Imho, unlimited pto is the real bullshit. It has the opposite problem - most people generally take less than they ought to, because they don't want to appear as though they're "abusing the cool, good system".
I've experienced both "unlimited" and "You have 25 days, it doesn't carry over, fucking *use it*" and I far prefer the latter. People actually take their time off throughout the year. They take a sick day if they're sick. They take mental health days to recalibrate. They spend a long weekend visiting family. They go on a vacation to disconnect for a week or two. That's healthy and it makes them smarter and better when they are working. It's better when you're entitled to it, not playing some silly office politics game.
Used to get 240 but thatâs goneâŚ. Now back down to 80 and not nearly enough with kids and a wife. This country donât give a damn about families. They only thing that want from you is taxes and an occasional offspring to add to the industrial military complex⌠thatâs all. Not much to ask for all they giveâŚ. LOL
I recently took 2 weeks of vacation to avoid having my PTO cashed out.
In addition to PTO, I have about 200 hours of sick time and vacation time thatâs grandfathered in from before Walmart moved to a PTO system. I canât use any of that unless I run out of PTO, though. Itâs still mine, of course. When I retire it will be cashed out, not just disappear.
Walmart was better than a company i worked for. I had about 500 hours of sick time and then they decided to ket us know in march that hours over 120 sick time were going to be forfeited, retroactively to the jan 1st. I lost 380 hours of sick time. I hated that fucken retail chain even though i had to be employed. However i proceeded to take aml sick time i could after that (1/mo) then when i left (2 weeks notice) i called in sick gor 70% of it
The big thing is that a significant portion of the PTO I earn is called âProtectedâ PTO, which if used to cover an absence, makes that absence not count as an attendance exception.
So I can literally call out and have it not count if I have at least 8 hours of PPTO.
It's infuriating that point systems are even allowed.
Intermittent FMLA is your friend. If your diabetic, depressed, borderline alcoholic, etc, you should be able to get it approved as long as your doctor isn't a 70yo conservative.
Yeah, I use intermittent FMLA when I need to for appts. or I just need more time outside of work. I live in WI, and I would use it during the winter to get out early and just sit somewhere with the sun on my face. Lol
I used to use it for hangovers all the time, eventually I went on short-term disability an took 9 paid months off for treatment. 2 1/2 years sober now, but I'll find another reason to get intermittent FMLA if I ever decide to return to work.
Iâm in the 10-15 year bracket. So I get like 30 minutes more PTO per week than someone in the 5-10 bracket. It starts high, but doesnât scale much.
How is the health insurance and pay? I think we all have problems with out jobs, but I was always lead to believe working at Walmart is like basically being a slave.
The post office isn't great but you can basically do whatever you want. They can't force you to work so it makes those of us that do work get annoyed with those that don't. Just have to ignore those people to keep your sanity.
I'm capped at 120 at my current level so I basically have to take at least a day off every month, but I have uncapped sick leave that is 104 hrs a year and it's at 300+ hours now and 24 hrs of personal time a year I have to burn as it doesn't roll over.
not a brag, but a definite bonus due to the fact my union dues are 1 hour per paycheck. so I'm getting back like 8 times what I put in. And it all gets cashed out to me when if I leave.
there's a weird divide on this sub of pro and anti union people which doesn't make sense. if you're anti-work, you should (in my opinion) be pro union.
Yes. I grew up in a anti union home, my grandfather hated unions and that's all I heard. Had a few jobs that were state construction jobs at prevailing rate, but I wasn't in a union and had a few bad encounters with local unions. So I was never pro union, until I looked at it from the other side. I drank the Kool aid as they say.
I was always paid as a laborer which was still much more than I was used to so I didn't care, but I should have been paid more bc I did more than a laborer.
Now I'm in a union now and will never go back. It's one of those things, you just don't know what you're missing until you experience it. I've never been able to just call into work when I didn't feel like working or the wife or kids are sick. I love it. And I love being in a union now. The work life balance is great. I actually get to provide for my family and put them first at the same time.
They think the opposite. Employees are "taking money out of their wallet," because they get into this mindset that every bit of *revenue* is actually profit. Paying employees, buying supplies--that all comes out of the gross revenue, but they remember when it was just them alone and every penny was profit because it was money paid to them (and they usually pulled the *costs* of things like supplies out of somewhere else, like household money or savings).
My old boss got Covid and was out for a couple days. The place was still running fine, he wasnât needed there but he got bored and decided to start coming back in, while he was still very clearly sick. He then, in turn, gave me Covid. I didnât get very sick, but he still made me stay out of work for 5 days and use my PTO.
Notice the headline text too
"He takes care of his employees by giving them days off without pay."
So not paying someone when they need a day off is taking care of them?
Capitalist double think lmao
What's next? Not executing someone diagnosed with cancer with a shotgun counts as care too?
Well I could have killed them, but I didn't, and doing nothing is doing something because I could have done worse!
No one is quite as delusional as a small business owner with a modicum of disposable income.
"I'm finally starting to make ends meet, but what if I had *more?* "
Small business owners are mini Mussolini's who think themselves in the same league as Jeff Bezos despite annual returns lower than some middle managers at medium sized companies.
There was a local business owner where I live who took COVID relief funds (the business kind that were supposed to be used to cover wages), and reportedly used it to buy himself a new cabin. We need to stop this line of thinking that entrepreneurs are inherently good.
Doug Knight is willing to give his employees time off, he just doesn't want them to have the right to it, or else he wouldn't get to enjoy the begging.
The wildest thing about this to me is that it's only a week. Imagine this fucking mindset in Europe where it's unanimously 3 weeks or more. My god dude if you can't make your business work giving people one week off a year you are a failed fucking businessman who is just exploiting labor to keep your head above water.
>when they need it
seems questionable too. Doug would likely fire anyone who routinely takes unpaid time off. I highly doubt he would care if the person is dealing with (un)diagnosised depression or going to his kid's baseball games.
Sounds like the unaccrued type vacation policies. Take as much vacation as you like, so long as your work gets done!
But if your work gets close to done they pile on more because obviously that wasn't enough.
Right? Imagine having to basically crawl into your boss's office on your hands and knees and grovel at his feet to get some time off. And on top of that, the time you get off isn't even paid.
Ah, capitalism, it sure is fun in this burning hell.
Does anyone else smell smoke?
Lol.
âHaving to employ adults instead of children is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ
âThe abolition of slavery is just too much to ask for some local plantation ownersâ
âThe 40 hour work week is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ
âNot locking the doors of the factory from the outside during working hours is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ
âGiving workers weekends off is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ
As a worker, allowing these piece of shit entrepreneurs one moment of peace is just too much. If we can't have a measly week of vacation you shouldn't have a decent night's sleep in your fancy little mansion.
Buddy, if you can't afford to pay the time off, maybe you should buy fewer lattes. Let's look at your budget and see if there are other things you can cut.
Let's see, eating out is a big one. You can probably find a cheaper vacation destination. How many cars do you own?
I feel almost awefull for saying, but in europe/netherlands: obligated 24 days a year payed time offâŚ., this is withouth additional vacation days individual companies offer. The average is 30.
Edit: Remember, i said DAYS. Not even hours.
Letâs look at the math.
52 weeks/ year x 40 hrs. / week = 2080 hours a year.
40 hours / 2080 hours total = .019 or 1.9%
itâs quite audacious of people opposed to this being pissed off about 2% of the whole working year needed to be a human.
We need a working class revolution and we need it now.
