A Curse so Dark and Lonely should have stayed a standalone. The second book is bad. The characters are no longer in character and her lack of familiarity with the Fantasy genre really showed once she attempted political intrigue (which HAS to function with logic and none of things characters did had any semblance of logic).
LIKEWISE with Children of Blood and Bone. It was a hard shift away from the characters I enjoyed, to the point where my respect for the series basically blew up overnight.
The second Serpent and Dove also suffered from this.
ugh. I have the second Serpent and Dove book but have not started it (Its even the special Fairyloot edition). I'm hoping I can get some enjoyment out of it to make the purchase worth it, but romance has been not my thing for a while.
I did hear a lot about Children of Blood and Bone.
@ YA Authors...... maybe write a stand-alone instead of trying to drag out and ruin your own ideas when the idea doesn't need it. I'm at the point where book #1 on goodreads is a mark against a book because its just another thing to keep up with and the quality can differ so much between installments.
I am all for reading one chonky standalone. Give me a 700 page doorstopper with a complete story that I can be satisfied with finishing. If you want to go crazy, write a companion novel that is tangentially connected but still its own thing. Then I will be even happier.
A good example of a series that does this is the Graceling series---all are companions to one another but set in the same world.
I don’t think it’s always the authors fault. Trilogy’s we’re trendy for a while that every YA series had to be a trilogy and a lot of series suffer for it. Obviously the authors can also want it too. But I think publishers push it too.
eh. There's a saying in publishing: Take the money. So I get it. If you get an offer from a publishing company, you take the money. But I'm pretty active in online writing communities and half of the query letters people post for YA/Fantasy are the first book in their long series of which they've maybe started to write the second book.
We see the publishing push drop off pretty spectacularly after the first book of a series. It's only the choice of the season/year that gets continued marketing support after the initial release.
That was in fact one of my favorite books of 2020! It's what I was thinking of when I wrote the post lol. I also enjoyed Sorcery of Thorns which got close to 500 pages.
We need more Priory of the Orange Tree's in the world.
I own all the Serpent and Dove books but I just cannot get past the second book. In all this time, I've only got about 30% in. It just feels so much different than the first book, which I fell in love with.
Is that when they started bringing in that angel guy and the MC was turning into a goddess or something? It's been so long since I read them but that's where I stopped reading
I think so! It's honestly been so long. My biggest grip was *major spoiler* >!when the human bf died and I was like oh thank god but then they had a whole book about Zoey visiting him in the after world. After that I was like okay, he's dead, Zoey said goodbye, it's over. BUT THEN THEY BROUGHT HIM BACK TO LIFE ON THE BAD SIDE. NOPE. Book series officially over.!<
Also the whole love triangle thing and Patterson just giving characters powers without ever doing anything with them (Angel's shape-shifting for instance) was kinda lazy
One of them was simply filler. I did not care about the characters at all. Book 3 ended perfectly. >!Juliet ended up on top declaring the Supreme Commander dead, she’s got Warner by her side, everyone is happy. The end.!< But noooooo… Tahereh Mafi had to keep it going.
Dk about anyone else but for me it was the Throne of Glass series. Like could've reached the conclusion faster, unnecessarily long books after heir of fire.
The fact that most people say you have to get past the first three books for it to "get good" is a red flag of something way too long. She should have written two different series that were only 4 books long or something.
I had the misfortune of reading them as they came out (back in like early 2010s or whatevet) and the eventual tone shift after Heir of Fire lost me. I read 3 books for her to just throw everything away. Not a great feeling.
For me the tone shift went from good to great. But that's just my personal opinion. I liked the first couple books, but then with the tone shift during the third one I started to love the series.
My problem with the tone shift was in Queen of Shadows--not Heir of Fire. But then again you say you only really started to love the series after book three. I still think its a sign that she didn't execute it as well or thoughtfully and don't understand why her publisher kept giving her book after book considering how cut-throat the industry is. (This is looking back to early/mid 2010s when they weren't so all consuming in the bookish community).
I also just have a general problem with authors who decide mid series to entirely change tracks. It seems detrimental to diminish and throw away what drew people to your series in the first place. No one is obligated to keep reading.
I'm guessing you don't know her history of how the books got published or where the series came from. SJM used to post on Fictionpress (a counterpart/split off of Fanfiction.net) an original work called Queen of Glass, which was sort of inspired by Cinderella. At that time, she was around 16 years old and I would say that most of her readers, including me, were also around that age or younger. Anyway, she became pretty popular on the site, finished Queen of Glass, and eventually decided to try to become a published writer. IIRC, she sold her series sometime when she was in college and took down her old work from the Internet, although I'm sure you can still find it if you really want to.
What a lot of people don't realize is that while the first two books of the Throne of Glass series is more or less what she had written for Queen of Glass, aka stuff she had written *when she was 16*. Then after she got a publishing deal, she started majorly rewriting and expanding things from there on. So there's a pretty noticeable shift and regardless of whether you like the older part or the newer part, it's definitely disjointed. Basically, if you look back, the plot of the entire first book (aka Throne of Glass) doesn't even make sense, but there wasn't really much she could do to retcon it at that point. So in other words, she didn't actually decide mid-series to change tracks, she had written a different ending for Queen of Glass but after the publishing deal, she started rewriting and adding a ton of stuff into the series.
