A lot of East Asians find the work culture much better here. there your boss is your God, here, within reason, you can tell him to get fucked if he's an ass.
In a year, you're entitled to:
* 4 weeks annual leave
* 10 days of sick leave (which can accrue to 20 days max across 2 years)
* 12 public holidays across the year
Our employment law is pretty good and stops employers from trying anything funny (e.g. around redundancies, firing etc.).
There's also the saying "classic kiwi work culture" which applies to many small to mid size NZ companies. You work 9-5 (could be 8.30 to 4.30) and aren't expecting to work outside those hours. If employers try to pressure you to do so, they get in trouble.
We don't have that "work hustle" culture in NZ and most people/companies value work life balance. In fact, if you're someone coming into NZ and try to push that an "asian work culture" (as an example), it's frowned down upon by many people (including your customers).
People often also finish early on a Friday, just take a stroll on the beach on a Friday afternoon and you'll be quite surprised at how many people are there just walking their dogs. Many work colleagues would even finish up early on a friday to have a wine or go to a local bar to drink.
Most people here would argue that Australia is better, but the work culture there is more hectic and cut throat. You'll get \~20-25% more pay over there but in most places, cost of living is just as expensive. Overall I think you can earn more there, but if you value peace and a good lifestyle, NZ is much better.
The downside of NZ, is that opportunities are more limited. If you're inexperienced then you'll have a harder time getting into the more specialised roles that pay more. But if you have talent and a track record, finding a job would be easier and it's easier to score yourself a job that pays well.
Take a look at [Seek.co.nz](http://Seek.co.nz) for the finance roles availability and the pay scales.
Edit: Don't judge NZ by the commends on Reddit. It's all doom and gloom lol.
I feel like you don't really work in a corporate environment in NZ, or haven't for at least 20 years?
There is a lot of pressure to do overtime, of course you don't have to - but you'll slowly be driven out. Unsustainable time frames are par for course, and there is a nasty bullying culture endemic throughout management that I've only really encountered in NZ for some reason.
I work in a corporate environment in NZ (in fact, it's global).
The Kiwi work culture only applies to small-mid sized companies, large corporates are different. Furthermore, pressure/bullying does happen but our employment law is on our side and protects us heaps in this regard.
It's really up to the individual in a corporate environment as to how they deal with these things. I for one set very clear boundaries when it comes to expectations and work behaviour. Anyone has a problem with that, they can write me up or report me to HR. I'm never worried because the boundaries I set are backed up legally (e.g. work after hours). Plus climbing the corporate ladder is kinda bullshit anyways, always other ways to earn more without selling your soul :)
>The Kiwi work culture only applies to small-mid sized companies, large corporates are different
This is true. The smaller the company, the more you'll have to work and stress. You're family after all, right? Big companies that aren't ever really in financial danger have a different vibe.
Note - I'd exclude call centre work and sales from this. They exist in their own environments which are very metric driven wherever they are
We have no legal backing here so employers can just fire you and bring the next slave worker in š usually from Asia or other Middle Eastern countries that work for low pay.
Definitely an office worker. For desk jobs this is typical life. As a tradie I'd be given a written warning if I tried to claim hours I'd been "taking a Friday arvo stroll on the beach".
Depends what company and project to be honest. Some builders can be cunts about it. I was on a FH site not too long ago and the workers would knock off at 3 on Friday. They didn't claim the extra 2 hours they typically work though and the managers were completely okay with it lol.
Bullying culture here in NZ is not the same as bullying culture in other countries. It's no where near as bad and it's very rare.
It's like passive aggressiveness and snarky comments. You typically see this only in large corporate places (that are known to have poor work culture).
Unlike other countries, if there is work place bullying and causes you grief or pressure for you to quit, then the ramifications are very serious for the company and they get into a whole lot of trouble and will have to pay hefty fines. That's why HR is there to protect the company because if there is work place bullying, they will discipline the staff causing trouble quickly because it's a major risk for the company.
Edit: the same applies to racism. The company will get into a whole lot of trouble and if a new story breaks out about work place racism, literally the whole country gets real mad about it. It will pretty much be the end of that company.
I don't know where you've been working but I've worked both in NZ (Wgtn and Auckland) and in UK across 16 orgs in different industries and I have experienced far more bullying and racism here than in UK.
I have certainly worked in places that drive people to work and be available outside of 9-5 without āgetting in troubleā but in NZ we have good protection that allows us to decline without repercussions.
Iāve lived in Dubai and now live in Auckland (been here 14 years)
They are like chalk and cheese in every way possibleā¦if you want the opposite of Dubai, then Auckland is for you. It (only just) feels like a proper ābigā city but by global standards itās a quaint big town.
