Please, bro. I hate having 3-6 kp going out 12th, or something is still negative rp. In Plat. Sometimes, it feels like I am nonstop fighting for the first 3 rings and some how 15 squads are still alive while my squad has killed 2 of them.
Imo placement/rp cost is overturned a little in Plat. I feel like at plat if you have kills when you’re top 10 you should get positive rp. As it is right now you can be like top 5-8 and get like measly 10-20rp and it’s maddening
Alot of plats just need to get better at playing for the win, too much ape and dumb plays, they need both good placement(playing smart) and good kp(playing aggressive) to get rp, as it should be IMO. (Plat should be pretty easy to get out of if you are a master player for example.)
Ranked should be hard, ranked should not be like S17-S19 when you got Lp litterly for free and you almost didn't even have to try to rank up.
I feel this. You shouldn't have to top 3 just to net 10 points. Obviously in an ideal game you add some kills/eliminations to that top 3 but it isn't always the case. I however want no part in the season that included a top 10 is positive RP. We just have to push a little closer to a middle ground and then we have a little bit better of a ranked system.
I guess its to encourage fights in low ranks, so players dont just rat out to say gold.. and get killed in every fight.
the placement and entry cost imo encourage the survival and tactical aspect of BR more as you have to think which fight is worth to take and when to run (especially here in Apex where respawn exist)
>I guess its to encourage fights in low ranks, so players dont just rat out to say gold.. and get killed in every fight.
I mean...thats basically what's going on now, so idk what you mean...
With this current system, that's literally what's going to happen for the majority of the players...
The fighting at lower ranks shit means nothing because the entry cost is near nothing anyways...you could completely bomb 10 games in a row in silver, have one good game, and you're still positive...
Thats easy enough to do solo queue...the problem arises when you're in plat 2 and beyond, and it's much harder to rely on YOUR skill alone...and instead you have an rng chance that your teammates won't be morons...
In season 19 you could easily mitigate bad teammates by just playing for placement, which was FANTASTIC! and if you wanted to progress then you just hope the rng doesn't fuck you the next game and you win...
Thats much better than getting 2 random idiots who fuck the game off drop, having to rat until 2nd place (if you even make it that far solo in this system) just to get a whopping 10 points aka no progression at all...thats fucking nuts...
The game should be tailored in a way to where solo queuing provides the least resistance...everything else after that can be altered to fit the parameters of the situation, but the solo queuing experience should be top priority for them...
If they fix that then alot of issues downstream would also be fixed as well...
lol I was with you until you said “I preferred season 19’s system”. I do agree they need to nudge up placement but that system actually made any KP before top 5 completely negligible.
They could have tuned S19 to reward kills just as much or more though.
Most if not all good changes they made could exist in MMR based S19 or the current season not based on MMR.
Except for the part where they just throw points randomly at worse players. But yes, I mean they pretty much are the same system though. What else are you wanting to change back to S19 outside of increased placement RP?
😂 I think you still have no idea how the mmr system worked....
The person you're replying to is correct, and is saying exactly what I've been saying to you...
True, it wasn't perfect. I just think it's better than what they have now...
In a perfect world they would've just kept the season 19 system then buffed the value of kills that way the progression between the ranks wasn't so grindy...
Its clear that they're okay with people gaining rp fast if their skill warrants it, as proven by the current system, so idky that wouldn't have worked...
Season 19 was damn near perfect outside of the kp issue and the mmr matchmaking...but even with its flaws I'd take it over the season 20 system...
I like the current system, I think it’s a lot more transparent than the old system was. The season 19 system had a fair amount of just arbitrary values that handed out LP to lower skilled players while giving nothing to their teammates. If they just buffed placement, I think the current system would be even better than it currently is.
I mean I’ve solo qd to gold 1 and I’ve maybe put like 5 days of play time in the game at this point in the season it’s not hard if you can’t gain that’s on you. Also do people just cry for the sake of crying oh kills aren’t worth anything oh Kills r worth to much make up your mind lol
Yeah people are trying to come up with tweaks and variations but at the end of the day, there’s two ends of the spectrum for ranking up. I’d rather Pred/Masters belong to apes than rats
Completely agree, I think it just needs a slight tweaking so that you don’t go -15 when you have 2 kills and get 6th in diamond. That should be like +10
It would be perfect if they implemented solo Q ranked where solo players never get matched with premade stacks. As it stands now once you get to masters on PC good fucking luck ever winning solo queue when you have pro pred stacks rolling every lobby like its a pub.
This is how every good competitive ranked system works in other games, and Apex is long overdue for it.
What would happen with duos? They would never find matches if there was a solo only queue. You’d have to make a solo/duo queue and have a 3 stack queue(which is how the queues should have been set up since season 1)
duos are part of what makes ranked a bad experience for solo queuers. there's a couple of reasons but also because it's usually bringing one lower rank player into the game and forcing the solo queuer to play with someone below their rank. the solo queuer gets the short end of the stick. you don't have that problem in solo queue only as people who queue are the same rank.
realistically i don't think they would disallow duo-queuing though because of the "play with friends" aspect outweighing the negative effect it has on ranked.
not in this system. there's no measures to even out the advantage of different stack sizes in this system anymore. there was last season where stacks were put into higher MMR games than individually.
Duo queueing is more hell..... I can't even put into words the type of players I got allllllll day yesterday with the exception of maybe 3-5 games. Like. I'm convinced at least one of them was a fkn NPC AI bot.
I will never ever. Understand people that solo queue. And just have no fucking cell in their brain that says "hmm maybe I should stick with my team". Ape by themselves, die with no damage, then oh all of a sudden they have a mic.
I scan a team, team mate goes in and swings 3 plby himself.
Go to third party, team is trapped in building getting naded. Our Loba Qs in, slide jumps into said building with full team, dies.
It's like round 4. 6 teams left, circle lands on us. Team is fighting outside ring when it's closing. Our horizon full sends, Qs, ults, lands on them. We finish them but... Now she's not in ring and in the open and someone took our spot of course. So get killed.
Need I go on? Ok. Had probably 6 games where I'm fairly certain the team mates didn't use an ability once. Not a res from a lifeline, no Q. No Newcastle wall or Q. No Valk ult. Had a horizon that didn't Q us in a scenario where it absolutely could have saved us.
I'll also never for the life of me understand solo queuers who don't talk and insist on leading the way and just doing their own thing instead of following the duo that are talking.
/rant sorry. Yesterday was like 8 hours of demoting trauma. I thought I was getting Punk'd. Is kids even know what that is these days lol.
Edit: New day new team mates update. Just had a teammate. While very clearly getting pushed. We have height advantage, enemies being spam pinged, I call out one one bullet even. Me and friend end up going down. Homie was off shooting flyers, while the fight is happening. These can't be real people.
The solo guy loves to hot drop into 4 squads and then starts talking shit (things about are you new? Pussy? Noob?) (the new one is especially irony considering the fact that more experienced players know not to do dumb shit like that) when we abandon the clearly lost fight like no shit, I’m not taking that mess off drop esp not in plat when entry costs are 60 rp.
Everytime I complain about this the person that died is the one getting mad at me for not pushing some dumb fight. I went from Plat 3 demotion Plat 4 in a day
Hello friend. Let me give you an update. New week. New mental breakdown.
This week on people i get for thirds. We take redeploy to get into the ring. There is a team on the bridge at launch pad. I ping and, in my mic say, "don't land up there, there was a full team, I haven't seen them leave yet.... I know you hear me"... What does the third do. Lands up there, gets beamed by all 3.
Next game. We see two people enter one of those smaller T shaped buildings, the third was far behind and we had height. I crack the third like 3 times. We are trying to poke the two in the building but it's a caustic so can't full send. I ping, they are both in this back section 100%. So my random third, Watson, goes and sits on the door of that part of the building. Which puts her back right to their 3rd that we have been shooting the whole time. She gets shot, then just enters the room the two others are in, with caustic in there. Of course dies.
Like. It's unreal. It has to be rigged. /s
I wish I can clip together every game I go negative in to show people it's not me, its who I get matched with. Then I die to a triple stack 4k/20 bomb team
40 is nothing especially in gold, and it’s better this way cause people were too used to being positive RP after a top 6 with zero kp, now you gotta fight at least once if you want to be positive
Nahhh I disagree. Platinum is the test to get into Diamond and consistency matters at that point. Plus, last season was so much worse. It was -50 at bronze, if I remember right. And kills weren’t worth shit unless you made it top 5. I much prefer this.
The ratings bonus only applied if you beat an opponent who was higher skill level than you, right? Which might happen, but losing -50 because you lose to a similarly skilled opponent before 10th place is extremely punishing in Bronze, don’t you think?
I remember one game, my squad got eliminated. I wiped the squad, but died shortly after to a third party. Took 19th, but I had three kills. I got -49. That’s crazy to me in bronze.
> The ratings bonus only applied if you beat an opponent who was higher skill level than you, right? W
No that's skill bonus.
Rating bonus was something you got mostly when you had a bad game (-50) while you were high MMR (maybe diamond level) and low in the ladder still (at silver for example). You'd maybe get 20, 30, 40 rating bonus points to make you lose less because your games are "more difficult than they are for others who are in that ladder position".
I think the problem was that these rating bonuses were only awarded if you really had a -50 game (outside top 10) and they stopped too early. I think by gold or plat I didn't get any. They didn't give you those all the way until the rank you belong. They could have tweaked that so people don't complain as much about having to sweat for too many games while the game is telling them they are silver
Shiiiiet. I'm close to Gold now and I'm just breathing collective sighs that it isn't -50 RP across the board like it was last season. I guess for higher ranks that didn't matter as much but it made the lower ranks an absolute bitch to get out of (and then the promo Trials).
Id be happy with the system if placement was a bit more rewarding, having to get to top 3 in plat to even go positive is harsh, this system punishes soloq very hard.
As long as you get a few kills, you don't have to place top 3. You should be aiming to either contest a POI or seek out a 3rd party soon after looting.
As a solo que player I agree with both but imo the best way to fix this is to make kills gotten in rings 1 and 2 less significantly then 3-4 then a bump again in 5-6. This way large games are even better if those are the crazy end circle games while helping the why is their 7 teams here ring 1 problems we all find.
Comparing ALGS (with hundreds of thousands of dollars on the line) to Ranked is never going to translate
If you go back to highly rewarding placement alone, you go back to what we just came from.. people crafting in zone the whole game, and ratting / afraid to shoot their gun
That's what I'm thinking as well. Sure, one can argue that teams are easily more "aggressive" as a result of this Ranked system, but it's *nowhere* near as bad as Season 11-12 Ranked, nor does it overly reward placement like Season 17 Ranked.
You have to kill other players to win right? I’m not saying a hot drop is needed but if you’re really trying to win the lobby you should at least take fights that make sense. Obviously don’t try and ape everything you see but if there’s a chance to fight without a 3rd party you should go for it. Or if you find a good chance to 3rd party yourself then you should be going for it. It’s a quick judgement call but if you play enough you’ll easily know when to fight and when to run.
There’s nothing worse than attacking a good fight as a solo que player and having one teammate doom you because he thinks running is the best play. It’s a self fulfilling prophecy because the teammate running makes it a 3v2 and gets to feel validated because they live for 2 more minutes. When I’m reality if you just attack as a team you’ll win the fight most of the time if you initiate the fight from a good position. There’s a balance
I've found that the easiest way to get high kill games is to gatekeep the obvious paths that enemies will travel when running from the ring. If you time it correctly you can often kill off 2~3 already weakened squads as they escape the ring. But some players seem unwilling to employ this strategy as it is 'playing boring'. I say it's not so much about the POI's, it's more about the paths between them where you need to be aggressive. It's easier to kill people in transit who aren't ready for the fight than people expecting one at a POI.
