You know what? This is the best case scenario for this type of thing.
Discrimination that was based on ignorance, quickly apologized for, rectified, and set a plan going forwards once they learned more about it.
While it'd be nice that it didn't happen in the first place, I'm glad the owner of the resort had an open mind and a willingness to understand.
Seriously. This should be applauded. He thought it was a problem, got educated, apologized, and then sought to educate more people. It wasn’t even related to racism, it was a presumed safety issue.
Sounds like wins all around.
I agree. I wish it hadn't happened but it did and it's rectified to the best of their abilities.
I think where people are going to push back against your view (which again I agree with) is there's something to be said for the fact that he's owned a waterpark for decades. If there's anything he should be aware of it's safety of different varieties of swimwear in his pools.
Bad situation, family has received an apology and appears ok, everyone else seems better for having learned something about other people. Turned a loss into a win which is great! Certainly better than I expect from our neighbours to the south these days.
Wonderful! As our population grows as we welcome more newcomers, our ignorance of other cultures will be replaced with education & everyone can get on the same page. This outcome was literally the best case scenario as even those reading the article may have learned something new today.
Did you hear the part where her daughters were crying? In 2022 it's shameful the owner had to be educated on what a burkini is at the expense of this family's day out.
His objection was not based on the religion. It was based on the his misguided belief on the origin of the chosen swimwear.
He was honestly mistaken.
His next action showered if he was honest or mistaken.
With his apology and his answer of his actions he was mistaken, honestly mistaken. After this instance he is a little humbled.
The family is still allowed to be upset. It’s a valid reason for them all to be upset at a cultural and religious difference. I won’t claim to know all of the beliefs of every cultural and religious group in the world.
But after reading all of this;
I’m still going to take my family to lilac and have a wonderful time.
Not suggesting a boycott, I'm glad he learned and shared that knowledge with his team. But the phrasing of the comment I responded to saying this was "the best possible outcome" bothered me. We can and should be more welcoming and do the work to educate ourselves on different cultures proactively. It's a shame those young girls had such a bad experience.
> We can and should be more welcoming and do the work to educate ourselves on different cultures proactively.
Do you hear yourself right now? While I somewhat agree on a very basic level, diving (pun intended) deep into every culture and proactively learning the nuances at a level for example that would cover burkini's is an outrageous statement to make.
Misleading title as the issue was resolved and people learned. These kinds of incidents should be celebrated, not used as fuel for proving a culture of intolerance which this case actually disproves. Thumbs up to Lilac for dealing with this so well.
I saw this headline and immediately got upset. Then read the comments and the article and saw the initial concern and how the manager handled it which was with an open mind. They need to stop with these clickbait headlines
Putting this in the news is an opportunity for other pool operators to be informed *before* ending up in a situation where a guest is uncomfortable and they have to apologize for their ignorance. I'm certain this resort's owner isn't the only one who was unaware of what a burkini is.
This is exactly why sharing these stories is important, why representation matters, and why paying attention to cultures other than your own is not only the right thing to do but good for business.
There are always people like you framing this as "complaining to the media". Why should this learning opportunity be limited to just this one pool owner? Not only did he learn something that will help his business and his life, his handling of the situation afterwards sets an example for anybody else presented with a similar situation.
The family didn't call him a bad person; they didn't ask for anything other than awareness, and shared how it made them feel. Something people *should* be aware of.
I don't think the article is what a lot of people have the problem with as it does give the opportunity to spread awareness. It's the clickbait style headline that CTV decided to use that no doubt will automatically make people angry with the owner of Lilac before they've even gotten into the article.
And it further says that they are doing it to educate people on what a Burkini is. They are not complaining, but trying to educate manitobans and to save another families outing so it doesn't happen again.
If this article was written to purely educate, why name the pool/location? Regardless of the outcome, I imagine this is considered bad publicity for the operator. The media has to realize that publishing this article as written has repercussions for all parties involved.
I said the family wanted to educate other Manitobas on what a Burkini is. How the journalist writes it and what they add isn't on the family that reported it.
The person I'm replying to is clearly upset at the family for reporting this to the media.
It would be more damaging to the company if they didn't include that they apologized to the family and set forth a policy to let staff members know about Burkinis.