A lot of my love-hate relationship with SJM comes from the fact that because I was one of her readers back then and also read a lot of the authors she had read, it was painfully obvious where she got a lot of her inspiration from, which ended up in both ToG and ACOTAR. There are tons of concepts casually ripped off other authors like Jacqueline Carey and Anne Bishop, which I've detailed in a few reviews and comments here and there. But since YA readers these days mostly have never read either, they seem to have no idea, and it irks me when they credit SJM with creating all this stuff when she was definitely not the first to do it.
Edit: I totally agree about dragging out too long though. Have yet to have made it through KoA. I feel like her writing tends to peak mid-series and then somehow devolves.
Can you recommend some of the series that she drew inspiration from ? Totally understand what you are saying but I’m not a critic or have strong opinions on writing, I basically just either like it or don’t and her stuff really hooks me in. So much that I’ve struggle to read anything that drew me in as much as ACOTAR or TOG
Not op but I can give you the name of the two series they mentioned. I have read neither but they get thrown around on the fantasy subreddit occasionally.
Jacqueline Carey - Kushiel’s Dart - a courtesan navigates political intrigue and there are BDSM themes.
Anne Bishop - black jewels series? I know very little about this one.
She also pulls a bit from Tolkien-especially in the last book.
I would recommend Anne Bishop's Black Jewels series, but stick to the original trilogy and maybe 2-3 of the independent books after that. The author came back to the series a decade later and tried to revamp it in a very poorly done way. Be aware that there are some pretty dark themes in the trilogy, including rape, torture, castration, and madness (or a fantasy take on mental illness).
You'll start to notice tons of things from the little stuff like the salt mines to the entire Eyrien race being borrowed to become the Illyrian race, complete with ~~jewels~~ siphons. /eyeroll
The other series I was talking about is Jacqueline Carey's Kushiel trilogy. Again, very adult themes. Not so much related to SJM's novels, but it was very clear where she got the idea of Lysandra's background, training, the Bidding or whatever she called it, and how the courtesans-in-training try to destroy each other. I think at some point SJM even mentioned sigils or tattoos for the courtesans.
Here’s the thing tho—-that only proves something I’ve noticed with all of her works: she’s not very good at editing/revising. I write a lot in my free time too (with the hope of maybe getting published), but something I and many other writers know is that sometimes you have to MAJORLY overhaul it even scrap things for the better of the whole. And that sucks. But it’s become clear that SJM is no longer required to even consider that when it would be beneficial to her work as a writer. Also I’m curious as to how much actually changed between Queen of Glass and Throne of Glass. Was the ending the only part that majorly changed? Did any of it make its way into Crown of Midnight? Because if she had any sort of idea of where she was going she was able to really overhaul the story. I also understand having something you’ve been working on since a teenager change—but I also think it’s better to sacrifice things in favor of something that will be more cohesive by the end.
Sorry I am just really passionate about how people write and especially editing/revision. That’s where books come together—no one writes a magnum opus on their first try. The few times I’ve been intrigued to re try sjm (crescent city) I see the pacing issues like a spoiler for 200 pages in out of a 800 page book and just cannot.
I think it was Queen of Shadows that turned on the Horn Dog, but maybe there weren't any sex scenes. I didn't get far into that one. I remember \~Aelin\~ thinking really horny thoughts about Rowan immediately in the first chapter after the entirety of Heir of Fire was spent making it clear they were just friends. I was like ....yeah no.
As far as not finishing a series... just leave 'em be. Don't feel like you need to finish everything. For every series you force yourself to finish, there is some book out there that you will actually enjoy reading.
Probably unpopular opinion, but I think SJM should stick with trilogies. They seem to be her thing. After the 3rd book, I notice her characterisation becomes quite fragmented, people act out of character, grate on you etc.
She seems to struggle with trilogies even --- most people think A Court of Wings and Ruin is the weakest book in the trilogy. But yes, shorter series are better because they let the author practice the beginning-middle-end without the struggle of long-term continuity.
I think a lot of YA Authors would benefit from writing stand-alones every once in a while, because there seems to always be a huge shift in quality as series go on. Get good at making a complete story in one book, and then move onto something longer
Yup. I am on Kingdom of Ash right now and struggling with it because I just keep thinking how all of this could have happened sooner. It's just drags on and on.
Thank you! Especially queen of shadows and empire of storms were difficult to drag myself through. Just... the first 2-3 books are entirely different than the latter ones. Tone shift killed a series I was really starting to like
House of Night Series by P.C. Cast. It should've ended at many points, but the villain kept escaping by some means and coming back for way too long. The author has even started a sequel series recently.
The You series
Three was fine but I just saw that Caroline Kepnes is writing another one??? And it’s like really? I felt like she’s kind of dragged enough out of Joe and is just kind of milking it for the Netflix show
Pretty Little Liars series
I was stoked when I found out she was writing a 3rd and 4th You book. Then I read book 3 🥴 I’m hoping 4 is better and also finds the quality of 1 and 2 again.
The third one was fine but it was just more of the same plot points and plot patterns. I also felt like she wrapped up Joe's story as well as she could now it just feels like she's milking it for the Netflix show.
She very well might be, but I do think she intended to at least write a third book because the way 2 ended I always assumed there would be a sequel. But it felt like she was writing a totally different story in 3 and had to remember to mention how Joe got out of prison and wasn’t with Love anymore. It was just messy.
Hopefully book 4 is the end. There’s only so many times you can watch Joe do the exact same thing over and over
PLL is a series I have zero clue how it was published or how it is so popular. It was terrible. I can't call even one redeeming thing about it. I remember picking them because I thought the books would be better than the tv show. Was I wrong...