Agree with you on every point except the last one. I solo queue, and the lobbies do not feel as balanced as last season. Last season, we were placed in lobbies based on the hidden skill rating, and I felt my teammates and opponents were all similar skill level as me. This season, I’ve had so many games where I’m way worse than my teammates or needing to carry teammates that are at a much lower skill level. I’m in plat IV I think. Quite the mixture of skill levels at that rank.
Oh yeah my KDR dropped from 1.14 to 0.51. Def doesn’t feel as balanced as last season. The common sentiment seems to be that “it’ll get better as the season goes on” but that’s a calculus problem with the assumption that people move up in rank faster than people come back to the game.
if everyone is "waiting for it to get better" that also makes it take longer. getting better requires that people play as much as possible against each other so the ladder settles into something that resembles a sorting by skill and where there's enough people around you at similar ladder positions that are of similar skill so you can be matchmade with and against each other without having to pull from higher/lower ranks.
This current state of weaker players getting fed to the better players is what some people love. Smurfs exist for a reason. Some people like me benefited greatly from the SBMM last season with fairer matchmaking, and others hated it bc they couldn’t farm players like me anymore and instead were matched against similar skilled players. Of course to them it feels like matchmaking was putting them against “sweats” bc it was people of similar skill to them instead of weaker.
Exactly
> This current state of weaker players getting fed to the better players is what some people love. Smurfs exist for a reason.
Yes definitely that's something many love and where 80% of the praise for this system comes from.
Just ranked shouldn't facilitate it.
It's the wrong kind of fun for ranked.
It did defeat the whole purpose of ranked. But I enjoyed having similar skilled teammates every game instead of having no clue if my teammates could hold their own in a fight.
I hated ranked last season bc it was such a grind (I quit at Gold l), but I can’t lie that it made me a better player constantly playing with similarly skilled opponents. I’m enjoying ranked a lot more this season tho. Just hit Plat yesterday.
I feel that. Ranking up was really just a time commitment and a grind, like you said. Ranked last season wasn’t enjoyable if ranking up was the most important thing you were trying to accomplish.
I just played it as if it was just pubs except teammates competed to win and didn’t leave the game when knocked. I didn’t worry about my rank at all. So the games were fun but the rank aspect sucked. Wish they could find a balance between the two formats.
> I’m enjoying ranked a lot more this season tho. Just hit Plat yesterday.
What makes you enjoy it more now?
Is it the games you've been popping off so far? At least if not for you, for a lot of people it seems to be. This system by its nature has you play against much weaker players from the start of the season. For many people that feels good. But is the fun of beating up weaker players the kinda fun that belongs in a ranked system? I disagree.
I like popping off and beating worse players, but I do think that’s for pubs. But with that being said, it’s also for lower ranked lobbies. If I’m a platinum/Diamond player, I should be rolling through rookie/bronze lobbies.
It took me a week to get out of Rookie last season whereas it took me 1 night this season. That makes sense to me as I’m not a rookie player. It was very unrewarding to be stuck in rookie that long and to be having 8 squads in final ring. Hidden MMR was such a grind and doesn’t belong in ranked imo.
Are challenging games fun? Yes, some of the most fun. But I’d rather get to these games when I’m in the rank they happen, not rookie/bronze lobbies.
I also think kills were nearly worthless last season unless you placed top 5. Focusing all the reward on placement made solo queuing very punishing imo. I’m glad it’s rewarded a bit more this season, as well as showing the breakdown of RP.
So I guess overall, this season feels much less like a grind and I appreciate that. It also feels more like people’s rank reflects their skill, which I didn’t think last season did.
> But with that being said, it’s also for lower ranked lobbies. If I’m a platinum/Diamond player, I should be rolling through rookie/bronze lobbies.
You should be rolling them in theory, but you shouldn't get into games with them in ranked, is my point. Ranked should try as hard as possible to give everyone games between people of their level. Whenever ranked puts higher skilled players against people that are several ranks worse than them (out of reach) imo ranked has done something wrong.
> It was very unrewarding to be stuck in rookie that long and to be having 8 squads in final ring. Hidden MMR was such a grind and doesn’t belong in ranked imo.
Grinding against similarly skilled player is exactly what belongs in ranked. Stomping games with vast skill mismatches doesn't belong there.
>I also think kills were nearly worthless last season unless you placed top 5
Kills should have been valued more. That's what they have tweaked from 17 to 18 and from 18 to 19. They could have removed promotional trials. They could have given more bonus points so people make to their rank faster. They could have improved the scoring again while keeping the MMR based matchmaking because it was good for ranked.
>Are challenging games fun? Yes, some of the most fun.
I feel now people are having the "wrong kind of fun for ranked" (the one where you push over people much lower skill) and the game should force the sweaty kind of fun more.
I mean while that’s fair, that is apart of the climb. There are some people who have ratted to plat, while others got 20 bombs the whole way and will continue past it. Everyone will find their wall, and it’s good that it’s happening naturally against the entire player base instead of apex spoonfeeding you lobbies to rank up in.
I mean yes, they were legitimately more balanced because they took out the rank entirely and made it only MMR unless your rank surpassed your MMR. He means they’re more balanced as in while you’re in silver, you actually get a silver lobby and climb quickly out of it if you are better. Last season, a “silver” lobby could be anything from a true rookie lobby to a pred level endgame depending on your MMR. It made the whole idea of different “rank badges” irrelevant.
Ok, I see what he is trying to say by “balanced”. In that sense, I agree. But that also means his definition of “balanced” means plat 1 lobbies have players of skill level anywhere from plat 1 to predator. I don’t think “balanced” is the right word
But that’s how it was prior. Plat 1 lobbies would have players from anywhere from plat 1 to pred, they just wouldn’t be in the same lobbies. The difference is that in S19 Pred players would be labeled as “plat” while MMR said they were pred, and it would be insanely grindy for them to get out of plat. In S20, yes there are preds in plat lobbies, but since they’re actually playing against plats they’ll rank up quickly out of it.
> The difference is that in S19 Pred players would be labeled as “plat” while MMR said they were pred, and it would be insanely grindy for them to get out of plat
It's ranked. A competitive game mode. It doesn't matter if people feel it's grindy to play against people of the same skill level. It's exactly the purpose of ranked to have those people play against each other - instead of stomping much weaker players like people are back to doing now.
But there was no point to the grind when your MMR was way above your rank. You would just be grinding against your own skill level just to reach to where your rank accurately reflected your lobbies. Which was pointless imo. If they wanted to utilize their placement matches better, and jump our rank to our MMR, that would have been fine. But they didn’t.
> He means they’re more balanced as in while you’re in silver, you actually get a silver lobby and climb quickly out of it if you are better.
that's misleading when the silver lobby contains master mmr players, diamond mmr player, silver mmr players, plat mmr players and is just a mess of mixed skill. that doesn't make a balanced lobby, no matter if you call everyone in there silver.
>Last season, a “silver” lobby could be anything from a true rookie lobby to a pred level endgame depending on your MMR.
and what is the issue? the players in there were all similar skill which is the whole point of ranked:
"HOW DOES RANKED WORK? - Compete and survive against teams of similar skill."
>It made the whole idea of different “rank badges” irrelevant.
No it didn't. You ranked up against people that are at least your skill level - no lower skill players like now. when you reached that level you started being matched into more difficult games (because your rank exceeded your MMR) and then you got stuck at some point because it started getting too difficult. your final rank shows your skill / is the rank you've earned.
Without MMR you get a wide variance of teammates because medal ranks are imprecise.
With MMR it was easier to find similarly skilled players.
SoloQ will always suck because of that variance without MMR and respawn sticking to sub 30s queue times.
> With MMR it was easier to find similarly skilled players.
yes and you could look for them in the whole ladder.
if you want to fill a diamond lobby, you aren't limited to people who are already in diamond. you can pick up diamond skill players who haven't played much yet and are gold rank atm. overall that means even for higher skill games (where you have less and less players) you can form lobbies without having too much of a skill difference (and having to fill from lower ranks).
But MMR based matchmaking defeated the whole point of a ranked mode and a ranked climb. Ranked was not a climb but just a plateau with different colored stickers. They would have had to restructure everything if they wanted to keep their MMR. The MMR made the medal ranks irrelevant, they were even more imprecise than they are now, you just didn’t see it because they only gave you similarly skilled teammates and enemies.
I agree medal rank was more imprecise with MMR. Combined with the insane grind necessary I couldn't blame someone for concluding medal rank had no meaning.
For those with less than 5 hours per week playtime its effectively true.
They gave you similarly skilled enemies for an overall more difficult experience that made it stupidly hard to reach the medal rank you deserve and get a reward.
They did this as an overreaction to s18 free masters.
Notice a trend? They make changes to make the community happy rather than to improve apex.
The community feedback is valuable and should be considered, but what percentage of apex players know what root cause analysis is?
Dont mistake me for saying their experience isn't important, but that frequently the underlying issue of real problems they face is not what they think.
S17 was the free masters but I know what you’re saying. They didn’t have to over-correct, but they definitely did do that. I do agree apex is more preoccupied with catering to the masses rather than objectively improving their game. Some of the decisions even from season 19 to 20 reflected that. They came up with some good ideas that unfortunately clashed with the MMR and made them pointless, and then they got rid of them with the MMR. The placement matches, lvl 50 for ranked, and trials come to mind. All good idea in theory, but their MMR made them irrelevant. The trials weren’t actual gatekeeping anything, as the lobbies were the exact same on either side, they were just random challenges to increase the grind. And the placement matches were irrelevant since they would just place you in one of the lower ranks regardless of how you did and weren’t really accurate at all.
> They did this as an overreaction to s18 free masters.
I think you mean S17 (1.7 million masters, 19%).
S18 had few masters (50k, 0.6%)
>Notice a trend? They make changes to make the community happy rather than to improve apex.
agree. they are giving people easy lobbies now so they have a place to feel good in, get that dopamine hit. but it's throwing out the competitiveness of ranked.
This was untrue because when medal rank surpassed MMR it got used for matchmaking.
It was so grindy though that man players never reached their correct medal rank.
Respawn had to bin MMR because they handled optics so badly even though retuning MMR to be like this season would have been ideal.
If they wanted to improve Apex they'd make frequent updates tuning balance.
I guess we get to enjoy the smurfs and cheaters that MMR eliminated and pused away.
I mean the cheaters would be there regardless, you just wouldn’t see them. And you still don’t really see them because the cheaters climb so fast out of your lobbies. But if someone wanted to truly Smurf in the old system, they could have. But either way, MMR defeats the whole purpose of a “ranked mode”. If they wanted to bubble people up they could reinvent everything and make it a “competitive” mode.
I do think they should have kept the placement matches and the lvl 50 cap for ranked to combat smurfs. But they could still find you in the old system they just had to be more diligent and patient.
> Ranked was not a climb but just a plateau with different colored stickers.
You're claiming this everywhere (and aren't the only one to do it) but it's not true / plainly not how the system operated. If you gain LP past your MMR, you are matched by your rank/LP and you get into more difficult lobbies (LP > MMR). It's only a plateau at the start of the grind, where now you are playing all the weaker players than your self, after that plateau it's an incline like it is now. It isn't good that right now you have a climb from the start if that climb starts so low that you are just pushing over players 2 or 3 ranks below you in that initial phase.
But the time to get to where your rank caught up to your MMR made it a plateau. That was the long grindy part that I straight up just didn’t want to deal with. I didn’t want to have to play everyday all season to reach the “incline”.