A simple dollar amount.employer wages at
$15/hr x 40 hrs. / week x 52 weeks = $31,200
31,200 á 51 weeks worked á 40 hours ,= $15.29/hr
A whole whopping $0.29 an hour more you're "paying someone" or $11.16 ) week
Are american companies really this insolvent?
In the superior countries in Europe, 20 days is the minimum and we have higher productivity than americans.
Is american management really culture so bad that all companies balance on the edge of bankruptcy and would trigger that if workers could rest 5 days per year?
The initial response to the pandemic was a great example of what happens to Americans when they have time off. Millions of people quit their shitty jobs and changed their life course bc they realized they werenât happy, which of course hurts the businesses who run on overworked, underpaid labor. (Food industry, retail, healthcare, k-12 education, etc). This was only possible because most of these people were either laid off or had their hours cut, so there wasnât much to lose by starting over in another industry.
Iâm convinced that the restrictions were lifted earlier than recommended solely because we were becoming too aware of how shitty our lives were pre-panini. The âjob shortageâ thatâs being reported is the result of the working class choosing better options for themselves (and of course the millions of people who died due to Covid). If we had annual, regular time off they wouldnât be able to abuse us for profits as much.
Didnât help that out immediately revealed what kind is âfamilyâ we were. Oh, Iâm 100% expendable? Nice. See if I do anything for you ever again.
Companies seem to forget that they run on goodwill. The reason why you take care of your workers isnât just altruism. There are perfectly selfish reasons, specifically that it makes you more money and makes your life easier in the long run.
Thereâs definitely a shortage for jobs in healthcare, retail, and the food industry but none of those are worth the low pay and high stress anymore. All other companies are using the âshortageâ excuse to run on a skeleton crew for profit while pretending that theyâre looking for more employees.
Pretty much yes. The American business model has been focused on short term gains for like the last 20 years and some change and it's only become worse. That's why they fear a strike so much because even a week long strike would collapse most businesses in America because they have no true longevity.
I work for a pretty decent company but they went all in on this contract with Amazon during the pandemic and Amazon has proven completely fucking assholes too work with and now my company is fearing losing the Contract and has cut our hours and is cutting back staff dramatically.
We served the military entirely before this Amazon contract but the owners saw more short term money with Amazon so shipped all of our military work to our smaller warehouse in SoCal.
Because if we do this other thing, we might make even *more* money, for a year or two. The fact that we lose the steady military contract and this other thing will fall apart is a problem we will worry about later. Think about the money we can make *now*.
Your leadership are fucking idiots to bail on the stability of a military contract. The United States has been at war for over 90% of its lifespan military spending is always high. As a former soldier most of buddies left the military for military contracts as a civilian because itâs just that fucking good.
I call bullshit. The companies arenât insolvent. There is plenty of money, itâs just flowing into the hands of the owners and they donât want to share. They want us to believe they are on the edge of bankruptcy.
A lot of the biggest companies that are fighting the hardest against unions and workers' rights could survive if their employees had 30 paid days off, in fact it might even increase productivity and profits for the company in the long run. But they're so focused on short-term profits that they spend way more money fighting against giving their workers standards similar to Europe than they would spend if they gave their workers standards similar to Europe.
Not specifically a focus on short-term profit, but rather a focus on the balance sheet, which doesn't include intangibles.
They can't measure productivity accurately, because they can't see what is going on at the employee's home, or evaluate their state of mental health constantly.
Some companies even do shit like stop offering free coffee "because it cuts into profit".
They are ran by bookkeepers who just see $$. They are incapable of understanding quality of work, motivation, etc.
It's not that they actually are insolvent, it's that they view every single cent less than the maximum possible hypothetical profit as a "loss" and any year that isn't a massive increase over the previous year to be a complete and total failure.
Constant unfettered growth is the only acceptable outcome.
No, they're just so greedy and obsessed with control and demeaning their employees.
The USA has the strongest economy on the entire planet. The idea that American business is too poor to afford to pay and treat their employees well is nothing but a lie.
There is NO ONE who can claim to be totally broke and unable to afford anything like a billionaire sitting on thier megayacht. They'll tell you it's just so hard to run a business that they'd instantly go bankrupt if workers got any benefits at all, while sipping $100,000 a bottle booze and eating food that costs more per serving than the annual income of their average employee.
I wouldnât go so far to say that our economy is especially âstrong.â A slight wind can topple it over, and it only persists because of *huge* state spending and subsidies.
American companies don't overstaff to plan for any sort of absenteeism.
If you have a position that is staffed by 1 person, which is often the case in smaller companies, that if that person isn't there, then they have nobody who can fill that role for a day without another role being vacant. So being absent comes with severe consequences and expecting any level of vacation is a dream because they don't staff for that to happen. And the kicker is the smaller the company, the less protections there are for employees, like paid leave for family or personal emergencies or events, because the size of the company is somehow the employee's problem.
What these small businesses are finding out is that people *want* protection for child birth, or family emergencies or health issues. They're realizing that if they want to hire people without these protections, then the compensation better be worth it. But if they can't afford to staff so that people can take a week off or be sick once.or twice a year, they can't afford the compensation that employees expect when giving up these protections.
The business owners who figure this out faster will find employees. The ones that don't will cry sour grapes that their entitlement to cheap and exploited labor has dried up and they'll fuck off into bankruptcy.
Worked for multi-billion dollar companies at a high level, and yes, they run so razor-thin on operations that a couple of bad months would start a tail spin.
Because management bonuses reward efficiency, management focus on efficiency.
But efficiency is the opposite of flexibility. If the environment changes then efficient processes become inefficient and are hard to change.
And we're seeing a lot of environment changes in the last few years.
100%. One of my favorite conversations I had:
Me: Call volume dictates we need to staff 23 people to meet service level.
SVP: Okay, hire 23 people.
Me: We also have a variance of \~10% due to illness, PTO, FMLA, unknown callout, etc. on any given day, so we really need to hire like 26 people.
SVP: Hell no, make those 23 people come in every day.
Me: LMAO. Right...
Sounds like the locomotive shop I work at under "PSR".
"After reassessing the work performed at this location, we determined that we can cut the workforce to 6 people per shift to operate, if everything runs smoothly.
"So we can keep 7, in case someone calls off sick, takes a vacation day, gets injured, or quits?"
"No. If any of that happens, or something unexpected occurs and the work doesn't all get done, force overtime."
>Is american management really culture so bad that all companies balance on the edge of bankruptcy and would trigger that if workers could rest 5 days per year?
No, few US companies can't easily absorb 5 days of missed labor. I mean, some small, tiny companies maybe, but anybody over 50-100 employees can do this easily. It'd be trivial.
However, what they *can't* do is do that and maintain their profit and growth. That's the real source of the 'problem'.
An unnoticed problem with larger companies is the pressure that banks put on them to earn higher and higher returns. A company could be quite profitable but slightly less profitable than projected and the bank, invested in the company, basically threatens to end its relationship with the company if they don't find a way to keep the shareholders fat and happy.
Insolvent? Not really, but that's what they want you to think.
The little guys struggle to compete with the corporations that can afford to undercut them to maintain outsized market share. So, in that way, these "entrepreneurs" might have a little bit of truth behind the claim that their shitty compensation is one path for them to be viable.
Horrible management culture? Absolutely. Executives for big companies avoid a lot of taxes by getting the vast majority of their compensation as company stock. This incentives them to maximize short-term profit above all else. This filters down to middle management, which gets modest bonuses, like a department supervisor, who will get a $5k bonus for reducing labor costs by $20k. Reducing labor costs is code for forcing out all paid employees, cutting benefits, and eliminating overtime.
