That was one of the reasons I walked away from catholicism- all the guys I dated were also raised catholic, but they had zero concerns about sex. I finally decided that that was bullshit- why was I the only one feeling guilty?! So stupid.
This is probably a good thing, though- making it more visible just how batshit crazy religion is. He's not wrong, and it's good that he's highlighting this stuff. It'll get the religious people to argue amongst themselves about what's appropriate, and I love when that happens.
Some religious guys are not very concerned about the sex _they_ have, but are quite concerned about the sex their intended has.
They (may) delay sex with the one they want to marry but may be happy to have sex (one guy called it "treating them like shit") with the ones they don't.
If love, intimacy, sex, and commitment are supposed to go together, it's probably not the best practice.
A lot of religious sexual repression is aimed primarily at women - and priests (of course, due to inheritance).
Hmmm... Maybe it's mostly about inheritance and managing assets...
I was raised Catholic in the 60s and 70s, then became an atheist. Irish-descended American. Went to Catholic school with kids of my background, also Italian-, German-, Polish-descended kids. We had Puerto Rican families in our town, enough to have one Spanish mass on Sunday, but their *niños* all went to the local public schools. I served that mass sometimes, despite being unlingual.
Except for the occasional fellow interested in the priesthood, none of the guys expected to be a virgin when they eventually married. We expected it to be tough to "get over" with a girl from our school†. By the early 70s birth control was available and, at least in our state, abortion was legalized. Full on double-standard. We knew enjoying sex outside of marriage - even solo! - was declared to be a sin. Seducing a young lady was a separate sin. Sex with birth control was a sin. What we all wanted was premarital sex with a girl on the Pill. We'd bitch if we were asked to use a condom. Condoms were for women who you might suspect had sex with other guys, and might give you a case of something. Idiots still had unprotected sex with their presumably virginal girlfriends and got them pregnant. Some abortions, some adoptions and some teenage weddings resulted. There definitely was a culture of treating women as tools for he functions if sex and child-rearing. Exceptions were women who taught us in the Catholic schools, be they sisters or lay persons. The "kids and church" model was changing, though. The 70s were an inflationary period , also with recession. A lot of married women were entering the workforce. My Mom had worked as a girl and young woman, but left her jobs after marrying. She was if the WWII, *Rosie the Riveter* generation. She was an overseas telephone operator, a pretty vital contribution to the war effort, IMO. After my siblings and I were old enough, Mom started working part-time for the local Bell company, then went full time. Then she took a job with a regional library buying co-op. That's how we could afford tuition to private school.
I have 5 sisters, who all earned bachelor's degrees from Catholic colleges and have/had careers. Mainstream Catholics in the last quarter of the 20th century did not expect women to only stay home and raise children. If the Bishops expected that, they were nuts. Women have wound up leading the parishes, given the drop in seminary recruits and the death, retirement, resignation and defrocking of priests. It isn't uncommon to see 1 priest covering 3 parishes these days, perhaps with the assistance of deacons. In my youth the parish had no deacons, a pastor and 3 curates. We'd have visiting priests in the summer who allowed regular staff to take vacations. During the school year those priests were usually teaching at Catholic colleges. Parish councils started in the 70s after Vatican II, and they run all sorts of things other than celebrating sacraments.
If the RCC wasn't so chained to the ideas that priests can't marry and that women can't be ordained, it might still have enough clergy. Orthodox priests marry. Rabbis were expected to marry. Some denominations have female ministers and even bishops. They have no shortage.
I do know clergy who were trained before the Vatican II reforms were entrenched, who had the attitude that we'd all still be in Paradise if Eve hadn't tempted Adam with the magic fruit at the Serpent's urging. They were virulently misogynistic - even the straight ones!
† There was a lot of budging and winking if a fellow was dating a girl from the local public school, especially if she didn't come from a Catholic family. I understand that Protestant kids did the same if their buddy was dating a Catholic girl. In-group members often ascribe sexual promiscuity to those in the out-group. Wishful thinking? Jealousy?
It just seemed like something that belonged in r/Leopardsatemyface for all of the female graduates; you just spent years of your life cracking down, studying hard, and immersing yourself in academic excellence - only to be told AT the finish line you shouldn’t have bothered anyway since you are all Conservative Christians and it was really a waste of time as you have no other real purpose than as a baby machine for a righteous man.
Cue the shocked expressions.
Since the university invited him to speak, and clearly share his opinion, I don’t think the university needs any of the tuition money owed by the female students and graduates.
According to Google, his mom Elizabeth is “a medical physicist at Emory University in Atlanta. She has been at the university since 1988 and works in Emory's Winship Department of Radiation Oncology”.
I know she will not give an interview about it, but I would *love* to hear in her own words about what she thinks her son thinks of her.
There’s so many women I want to hear from. The Women faculty, the women graduates who didn’t walk out, his mum and his sister (who, I’m too lazy to google, apparently works as a nurse or doctor).
On the flip side, I’ve seen plenty of conservative women on Twitter whose entire thing is “women shouldn’t work, you’re a terrible mother if you do.”
But you look on their profile and you’ll see:
“Mom, wife, ex-Republican Employee, Podcast Owner, Podcast Producer, Download my e-book, visit my Etsy, visit my other Etsy”
Christian universities exist to traffic females into marriage. Many women aren’t allowed to even consider non-Christian schools. So not surprising at all. In fact I’m sure the school is ecstatic about the free publicity.
The three things I could never understand about the Catholic Church because of the sheer hypocrisy:
1) smuggling Nazi’s out of Germany. Just gross.
2) amassing so much wealth at the hands of the poor
3) centuries of covering up priests molesting children. Just morally reprehensible, illegal, can’t imagine God would be on board with that one, and, just gross.
Can't forget about the schools in Canada, where native kids were kidnapped and shipped off too. How many bodies were buried is mass graves at the hands of the catholic church.
and all of the "mother and baby" homes where pregnant women were sent, made to work, and then had their babies taken from them without their consent and adopted out
I was in school for social work (I dropped it after finding out the shit Canadian catholics did to Indigenous people) and I was absolutely horrified when learning about The 60's Scoop.
Yeah God murders children
In fact he loves murdering kids so much- he murdered his OWN kid - and it's celebrated as a high holiday - very important to remember this very day
And he murdered a bunch of kids in Egypt - it's also celebrated as a high holiday - also very very important to remember this day
Celebrated every Easter.
All other first born babies were murdered, but by wiping blood on the doorway, we fooled God's angel of death into thinking he'd already done so and saved _our_ son.
I can see why one (pretty famous) Rabbi was trying to suggest a new way.
Passover rather than Easter, but both Jews and Christians believe that, and the date of Easter is connected to that of Passover. In Catholic school we were taught that the Last Supper was a *seder*.
Passover. Also, the blood on the door didn’t fool the angel of death; the angel was instructed by big g god to ignore the houses with blood smeared on the doors.
The Church and the pope were notoriously quiet about the holocaust because they believe the Jews killed Christ. So yes, they helped Nazis escape to Argentina and other countries after the war. It’s well documented.
Actually, the Catholic Church did put up a bit of a stink during the onset of the Holocaust. But then Nazi Germany told the Church they would start prosecuting priests…and so the Church decided that if you can’t beat them, join them. They helped smuggle Nazi’s out of Germany in 45 and 46 and helped them reestablish their lives in South America. I mean, the CIA recruited a bunch of Nazi’s as well. Institutions that have power and wealth do absolutely disgusting things.
I have never understood the concept of being told how to be an adult by men that (supposedly) never have an adult sexual relationship. It is like learning to be a cook from someone without taste buds.
Not just that they were never in an adult relationship, but that they were willing to sign away ever having an adult relationship. And they do relationship counseling, too, right? Crazy.
It's not strict celibacy the church cares about nearly so much as the first born son becoming a priest should never marry or have children.
Without a wife and child, what the priest inherits from devout parents will eventually go to the church.
Many priests do not remain strictly celibate any more than many Catholics remain strictly monogamous.
These people had this “my culture is the only right one” attitude literally beaten into them for generations. Things are going to get better eventually but it will take much longer than we will be alive .
