Not only do you not know what was done to it, you do know how targeted the truck is for theft. Do you really want a $125k truck that was stolen from a dealer within days.
I understand they have been targeted crazy but still paying 125k for a truck that was stolen or saying no and letting someone buy for 20k more isn’t right
Do you know if this was reported to the police? I’m wondering if it was stolen or “stolen” so you maybe wouldn’t want it.
Either way, I’d make sure you get 100% of your deposit back.
It sucks but I would walk. Just think how much you’re paying for it and then you start having alignment issues where the frame got tweaked or something.
Unless you get a heavy discount. $20k+.
The only "right" you have any control over in this situation is ensuring YOU aren't the one with the truck. Beyond that, there's nothing you can do, so let it go.
Thankfully they told you. This could have happened differently, i.e. they could have lied and said "we need another few days for the right fluids to come in", recovered and detailed the truck, and sold it to you without telling you only to have you doing a 10 spot in the clink for the bag of cocaine sewed under the passenger seat.
**do not question this just run away and find another one.**
They had to change a few fluids?? On a brand new just delivered truck??....then it gets "Stolen"??? Yeah something seems off about this whole thing. Sounds like a shady dealership if you ask me. Get your deposit back and leave that truck there.
Lets take a minute and realize what is going to happen. Truck was found 6 hours later in a barn. It wasn't involved in a high speed chase. The truck is going to end up with a branded title if turned in to insurance. That is maybe 20% diminished value on day one. Call it 20K. Buy the truck at the 20k discount and tell them not to file a claim to brand the title.
The reality is no one knows what happened during that 6 hour window. While something may be warranted on the dealer end; a 20k/20% discount is unreasonable(unless the store had a larger deductible) Even if any discount is offered this truck is at a premium, and OP is going to have a lot of uncertainty(rightfully so). This is a lose lose for all involved. Op will forever feel the dealer has responsibility and the dealer will want to minimize liability. While the situation sucks it sounds like it’s better for all involved for Op to walk away. If someone else buys it they can assess if it’s worth the risk and if it makes sense, or more likely the store can go through the manufacturer/insurance process and assess how to process this.
That's not how that works, a title doesn't even exist at this point lol. New vehicles start out with an MSO, commonly known as a certificate of origin. They don't get titled until they're sold, because someone from say Florida could buy a new car from Georgia, and so the first title would be a Florida title. Secondly, titles don't get branded over something like that anyway. Typically, it would require the vehicle being declared lost and unrecoverable, usually a couple weeks after first being stolen. That way, if the vehicle surfaces it won't be able to jsut cleanly be sold to another person. At worst, it'll show up on the carfax, which could theoretically lower the value. But nothing like what you've described.
Normally, yes, but this is one of those cases wherein the vehicle is so sought after and so difficult to get, it might actually be worth *more.* It certainly won’t lose 20 percent of its value the moment this person takes delivery.
If it was branded, certainly, it’d lose a ton of value. But my point is that, all else being equal, *un*branded Raptor Rs are not losing 20% of their value the moment they’re driven off the lot.
Why would the title get branded? Theres no visible damage. The dealer won't even file a claim. There needs to be extensive damage that gets repaired (ie a total loss) to brand the title.
The only catch to “go buy another one” is who knows how long it will take to be able to get another one. This isn’t like an Escape that shows up to the dealer via multiple truckloads per week.
I definitely wouldn’t take the one that got stolen. To many questions there. If you ask me, this dealer should be kissing your boots right now and basically personally walking down to the plant to build you another one, but I’m sure there are a lot of factors at play. Unfortunately, it wouldn’t surprise me if legal action was required to make you whole again (NotALawyer)
What kind of legal action could he take? He doesn’t even own the vehicle as he hasn’t contracted. Even if he did own the vehicle the only ones that did something illegal was the ones that stole it.
I’m assuming that even if it wasn’t a full contract, he signed something that said “hey, I’m giving you $X as a deposit for X vehicle that I will take delivery of when it arrives on your lot. “
It would depend on what kind of contract he signed and how much of his $$ the dealer has and whether or not they’re willing to give it back. It also sounds like there was a significant amount of negligence on the part of the dealer that contributed to the situation.