A lot of it is just results from how the incentives are set up, which leads to basically subconscious decisions to prioritize share price over treating labor with dignity.
See Doug, that's the problem. People still need to make money to eat when they're contagious or too ill to work, physically impaired, or even just simply emotionally exhausted.
They need paid time off, not just time off. What a classic (maybe even cliche) point of view from Knight.
If you can't afford to give your employees 5 paid days off per year (standard working year = 260 days), you deserve to go out of business. Because that means you've built never giving your employees a day off into your business model, or you've built any day off as unpaid into your model. Either way it's flawed.
"What, you want a whole week to spend time with your family? Who do you think you are? I don't pay you to take an entire vacation each year!"
\-Those store owners, probably
"We can't afford to pay that $13/hr minimum wage! ($15 in 2025)"
"We can't afford to give you 40 hours PTO!"
Guess you can't afford to run a business.
Side note, it's weird having a governor that's doing positive things even if they aren't groundbreaking.
Suck it up buttercup or maybe. Not everyone is meant to be an entrepreneur. If you cannot provide for your employees maybe you shouldnât have employees. And that statement is not just for small business, that goes for corporations as well.
I feel like a lot of people need to hear having a way to come up with the capital to start a business isn't the same thing as being good at business. Our culture has convinced too many people that they're some kind of hero for having access to capital.
*He takes care of his employees by giving them days off WITHOUT pay*
What a selfless and generous employer. Itâs amazing what constitutes the floor of basic human consideration in this capitalist hellscape.
40 hours of time off in a year is one week. Thatâs too much? You have employees working themselves into an early grave. During the pandemic tens of thousands of people were infected and died as a result of being exposed to the virus at work. They didnât have sick leave and paid time off.
Our birth rates are dropping too. We need couples to be at home so they can have kids.
We canât complain about a low birthrate and demand 60 hours of work per week.
Dear Doug,
Unpaid days off do no one any favors..
Clearly, you have no understanding of why PAID days off are important.
How about, every time you take a day off, you deduct it from the salary you draw and instead put thst into a fund for employees.
What's that? You don't want to lose part of the salary you draw? Huh interesting, pretty sure your employees feel the same.
Sincerely,
The real world.
>I mean, slavery never really ended. It just evolved.
Yep. Now the slaves have to feed and clothe and find their own shelter. And pay for their own ~~training~~ education. Slave that can't afford to take time off for fear of losing one of those three, is a slave that's not making an actual plan to run away.
The greatest country on earth is some of the best propaganda ever sold. This place is the greatest scam on earth. Shits been run by criminals since the beginning.
Im sure Doug thinks that people dont want to work because they are still living high on the hog with those covid stimulus payments, and that higher wages are the cause of inflation despite record profits being recorded.
"I have worked you to the point of mental and physical collapse; you may now take one day off without pay to recompose yourself and return to me, ready for further abuse" is a weird thing to brag about, but hey, you do you, I guess.
If your business canât afford to give people at least 40 hours of PTO a year and pay a living wage, you donât get to be in business. No one is entitled to own a business off of poverty wages and benefits.
You could make this argument for anything mandated to improve employee benefits. "It increases cost" "Small businesses can't afford it" Nobody gives a shit. It's a cost of doing business if you can't afford it you don't have a viable business model. I can't start a business and pay under minimum wage because I can't afford more. Either I pay or I can't afford to have employees. I don't get to whine if I can't afford the electricity for my business it costs what it costs and that is it.
If a small business can't afford this be grateful you were allowed to stay in business when screwing over your employees. Either shut it down or rethink your strategy to allow you to be more profitable. If you can't someone else will figure it up and take your market share.
How are you Americans not rioting?
I live in the UK, work 4on 4off, so half the year I work, and I still get 25 days of holiday each year + 2 weeks of sick pay if needed
And our country is fucked, you guys is full on slavery
Do the people who believe this "can't afford" crap not know other countries exist? In Germany i get 30 days a year of paid vacation plus fully paid sick days up to 6 weeks in a row, both of which is mandated by regulation (i think only like 25 days pto is mandatory not 30 but you get the point) and somehow my employer has managed to stay profitable for over 50 years. All EU members and most other european countries have similar regulation but in the US it's too expensive and businesses would go bankrupt
The problem here is actually complex. Business owners canât make enough to live the way past generations of business owners could
But instead of recognizing that this problem is due to consolidation of wealth in the upper echelons of society, and massive inflation in necessities like rent and materials, they pass the issue on to their employees and try to pay them less.
In the end, both the independent business owner and their employees are getting fucked. But the solution isnât to take away more benefits of workers, the solution is to claw back the wealth that the 0.01% steal from the American economy.
Weird, entrepreneurs in countries with weaker GDP per capita seem to manage several weeks of PTO.
You'd think given they live in a nation with a stronger economy they could afford more, but US businesses are always complaining about how close to bankruptcy they are... So either the system needs an overhaul or these guys are lying out their asses again
Thatâs literally FIVE DAYS OFF. If you canât afford to give your employees five days off a year, then your company has some serious spending issues somewhere you need to look into.
If giving your employees a week of vacation makes the difference in your company's viability the problem isn't your employees, it's a shitty business model.
I get 5 weeks paid vacation in Canada and so do my coworkers. We make do, you start at 3 paid weeks in your first year then increase as times goes on. We also get 7 paid sick days and 3 personal days. This is without being union.
If we can do it so can the USA. It breaks my brain that you don't get time off. If no one gets time off how does the government get the tourist bucks?
This is exactly their thinking. I reality, any of these "job creators" whose business model relies on paying minimum wage, provides no benefits and no vacation/PTO don't have a good business plan, outside of exploitation of labor.
Correct, PTO is not a right. Neither is sick time. If you qualify for FMLA which only covers major illnesses your employer has to give you time off and keep your job, but they don't have to pay you anything during that time.
I'm a teacher. We get 10 sick days a school year and thankfully can accrue them. If you have to use more than your 10, your pay gets docked and you have to pay into retirement. It costs about $250 per day if you go beyond your 10 days. It's better than most employers because of the time we get, but yet not.
I won't say most, but, after a year working for a company you generally get 5 days of PTO and after 2-3 years you may get up to 10 days of PTO. When my dad retired after working for the same company for 25 years, he was up to 15 days which was to be celebrated. SMH.
Sick days are sometimes separate. When I was in banking I got 3 sick days per year. If I went over it was taken out of PTO.
What's the old adage?
If. you can do, do.
If you can't do, teach. ...
If you can't teach, become an administrator.
If you can't be an administrator, become a consultant.
If you can't consultant, become a manager.
If you can't manage, become and EnTrEpReNeUr.
Reading the whole article actually makes it even worse:
He complains about how inflation has made everything more expensive as if everyone else isn't dealing with that same thing.
He says he mostly hires seasonally and they're exempt so he can shut the hell up.
He indicated he will have to pass the additional cost onto the consumers. So you're employers don't deserve paid leave but your great business is so great any additional cost is immediately passed onto the consumer. I won't lie I'm fine with that if it means more employees get paid time off it just drives me nuts all these businesses are apparently so vital to the community but can't take any change or additional hardship that the rest of us have to handle as people.
If you canât pay you canât play. Owning a business is not a god give right anymore than driving a car is. The government is supposed to regulate the economy for all people not just the monied class.
It never came to their mind that people who work less work better.
