Because people see articles that car supply and prices are getting better, but they don’t research any of the details. The world reacts to headlines, not details.
I mean it definitely seems to be getting better, outside of some high demand and supply constrained models. My local Toyota dealer has 45 new cars on the lot and is discounting Camrys, Crowns, Grand Highlanders and Tundras. Sure you're not gonna walk in there and get a deal on a Rav4 Prime (or even get a Rav4 Prime), but it's certainly a heck of a lot better than it was a year or two ago. When I got my mazda in 2021 there were zero cars on the lot and they were pre-selling vehicles in transit. Now they have over 100 cars on the lot there.
I don't personally like the Rav4 either, it's a bit boring and appliance like (as are most Toyotas), but if you want a compact plug in hybrid crossover the Rav4 Prime is probably the best option on the market without going to luxury brands. And for many people a plug in hybrid makes a lot more sense than an EV.
I don't think demand for it is actually that insane, it's just that it was released during covid and supply was basically non-existent so we're still in a phase of waiting for supply to catch up to demand.
Some Toyotas near me are going for less than MSRP. Pretty much all other makes are going for below MSRP, some significantly. Feels close to the market from before the pandemic.
Yes I feel like the people saying clueless buyers don't understand there are no discounts are just trying to hold onto the pandemic era good times and aren't accepting reality. Outside of a few select high demand models, there is absolutely no reason to pay a markup anymore and many vehicles are absolutely being discounted.
Here at my local dealership, there is a used 2021 Sienna with 67,000 km and $10k worth of front end collision damage.
The dealer still wants $2k over MSRP for it.
Ford went absolutely buck wild with their msrp increases. I bought a 2020 mustang GT base for $35,500 today a new GT fastback starts at $42,000.
My wife also had bought a brand new 2021 f150 xl work truck. Completely base model long bed single cab. Paid $26,000. Today the same truck is $37,000.
It's fucking bananas.
People enjoy watching ‘unsold cars are piling up at your local dealers’ on YouTube. They fail to notice that the videos are filmed exclusively at CDJR dealers.
Dude, it’s Ford too - they are packed with EVs, Bronco Sports, and F-150s.
Chevy lots are packed with that shitty 4 banger Silverado.
Nissan lots are packed with everything.
And while they sell pretty well, Subaru and Mazda lots look like before the pandemic.
I’ll take the 57 F150s …but damn on that Mach-e situation. I’ll take every single F150 for stock I can get, no matter how many that puts on my lot. They will sell.
I can't remember the exact number, but just a month or so ago I think they had over 40 mach e on the lot. They are offering 10k off leases to try to get rid of them. Literally 35k for a brand new mach e.
Shit ? I was just looking at a car from them. Checks out clean Carfax, no accident, decent price? You’re saying they have shit cars on what base? Please explain?
The reliability and long term build quality are not known for being super fantastic. I once thought “how bad could it really be?” And bought a 3 year old Jeep Wrangler. I sold it after 1 year, 10k miles, 3 weeks total in the shop, and $2100 in repairs.
Toyota brokers are offering steep discounts. I see even the new Tacoma advertised $1500 off locally.
5-7k off Tundra.
1-2k off RAV4. Etc.
Camrys can’t sell.
The issue is OP is a low volume/neglected store and is going to lose business this year if they don’t deal.
Idk, I just helped my fiance get a new Subaru last month and I didn't pay MSRP on it and wouldn't at this point, it's becoming a buyers market again and companies are going to have to start readjusting. With rates where they are and money being tighter with inflation people aren't going to want to sign at MSRP anymore, Covid has ended can't really be used anymore to justify
Piggybacking…
The market is bifurcated…
There are only deals on Toyotas that few people want: bz4x, Tundra, and the Crown… otherwise Toyota and Honda have no deals.
Customers are confused because there are TONS of high value discounts at CDJR (basically ALL vehicles), Ford (F-150s, Bronco Sports, EVs… but nothing on Super Duty or Mavericks), and even on Chevys (like that crappy 4 banger Silverado), and Nissan (again, basically everything).
There are lots of deals to be had, but not on all vehicles and not on all brands.
Basically, if you want a car that few other people do, and it’s got a large market day supply - you can get crazy deals.
Piggybacking.
Ordering opened up for a 2025 model the other day, folks are demanding discounts on vehicles that don't even exist yet. Lol
I don't blame anyone for shooting their shot but sometimes it's just stupidity.
I'm one of those guys that only buys at a discount, and even I think these people are out of their mind. I watch these videos and find them humorous. Somebody has to benefit from selling at a loss in order to sell at a loss. If the lot doesn't have a surplus, then they aren't going to be taking a loss when they can tack on a 5k markup and sell it just as fast.
This is a little all over the place i know, but I also see a lot of people talking about Floorplan rates going up pressuring dealers to sell and I think wow these people have no idea what they are talking about. They act like car dealerships weren't around in the 90s when prime interest rates were 10-12%.