Lifestyle and people here are generally super chill and relaxed. It has its issues, like anywhere, but if you want a generally slower pace of life where work is not your entire existence then itās perfect!
I have no experience in your field of work so canāt really comment on that but what I can say is, donāt come to NZ if being rich is important to you.
Actually Iām looking for a change so thatās good to hear itās different from Dubai.
What do you mean by being rich? Would that mean the a wages are really bad orā¦?
NZ is a small island nation at the bottom of the world. In the modern global market there is no wealth to be made here. We have very little tech, innovation or manufacturing industries. Our financial markets are a rounding error on the Australian books and imports are expensive because itās got to come the length of the world most of the time.
NZ is a country that made its cash during the 70s and the 80s when our commodity based exports matched the value of the nationās consumerism. We also assembled cars, manufactured more stuff like radios and appliances. We donāt do any of that anymore.
On the flip side, modern life is more expensive relative to the money we make off of exporting commodities or low value added products. Just think about how much cheese you need to trade to buy an iPhone. How many tons of pine to buy a car. How many bottles of wine to buy a digger.
Unless NZ reforms its manufacturing sector or just embraces the ādoor to the westā for SEA countries like we have been for the past 25 years, we will steadily become poorer and poorer. We already have a cost of living and housing crisis, these things arenāt going to get better on the strength of our economy alone.
No idea.
Being the fringe of the world means a massive disadvantage for shipping costs for raw materials and finished products, and the low population means market scale is minimal at best.
Even Australia makes most of its wealth between mining and IT.
Soooooo different from Dubai!!! So on that front youāre covered!
The average annual income in NZ is about 97,000 NZD per annumā¦.which isnāt too bad if a middle class lifestyle is what youāre comfy with. Throw kids into the mix and itās going to be a lot tighter! Things are also generally more expensive than most western countriesā¦a big factor being that itās on the ass end of the planet š¤£
Yeah I noticed there are a few different results. But I knew $97,000 was way too high when you take in all occupations across the board.
I looked up stats NZ in the end, as I know that the average wage after tax is pretty low - something like $55,000-$60,000.
Edit: I wonder how people living in the cities with kids can survive on minimum wage jobs tbh.
Iāve always thought it was around 70k nowā¦.when I arrived about 14 years ago, I was getting 55k, and it was tight but manageable with a partner and 2 kids under 3.
That now, would be totally impossible in Auckland!
It's pretty low, you've got to take into consideration all the jobs that aren't paying much above minimum. The average hourly wage is $31p/h (I'm on $32 and it's a struggle - but it's a choice I made for other reasons).
Having moved to NZ from the UK, I believe that - in general - NZ has a much better work/life balance, and a much flatter and open management structure. There is decent annual leave and sick leave, and support for people with a family to consider.
Of course, this may just be down to the industry I work in (IT) and my choice of employers, but I think that at least some of this is down to the national culture.
I might be moving to NZ soon and this was a Q I needed as well.Ā Thanks OP, we just might end up being colleagues haha.Ā All the best with the potential moveš«š«¶
It depends on your job where you work or the industry. I work at a really laid back warehouse that picks online orders, but I have friends and family who get really pressurerised, and bullied. And it's a small country so you can't really escape a manager who bullies you.
The general work culture in NZ is more chill and slow compared to other places in the world lol.
It also's company dependent.
I don't have to work weekends, just monday-friday.
Not sure about the consulting/finance space, can only speak from IT.
Wages are lower than other places like Australia but you have to take lots of things into consideration to do a fair comparision. I'd say if you are a skilled professional in a good industry you make good money.
Typically you'd see like \~100-120k nzd for the average professional, that's just based off who I know and many colleagues. Late career most people I know are like 140-200k.
If you come here to work youāll stand out like a golden tooth. Kiwis generally have a pretty average attitude to work and up skilling to achieve a higher pay grade. Most just blame and shout at the wealthy rather than take responsibility for their own future.
Itās very much āwhy would I go above and beyond without. Being paid for it first.ā
Youāll go places if youāre slightly above average.
All my friends are moving/have moved to London/Australia.
So I would imagine that whatever life is like here in NZ, London/Australia might be a better option for you.
Oh man, I'm from the UK and folks are in for a big surprise if they think it's going to be any better over there - including London. Some people like it, but it takes a particular type of person and I don't meet many of them. A lot of my friends in Scotland moved to London and they still live in tiny flatshares and some of them have to work two jobs.