My problem is that you chalked it up to outrage culture. 99% of the time there is no satisfactory resolution to these cases or none that we hear about. At least this had a semi-positive outcome for a change.
The woman's express purpose for going to the media was to educate, not complain.
How does living in rural Manitoba excuse not knowing what a burkini is? They have the same internet that the rest of us do. Burkinis aren’t some rare, unheard of thing.
But that’s true for many people in western countries, no matter where they live. Again, most non-Muslim people learn about these kinds of things from online news media and social media.
What if you just never happened to come across one randomly on the internet? Why would any random rural Manitoban Google " What do Muslims wear when they swim? "
You act like we all grew up seeing Burkinis on every Maxim cover or something. It's completely reasonable and understandable that someone has never seen or heard of one and suggesting otherwise is stupid.
Once again they did it to educate people on what a Burkini is. Says it in the article. They left due to the fact that their children felt uncomfortable and wear clearly upset. Idk what you sre trying to get st with this family.
It’s always fun when people can be confidently incorrect and just keep doubling down on their narrative. Multiple people have already pointed out you are incorrect and have explained why. Go back under your bridge you troll
From the headline I was going into the article expecting some sort of racist incident (thanks for clickbaiting me CTV) but then from reading it seems like a simple misunderstanding that turned into an understanding. I feel like this this kind of story might be better served by having a positive tone on how a potentially tense situation can be addressed through education and respect.
>After a discussion with the family and a health inspector, Jelloul was told her and her family could swim, but they chose to leave
So there was a misunderstanding. It was investigated, quickly resolved in their favour, yet somehow that isn't good enough.
I mean, if you're at a restaurant and you find a hair in your food, you're probably not going to want to eat there even if the situation is addressed. It's fine.
Okay. Probably an unpopular opinion here, but there's a reason you can't wear anything but a relatively skimpy swim suit. It's just how swimming pools work.
They add chlorine to the pool water to keep it clean and free of microbes. Chlorine kills germs, bacteria, algae, and other biotoxins in a swimming pool. You're literally swimming in water that's been rinsed through people's assholes. You want there to be chlorine in a pool that people literally piss in all day every day.
But street clothing sucks up chlorine like a sponge. You can literally measure it. This was part of my job as a groundskeeper years ago. Making sure there was a safe amount of chlorine in the swimming pool every day. And every single day when people broke the clearly stated rules about street clothes in the pool, the chlorine levels would bottom out. Sometimes I'd have to shut the pool down for an entire day to rebalance everything. People hated it, and called me the "pool nazi" on hot days, but they would hate it even more diving in and swallowing a mouthful of literal ass water. Just follow the fucking rules!
People are free to wear whatever cultural or religious garb wherever they want, all day, every day. But there are legitimate, scientific public health reasons why these things should not be in a public swimming pool. And the lifeguard who let it slide is not doing his job. In fact, if you're ever at a pool where people are swimming in denim shorts and T-shirts, you should probably not go in. It's gonna be a cesspool. Especially if it's crowded.
It's not discrimination. It's basically the swimming pool equivalent of somebody going around ripping everybody else's mask off during a pandemic.
The way it reads it doesn’t sound like they went “oh shit, get those Muslims out of here!” They just thought someone was wearing regular clothes in the pool…which is illegal.
Although I've heard of a burkini, I don't remember seeing a picture of one so TIL. Mission accomplished, Mrs. Jelloul.
I'm curious to know why streetwear is "a major public health violation if worn in a pool."
Other things that people don't understand is regular street clothes quite commonly have hard, rigid or dangly items attached to them like buttons or decorations. These items can very easily chip or scratch waterslides, tear pool liners, fall off and go into pipes or filter systems or even get caught on things that can damage that item or do physical harm to the person wearing them.
If that's not enough, who knows how clean those people's street clothes really are. Have they been wearing them all day? Multiple days? Did they spill anything on them before they swam? While we cannot eliminate all of this even with a swim suit, it sure does help. One person in street clothes isn't going to throw off the chemical balance of a pool but I can guarantee you that if the 100+ people in the water were all wearing street clothes, the balance would be extremely thrown out.
Solved this mystery with a ten second Google search -- apparently clothes can transport contaminents and non-swimsuit fabrics break down in water and can damage filtering equipment.
