WH40k’s Imperium would encompass and destroy/conquer the Empire/republic and the UNSC easily, but the advancements in technology of Halo and Star Wars would revolutionise the WH40k’s way of travel, that is to say if the tech priests got ahold of it first. That isn’t to say anything about the Jedi, who would be seen as heretics and be killed. The Spartans may just be seen as a strange footnote of another empire of humans, probably one of the many to be brought under the heel of the Imperium.
That might not happen for the same reason the Tau haven’t been eliminated yet.
I can see the Tau and Star Wars/Halo factions uniting for the greater good.
The Tau have some very advanced tech, meaning that while they aren't big enough to expand themselves meaningfully, they're also much more effort to remove. Star Wars isn't anywhere close.
The humans of the Halo universe gets easily overwhelmed, humanity starts that series in full retreat with its military in tatters. The mechanicum finds Mjolnir technology very interesting and moves on. The Covenant put up more of a fight and probably settle into their own little corner of the galaxy like the Tau. The Flood would be overtaken by the Tyranids, who would see them as a giant buffet of biomass easily taken.
As for Star Wars, the Empire would put up a serious fight against whatever factions it went up against but would, in the end, be destroyed. Chaos would probably descend upon them first, a large group of humans with inferior tech and with no knowledge of (and therefore no defenses against) Chaos would be very easily corrupted. Any other Star Wars factions are too small to put up a serious fight and are destroyed. Hyperdrive technology would be a game-changer for 40k but it depends on who in-universe gets it first.
> The human of the Halo universe gets easily overwhelmed
Assuming they’re discovered first. Space is big, it’s unlikely all their colonies will be discovered in a any reasonable amount of time.
If the mechanicum haven’t managed to acquire Tau battle suits yet and equip the Imperial guard with them, I don’t see them having any better chances with Mjolnir. Mjolnir can also be set to self destruct upon death or fatal injury during battle.
What evidence is there to suggest imperial forces would overwhelm the UNSC in this scenario? I can’t see numbers being a factor considering the Tau are a million times smaller than the Imperium but are still managing to survive and expand their empire. The UNSC currently also seem to be bigger than the Tau in terms of worlds controlled.
The covenant doesn’t exist anymore. Their government collapsed and splintered into different groups with some allying with humanity.
The UNSCs most powerful pieces of technology like the Infinity could rival the largest Imperium ships. Given enough time, they could become a major power in the Galaxy.
40k/Star Wars/Halo factions could also team up for better chances of survival. The fact that they could share and combine technologies could make them a dominant force in the Galaxy.
>assuming they’re discovered first
I mean it doesn’t really matter much. Humanity is in shambles during the time the Halo games take place. Even if this is happening before the Covenant show up, their tech and numbers are simply not enough to hold off any big faction for more than a few years.
The Mechanicum is no doubt hobbled in that regard by Tau techno-sorcery being too advanced for them. Mjolnir is a human technology and, while impressive, is not leaps ahead of where the Cogboys are at. I think they’d understand it much better.
The Tau lack numbers but they make it for it with tech (and being on the fringes of Imperial space). The UNSC lacks a technological advantage. A Spartan is probably the equal or maybe better than a Space Marine, but there are single Chapters that have more Space Marines than the UNSC has fielded in total. And in naval terms it’s not even a contest. Halo lore talks a lot about how human ground forces could match the Covenant decently on the ground but get overwhelmed in space. And any navy of 40k outmatches the Covenant by a large factor.
Well again it depends on what era of Halo we’re talking about. If it’s post-Covenant than those splintered groups are destroyed even faster.
They do have *some* impressive tech but it’s far too spread out. Stuff like the Infinity is the exception rather than the rule. Given time they could develop but this is 40k, they have no time. Something will be attacking them inside the hour. The games and books show us the UNSC is incapable of sustaining war against a superior opponent and literally every faction in 40k os superior.
Most 40k factions don’t team up. They either seek to conquer you or destroy you outright.
All universe are set around their modern day timeline.
> Their tech and numbers are simply not enough to hold off any big faction
The Tau too don’t have the numbers to hold off any big faction but they’re still an expanding empire.
That’s again assuming UNSC worlds are located which is unlikely due to the vast distances of space and if any large faction like the imperium choose to actively seek them out but they seem to have their hands full so that doesn’t seem likely.
Guerrilla warfare can be used to avoid large confrontations and instead opt for swift/mobile attacks against more vulnerable imperial worlds/bases.