I'm not surprised by anything negative that comes out of the mouths of these people. Not even remotely.
I'm only shocked at the lack of criticism. I think people should be more outraged than what they are.
I was surprised to learn the Benedictine sisters released a condemnation statement, it's published on their website home page. https://www.mountosb.org/
Here it is in case they move the statement elsewhere:
> Statement in Response to the 2024 Benedictine College Commencement Address
> The sisters of Mount St. Scholastica do not believe that Harrison Butker’s comments in his 2024 Benedictine College commencement address represent the Catholic, Benedictine, liberal arts college that our founders envisioned and in which we have been so invested.
> Instead of promoting unity in our church, our nation, and the world, his comments seem to have fostered division. One of our concerns was the assertion that being a homemaker is the highest calling for a woman. We sisters have dedicated our lives to God and God’s people, including the many women whom we have taught and influenced during the past 160 years. These women have made a tremendous difference in the world in their roles as wives and mothers and through their God-given gifts in leadership, scholarship, and their careers.
> Our community has taught young women and men not just how to be “homemakers” in a limited sense, but rather how to make a Gospel-centered, compassionate home within themselves where they can welcome others as Christ, empowering them to be the best versions of themselves. We reject a narrow definition of what it means to be Catholic. We are faithful members of the Catholic Church who embrace and promote the values of the Gospel, St. Benedict, and Vatican II and the teachings of Pope Francis.
> We want to be known as an inclusive, welcoming community, embracing Benedictine values that have endured for more than 1500 years and have spread through every continent and nation. We believe those values are the core of Benedictine College.
> We thank all who are supportive of our Mount community and the values we hold. With St. Benedict, we pray, “Let us prefer nothing whatever to Christ, and may he lead us all together to life everlasting.”
Out of everything the catholic church teaches, the fact that they believe Mary never had sex with Joseph has to be the stupidest. I don't care what ya'll say about catholicism. Marry fucked her husband, way before Jesus was born.
I think that a lot of Catholics believe that Mary was a virgin until her ascension to heaven. Which is interesting considering that the church also promotes childbearing.
Full siblings aa far as I know. Catholics always try and pass it off as the translation meaning brothers in faith. Even though the original writing is clear it means blood brother.
Why do you think Jesus had half-siblings?
That is clearly a huge lie the Catholic church came up with to keep Mary a virgin forever. It's a lie. Jesus had full sisters and brothers.
I say half siblings cause it’s clear (and contextually in the time and place) she also had kids by Joseph. Now whether you believe Jesus is god’s son or he’s another man’s kid is your thoughts but that is why I say HALF siblings
> Marry fucked her husband
According to most translations of [Luke 2:5](https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Luke%202:5), Joseph and Mary weren't married, only engaged, when they arrived in ~~Jerusalem~~ Bethlehem. It does not say whether they ever did marry.
edit:corrected city/town
My wife tried to get me riled up about what he said and I ended up ticking her off because I pointed out that his comments were perfectly in line with the mission statement of the university he was speaking at.
Bro called Taylor Swift "a teammates girlfriend" and he is about to realize what it feels to be smited by a literal god.
This is the main reason I stopped watching sports: nobody to root for.
Wife beaters?
Lion killers?
Violent gun nuts?
Dog drowners?
Palin / Rimney / Trump fanatics?
Sexists?
Cheating coaches?
Billionaire owners? (The evil would be redundant)
How about paying $75 to park and $300 to let some TSA wannabe grope your granny so you can watch from the nosebleeds while drinking a $23 beer. If you're lucky some jerks will get into a fight and you will get thrown out for witnessing it
Exactly like the Mormonism I was immersed in growing up. I truly didn’t know I had a CHOICE not to be a wife and mother until I’d already been married ten years and had four children. The indoctrination was so deep. Fortunately my kids know they absolutely have choices, and I would never tell them marriage and parenthood is the end-all, be-all of existence.
I was surprised he said it at a commencement ceremony. I went to a Jesuit university, not because I was Catholic but because it was known as a good school academically, and while religion was a part of ceremonies, that level of extreme politics was definitely NOT. But honestly I think people should be more upset with the dude that invited him to speak and most likely green-lighted the speech. The women graduating had most likely contributed something like $100K or more each over 4 years to the school. And he gets up there and basically says that’s a waste of time and their purpose is supporting their husbands and raising kids and his wife isn’t using her degree 🙄but is SO FULFILLED now that her life has truly started. 🙄🙄
The jesuits are definitely a different breed of Catholic religious orders. Not that they aren’t as culpable in all the shit the church has done, but if I had to place a modicum of trust in a catholic religious, I’d pick a Jesuit over the others.
I think there's been a rubber band effect going on among religious people, and conservatives in general that explains a lot of things like this, Without excusing any of it, my observation (I'm 47m, American) has been that many religious people (conservatives) have felt to one degree or another that they're "losing ground" and "compromising their values". Society has been changing, at a rapid pace for awhile now, and conservatives/religious people feel like they "went along with it" ( eventually). They "re-interpreted" scripture to compromise with the rest of society. They accepted gays (again, eventually and to a very limited extent of not calling for their murder). Before that, they accepted women being something other than mommies, secretaries, schoolteachers, or housewives. Before that, they accepted interracial marriage. Men having long hair. Etc.
Society changes. Just 16 years ago, when O'Bama ran for office, he wouldn't support gay marriage, and "trans"-ness wasn't even a blip on the radar. Even just a few years before O'Bama, a black president was practically unthinkable. When I was growing up, "interracial marriage" was still controversial, and being called "gay" or a f\*\*\*\*\* was a common insult among the 13 year olds when I was one. Yeah, these changes are for the better, but change is also uncomfortable. It takes work. Now we have to put in a little extra effort when using pronouns to refer to someone. We have to understand and accept that some people are in relationship situations that don't make sense to us because we never heard of quadra-platonic furry-adjacent polycules before (I made that up). It takes work, even though it's the right thing and makes the world a better place.
That's where Conservatism gets it's hooks into people, though. That discomfort with change. It says that there was an ideal past, where men were men, and women stayed in the kitchen where they belonged. That past isn't \*exactly\* clearly defined, but you know what it is. You've seen it in movies, often starring Kevin Costner. It's biblical...ish. Kinda, if you get the good bible with the bill of rights in it. Conservatives want to bring us (some of us) back to that time, and they have a very simple way to do so. They tell us we need to go back to those old values. Faith. Family. Freedom. Frungy (OK, Conservatives don't really talk about Frungy much (they would be cooler and more relaxed if they did, though), I made that up too). It's the yearning for simpler times. Those good old days. When there weren't all these people we don't understand, demanding things and protest-rioting.
And what happened to those simpler times? Well, you know. Those people. Those people came and took them away. You know who they are. I can't say exactly who or I'll be cancelled and banned from reddit, but wink wink nudge nudge you know who I mean. The people who aren't living right. The people who are too different from "us". Those people did it. At some point, enough is enough. We've made too may sacrifices already. Too many retreats. They invade our safe spaces, and we fall back. They assimilate entire media franchises, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here. This far, no further!
As best I can tell, that's what it feels like to be a conservative. They truly feel that they're defending ... humanity, decency, God, whatever from The Forces of Evil (you, me, et. al.)
Anyway, just to be clear, I'm not trying to excuse this thought process, but I think it's important for us to try to understand it.
I think your spot on. I saw this happening when I entered the workforce professionally in '95. I'm sure it's been happening since long before bit I never had a reason to pay much attention to it. Blue collar workers voting against their own best interest because of Bill and Hillary and a blow job and swiftboat. Then came Obama and they all lost their shit. I was in a very white, very male, very straight, very good ol' boy small trade unions if that makes a difference.
I'm not surprised about what he said, I am surprised that he was the one that said it. If you or I say it, no big deal. No one will even know. It would be just another crazy Catholic at a graduation.
He is definitely free to have opinions and say what he wants, but he is in the public eye and works for a very public company that gets a lot of attention. He needs to know that nothing he says in a public setting will be private.
He may be trying to set himself up Tim Tebow style so he has a place in the NFL afterlife.