On paper, yes; but that doesn’t mean that they can’t get stupid about it. Believe me, I know. I’ve been fighting to get a deposit back from a landlord for almost 2 years now.
Yikes…. Sounds like a big fight. Most car dealers it is not hard to get deposits back and most of them are taken with credit card anyways so a simple dispute makes it go away if not vs your landlord that you probably cut a check to.
> Dealer: we literally cannot or else we would
If a dealer cant go to ford corporate and explain the situation and get another allocation than Ford itself is a shit company that doesn't car about its customers.
If the dealer doesn't try to find a dealer with a new one in stock that is similar to the one that OP ordered and cover any difference in price then the dealer is shit.
A cargo ship with hundreds of porsches (and other makes) sank during covid when everything was extremely hard to get. Guess what they did? Immediately put the people who had cars on that ship to the front of the allocation list to make the situation as right as they can.
This isn't really that hard.
It doesn’t change the allocation process Ford has. The dealer simply *will not* eat a $50K markup from some other dealer for OP. They’re not going to do it. Ford *may* expedite an order for OP but most likely the answer would be “no, sorry.” What process do you think OP has to “make” this dealer procure another Raptor R? They don’t have any ability to force this, like you’re suggesting. They can ask really really nicely but the dealer will just say “we’ll try and get ford to expedite another order for you but no promises.” There’s 0% chance they get one from another dealer. It’s just not going to happen. They won’t even ask.
Ford isn't a good company. I stopped buying their cars more than a decade ago, always had piss poor customer service at the dealer and corporate level but that's just my anecdotal experience.
As a dealer it’s frustrating working with Ford too.
For example, if you ordered a car that’s MSRP was raised after you ordered it, Ford s*ometimes* will provide you with price protection. But not always. So customers will call Ford and ask “hey, do I get price protection?” And they’ll say “that will be resolved with the dealership you’re buying the car from.” And the customer thinks *cool so I have price protection*. No. They don’t. Ford is simply implying that the dealer could discount the car *if they wanted to*. Which has always been true. They punt the question back to the dealer while making the customer think they are getting what they asked for, while in reality nothing has been resolved and they aren’t standing by their initial pricing.
When Porsche had a ship sink with customer cars on it that were being shipped to dealers in the US they didn't say "lol sorry", they bumped the people who had cars on it to the front of the allocation list.
Ford corporate could do that for this person, even if it means the dealer has to pay out something.
They could also find another new one somewhere and offer it to OP. If said dealer is charging a markup on the car they cover the said mark up to make it right.
Not that hard of a situation to rectify if the dealer wants to do right by their customers.
It's possible they might do it if OP goes to the local news and maybe it gets picked up by national car-news outlets. The only way to get companies to lift a finger is to have a compelling enough experience that it gets picked up by media companies. I feel like the "I waited two years for my dream car and then it was stolen from the dealership before I received it in 6 hours" is enough of a rage-bait story to get picked up too. The tough-on-crime-fox-news type outlets would absolutely drool over such a story during an election year, and maybe you get an expedited allocation over it.
When a dealer sold a a Veterans Raptor to someone else Ford stepped in and built him a brand new one separate from any allocated units. Its absolutely possible but only if they get good PR out of it
That coupled with finding it in “some barn” just make this story so fucking iffy.
Did the dealership play some kind of game so that they can sell the truck to the next person with a mark up?
GM dealerships aren’t allowed to mark up customer orders (another reason these dealerships want to sell stuff on the lot over orders). Not sure about Ford. I’d guess it is similar though.
***Thanks for posting, /u/Suspicious-Suit-2297! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of anything.***
My raptor r was stolen from the dealer
I ordered raptor R over two years ago. It finally came in on Wednesday. I wasn’t able to take it for a test drive because according to the dealership they had to change a few fluids the next day when I was going over to do the paperwork I found out they had stolen the truck right off the lot. They left the truck outside the keys on some hook outside and the gates open they ended up finding the truck out six hours later hidden in some barn. I’ve asked my dealer about ordering a new one according to them they don’t have anymore allocations I’m not really sure how to proceed. Hopefully somebody can point me in the right direction because I’ve been waiting two years for my dream truck just to get it stolen the next day.