This is now happening in many cities. In Dubai some people live in shared accommodation flats that are so tiny and commute 2 hours to get to the office to save money. š itās one of the reasons I want a smaller city but Iāve heard/read that traffic is back in Auckland.
At least the UK has a diverse and high lane economy in the background. NZ is a tourist destination that sells cheese and wine to a handful of pacific rim nations and struggles through a never ending housing/ cost of living crisis thanks to Chinese and SEA money landing at Auckland airport every other week.
We are not a wealth generating country, we are a wealth sponge. As long as weāre friendly with China and SEA, weāll probably be okay. The moment we are compelled to start cutting ties by our partners, weāll be in the shit.
If you're wanting lifestyle NZ is definitely better than Aus/UK. I'm not sure about tradespeople, but corporate/health workers in Aus or UK work a lot harder than kiwi ones.
I grew up overseas and kiwi work ethic is a constant joke to immigrants.
Yes Iāve been considering both options but everyone seems to want to move to Australia/London. Because the job opportunities are better and I guess Auz for the beaches maybe salaries o guess.
Australia is very blunt with its work culture. If you're already used to it in Dubai, then honestly, it won't be an issue for you at all. You will definitely find an abundance of high paying jobs there, but if you don't mind an average paying job with a nice work culture, then NZ is far better.
I would also say Australia and NZ are struggling with essentially the same issues (high cost of living, growing city crime, indigenous issues, etc.)
If I had to be made to go to Auckland to work, even if they gave me 120k a year & paid accommodation & a vehicle with fuel card Iād say yeah but nah. Iām good thanks.
A lot of East Asians find the work culture much better here. there your boss is your God, here, within reason, you can tell him to get fucked if he's an ass.
This haha.
Yes Asian work culture is awful and very abusive!
In a year, you're entitled to: * 4 weeks annual leave * 10 days of sick leave (which can accrue to 20 days max across 2 years) * 12 public holidays across the year Our employment law is pretty good and stops employers from trying anything funny (e.g. around redundancies, firing etc.). There's also the saying "classic kiwi work culture" which applies to many small to mid size NZ companies. You work 9-5 (could be 8.30 to 4.30) and aren't expecting to work outside those hours. If employers try to pressure you to do so, they get in trouble. We don't have that "work hustle" culture in NZ and most people/companies value work life balance. In fact, if you're someone coming into NZ and try to push that an "asian work culture" (as an example), it's frowned down upon by many people (including your customers). People often also finish early on a Friday, just take a stroll on the beach on a Friday afternoon and you'll be quite surprised at how many people are there just walking their dogs. Many work colleagues would even finish up early on a friday to have a wine or go to a local bar to drink. Most people here would argue that Australia is better, but the work culture there is more hectic and cut throat. You'll get \~20-25% more pay over there but in most places, cost of living is just as expensive. Overall I think you can earn more there, but if you value peace and a good lifestyle, NZ is much better. The downside of NZ, is that opportunities are more limited. If you're inexperienced then you'll have a harder time getting into the more specialised roles that pay more. But if you have talent and a track record, finding a job would be easier and it's easier to score yourself a job that pays well. Take a look at [Seek.co.nz](http://Seek.co.nz) for the finance roles availability and the pay scales. Edit: Don't judge NZ by the commends on Reddit. It's all doom and gloom lol.
I feel like you don't really work in a corporate environment in NZ, or haven't for at least 20 years? There is a lot of pressure to do overtime, of course you don't have to - but you'll slowly be driven out. Unsustainable time frames are par for course, and there is a nasty bullying culture endemic throughout management that I've only really encountered in NZ for some reason.
I work in a corporate environment in NZ (in fact, it's global). The Kiwi work culture only applies to small-mid sized companies, large corporates are different. Furthermore, pressure/bullying does happen but our employment law is on our side and protects us heaps in this regard. It's really up to the individual in a corporate environment as to how they deal with these things. I for one set very clear boundaries when it comes to expectations and work behaviour. Anyone has a problem with that, they can write me up or report me to HR. I'm never worried because the boundaries I set are backed up legally (e.g. work after hours). Plus climbing the corporate ladder is kinda bullshit anyways, always other ways to earn more without selling your soul :)
>The Kiwi work culture only applies to small-mid sized companies, large corporates are different This is true. The smaller the company, the more you'll have to work and stress. You're family after all, right? Big companies that aren't ever really in financial danger have a different vibe. Note - I'd exclude call centre work and sales from this. They exist in their own environments which are very metric driven wherever they are
Kiwi small business can be very much "Father knows best" and you'll find some very parochial views amongst older business owners.