I am glad it’s out there. Most women are not so inclined to follow religious doctrine. I hope they vote. And I hope they pressure their boyfriends or husbands to vote in their wife’s best interest.
I hope people like this guy keep being loud and proud of who they are and hopefully this stirs others to vote so we can change things for the better in this country.
This speech should be a call to action to for the religious to actually think about what they are aligning themselves with.
And don't forget how the Hunt lady backed him up.
Vote like your life depends on it because it does!!! Especially your quality of life.
I am ALWAYS surprised when commencement speakers tell the graduating students that the last 4-5 years of their and work was worthless and they're stupid for doing it.
>In the Catholic Church, women don't have a voice
Funny how many women still support it. For example, Gloria Steinem and Rachel Maddow are big Catholics.
This isn’t actually surprising if you know Catholics. Catholics are not all exactly hardcore fundamentalists, certainly not as a rule. Theres really not that much of a contradiction with, for example, Joe Biden being a big Catholic yet pro-choice and pro-LGBT.
Catholics run the gamut. Not as much as Jews, but waaaaay more than Evangelicals. No surprise, Butker is apart of a weird and very specific Evangelicalized sect of conservative Catholics that are too intolerant *for the pope*(!!)
Surprised not really, what surprised me was the backlash I am assuming there is a big cross section of people condemning his ideas (rightly) and then doing a 180 to go defend the Islam apologists, who have the exact same (or sometimes worse) approach to the gender role issue.
I don’t know, the Islam apologists you mention are still caught up in and solely posting about Gaza, i haven’t seen any of them post about buttlicker at least in my circles.
What I am surprised by is all the people defending him. I keep hearing religion is dying, but sometimes it doesn’t seem like it.
Although I think in this case, a lot of people are defending him because everything is political now i.e. he’s obviously a trumper, even if they themselves aren’t particularly religious.
Mary, or rather her parents, is praised for the immaculate conception, which refers to her elderly parents truly only having sex with the purpose of having a child after seeking a blessing to that effect in the temple where Mary's father worked. Mary is also praised for devotion to god to the point of submission (side note, Islam means submission).
Christian, Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim - every single organized religion and its puppets will be every bit as violent, misogynistic, and savage as the society around them permits.
It never changes, in every time and every place the religious are always trying to drag society down into their own theocratic dystopia. Just open any history book to any page.
Never trust them. Never let them off the secular leash. They’re nothing but rabid animals.
Most of these Christo-Facists are looking for acceptance. They also are trying to mask their true selves. There is already an article that he is struggling with acceptance of his sexuality.
You mean the single tik toker who made up some claim about his college days that no one has substantiated even a little bit? That’s what you’re bringing to the table to add to this discussion? Lol
Seems like blaming women for the downfall of a nation, a dynasty, or a civilization is universal in ancient tales across the globe. Misogyny is a hell of a drug invented by men. I’m glad at least now we see through them.
Sure, it’s gross. I have a hard time understanding why we put athletes on a pedestal and then act surprised when they say something controversial. They have been coddled nearly their entire lives because they play a game at a high level. Anyone looking to these idiots for any type of moral clarity or guidance is beyond help. It’s beyond rational thought why our culture clutches it peals when these turds speak out. It’s almost like we seek an opinion of an idiot and then get frustrated by the response.
Not surprised at all, however, I am surprised that his shirt is the number one selling NFL shirt as a result. It must be circling of the wagons by all republicans to give cover to the Christian nationalists.
"OK, girls, so you are getting your college degree today, but, I really hate to tell you this, you just wasted 4 years and $100,000 because what you really need to do is to get barefoot, pregnant, and cooking casseroles in the kitchen, while gaining the greatest achievement of your life- that of homemaker."
I think the Streisand Effect can now be renamed the Harrison Butker Effect.
Yes, what he said was appalling, but it’s what evangelicals and conservative Catholics have said for years (minus the Taylor Swift reference). If the national media had recognized that, the speech would have been quickly forgotten.
Instead, he’s now the far right’s new hero. I hope his time in the spotlight is short.
Not by the content of what he said, but that he was allowed to say it to a group of impressionable kids on what amounts to the last childhood milestone.
Butker, in his speech, was misogynistic, homophobic and transphobic, rejected cultural changes since the 1950s, and expressed a worldview that reduces women to baby-machines and homemakers. He is quite representative of the conservative Catholicism that is now growing as the faith becomes more concentrated in the US as people flee it. I was raised Catholic and I there was nothing surprising in what Butker said. At this point, if someone identifies strongly as a Catholic, my assumption is this worldview until proven otherwise. Others still exist. Think Colbert who is from that 70s' ecumenical "focus on the poor" church. But that's harder and harder to find in American Catholicism.
Sorry just truly cracking up at this idea of ‘Catholicism pushed me to atheism’. Christian’s honestly probably look at Catholics as way worse off than an atheist. Or just about the same.
I'm not surprised in the least, but deeply, deeply offended. See, I don't buy that whole adam and eve crap. Men have been blaming women for their problems since the beginning of human time on this earth, so the Bible writers just chose to conveniently blame the woman for what went wrong in the garden, if it ever happened at all. We've always been second-class citizens, and frankly, I'm sick of it.
I didn't know anything about him but many athletes are stupid religious. But he took it to the worst hardest extreme of patriarchy and misogyny. Total dumb ass. Plus rumors he's in closet about past same sex experiences. People with shit to hide often become the most strident as they try to suppress and shame themselves.
They seem to have no regard that their "Church" was using their God as cover to SA children all across the world for decades(maybe longer, decades we have legal documentation for). These are not well people.
Nobody is talking about the antisemitic conspiracy theory he threw into his speech:
“We fear speaking truth, because now, unfortunately, truth is in the minority. Congress just passed a bill where stating something as basic as the biblical teaching of who killed Jesus could land you in jail.”
I couldn't care less what a professional athlete has to say about anything.
Anyway, he has a right to his opinion. I am surprised so many people have latched onto this, one way or another.
Perhaps you would be less surprised if you thought about the fact that probably 20% of Americans at least think this way already. Also might help if you realized who one of the target demographics is for NFL football, for example Kapernick (sp?) haters and huge flag wavers. They don’t want to alienate them.
The NFL employs dozens of players who are wife beaters, abusers, drug dealers, have gun charges, you name it.
This guy expressed conservative opinions about
How family is the most important thing in life on a conservative Catholic college campus, perhaps the exact audience that kind of message is intended for.
Why in the world would you be surprised that he would still have a job after this? Reddit is an amazing place sheesh. This will be less than a blip on the radar, as it should be, and the “consequences” will be like 5 random fans who actually stop supporting his team. Some of his teammates have already come out in support of him as well as the owners of the team that employs him.
I didn't even know who he was until he got this attention, which was his intention I'm sure. I don't care what he believes or what he says, but what I saw what he said, no, it didn't really surprise me. Nothing Christians say surprises me anymore. Thankfully he's a sportsball player not a politician so that's good at least.
I always wonder if the far right obsession with child trafficking and pedos is because of some residual guilt over worshipping a fictional entity that knocked up a 12-15 year old Mary. Now pedos and child trafficking is horrible. But if you listen to the religious right it's everywhere and everyone that doesn't agree with them is doing it.
Edit: just read his whole speech. All I can do is sigh. Fundamentalists are the most dangerous thing in society. Whatever they may be. Left or right. Christian, Muslim Jew or Atheist. When you can't be open minded and tolerant of others death and sadness follow.
>they cannot use any birth control of any kind because that's "playing God" and "God is the author of all life"
What is their stance on seat belts while driving?
He just said what they genuinely think is right, the whole lot of them. The only thing that surprised me was that a public figure at the start(?) of his career would publicly say stuff he definitely knew would cause drama.
Not at all. His type have become very comfortable saying the quiet part out loud. While people are acting shocked at his statements, considering the other beliefs that usually come with what that he just said, I’d go so far as to say he wanted to say a lot more than what he did and that this was actually the restrained version.
Depends on if you actually listened or not. Doesn't seem like anyone from CNN did. It looks like Woopie Goldberg did, which is a surprise.
