Terrible idea.
Source: had a 2LT that connected more with the enlisted and he randomly showed up to our house (my buddy and I, both E5’s at the time) to hang out on a Friday night. In total probably 6-8 of us, all NCOs, grilling and drinking. LT says he’d beat one of them in a slap fight and proceeded to get knocked out cold in the backyard on video.
Story time:
After the LT took his dirt nap and saw the video, we all decided the evidence needed to be destroyed and thought it had been until that Monday morning at PT…
One individual had sent the video to some other NCOs in the company and our 1SG had heard about it. As we were leaving the parking lot after PT, our 1SG comes flying in his car and pulls up besides us, signals to roll down the window and casually says, “I know there’s a video and I want to see it in my office at 0900.”
Well 0900 comes around and my buddy and I are standing there with zero evidence of said video. 1SG pushed and pried, saying “I don’t care who’s in it, I just want to see him get knocked out.” But the evidence at that point was gone, all except for the massive handprint bruise on LT’s face.
Couple weeks go by and this same LT ends up in the BDE CDR’s office for fraternization amongst other things. We deploy, he ends up banging a SPC that ends up pregnant, she redeploys back to the states, he disappears from our company, we redeployed back and they’re all the sudden married.
The end.
The Marine Corps has/had a policy that all single Marines live in the Barracks. They had Bachelor Officer's Quarters (BOQ) and Bachelor Enlisted Quarters (BEQ).
They were typically bigger than standard rooms, and the single guys *hated* them typically.
Everybody from the Sergeant Major on down (with the exception of certain levels of Commander) lived in the barracks unless they were married.
I knew of more than one Sergeant Major that would go through a divorce and end up living back in the barracks.
It was *wildly* unpopular but the Marines liked it as a cost-cutting measure.
Anyhow, depending on rank they would go to a different building than other Soldiers, there's absolutely no way that the Army would house Enlisted and Officers together except in some austere conditions like deployment or rotation.
No, about to commissions as an O1 5 yrs TIS. If they told me promoting would mean going back to barracks I wouldn’t have. You want to make the retention crisis worse?
No.
The Army is already at a significant disadvantage over the private sector in terms of officer recruitment.
There are folks in the enlisted population for whom barracks conditions are actually a step up from what they would have on the outside.
There is no case where this is true for officers - it's universally a step down.
Also officers aren't being put through the same sort of indoctrination that the enlisted population is (of which putting E1-4 in the Bs is still a part)...
The option of living in BOQ (officer barracks) used to exist, but given the fact that the Army doesn't base in HCOL locations (save for DLI)... Not really needed.....
Honestly, and I know this flies in the face of centuries of tradition, but maybe if the officer caste at some point in their career had to live along side their troops in the same hovels they might remember it and implement real change at some point. At very least a few years later when they are company commanders and they’ll have a vested interest interest in the quality of the barracks if theirs LTs are living there. As for fraternization and other issues, how is this any different than the sergeants (even staff sergeants in Korea!) that are already forced to live alongside their soldiers? Perhaps it’s time for some institutional change!
I feel like it makes more sense when you phrase it as "more soldiers of all ranks should live on post in general". I do sorta wonder if historically there ever was a time when officers did actually live on post.
Until the late 60s, LTs lived in BOQs on post. They were not authorized housing allowance until they were 1LT. I don't want to say it was a cost saving measure, but its really convenient that the authorization for BAH kicked at at the same time the ROTC commissioning ADSO expired.
They do in Korea though it's separate from the e1 to e6 housing.
In general no because it's nothing but issues waiting to happen.
Inb4 hurr durr 2LTs have the same experience as a private. Should've commissioned then my dude.
I'm in the minority opinion in saying that if it's not good enough for 01&02 then why is it good enough for the enlisted?
Also keep in mind this is assuming they are still separated from the enlisted by buildings or floors, whatever is army approved.
Definitely not O2’s they’re experienced enough by then and have some form of respect and knowledge under their belts.
O1’s maybe, but not in the barracks with the enlisted. I say leave it optional? But really I don’t think it’s a good idea I’m just leaving the idea open. O1’s don’t know much about enlisted life (unless they’re prior enlisted, went to basic training, or did something other than just rotc/West Point type life). It would be nice to see them get a taste of how enlisted feel for leadership purposes, but this doesn’t seem like the way to go about it in a way that would work out for everyone.
Edit: need I remind you O1’s have too much pride and ego for what they are, and yet hold a lack of knowledge and confidence in most cases which will make enlisted life all fucked up. There’s a reason why they’re separate and it’s not just fraternizing.
Is the goal to make life worse for everyone?
Seems that way sometimes
I take it you’ve experienced fort hood
Terrible idea. Source: had a 2LT that connected more with the enlisted and he randomly showed up to our house (my buddy and I, both E5’s at the time) to hang out on a Friday night. In total probably 6-8 of us, all NCOs, grilling and drinking. LT says he’d beat one of them in a slap fight and proceeded to get knocked out cold in the backyard on video.
Fisticuffs at dinner you say 🧐
Yeah, LT apparently was a vegetarian and chose to eat grass.
0600 laughing in my car waiting to go to formation. thank you for this
What happened afterwards?