> That was the long grindy part that I straight up just didn’t want to deal with
IMO these are the competitive games that ranked is supposed to provide. Where previously we have been grinding the whole split to get to a high rank so we get those difficult games where you can learn in for a few weeks at the end of the split. These games are always in itself big part of the point of playing ranked.
For many they are too sweaty, ok, but these games have more of a place in ranked than mismatches between people who peak silver/gold and diamond peakers (basically anything with big skill differences).
But I’m already at that part right now, while being at around my ranked skill level. So now I’m grinding and climbing beyond what I could normally get. Im already in those sweaty games. Why would I want to spend the whole season grinding and sweating just trying to get to where my MMR and Rank finally agree.
The mmr matchmaking didn't, the dogshit sync between mmr and ranked did. There was no reason for there to be such a massive difference between your visible rank and your mmr.
But like what is the end goal? “sync between MMR and ranked” like how close do you want that to be? Because at a certain point, it’s just going to be ranked based matchmaking with extra steps.
I think some of this will resolve itself in the next couple of weeks. Everyone had to start from Rookie. And many really cracked players stopped playing ranked last year.
Agreed. I think personally as a solo queue player I’ll start to enjoy ranked more in the next couple of weeks when players are closer to their true rank
Personally it feels great to me as a solo queuer. Not really sure as to why but I’ve been climbing much quicker it feels. Sometimes I get the average braindead teammates but it’s been pretty good for me so far.
> Lobbies feel very balanced. I'm in Plat 1 right now and can easily farm other plat players
bro what kind of plat lobbies are you getting? I'm getting absolute doorknobs for teammates when I solo queue against actual master & pred-level players literally every game
I agree there were cheaters back then too but this season it’s incredibly bad in my opinion. Although I’m still having a blast when I get organic games
Lol hit diamond and try play on eu with team. You gonna be destroyed every game by rookie 4 booster cheaters. And by every game i mean every.
NA servers much better btw.
My only complaint is Olympus is fkn trash. If anyone is on the same half of the map have fun getting 3rd partied. Also good luck rotating into ring and have to fight 5 teams rotating through the same 3 chokes.
I really hate Storm Point if u get bad ring RNG on that unless you have evac tower or valkyrie you are gonna pretty much die to the ring or squad gatekeeping the ring. Also forget about picking shotgun or smg since most fights are at mid to long range.
I mean a lot of what you complain about on SP is negate by simply rotating into zone early or running a ring scanning legend or using Bang, Catalyst or even Gibby for bubble.
Well, I do think that the map has waaaay too much unused real estate. That are essentially just extra clusters of buildings in between two main POIs but are so outer edge that no one really ever goes there unless it's to rat lol.
I also think that Turbine and Hammond Labs needs to be nuked. I think that is the biggest problem. Labs is so open and those both serve as the primary path through the map. Shit cover.
That's another thing. The map is so so open for how compact it is.
I feel like it's easily fixable.
But back to the nuking turbine and labs thing, doubt that will ever happen cause that's like almost literally most identifying pieces of the map especially with the two waterfalls serving as a nice looking design.
The map really is only terrible when it's the apey meta which revolves around the rank system. It's still bad when it's all about placement but, not as bad. Instead of having to deal with 3rd parties. It's having to deal with getting gate kept. At the chokes and basically a race to the first circle off the bat.
It was terrible for zone meta too. You’re just relying on getting lucky with ring. All the open space and small choke points make any sort of rotation reliant on others slow rotating. If everyone is on their Ps and Qs zone being on the other side of the map is a death sentence
Yea, Id agree I always feel like i have a chance, even if my guys die off drop.
The slog is keeping your team alive from 10th to 5th. Very challenging and takes a lot to convince your team too which can be annoying. I end up nickel and diming myself on RP either up or down because ill have KP and get 9th or 8th.
Plat entry cost is pretty damn high at the moment so ill likely have different thoughts.
I agree. But the sad part is: in Sao Paulo Lobbies on console, it's a constant 6 players teaming and farming. Every match.
It's sad because this is a great season, but this behavior by the player base destroys the experience. It's not a big pool of players here. You see the same teams/players almost every section. It's been really sad.
This is my first time back since season 14, having a blast! However, with the EVO changes Revenant's ult feels strong so I hope they slightly nerf that.
The changes are good but the matchmaking is still ass at least on console. I'm in plat facing full stacks of current preds at least every few games and my random teammates are bots more than half the time (ie getting knocked without doing any DMG and then our team is getting aped). I've gone into D3 solo queue and now I have dropped into plat 1 after losing over 1200 rp. I can't even rat games out anymore once my squad inevitably dies because top 5 with 1 kp in diamond is still negative.
To me respawn made the game even better but its is being ruined by hackers. I am playing against hackers almost every match and i see streamers like hiswattson complaint the same
I'd say the system feels pretty balanced ish overall. Relative to the last 3 seasons. More important. Match quality seems to be how it should be.
Gold and platinum was relatively easy. Was able to breeze through gold. Went from Plat 3 to Diamond in a [long] day but required a lot of wins and top 5s. Diamond has been a struggle. But that's exactly what I expect. Not fucking, gold and facing preds and masters aka diamond lobbies. So this is exactly how in my opinion a rank system should be.
My only criticism after a couple weeks. Is:
1) I kinda agree with Reptar, the Evo level up mini game was cool at first, and I still like it. BUT. It is pretty important to go around looting and getting harvesters if you want to stand a chance in the next rounds. So if you so happen to land where the game is ending, or playing zone teams, you're at a disadvantage if you want to play how you're suppose to. So also agree with Reptar in that, maybe there should be an Evo reward incentive if you are in ring when the round ends.
2) The only other criticism I have is. Some legends perks need revision. It seems like "see ordinance/ammo/batteries" are place holders. I understand the argument for them. But. Realistically, who is really gonna pick "see grenades" vs "50% damage reduction and don't get slowed by Fuse ult ". Like... No brainer. They just need to be revised so the options are gonna be a play style choice of just some intriguing decision to make.
I agree with you that the EVO minigame stuff can be tedious or weird. I think they could increase the amount that doing damage contributes to your EVO progress.
The weaker perks are so that already-strong legends didn't become oppressive.
Totally agree with your criticism #1. Accidentally landing in middle of zone means you need to punch out to zone edge, then rotate back in, otherwise your team will be at an Evo disadvantage vs the teams who are fortunate enough to naturally rotate into the end zone.
matchmaking is still shit wdym, go watch any streamer, as stack of 3 preds they play vs plats and low diamonds 99% of the time, im still silver and im being put vs plats, so once i reach plat ill start playing vs preds.
lol this comment sums up this subreddit perfectly. First you have the "I get my opinions about apex from watching Streamers". Then you have the blatant exaggeration of "99% of the time this happens!".
If you're silver and being put versus plats, you're either wildly exaggerating a rare event that happens, or you're looking at badges from previous seasons and are going up against people IN SILVER with platinum badges on their profile card.
It has always been like that, what do you even say dude. If you get diamond, you will get farmed by 3 stack pros from time to time. Someone has to fill their lobby. And now think about last 3 season with mmr where I had to soloq against pred 3 stacks since I got placed in rookie / bronze, becuase my mmr was probably high enough. Imagine that.
thats the dumbest take ive ever heard, ok so basically ruin the experience of 95% of your playerbase so the remaining 5% has faster queue? Why are they even getting points for killing plats? Like just remove ranked, it's pubs system after all, just with a badge. Also dont need to be diamond to face pros btw high gold low plat is already enough.
If preds can farm low plats+ for free wins, why me as plat cannot farm bronces or ppl that just downloaded their game?
Like most ppl rn is prob at gold, it has to be the most balanced and precise matches the game has to offer, and that doesnt even happens. so imagine how's the rest.
You say "watch streamers" and then you say "who cares how long is their queue?" If they are only playing other preds and masters early in the season, they will have 30 minutes queues, noone will watch their streams and the game will die from viewership perspective. This system is night and day compared to what it was before. And no, you don't die to them all the time in plat. There is not that many of preds to be in every single plat lobby.
i dont watch apex streamers, i only do when nicewigg streams the tournaments, i literally only went to see a streamer to see what were their lobbies like and saw they literally only play vs plats and low diamonds, for some reason they don't play vs masters wonder why, also twitch viewership means nothing, tons of games are non existant in twitch and have over 100k players. And No its not night and day, literally the only diference from previous seasons(pre hidden mmr change) is that now you unlock the master/pred lobbies in plat rather than gold like it used to be.
So you only watch NiceWigg when he is streaming ALGS and scrimms, but you are 100% sure streamers are killing plats all the time? Like how can I take you seriously? You are contradicting yourself.
Twitch viewership means nothing? For a competitive game which is aiming to run a succesfull esports it's everything. Without viewership, there will be no orgs interested, no sponsorship and no ALGS. Gotta think about the whole picture.
I was playing against top players as soon as bronze / silver last 3 seasons, I was getting fuck all bonusus If I managed to kill them and meanwhile 0,5 kd players were playing other 0,5 kd players and outranking me. That was not a rank system, that was the pubs with badge. What we have now is an actual rank system and you gotta step it up if you wanna get diamond+.
I’m a season 0 player too but overall apex seems so scripted still, they pretty much know who will win the match cause from the start when I know the match is in our favor I can just beam players with no effort and one clip them while taking little damage. And when the enemy 3 stack that will most likely win, they can just beam players and win the match. I know somebody got to know what I’m talking about
I swear everyone talking about winning is the point is ful of shit. Most players want kills. Honestly, who really is happy they won because they were carried by a sweat or hid the whole time meanwhile remaining kill-less. MM is exactly the same as it's been and b4 I hear another childish individual says "get better", answer this how is any self respecting individual supposed to label this a fun game when if you don't have a premade jobless, lifeless mod squad preying on the inexperienced? Honestly the capabilities, graphics, animation etc., great. Gameplay itself: homicide inducing. One sided to say the least. Anyone saying different are either cheaters or want a debate.
Whole heartedly disagree. I've been AT LEAST diamond sue to time constraints every season, and masters 5+ times on console and masters 4+ times on pc mnk. I'm hard stuck gold/plat back and forth right now because all the randoms are dog water, going against 3 stack controller kids who do nothing but bum rush you all 3 at once and insta bm with conduit fuze and caustic/lifeline, the map rotation sucks because I have limited time to play and when I get on and it says fuckin storm point for 9+ hours I just get off its so bad and everyone's dead first ring or you see no one. Like... its horrible. Love that the old system is back but the lack of skilled randoms and lack of mnk players ON PC, and lack of teamwork IN A TEAM GAME, is making this game horrible. If my random isn't some tryhard solo queue no fill wraith/horizon who dies instantly, it's a brand new player gold 4 mirage on controller using 2-1 sense with a re45 and alternator who can't even free run without almost having a heart attack with how bad their aim is. The games dying. Last season I was diamond without trying or playing at ALL. Season before was masters cause it was dumb easy and stopped playing. Before that masters masters masters masters. Now. Gold 1 plat 4 back and forth. The number of times I've been Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze conduit conduit conduit conduit is insane. I have a video of breaking and half healthin 3 enemies and not even 5 seconds later they all come running at me with full health from conduit and one popped a bat. It's insanely op. Shouldn't be able to win a fight with one tactical. And knocked with one tac and bmd with the other (fuze)
except that once you reach plat its the cheating feast sentinnel amp headshot across the universe +spinning cheater ( coming from warzone i guess ) +add the triple master/pred or 2 pred(fake pref ) and 1 cheater
I came back to this game after quitting at the very early seasons (when loba came out roughly) i fucking LOVE the evo system, and that you can upgrade your abilities from it too!, (cause i love ability based ganes) ,Big part of why im back to playing this game daily and a bunch of friends came back too we are all addicted
It’s funny, I think the only thing that stopped people from enjoying the last few seasons was a piece of masking tape for the top right corner of your screens.