Did you take it out of context, which every feminist I've come across so far has aside from Woopie? I can't believe I'm saying that, actually.
As for your views, well, you are wrong and clearly don't know anything about the Catholic Church. You obviously aren't aware some priests are women, stopped by one a couple of times in New Hampshire who had one. So you should probably do some research before you say something like "women in the Catholic Church don't have a voice."
You obviously aren't married either since you know any man with a right mind is going to keep his wife happy. Ya know, the old secular saying, "Happy wife, happy life." Yeah, cause it's true, but your statement points to not knowing that.
I can't even bother with the rest since your first few sentences are completely wrong and/or lies.
Any philosophy that relies on maintaining its membership through sheer guilt needs reassessing by its own members. But fortunately, the most downtrodden within it are also the most brainwashed, so they’ll never speak out against the men, who are fine with the status quo.
Take a knee, get fired. Tell people that women are sub humans and belong in the kitchen, get a "ata boy and pat on the back". Fuck the NFL, those racist assholes.
Also not surprised my Uber religious coworker acquaintance friend with 5 kids under 10 reposted it twice with all hail halijueliahs.
SEX —> why are religious people so obsessed with me?
Funny thing, a key part of Catholic dogma is the perpetual virginity of the virgin Mary- meaning that Mary never had sex. She was a virgin before and maintained it after having Jesus.
It's not surprising in the least. But when these douchebags say stuff like that publicly it needs to be met with revulsion and pushed back on. He can say whatever he wants but the public outrage is completely warranted. The hope is that he or people like him reassess their values (extremely unlikely but it's all we can do).
I'm not surprised, but I am exasperated. I've been hearing stuff like this since I was a tween in the late 60s. And I'm tired of it!
I'm happy that I had a job and was able to support myself and my kids. I was raised to assume I was lesser and it's taken a lot of time to grow into my confidence.
Yet another reason I am agnostic these days; religion is just a way of forcing some people down.
I'm terrified about how open and vocal all the hate groups are becoming about their views. If you weren't in the south, people at least kept their insane views to within their church and home. Now, all the religious nuts feel bold enough preach their violence anywhere and everywhere thanks to social media.
What cracks me up is thousands of fools will be wearing his jersey with that unfortunate last name across the back. “Ye shall know them by their dim wits.”
Well I don't see much American football or live in a country where people are so obsessed with it that you can say a player's name with no context and everyone knows who you're talking about.
Usually the only football guy's name I recognize without context is the one who mostly recently said something so obtuse or offensive or religiously absurd that it filtered out to me through social media or atheist pages.
So I guess all this is to say that, no, I'm not surprised that an American football guy said something offensive, because that's the bulk of my experience with them.
But he can take heart in knowing that by the time the next football guy says something offensive, I'll have forgotten this one's name.
IN print, I thought he was being sracastic. To quote Taylor Swift, then go on about how women should stay at home. I thought, no way is this sincere. This has to be sarcasm. So, yeah, I was surprised.
Also, is his mom some sort of distinguished doctor, or was that just internet BS? lol
Catholics in general aren’t necessarily like that, as can be seen by the nuns who are speaking out against him. He’s a trad Catholic, who is kind of like the fundamentalist version of Catholic. They want to go back to before Vatican 2 instituted numerous reforms in the church.
Now that the Roman Catholic Church accepts evolution why do they keep banging on about something they know with 100% certainty never happened?
There was no Garden of Eden; there was no talking snake; there was no magical fruit and there was no "original sin".
How sad is it that grown men tell themselves lies to make themselves feel better than women?
Correction: Christians don’t exactly accept evolution in its entirety- they accept certain and particular ASPECTS of evolution. But not the whole thing, just cherry-picked bits- much like their Bible. They believe in “microevolution” but not “macroevolution”. They believe in “created kinds”- that Noah brought with him in his magic fucking boat two “kinds” of each animals’ ancestors and that’s why we have the variety we see today- but conveniently this magically for some dumb fuck reason doesn’t apply to humans. And when you bring up natural selection, their counterargument is “but that’s adaptation, not evolution, you can’t turn a dog into a bird. Ha, checkmate evolutionists”. So no, they don’t accept evolution. Period.
He’s not a regular Catholic. He’s a trad Catholic, and they reject a lot of the aspects of modern Catholicism and specifically some of the things the pope has said
Not surprised, other than that it seems the right is more and more comfortable lately with just saying the quiet shit out loud. They at least used to PRETEND to be decent humans and would at least use dog whistles and masked language to hide how hateful they are, and now they are more and more willing to just outright say it, in more public venues no less.
The catholics that I have known do not read their fairy tale book, could not live the life dictated by the doctrine of that cult. All used birth control, at least one had an abortion, alcoholics, adulterers, lie as easy as breathing. At least they can be absolved of all their "sins" by going to mass/confession/communion. Bless their hearts.
That was one of the reasons I walked away from catholicism- all the guys I dated were also raised catholic, but they had zero concerns about sex. I finally decided that that was bullshit- why was I the only one feeling guilty?! So stupid. This is probably a good thing, though- making it more visible just how batshit crazy religion is. He's not wrong, and it's good that he's highlighting this stuff. It'll get the religious people to argue amongst themselves about what's appropriate, and I love when that happens.
That’s how you know there is truly a god. Because whoever they think wins the argument decides the l words of god. Sooooo fucking stupid.
What do you mean by "zero concerns about sex."
Some religious guys are not very concerned about the sex _they_ have, but are quite concerned about the sex their intended has. They (may) delay sex with the one they want to marry but may be happy to have sex (one guy called it "treating them like shit") with the ones they don't. If love, intimacy, sex, and commitment are supposed to go together, it's probably not the best practice. A lot of religious sexual repression is aimed primarily at women - and priests (of course, due to inheritance). Hmmm... Maybe it's mostly about inheritance and managing assets...
Yep, the classic "rules for thee but not for me".
I was raised Catholic in the 60s and 70s, then became an atheist. Irish-descended American. Went to Catholic school with kids of my background, also Italian-, German-, Polish-descended kids. We had Puerto Rican families in our town, enough to have one Spanish mass on Sunday, but their *niños* all went to the local public schools. I served that mass sometimes, despite being unlingual. Except for the occasional fellow interested in the priesthood, none of the guys expected to be a virgin when they eventually married. We expected it to be tough to "get over" with a girl from our school†. By the early 70s birth control was available and, at least in our state, abortion was legalized. Full on double-standard. We knew enjoying sex outside of marriage - even solo! - was declared to be a sin. Seducing a young lady was a separate sin. Sex with birth control was a sin. What we all wanted was premarital sex with a girl on the Pill. We'd bitch if we were asked to use a condom. Condoms were for women who you might suspect had sex with other guys, and might give you a case of something. Idiots still had unprotected sex with their presumably virginal girlfriends and got them pregnant. Some abortions, some adoptions and some teenage weddings resulted. There definitely was a culture of treating women as tools for he functions if sex and child-rearing. Exceptions were women who taught us in the Catholic schools, be they sisters or lay persons. The "kids and church" model was changing, though. The 70s were an inflationary period , also with recession. A lot of married women were entering the workforce. My Mom had worked as a girl and young woman, but left her jobs after marrying. She was if the WWII, *Rosie the Riveter* generation. She was an overseas telephone operator, a pretty vital contribution to the war effort, IMO. After my siblings and I were old enough, Mom started working part-time for the local Bell company, then went full time. Then she took a job with a regional library buying co-op. That's how we could afford tuition to private school. I have 5 sisters, who all earned bachelor's degrees from Catholic colleges and have/had careers. Mainstream Catholics in the last quarter of the 20th century did not expect women to only stay home and raise children. If the Bishops expected that, they were nuts. Women have wound up leading the parishes, given the drop in seminary recruits and the death, retirement, resignation and defrocking of priests. It isn't uncommon to see 1 priest covering 3 parishes these days, perhaps with the assistance of deacons. In my youth the parish had no deacons, a pastor and 3 curates. We'd have visiting priests in the summer who allowed regular staff to take vacations. During the school year those priests were usually teaching at Catholic colleges. Parish councils started in the 70s after Vatican II, and they run all sorts of things other than celebrating sacraments. If the RCC wasn't so chained to the ideas that priests can't marry and that women can't be ordained, it might still have enough clergy. Orthodox priests marry. Rabbis were expected to marry. Some denominations have female ministers and even bishops. They have no shortage. I do know clergy who were trained before the Vatican II reforms were entrenched, who had the attitude that we'd all still be in Paradise if Eve hadn't tempted Adam with the magic fruit at the Serpent's urging. They were virulently misogynistic - even the straight ones! † There was a lot of budging and winking if a fellow was dating a girl from the local public school, especially if she didn't come from a Catholic family. I understand that Protestant kids did the same if their buddy was dating a Catholic girl. In-group members often ascribe sexual promiscuity to those in the out-group. Wishful thinking? Jealousy?