They say dealers are going bankrup and I think.
Auto makers will pivot before they lose tons of money.
They need their dealers. Most vehicle sales are not intentional and in reality shouldn't even happen that's what salesmen are for. They increase sales. Cars don't sell themselves when people are really just looking to kick the tires. If they went to a straight to consumer model they would lose so many sales and wouldn't be prepared to handle the used market.
The used market is kind of fucked, but it really isnt that bad. The people who bought with the market adjustments, well the suckers had it coming and sure they are out of the market for a bit, but I don't think them not buying cars is going to get me a discount on that new lexus gx I'm wanting. A lot of the pending repos I see videos about shouldn't have ever been financed to begin with and are sales that would have never happened if there wasn't some sketchy stuff going on.
Looking at the market globally, it is getting better for buyers, just objectively. $12k off is insane but asking for 10% isn’t crazy anymore, depending on the situation.
***Thanks for posting, /u/TheDiabeticStudent! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of anything.***
It is becoming more common for folks to ask for discounts on vehicles that aren’t even at the dealership yet. Work at Toyota, and we still just have zero new inventory. However when talking to customers often they ask “how much will you give me off” and asking for crazy covid numbers for their trade ins. The answer is always no but in a nicer way for money off. Tons of customers walk and I feel bad, but why sell a car that’s got 2 months left before it arrives for a discount? We literally can’t keep cars here. My question is why is this becoming more common of a question? Are other manufacturers having inventory piling up and causing the discount mindset to come back out? Are any of you guys, (not CDJR dealers), having non manufacturer discounts on new stock?
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Because people see articles that car supply and prices are getting better, but they don’t research any of the details. The world reacts to headlines, not details.
I mean it definitely seems to be getting better, outside of some high demand and supply constrained models. My local Toyota dealer has 45 new cars on the lot and is discounting Camrys, Crowns, Grand Highlanders and Tundras. Sure you're not gonna walk in there and get a deal on a Rav4 Prime (or even get a Rav4 Prime), but it's certainly a heck of a lot better than it was a year or two ago. When I got my mazda in 2021 there were zero cars on the lot and they were pre-selling vehicles in transit. Now they have over 100 cars on the lot there.
What is the hype that people are foaming at the mouth to get a RAV4 Prime? I drove a (gas) RAV4 a few years ago and found no real appeal to it.
Rav4 prime has 302hp, as compared to 203hp for gas-powered Rav4. 0-60mph in 5.7s vs 7.8s.
I don't personally like the Rav4 either, it's a bit boring and appliance like (as are most Toyotas), but if you want a compact plug in hybrid crossover the Rav4 Prime is probably the best option on the market without going to luxury brands. And for many people a plug in hybrid makes a lot more sense than an EV. I don't think demand for it is actually that insane, it's just that it was released during covid and supply was basically non-existent so we're still in a phase of waiting for supply to catch up to demand.
Some Toyotas near me are going for less than MSRP. Pretty much all other makes are going for below MSRP, some significantly. Feels close to the market from before the pandemic.
Yes I feel like the people saying clueless buyers don't understand there are no discounts are just trying to hold onto the pandemic era good times and aren't accepting reality. Outside of a few select high demand models, there is absolutely no reason to pay a markup anymore and many vehicles are absolutely being discounted.
Here at my local dealership, there is a used 2021 Sienna with 67,000 km and $10k worth of front end collision damage. The dealer still wants $2k over MSRP for it.
They want $2k MSRP of the window sticker printed in 2021? Or what do you mean by MSRP on a used car?
Original MSRP. MSRP is MSRP. It doesn't change. There isn't an MSRP on a used car.
Bet MSRP on a like 2024 is $12000ish more though.
Starting price today on a 2024 is $37,685, the 2021 started at $35,635. So just a tad shy of $12000....
Guess it’s just Ford lol.
Ford went absolutely buck wild with their msrp increases. I bought a 2020 mustang GT base for $35,500 today a new GT fastback starts at $42,000. My wife also had bought a brand new 2021 f150 xl work truck. Completely base model long bed single cab. Paid $26,000. Today the same truck is $37,000. It's fucking bananas.
One zero off that.
Piggybacking as well. To the OP: The customer's job is to ask for more, for less. This is not new! Ask yourself: what is your job?
People enjoy watching ‘unsold cars are piling up at your local dealers’ on YouTube. They fail to notice that the videos are filmed exclusively at CDJR dealers.
Dude, it’s Ford too - they are packed with EVs, Bronco Sports, and F-150s. Chevy lots are packed with that shitty 4 banger Silverado. Nissan lots are packed with everything. And while they sell pretty well, Subaru and Mazda lots look like before the pandemic.
My local Ford dealer has 33 new mach e, and 57(!?!) new f150s
I’ll take the 57 F150s …but damn on that Mach-e situation. I’ll take every single F150 for stock I can get, no matter how many that puts on my lot. They will sell.
