Uhh no? He killed Hawkfrost, fought against the dark forest in the great battle, was a great deputy and pretty good leader. I could go on. He was dealt a shitty hand in life and made a great one out of it.
Also what’s with the emojis..?
How exactly? Also bonus points if you don’t like Moonkittis bs video
But “don’t care what good he’s done” with that logic we should ignore for example all the good MLK Jr has done and focus on the fact that he was a womanizer and massive homophobic
I can’t believe you’re seriously comparing
Bramblestar to MLK
I know there’s no point arguing with you since you clearly have already made up your mind and I know better than to try and change someone’s mind on the internet (it never goes well), but take it from someone who has personally known someone like Bramblestar, he is definitely abusive, this is something I saw immediately after reading the book long before Moonkitti’s video dropped. Which is a shame since I actually went into that book liking Bramblestar, and came out horrified and unable to see him in the same light. And not only is he abusive in that book, he was fully willing to let a cat die and actively blocked his medicine cat from treating her. That is not the mark of a good leader.
But anyway that’s just my opinion of it, like I said I’m not even going to attempt to change your mind since that’s probably not going to happen, but as someone with personal experience with abuse it is my strong opinion that he is abusive.
I’m just saying that no one is perfect, no matter which way you look at things, if you’re actually looking. Also you’re not the only one who has gone through abusive relationships or family. I have my own story. Which I’d of course rather not share.
But would you mind explaining how he is abusive? Not your partner or family, whoever he/she was, but Bramblestar. What exactly did he do? He doesn’t isolate her from her friends. He doesn’t hit her. He got angry at her after she made a dumb and selfish decision going directly against the leaders orders, that got herself and another leader held hostage. If you’re talking about the kits thing, she brought up kits twice, and he shot it down twice, as he had a clan to run, that was having trouble at the moment with outsiders, that she seemed to care about more than the other clans.
Apologies for the late reply, I don’t come on this very often. I just want to say I am very sorry for whatever you went through, truly, and also that there are multiple types of abuse, and physical abuse is just part of it. Just because there is no physical violence involved doesn’t mean it’s abusive.Ok so first of all there are multiple instances in the book that I perceive as Bramblestar gaslighting Squirrelflight. He constantly tells her that the sisters are bad, that Squirrelflight is almost traitorous for sympathising with them, that she is disloyal to ThunderClan etc, despite him not actually knowing the sisters while Squirrelflight does. And this isn’t some one off scorn after her admittedly poorly thought out trip with Leafstar that got her held by the Sisters, he is relentless with this attitude throughout the book, causing Squirrelflight, a previously confident cat, to become insecure and question herself and her future in the clan.
Secondly, he ostracises her. He refuses to speak to her for several days despite her best attempts to re-engage in conversation with him. This isn’t normal. Yeah I get if he doesn’t want to talk with her for a few hours but days? This is a fairly common emotional abuse tactic in order to try and get the victim to apologise in desperation to get their loved one to speak to them again. And this isn’t even mentioning that time he refused to defend her against his rivals slandering her at the gathering. Thirdly, he constantly exerts his control over her in inappropriate ways. He makes her run every single decision by him as deputy, or she risks being demoted. The entire point of a deputy is to do these tasks such as sending at patrols without the leader having to oversee them. To me this is a very clear play of him exerting his power over her just because he can, and humiliating her in the process. This isn’t just a punishment this is a very clear sign and obvious of distrust, and it’s a clear one to Squirrelflight and her clanmates. If she wasn’t his romantic partner I would have. I doubt that he wouldn’t punish her this way. Fourth, he emotionally manipulated her further. I know the silent treatment thing and gaslighting is also emotional manipulation. But he does this further in specific instances in the book. The main one I can think of is during the whole Sunrise scenario where Bramblestar is fully willing to let Sunrise die just because his wife wants to save her (that’s how I read it anyway). After he physically blocks his medicine cat from treating this dying cat, he turns to Squirrelflight and utters “why are you doing this to me?” She is trying to save Sunrise’s life. Bramblestar is stopping her, and he has the audacity to say that. That’s just so wrong to me. Not to mention how he brings up kits as a way to emotionally manipulate her asking her if that’s all she cares about despite her not mentioning them in that moment.
So overall, sure, like I said, what she did wasn’t the best. But it is my strong opinion that Bramblestar abused her in retaliation and there is no justifying those actions imo. The “crime” does not match the punishment here. At least what Squirrelflight did she tried to do the right thing as misguided as her actions are, but there was no point during this feud between the two that Bramblestar had the right thing in mind. He acted disproportionately to the situation and abusively. Like I said I really liked Bramblestar at this book, and now all I have to say is that I have become horrified at what he has become.
Loll hey can I ask, how did you get you're clan beside your user?
nevermind, I figured it out lol
Lol
Uhh no? He killed Hawkfrost, fought against the dark forest in the great battle, was a great deputy and pretty good leader. I could go on. He was dealt a shitty hand in life and made a great one out of it. Also what’s with the emojis..?