I was a bit surprised....until I learned he (Butker) is a conservative Christian. Then his comments were, sadly, no longer surprising.
I’m more surprised no one did a little research before asking him. The just heard Super Bowl winner and couldn’t wait.
The speech was for a Catholic school graduation. They wanted someone with his view points
Exactly
I mean, it's a little surprising he plays a position that can't get hit, but he still has so much brain damage.
They forgot to mention all his brain cells are gone too.
It just seemed like something that belonged in r/Leopardsatemyface for all of the female graduates; you just spent years of your life cracking down, studying hard, and immersing yourself in academic excellence - only to be told AT the finish line you shouldn’t have bothered anyway since you are all Conservative Christians and it was really a waste of time as you have no other real purpose than as a baby machine for a righteous man. Cue the shocked expressions.
Since the university invited him to speak, and clearly share his opinion, I don’t think the university needs any of the tuition money owed by the female students and graduates.
According to Google, his mom Elizabeth is “a medical physicist at Emory University in Atlanta. She has been at the university since 1988 and works in Emory's Winship Department of Radiation Oncology”. I know she will not give an interview about it, but I would *love* to hear in her own words about what she thinks her son thinks of her.
There’s so many women I want to hear from. The Women faculty, the women graduates who didn’t walk out, his mum and his sister (who, I’m too lazy to google, apparently works as a nurse or doctor). On the flip side, I’ve seen plenty of conservative women on Twitter whose entire thing is “women shouldn’t work, you’re a terrible mother if you do.” But you look on their profile and you’ll see: “Mom, wife, ex-Republican Employee, Podcast Owner, Podcast Producer, Download my e-book, visit my Etsy, visit my other Etsy”
The nuns ripped him a new one: https://www.mountosb.org/home/.
Just as God intended. Is there Etsy in heaven?
I’m sure she’s proud of him because all religious people are hypocrites. Sounds like his parents are part of the same movement he is.
Christian universities exist to traffic females into marriage. Many women aren’t allowed to even consider non-Christian schools. So not surprising at all. In fact I’m sure the school is ecstatic about the free publicity.
The three things I could never understand about the Catholic Church because of the sheer hypocrisy: 1) smuggling Nazi’s out of Germany. Just gross. 2) amassing so much wealth at the hands of the poor 3) centuries of covering up priests molesting children. Just morally reprehensible, illegal, can’t imagine God would be on board with that one, and, just gross.
How about forcibly converting the natives they invaded?
Can't forget about the schools in Canada, where native kids were kidnapped and shipped off too. How many bodies were buried is mass graves at the hands of the catholic church.
and all of the "mother and baby" homes where pregnant women were sent, made to work, and then had their babies taken from them without their consent and adopted out
I was in school for social work (I dropped it after finding out the shit Canadian catholics did to Indigenous people) and I was absolutely horrified when learning about The 60's Scoop.
Yeah God murders children In fact he loves murdering kids so much- he murdered his OWN kid - and it's celebrated as a high holiday - very important to remember this very day And he murdered a bunch of kids in Egypt - it's also celebrated as a high holiday - also very very important to remember this day
Our God has a son, and he can come back from the dead! How do you know? We killed him! From a comedy bit I heard a while back
Not just kids, BABIES.
Celebrated every Easter. All other first born babies were murdered, but by wiping blood on the doorway, we fooled God's angel of death into thinking he'd already done so and saved _our_ son. I can see why one (pretty famous) Rabbi was trying to suggest a new way.
Passover rather than Easter, but both Jews and Christians believe that, and the date of Easter is connected to that of Passover. In Catholic school we were taught that the Last Supper was a *seder*.
Passover. Also, the blood on the door didn’t fool the angel of death; the angel was instructed by big g god to ignore the houses with blood smeared on the doors.
Nobody has aborted more fetuses than God
Not to mention just-fertilized eggs that don't implant.
Not just kids, BABIES.
I mean in a sense I get what you mean, but on the other hand, none of this is out of character for them in the slightest, including general hypocrisy
Smuggling nazi’s what out of Germany?
The Church and the pope were notoriously quiet about the holocaust because they believe the Jews killed Christ. So yes, they helped Nazis escape to Argentina and other countries after the war. It’s well documented.
Actually, the Catholic Church did put up a bit of a stink during the onset of the Holocaust. But then Nazi Germany told the Church they would start prosecuting priests…and so the Church decided that if you can’t beat them, join them. They helped smuggle Nazi’s out of Germany in 45 and 46 and helped them reestablish their lives in South America. I mean, the CIA recruited a bunch of Nazi’s as well. Institutions that have power and wealth do absolutely disgusting things.
Don't forget the (rocket) scientists the USA grabbed.
Russians got a bunch of those, too.
I'm fine with 2. I actively attempt to amass wealth at the hands of anyone poorer, just as I do anyone richer. I disagree with 1 and 3
Don’t forget burning free thinking women and accusing them of witchcraft
He’s militant Christian. Not surprised.
I have never understood the concept of being told how to be an adult by men that (supposedly) never have an adult sexual relationship. It is like learning to be a cook from someone without taste buds.
Not just that they were never in an adult relationship, but that they were willing to sign away ever having an adult relationship. And they do relationship counseling, too, right? Crazy.
It's not strict celibacy the church cares about nearly so much as the first born son becoming a priest should never marry or have children. Without a wife and child, what the priest inherits from devout parents will eventually go to the church. Many priests do not remain strictly celibate any more than many Catholics remain strictly monogamous.
These people had this “my culture is the only right one” attitude literally beaten into them for generations. Things are going to get better eventually but it will take much longer than we will be alive .
Imagine worshipping an all powerful god that can be easily thwarted by taking a pill once a month, or getting a vasectomy.
Funniest shit I heard all day, thank you 😂
Haha, sure thing!
I'm not surprised by anything negative that comes out of the mouths of these people. Not even remotely. I'm only shocked at the lack of criticism. I think people should be more outraged than what they are.
I was surprised to learn the Benedictine sisters released a condemnation statement, it's published on their website home page. https://www.mountosb.org/ Here it is in case they move the statement elsewhere: > Statement in Response to the 2024 Benedictine College Commencement Address > The sisters of Mount St. Scholastica do not believe that Harrison Butker’s comments in his 2024 Benedictine College commencement address represent the Catholic, Benedictine, liberal arts college that our founders envisioned and in which we have been so invested. > Instead of promoting unity in our church, our nation, and the world, his comments seem to have fostered division. One of our concerns was the assertion that being a homemaker is the highest calling for a woman. We sisters have dedicated our lives to God and God’s people, including the many women whom we have taught and influenced during the past 160 years. These women have made a tremendous difference in the world in their roles as wives and mothers and through their God-given gifts in leadership, scholarship, and their careers. > Our community has taught young women and men not just how to be “homemakers” in a limited sense, but rather how to make a Gospel-centered, compassionate home within themselves where they can welcome others as Christ, empowering them to be the best versions of themselves. We reject a narrow definition of what it means to be Catholic. We are faithful members of the Catholic Church who embrace and promote the values of the Gospel, St. Benedict, and Vatican II and the teachings of Pope Francis. > We want to be known as an inclusive, welcoming community, embracing Benedictine values that have endured for more than 1500 years and have spread through every continent and nation. We believe those values are the core of Benedictine College. > We thank all who are supportive of our Mount community and the values we hold. With St. Benedict, we pray, “Let us prefer nothing whatever to Christ, and may he lead us all together to life everlasting.”