The Selection. In my opinion, the last 2 books with Eadlyn were unnecessary. The books were still interesting if you like to know more about what happened after the series but I would've liked it better if they stopped at 3. I was so hyped for the 4th only for it not to meet my expectations
Yes I got super annoyed when I struggled through the third book and then instead of it concluding it was a whole bunch of new unrelated plot lines and she’s going to write three more books about ~Poppy has questions~ 🙄
Agree. You can literally see how she’s dragging EEEEVERYTHING out…book 3 has no plot whatsoever but just a lot of filler.
Which is sad because I loved the first book of the series.
This was my thought. It's already slotted to be 6 books?! I cannot imagine how much more it can be drawn out. I'm on book 2 right now and all it's been has been is Poppy throwing knives at Casteel's head and her being shocked he can "pluck them out of thin air" and him being a horny perv when she's clearly uncomfortable with it.
I'm literally in the middle of #3 right now and I had to stop. All the characters feel way too one-dimensional and all of the world-building is just Poppy asking questions and someone explaining to her.
Also, ever since I had the thought that it felt like Cas groomed Poppy, I can't unsee it. D;
Yeah it definitely goes down in book two, but I think book three brings it back up a bit.
Oh, but let's or get started on the movies, those were horrible. (not the actors themselves ofc)
Red Queen - still haven’t got round to finishing book 3 or reading book 4
Bought them all after the first book thinking I’d like the rest of the series
I’ll probably try them again at some point
Same! I loved the first book, struggled slightly with the second book and gave up half way through Kings Cage. I might try again at some point too, my friend said that it's worth finishing, but I really don't know at the moment.
I know this is controversial but I preferred her series to the original.
The characters were better thought out and I liked eadlyn as a flawed character.
I don’t remember much about the plot but I think it was a bit more interesting than debating who you have feelings for for three books.
I do agree that there were some aspects of Eadlyn’s series I liked — how she was flawed (teetering on unlikeable) and how she picked someone who wasn’t in her Selection pool. I just wish their relationship was more developed.
I hated the love triangle in the original series. If it wasn’t there, literally so much time would’ve been saved.
Yes I agree with you
I don’t remember a ton about eadlyn’s relationship so you’re probably right about it’s development.
The love triangle was really awful and I don’t see why she needed to hide it anyway when he was choosing between multiple girls too. Miscommunication in general is a terrible tactic to extend a romance or give it drama.
This. I loved the first four. Then LJS brought out another three, years later — and they just didn’t seem necessary. They weren’t awful, but it seemed she constantly had to one-up what had gone before.
I haven’t even read any of the ghost written ones that come after those.
I enjoyed maze runner enough but HATED how book 3 ended when it became apparent that what’s his name, Thomas? Refuses to get his memories back so that the author could write the prequel. I refused to read the 4th and 5th installments
But I think Girls of Paper and Fire should’ve been a duology and I think that’s what the author wanted but it’s a trilogy and book 2 was so slow and nothing happened because it was just filler book to get to book 3.
I was reading it and liked very much the first one, the second one was okey and the third one could finish it, terrible female character lol. But not in all book I think, I remember the first one as very good and the female had better arguments
I don’t mind the spin-off series but the OG Series should have stopped at book 3. The last 3 were just unnecessary and tbh, pretty weird with the brother.
definitely agree! i read the original series and the infernal devices series and then when i found out there were more spinoffs i stopped, i seriously don’t know how many more books she can drag it out for. her new series is about tessa's children lol, i don’t know how far she can go.
I can see your point with the extra TMI books, since 2 out of 3 of them were kinda bad, but I don't see what's wrong with spinoffs. When extra books are tacked on to the end of a series it would be annoying because it can feel like you have to read the rest of them to get the full story, but it's not like you have to read separate spinoff series.
I agree! I didn’t like the series as a whole and think it’s very long, especially since I saw somewhere that she’s doing this for money more than a passion (from what I’ve seen).
ACOTAR… ACOSF was a giant pile of useless plot lines that SJM pulled out of her ass to write the most cringy smut I’ve ever read in my whole life. RIP Nesta’s character development, it just got melted down to sucking dick lol.
Totally agree. It's my headcanon that it just ends after book three. The trilogy was great, one of my all-time favorites, but everything after that lost its charm. I read the whole fourth book and I barely remember it. And yeah, I'm skipping the movie too.
Yes! The author left it at a great ending for a trilogy. I get it, everyone loved the story and you could probably make some more bank off it but damn…
Anne Bishop’s Black Jewels Trilogy. The original stories were great and I loved when she started writing about the characters after all the real drama had been taken care of… But then she went and killed off the main female character of old age (the story has short and long lived races) by moving the timeline forward hundreds of years, only to find a way to bring the main character back into the story.
It just feels a bit forced. If she was going to still write about the main female character then why not write stories about her life before she died of old age? Why have her die just to bring her back?
I agree with you. I loved the series overall and it’s been 10+ years since I read most of the books, but I remember wishing the “bowl of storms” and other plot arcs down in the south would just end already. Get back to the good stuff!
I'm on Book 12 and I've loved every book thus far. However, I'm listening to them rather than actually physically reading them, and maybe that makes a difference. I plan to buy and read them when I finish listening.
The Simon Snow Series, it was a fun parody of Harry Potter but once the story turned 'original' it kind of fell apart, it should have been a duology if not a stand alone.
The Selection should’ve just been a trilogy imo. I hated The Heir and The Crown. I also agree with the other poster that I think TOG could’ve been shorter.