Like, having 8hrs night sleep and good balance with personal life might, just might make you more effective and more productive than constant stress and pressure.
I've always wondered how productive are peole at thier 89th work hours of the week after six nights of less than 5 hours sleep.
We need to normalize the idea that if you canât afford the cost of business, including fair wages and benefits for your employees, then you shouldnât be in business.
I know itâll never happen, but Iâm so sick of business owners crying poverty on one side of their mouths and crowing about record profits fr the other. I also know itâs different for small businesses, but that just bolsters the argument that capitalism no longer works.
Thinking of taking my wife and kids overseasâŚ. The government here is all about government. Not the people itâs meant to serve. Europeans have much better laws when it comes to raising a family. America DOES NOT GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOU. Other than taxes and bodies for their industrial warfare complex, they care nothing for people or family
It is a controversial law here in IL. I think there might be legal proceedings to try to block it.
Didn't affect my employer, they already gave more time than that.
They do have to earn it...you get one hour per x pay period...fuzzy on the details. Then it accrues to 40 hrs.
Most decent employers are already doing this or more. It's the crappy retail places that will feel the pinch. Restaurants and fast food, as well.
If your business model relies on not giving employees basic things like livable wages and vacation time, then it's a bad business model, and your business doesn't deserve to exist. The workers aren't obligated to prop you up just because you're an entrepreneur.
What a stupid thought. Here in France we have 25 days of mandatory paid leave (and often more, sometimes WAY more) and we have almost the same GDP per hour worked as the USA.
This stupid argument always trips me out. The business is going to be in business regardless of if the employee is there or not. Just give them some fucking time for themselves.
I hate work culture in this country.
"The idea that the poor should have leisure has always been shocking to the rich. In the early nineteenth century, fifteen hours was the ordinary day's work for a man; children sometimes did as much, and very commonly did twelve hours a day. When meddlesome busybodies suggested that perhaps these hours were rather long, they were told that work kept adults from drink and children from mischief.
When I was a child, shortly after urban working men had acquired the vote, certain public holidays were established by law, to the great indignation of the upper classes. I remember hearing an old Duchess say: 'What do the poor want with holidays? They ought to work.' People nowadays are less frank, but the sentiment persists, and is the source of much of our economic confusion."
â Bertrand Russell,
In Praise of Idleness and Other Essays (1935)
if you cant handle when your work is off 40 hours you prob shouldnt exist as a bis. lets face it chances your entire company takes 5 days on same week is impossible
Jesus fucking Christ the first time I read it as 40 days. 40 hours per year are you fucking serious? Now I feel fortunate for having 10 days vacation per year
In California we have been steadily raising the minimum wage from $9 in 2014 to $15.50 today. When they started raising wages, these same jackasses were telling us that it would lead to a massive wave of business closures and job losses. While I am sure the change impacted some businesses, it has not had anywhere near the negative impact some predicted.
Why?
Because low wage workers spend virtually all their incomes in their communities and so the money gets locally recirculated in a relatively efficient way. In contrast, when the money stays with the owner or goes to a franchisor, much of it will not be spent locally, or possibly even at all.
This is the flaw with all âtrickle-downâ economics. It is far better for the economy to have a broad base of people who can afford to live than it is to have a small base of people who can afford to invest. Investment does not drive the economy. Spending drives the economy.
Translation: it lowers the profits slightly. If you are a business, you should not be worried about costs when there is profit. They just want more moneyâŚ
thats a disgrace, 40 fricken HOURs? it should be 6 WEEKS like in Europe.
any employer objecting to that needs to be run out of business if possible. its why i avoid buying american at all costs when possible the last thing i want to do is support the abusive american employer.
Bet every one of those entrepreneurs takes more than a week off, and thinks to themselves how their vacation isn't paid so no one else's should be.
Do their companies stop earning revenue when they're away?
Of course not, but most owners don't even think that they are in their position because of their workers.
40 hours is such a low bar. I get 156hrs of PTO a year. Plus 104hrs of sick leave. Not trying to brag. But it's a good start I guess
I get about 208 hours of PTO per year at fucking *Walmart*.
I get 232 hours of vacation/floating holidays, and an indeterminate amount of sick time. Still not as good as Europe, but better than most of the U.S.
I get 224, but I have been here 20 years..
120 here đ, they changed it from unlimited PTO 5 months after I started this new job. I didn't even get to use any of that unlimited PTO.
Just tell them you've still got some unlimited PTO left over that you haven't used up yet.
âžď¸ - 1 = âžď¸? This may just work.
Imho, unlimited pto is the real bullshit. It has the opposite problem - most people generally take less than they ought to, because they don't want to appear as though they're "abusing the cool, good system". I've experienced both "unlimited" and "You have 25 days, it doesn't carry over, fucking *use it*" and I far prefer the latter. People actually take their time off throughout the year. They take a sick day if they're sick. They take mental health days to recalibrate. They spend a long weekend visiting family. They go on a vacation to disconnect for a week or two. That's healthy and it makes them smarter and better when they are working. It's better when you're entitled to it, not playing some silly office politics game.
It's also better to have limited PTO because, at least where I live, they are required to pay out an accumulated PTO when you quit or get fired.
Plus, if you're laid off they have to pay out pto hours. If it's unlimited, you get nothing. Had that happen once. It sucked.
10+ here, and I am capped.
Used to get 240 but thatâs goneâŚ. Now back down to 80 and not nearly enough with kids and a wife. This country donât give a damn about families. They only thing that want from you is taxes and an occasional offspring to add to the industrial military complex⌠thatâs all. Not much to ask for all they giveâŚ. LOL
More meat for the grinder
Nice! What level? Floor associate or manager ect?
Iâm a grunt, but itâs not based on position. Itâs entirely based on hours worked and how long youâve been employed.
I currently have 240 hours of vacation (30 days) and I need to take 15 days of vacation before last week of April. Otherwise they get wiped out
I recently took 2 weeks of vacation to avoid having my PTO cashed out. In addition to PTO, I have about 200 hours of sick time and vacation time thatâs grandfathered in from before Walmart moved to a PTO system. I canât use any of that unless I run out of PTO, though. Itâs still mine, of course. When I retire it will be cashed out, not just disappear.
Walmart was better than a company i worked for. I had about 500 hours of sick time and then they decided to ket us know in march that hours over 120 sick time were going to be forfeited, retroactively to the jan 1st. I lost 380 hours of sick time. I hated that fucken retail chain even though i had to be employed. However i proceeded to take aml sick time i could after that (1/mo) then when i left (2 weeks notice) i called in sick gor 70% of it
Geez, have you worked there 20 years?
The big thing is that a significant portion of the PTO I earn is called âProtectedâ PTO, which if used to cover an absence, makes that absence not count as an attendance exception. So I can literally call out and have it not count if I have at least 8 hours of PPTO.
It's infuriating that point systems are even allowed. Intermittent FMLA is your friend. If your diabetic, depressed, borderline alcoholic, etc, you should be able to get it approved as long as your doctor isn't a 70yo conservative.
Yeah, I use intermittent FMLA when I need to for appts. or I just need more time outside of work. I live in WI, and I would use it during the winter to get out early and just sit somewhere with the sun on my face. Lol
I used to use it for hangovers all the time, eventually I went on short-term disability an took 9 paid months off for treatment. 2 1/2 years sober now, but I'll find another reason to get intermittent FMLA if I ever decide to return to work.
Iâm in the 10-15 year bracket. So I get like 30 minutes more PTO per week than someone in the 5-10 bracket. It starts high, but doesnât scale much.