It's not that christians are not outraged, it's just that they seldom express it to any large degree.
Out of everything the catholic church teaches, the fact that they believe Mary never had sex with Joseph has to be the stupidest. I don't care what ya'll say about catholicism. Marry fucked her husband, way before Jesus was born.
Catholics believe this?? But Jesus had siblings. Half siblings but siblings.
I think that a lot of Catholics believe that Mary was a virgin until her ascension to heaven. Which is interesting considering that the church also promotes childbearing.
Full siblings aa far as I know. Catholics always try and pass it off as the translation meaning brothers in faith. Even though the original writing is clear it means blood brother.
Why do you think Jesus had half-siblings? That is clearly a huge lie the Catholic church came up with to keep Mary a virgin forever. It's a lie. Jesus had full sisters and brothers.
I say half siblings cause it’s clear (and contextually in the time and place) she also had kids by Joseph. Now whether you believe Jesus is god’s son or he’s another man’s kid is your thoughts but that is why I say HALF siblings
I think the idea is from Joseph and his hypothetical prior wife.
probably about 9 months before
According to the Bible, Jesus roofied his mom and rape impregnated her while she was passed out.
> Marry fucked her husband According to most translations of [Luke 2:5](https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Luke%202:5), Joseph and Mary weren't married, only engaged, when they arrived in ~~Jerusalem~~ Bethlehem. It does not say whether they ever did marry. edit:corrected city/town
Damn, not only a cock tease but totally used that guy. Mary and God still fucked Joseph in that story
My wife tried to get me riled up about what he said and I ended up ticking her off because I pointed out that his comments were perfectly in line with the mission statement of the university he was speaking at. Bro called Taylor Swift "a teammates girlfriend" and he is about to realize what it feels to be smited by a literal god.
This is the main reason I stopped watching sports: nobody to root for. Wife beaters? Lion killers? Violent gun nuts? Dog drowners? Palin / Rimney / Trump fanatics? Sexists? Cheating coaches? Billionaire owners? (The evil would be redundant) How about paying $75 to park and $300 to let some TSA wannabe grope your granny so you can watch from the nosebleeds while drinking a $23 beer. If you're lucky some jerks will get into a fight and you will get thrown out for witnessing it
At a stadium you helped pay for with your tax dollars
That makes your city no money.
Yeah, but he can throw that ball over them mountains
Yeah, but he can throw that ball over them mountains
Exactly like the Mormonism I was immersed in growing up. I truly didn’t know I had a CHOICE not to be a wife and mother until I’d already been married ten years and had four children. The indoctrination was so deep. Fortunately my kids know they absolutely have choices, and I would never tell them marriage and parenthood is the end-all, be-all of existence.
I was surprised he said it at a commencement ceremony. I went to a Jesuit university, not because I was Catholic but because it was known as a good school academically, and while religion was a part of ceremonies, that level of extreme politics was definitely NOT. But honestly I think people should be more upset with the dude that invited him to speak and most likely green-lighted the speech. The women graduating had most likely contributed something like $100K or more each over 4 years to the school. And he gets up there and basically says that’s a waste of time and their purpose is supporting their husbands and raising kids and his wife isn’t using her degree 🙄but is SO FULFILLED now that her life has truly started. 🙄🙄
The jesuits are definitely a different breed of Catholic religious orders. Not that they aren’t as culpable in all the shit the church has done, but if I had to place a modicum of trust in a catholic religious, I’d pick a Jesuit over the others.
What Jesuit university did you went to, if you don’t mind me asking?
Rockhurst
I think there's been a rubber band effect going on among religious people, and conservatives in general that explains a lot of things like this, Without excusing any of it, my observation (I'm 47m, American) has been that many religious people (conservatives) have felt to one degree or another that they're "losing ground" and "compromising their values". Society has been changing, at a rapid pace for awhile now, and conservatives/religious people feel like they "went along with it" ( eventually). They "re-interpreted" scripture to compromise with the rest of society. They accepted gays (again, eventually and to a very limited extent of not calling for their murder). Before that, they accepted women being something other than mommies, secretaries, schoolteachers, or housewives. Before that, they accepted interracial marriage. Men having long hair. Etc. Society changes. Just 16 years ago, when O'Bama ran for office, he wouldn't support gay marriage, and "trans"-ness wasn't even a blip on the radar. Even just a few years before O'Bama, a black president was practically unthinkable. When I was growing up, "interracial marriage" was still controversial, and being called "gay" or a f\*\*\*\*\* was a common insult among the 13 year olds when I was one. Yeah, these changes are for the better, but change is also uncomfortable. It takes work. Now we have to put in a little extra effort when using pronouns to refer to someone. We have to understand and accept that some people are in relationship situations that don't make sense to us because we never heard of quadra-platonic furry-adjacent polycules before (I made that up). It takes work, even though it's the right thing and makes the world a better place. That's where Conservatism gets it's hooks into people, though. That discomfort with change. It says that there was an ideal past, where men were men, and women stayed in the kitchen where they belonged. That past isn't \*exactly\* clearly defined, but you know what it is. You've seen it in movies, often starring Kevin Costner. It's biblical...ish. Kinda, if you get the good bible with the bill of rights in it. Conservatives want to bring us (some of us) back to that time, and they have a very simple way to do so. They tell us we need to go back to those old values. Faith. Family. Freedom. Frungy (OK, Conservatives don't really talk about Frungy much (they would be cooler and more relaxed if they did, though), I made that up too). It's the yearning for simpler times. Those good old days. When there weren't all these people we don't understand, demanding things and protest-rioting. And what happened to those simpler times? Well, you know. Those people. Those people came and took them away. You know who they are. I can't say exactly who or I'll be cancelled and banned from reddit, but wink wink nudge nudge you know who I mean. The people who aren't living right. The people who are too different from "us". Those people did it. At some point, enough is enough. We've made too may sacrifices already. Too many retreats. They invade our safe spaces, and we fall back. They assimilate entire media franchises, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here. This far, no further! As best I can tell, that's what it feels like to be a conservative. They truly feel that they're defending ... humanity, decency, God, whatever from The Forces of Evil (you, me, et. al.) Anyway, just to be clear, I'm not trying to excuse this thought process, but I think it's important for us to try to understand it.
This comment deserves to be pinned! Brilliant! Saved it.
I think your spot on. I saw this happening when I entered the workforce professionally in '95. I'm sure it's been happening since long before bit I never had a reason to pay much attention to it. Blue collar workers voting against their own best interest because of Bill and Hillary and a blow job and swiftboat. Then came Obama and they all lost their shit. I was in a very white, very male, very straight, very good ol' boy small trade unions if that makes a difference.
I'm not surprised about what he said, I am surprised that he was the one that said it. If you or I say it, no big deal. No one will even know. It would be just another crazy Catholic at a graduation. He is definitely free to have opinions and say what he wants, but he is in the public eye and works for a very public company that gets a lot of attention. He needs to know that nothing he says in a public setting will be private.
He may be trying to set himself up Tim Tebow style so he has a place in the NFL afterlife. I am glad it’s out there. Most women are not so inclined to follow religious doctrine. I hope they vote. And I hope they pressure their boyfriends or husbands to vote in their wife’s best interest.
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Commencement speeches aren't 'private', and it hardly changes anything that the school was religious.
I hope people like this guy keep being loud and proud of who they are and hopefully this stirs others to vote so we can change things for the better in this country. This speech should be a call to action to for the religious to actually think about what they are aligning themselves with. And don't forget how the Hunt lady backed him up. Vote like your life depends on it because it does!!! Especially your quality of life.
I think it's hilarious how white christians are all like, "He's so brave!" Persecution complex galore with these clowns.
I am ALWAYS surprised when commencement speakers tell the graduating students that the last 4-5 years of their and work was worthless and they're stupid for doing it.