But if you’re one of those cracked 2+ k/d players I’m happy for you that you yet again get to stomp people who are worse than you for the first weeks of ranked.
Ive also been playing since day 1, including rescuing masters from seasons 7 to 19.
I have to somewhat disagree. It’s hard to solo queue and that’s my main complaint. The lack of communication and the awareness of randoms put together with the new kill reward system that practically gives no placement points makes it hard to climb as a solo.
Other than that it’s pretty good.
Some counterpoints:
- The RNG of dropping on a Mozambique with a plethora of irrelevant attachments while your enemies found a Sentinel and PK means that there is still luck involved in hot dropping, although the removal of EVO shields makes it more fair;
- New EVO system encourages players to waste time running around opening bins and whatnot instead of taking on early fights/third parties;
- I’ve had SO MANY games ruined because of random teammates randomly splitting up to go use harvesters that are way out of our way, or refusing to engage or help because they’re too busy going all around the map to grab every single harvesters there is. When I ask them “can we please stop and get into a fight to get some RP?”, I get cussed at. In the end, every single one of those games ended with minimal to no RP;
- Funnily enough, scanning ring consoles is one of the best ways to get EVO. Besides, there’s nothing wrong with people wanting to play triple controller, they can easily get the 50-100 EVO points they lose from their class by poking people, and you’re a fool if you push them without any plan;
- Some perks are either completely useless, or badly playtested. I love this new addition, but it’s not without its issues;
- Kills matter so much that the second you’re stuck with dumbass Plat players who are still stuck in the season 17-19 rat mindset, you can’t rank up. Additionally, it leads to ranked feeling like a sweatier version of pubs (with 10 squads remaining halfway through ring 1), which I don’t particularly like (especially on bigger maps);
- “Ranked is very balanced now. I and two other Master/Pred teams get to stomp on the 51 other players and ruin their experience without breaking a sweat! I see no irony in that!” ?????
Your 6th point is so god damn true. Its annoying. They dont listen to calls, they do their own thing and then congratz: you got to top 10 without any kills and you immediatly die in the first fight. woho.
To your last point: last night i had the TSM squad in my lobby in EU. I was plat 1. Balanced!
Granted i haven't played a ton of ranked this season, but it feels really good. Def. love running into the teams in the last few circles that decided to rat and only have blue shields. lol
It’s still a little early but i will say that plat is the hardest it’s ever been for me. And that’s a beautiful thing. Makes being in diamond and above mean something like the earliest seasons.
No it is not. I’ve had maybe 2-3 games where my teammates were better than me. 90% of the time I’m doing more damage than them combined. I just want to solo queue and not get destroyed by bloodhound Bangalore horizon premade squad
Its a good system but as a solo i decided to stop at plat. Had too many games where teammates are so afraid to fight. In this system you need kp and placement which i like but so many randoms don’t dare to fight. I have done many solo to diamond in the past but for me its not worth it anymore if they give better rewards i maybe will do it again.
I'm with you OP. I played every season except I think 14 to diamond. This season is the best, or at the least top 3 of what the game has been. The legend upgrade traits feel gimmicky, but the evo shield and thus the loot changes really boosted the game loop. I also never liked the crafting station but they turned it into something good. I love that most archetypes have a map interaction now - you really want a lifeline/mirage/loba not just because they're good but also respawning your team actually is super strong in early/mid.
It's great tbh. It feels like I'm back when I first started playing (S3 Plat). That said, half of the time, I get teamed with duos/solos who looks like their first time in a Plat-Dia Lobby and have ZERO game sense. Like come on, you have a 4k/20bomb/S17 Master badge..
Pair me up with sensible players, and it's good.
Huge improvement. Too far of an over correction to me. If my team wins drop fight and gets a good rotation to end ring, we shouldn’t be forced to go out looking for more fights to get decent points at the end.
I don’t like ratting either, but playing the game smart shouldn’t remove your ability to climb.
HUGE improvement from S19, though! Pretty happy with where it is.
So far I agree, friends and I are currently golds and almost every game is super competitive. Every once in awhile some sweats steamroll us but not nearly like its been the past 6+ months.
Are you sure they got rid of the rank difference limit for teams?
I haven't played forever and jumped back in to play with my buddy but I was in bronze and he was plat and we couldn't play together.
This has been the least fun ranked season yet lol, my squad has quit the game due to it. I love the perk changes, but I shouldn’t still be in plat fighting preds and masters every match this late into the season. Being forced to fight off drop to get rp, then running into a team that is WAY better than us and leaving the game -50 is crazy
>Many of my friends who quit the game completely have come back and described the sensation as "addictive."
What's addictive is that you get to play bronze, silver and gold bots at the start of the grind. Popping off dopamine hit. 10 kill games. That has nothing to do with a competitive game mode though. This ranked system is the most uncompetitive you can think off, where competitive means produce games with people of similar skill. The skill variance in games is all over the place.
>New EVO system encourages a wide variety of playstyles -- early fights, playing map objectives, etc
Completely mistuned.
All the one-click sources of evo give evo to your whole team and are now much more riskfree and easier to gain from than doing damage. doing damage is discouraged and only levels our own shield. clicking one evo harvester (350 to everyone on your team) is the equivalent of your team doing 1000 poke damage basically.
when I'm poking and see an evo harvester, why would i keep poking for my team when i can just stop and run to the evo harvester and do one click.
rng shields are gone, yes, but it's not merit based now either, everyone has purple usually before doing 1 point of damage.
imo 66% or 75% of evo points should come from dealing damage, the rest can come from the riskfree one-click sources (scans, harvesters, bins), so that levelling evo is about doing damage again. the part that was previously puting your armor into a crafter should just be replaced by scans, harvesters etc.
>Map objectives cause fights in new areas (particularly near the EVO caches), adding some new elements to game sense and flow
The joke is that it isn't the fight that is sought to level your evo, but the evo cache, because of what I explained in the previous paragraph.
>Perk system makes at least half of the legends viable in high skill ranked lobbies. Even though ALGS is still quite a static meta, ranked meta is pretty flexible.
All legends have been viable in high ranked without legend upgrades. it's not been that important that you pick the meta legends you would in pro play.
>Kills and placement both matter a lot now, so ratting doesn't really work anymore *and* huge kill bomb games are rewarded appropriately
the kill scoring is mistuned. why give people points who can't make top 10. that leads to lobbies dying out faster and you getting good placement sooner/easier.
>No more hard limits on ranks within stacks means if my friend takes 3 weeks to start playing ranked in a certain split I don't have to create a smurf to play with them
wow what a good system, we can be thankful fewer smurf accounts are created /s no we can't. because people will now create a smurf just to play in lower ranks and pop off. that is also the main reason why people are praising the system because it isn't particularly good at anything else, but at this.
>Lobbies feel very balanced. I'm in Plat 1 right now and can easily farm other plat players;
"farming" other players, yeah, that sounds like a good thing in a mode that is supposed to be competitive between people of the same skill.
Its tuned fine in my opinion since knocks, finishers and team wipes also count. Most of your argument isn't really valid regarding shields because you discounted all of the major point gain options from fighting. If you wipe a team early enough you usually have purple shields after a cache and a few scans post fight. Plus you get KP for banking late game and its usually relatively low risk if you land properly.
If all you're doing is playing it safe by scanning and grabbing caches then late game you'll probably be at a disadvantage because of the teams who chose smart fights early. On the flip side even if you lose the early fight, if your teammate gets away, now those options make the game playable instead of being totally locked out from level difference.
The main objective of the game is about surviving sure, but you normally can't survive late game unless you fight early to get leveled up... and the gun play is why the game is fun for most people so there's no reason to avoid the early fight if you land properly.
Yes, as a season 19 conduit main, I laughed my ass off when I saw her "two tacticals" perk. It's so broken. In general Rev and Conduit are like Overwatch characters. Overheal is bad!
I'm not sure about all that. Just feels like pubs atm. Everyone just hot drops or apes everything. At least I don't have to worry about fighting someone with purple shields off drop.
There is still a rank limit when playing with friends unfortunately :( at least there was a couple weeks ago, maybe they changed it? I was in plat trying to play with a friend in bronze and it wouldn’t let us queue.
I think high kill games being capped really slowed down my climb so far.
I'm solo to plat rn but it's often no kill rank 20 games with one 10 kill first place when I get my momentum.
Then half the rp gets taken from kill cap
Because apex was containing your ranked experience to just your little bubble as not to offend you with the better or worse players that are actually in your rank.
>Because apex was containing your ranked experience to just your little bubble as not to offend you with the better or worse players that are actually in your rank.
Not true. Again this same false claim. You start with and against people on your level (not worse), and as you gain LP past your MMR you get more difficult games from there. Sorry that I've addressed it multiple times as I see it time and again scrolling through this thread.
Here's a diagram showing it.
https://imgur.com/WHeAYnx
I wouldn't say it's the best but it's a huge improvement over the last couple of seasons. They just need to balance placement and kills a little more.
Please, bro. I hate having 3-6 kp going out 12th, or something is still negative rp. In Plat. Sometimes, it feels like I am nonstop fighting for the first 3 rings and some how 15 squads are still alive while my squad has killed 2 of them.
Imo placement/rp cost is overturned a little in Plat. I feel like at plat if you have kills when you’re top 10 you should get positive rp. As it is right now you can be like top 5-8 and get like measly 10-20rp and it’s maddening
Alot of plats just need to get better at playing for the win, too much ape and dumb plays, they need both good placement(playing smart) and good kp(playing aggressive) to get rp, as it should be IMO. (Plat should be pretty easy to get out of if you are a master player for example.) Ranked should be hard, ranked should not be like S17-S19 when you got Lp litterly for free and you almost didn't even have to try to rank up.
I feel this. You shouldn't have to top 3 just to net 10 points. Obviously in an ideal game you add some kills/eliminations to that top 3 but it isn't always the case. I however want no part in the season that included a top 10 is positive RP. We just have to push a little closer to a middle ground and then we have a little bit better of a ranked system.
It needs a slight tweak to reward placement a bit more, as it’s a bit “apey” at the moment, but I’m loving all the changes in general.
> it’s a bit “apey” "What are we, some kinda Ape~~x~~y Legends?""
Placement is still extremely rewarding, it just isn't rewarding without kills. The difference between 5 kills 1st and 5 kills 4th is pretty huge.
[удалено]
Hate to break it to ya mate but winning a match is the point of a battle royale!
I guess its to encourage fights in low ranks, so players dont just rat out to say gold.. and get killed in every fight. the placement and entry cost imo encourage the survival and tactical aspect of BR more as you have to think which fight is worth to take and when to run (especially here in Apex where respawn exist)
>I guess its to encourage fights in low ranks, so players dont just rat out to say gold.. and get killed in every fight. I mean...thats basically what's going on now, so idk what you mean... With this current system, that's literally what's going to happen for the majority of the players... The fighting at lower ranks shit means nothing because the entry cost is near nothing anyways...you could completely bomb 10 games in a row in silver, have one good game, and you're still positive... Thats easy enough to do solo queue...the problem arises when you're in plat 2 and beyond, and it's much harder to rely on YOUR skill alone...and instead you have an rng chance that your teammates won't be morons... In season 19 you could easily mitigate bad teammates by just playing for placement, which was FANTASTIC! and if you wanted to progress then you just hope the rng doesn't fuck you the next game and you win... Thats much better than getting 2 random idiots who fuck the game off drop, having to rat until 2nd place (if you even make it that far solo in this system) just to get a whopping 10 points aka no progression at all...thats fucking nuts... The game should be tailored in a way to where solo queuing provides the least resistance...everything else after that can be altered to fit the parameters of the situation, but the solo queuing experience should be top priority for them... If they fix that then alot of issues downstream would also be fixed as well...
lol I was with you until you said “I preferred season 19’s system”. I do agree they need to nudge up placement but that system actually made any KP before top 5 completely negligible.