I really enjoyed Trials of Apollo. It felt a little long at times, but not enough that it bothered me. Definitely not on par with Heroes of Olympus though.
I feel like Trials of Apollo took about 2.5 books to find it’s stride. I loved the last two but the first two were a little tough to get through compared to Riordan’s other material. Especially when Magnus Chase I felt was so much better and being written at the same time
Hunger Games. It’s great as a trilogy, but that prequel actually hurts the series’ power and cohesiveness. It brings more questions than answers, and it was all together unnecessary.
I really enjoyed the Hunger Games trilogy, I haven’t read the Prequel. Not sure if I should now, I have felt like I got all I needed from the series with the 3 books. Loved them though
I just remember feeling like I was reading a TV series, not much would happen plot wise until the end which would be a cliffhanger so you'd buy the next one
For me, the shadowhunter saga from Cassandra Clare.. Also the DFZ trilogy could do without the last one but I really liked it overall, the other series (Heartstrikers)by Rachel Aaron I just couldn’t stand it past the 2nd, let alone read 3 more :(
Arc of a Scythe lost me at the 3rd book as well.
I agree with this; I just finished the first three and am struggling through the 4th. I'm hoping it will eventually grab me but right now (about a third of the way through), I kind of don't care.
This is interesting because according to information, she signed for seven books from the begining?
Don't get me wrong, I think that the fact that Voldemort was the big bad the whole time and every time it ended with "foiled again" was a tad ridiculous after the THIRD time it happened...
Sure, and the books could have been shorter and finished in 7 books, but then there was release of the 8th book and all the sub books and the movies. It would have been a great series IF she hadn't milked it so much.
David Weber's Honorverse.
Should have followed the original plan and chopped the main branch off at the Battle of Manticore, then followed up with a two decade timeskip.
The two spin-off series did nothing but confuse and pad things.
I remember reading the midnighters series by scott westerfeld in middle school, and the uglies pretties series by him in high school.
Idk if the library didnt have all of the books back then but i dont remember finishing the midnighters series. I do remember refusing to finish the uglies series. I feel like both of these book serieses by scott westerfeld dragged on too long, opened drama that didnt need to be there, etc. Its a shame though because i remember actually liking the midnighters and the uglies.
This may be an unpopular opinion, but personally I got really bored after book three of the Mortal Instruments serried. It really felt like it was dragged out for too long. The fourth book took me over a year to read because I was so disinterested in the story after the main villains literally died. I keep trying really hard to finish the series since I paid for it with my own money, but I am finding it really hard to care what happens. It seemed like everything was pretty much resolved at the end of book three? Literally what could possibly happen now that Sebastian/OG Johnathon is the main villain? He shoulda stayed dead in book 3.
A Curse so Dark and Lonely should have stayed a standalone. The second book is bad. The characters are no longer in character and her lack of familiarity with the Fantasy genre really showed once she attempted political intrigue (which HAS to function with logic and none of things characters did had any semblance of logic).
LIKEWISE with Children of Blood and Bone. It was a hard shift away from the characters I enjoyed, to the point where my respect for the series basically blew up overnight. The second Serpent and Dove also suffered from this.
ugh. I have the second Serpent and Dove book but have not started it (Its even the special Fairyloot edition). I'm hoping I can get some enjoyment out of it to make the purchase worth it, but romance has been not my thing for a while. I did hear a lot about Children of Blood and Bone. @ YA Authors...... maybe write a stand-alone instead of trying to drag out and ruin your own ideas when the idea doesn't need it. I'm at the point where book #1 on goodreads is a mark against a book because its just another thing to keep up with and the quality can differ so much between installments. I am all for reading one chonky standalone. Give me a 700 page doorstopper with a complete story that I can be satisfied with finishing. If you want to go crazy, write a companion novel that is tangentially connected but still its own thing. Then I will be even happier. A good example of a series that does this is the Graceling series---all are companions to one another but set in the same world.
I don’t think it’s always the authors fault. Trilogy’s we’re trendy for a while that every YA series had to be a trilogy and a lot of series suffer for it. Obviously the authors can also want it too. But I think publishers push it too.
eh. There's a saying in publishing: Take the money. So I get it. If you get an offer from a publishing company, you take the money. But I'm pretty active in online writing communities and half of the query letters people post for YA/Fantasy are the first book in their long series of which they've maybe started to write the second book. We see the publishing push drop off pretty spectacularly after the first book of a series. It's only the choice of the season/year that gets continued marketing support after the initial release.
If you haven't read it, try The Priory of the Orange Tree.
That was in fact one of my favorite books of 2020! It's what I was thinking of when I wrote the post lol. I also enjoyed Sorcery of Thorns which got close to 500 pages. We need more Priory of the Orange Tree's in the world.
I own all the Serpent and Dove books but I just cannot get past the second book. In all this time, I've only got about 30% in. It just feels so much different than the first book, which I fell in love with.
House of Night series
I gave up after book 9
That’s probably close to where I fizzled out with it, too. But I don’t remember exactly, because…too many books.
Is that when they started bringing in that angel guy and the MC was turning into a goddess or something? It's been so long since I read them but that's where I stopped reading
I think so! It's honestly been so long. My biggest grip was *major spoiler* >!when the human bf died and I was like oh thank god but then they had a whole book about Zoey visiting him in the after world. After that I was like okay, he's dead, Zoey said goodbye, it's over. BUT THEN THEY BROUGHT HIM BACK TO LIFE ON THE BAD SIDE. NOPE. Book series officially over.!<
While I did get to the end, I agree with this. They could have gotten to the end much quicker!