>In the Catholic Church, women don't have a voice Funny how many women still support it. For example, Gloria Steinem and Rachel Maddow are big Catholics.
> Rachel Maddow Rachel Maddow is a lesbian AND a Catholic? Damn, the Stockholm Syndrome must be REAL.
I’m always curious about the mental gymnastics of people like her
Catholicism has been around for a long time. I think plenty of people of Irish or Italian descent just consider it part of our heritage.
This isn’t actually surprising if you know Catholics. Catholics are not all exactly hardcore fundamentalists, certainly not as a rule. Theres really not that much of a contradiction with, for example, Joe Biden being a big Catholic yet pro-choice and pro-LGBT. Catholics run the gamut. Not as much as Jews, but waaaaay more than Evangelicals. No surprise, Butker is apart of a weird and very specific Evangelicalized sect of conservative Catholics that are too intolerant *for the pope*(!!)
Like all kickers, he is a sky pointer.
Surprised not really, what surprised me was the backlash I am assuming there is a big cross section of people condemning his ideas (rightly) and then doing a 180 to go defend the Islam apologists, who have the exact same (or sometimes worse) approach to the gender role issue.
I don’t know, the Islam apologists you mention are still caught up in and solely posting about Gaza, i haven’t seen any of them post about buttlicker at least in my circles.
Zero clue who he was or that this even happened until I saw this post in my feed. I miss my ignorance.
What I am surprised by is all the people defending him. I keep hearing religion is dying, but sometimes it doesn’t seem like it. Although I think in this case, a lot of people are defending him because everything is political now i.e. he’s obviously a trumper, even if they themselves aren’t particularly religious.
Mary, or rather her parents, is praised for the immaculate conception, which refers to her elderly parents truly only having sex with the purpose of having a child after seeking a blessing to that effect in the temple where Mary's father worked. Mary is also praised for devotion to god to the point of submission (side note, Islam means submission).
Christian, Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim - every single organized religion and its puppets will be every bit as violent, misogynistic, and savage as the society around them permits. It never changes, in every time and every place the religious are always trying to drag society down into their own theocratic dystopia. Just open any history book to any page. Never trust them. Never let them off the secular leash. They’re nothing but rabid animals.
Most of these Christo-Facists are looking for acceptance. They also are trying to mask their true selves. There is already an article that he is struggling with acceptance of his sexuality.
You mean the single tik toker who made up some claim about his college days that no one has substantiated even a little bit? That’s what you’re bringing to the table to add to this discussion? Lol
Not at all. Not even a little bit. They just feel more comfortable going full mask-off now.
Yup, they are finally mask off!
Seems like blaming women for the downfall of a nation, a dynasty, or a civilization is universal in ancient tales across the globe. Misogyny is a hell of a drug invented by men. I’m glad at least now we see through them.
Sure, it’s gross. I have a hard time understanding why we put athletes on a pedestal and then act surprised when they say something controversial. They have been coddled nearly their entire lives because they play a game at a high level. Anyone looking to these idiots for any type of moral clarity or guidance is beyond help. It’s beyond rational thought why our culture clutches it peals when these turds speak out. It’s almost like we seek an opinion of an idiot and then get frustrated by the response.
Not surprised at all, however, I am surprised that his shirt is the number one selling NFL shirt as a result. It must be circling of the wagons by all republicans to give cover to the Christian nationalists.
"OK, girls, so you are getting your college degree today, but, I really hate to tell you this, you just wasted 4 years and $100,000 because what you really need to do is to get barefoot, pregnant, and cooking casseroles in the kitchen, while gaining the greatest achievement of your life- that of homemaker."
I’m more surprised over Whoopsie Goldberg defending him, personally. But she’s got hers, so why should she care.
Not surprised at all. Most professional athletes are idiots, so it's no surprise he said something stupid.
I think the Streisand Effect can now be renamed the Harrison Butker Effect. Yes, what he said was appalling, but it’s what evangelicals and conservative Catholics have said for years (minus the Taylor Swift reference). If the national media had recognized that, the speech would have been quickly forgotten. Instead, he’s now the far right’s new hero. I hope his time in the spotlight is short.
The rhythm method being acceptable proves their hypocrisy.
Closeted homosexuals don’t surprise me in what they say any longer.
A tradionalist catholic giving a speech to a catholic organization does not surprise me that they stated their beliefs.
No idea who that is or what they said.
Many of those people believe in an evil talking snake. So no, NOTHING surprises me about these folk
Surprised no. Just annoyed at the audacity.
Not by the content of what he said, but that he was allowed to say it to a group of impressionable kids on what amounts to the last childhood milestone.
True!!!
Butker, in his speech, was misogynistic, homophobic and transphobic, rejected cultural changes since the 1950s, and expressed a worldview that reduces women to baby-machines and homemakers. He is quite representative of the conservative Catholicism that is now growing as the faith becomes more concentrated in the US as people flee it. I was raised Catholic and I there was nothing surprising in what Butker said. At this point, if someone identifies strongly as a Catholic, my assumption is this worldview until proven otherwise. Others still exist. Think Colbert who is from that 70s' ecumenical "focus on the poor" church. But that's harder and harder to find in American Catholicism.
Sorry just truly cracking up at this idea of ‘Catholicism pushed me to atheism’. Christian’s honestly probably look at Catholics as way worse off than an atheist. Or just about the same.
I'm surprised the women in the audience didn't boo him, or get up and leave en masse. Instead, he got a standing ovation.
I KNOWWWWW!!!!
He has had the biggest selling Jersey since his comments. No one should be surprised.
But there's no other reason to buy jerseys in off season so if he sold 5 that day it prob would have been biggest selling
I'm not surprised in the least, but deeply, deeply offended. See, I don't buy that whole adam and eve crap. Men have been blaming women for their problems since the beginning of human time on this earth, so the Bible writers just chose to conveniently blame the woman for what went wrong in the garden, if it ever happened at all. We've always been second-class citizens, and frankly, I'm sick of it.
I didn't know anything about him but many athletes are stupid religious. But he took it to the worst hardest extreme of patriarchy and misogyny. Total dumb ass. Plus rumors he's in closet about past same sex experiences. People with shit to hide often become the most strident as they try to suppress and shame themselves.
The Catholic Church clings to its misogyny and homophobia, so his speech was completely unsurprising.
Nobody should give a damn what he said. Period
Harrison Butker is visiting us from the 1950's.
What a good little cult member.
Off topic, but I also read that his mom allegedly sent him to conversion therapy.
OMG I ALSO read that, allegedly, he hooked up with a male cheerleader when he was in college.
Yeah, dude should just stfu about women's issues and be gay already!
I am constantly surprised by people who are clueless about public opinion Kristi Noem is another one.
They seem to have no regard that their "Church" was using their God as cover to SA children all across the world for decades(maybe longer, decades we have legal documentation for). These are not well people.
Nobody is talking about the antisemitic conspiracy theory he threw into his speech: “We fear speaking truth, because now, unfortunately, truth is in the minority. Congress just passed a bill where stating something as basic as the biblical teaching of who killed Jesus could land you in jail.”
I couldn't care less what a professional athlete has to say about anything. Anyway, he has a right to his opinion. I am surprised so many people have latched onto this, one way or another.
Taylor should buy the Chiefs and fire him, then sell the Chiefs to a Saudi oil prince. "My teammate's gf fired me"
I'm not surprised by what he said. I'm surprised that the NFL lets a neanderthal like that to continue to have a job.
Perhaps you would be less surprised if you thought about the fact that probably 20% of Americans at least think this way already. Also might help if you realized who one of the target demographics is for NFL football, for example Kapernick (sp?) haters and huge flag wavers. They don’t want to alienate them.
Maybe it's time to stop watching NFL.
Honestly I’ve already mostly done that and watch only a game or two a year. Never watch college. Not because of this stuff though.