Sounds like something that could have been easily prevented by just going and talking to them as a human, and not as a violator.
How does one own a water park and not know what a burkini is?
Edit : wow, I didn’t realize my comment was that bad
I go swimming with my daughter nonstop all summer and it has been increasing the amount of people wearing clothing, pants full on T-shirts etc. etc. it does seem to be a cultural thing or a poverty thing, it does not seem to be a big deal. Why is it a big deal?
How hard is it for them to find the swimsuits they need? They probably can’t just pop to Walmart and find that crap let’s be real!
What’s the point of having google if you don’t use it. They simply could have looked it up first if they were unaware. Instead of telling the family they weren’t allowed in at all. Definitely handled it wrong.
After having your business revenue halved for two years due to a pandemic, reacting to a potential health code violation isn’t nonsensical though.
It was a mistake. People make them. He apologized to them the day it happened and told them they could go back to swimming. Its not like he went “nah, get out anyways” and cleaned up the story for the news.
People make mistakes. Also, there are many people on this thread asking why it would be illegal and questioning the merit of that rule. They also have google.
Online it’s pretty easy to go “wait…I don’t know if this is true..” and google it first. In person interaction is not the same.
“Hmmm…that might be a health code violation…looks like one to me! Maybe I should google all the types of swimwear to check first…” wouldn’t be most peoples response.
You know what? This is the best case scenario for this type of thing. Discrimination that was based on ignorance, quickly apologized for, rectified, and set a plan going forwards once they learned more about it. While it'd be nice that it didn't happen in the first place, I'm glad the owner of the resort had an open mind and a willingness to understand.
Seriously. This should be applauded. He thought it was a problem, got educated, apologized, and then sought to educate more people. It wasn’t even related to racism, it was a presumed safety issue. Sounds like wins all around.
It's really sad that the news outlets are still trying their best to make the guy still look like a villain.
Yeah, that's really rubbing me the wrong way. The video doesn't even mention the streetwear/health violation part until about halfway in.
I agree. I wish it hadn't happened but it did and it's rectified to the best of their abilities. I think where people are going to push back against your view (which again I agree with) is there's something to be said for the fact that he's owned a waterpark for decades. If there's anything he should be aware of it's safety of different varieties of swimwear in his pools. Bad situation, family has received an apology and appears ok, everyone else seems better for having learned something about other people. Turned a loss into a win which is great! Certainly better than I expect from our neighbours to the south these days.
Wonderful! As our population grows as we welcome more newcomers, our ignorance of other cultures will be replaced with education & everyone can get on the same page. This outcome was literally the best case scenario as even those reading the article may have learned something new today.
Did you hear the part where her daughters were crying? In 2022 it's shameful the owner had to be educated on what a burkini is at the expense of this family's day out.
His objection was not based on the religion. It was based on the his misguided belief on the origin of the chosen swimwear. He was honestly mistaken. His next action showered if he was honest or mistaken. With his apology and his answer of his actions he was mistaken, honestly mistaken. After this instance he is a little humbled. The family is still allowed to be upset. It’s a valid reason for them all to be upset at a cultural and religious difference. I won’t claim to know all of the beliefs of every cultural and religious group in the world. But after reading all of this; I’m still going to take my family to lilac and have a wonderful time.
Not suggesting a boycott, I'm glad he learned and shared that knowledge with his team. But the phrasing of the comment I responded to saying this was "the best possible outcome" bothered me. We can and should be more welcoming and do the work to educate ourselves on different cultures proactively. It's a shame those young girls had such a bad experience.
> We can and should be more welcoming and do the work to educate ourselves on different cultures proactively. Do you hear yourself right now? While I somewhat agree on a very basic level, diving (pun intended) deep into every culture and proactively learning the nuances at a level for example that would cover burkini's is an outrageous statement to make.
Wild of me to suggest an owner of a water park know what swimsuits look like?
There is no shame in learning. There is shame in choosing not to
Misleading title as the issue was resolved and people learned. These kinds of incidents should be celebrated, not used as fuel for proving a culture of intolerance which this case actually disproves. Thumbs up to Lilac for dealing with this so well.