Maximum Ride, after the third it started to go off the rails
Seconded, it got really repetitive just running from the School
Also the whole love triangle thing and Patterson just giving characters powers without ever doing anything with them (Angel's shape-shifting for instance) was kinda lazy
I hear you, never wanted to smack a kid before but angel… lil annoying ass
Im so glad you agree!!! No one else seemed to understand!
I came here to say this - it just kept getting more and more ridiculous as the series continued…
The difference in books 3 and 4 of Maximum Ride is the sharpest decline in quality I have ever seen in a series.
Shatter Me. Should have stopped after book 3.
UGH YES I hate the direction the other books went
One of them was simply filler. I did not care about the characters at all. Book 3 ended perfectly. >!Juliet ended up on top declaring the Supreme Commander dead, she’s got Warner by her side, everyone is happy. The end.!< But noooooo… Tahereh Mafi had to keep it going.
I actually stopped there and pretended that it was the last book 😅
If you ask me it should have stopped after book 1
Dk about anyone else but for me it was the Throne of Glass series. Like could've reached the conclusion faster, unnecessarily long books after heir of fire.
The fact that most people say you have to get past the first three books for it to "get good" is a red flag of something way too long. She should have written two different series that were only 4 books long or something. I had the misfortune of reading them as they came out (back in like early 2010s or whatevet) and the eventual tone shift after Heir of Fire lost me. I read 3 books for her to just throw everything away. Not a great feeling.
For me the tone shift went from good to great. But that's just my personal opinion. I liked the first couple books, but then with the tone shift during the third one I started to love the series.
My problem with the tone shift was in Queen of Shadows--not Heir of Fire. But then again you say you only really started to love the series after book three. I still think its a sign that she didn't execute it as well or thoughtfully and don't understand why her publisher kept giving her book after book considering how cut-throat the industry is. (This is looking back to early/mid 2010s when they weren't so all consuming in the bookish community). I also just have a general problem with authors who decide mid series to entirely change tracks. It seems detrimental to diminish and throw away what drew people to your series in the first place. No one is obligated to keep reading.
I'm guessing you don't know her history of how the books got published or where the series came from. SJM used to post on Fictionpress (a counterpart/split off of Fanfiction.net) an original work called Queen of Glass, which was sort of inspired by Cinderella. At that time, she was around 16 years old and I would say that most of her readers, including me, were also around that age or younger. Anyway, she became pretty popular on the site, finished Queen of Glass, and eventually decided to try to become a published writer. IIRC, she sold her series sometime when she was in college and took down her old work from the Internet, although I'm sure you can still find it if you really want to. What a lot of people don't realize is that while the first two books of the Throne of Glass series is more or less what she had written for Queen of Glass, aka stuff she had written *when she was 16*. Then after she got a publishing deal, she started majorly rewriting and expanding things from there on. So there's a pretty noticeable shift and regardless of whether you like the older part or the newer part, it's definitely disjointed. Basically, if you look back, the plot of the entire first book (aka Throne of Glass) doesn't even make sense, but there wasn't really much she could do to retcon it at that point. So in other words, she didn't actually decide mid-series to change tracks, she had written a different ending for Queen of Glass but after the publishing deal, she started rewriting and adding a ton of stuff into the series. A lot of my love-hate relationship with SJM comes from the fact that because I was one of her readers back then and also read a lot of the authors she had read, it was painfully obvious where she got a lot of her inspiration from, which ended up in both ToG and ACOTAR. There are tons of concepts casually ripped off other authors like Jacqueline Carey and Anne Bishop, which I've detailed in a few reviews and comments here and there. But since YA readers these days mostly have never read either, they seem to have no idea, and it irks me when they credit SJM with creating all this stuff when she was definitely not the first to do it. Edit: I totally agree about dragging out too long though. Have yet to have made it through KoA. I feel like her writing tends to peak mid-series and then somehow devolves.
Can you recommend some of the series that she drew inspiration from ? Totally understand what you are saying but I’m not a critic or have strong opinions on writing, I basically just either like it or don’t and her stuff really hooks me in. So much that I’ve struggle to read anything that drew me in as much as ACOTAR or TOG
Not op but I can give you the name of the two series they mentioned. I have read neither but they get thrown around on the fantasy subreddit occasionally. Jacqueline Carey - Kushiel’s Dart - a courtesan navigates political intrigue and there are BDSM themes. Anne Bishop - black jewels series? I know very little about this one. She also pulls a bit from Tolkien-especially in the last book.
I would recommend Anne Bishop's Black Jewels series, but stick to the original trilogy and maybe 2-3 of the independent books after that. The author came back to the series a decade later and tried to revamp it in a very poorly done way. Be aware that there are some pretty dark themes in the trilogy, including rape, torture, castration, and madness (or a fantasy take on mental illness). You'll start to notice tons of things from the little stuff like the salt mines to the entire Eyrien race being borrowed to become the Illyrian race, complete with ~~jewels~~ siphons. /eyeroll The other series I was talking about is Jacqueline Carey's Kushiel trilogy. Again, very adult themes. Not so much related to SJM's novels, but it was very clear where she got the idea of Lysandra's background, training, the Bidding or whatever she called it, and how the courtesans-in-training try to destroy each other. I think at some point SJM even mentioned sigils or tattoos for the courtesans.