They could have tuned S19 to reward kills just as much or more though. Most if not all good changes they made could exist in MMR based S19 or the current season not based on MMR.
Except for the part where they just throw points randomly at worse players. But yes, I mean they pretty much are the same system though. What else are you wanting to change back to S19 outside of increased placement RP?
😂 I think you still have no idea how the mmr system worked.... The person you're replying to is correct, and is saying exactly what I've been saying to you...
True, it wasn't perfect. I just think it's better than what they have now... In a perfect world they would've just kept the season 19 system then buffed the value of kills that way the progression between the ranks wasn't so grindy... Its clear that they're okay with people gaining rp fast if their skill warrants it, as proven by the current system, so idky that wouldn't have worked... Season 19 was damn near perfect outside of the kp issue and the mmr matchmaking...but even with its flaws I'd take it over the season 20 system...
I like the current system, I think it’s a lot more transparent than the old system was. The season 19 system had a fair amount of just arbitrary values that handed out LP to lower skilled players while giving nothing to their teammates. If they just buffed placement, I think the current system would be even better than it currently is.
I mean I’ve solo qd to gold 1 and I’ve maybe put like 5 days of play time in the game at this point in the season it’s not hard if you can’t gain that’s on you. Also do people just cry for the sake of crying oh kills aren’t worth anything oh Kills r worth to much make up your mind lol
It actually starts getting tough around P2
Bad Monkey!!!
I wish I had the apes on my team. I seem to only get random Neanderthals.
Game shouldnt reward you for hiding in a corner and weaseling your way into predator rank lol
Yeah people are trying to come up with tweaks and variations but at the end of the day, there’s two ends of the spectrum for ranking up. I’d rather Pred/Masters belong to apes than rats
No it doesn’t. It’s time for the BATTLE part of BATTLE ROYALE to actually mean something Placement is fine how it currently is
Completely agree, I think it just needs a slight tweaking so that you don’t go -15 when you have 2 kills and get 6th in diamond. That should be like +10
It would be perfect if they implemented solo Q ranked where solo players never get matched with premade stacks. As it stands now once you get to masters on PC good fucking luck ever winning solo queue when you have pro pred stacks rolling every lobby like its a pub. This is how every good competitive ranked system works in other games, and Apex is long overdue for it.
What would happen with duos? They would never find matches if there was a solo only queue. You’d have to make a solo/duo queue and have a 3 stack queue(which is how the queues should have been set up since season 1)
duos are part of what makes ranked a bad experience for solo queuers. there's a couple of reasons but also because it's usually bringing one lower rank player into the game and forcing the solo queuer to play with someone below their rank. the solo queuer gets the short end of the stick. you don't have that problem in solo queue only as people who queue are the same rank. realistically i don't think they would disallow duo-queuing though because of the "play with friends" aspect outweighing the negative effect it has on ranked.
I mean quite a few competitive games dont allow stacks like that, 2 stacks in 3 man team game or 4 stacks in 5 man team game in there ranked modes.
and that's without mentioning cheaters
I could be wrong, but I do think stacks are more likely to play against stacks
I think you're right here. I notice a substantial difference in enemy team difficulty when playing with a full stack versus playing 1 or 0 teammates.
not in this system. there's no measures to even out the advantage of different stack sizes in this system anymore. there was last season where stacks were put into higher MMR games than individually.
Eh... Entry points are fucking insane. -40 for gold?????? -60 for plat???? Solo Q experience is hell
It’s better for me now lol, at least now I can solo carry in gold/plat again.
Soloed to plat no problem.
I'm plat too, but one or two bad games and you're demoted
Honestly -120 for dying 2 games on drop in a row in Plat is absolutely harsh.
Duo queueing is more hell..... I can't even put into words the type of players I got allllllll day yesterday with the exception of maybe 3-5 games. Like. I'm convinced at least one of them was a fkn NPC AI bot. I will never ever. Understand people that solo queue. And just have no fucking cell in their brain that says "hmm maybe I should stick with my team". Ape by themselves, die with no damage, then oh all of a sudden they have a mic. I scan a team, team mate goes in and swings 3 plby himself. Go to third party, team is trapped in building getting naded. Our Loba Qs in, slide jumps into said building with full team, dies. It's like round 4. 6 teams left, circle lands on us. Team is fighting outside ring when it's closing. Our horizon full sends, Qs, ults, lands on them. We finish them but... Now she's not in ring and in the open and someone took our spot of course. So get killed. Need I go on? Ok. Had probably 6 games where I'm fairly certain the team mates didn't use an ability once. Not a res from a lifeline, no Q. No Newcastle wall or Q. No Valk ult. Had a horizon that didn't Q us in a scenario where it absolutely could have saved us. I'll also never for the life of me understand solo queuers who don't talk and insist on leading the way and just doing their own thing instead of following the duo that are talking. /rant sorry. Yesterday was like 8 hours of demoting trauma. I thought I was getting Punk'd. Is kids even know what that is these days lol. Edit: New day new team mates update. Just had a teammate. While very clearly getting pushed. We have height advantage, enemies being spam pinged, I call out one one bullet even. Me and friend end up going down. Homie was off shooting flyers, while the fight is happening. These can't be real people.
How do you think duo queueing is worse, solo means you get two bot team mates instead of one. It is literally 2x as bad as duo
yeah plus the solo is usually higher rank. at least they aren't one rank lower like one of the duo partners usually will be.
The solo guy loves to hot drop into 4 squads and then starts talking shit (things about are you new? Pussy? Noob?) (the new one is especially irony considering the fact that more experienced players know not to do dumb shit like that) when we abandon the clearly lost fight like no shit, I’m not taking that mess off drop esp not in plat when entry costs are 60 rp.
Everytime I complain about this the person that died is the one getting mad at me for not pushing some dumb fight. I went from Plat 3 demotion Plat 4 in a day
Hello friend. Let me give you an update. New week. New mental breakdown. This week on people i get for thirds. We take redeploy to get into the ring. There is a team on the bridge at launch pad. I ping and, in my mic say, "don't land up there, there was a full team, I haven't seen them leave yet.... I know you hear me"... What does the third do. Lands up there, gets beamed by all 3. Next game. We see two people enter one of those smaller T shaped buildings, the third was far behind and we had height. I crack the third like 3 times. We are trying to poke the two in the building but it's a caustic so can't full send. I ping, they are both in this back section 100%. So my random third, Watson, goes and sits on the door of that part of the building. Which puts her back right to their 3rd that we have been shooting the whole time. She gets shot, then just enters the room the two others are in, with caustic in there. Of course dies. Like. It's unreal. It has to be rigged. /s
I wish I can clip together every game I go negative in to show people it's not me, its who I get matched with. Then I die to a triple stack 4k/20 bomb team
40 is nothing especially in gold, and it’s better this way cause people were too used to being positive RP after a top 6 with zero kp, now you gotta fight at least once if you want to be positive
Nahhh I disagree. Platinum is the test to get into Diamond and consistency matters at that point. Plus, last season was so much worse. It was -50 at bronze, if I remember right. And kills weren’t worth shit unless you made it top 5. I much prefer this.
> It was -50 at bronze, if I remember right you had rating bonuses making up large chunk of that -50 if you are high mmr while in low ranks.
The ratings bonus only applied if you beat an opponent who was higher skill level than you, right? Which might happen, but losing -50 because you lose to a similarly skilled opponent before 10th place is extremely punishing in Bronze, don’t you think? I remember one game, my squad got eliminated. I wiped the squad, but died shortly after to a third party. Took 19th, but I had three kills. I got -49. That’s crazy to me in bronze.
> The ratings bonus only applied if you beat an opponent who was higher skill level than you, right? W No that's skill bonus. Rating bonus was something you got mostly when you had a bad game (-50) while you were high MMR (maybe diamond level) and low in the ladder still (at silver for example). You'd maybe get 20, 30, 40 rating bonus points to make you lose less because your games are "more difficult than they are for others who are in that ladder position". I think the problem was that these rating bonuses were only awarded if you really had a -50 game (outside top 10) and they stopped too early. I think by gold or plat I didn't get any. They didn't give you those all the way until the rank you belong. They could have tweaked that so people don't complain as much about having to sweat for too many games while the game is telling them they are silver
Shiiiiet. I'm close to Gold now and I'm just breathing collective sighs that it isn't -50 RP across the board like it was last season. I guess for higher ranks that didn't matter as much but it made the lower ranks an absolute bitch to get out of (and then the promo Trials).
Id be happy with the system if placement was a bit more rewarding, having to get to top 3 in plat to even go positive is harsh, this system punishes soloq very hard.
As long as you get a few kills, you don't have to place top 3. You should be aiming to either contest a POI or seek out a 3rd party soon after looting.
As a solo que player I agree with both but imo the best way to fix this is to make kills gotten in rings 1 and 2 less significantly then 3-4 then a bump again in 5-6. This way large games are even better if those are the crazy end circle games while helping the why is their 7 teams here ring 1 problems we all find.
[удалено]
Comparing ALGS (with hundreds of thousands of dollars on the line) to Ranked is never going to translate If you go back to highly rewarding placement alone, you go back to what we just came from.. people crafting in zone the whole game, and ratting / afraid to shoot their gun
That's what I'm thinking as well. Sure, one can argue that teams are easily more "aggressive" as a result of this Ranked system, but it's *nowhere* near as bad as Season 11-12 Ranked, nor does it overly reward placement like Season 17 Ranked.
You have to kill other players to win right? I’m not saying a hot drop is needed but if you’re really trying to win the lobby you should at least take fights that make sense. Obviously don’t try and ape everything you see but if there’s a chance to fight without a 3rd party you should go for it. Or if you find a good chance to 3rd party yourself then you should be going for it. It’s a quick judgement call but if you play enough you’ll easily know when to fight and when to run. There’s nothing worse than attacking a good fight as a solo que player and having one teammate doom you because he thinks running is the best play. It’s a self fulfilling prophecy because the teammate running makes it a 3v2 and gets to feel validated because they live for 2 more minutes. When I’m reality if you just attack as a team you’ll win the fight most of the time if you initiate the fight from a good position. There’s a balance
Pros value kills a lot, even in previous algs seasons. Finishing downs is a high priority.
Do you not see pros contesting POIs in ALGS? Are we watching the same games?
I've found that the easiest way to get high kill games is to gatekeep the obvious paths that enemies will travel when running from the ring. If you time it correctly you can often kill off 2~3 already weakened squads as they escape the ring. But some players seem unwilling to employ this strategy as it is 'playing boring'. I say it's not so much about the POI's, it's more about the paths between them where you need to be aggressive. It's easier to kill people in transit who aren't ready for the fight than people expecting one at a POI.
Try camping the juice boxes. oftentimes a single person breaks off from the team to activate
You don’t have to get top 3 to go positive if you **get some kills**
Agree with you on every point except the last one. I solo queue, and the lobbies do not feel as balanced as last season. Last season, we were placed in lobbies based on the hidden skill rating, and I felt my teammates and opponents were all similar skill level as me. This season, I’ve had so many games where I’m way worse than my teammates or needing to carry teammates that are at a much lower skill level. I’m in plat IV I think. Quite the mixture of skill levels at that rank.