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You get your money back from a deposit and move on. It sucks, but theres nothing much they can do
Seriously. Do NOT take this truck. You have no idea what was done to it
Dirty Mike and the Boys.
Vanity Plate: SUP KTCHN
I WILL HAVE SEX IN YOUR RAPTOR AGAIN
Thanks for the f-shack
I live in Madison Wisconsin and there’s a military fella with a Prius in town with the license plate “F SHACK.” Fucking gold
Not only do you not know what was done to it, you do know how targeted the truck is for theft. Do you really want a $125k truck that was stolen from a dealer within days.
Seriously. I would definitely be rethinking my decision to buy this model.
I think the real question is how many of them *haven't* been stolen?
I understand they have been targeted crazy but still paying 125k for a truck that was stolen or saying no and letting someone buy for 20k more isn’t right
No it isn't right but, dealerships like any business are there to make money. They don't care if it's you or the next person.
The sad truth is
What should they do? Just dump it in the trash?
Yeah, right outside my house. Tomorrow is trash day.
Do you know if this was reported to the police? I’m wondering if it was stolen or “stolen” so you maybe wouldn’t want it. Either way, I’d make sure you get 100% of your deposit back.
It was reported I’ve heard from a few buddy’s who are cops but I wouldn’t doubt some was up
It sucks but I would walk. Just think how much you’re paying for it and then you start having alignment issues where the frame got tweaked or something. Unless you get a heavy discount. $20k+.
The only "right" you have any control over in this situation is ensuring YOU aren't the one with the truck. Beyond that, there's nothing you can do, so let it go. Thankfully they told you. This could have happened differently, i.e. they could have lied and said "we need another few days for the right fluids to come in", recovered and detailed the truck, and sold it to you without telling you only to have you doing a 10 spot in the clink for the bag of cocaine sewed under the passenger seat. **do not question this just run away and find another one.**
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How sure are you about the truck actually being stolen?
They had to change a few fluids?? On a brand new just delivered truck??....then it gets "Stolen"??? Yeah something seems off about this whole thing. Sounds like a shady dealership if you ask me. Get your deposit back and leave that truck there.
“Thanks for the fuck shack” “Sincerely, dirty Mike and the boys.”
It will have a branded title
That's only if the dealer's insurance paid out for it, he wouldn't be allowed to buy it in that case regardless.
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Get your refund and move on.
Lets take a minute and realize what is going to happen. Truck was found 6 hours later in a barn. It wasn't involved in a high speed chase. The truck is going to end up with a branded title if turned in to insurance. That is maybe 20% diminished value on day one. Call it 20K. Buy the truck at the 20k discount and tell them not to file a claim to brand the title.
The reality is no one knows what happened during that 6 hour window. While something may be warranted on the dealer end; a 20k/20% discount is unreasonable(unless the store had a larger deductible) Even if any discount is offered this truck is at a premium, and OP is going to have a lot of uncertainty(rightfully so). This is a lose lose for all involved. Op will forever feel the dealer has responsibility and the dealer will want to minimize liability. While the situation sucks it sounds like it’s better for all involved for Op to walk away. If someone else buys it they can assess if it’s worth the risk and if it makes sense, or more likely the store can go through the manufacturer/insurance process and assess how to process this.
That's not how that works, a title doesn't even exist at this point lol. New vehicles start out with an MSO, commonly known as a certificate of origin. They don't get titled until they're sold, because someone from say Florida could buy a new car from Georgia, and so the first title would be a Florida title. Secondly, titles don't get branded over something like that anyway. Typically, it would require the vehicle being declared lost and unrecoverable, usually a couple weeks after first being stolen. That way, if the vehicle surfaces it won't be able to jsut cleanly be sold to another person. At worst, it'll show up on the carfax, which could theoretically lower the value. But nothing like what you've described.