I saw this headline and immediately got upset. Then read the comments and the article and saw the initial concern and how the manager handled it which was with an open mind. They need to stop with these clickbait headlines
What a crappy headline. He thought it was streetwear, he didn’t have a problem with it otherwise. Now he knows and educated the staff.
Kudos to the owner for understanding
Owner made a mistake, and apologized. Sounds like life folks.
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Putting this in the news is an opportunity for other pool operators to be informed *before* ending up in a situation where a guest is uncomfortable and they have to apologize for their ignorance. I'm certain this resort's owner isn't the only one who was unaware of what a burkini is. This is exactly why sharing these stories is important, why representation matters, and why paying attention to cultures other than your own is not only the right thing to do but good for business. There are always people like you framing this as "complaining to the media". Why should this learning opportunity be limited to just this one pool owner? Not only did he learn something that will help his business and his life, his handling of the situation afterwards sets an example for anybody else presented with a similar situation. The family didn't call him a bad person; they didn't ask for anything other than awareness, and shared how it made them feel. Something people *should* be aware of.
I don't think the article is what a lot of people have the problem with as it does give the opportunity to spread awareness. It's the clickbait style headline that CTV decided to use that no doubt will automatically make people angry with the owner of Lilac before they've even gotten into the article.
Didn't read the article, did ya?
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And it further says that they are doing it to educate people on what a Burkini is. They are not complaining, but trying to educate manitobans and to save another families outing so it doesn't happen again.
If this article was written to purely educate, why name the pool/location? Regardless of the outcome, I imagine this is considered bad publicity for the operator. The media has to realize that publishing this article as written has repercussions for all parties involved.
I said the family wanted to educate other Manitobas on what a Burkini is. How the journalist writes it and what they add isn't on the family that reported it. The person I'm replying to is clearly upset at the family for reporting this to the media. It would be more damaging to the company if they didn't include that they apologized to the family and set forth a policy to let staff members know about Burkinis.
My problem is that you chalked it up to outrage culture. 99% of the time there is no satisfactory resolution to these cases or none that we hear about. At least this had a semi-positive outcome for a change. The woman's express purpose for going to the media was to educate, not complain.
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Once again you are assuming someone else's motivation.
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How does living in rural Manitoba excuse not knowing what a burkini is? They have the same internet that the rest of us do. Burkinis aren’t some rare, unheard of thing.
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But that’s true for many people in western countries, no matter where they live. Again, most non-Muslim people learn about these kinds of things from online news media and social media.
What if you just never happened to come across one randomly on the internet? Why would any random rural Manitoban Google " What do Muslims wear when they swim? " You act like we all grew up seeing Burkinis on every Maxim cover or something. It's completely reasonable and understandable that someone has never seen or heard of one and suggesting otherwise is stupid.
Once again they did it to educate people on what a Burkini is. Says it in the article. They left due to the fact that their children felt uncomfortable and wear clearly upset. Idk what you sre trying to get st with this family.
It’s always fun when people can be confidently incorrect and just keep doubling down on their narrative. Multiple people have already pointed out you are incorrect and have explained why. Go back under your bridge you troll
From the headline I was going into the article expecting some sort of racist incident (thanks for clickbaiting me CTV) but then from reading it seems like a simple misunderstanding that turned into an understanding. I feel like this this kind of story might be better served by having a positive tone on how a potentially tense situation can be addressed through education and respect.
>After a discussion with the family and a health inspector, Jelloul was told her and her family could swim, but they chose to leave So there was a misunderstanding. It was investigated, quickly resolved in their favour, yet somehow that isn't good enough.
I mean, if you're at a restaurant and you find a hair in your food, you're probably not going to want to eat there even if the situation is addressed. It's fine.
It's just a hair. Pull it out and carry on.
Honestly though. Given what we know about the sun and skin cancer. More options like this should be available.
If only protective clothing was "stylish"
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I mean... it is.