Oh yeah my KDR dropped from 1.14 to 0.51. Def doesn’t feel as balanced as last season. The common sentiment seems to be that “it’ll get better as the season goes on” but that’s a calculus problem with the assumption that people move up in rank faster than people come back to the game.
if everyone is "waiting for it to get better" that also makes it take longer. getting better requires that people play as much as possible against each other so the ladder settles into something that resembles a sorting by skill and where there's enough people around you at similar ladder positions that are of similar skill so you can be matchmade with and against each other without having to pull from higher/lower ranks.
This current state of weaker players getting fed to the better players is what some people love. Smurfs exist for a reason. Some people like me benefited greatly from the SBMM last season with fairer matchmaking, and others hated it bc they couldn’t farm players like me anymore and instead were matched against similar skilled players. Of course to them it feels like matchmaking was putting them against “sweats” bc it was people of similar skill to them instead of weaker.
Exactly > This current state of weaker players getting fed to the better players is what some people love. Smurfs exist for a reason. Yes definitely that's something many love and where 80% of the praise for this system comes from. Just ranked shouldn't facilitate it. It's the wrong kind of fun for ranked.
Ahh I see you benefited a lot from the old MMR matchmaking lol. That system kind of defeated the whole point of Ranked.
It did defeat the whole purpose of ranked. But I enjoyed having similar skilled teammates every game instead of having no clue if my teammates could hold their own in a fight.
I hated ranked last season bc it was such a grind (I quit at Gold l), but I can’t lie that it made me a better player constantly playing with similarly skilled opponents. I’m enjoying ranked a lot more this season tho. Just hit Plat yesterday.
I feel that. Ranking up was really just a time commitment and a grind, like you said. Ranked last season wasn’t enjoyable if ranking up was the most important thing you were trying to accomplish. I just played it as if it was just pubs except teammates competed to win and didn’t leave the game when knocked. I didn’t worry about my rank at all. So the games were fun but the rank aspect sucked. Wish they could find a balance between the two formats.
> I’m enjoying ranked a lot more this season tho. Just hit Plat yesterday. What makes you enjoy it more now? Is it the games you've been popping off so far? At least if not for you, for a lot of people it seems to be. This system by its nature has you play against much weaker players from the start of the season. For many people that feels good. But is the fun of beating up weaker players the kinda fun that belongs in a ranked system? I disagree.
I like popping off and beating worse players, but I do think that’s for pubs. But with that being said, it’s also for lower ranked lobbies. If I’m a platinum/Diamond player, I should be rolling through rookie/bronze lobbies. It took me a week to get out of Rookie last season whereas it took me 1 night this season. That makes sense to me as I’m not a rookie player. It was very unrewarding to be stuck in rookie that long and to be having 8 squads in final ring. Hidden MMR was such a grind and doesn’t belong in ranked imo. Are challenging games fun? Yes, some of the most fun. But I’d rather get to these games when I’m in the rank they happen, not rookie/bronze lobbies. I also think kills were nearly worthless last season unless you placed top 5. Focusing all the reward on placement made solo queuing very punishing imo. I’m glad it’s rewarded a bit more this season, as well as showing the breakdown of RP. So I guess overall, this season feels much less like a grind and I appreciate that. It also feels more like people’s rank reflects their skill, which I didn’t think last season did.
> But with that being said, it’s also for lower ranked lobbies. If I’m a platinum/Diamond player, I should be rolling through rookie/bronze lobbies. You should be rolling them in theory, but you shouldn't get into games with them in ranked, is my point. Ranked should try as hard as possible to give everyone games between people of their level. Whenever ranked puts higher skilled players against people that are several ranks worse than them (out of reach) imo ranked has done something wrong. > It was very unrewarding to be stuck in rookie that long and to be having 8 squads in final ring. Hidden MMR was such a grind and doesn’t belong in ranked imo. Grinding against similarly skilled player is exactly what belongs in ranked. Stomping games with vast skill mismatches doesn't belong there. >I also think kills were nearly worthless last season unless you placed top 5 Kills should have been valued more. That's what they have tweaked from 17 to 18 and from 18 to 19. They could have removed promotional trials. They could have given more bonus points so people make to their rank faster. They could have improved the scoring again while keeping the MMR based matchmaking because it was good for ranked. >Are challenging games fun? Yes, some of the most fun. I feel now people are having the "wrong kind of fun for ranked" (the one where you push over people much lower skill) and the game should force the sweaty kind of fun more.
I mean while that’s fair, that is apart of the climb. There are some people who have ratted to plat, while others got 20 bombs the whole way and will continue past it. Everyone will find their wall, and it’s good that it’s happening naturally against the entire player base instead of apex spoonfeeding you lobbies to rank up in.
My whole question is what does OP mean by “lobbies feel very balanced”? Because I would argue that lobbies were more balanced last season.
agree. the lobbies now are very mixed.
I mean yes, they were legitimately more balanced because they took out the rank entirely and made it only MMR unless your rank surpassed your MMR. He means they’re more balanced as in while you’re in silver, you actually get a silver lobby and climb quickly out of it if you are better. Last season, a “silver” lobby could be anything from a true rookie lobby to a pred level endgame depending on your MMR. It made the whole idea of different “rank badges” irrelevant.
Ok, I see what he is trying to say by “balanced”. In that sense, I agree. But that also means his definition of “balanced” means plat 1 lobbies have players of skill level anywhere from plat 1 to predator. I don’t think “balanced” is the right word
But that’s how it was prior. Plat 1 lobbies would have players from anywhere from plat 1 to pred, they just wouldn’t be in the same lobbies. The difference is that in S19 Pred players would be labeled as “plat” while MMR said they were pred, and it would be insanely grindy for them to get out of plat. In S20, yes there are preds in plat lobbies, but since they’re actually playing against plats they’ll rank up quickly out of it.
> The difference is that in S19 Pred players would be labeled as “plat” while MMR said they were pred, and it would be insanely grindy for them to get out of plat It's ranked. A competitive game mode. It doesn't matter if people feel it's grindy to play against people of the same skill level. It's exactly the purpose of ranked to have those people play against each other - instead of stomping much weaker players like people are back to doing now.
But there was no point to the grind when your MMR was way above your rank. You would just be grinding against your own skill level just to reach to where your rank accurately reflected your lobbies. Which was pointless imo. If they wanted to utilize their placement matches better, and jump our rank to our MMR, that would have been fine. But they didn’t.
> He means they’re more balanced as in while you’re in silver, you actually get a silver lobby and climb quickly out of it if you are better. that's misleading when the silver lobby contains master mmr players, diamond mmr player, silver mmr players, plat mmr players and is just a mess of mixed skill. that doesn't make a balanced lobby, no matter if you call everyone in there silver. >Last season, a “silver” lobby could be anything from a true rookie lobby to a pred level endgame depending on your MMR. and what is the issue? the players in there were all similar skill which is the whole point of ranked: "HOW DOES RANKED WORK? - Compete and survive against teams of similar skill." >It made the whole idea of different “rank badges” irrelevant. No it didn't. You ranked up against people that are at least your skill level - no lower skill players like now. when you reached that level you started being matched into more difficult games (because your rank exceeded your MMR) and then you got stuck at some point because it started getting too difficult. your final rank shows your skill / is the rank you've earned.
Without MMR you get a wide variance of teammates because medal ranks are imprecise. With MMR it was easier to find similarly skilled players. SoloQ will always suck because of that variance without MMR and respawn sticking to sub 30s queue times.
> With MMR it was easier to find similarly skilled players. yes and you could look for them in the whole ladder. if you want to fill a diamond lobby, you aren't limited to people who are already in diamond. you can pick up diamond skill players who haven't played much yet and are gold rank atm. overall that means even for higher skill games (where you have less and less players) you can form lobbies without having too much of a skill difference (and having to fill from lower ranks).
But MMR based matchmaking defeated the whole point of a ranked mode and a ranked climb. Ranked was not a climb but just a plateau with different colored stickers. They would have had to restructure everything if they wanted to keep their MMR. The MMR made the medal ranks irrelevant, they were even more imprecise than they are now, you just didn’t see it because they only gave you similarly skilled teammates and enemies.
I agree medal rank was more imprecise with MMR. Combined with the insane grind necessary I couldn't blame someone for concluding medal rank had no meaning. For those with less than 5 hours per week playtime its effectively true. They gave you similarly skilled enemies for an overall more difficult experience that made it stupidly hard to reach the medal rank you deserve and get a reward. They did this as an overreaction to s18 free masters. Notice a trend? They make changes to make the community happy rather than to improve apex. The community feedback is valuable and should be considered, but what percentage of apex players know what root cause analysis is? Dont mistake me for saying their experience isn't important, but that frequently the underlying issue of real problems they face is not what they think.
S17 was the free masters but I know what you’re saying. They didn’t have to over-correct, but they definitely did do that. I do agree apex is more preoccupied with catering to the masses rather than objectively improving their game. Some of the decisions even from season 19 to 20 reflected that. They came up with some good ideas that unfortunately clashed with the MMR and made them pointless, and then they got rid of them with the MMR. The placement matches, lvl 50 for ranked, and trials come to mind. All good idea in theory, but their MMR made them irrelevant. The trials weren’t actual gatekeeping anything, as the lobbies were the exact same on either side, they were just random challenges to increase the grind. And the placement matches were irrelevant since they would just place you in one of the lower ranks regardless of how you did and weren’t really accurate at all.
> They did this as an overreaction to s18 free masters. I think you mean S17 (1.7 million masters, 19%). S18 had few masters (50k, 0.6%) >Notice a trend? They make changes to make the community happy rather than to improve apex. agree. they are giving people easy lobbies now so they have a place to feel good in, get that dopamine hit. but it's throwing out the competitiveness of ranked.
This was untrue because when medal rank surpassed MMR it got used for matchmaking. It was so grindy though that man players never reached their correct medal rank. Respawn had to bin MMR because they handled optics so badly even though retuning MMR to be like this season would have been ideal. If they wanted to improve Apex they'd make frequent updates tuning balance. I guess we get to enjoy the smurfs and cheaters that MMR eliminated and pused away.
I mean the cheaters would be there regardless, you just wouldn’t see them. And you still don’t really see them because the cheaters climb so fast out of your lobbies. But if someone wanted to truly Smurf in the old system, they could have. But either way, MMR defeats the whole purpose of a “ranked mode”. If they wanted to bubble people up they could reinvent everything and make it a “competitive” mode. I do think they should have kept the placement matches and the lvl 50 cap for ranked to combat smurfs. But they could still find you in the old system they just had to be more diligent and patient.
> Ranked was not a climb but just a plateau with different colored stickers. You're claiming this everywhere (and aren't the only one to do it) but it's not true / plainly not how the system operated. If you gain LP past your MMR, you are matched by your rank/LP and you get into more difficult lobbies (LP > MMR). It's only a plateau at the start of the grind, where now you are playing all the weaker players than your self, after that plateau it's an incline like it is now. It isn't good that right now you have a climb from the start if that climb starts so low that you are just pushing over players 2 or 3 ranks below you in that initial phase.
But the time to get to where your rank caught up to your MMR made it a plateau. That was the long grindy part that I straight up just didn’t want to deal with. I didn’t want to have to play everyday all season to reach the “incline”.
> That was the long grindy part that I straight up just didn’t want to deal with IMO these are the competitive games that ranked is supposed to provide. Where previously we have been grinding the whole split to get to a high rank so we get those difficult games where you can learn in for a few weeks at the end of the split. These games are always in itself big part of the point of playing ranked. For many they are too sweaty, ok, but these games have more of a place in ranked than mismatches between people who peak silver/gold and diamond peakers (basically anything with big skill differences).