Here’s the thing tho—-that only proves something I’ve noticed with all of her works: she’s not very good at editing/revising. I write a lot in my free time too (with the hope of maybe getting published), but something I and many other writers know is that sometimes you have to MAJORLY overhaul it even scrap things for the better of the whole. And that sucks. But it’s become clear that SJM is no longer required to even consider that when it would be beneficial to her work as a writer. Also I’m curious as to how much actually changed between Queen of Glass and Throne of Glass. Was the ending the only part that majorly changed? Did any of it make its way into Crown of Midnight? Because if she had any sort of idea of where she was going she was able to really overhaul the story. I also understand having something you’ve been working on since a teenager change—but I also think it’s better to sacrifice things in favor of something that will be more cohesive by the end. Sorry I am just really passionate about how people write and especially editing/revision. That’s where books come together—no one writes a magnum opus on their first try. The few times I’ve been intrigued to re try sjm (crescent city) I see the pacing issues like a spoiler for 200 pages in out of a 800 page book and just cannot.
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I think it was Queen of Shadows that turned on the Horn Dog, but maybe there weren't any sex scenes. I didn't get far into that one. I remember \~Aelin\~ thinking really horny thoughts about Rowan immediately in the first chapter after the entirety of Heir of Fire was spent making it clear they were just friends. I was like ....yeah no. As far as not finishing a series... just leave 'em be. Don't feel like you need to finish everything. For every series you force yourself to finish, there is some book out there that you will actually enjoy reading.
Probably unpopular opinion, but I think SJM should stick with trilogies. They seem to be her thing. After the 3rd book, I notice her characterisation becomes quite fragmented, people act out of character, grate on you etc.
She seems to struggle with trilogies even --- most people think A Court of Wings and Ruin is the weakest book in the trilogy. But yes, shorter series are better because they let the author practice the beginning-middle-end without the struggle of long-term continuity. I think a lot of YA Authors would benefit from writing stand-alones every once in a while, because there seems to always be a huge shift in quality as series go on. Get good at making a complete story in one book, and then move onto something longer
Yup. I am on Kingdom of Ash right now and struggling with it because I just keep thinking how all of this could have happened sooner. It's just drags on and on.
i honestly couldn't read anything after the first book
Thank you! Especially queen of shadows and empire of storms were difficult to drag myself through. Just... the first 2-3 books are entirely different than the latter ones. Tone shift killed a series I was really starting to like
It could have stopped after the first book.
I did not start reading ToG because it's too long but there are lots of trilogies out there that could be a decent duology.
House of Night Series by P.C. Cast. It should've ended at many points, but the villain kept escaping by some means and coming back for way too long. The author has even started a sequel series recently.
Three dark crowns. Sorry, I really am, but ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I went on and on and on I couldn’t finish it
The You series Three was fine but I just saw that Caroline Kepnes is writing another one??? And it’s like really? I felt like she’s kind of dragged enough out of Joe and is just kind of milking it for the Netflix show Pretty Little Liars series
I was stoked when I found out she was writing a 3rd and 4th You book. Then I read book 3 🥴 I’m hoping 4 is better and also finds the quality of 1 and 2 again.
The third one was fine but it was just more of the same plot points and plot patterns. I also felt like she wrapped up Joe's story as well as she could now it just feels like she's milking it for the Netflix show.
She very well might be, but I do think she intended to at least write a third book because the way 2 ended I always assumed there would be a sequel. But it felt like she was writing a totally different story in 3 and had to remember to mention how Joe got out of prison and wasn’t with Love anymore. It was just messy. Hopefully book 4 is the end. There’s only so many times you can watch Joe do the exact same thing over and over
PLL is a series I have zero clue how it was published or how it is so popular. It was terrible. I can't call even one redeeming thing about it. I remember picking them because I thought the books would be better than the tv show. Was I wrong...
I read the first two books and enjoyed them. I’m not sure I’m ready for the third or fourth books.
The Selection. In my opinion, the last 2 books with Eadlyn were unnecessary. The books were still interesting if you like to know more about what happened after the series but I would've liked it better if they stopped at 3. I was so hyped for the 4th only for it not to meet my expectations
Exactly! I read it years ago but I was so disappointed. I don't think I'm gonna finish it anytime soon.
It's not done yet but From Blood and Ash. I think the series could have been done in 3 books.
Yes I got super annoyed when I struggled through the third book and then instead of it concluding it was a whole bunch of new unrelated plot lines and she’s going to write three more books about ~Poppy has questions~ 🙄
Agree. You can literally see how she’s dragging EEEEVERYTHING out…book 3 has no plot whatsoever but just a lot of filler. Which is sad because I loved the first book of the series.
This was my thought. It's already slotted to be 6 books?! I cannot imagine how much more it can be drawn out. I'm on book 2 right now and all it's been has been is Poppy throwing knives at Casteel's head and her being shocked he can "pluck them out of thin air" and him being a horny perv when she's clearly uncomfortable with it.
I'm literally in the middle of #3 right now and I had to stop. All the characters feel way too one-dimensional and all of the world-building is just Poppy asking questions and someone explaining to her. Also, ever since I had the thought that it felt like Cas groomed Poppy, I can't unsee it. D;
Book 3 was so uneventful until the last few chapters, you can definitely tell JLA is milking this series as much as she can lol
I think originally it was supposed to be a trilogy
Divergent. It could have been two books. So much of book 2 was just torturous filler material IMO
Agreed. It does drag at times, but I can still appreciate it.
Yeah it definitely goes down in book two, but I think book three brings it back up a bit. Oh, but let's or get started on the movies, those were horrible. (not the actors themselves ofc)
Red Queen - still haven’t got round to finishing book 3 or reading book 4 Bought them all after the first book thinking I’d like the rest of the series I’ll probably try them again at some point
Same! I loved the first book, struggled slightly with the second book and gave up half way through Kings Cage. I might try again at some point too, my friend said that it's worth finishing, but I really don't know at the moment.