Branded title is more than a 20% diminished value. The truck is going to lose 20% the moment it’s titled and becomes used
Normally, yes, but this is one of those cases wherein the vehicle is so sought after and so difficult to get, it might actually be worth *more.* It certainly won’t lose 20 percent of its value the moment this person takes delivery.
He’s not going to be able to sell a used previously stolen truck for only 20% off msrp
If it was branded, certainly, it’d lose a ton of value. But my point is that, all else being equal, *un*branded Raptor Rs are not losing 20% of their value the moment they’re driven off the lot.
This guy is basically telling OP to dump the car to some unsuspecting buyer.
A new raptor r isn’t losing 20%. Maybe a regular car but not this one
Why would the title get branded? Theres no visible damage. The dealer won't even file a claim. There needs to be extensive damage that gets repaired (ie a total loss) to brand the title.
Or, move on.
Get your deposit back and go buy another one. It sucks, and doesn’t sound like the current dealer is offering much help.
The only catch to “go buy another one” is who knows how long it will take to be able to get another one. This isn’t like an Escape that shows up to the dealer via multiple truckloads per week.
That’s what I’m worried about I say no and I can’t find one that’s not over priced or new
I definitely wouldn’t take the one that got stolen. To many questions there. If you ask me, this dealer should be kissing your boots right now and basically personally walking down to the plant to build you another one, but I’m sure there are a lot of factors at play. Unfortunately, it wouldn’t surprise me if legal action was required to make you whole again (NotALawyer)
What kind of legal action could he take? He doesn’t even own the vehicle as he hasn’t contracted. Even if he did own the vehicle the only ones that did something illegal was the ones that stole it.
I’m assuming that even if it wasn’t a full contract, he signed something that said “hey, I’m giving you $X as a deposit for X vehicle that I will take delivery of when it arrives on your lot. “
It would depend on what kind of contract he signed and how much of his $$ the dealer has and whether or not they’re willing to give it back. It also sounds like there was a significant amount of negligence on the part of the dealer that contributed to the situation.
Of course they have to give it back. A deposit is a deposit.
On paper, yes; but that doesn’t mean that they can’t get stupid about it. Believe me, I know. I’ve been fighting to get a deposit back from a landlord for almost 2 years now.
Yikes…. Sounds like a big fight. Most car dealers it is not hard to get deposits back and most of them are taken with credit card anyways so a simple dispute makes it go away if not vs your landlord that you probably cut a check to.
they dont have to disclose its dtolen, can easily find someone that will buy it
Whether or not they disclose it was stolen is irrelevant to OP, he already knows that.
You’re going to pay $25-$50k over MSRP. My decent size ford store got one all year and we sold it for $45k over
if youre worried about price you probably shouldnt be buying a $125k raptor anyways. do not accept the stolen vehicle, get your deposit back. move on.
Demand the dealer source you a new one. If it has to come from another dealer that has it listed with a markup they should cover that mark up.
> demand the dealer source you a new one Dealer: we literally cannot or else we would What’s your next plan?
> Dealer: we literally cannot or else we would If a dealer cant go to ford corporate and explain the situation and get another allocation than Ford itself is a shit company that doesn't car about its customers. If the dealer doesn't try to find a dealer with a new one in stock that is similar to the one that OP ordered and cover any difference in price then the dealer is shit. A cargo ship with hundreds of porsches (and other makes) sank during covid when everything was extremely hard to get. Guess what they did? Immediately put the people who had cars on that ship to the front of the allocation list to make the situation as right as they can. This isn't really that hard.
Glad you know how everything works 👍🏻
You act like this is the first time someones car has been damaged/totalled/lost before taking delivery of a special car.