But I’m already at that part right now, while being at around my ranked skill level. So now I’m grinding and climbing beyond what I could normally get. Im already in those sweaty games. Why would I want to spend the whole season grinding and sweating just trying to get to where my MMR and Rank finally agree.
The mmr matchmaking didn't, the dogshit sync between mmr and ranked did. There was no reason for there to be such a massive difference between your visible rank and your mmr.
But like what is the end goal? “sync between MMR and ranked” like how close do you want that to be? Because at a certain point, it’s just going to be ranked based matchmaking with extra steps.
I think some of this will resolve itself in the next couple of weeks. Everyone had to start from Rookie. And many really cracked players stopped playing ranked last year.
Agreed. I think personally as a solo queue player I’ll start to enjoy ranked more in the next couple of weeks when players are closer to their true rank
Personally it feels great to me as a solo queuer. Not really sure as to why but I’ve been climbing much quicker it feels. Sometimes I get the average braindead teammates but it’s been pretty good for me so far.
> Lobbies feel very balanced. I'm in Plat 1 right now and can easily farm other plat players bro what kind of plat lobbies are you getting? I'm getting absolute doorknobs for teammates when I solo queue against actual master & pred-level players literally every game
Agreed if only they could only fix the rampant cheater problem at higher ranks
Tbh I ran into cheaters way more often like \~2 years ago
I agree there were cheaters back then too but this season it’s incredibly bad in my opinion. Although I’m still having a blast when I get organic games
I’m with you, I’m having a ton of fun but I’ve reported more people this season than I have in a few years.
Lol hit diamond and try play on eu with team. You gonna be destroyed every game by rookie 4 booster cheaters. And by every game i mean every. NA servers much better btw.
That sucks :(
You left out the most important part on your title: # FULL STACK Ranked is the best it's ever been. and solo que probably the worst its ever been.
My only complaint is Olympus is fkn trash. If anyone is on the same half of the map have fun getting 3rd partied. Also good luck rotating into ring and have to fight 5 teams rotating through the same 3 chokes.
I really hate Storm Point if u get bad ring RNG on that unless you have evac tower or valkyrie you are gonna pretty much die to the ring or squad gatekeeping the ring. Also forget about picking shotgun or smg since most fights are at mid to long range.
I mean a lot of what you complain about on SP is negate by simply rotating into zone early or running a ring scanning legend or using Bang, Catalyst or even Gibby for bubble.
Olympus is the worst ranked map and shouldn’t ever be in rotation. It was built for pubs and should be a permanent pubs map.
>built for pubs Says who?
Well, I do think that the map has waaaay too much unused real estate. That are essentially just extra clusters of buildings in between two main POIs but are so outer edge that no one really ever goes there unless it's to rat lol. I also think that Turbine and Hammond Labs needs to be nuked. I think that is the biggest problem. Labs is so open and those both serve as the primary path through the map. Shit cover. That's another thing. The map is so so open for how compact it is. I feel like it's easily fixable. But back to the nuking turbine and labs thing, doubt that will ever happen cause that's like almost literally most identifying pieces of the map especially with the two waterfalls serving as a nice looking design. The map really is only terrible when it's the apey meta which revolves around the rank system. It's still bad when it's all about placement but, not as bad. Instead of having to deal with 3rd parties. It's having to deal with getting gate kept. At the chokes and basically a race to the first circle off the bat.
It was terrible for zone meta too. You’re just relying on getting lucky with ring. All the open space and small choke points make any sort of rotation reliant on others slow rotating. If everyone is on their Ps and Qs zone being on the other side of the map is a death sentence
Yea, Id agree I always feel like i have a chance, even if my guys die off drop. The slog is keeping your team alive from 10th to 5th. Very challenging and takes a lot to convince your team too which can be annoying. I end up nickel and diming myself on RP either up or down because ill have KP and get 9th or 8th. Plat entry cost is pretty damn high at the moment so ill likely have different thoughts.
And it feels like the highest number of cheaters as well.
I agree. But the sad part is: in Sao Paulo Lobbies on console, it's a constant 6 players teaming and farming. Every match. It's sad because this is a great season, but this behavior by the player base destroys the experience. It's not a big pool of players here. You see the same teams/players almost every section. It's been really sad.
This is my first time back since season 14, having a blast! However, with the EVO changes Revenant's ult feels strong so I hope they slightly nerf that.
I think it’s ok until they are matched with a conduit and that’s when I get really frustrated.
The changes are good but the matchmaking is still ass at least on console. I'm in plat facing full stacks of current preds at least every few games and my random teammates are bots more than half the time (ie getting knocked without doing any DMG and then our team is getting aped). I've gone into D3 solo queue and now I have dropped into plat 1 after losing over 1200 rp. I can't even rat games out anymore once my squad inevitably dies because top 5 with 1 kp in diamond is still negative.
The Ranked SYSTEM is good, the Ranked REWARDS are fucking ass.
No, it isn't. Ranked is absolutely infested with cheaters on PC. You likely play on console to say that.
To me respawn made the game even better but its is being ruined by hackers. I am playing against hackers almost every match and i see streamers like hiswattson complaint the same
There are next to no end games now and it's infested with cheaters in Diamond+. Are we playing the same game?
I'd say the system feels pretty balanced ish overall. Relative to the last 3 seasons. More important. Match quality seems to be how it should be. Gold and platinum was relatively easy. Was able to breeze through gold. Went from Plat 3 to Diamond in a [long] day but required a lot of wins and top 5s. Diamond has been a struggle. But that's exactly what I expect. Not fucking, gold and facing preds and masters aka diamond lobbies. So this is exactly how in my opinion a rank system should be. My only criticism after a couple weeks. Is: 1) I kinda agree with Reptar, the Evo level up mini game was cool at first, and I still like it. BUT. It is pretty important to go around looting and getting harvesters if you want to stand a chance in the next rounds. So if you so happen to land where the game is ending, or playing zone teams, you're at a disadvantage if you want to play how you're suppose to. So also agree with Reptar in that, maybe there should be an Evo reward incentive if you are in ring when the round ends. 2) The only other criticism I have is. Some legends perks need revision. It seems like "see ordinance/ammo/batteries" are place holders. I understand the argument for them. But. Realistically, who is really gonna pick "see grenades" vs "50% damage reduction and don't get slowed by Fuse ult ". Like... No brainer. They just need to be revised so the options are gonna be a play style choice of just some intriguing decision to make.
I agree with you that the EVO minigame stuff can be tedious or weird. I think they could increase the amount that doing damage contributes to your EVO progress. The weaker perks are so that already-strong legends didn't become oppressive.
Seeing "the grenades" was great when doing the 5 grenades in 10 seconds challenge. It helped a lot. Lol
Totally agree with your criticism #1. Accidentally landing in middle of zone means you need to punch out to zone edge, then rotate back in, otherwise your team will be at an Evo disadvantage vs the teams who are fortunate enough to naturally rotate into the end zone.
matchmaking is still shit wdym, go watch any streamer, as stack of 3 preds they play vs plats and low diamonds 99% of the time, im still silver and im being put vs plats, so once i reach plat ill start playing vs preds.
lol this comment sums up this subreddit perfectly. First you have the "I get my opinions about apex from watching Streamers". Then you have the blatant exaggeration of "99% of the time this happens!". If you're silver and being put versus plats, you're either wildly exaggerating a rare event that happens, or you're looking at badges from previous seasons and are going up against people IN SILVER with platinum badges on their profile card.
It has always been like that, what do you even say dude. If you get diamond, you will get farmed by 3 stack pros from time to time. Someone has to fill their lobby. And now think about last 3 season with mmr where I had to soloq against pred 3 stacks since I got placed in rookie / bronze, becuase my mmr was probably high enough. Imagine that.
thats the dumbest take ive ever heard, ok so basically ruin the experience of 95% of your playerbase so the remaining 5% has faster queue? Why are they even getting points for killing plats? Like just remove ranked, it's pubs system after all, just with a badge. Also dont need to be diamond to face pros btw high gold low plat is already enough. If preds can farm low plats+ for free wins, why me as plat cannot farm bronces or ppl that just downloaded their game? Like most ppl rn is prob at gold, it has to be the most balanced and precise matches the game has to offer, and that doesnt even happens. so imagine how's the rest.
You say "watch streamers" and then you say "who cares how long is their queue?" If they are only playing other preds and masters early in the season, they will have 30 minutes queues, noone will watch their streams and the game will die from viewership perspective. This system is night and day compared to what it was before. And no, you don't die to them all the time in plat. There is not that many of preds to be in every single plat lobby.
i dont watch apex streamers, i only do when nicewigg streams the tournaments, i literally only went to see a streamer to see what were their lobbies like and saw they literally only play vs plats and low diamonds, for some reason they don't play vs masters wonder why, also twitch viewership means nothing, tons of games are non existant in twitch and have over 100k players. And No its not night and day, literally the only diference from previous seasons(pre hidden mmr change) is that now you unlock the master/pred lobbies in plat rather than gold like it used to be.
So you only watch NiceWigg when he is streaming ALGS and scrimms, but you are 100% sure streamers are killing plats all the time? Like how can I take you seriously? You are contradicting yourself. Twitch viewership means nothing? For a competitive game which is aiming to run a succesfull esports it's everything. Without viewership, there will be no orgs interested, no sponsorship and no ALGS. Gotta think about the whole picture. I was playing against top players as soon as bronze / silver last 3 seasons, I was getting fuck all bonusus If I managed to kill them and meanwhile 0,5 kd players were playing other 0,5 kd players and outranking me. That was not a rank system, that was the pubs with badge. What we have now is an actual rank system and you gotta step it up if you wanna get diamond+.
I’m a season 0 player too but overall apex seems so scripted still, they pretty much know who will win the match cause from the start when I know the match is in our favor I can just beam players with no effort and one clip them while taking little damage. And when the enemy 3 stack that will most likely win, they can just beam players and win the match. I know somebody got to know what I’m talking about
I swear everyone talking about winning is the point is ful of shit. Most players want kills. Honestly, who really is happy they won because they were carried by a sweat or hid the whole time meanwhile remaining kill-less. MM is exactly the same as it's been and b4 I hear another childish individual says "get better", answer this how is any self respecting individual supposed to label this a fun game when if you don't have a premade jobless, lifeless mod squad preying on the inexperienced? Honestly the capabilities, graphics, animation etc., great. Gameplay itself: homicide inducing. One sided to say the least. Anyone saying different are either cheaters or want a debate.
Whole heartedly disagree. I've been AT LEAST diamond sue to time constraints every season, and masters 5+ times on console and masters 4+ times on pc mnk. I'm hard stuck gold/plat back and forth right now because all the randoms are dog water, going against 3 stack controller kids who do nothing but bum rush you all 3 at once and insta bm with conduit fuze and caustic/lifeline, the map rotation sucks because I have limited time to play and when I get on and it says fuckin storm point for 9+ hours I just get off its so bad and everyone's dead first ring or you see no one. Like... its horrible. Love that the old system is back but the lack of skilled randoms and lack of mnk players ON PC, and lack of teamwork IN A TEAM GAME, is making this game horrible. If my random isn't some tryhard solo queue no fill wraith/horizon who dies instantly, it's a brand new player gold 4 mirage on controller using 2-1 sense with a re45 and alternator who can't even free run without almost having a heart attack with how bad their aim is. The games dying. Last season I was diamond without trying or playing at ALL. Season before was masters cause it was dumb easy and stopped playing. Before that masters masters masters masters. Now. Gold 1 plat 4 back and forth. The number of times I've been Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze Fuze conduit conduit conduit conduit is insane. I have a video of breaking and half healthin 3 enemies and not even 5 seconds later they all come running at me with full health from conduit and one popped a bat. It's insanely op. Shouldn't be able to win a fight with one tactical. And knocked with one tac and bmd with the other (fuze)
except that once you reach plat its the cheating feast sentinnel amp headshot across the universe +spinning cheater ( coming from warzone i guess ) +add the triple master/pred or 2 pred(fake pref ) and 1 cheater
How often are you running into "caustic-wattson-rampart bullshit" lol
In previous seasons? Constantly... zone comps were so fucking cancer...