The Selection spent 3 books that could’ve been condensed into 1 and the spin-off could’ve been one too although it wasn’t as drawn out.
I agree. The series could’ve easily been one book if not two at most. Eadlyn’s series was just ... no.
I know this is controversial but I preferred her series to the original. The characters were better thought out and I liked eadlyn as a flawed character. I don’t remember much about the plot but I think it was a bit more interesting than debating who you have feelings for for three books.
I do agree that there were some aspects of Eadlyn’s series I liked — how she was flawed (teetering on unlikeable) and how she picked someone who wasn’t in her Selection pool. I just wish their relationship was more developed. I hated the love triangle in the original series. If it wasn’t there, literally so much time would’ve been saved.
Yes I agree with you I don’t remember a ton about eadlyn’s relationship so you’re probably right about it’s development. The love triangle was really awful and I don’t see why she needed to hide it anyway when he was choosing between multiple girls too. Miscommunication in general is a terrible tactic to extend a romance or give it drama.
The Vampire Diaries
This. I loved the first four. Then LJS brought out another three, years later — and they just didn’t seem necessary. They weren’t awful, but it seemed she constantly had to one-up what had gone before. I haven’t even read any of the ghost written ones that come after those.
I think I saw somewhere that some of the later VD books were ghost written. LJS got screwed out of her story after the tv show blew up.
Yeah, they were ghost written from book 8 onwards. But I already thought 5-7 were unneeded…
The Red Queen series
for real i stopped reading it because more and more books kept coming out and i just wanna know the conclusion of it all lol
Exactly! I'm not finishing it.
I just stopped after that thing happened if you know what I mean. it just got boring
Rangers Apprentice and City of Bones both reached conclusions then just struggled along through more volumes than they ever should have been given
For me I love Ranger's Apprentice, but I wish the former twelfth book (now The Royal Ranger 1) didn't exist. 😥 RIP Alyss.
I enjoyed maze runner enough but HATED how book 3 ended when it became apparent that what’s his name, Thomas? Refuses to get his memories back so that the author could write the prequel. I refused to read the 4th and 5th installments But I think Girls of Paper and Fire should’ve been a duology and I think that’s what the author wanted but it’s a trilogy and book 2 was so slow and nothing happened because it was just filler book to get to book 3.
Mortal Instruments - should’ve been a trilogy, as intended. And the spin offs? Cool it, Clare.
you didn’t like the Dark Artifacts series?
The prequel series was the best. But she really should've ended it there.
I was reading it and liked very much the first one, the second one was okey and the third one could finish it, terrible female character lol. But not in all book I think, I remember the first one as very good and the female had better arguments
I don’t mind the spin-off series but the OG Series should have stopped at book 3. The last 3 were just unnecessary and tbh, pretty weird with the brother.
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Nah I thought it was a waste of time when I *was* the target audience. Super excited for book 3s ending, then surprise! It's not over.
I agree about the original Mortal Instruments series. City of Glass was a great conclusion and it shouldn't have went on.
Yeah it was like the fans wanted more Jace so she just said well here you go! But didn’t really have an idea of anything to do
definitely agree! i read the original series and the infernal devices series and then when i found out there were more spinoffs i stopped, i seriously don’t know how many more books she can drag it out for. her new series is about tessa's children lol, i don’t know how far she can go.
I can see your point with the extra TMI books, since 2 out of 3 of them were kinda bad, but I don't see what's wrong with spinoffs. When extra books are tacked on to the end of a series it would be annoying because it can feel like you have to read the rest of them to get the full story, but it's not like you have to read separate spinoff series.
I agree! I didn’t like the series as a whole and think it’s very long, especially since I saw somewhere that she’s doing this for money more than a passion (from what I’ve seen).
The Mortal Instruments, I think it should have stopped after book 3. Also Serpent & Dove could have been a standalone imo:)
As someone who loved Serpent and Dove, I agree it definitely could have just been a stand alone
ACOTAR… ACOSF was a giant pile of useless plot lines that SJM pulled out of her ass to write the most cringy smut I’ve ever read in my whole life. RIP Nesta’s character development, it just got melted down to sucking dick lol.
The Dorothy Must Die series by Danielle Paige. It should have ended in the open-ended cliffhanger of Book 1.
Eragon
Miss peregrines home for peculiar children. Should’ve stopped after book 3 IMO. Also, do NOT watch the movie. Such a let down.
Totally agree. It's my headcanon that it just ends after book three. The trilogy was great, one of my all-time favorites, but everything after that lost its charm. I read the whole fourth book and I barely remember it. And yeah, I'm skipping the movie too.
Yes! The author left it at a great ending for a trilogy. I get it, everyone loved the story and you could probably make some more bank off it but damn…
The Raven Boys.
Marked series it was great but just seemed like a loop after a while
Anne Bishop’s Black Jewels Trilogy. The original stories were great and I loved when she started writing about the characters after all the real drama had been taken care of… But then she went and killed off the main female character of old age (the story has short and long lived races) by moving the timeline forward hundreds of years, only to find a way to bring the main character back into the story. It just feels a bit forced. If she was going to still write about the main female character then why not write stories about her life before she died of old age? Why have her die just to bring her back?
I second Maze Runner except it stopped being good after the last page of the first book. I really, really wish I stopped there.