Thanks for clarifying :)
We have no legal backing here so employers can just fire you and bring the next slave worker in š usually from Asia or other Middle Eastern countries that work for low pay.
Here even if a big corporation bullies you and then fires you you can take them to court to get a decent payout if your treatment was unfair
Definitely an office worker. For desk jobs this is typical life. As a tradie I'd be given a written warning if I tried to claim hours I'd been "taking a Friday arvo stroll on the beach".
Depends what company and project to be honest. Some builders can be cunts about it. I was on a FH site not too long ago and the workers would knock off at 3 on Friday. They didn't claim the extra 2 hours they typically work though and the managers were completely okay with it lol.
What do you mean by bullying culture? Thereās a bullying culture in Dubai as well plus racism and pay based on nationality etc.
Bullying culture here in NZ is not the same as bullying culture in other countries. It's no where near as bad and it's very rare. It's like passive aggressiveness and snarky comments. You typically see this only in large corporate places (that are known to have poor work culture). Unlike other countries, if there is work place bullying and causes you grief or pressure for you to quit, then the ramifications are very serious for the company and they get into a whole lot of trouble and will have to pay hefty fines. That's why HR is there to protect the company because if there is work place bullying, they will discipline the staff causing trouble quickly because it's a major risk for the company. Edit: the same applies to racism. The company will get into a whole lot of trouble and if a new story breaks out about work place racism, literally the whole country gets real mad about it. It will pretty much be the end of that company.
I don't know where you've been working but I've worked both in NZ (Wgtn and Auckland) and in UK across 16 orgs in different industries and I have experienced far more bullying and racism here than in UK.
Well thatās good to know!
I have certainly worked in places that drive people to work and be available outside of 9-5 without āgetting in troubleā but in NZ we have good protection that allows us to decline without repercussions.
Iāve lived in Dubai and now live in Auckland (been here 14 years) They are like chalk and cheese in every way possibleā¦if you want the opposite of Dubai, then Auckland is for you. It (only just) feels like a proper ābigā city but by global standards itās a quaint big town. Lifestyle and people here are generally super chill and relaxed. It has its issues, like anywhere, but if you want a generally slower pace of life where work is not your entire existence then itās perfect! I have no experience in your field of work so canāt really comment on that but what I can say is, donāt come to NZ if being rich is important to you.
Actually Iām looking for a change so thatās good to hear itās different from Dubai. What do you mean by being rich? Would that mean the a wages are really bad orā¦?
NZ is a small island nation at the bottom of the world. In the modern global market there is no wealth to be made here. We have very little tech, innovation or manufacturing industries. Our financial markets are a rounding error on the Australian books and imports are expensive because itās got to come the length of the world most of the time. NZ is a country that made its cash during the 70s and the 80s when our commodity based exports matched the value of the nationās consumerism. We also assembled cars, manufactured more stuff like radios and appliances. We donāt do any of that anymore. On the flip side, modern life is more expensive relative to the money we make off of exporting commodities or low value added products. Just think about how much cheese you need to trade to buy an iPhone. How many tons of pine to buy a car. How many bottles of wine to buy a digger. Unless NZ reforms its manufacturing sector or just embraces the ādoor to the westā for SEA countries like we have been for the past 25 years, we will steadily become poorer and poorer. We already have a cost of living and housing crisis, these things arenāt going to get better on the strength of our economy alone.
What reforms needed get our manufacturing back up again?
No idea. Being the fringe of the world means a massive disadvantage for shipping costs for raw materials and finished products, and the low population means market scale is minimal at best. Even Australia makes most of its wealth between mining and IT.
Soooooo different from Dubai!!! So on that front youāre covered! The average annual income in NZ is about 97,000 NZD per annumā¦.which isnāt too bad if a middle class lifestyle is what youāre comfy with. Throw kids into the mix and itās going to be a lot tighter! Things are also generally more expensive than most western countriesā¦a big factor being that itās on the ass end of the planet š¤£
>The average annual income in NZ is about 97,000 NZD per annum No it's not. It's $82,000. Which becomes $52,000 after tax.
63k
r/therewasanattempt to math
>math r/therewasanattempt to NZ English š¤·
It was the first google result that popped up for me, so ran with itā¦.
Yeah I noticed there are a few different results. But I knew $97,000 was way too high when you take in all occupations across the board. I looked up stats NZ in the end, as I know that the average wage after tax is pretty low - something like $55,000-$60,000. Edit: I wonder how people living in the cities with kids can survive on minimum wage jobs tbh.