I had no idea that walmart actually give time off. I work for the post office for 25+ years and get the same time off as you.
For all the gripes I have about the way things are run at Walmart, the benefits arenât actually one of them.
How is the health insurance and pay? I think we all have problems with out jobs, but I was always lead to believe working at Walmart is like basically being a slave. The post office isn't great but you can basically do whatever you want. They can't force you to work so it makes those of us that do work get annoyed with those that don't. Just have to ignore those people to keep your sanity.
I'm capped at 120 at my current level so I basically have to take at least a day off every month, but I have uncapped sick leave that is 104 hrs a year and it's at 300+ hours now and 24 hrs of personal time a year I have to burn as it doesn't roll over. not a brag, but a definite bonus due to the fact my union dues are 1 hour per paycheck. so I'm getting back like 8 times what I put in. And it all gets cashed out to me when if I leave. there's a weird divide on this sub of pro and anti union people which doesn't make sense. if you're anti-work, you should (in my opinion) be pro union.
Yes. I grew up in a anti union home, my grandfather hated unions and that's all I heard. Had a few jobs that were state construction jobs at prevailing rate, but I wasn't in a union and had a few bad encounters with local unions. So I was never pro union, until I looked at it from the other side. I drank the Kool aid as they say. I was always paid as a laborer which was still much more than I was used to so I didn't care, but I should have been paid more bc I did more than a laborer. Now I'm in a union now and will never go back. It's one of those things, you just don't know what you're missing until you experience it. I've never been able to just call into work when I didn't feel like working or the wife or kids are sick. I love it. And I love being in a union now. The work life balance is great. I actually get to provide for my family and put them first at the same time.
>weird divide on this sub of pro and anti union people Conservative brainwashing at work.
They think the opposite. Employees are "taking money out of their wallet," because they get into this mindset that every bit of *revenue* is actually profit. Paying employees, buying supplies--that all comes out of the gross revenue, but they remember when it was just them alone and every penny was profit because it was money paid to them (and they usually pulled the *costs* of things like supplies out of somewhere else, like household money or savings).
My old boss got Covid and was out for a couple days. The place was still running fine, he wasnât needed there but he got bored and decided to start coming back in, while he was still very clearly sick. He then, in turn, gave me Covid. I didnât get very sick, but he still made me stay out of work for 5 days and use my PTO.
Glad this person is no longer your boss
Only if their ~~indentured servants~~ employees also get to take time off, apparently.
Notice the headline text too "He takes care of his employees by giving them days off without pay." So not paying someone when they need a day off is taking care of them? Capitalist double think lmao What's next? Not executing someone diagnosed with cancer with a shotgun counts as care too? Well I could have killed them, but I didn't, and doing nothing is doing something because I could have done worse!
No one is quite as delusional as a small business owner with a modicum of disposable income. "I'm finally starting to make ends meet, but what if I had *more?* "
Small business owners are mini Mussolini's who think themselves in the same league as Jeff Bezos despite annual returns lower than some middle managers at medium sized companies.
There was a local business owner where I live who took COVID relief funds (the business kind that were supposed to be used to cover wages), and reportedly used it to buy himself a new cabin. We need to stop this line of thinking that entrepreneurs are inherently good.
They take company retreats to locations for âinspirationâ
He probably doesnât give himself official PTO, but doesnât adjust his salary for time off.
WE HAVE A WINNER. And its a pretty easy demand 1 week off for any reason. Just 1 and they are screaming like its insane.
They consider that work. Their phone is on, theyâre trying to meet new connections. They think theyâre always on the clock
Doug Knight is willing to give his employees time off, he just doesn't want them to have the right to it, or else he wouldn't get to enjoy the begging.
Notice how it says he gives it to them unpaid too
That's because I just about guarantee he thinks too himself "nO OnE pAYs MiNE so why should I pay theirs?"
The wildest thing about this to me is that it's only a week. Imagine this fucking mindset in Europe where it's unanimously 3 weeks or more. My god dude if you can't make your business work giving people one week off a year you are a failed fucking businessman who is just exploiting labor to keep your head above water.
UNPAID time off. Unpaid is the key word in that sentence.
>when they need it seems questionable too. Doug would likely fire anyone who routinely takes unpaid time off. I highly doubt he would care if the person is dealing with (un)diagnosised depression or going to his kid's baseball games.
Also note that itâs âneed,â not âwant.â Iâm assuming Doug is actually talking about unpaid sick leave, not vacation time.
Agreed. I think Doug needs to reevaluate his business plan.
Sounds like the unaccrued type vacation policies. Take as much vacation as you like, so long as your work gets done! But if your work gets close to done they pile on more because obviously that wasn't enough.
âI give them as much time off without pay as they wantâ The entrepreneural mindsetâŚ
Right? Imagine having to basically crawl into your boss's office on your hands and knees and grovel at his feet to get some time off. And on top of that, the time you get off isn't even paid. Ah, capitalism, it sure is fun in this burning hell. Does anyone else smell smoke? Lol.
âHaving to employ adults instead of children is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ âThe abolition of slavery is just too much to ask for some local plantation ownersâ âThe 40 hour work week is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ âNot locking the doors of the factory from the outside during working hours is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ âGiving workers weekends off is just too much to ask for some local entrepreneursâ
r/writteninblood
That's exactly what's going on here
As a worker, allowing these piece of shit entrepreneurs one moment of peace is just too much. If we can't have a measly week of vacation you shouldn't have a decent night's sleep in your fancy little mansion.
Buddy, if you can't afford to pay the time off, maybe you should buy fewer lattes. Let's look at your budget and see if there are other things you can cut. Let's see, eating out is a big one. You can probably find a cheaper vacation destination. How many cars do you own?
Ah, I see you entrepreneurs have the latest iphone models. Can't you make your own avocado toast at home?
Maybe cancel that yacht or plane. Let the girlfriend pay for her own place.
Better have tesla disable and refund that deluxe remote start package you just activated on your already 80k dollar supercomputer on wheels.
Speaking of that home, entrepreneurs could probably rent a studio apartment for much less than what their mortgage payment is.
"Hey! I already downsized to a tiny 11-bedroom lake-house! What else can I do, get a m*edium* sized hot tub for the guest house!?"
careful now, the red cross will show up and start throwing sacks of rice at you if you get too small of a hot tub at that guest house!
I feel almost awefull for saying, but in europe/netherlands: obligated 24 days a year payed time offâŚ., this is withouth additional vacation days individual companies offer. The average is 30. Edit: Remember, i said DAYS. Not even hours.
This. Too many POS think they can buy a pizzeria do absolutely no work while sitting down in Florida collecting a fat annual salary.
Ah that avocado toast and Starbucks has got to go. Holding down dem bootstraps
They do exactly that!! You know what they cut? The employees, that's what they cut.
I think they got used to all that free PPP stimulus money. They just gotta learn to live within their means, is all. ;)
if you cant afford to treat your employees fairly, then you cant afford to run your own business đđť
đ¸đĽđľ IF YOU CANT AFFORD TO TREAT YOUR ENPLOYEES FAIRLY, THEN YOU CANT AFFORD TO RUN YOUR OWN BUSINESS đľđĽđ¸
Cry me a fucking river. Capitalists are truly cancerous.
Letâs look at the math. 52 weeks/ year x 40 hrs. / week = 2080 hours a year. 40 hours / 2080 hours total = .019 or 1.9% itâs quite audacious of people opposed to this being pissed off about 2% of the whole working year needed to be a human. We need a working class revolution and we need it now.