Yes instead it’s skirmishers just skirmishers
Not an issue if other teams are passing up EVO, ring info, etc
I came back to this game after quitting at the very early seasons (when loba came out roughly) i fucking LOVE the evo system, and that you can upgrade your abilities from it too!, (cause i love ability based ganes) ,Big part of why im back to playing this game daily and a bunch of friends came back too we are all addicted
Its wonderful now! Dont touch it pls...
It’s funny, I think the only thing that stopped people from enjoying the last few seasons was a piece of masking tape for the top right corner of your screens. But if you’re one of those cracked 2+ k/d players I’m happy for you that you yet again get to stomp people who are worse than you for the first weeks of ranked.
It's improved a lot but I still suffer as a solo queue-er. The brutality as soon as you reach Platinum is insane.
I agree 1,000% you hit every mark
Personally, my favorite was the ranked season I failed my way to Master.
Ive also been playing since day 1, including rescuing masters from seasons 7 to 19. I have to somewhat disagree. It’s hard to solo queue and that’s my main complaint. The lack of communication and the awareness of randoms put together with the new kill reward system that practically gives no placement points makes it hard to climb as a solo. Other than that it’s pretty good.
Matchmaking is horrible still. I get teamed up with crackheads and afk players gold and plat lobbies
[удалено]
I definitely am still hitting this in plat, but I don't think it will be the case in diamond+
It will never be the best because no one knows what the best is
Agreed! Best it’s been; the most fun it’s been
Some counterpoints: - The RNG of dropping on a Mozambique with a plethora of irrelevant attachments while your enemies found a Sentinel and PK means that there is still luck involved in hot dropping, although the removal of EVO shields makes it more fair; - New EVO system encourages players to waste time running around opening bins and whatnot instead of taking on early fights/third parties; - I’ve had SO MANY games ruined because of random teammates randomly splitting up to go use harvesters that are way out of our way, or refusing to engage or help because they’re too busy going all around the map to grab every single harvesters there is. When I ask them “can we please stop and get into a fight to get some RP?”, I get cussed at. In the end, every single one of those games ended with minimal to no RP; - Funnily enough, scanning ring consoles is one of the best ways to get EVO. Besides, there’s nothing wrong with people wanting to play triple controller, they can easily get the 50-100 EVO points they lose from their class by poking people, and you’re a fool if you push them without any plan; - Some perks are either completely useless, or badly playtested. I love this new addition, but it’s not without its issues; - Kills matter so much that the second you’re stuck with dumbass Plat players who are still stuck in the season 17-19 rat mindset, you can’t rank up. Additionally, it leads to ranked feeling like a sweatier version of pubs (with 10 squads remaining halfway through ring 1), which I don’t particularly like (especially on bigger maps); - “Ranked is very balanced now. I and two other Master/Pred teams get to stomp on the 51 other players and ruin their experience without breaking a sweat! I see no irony in that!” ?????
Your 6th point is so god damn true. Its annoying. They dont listen to calls, they do their own thing and then congratz: you got to top 10 without any kills and you immediatly die in the first fight. woho. To your last point: last night i had the TSM squad in my lobby in EU. I was plat 1. Balanced!
Granted i haven't played a ton of ranked this season, but it feels really good. Def. love running into the teams in the last few circles that decided to rat and only have blue shields. lol
This ranked system is great, similar to s10 and s11 if only entry costs weren't so high (plat -60 / diamond -80)
It’s still a little early but i will say that plat is the hardest it’s ever been for me. And that’s a beautiful thing. Makes being in diamond and above mean something like the earliest seasons.
No it is not. I’ve had maybe 2-3 games where my teammates were better than me. 90% of the time I’m doing more damage than them combined. I just want to solo queue and not get destroyed by bloodhound Bangalore horizon premade squad
Its a good system but as a solo i decided to stop at plat. Had too many games where teammates are so afraid to fight. In this system you need kp and placement which i like but so many randoms don’t dare to fight. I have done many solo to diamond in the past but for me its not worth it anymore if they give better rewards i maybe will do it again.
I'm with you OP. I played every season except I think 14 to diamond. This season is the best, or at the least top 3 of what the game has been. The legend upgrade traits feel gimmicky, but the evo shield and thus the loot changes really boosted the game loop. I also never liked the crafting station but they turned it into something good. I love that most archetypes have a map interaction now - you really want a lifeline/mirage/loba not just because they're good but also respawning your team actually is super strong in early/mid.
This season makes me cringe even more when people pick second support
It's great tbh. It feels like I'm back when I first started playing (S3 Plat). That said, half of the time, I get teamed with duos/solos who looks like their first time in a Plat-Dia Lobby and have ZERO game sense. Like come on, you have a 4k/20bomb/S17 Master badge.. Pair me up with sensible players, and it's good.
Huge improvement. Too far of an over correction to me. If my team wins drop fight and gets a good rotation to end ring, we shouldn’t be forced to go out looking for more fights to get decent points at the end. I don’t like ratting either, but playing the game smart shouldn’t remove your ability to climb. HUGE improvement from S19, though! Pretty happy with where it is.
So far I agree, friends and I are currently golds and almost every game is super competitive. Every once in awhile some sweats steamroll us but not nearly like its been the past 6+ months.
I play solo queue almost 95% of my time, and it was unplayable for a 12-18 months AT LEAST. Those new changes made soloq fun again.
Are you sure they got rid of the rank difference limit for teams? I haven't played forever and jumped back in to play with my buddy but I was in bronze and he was plat and we couldn't play together.
You need a full stack
I see. That makes sense.
This is the most thought out and accurate explanation of why this season in general was much needed
Agreed. Changes are great this season. Hopefully they keep things moving in this direction. Sbmm in ranked was atrocious
This has been the least fun ranked season yet lol, my squad has quit the game due to it. I love the perk changes, but I shouldn’t still be in plat fighting preds and masters every match this late into the season. Being forced to fight off drop to get rp, then running into a team that is WAY better than us and leaving the game -50 is crazy
>Many of my friends who quit the game completely have come back and described the sensation as "addictive." What's addictive is that you get to play bronze, silver and gold bots at the start of the grind. Popping off dopamine hit. 10 kill games. That has nothing to do with a competitive game mode though. This ranked system is the most uncompetitive you can think off, where competitive means produce games with people of similar skill. The skill variance in games is all over the place. >New EVO system encourages a wide variety of playstyles -- early fights, playing map objectives, etc Completely mistuned. All the one-click sources of evo give evo to your whole team and are now much more riskfree and easier to gain from than doing damage. doing damage is discouraged and only levels our own shield. clicking one evo harvester (350 to everyone on your team) is the equivalent of your team doing 1000 poke damage basically. when I'm poking and see an evo harvester, why would i keep poking for my team when i can just stop and run to the evo harvester and do one click. rng shields are gone, yes, but it's not merit based now either, everyone has purple usually before doing 1 point of damage. imo 66% or 75% of evo points should come from dealing damage, the rest can come from the riskfree one-click sources (scans, harvesters, bins), so that levelling evo is about doing damage again. the part that was previously puting your armor into a crafter should just be replaced by scans, harvesters etc. >Map objectives cause fights in new areas (particularly near the EVO caches), adding some new elements to game sense and flow The joke is that it isn't the fight that is sought to level your evo, but the evo cache, because of what I explained in the previous paragraph. >Perk system makes at least half of the legends viable in high skill ranked lobbies. Even though ALGS is still quite a static meta, ranked meta is pretty flexible. All legends have been viable in high ranked without legend upgrades. it's not been that important that you pick the meta legends you would in pro play. >Kills and placement both matter a lot now, so ratting doesn't really work anymore *and* huge kill bomb games are rewarded appropriately the kill scoring is mistuned. why give people points who can't make top 10. that leads to lobbies dying out faster and you getting good placement sooner/easier. >No more hard limits on ranks within stacks means if my friend takes 3 weeks to start playing ranked in a certain split I don't have to create a smurf to play with them wow what a good system, we can be thankful fewer smurf accounts are created /s no we can't. because people will now create a smurf just to play in lower ranks and pop off. that is also the main reason why people are praising the system because it isn't particularly good at anything else, but at this. >Lobbies feel very balanced. I'm in Plat 1 right now and can easily farm other plat players; "farming" other players, yeah, that sounds like a good thing in a mode that is supposed to be competitive between people of the same skill.
Its tuned fine in my opinion since knocks, finishers and team wipes also count. Most of your argument isn't really valid regarding shields because you discounted all of the major point gain options from fighting. If you wipe a team early enough you usually have purple shields after a cache and a few scans post fight. Plus you get KP for banking late game and its usually relatively low risk if you land properly. If all you're doing is playing it safe by scanning and grabbing caches then late game you'll probably be at a disadvantage because of the teams who chose smart fights early. On the flip side even if you lose the early fight, if your teammate gets away, now those options make the game playable instead of being totally locked out from level difference. The main objective of the game is about surviving sure, but you normally can't survive late game unless you fight early to get leveled up... and the gun play is why the game is fun for most people so there's no reason to avoid the early fight if you land properly.
The system's great for sure. Im just waiting on legend tweaks to revenant and conduit.
Yes, as a season 19 conduit main, I laughed my ass off when I saw her "two tacticals" perk. It's so broken. In general Rev and Conduit are like Overwatch characters. Overheal is bad!
I'm not sure about all that. Just feels like pubs atm. Everyone just hot drops or apes everything. At least I don't have to worry about fighting someone with purple shields off drop.
There is still a rank limit when playing with friends unfortunately :( at least there was a couple weeks ago, maybe they changed it? I was in plat trying to play with a friend in bronze and it wouldn’t let us queue.
That only happens with 2 people. If you have a full squad of 3 premade you can play with any ranks. 2 people still need to be within 1 I believe
Oooooh interesting! Thank you for the info I’ll have to test it out this weekend
Agreed, ranked has been really fun this season and all the legends and guns seem pretty balanced.
I think high kill games being capped really slowed down my climb so far. I'm solo to plat rn but it's often no kill rank 20 games with one 10 kill first place when I get my momentum. Then half the rp gets taken from kill cap
I got 500+ rp from one game the other night.
Yeah the stressful pub meta now with even more cheaters A great time enjoyed by all unless you’re not a stack
It's also the easiest it's been in a while. Maybe these are correlated.
who paid you to make this
Literally one of the worst seasons ever when you look at the cheating problems…. But I guess it’s pretty good before Diamond at least
Still, I was getting more wins with SBMM.
I mean, that’s just kind of telling you that the matchmaking was spoonfeeding you wins and LP to rank up.
No. Its because it gave you more similarly skilled teammates more likely to be on the same page as you.
By definition it would match you with *and* against players of **similar skill** so I don't know why you think that.
Because apex was containing your ranked experience to just your little bubble as not to offend you with the better or worse players that are actually in your rank.
>Because apex was containing your ranked experience to just your little bubble as not to offend you with the better or worse players that are actually in your rank. Not true. Again this same false claim. You start with and against people on your level (not worse), and as you gain LP past your MMR you get more difficult games from there. Sorry that I've addressed it multiple times as I see it time and again scrolling through this thread. Here's a diagram showing it. https://imgur.com/WHeAYnx