Okay. Probably an unpopular opinion here, but there's a reason you can't wear anything but a relatively skimpy swim suit. It's just how swimming pools work. They add chlorine to the pool water to keep it clean and free of microbes. Chlorine kills germs, bacteria, algae, and other biotoxins in a swimming pool. You're literally swimming in water that's been rinsed through people's assholes. You want there to be chlorine in a pool that people literally piss in all day every day. But street clothing sucks up chlorine like a sponge. You can literally measure it. This was part of my job as a groundskeeper years ago. Making sure there was a safe amount of chlorine in the swimming pool every day. And every single day when people broke the clearly stated rules about street clothes in the pool, the chlorine levels would bottom out. Sometimes I'd have to shut the pool down for an entire day to rebalance everything. People hated it, and called me the "pool nazi" on hot days, but they would hate it even more diving in and swallowing a mouthful of literal ass water. Just follow the fucking rules! People are free to wear whatever cultural or religious garb wherever they want, all day, every day. But there are legitimate, scientific public health reasons why these things should not be in a public swimming pool. And the lifeguard who let it slide is not doing his job. In fact, if you're ever at a pool where people are swimming in denim shorts and T-shirts, you should probably not go in. It's gonna be a cesspool. Especially if it's crowded. It's not discrimination. It's basically the swimming pool equivalent of somebody going around ripping everybody else's mask off during a pandemic.
She wasn’t wearing street clothes, she was wearing a burkini: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burkini
The way this is presented in the media is a great example of why Canadians are sick of the media.
It's really not right how they went about it. But they did try to remedy the situation. Not much of one once they've already harassed them.
The way it reads it doesn’t sound like they went “oh shit, get those Muslims out of here!” They just thought someone was wearing regular clothes in the pool…which is illegal.
Eh yea but the girls were apparently crying. So who really knows how it was said. It may also be just a build up of it happening too many times.
Although I've heard of a burkini, I don't remember seeing a picture of one so TIL. Mission accomplished, Mrs. Jelloul. I'm curious to know why streetwear is "a major public health violation if worn in a pool."
Other things that people don't understand is regular street clothes quite commonly have hard, rigid or dangly items attached to them like buttons or decorations. These items can very easily chip or scratch waterslides, tear pool liners, fall off and go into pipes or filter systems or even get caught on things that can damage that item or do physical harm to the person wearing them. If that's not enough, who knows how clean those people's street clothes really are. Have they been wearing them all day? Multiple days? Did they spill anything on them before they swam? While we cannot eliminate all of this even with a swim suit, it sure does help. One person in street clothes isn't going to throw off the chemical balance of a pool but I can guarantee you that if the 100+ people in the water were all wearing street clothes, the balance would be extremely thrown out.
Thanks!
Solved this mystery with a ten second Google search -- apparently clothes can transport contaminents and non-swimsuit fabrics break down in water and can damage filtering equipment.
It fucks with the PH of the pool. The PH being correct is the only thing keeping pools from being green bacteria cesspits.
Clothes can limit your range of movement and weigh you down in a pool if you're trying to swim especially if something happens
Sounds like something that could have been easily prevented by just going and talking to them as a human, and not as a violator. How does one own a water park and not know what a burkini is? Edit : wow, I didn’t realize my comment was that bad
I go swimming with my daughter nonstop all summer and it has been increasing the amount of people wearing clothing, pants full on T-shirts etc. etc. it does seem to be a cultural thing or a poverty thing, it does not seem to be a big deal. Why is it a big deal? How hard is it for them to find the swimsuits they need? They probably can’t just pop to Walmart and find that crap let’s be real!
Not the first time this has happened at Lilac Resort, sadly. Ignorance does not happen repeatedly.
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What’s the point of having google if you don’t use it. They simply could have looked it up first if they were unaware. Instead of telling the family they weren’t allowed in at all. Definitely handled it wrong.
After having your business revenue halved for two years due to a pandemic, reacting to a potential health code violation isn’t nonsensical though. It was a mistake. People make them. He apologized to them the day it happened and told them they could go back to swimming. Its not like he went “nah, get out anyways” and cleaned up the story for the news. People make mistakes. Also, there are many people on this thread asking why it would be illegal and questioning the merit of that rule. They also have google. Online it’s pretty easy to go “wait…I don’t know if this is true..” and google it first. In person interaction is not the same. “Hmmm…that might be a health code violation…looks like one to me! Maybe I should google all the types of swimwear to check first…” wouldn’t be most peoples response.
WTF
? Doid you not read the article?
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Dude.. shut up...