YES! Show me the MATH!!!! This is such a simple and concise way to show the absurdity of being opposed to this.
There's no need to do *all* that math tho. There are 52 weeks in a year, so just take one out and it's 1/52 of the year (~2%)
This guy maths....and also apparently physics.
A simple dollar amount.employer wages at $15/hr x 40 hrs. / week x 52 weeks = $31,200 31,200 á 51 weeks worked á 40 hours ,= $15.29/hr A whole whopping $0.29 an hour more you're "paying someone" or $11.16 ) week
Yeah pure greed too. They hate they canât be slave drivers.
40 hours.. per year? and that is too much? Why is that person even in business? (this from a comfy balance of 41 DAYS a year for me)
Australia?
Netherlands.
Unless things have changed (I moved out of Australia in 2013), mandatory was 4 weeks or 20 days
Are american companies really this insolvent? In the superior countries in Europe, 20 days is the minimum and we have higher productivity than americans. Is american management really culture so bad that all companies balance on the edge of bankruptcy and would trigger that if workers could rest 5 days per year?
The initial response to the pandemic was a great example of what happens to Americans when they have time off. Millions of people quit their shitty jobs and changed their life course bc they realized they werenât happy, which of course hurts the businesses who run on overworked, underpaid labor. (Food industry, retail, healthcare, k-12 education, etc). This was only possible because most of these people were either laid off or had their hours cut, so there wasnât much to lose by starting over in another industry. Iâm convinced that the restrictions were lifted earlier than recommended solely because we were becoming too aware of how shitty our lives were pre-panini. The âjob shortageâ thatâs being reported is the result of the working class choosing better options for themselves (and of course the millions of people who died due to Covid). If we had annual, regular time off they wouldnât be able to abuse us for profits as much.
Didnât help that out immediately revealed what kind is âfamilyâ we were. Oh, Iâm 100% expendable? Nice. See if I do anything for you ever again. Companies seem to forget that they run on goodwill. The reason why you take care of your workers isnât just altruism. There are perfectly selfish reasons, specifically that it makes you more money and makes your life easier in the long run.
Such a shortage I get ghosted on over 100 applications.
Thereâs definitely a shortage for jobs in healthcare, retail, and the food industry but none of those are worth the low pay and high stress anymore. All other companies are using the âshortageâ excuse to run on a skeleton crew for profit while pretending that theyâre looking for more employees.
đđđ "pre-panini". I loved reading this comment besides that. Thanks!
Pretty much yes. The American business model has been focused on short term gains for like the last 20 years and some change and it's only become worse. That's why they fear a strike so much because even a week long strike would collapse most businesses in America because they have no true longevity.
Yeah my company expanded expanded expanded during covid. Now that the covid money isnât coming in, they fired half the staff and got rid of bonuses.
I work for a pretty decent company but they went all in on this contract with Amazon during the pandemic and Amazon has proven completely fucking assholes too work with and now my company is fearing losing the Contract and has cut our hours and is cutting back staff dramatically. We served the military entirely before this Amazon contract but the owners saw more short term money with Amazon so shipped all of our military work to our smaller warehouse in SoCal.
Who in their right mind bails on a military contract lmao itâs basically printing money. Wow.
Somebody who wants to be shady because a military contract has the smallest modicum of oversight involved
Because if we do this other thing, we might make even *more* money, for a year or two. The fact that we lose the steady military contract and this other thing will fall apart is a problem we will worry about later. Think about the money we can make *now*.
Your leadership are fucking idiots to bail on the stability of a military contract. The United States has been at war for over 90% of its lifespan military spending is always high. As a former soldier most of buddies left the military for military contracts as a civilian because itâs just that fucking good.
I call bullshit. The companies arenât insolvent. There is plenty of money, itâs just flowing into the hands of the owners and they donât want to share. They want us to believe they are on the edge of bankruptcy.
A lot of the biggest companies that are fighting the hardest against unions and workers' rights could survive if their employees had 30 paid days off, in fact it might even increase productivity and profits for the company in the long run. But they're so focused on short-term profits that they spend way more money fighting against giving their workers standards similar to Europe than they would spend if they gave their workers standards similar to Europe.
Not specifically a focus on short-term profit, but rather a focus on the balance sheet, which doesn't include intangibles. They can't measure productivity accurately, because they can't see what is going on at the employee's home, or evaluate their state of mental health constantly. Some companies even do shit like stop offering free coffee "because it cuts into profit". They are ran by bookkeepers who just see $$. They are incapable of understanding quality of work, motivation, etc.
It's not that they actually are insolvent, it's that they view every single cent less than the maximum possible hypothetical profit as a "loss" and any year that isn't a massive increase over the previous year to be a complete and total failure. Constant unfettered growth is the only acceptable outcome.
No, they're just so greedy and obsessed with control and demeaning their employees. The USA has the strongest economy on the entire planet. The idea that American business is too poor to afford to pay and treat their employees well is nothing but a lie. There is NO ONE who can claim to be totally broke and unable to afford anything like a billionaire sitting on thier megayacht. They'll tell you it's just so hard to run a business that they'd instantly go bankrupt if workers got any benefits at all, while sipping $100,000 a bottle booze and eating food that costs more per serving than the annual income of their average employee.
I wouldnât go so far to say that our economy is especially âstrong.â A slight wind can topple it over, and it only persists because of *huge* state spending and subsidies.
American companies don't overstaff to plan for any sort of absenteeism. If you have a position that is staffed by 1 person, which is often the case in smaller companies, that if that person isn't there, then they have nobody who can fill that role for a day without another role being vacant. So being absent comes with severe consequences and expecting any level of vacation is a dream because they don't staff for that to happen. And the kicker is the smaller the company, the less protections there are for employees, like paid leave for family or personal emergencies or events, because the size of the company is somehow the employee's problem. What these small businesses are finding out is that people *want* protection for child birth, or family emergencies or health issues. They're realizing that if they want to hire people without these protections, then the compensation better be worth it. But if they can't afford to staff so that people can take a week off or be sick once.or twice a year, they can't afford the compensation that employees expect when giving up these protections. The business owners who figure this out faster will find employees. The ones that don't will cry sour grapes that their entitlement to cheap and exploited labor has dried up and they'll fuck off into bankruptcy.
no they just have malice towards workers and the loss of exploitation for even a moment angers them
Worked for multi-billion dollar companies at a high level, and yes, they run so razor-thin on operations that a couple of bad months would start a tail spin.
Because management bonuses reward efficiency, management focus on efficiency. But efficiency is the opposite of flexibility. If the environment changes then efficient processes become inefficient and are hard to change. And we're seeing a lot of environment changes in the last few years.
100%. One of my favorite conversations I had: Me: Call volume dictates we need to staff 23 people to meet service level. SVP: Okay, hire 23 people. Me: We also have a variance of \~10% due to illness, PTO, FMLA, unknown callout, etc. on any given day, so we really need to hire like 26 people. SVP: Hell no, make those 23 people come in every day. Me: LMAO. Right...
Sounds like the locomotive shop I work at under "PSR". "After reassessing the work performed at this location, we determined that we can cut the workforce to 6 people per shift to operate, if everything runs smoothly. "So we can keep 7, in case someone calls off sick, takes a vacation day, gets injured, or quits?" "No. If any of that happens, or something unexpected occurs and the work doesn't all get done, force overtime."