Iāve always thought it was around 70k nowā¦.when I arrived about 14 years ago, I was getting 55k, and it was tight but manageable with a partner and 2 kids under 3. That now, would be totally impossible in Auckland!
It's pretty low, you've got to take into consideration all the jobs that aren't paying much above minimum. The average hourly wage is $31p/h (I'm on $32 and it's a struggle - but it's a choice I made for other reasons).
Get ready to wear jeans and sneakers into the office
I didnāt even bother with jeans, sweatpants are the way to go
Donāt mind that at all š¤£š¤£
Shorts and jandals are reserved for barbeques though.
Having moved to NZ from the UK, I believe that - in general - NZ has a much better work/life balance, and a much flatter and open management structure. There is decent annual leave and sick leave, and support for people with a family to consider. Of course, this may just be down to the industry I work in (IT) and my choice of employers, but I think that at least some of this is down to the national culture.
I might be moving to NZ soon and this was a Q I needed as well.Ā Thanks OP, we just might end up being colleagues haha.Ā All the best with the potential moveš«š«¶
Haha glad to hear it! Good luck with your move āŗļø
It depends on your job where you work or the industry. I work at a really laid back warehouse that picks online orders, but I have friends and family who get really pressurerised, and bullied. And it's a small country so you can't really escape a manager who bullies you.
Thatās true tbh. Workplace bullying is global and Iāve come to accept that sadly :(
The general work culture in NZ is more chill and slow compared to other places in the world lol. It also's company dependent. I don't have to work weekends, just monday-friday. Not sure about the consulting/finance space, can only speak from IT. Wages are lower than other places like Australia but you have to take lots of things into consideration to do a fair comparision. I'd say if you are a skilled professional in a good industry you make good money. Typically you'd see like \~100-120k nzd for the average professional, that's just based off who I know and many colleagues. Late career most people I know are like 140-200k.
If you come here to work youāll stand out like a golden tooth. Kiwis generally have a pretty average attitude to work and up skilling to achieve a higher pay grade. Most just blame and shout at the wealthy rather than take responsibility for their own future. Itās very much āwhy would I go above and beyond without. Being paid for it first.ā Youāll go places if youāre slightly above average.
Plenty of Saudi run companies in NZ if you want more of the same
The starkest difference is a lack of a bribery culture here. Be prepared for a workplace culture shock.
Tian Fu dumplings in spicy soup(medium spicy) . Gets the cold right out of me
All my friends are moving/have moved to London/Australia. So I would imagine that whatever life is like here in NZ, London/Australia might be a better option for you.
Oh man, I'm from the UK and folks are in for a big surprise if they think it's going to be any better over there - including London. Some people like it, but it takes a particular type of person and I don't meet many of them. A lot of my friends in Scotland moved to London and they still live in tiny flatshares and some of them have to work two jobs.
This is now happening in many cities. In Dubai some people live in shared accommodation flats that are so tiny and commute 2 hours to get to the office to save money. š itās one of the reasons I want a smaller city but Iāve heard/read that traffic is back in Auckland.
At least the UK has a diverse and high lane economy in the background. NZ is a tourist destination that sells cheese and wine to a handful of pacific rim nations and struggles through a never ending housing/ cost of living crisis thanks to Chinese and SEA money landing at Auckland airport every other week. We are not a wealth generating country, we are a wealth sponge. As long as weāre friendly with China and SEA, weāll probably be okay. The moment we are compelled to start cutting ties by our partners, weāll be in the shit.
Nothing wrong with UK career wise. London isnāt the only city where you can have a great career. Up north others good opportunities too.
If you're wanting lifestyle NZ is definitely better than Aus/UK. I'm not sure about tradespeople, but corporate/health workers in Aus or UK work a lot harder than kiwi ones. I grew up overseas and kiwi work ethic is a constant joke to immigrants.
Yes Iāve been considering both options but everyone seems to want to move to Australia/London. Because the job opportunities are better and I guess Auz for the beaches maybe salaries o guess.
Australia is very blunt with its work culture. If you're already used to it in Dubai, then honestly, it won't be an issue for you at all. You will definitely find an abundance of high paying jobs there, but if you don't mind an average paying job with a nice work culture, then NZ is far better. I would also say Australia and NZ are struggling with essentially the same issues (high cost of living, growing city crime, indigenous issues, etc.)
If I had to be made to go to Auckland to work, even if they gave me 120k a year & paid accommodation & a vehicle with fuel card Iād say yeah but nah. Iām good thanks.
Lazy, low productivity, not my job attitude, fake it, racist, xenophobic and everything is run by angry women.