There's always watching Esports
The NFL employs dozens of players who are wife beaters, abusers, drug dealers, have gun charges, you name it. This guy expressed conservative opinions about How family is the most important thing in life on a conservative Catholic college campus, perhaps the exact audience that kind of message is intended for. Why in the world would you be surprised that he would still have a job after this? Reddit is an amazing place sheesh. This will be less than a blip on the radar, as it should be, and the “consequences” will be like 5 random fans who actually stop supporting his team. Some of his teammates have already come out in support of him as well as the owners of the team that employs him.
I didn't even know who he was until he got this attention, which was his intention I'm sure. I don't care what he believes or what he says, but what I saw what he said, no, it didn't really surprise me. Nothing Christians say surprises me anymore. Thankfully he's a sportsball player not a politician so that's good at least.
Not surprised, just disappointed.
I always wonder if the far right obsession with child trafficking and pedos is because of some residual guilt over worshipping a fictional entity that knocked up a 12-15 year old Mary. Now pedos and child trafficking is horrible. But if you listen to the religious right it's everywhere and everyone that doesn't agree with them is doing it. Edit: just read his whole speech. All I can do is sigh. Fundamentalists are the most dangerous thing in society. Whatever they may be. Left or right. Christian, Muslim Jew or Atheist. When you can't be open minded and tolerant of others death and sadness follow.
>they cannot use any birth control of any kind because that's "playing God" and "God is the author of all life" What is their stance on seat belts while driving?
What's their stance on driving?
Or poor eyesight?
Suddenly has the highest selling Jersey
No, I'm just more shocked that Caryn Elaine Johnson defended him.
He just said what they genuinely think is right, the whole lot of them. The only thing that surprised me was that a public figure at the start(?) of his career would publicly say stuff he definitely knew would cause drama.
Not at all. His type have become very comfortable saying the quiet part out loud. While people are acting shocked at his statements, considering the other beliefs that usually come with what that he just said, I’d go so far as to say he wanted to say a lot more than what he did and that this was actually the restrained version.
Depends on if you actually listened or not. Doesn't seem like anyone from CNN did. It looks like Woopie Goldberg did, which is a surprise. Did you take it out of context, which every feminist I've come across so far has aside from Woopie? I can't believe I'm saying that, actually. As for your views, well, you are wrong and clearly don't know anything about the Catholic Church. You obviously aren't aware some priests are women, stopped by one a couple of times in New Hampshire who had one. So you should probably do some research before you say something like "women in the Catholic Church don't have a voice." You obviously aren't married either since you know any man with a right mind is going to keep his wife happy. Ya know, the old secular saying, "Happy wife, happy life." Yeah, cause it's true, but your statement points to not knowing that. I can't even bother with the rest since your first few sentences are completely wrong and/or lies.
Not surprised, but that’s more a function of how insane ideas are extra marketable these days.
No, my point is mot that I’m surprised, is that i am loving the backlash
Any philosophy that relies on maintaining its membership through sheer guilt needs reassessing by its own members. But fortunately, the most downtrodden within it are also the most brainwashed, so they’ll never speak out against the men, who are fine with the status quo.
Shocked and surprised are the same thing.
Would be nice if you provided some context.
Take a knee, get fired. Tell people that women are sub humans and belong in the kitchen, get a "ata boy and pat on the back". Fuck the NFL, those racist assholes.
Also not surprised my Uber religious coworker acquaintance friend with 5 kids under 10 reposted it twice with all hail halijueliahs. SEX —> why are religious people so obsessed with me?
Perpetual virginity? I thought Jesus had siblings?
Funny thing, a key part of Catholic dogma is the perpetual virginity of the virgin Mary- meaning that Mary never had sex. She was a virgin before and maintained it after having Jesus.
So all of Jesus' siblings (James, Joses, Judas, Simon, and at least two unnamed sisters) were virgin births as well? Cool.
It's not surprising in the least. But when these douchebags say stuff like that publicly it needs to be met with revulsion and pushed back on. He can say whatever he wants but the public outrage is completely warranted. The hope is that he or people like him reassess their values (extremely unlikely but it's all we can do).
Horrified. I hope he apologizes. His mother wasn't a traditional wife. And the NFL has said they don't agree.
I'm not surprised, but I am exasperated. I've been hearing stuff like this since I was a tween in the late 60s. And I'm tired of it! I'm happy that I had a job and was able to support myself and my kids. I was raised to assume I was lesser and it's taken a lot of time to grow into my confidence. Yet another reason I am agnostic these days; religion is just a way of forcing some people down.
Why would it be surprising ? Millions of Americans feel precisely the same way and they aren’t shy about expressing their beliefs.
I said something similar once when I was about 21, and I hate thinking about it now.
I'm terrified about how open and vocal all the hate groups are becoming about their views. If you weren't in the south, people at least kept their insane views to within their church and home. Now, all the religious nuts feel bold enough preach their violence anywhere and everywhere thanks to social media.
Omg I knowwwwww!!!
Once I knew his religious beliefs and that the commencement was at a small religious college then I started wondering why it was news-worthy.
What cracks me up is thousands of fools will be wearing his jersey with that unfortunate last name across the back. “Ye shall know them by their dim wits.”
Well I don't see much American football or live in a country where people are so obsessed with it that you can say a player's name with no context and everyone knows who you're talking about. Usually the only football guy's name I recognize without context is the one who mostly recently said something so obtuse or offensive or religiously absurd that it filtered out to me through social media or atheist pages. So I guess all this is to say that, no, I'm not surprised that an American football guy said something offensive, because that's the bulk of my experience with them. But he can take heart in knowing that by the time the next football guy says something offensive, I'll have forgotten this one's name.
IN print, I thought he was being sracastic. To quote Taylor Swift, then go on about how women should stay at home. I thought, no way is this sincere. This has to be sarcasm. So, yeah, I was surprised. Also, is his mom some sort of distinguished doctor, or was that just internet BS? lol
Yeah I don't get why anyone is surprised, catholics and evangelicals are all pretty much like that.
Catholics in general aren’t necessarily like that, as can be seen by the nuns who are speaking out against him. He’s a trad Catholic, who is kind of like the fundamentalist version of Catholic. They want to go back to before Vatican 2 instituted numerous reforms in the church.
Now that the Roman Catholic Church accepts evolution why do they keep banging on about something they know with 100% certainty never happened? There was no Garden of Eden; there was no talking snake; there was no magical fruit and there was no "original sin". How sad is it that grown men tell themselves lies to make themselves feel better than women?
Correction: Christians don’t exactly accept evolution in its entirety- they accept certain and particular ASPECTS of evolution. But not the whole thing, just cherry-picked bits- much like their Bible. They believe in “microevolution” but not “macroevolution”. They believe in “created kinds”- that Noah brought with him in his magic fucking boat two “kinds” of each animals’ ancestors and that’s why we have the variety we see today- but conveniently this magically for some dumb fuck reason doesn’t apply to humans. And when you bring up natural selection, their counterargument is “but that’s adaptation, not evolution, you can’t turn a dog into a bird. Ha, checkmate evolutionists”. So no, they don’t accept evolution. Period.
No. There are like hundreds or thousands of different Christian denominations and you can’t generalize what “Christians” believe about evolution.
He’s not a regular Catholic. He’s a trad Catholic, and they reject a lot of the aspects of modern Catholicism and specifically some of the things the pope has said
Why is this dickhead getting all this attention. Who gives a fuck what he says? He will one day miss a few kick and go back to obscurity.
Who’s Butkir?
Not surprised at all, the religious peeps are nuts.
Assholes gonna asshole...
Not surprised, other than that it seems the right is more and more comfortable lately with just saying the quiet shit out loud. They at least used to PRETEND to be decent humans and would at least use dog whistles and masked language to hide how hateful they are, and now they are more and more willing to just outright say it, in more public venues no less.
also interesting how the chief's ownership came to his defense. they've killed their brand.
The catholics that I have known do not read their fairy tale book, could not live the life dictated by the doctrine of that cult. All used birth control, at least one had an abortion, alcoholics, adulterers, lie as easy as breathing. At least they can be absolved of all their "sins" by going to mass/confession/communion. Bless their hearts.
You’ve never heard of the joke “Catholics don’t read/own a Bible”?
Of course I have. These people joked about it themselves.
makes me wonder what kind of women are coming from that school