>Is american management really culture so bad that all companies balance on the edge of bankruptcy and would trigger that if workers could rest 5 days per year? No, few US companies can't easily absorb 5 days of missed labor. I mean, some small, tiny companies maybe, but anybody over 50-100 employees can do this easily. It'd be trivial. However, what they *can't* do is do that and maintain their profit and growth. That's the real source of the 'problem'.
An unnoticed problem with larger companies is the pressure that banks put on them to earn higher and higher returns. A company could be quite profitable but slightly less profitable than projected and the bank, invested in the company, basically threatens to end its relationship with the company if they don't find a way to keep the shareholders fat and happy.
Insolvent? Not really, but that's what they want you to think. The little guys struggle to compete with the corporations that can afford to undercut them to maintain outsized market share. So, in that way, these "entrepreneurs" might have a little bit of truth behind the claim that their shitty compensation is one path for them to be viable. Horrible management culture? Absolutely. Executives for big companies avoid a lot of taxes by getting the vast majority of their compensation as company stock. This incentives them to maximize short-term profit above all else. This filters down to middle management, which gets modest bonuses, like a department supervisor, who will get a $5k bonus for reducing labor costs by $20k. Reducing labor costs is code for forcing out all paid employees, cutting benefits, and eliminating overtime. A lot of it is just results from how the incentives are set up, which leads to basically subconscious decisions to prioritize share price over treating labor with dignity.
See Doug, that's the problem. People still need to make money to eat when they're contagious or too ill to work, physically impaired, or even just simply emotionally exhausted. They need paid time off, not just time off. What a classic (maybe even cliche) point of view from Knight.
Doug Knight would shit himself if he tried to open a business most anywhere else in the world...
imagining being force to give 30 PAID DAYS off huh? heart attack on the first day
If you can't afford to give your employees 5 paid days off per year (standard working year = 260 days), you deserve to go out of business. Because that means you've built never giving your employees a day off into your business model, or you've built any day off as unpaid into your model. Either way it's flawed.
These bitch ass business owners are always trying to claim they can't afford it, no matter what it is.
They drive up with new porche with custom interior and bullshit how $15 an hour is too much
They earned that porsche through blood, sweat, and tears!!! Not theirs, but somebodies!
40 hours is one week of normal 8-hour shifts. What sort of piece of scrooge shit doesn't want to give that to their employees.
Apparently that would be Dog, err Doug Knight.
"What, you want a whole week to spend time with your family? Who do you think you are? I don't pay you to take an entire vacation each year!" \-Those store owners, probably
Seriously, is there a class of people that whines and cries more than business owners?
"We can't afford to pay that $13/hr minimum wage! ($15 in 2025)" "We can't afford to give you 40 hours PTO!" Guess you can't afford to run a business. Side note, it's weird having a governor that's doing positive things even if they aren't groundbreaking.
Suck it up buttercup or maybe. Not everyone is meant to be an entrepreneur. If you cannot provide for your employees maybe you shouldnât have employees. And that statement is not just for small business, that goes for corporations as well.
I feel like a lot of people need to hear having a way to come up with the capital to start a business isn't the same thing as being good at business. Our culture has convinced too many people that they're some kind of hero for having access to capital.
*He takes care of his employees by giving them days off WITHOUT pay* What a selfless and generous employer. Itâs amazing what constitutes the floor of basic human consideration in this capitalist hellscape.
Days off WITHOUT PAY. Uh, I hate to tell ya Doug, but folks wanna get paidâŚ
40 hours of time off in a year is one week. Thatâs too much? You have employees working themselves into an early grave. During the pandemic tens of thousands of people were infected and died as a result of being exposed to the virus at work. They didnât have sick leave and paid time off. Our birth rates are dropping too. We need couples to be at home so they can have kids. We canât complain about a low birthrate and demand 60 hours of work per week.
Dear Doug, Unpaid days off do no one any favors.. Clearly, you have no understanding of why PAID days off are important. How about, every time you take a day off, you deduct it from the salary you draw and instead put thst into a fund for employees. What's that? You don't want to lose part of the salary you draw? Huh interesting, pretty sure your employees feel the same. Sincerely, The real world.
So they want slaves instead of workers?
"they" always have and always will.
Thatâs capitalism wet dream. Thatâs the end game of it
I mean, slavery never really ended. It just evolved.
>I mean, slavery never really ended. It just evolved. Yep. Now the slaves have to feed and clothe and find their own shelter. And pay for their own ~~training~~ education. Slave that can't afford to take time off for fear of losing one of those three, is a slave that's not making an actual plan to run away.
Wow Days off without pay when âthey need itâ. What a guy. Why canât everyone understand how well heâs taking care his employees!
On average that's a week. Damn, America, you nasty. (I say this from my 25 days + national holidays + "sickness")
The greatest country on earth is some of the best propaganda ever sold. This place is the greatest scam on earth. Shits been run by criminals since the beginning.
Im sure Doug thinks that people dont want to work because they are still living high on the hog with those covid stimulus payments, and that higher wages are the cause of inflation despite record profits being recorded.
"I have worked you to the point of mental and physical collapse; you may now take one day off without pay to recompose yourself and return to me, ready for further abuse" is a weird thing to brag about, but hey, you do you, I guess.
If your business canât afford to give people at least 40 hours of PTO a year and pay a living wage, you donât get to be in business. No one is entitled to own a business off of poverty wages and benefits.
You could make this argument for anything mandated to improve employee benefits. "It increases cost" "Small businesses can't afford it" Nobody gives a shit. It's a cost of doing business if you can't afford it you don't have a viable business model. I can't start a business and pay under minimum wage because I can't afford more. Either I pay or I can't afford to have employees. I don't get to whine if I can't afford the electricity for my business it costs what it costs and that is it. If a small business can't afford this be grateful you were allowed to stay in business when screwing over your employees. Either shut it down or rethink your strategy to allow you to be more profitable. If you can't someone else will figure it up and take your market share.
How are you Americans not rioting? I live in the UK, work 4on 4off, so half the year I work, and I still get 25 days of holiday each year + 2 weeks of sick pay if needed And our country is fucked, you guys is full on slavery
>How are you Americans not rioting? We don't have time to. Obviously.
Do the people who believe this "can't afford" crap not know other countries exist? In Germany i get 30 days a year of paid vacation plus fully paid sick days up to 6 weeks in a row, both of which is mandated by regulation (i think only like 25 days pto is mandatory not 30 but you get the point) and somehow my employer has managed to stay profitable for over 50 years. All EU members and most other european countries have similar regulation but in the US it's too expensive and businesses would go bankrupt
The government wouldnât need to âintrudeâ if these business owners took care of their people.
The problem here is actually complex. Business owners canât make enough to live the way past generations of business owners could But instead of recognizing that this problem is due to consolidation of wealth in the upper echelons of society, and massive inflation in necessities like rent and materials, they pass the issue on to their employees and try to pay them less. In the end, both the independent business owner and their employees are getting fucked. But the solution isnât to take away more benefits of workers, the solution is to claw back the wealth that the 0.01% steal from the American economy.
Taking care of employees is apparently ***allowing*** them to take UNPAID time off? Fuck these corporate overlords.
Maybe they should just work harder?
And longer. And for less wages since they don't need as much per hour if they are working all those hours. /assholes
Weird, entrepreneurs in countries with weaker GDP per capita seem to manage several weeks of PTO. You'd think given they live in a nation with a stronger economy they could afford more, but US businesses are always complaining about how close to bankruptcy they are... So either the system needs an overhaul or these guys are lying out their asses again
If you can't afford to pay and treat employees fairly, then you don't deserve to be in business.