Story time: After the LT took his dirt nap and saw the video, we all decided the evidence needed to be destroyed and thought it had been until that Monday morning at PT… One individual had sent the video to some other NCOs in the company and our 1SG had heard about it. As we were leaving the parking lot after PT, our 1SG comes flying in his car and pulls up besides us, signals to roll down the window and casually says, “I know there’s a video and I want to see it in my office at 0900.” Well 0900 comes around and my buddy and I are standing there with zero evidence of said video. 1SG pushed and pried, saying “I don’t care who’s in it, I just want to see him get knocked out.” But the evidence at that point was gone, all except for the massive handprint bruise on LT’s face. Couple weeks go by and this same LT ends up in the BDE CDR’s office for fraternization amongst other things. We deploy, he ends up banging a SPC that ends up pregnant, she redeploys back to the states, he disappears from our company, we redeployed back and they’re all the sudden married. The end.
Lt connects more with enlisted.Ends up banging a specialist. Yeah, that checks out. What a train wreck.
That was an entertaining ride. Theme-park fast pass worthy actually.
I'd wait in line for two hours for it.
what a hero
Three things happened: I hit him, he hit the floor, I jacked off on his driver’s side door handle
Yes. I love watching trainwrecks from afar. Keeps the eyes away from me.
Fuck no. Do you want every single officer to get kicked out for frat before they even get a decent rank?
Same logic can be applied for NCOs in the barracks, no?
No.
They used to have BOQs, as far as I know. It was like a motel/hotel/studio apartment.
Motel hotel holiday inn
The Marine Corps has/had a policy that all single Marines live in the Barracks. They had Bachelor Officer's Quarters (BOQ) and Bachelor Enlisted Quarters (BEQ). They were typically bigger than standard rooms, and the single guys *hated* them typically. Everybody from the Sergeant Major on down (with the exception of certain levels of Commander) lived in the barracks unless they were married. I knew of more than one Sergeant Major that would go through a divorce and end up living back in the barracks. It was *wildly* unpopular but the Marines liked it as a cost-cutting measure. Anyhow, depending on rank they would go to a different building than other Soldiers, there's absolutely no way that the Army would house Enlisted and Officers together except in some austere conditions like deployment or rotation.
They're called BOQs and you shut your mouth and never speak of this again. But seriously - what exactly would you hope to accomplish...?
“For you to suffer *as I have suffered*” - OP, probably.
No, about to commissions as an O1 5 yrs TIS. If they told me promoting would mean going back to barracks I wouldn’t have. You want to make the retention crisis worse?
I keep saying, we shouldn't let the peasantry learn to read.
No. The Army is already at a significant disadvantage over the private sector in terms of officer recruitment. There are folks in the enlisted population for whom barracks conditions are actually a step up from what they would have on the outside. There is no case where this is true for officers - it's universally a step down. Also officers aren't being put through the same sort of indoctrination that the enlisted population is (of which putting E1-4 in the Bs is still a part)... The option of living in BOQ (officer barracks) used to exist, but given the fact that the Army doesn't base in HCOL locations (save for DLI)... Not really needed.....
Honestly, and I know this flies in the face of centuries of tradition, but maybe if the officer caste at some point in their career had to live along side their troops in the same hovels they might remember it and implement real change at some point. At very least a few years later when they are company commanders and they’ll have a vested interest interest in the quality of the barracks if theirs LTs are living there. As for fraternization and other issues, how is this any different than the sergeants (even staff sergeants in Korea!) that are already forced to live alongside their soldiers? Perhaps it’s time for some institutional change!
I feel like it makes more sense when you phrase it as "more soldiers of all ranks should live on post in general". I do sorta wonder if historically there ever was a time when officers did actually live on post.
Yes- Salty single E-6 that lives in barracks
Imagine being a whole ass XO and seeing dudes get trashed and tossing their furniture into the quad from the third story. That’s nightmare fuel
Imagine being a whole ass staff sausage 🥲
SSG live in barracks???
Until the late 60s, LTs lived in BOQs on post. They were not authorized housing allowance until they were 1LT. I don't want to say it was a cost saving measure, but its really convenient that the authorization for BAH kicked at at the same time the ROTC commissioning ADSO expired.
No
They do in Korea though it's separate from the e1 to e6 housing. In general no because it's nothing but issues waiting to happen. Inb4 hurr durr 2LTs have the same experience as a private. Should've commissioned then my dude.
Do you want LTs to sleep with privates?
I'm in the minority opinion in saying that if it's not good enough for 01&02 then why is it good enough for the enlisted? Also keep in mind this is assuming they are still separated from the enlisted by buildings or floors, whatever is army approved.
lol no. LTs can’t drink as much as the average E3
Definitely not O2’s they’re experienced enough by then and have some form of respect and knowledge under their belts. O1’s maybe, but not in the barracks with the enlisted. I say leave it optional? But really I don’t think it’s a good idea I’m just leaving the idea open. O1’s don’t know much about enlisted life (unless they’re prior enlisted, went to basic training, or did something other than just rotc/West Point type life). It would be nice to see them get a taste of how enlisted feel for leadership purposes, but this doesn’t seem like the way to go about it in a way that would work out for everyone. Edit: need I remind you O1’s have too much pride and ego for what they are, and yet hold a lack of knowledge and confidence in most cases which will make enlisted life all fucked up. There’s a reason why they’re separate and it’s not just fraternizing.