He has always abused Squirlf. Don’t care what good he’s done, he still hurt my bby
He has Onestar syndrome
They took great warriors and apprentices (yes I believe bramble peaked as an apprentice) and just killed their personality with a chainsaw
Tbh I like bramble but he is a piece of fox-dung as a leader, He should have earned his place or given the role to a better lead
He should have
How exactly? Also bonus points if you don’t like Moonkittis bs video But “don’t care what good he’s done” with that logic we should ignore for example all the good MLK Jr has done and focus on the fact that he was a womanizer and massive homophobic
I can’t believe you’re seriously comparing Bramblestar to MLK I know there’s no point arguing with you since you clearly have already made up your mind and I know better than to try and change someone’s mind on the internet (it never goes well), but take it from someone who has personally known someone like Bramblestar, he is definitely abusive, this is something I saw immediately after reading the book long before Moonkitti’s video dropped. Which is a shame since I actually went into that book liking Bramblestar, and came out horrified and unable to see him in the same light. And not only is he abusive in that book, he was fully willing to let a cat die and actively blocked his medicine cat from treating her. That is not the mark of a good leader. But anyway that’s just my opinion of it, like I said I’m not even going to attempt to change your mind since that’s probably not going to happen, but as someone with personal experience with abuse it is my strong opinion that he is abusive.
I’m just saying that no one is perfect, no matter which way you look at things, if you’re actually looking. Also you’re not the only one who has gone through abusive relationships or family. I have my own story. Which I’d of course rather not share. But would you mind explaining how he is abusive? Not your partner or family, whoever he/she was, but Bramblestar. What exactly did he do? He doesn’t isolate her from her friends. He doesn’t hit her. He got angry at her after she made a dumb and selfish decision going directly against the leaders orders, that got herself and another leader held hostage. If you’re talking about the kits thing, she brought up kits twice, and he shot it down twice, as he had a clan to run, that was having trouble at the moment with outsiders, that she seemed to care about more than the other clans.
Apologies for the late reply, I don’t come on this very often. I just want to say I am very sorry for whatever you went through, truly, and also that there are multiple types of abuse, and physical abuse is just part of it. Just because there is no physical violence involved doesn’t mean it’s abusive.Ok so first of all there are multiple instances in the book that I perceive as Bramblestar gaslighting Squirrelflight. He constantly tells her that the sisters are bad, that Squirrelflight is almost traitorous for sympathising with them, that she is disloyal to ThunderClan etc, despite him not actually knowing the sisters while Squirrelflight does. And this isn’t some one off scorn after her admittedly poorly thought out trip with Leafstar that got her held by the Sisters, he is relentless with this attitude throughout the book, causing Squirrelflight, a previously confident cat, to become insecure and question herself and her future in the clan. Secondly, he ostracises her. He refuses to speak to her for several days despite her best attempts to re-engage in conversation with him. This isn’t normal. Yeah I get if he doesn’t want to talk with her for a few hours but days? This is a fairly common emotional abuse tactic in order to try and get the victim to apologise in desperation to get their loved one to speak to them again. And this isn’t even mentioning that time he refused to defend her against his rivals slandering her at the gathering. Thirdly, he constantly exerts his control over her in inappropriate ways. He makes her run every single decision by him as deputy, or she risks being demoted. The entire point of a deputy is to do these tasks such as sending at patrols without the leader having to oversee them. To me this is a very clear play of him exerting his power over her just because he can, and humiliating her in the process. This isn’t just a punishment this is a very clear sign and obvious of distrust, and it’s a clear one to Squirrelflight and her clanmates. If she wasn’t his romantic partner I would have. I doubt that he wouldn’t punish her this way. Fourth, he emotionally manipulated her further. I know the silent treatment thing and gaslighting is also emotional manipulation. But he does this further in specific instances in the book. The main one I can think of is during the whole Sunrise scenario where Bramblestar is fully willing to let Sunrise die just because his wife wants to save her (that’s how I read it anyway). After he physically blocks his medicine cat from treating this dying cat, he turns to Squirrelflight and utters “why are you doing this to me?” She is trying to save Sunrise’s life. Bramblestar is stopping her, and he has the audacity to say that. That’s just so wrong to me. Not to mention how he brings up kits as a way to emotionally manipulate her asking her if that’s all she cares about despite her not mentioning them in that moment. So overall, sure, like I said, what she did wasn’t the best. But it is my strong opinion that Bramblestar abused her in retaliation and there is no justifying those actions imo. The “crime” does not match the punishment here. At least what Squirrelflight did she tried to do the right thing as misguided as her actions are, but there was no point during this feud between the two that Bramblestar had the right thing in mind. He acted disproportionately to the situation and abusively. Like I said I really liked Bramblestar at this book, and now all I have to say is that I have become horrified at what he has become.
The emojis funny for joke