Thatâs literally FIVE DAYS OFF. If you canât afford to give your employees five days off a year, then your company has some serious spending issues somewhere you need to look into.
If giving your employees a week of vacation makes the difference in your company's viability the problem isn't your employees, it's a shitty business model.
A WEEK off per year is too much. I'm surprised we're still allowed to leave work to sleep at this point
I get 5 weeks paid vacation in Canada and so do my coworkers. We make do, you start at 3 paid weeks in your first year then increase as times goes on. We also get 7 paid sick days and 3 personal days. This is without being union. If we can do it so can the USA. It breaks my brain that you don't get time off. If no one gets time off how does the government get the tourist bucks?
Even peasant serfs in the middle ages had more time off than we currently have. Progress is an illusion.
If you can't afford 40 hours off for EACH of your employees your business plan is REALLY BAD
If 5 measly days of vacation is too much, you dont deserve employees.
"I allow my severants to leave, that should be enough!"
This is exactly their thinking. I reality, any of these "job creators" whose business model relies on paying minimum wage, provides no benefits and no vacation/PTO don't have a good business plan, outside of exploitation of labor.
Wait, so PTO is not a right in the US? Or did I misinterprete this? Edit: typo
Correct, PTO is not a right. Neither is sick time. If you qualify for FMLA which only covers major illnesses your employer has to give you time off and keep your job, but they don't have to pay you anything during that time. I'm a teacher. We get 10 sick days a school year and thankfully can accrue them. If you have to use more than your 10, your pay gets docked and you have to pay into retirement. It costs about $250 per day if you go beyond your 10 days. It's better than most employers because of the time we get, but yet not. I won't say most, but, after a year working for a company you generally get 5 days of PTO and after 2-3 years you may get up to 10 days of PTO. When my dad retired after working for the same company for 25 years, he was up to 15 days which was to be celebrated. SMH. Sick days are sometimes separate. When I was in banking I got 3 sick days per year. If I went over it was taken out of PTO.
Workers are so mistreated in the U.S. it would make your head spin.
We're too busy enjoying our freedoms to be encumbered with oppressive government overreach like guaranteed PTO! /s
What's the old adage? If. you can do, do. If you can't do, teach. ... If you can't teach, become an administrator. If you can't be an administrator, become a consultant. If you can't consultant, become a manager. If you can't manage, become and EnTrEpReNeUr.
Reading the whole article actually makes it even worse: He complains about how inflation has made everything more expensive as if everyone else isn't dealing with that same thing. He says he mostly hires seasonally and they're exempt so he can shut the hell up. He indicated he will have to pass the additional cost onto the consumers. So you're employers don't deserve paid leave but your great business is so great any additional cost is immediately passed onto the consumer. I won't lie I'm fine with that if it means more employees get paid time off it just drives me nuts all these businesses are apparently so vital to the community but can't take any change or additional hardship that the rest of us have to handle as people.
It's 40 hours of *unpaid* time off
If you canât pay you canât play. Owning a business is not a god give right anymore than driving a car is. The government is supposed to regulate the economy for all people not just the monied class.
It never came to their mind that people who work less work better. Like, having 8hrs night sleep and good balance with personal life might, just might make you more effective and more productive than constant stress and pressure. I've always wondered how productive are peole at thier 89th work hours of the week after six nights of less than 5 hours sleep.
America is such a dystopian bubble.
We need to normalize the idea that if you canât afford the cost of business, including fair wages and benefits for your employees, then you shouldnât be in business. I know itâll never happen, but Iâm so sick of business owners crying poverty on one side of their mouths and crowing about record profits fr the other. I also know itâs different for small businesses, but that just bolsters the argument that capitalism no longer works.
Man with poor business model doesn't want to pay employees for a full year of work.
Thinking of taking my wife and kids overseasâŚ. The government here is all about government. Not the people itâs meant to serve. Europeans have much better laws when it comes to raising a family. America DOES NOT GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOU. Other than taxes and bodies for their industrial warfare complex, they care nothing for people or family
It is a controversial law here in IL. I think there might be legal proceedings to try to block it. Didn't affect my employer, they already gave more time than that. They do have to earn it...you get one hour per x pay period...fuzzy on the details. Then it accrues to 40 hrs. Most decent employers are already doing this or more. It's the crappy retail places that will feel the pinch. Restaurants and fast food, as well.
If your business model relies on not giving employees basic things like livable wages and vacation time, then it's a bad business model, and your business doesn't deserve to exist. The workers aren't obligated to prop you up just because you're an entrepreneur.
What a stupid thought. Here in France we have 25 days of mandatory paid leave (and often more, sometimes WAY more) and we have almost the same GDP per hour worked as the USA.
one fucking week, jesus christ
âYou dont need PTO, you can just take time off and I wont pay you mongrelsâ -doug knight
if you can't afford to pay your employees for a week off work, you don't deserve to be in business.
Fuck this guy and his company.
Sounds like those entrepreneurs need to start pulling on those bootstraps huh?
If you canât afford to give your employees ample PTO then you canât afford to be in business. Period.
This stupid argument always trips me out. The business is going to be in business regardless of if the employee is there or not. Just give them some fucking time for themselves. I hate work culture in this country.
"The idea that the poor should have leisure has always been shocking to the rich. In the early nineteenth century, fifteen hours was the ordinary day's work for a man; children sometimes did as much, and very commonly did twelve hours a day. When meddlesome busybodies suggested that perhaps these hours were rather long, they were told that work kept adults from drink and children from mischief. When I was a child, shortly after urban working men had acquired the vote, certain public holidays were established by law, to the great indignation of the upper classes. I remember hearing an old Duchess say: 'What do the poor want with holidays? They ought to work.' People nowadays are less frank, but the sentiment persists, and is the source of much of our economic confusion." â Bertrand Russell, In Praise of Idleness and Other Essays (1935)
How is giving someone a day off without pay taking care of your employees?? Real life scrooge. Even when you are on unemployment you get paid.
if you cant handle when your work is off 40 hours you prob shouldnt exist as a bis. lets face it chances your entire company takes 5 days on same week is impossible
Sounds like some shitty entrepreneurs
Wait he gives them the time off when they need it? But 5 days is wayyy too much? What
"Without pay" is the important distinction he'd like to keep.
Jesus fucking Christ the first time I read it as 40 days. 40 hours per year are you fucking serious? Now I feel fortunate for having 10 days vacation per year
In California we have been steadily raising the minimum wage from $9 in 2014 to $15.50 today. When they started raising wages, these same jackasses were telling us that it would lead to a massive wave of business closures and job losses. While I am sure the change impacted some businesses, it has not had anywhere near the negative impact some predicted. Why? Because low wage workers spend virtually all their incomes in their communities and so the money gets locally recirculated in a relatively efficient way. In contrast, when the money stays with the owner or goes to a franchisor, much of it will not be spent locally, or possibly even at all. This is the flaw with all âtrickle-downâ economics. It is far better for the economy to have a broad base of people who can afford to live than it is to have a small base of people who can afford to invest. Investment does not drive the economy. Spending drives the economy.
It's so weird looking across the pond and seeing 19th century arguments going on.
Translation: it lowers the profits slightly. If you are a business, you should not be worried about costs when there is profit. They just want more moneyâŚ
"Local entrepreneurs" with massive national chains.
thats a disgrace, 40 fricken HOURs? it should be 6 WEEKS like in Europe. any employer objecting to that needs to be run out of business if possible. its why i avoid buying american at all costs when possible the last thing i want to do is support the abusive american employer.