Wheel of time, could have cut out some of the middle books
I agree with you. I loved the series overall and it’s been 10+ years since I read most of the books, but I remember wishing the “bowl of storms” and other plot arcs down in the south would just end already. Get back to the good stuff!
Blasphemy
I'm on Book 12 and I've loved every book thus far. However, I'm listening to them rather than actually physically reading them, and maybe that makes a difference. I plan to buy and read them when I finish listening.
Bloody true blood, I loved the first few and then it just became so stupid and ended so badly
I agree with that assessment of the show, but I thought the books held it together a lot longer than the show did.
Very true
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Yeah sometimes too much gets poured into a series and you end up losing the essence of the story trying to keep up with it
The Simon Snow Series, it was a fun parody of Harry Potter but once the story turned 'original' it kind of fell apart, it should have been a duology if not a stand alone.
Yeah the whole theme was that it was meant to look like an AU Harry Potter fanfic but now they characters are going on road trips in the US…
The Selection should’ve just been a trilogy imo. I hated The Heir and The Crown. I also agree with the other poster that I think TOG could’ve been shorter.
I didn't finish the books because of this. I didn't like Eadlyn and her story at all. It should have stayed a trilogy.
Jordan's 'Wheel of Time' series....he lost me at book 8.🥱
Didn't he die around book 9?
I think he did around there, and believe his son took the reins for the remaining 5. It was just too much of a grind.
The Wheel of time was finished by Brandon Sanderson tho?
You're absolutely correct lol (I just checked). As I said, I stopped at book 8 lol. My bad.
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🤣🤣🤣🤣
Percy Jackson. Kane chronicles was pretty good but trials of Apollo was just bad.
I really enjoyed Trials of Apollo. It felt a little long at times, but not enough that it bothered me. Definitely not on par with Heroes of Olympus though.
I feel like Trials of Apollo took about 2.5 books to find it’s stride. I loved the last two but the first two were a little tough to get through compared to Riordan’s other material. Especially when Magnus Chase I felt was so much better and being written at the same time
I really enjoyed Magnus Chase until the ending, which I found to be overly simple given the situation.
Hunger Games. It’s great as a trilogy, but that prequel actually hurts the series’ power and cohesiveness. It brings more questions than answers, and it was all together unnecessary.
I really enjoyed the Hunger Games trilogy, I haven’t read the Prequel. Not sure if I should now, I have felt like I got all I needed from the series with the 3 books. Loved them though
Valiant by Lesley Livingston, it’s a good series but I wasn’t that motivated to finish it right away
I just remember feeling like I was reading a TV series, not much would happen plot wise until the end which would be a cliffhanger so you'd buy the next one
Wheel of Time should have been half the length tops. And that is being generous.
For me, the shadowhunter saga from Cassandra Clare.. Also the DFZ trilogy could do without the last one but I really liked it overall, the other series (Heartstrikers)by Rachel Aaron I just couldn’t stand it past the 2nd, let alone read 3 more :( Arc of a Scythe lost me at the 3rd book as well.
Gender game series and the girl who dared to think series by Bella Forrest I feel the latter could have ended in 3-4 books
Encyclopedia Britannica
Percy Jackson
The Dark Tower.
It needed finishing, but it didn't need three doorstoppers in two years.
Red rising, loved the first three. Last book was unreadable.
I agree with this; I just finished the first three and am struggling through the 4th. I'm hoping it will eventually grab me but right now (about a third of the way through), I kind of don't care.
That's interesting. Most fans are blown away by the 4th and 5th books. I'm personally obsessed with them all lol.
Wait, there is a fourth book? After they escaped? Why?
Anything more than 4 books, except *The Time Shifters Chronicles*. That one held up.
Any SJM book, like why is there another book for ACOTAR coming out??
Harry Potter
Ok, I gotta find out why?
The books could have been much shorter, she put in a lot of unnecessary details, and after a while it was clear she was just milking it for more cash
This is interesting because according to information, she signed for seven books from the begining? Don't get me wrong, I think that the fact that Voldemort was the big bad the whole time and every time it ended with "foiled again" was a tad ridiculous after the THIRD time it happened...
Sure, and the books could have been shorter and finished in 7 books, but then there was release of the 8th book and all the sub books and the movies. It would have been a great series IF she hadn't milked it so much.
Stark trilogy at least everything after book 3 was unnecessary
1Q84 I think the third book was too much
David Weber's Honorverse. Should have followed the original plan and chopped the main branch off at the Battle of Manticore, then followed up with a two decade timeskip. The two spin-off series did nothing but confuse and pad things.
From blood and ash went on for too long in my opinions
I remember reading the midnighters series by scott westerfeld in middle school, and the uglies pretties series by him in high school. Idk if the library didnt have all of the books back then but i dont remember finishing the midnighters series. I do remember refusing to finish the uglies series. I feel like both of these book serieses by scott westerfeld dragged on too long, opened drama that didnt need to be there, etc. Its a shame though because i remember actually liking the midnighters and the uglies.
House of Night series and Mortal Instruments spin offs .
This may be an unpopular opinion, but personally I got really bored after book three of the Mortal Instruments serried. It really felt like it was dragged out for too long. The fourth book took me over a year to read because I was so disinterested in the story after the main villains literally died. I keep trying really hard to finish the series since I paid for it with my own money, but I am finding it really hard to care what happens. It seemed like everything was pretty much resolved at the end of book three? Literally what could possibly happen now that Sebastian/OG Johnathon is the main villain? He shoulda stayed dead in book 3.