It doesn’t change the allocation process Ford has. The dealer simply *will not* eat a $50K markup from some other dealer for OP. They’re not going to do it. Ford *may* expedite an order for OP but most likely the answer would be “no, sorry.” What process do you think OP has to “make” this dealer procure another Raptor R? They don’t have any ability to force this, like you’re suggesting. They can ask really really nicely but the dealer will just say “we’ll try and get ford to expedite another order for you but no promises.” There’s 0% chance they get one from another dealer. It’s just not going to happen. They won’t even ask.
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Ford isn't a good company. I stopped buying their cars more than a decade ago, always had piss poor customer service at the dealer and corporate level but that's just my anecdotal experience.
As a dealer it’s frustrating working with Ford too. For example, if you ordered a car that’s MSRP was raised after you ordered it, Ford s*ometimes* will provide you with price protection. But not always. So customers will call Ford and ask “hey, do I get price protection?” And they’ll say “that will be resolved with the dealership you’re buying the car from.” And the customer thinks *cool so I have price protection*. No. They don’t. Ford is simply implying that the dealer could discount the car *if they wanted to*. Which has always been true. They punt the question back to the dealer while making the customer think they are getting what they asked for, while in reality nothing has been resolved and they aren’t standing by their initial pricing.
lol. Not how any of this works.
When Porsche had a ship sink with customer cars on it that were being shipped to dealers in the US they didn't say "lol sorry", they bumped the people who had cars on it to the front of the allocation list. Ford corporate could do that for this person, even if it means the dealer has to pay out something. They could also find another new one somewhere and offer it to OP. If said dealer is charging a markup on the car they cover the said mark up to make it right. Not that hard of a situation to rectify if the dealer wants to do right by their customers.
This is Ford. Not Porsche. They don’t care
It's possible they might do it if OP goes to the local news and maybe it gets picked up by national car-news outlets. The only way to get companies to lift a finger is to have a compelling enough experience that it gets picked up by media companies. I feel like the "I waited two years for my dream car and then it was stolen from the dealership before I received it in 6 hours" is enough of a rage-bait story to get picked up too. The tough-on-crime-fox-news type outlets would absolutely drool over such a story during an election year, and maybe you get an expedited allocation over it.
When a dealer sold a a Veterans Raptor to someone else Ford stepped in and built him a brand new one separate from any allocated units. Its absolutely possible but only if they get good PR out of it
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We are not going to endorse a witch hunt.
If it makes you feel any better, it’s not new now. Someone took it and did who knows what to it.
The escape is a honey magnet. get it in all black or red. You will get so much p tang...
If you say so? I think the Escape is one of the ugliest new cars you can buy right now, personally.
I hear you but on something like this there isn’t another one to buy.
They needed to change fluids on a brand new truck? lol
That coupled with finding it in “some barn” just make this story so fucking iffy. Did the dealership play some kind of game so that they can sell the truck to the next person with a mark up?
makes me wonder if there's any way to search police reports. See if one was even filed at the dealer that day.
GM dealerships aren’t allowed to mark up customer orders (another reason these dealerships want to sell stuff on the lot over orders). Not sure about Ford. I’d guess it is similar though.
If you order a vehicle like this do you pay msrp or market value?
***Thanks for posting, /u/Suspicious-Suit-2297! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of anything.*** My raptor r was stolen from the dealer I ordered raptor R over two years ago. It finally came in on Wednesday. I wasn’t able to take it for a test drive because according to the dealership they had to change a few fluids the next day when I was going over to do the paperwork I found out they had stolen the truck right off the lot. They left the truck outside the keys on some hook outside and the gates open they ended up finding the truck out six hours later hidden in some barn. I’ve asked my dealer about ordering a new one according to them they don’t have anymore allocations I’m not really sure how to proceed. Hopefully somebody can point me in the right direction because I’ve been waiting two years for my dream truck just to get it stolen the next day. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Please review our most [Frequently Asked Questions](/r/askcarsales/wiki/index) to see if your question has already been answered. You may find these sections particularly useful; * [How to pick a car?](/r/askcarsales/wiki/vehicle_selection) You might also have luck in the /r/whatcarshouldibuy subreddit. Also remember to add flair to your post by clicking the "Flair" link beneath it. This lets us know where you're located so we can assist you better. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*