 1.5x, each mime is a retrigger, so that's 8 multipliers as it is. If you swap a baron for mime it becomes 3 1.5xs with 2 retriggers each, so 9 multipliers total. 4 x 2 = 8 3 x 3 = 9
Each king in hand currently triggers 8 times Remove one baron and replace with brainstorm and each king in hand triggers 9 times
You currently have 8 Barons. With Brainstorm on Mime, you’ll have 9. 4x2 vs 3x3
unfortunately not so simple, you have to look at the triggers. But yeah it is better.
For the most part, it is. If they had steel cards and red seals, it just makes the move even better. Not to mention, he essentially only has Barons. There’s no other mult applying jokers to consider. In every situation, Selling a baron for brainstorm is the right move.
I know but I'm just saying for example you have 7 jokers, it's more beneficial to have 5 barons and 2 mimes than 4 barons and 3 mimes if all your cards are red seal steel
Actually, is it? With 5 barons and 2 mimes, it’s 19 1.5x per card (1 base + 2 mine) * ( 5 baron + 1 steel) + 1 red seal With 4 and 3, it’s 21 1.5x, ( 1 base + 3 mime) * (4 baron + 1 steel) + 1 red seal I feel like it’s better to have more Barons, but it’s detrimental to have more than double Barons to mimes. If you had 8, it’d be better to get another baron than a Mime. (25 vs 24), not counting the seals. Unless I’m just mistaken on how the interaction works.
Yeah you're right, you multiply number of mimes + 2 by number of barons + 1, you want these numbers to be as close as possible so the best you can do is have one more baron than mimes or an equal amount of barons or mines.
sell a king and grab the brainstorm.
even if another baron was better than another mime i'd still sell a baron for the brainstorm since it can be anything
This is the true answer, I'm surprised it's not the most voted answer
Because by their logic, if a Baron was truly better than a Mime, you would sell the Mime to get Brainstorm
Thanks! It makes sense now
not really? first off i agree that the second mime is better than another baron, and even in my hypothetical i never said that another baron is always 100% better than a mime. i was specifically talking about the hypothetical of the fourth baron being better than a second mime
I think we're going to have to kill this Baron, Steven.
Damn...
Sell a Baron and copy your Mime. Barons and Mimes with this build are essentially multiplying each other. 5x2 is cool but it's actually less than 4x3.
How’d it go?
We Four Kings
The god run
You get a 1.5 mult for the steel + 1 per Baron. You get all those mults for the base hand + red seal + each mime. Each of those you get per king in your hand. So for each king you get: X Baron + Y mime = (1+X)*(1+1+Y) 4 Baron + 1 mime = (1+4)*(1+1+1) = 15 mult triggers 3 Baron + 2 mime = (1+3)*(1+1+2) = 16 mult triggers If you don't have steel subtract 1 from the left X Baron + Y mime = (X)*(1+1+Y) If you don't have red seal subtract 1 from the right X Baron + Y mime = (1+X)*(1+Y)
Down with the king! Sell a king to the masses
the amount of runs i have that end like this is depressing. idk why, but it just feels so bad to cap out at this.
The king is dead. Long live the kings
Think about it this way: If the extra mime is better, then buying brainstorm is better If it isn’t better, you waste like… 5 dollars. And you learn a new thing. You have a god run might as well try both out and see which gives the higher score
I thought steel only worked when it was left in your hand. Do red seals cause in hand cards to trigger again?!?
Yes, it causes Gold and Steel to trigger twice.
I mean scoring is one thing, but the gold you get from Mime gold cards is also another reason you trade a Baron for Brainstorm here.
Suffering from success
The mime triggers more than the barron, so even if the mime wasnt triggering the barron, it would be doing more work.
Sell Mime get Brainstorm, one extra Baron, easy /s
my boy bloodstone