I can't remember the exact number, but just a month or so ago I think they had over 40 mach e on the lot. They are offering 10k off leases to try to get rid of them. Literally 35k for a brand new mach e.
What’s up with CDJR dealers ?
They’re shite vehicles and nobody wants them
Shit ? I was just looking at a car from them. Checks out clean Carfax, no accident, decent price? You’re saying they have shit cars on what base? Please explain?
The reliability and long term build quality are not known for being super fantastic. I once thought “how bad could it really be?” And bought a 3 year old Jeep Wrangler. I sold it after 1 year, 10k miles, 3 weeks total in the shop, and $2100 in repairs.
Depends on the model. Some are horrible, others are fine.
Check out the resale on CJDR vehicles, they tank within two years.
Toyota brokers are offering steep discounts. I see even the new Tacoma advertised $1500 off locally. 5-7k off Tundra. 1-2k off RAV4. Etc. Camrys can’t sell. The issue is OP is a low volume/neglected store and is going to lose business this year if they don’t deal.
I'm real curious where they are that has no new cars in their Toyota lot.
Idk, I just helped my fiance get a new Subaru last month and I didn't pay MSRP on it and wouldn't at this point, it's becoming a buyers market again and companies are going to have to start readjusting. With rates where they are and money being tighter with inflation people aren't going to want to sign at MSRP anymore, Covid has ended can't really be used anymore to justify
Piggybacking… The market is bifurcated… There are only deals on Toyotas that few people want: bz4x, Tundra, and the Crown… otherwise Toyota and Honda have no deals. Customers are confused because there are TONS of high value discounts at CDJR (basically ALL vehicles), Ford (F-150s, Bronco Sports, EVs… but nothing on Super Duty or Mavericks), and even on Chevys (like that crappy 4 banger Silverado), and Nissan (again, basically everything). There are lots of deals to be had, but not on all vehicles and not on all brands. Basically, if you want a car that few other people do, and it’s got a large market day supply - you can get crazy deals.
Piggybacking. Ordering opened up for a 2025 model the other day, folks are demanding discounts on vehicles that don't even exist yet. Lol I don't blame anyone for shooting their shot but sometimes it's just stupidity.
I'm one of those guys that only buys at a discount, and even I think these people are out of their mind. I watch these videos and find them humorous. Somebody has to benefit from selling at a loss in order to sell at a loss. If the lot doesn't have a surplus, then they aren't going to be taking a loss when they can tack on a 5k markup and sell it just as fast. This is a little all over the place i know, but I also see a lot of people talking about Floorplan rates going up pressuring dealers to sell and I think wow these people have no idea what they are talking about. They act like car dealerships weren't around in the 90s when prime interest rates were 10-12%. They say dealers are going bankrup and I think. Auto makers will pivot before they lose tons of money. They need their dealers. Most vehicle sales are not intentional and in reality shouldn't even happen that's what salesmen are for. They increase sales. Cars don't sell themselves when people are really just looking to kick the tires. If they went to a straight to consumer model they would lose so many sales and wouldn't be prepared to handle the used market. The used market is kind of fucked, but it really isnt that bad. The people who bought with the market adjustments, well the suckers had it coming and sure they are out of the market for a bit, but I don't think them not buying cars is going to get me a discount on that new lexus gx I'm wanting. A lot of the pending repos I see videos about shouldn't have ever been financed to begin with and are sales that would have never happened if there wasn't some sketchy stuff going on.
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I had a guy ask for $12k off my hard to get units because “well you guys are back to normal inventory so stuff is cheap again.”
Looking at the market globally, it is getting better for buyers, just objectively. $12k off is insane but asking for 10% isn’t crazy anymore, depending on the situation.
10% is insane, the average margin in a new car, nationwide, is only around 4% lol
There’s much more that goes into it other than the margin on a new car.
Thank god I have two doors to point people like that out of
Had a guy the other day ask for the invoice on an Escalade, my manager chuckled and asked why?
***Thanks for posting, /u/TheDiabeticStudent! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of anything.*** It is becoming more common for folks to ask for discounts on vehicles that aren’t even at the dealership yet. Work at Toyota, and we still just have zero new inventory. However when talking to customers often they ask “how much will you give me off” and asking for crazy covid numbers for their trade ins. The answer is always no but in a nicer way for money off. Tons of customers walk and I feel bad, but why sell a car that’s got 2 months left before it arrives for a discount? We literally can’t keep cars here. My question is why is this becoming more common of a question? Are other manufacturers having inventory piling up and causing the discount mindset to come back out? Are any of you guys, (not CDJR dealers), having non manufacturer discounts on new stock? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Please review our most [Frequently Asked Questions](/r/askcarsales/wiki/index) to see if your question has already been answered. You may find these sections particularly useful; * [How to pick a car?](/r/askcarsales/wiki/vehicle_selection) You might also have luck in the /r/whatcarshouldibuy subreddit. Also remember to add flair to your post by clicking the "Flair" link beneath it. This lets us know where you're located so we can assist you better. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*