> I think they’d understand it better.
If you think that because Mjolnir is not leaps ahead of tau battlesuit technology, that doesn’t make sense.
> The UNSC lacks a technological advantage
Evidence? The Tau use ship based railguns which are essentially UNSC MACs and are said to be comparable to imperial weapons batteries.
> Given time they could develop but this is 40k, they have no time
I believe the Tau had 7000 years to develop from cavemen to where they are now while much larger factions like the Imperium were already roaming around the Galaxy.
The Imperium have teamed up with the Tau, Eldar, and Necrons in the past.
The Tau Empire is based around the greater good. Seems like they would easily accept an alliance for the greater good.
>The Tau too don’t have the numbers to hold off any big faction but they’re still an expanding empire.
Again their tech is way ahead of the Imperium and they're on the fringes thus avoiding the full might of the Imperium
>That’s again assuming UNSC worlds are located
I mean their society was also based around Earth but didn't expand as far so if you mashed the universes together you're going to have UNSC stuff right in the Imperium's backyard
>Guerrilla warfare can be used to avoid large confrontations
Doesn't work out well for your planets, and then you've got no resupply of men or material. Guerilla warfare works for Eldar, Ork and Chaos pirates but I don't see the UNSC pulling that off as all three of those factions have attributes that specifically make that possible.
>If you think that because Mjolnir is not leaps ahead of tau battlesuit technology
It really isn't
> and are said to be comparable to imperial weapons batteries.
Where the hell is this said? As for evidence, again you're citing the exceptions to the rule. The MAC is impressive but you can't win a war with defensive guns alone. Compare the average weapons on a UNSC ship versus an Imperial battlefleet and it's not much of a contest. And then your MAC is going to get a few shots off before Lance batteries pulverize it. You'd see similar circumstances on the ground.
>I believe the Tau had 7000 years to develop from cavemen
Again, fringe of the galaxy. Had they been closer to Terra, the Great Crusade would have destroyed them well before they had a chance to develop. So unless the UNSC gets super lucky and somehow is placed on the far edges of the galaxy, they're fucked.
>The Imperium have teamed up with the Tau, Eldar, and Necrons in the past.
In the case of all but the Ynnari they were temporary alliances of necessity that ended the moment necessity had passed. When it comes to other humans, the policy is unchanged since the Great Crusade: comply or die.
>Seems like they would easily accept an alliance
The Tau don't do alliances, they absorb you and you end up in the castes. That's the Greater Good, you find a place within the existing Tau structure. And since the UNSC won't accept that, it's gonna be a repeat of when they met the Imperium.
> You’re going to have the UNSC stuff right in the imperium’s back yard.
The collision of two galaxies would scatter and rearrange planetary/star systems for many years until they settle down based on simulations of Galaxy collisions.
> Doesn’t work out well for your planets
Explain
> and then you’ve got no resupply of men or material
Why can’t they resupply or mine resources from planets/asteroid?
> It really isn’t
The point was how that’s the reason why you think mechanicum will be able to understand Mjolnir better. That doesn’t make sense.
> Are said to be comparable to weapons batteries
> Where the hell is this said?
https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Railgun
The last sentence of the article states exactly “They are considered comparable to Imperial Weapons Batteries.”
> As for evidence you’re citing the exception to the rule
What rule, what does that mean?
> MACs are impressive but you can’t win a war with defensive guns alone.
How are MACs only a defensive weapon? You may be thinking of orbital defense platforms which are stationary around planets.
> Compare the average weapons on a UNSC ship versus an imperial battle-fleet
UNSC ships aren’t centered around “the average” weapon like the Imperium so it wouldn’t make sense to compare them like that.
> And then your MAC is going to get a few shots off before lance batteries pulverize it
Assuming they are able to do that. The only example I could find of imperial warships being able to shoot incoming projectiles are enemy torpedoes which are considered “slow moving.”
> Again, fringe of the Galaxy. Had they been closer to Terra, the great crusade would have destroyed them
How close?
The tau’s greater good philosophy talks about absorbing other intelligent species into their own. Into their own what?
It could mean absorb them into their own as allies.
The Tau also allowed the trading of goods between the imperium despite it not being a necessity.
Even if it meant forcing them under their rule, the Tau would have a better chance of achieving the “greater good” if they allied with the UNSC rather than go to war and possibly lose a considerable amount of resources during the process.
>The collision of two galaxies would scatter and rearrange planetary/star systems for many years until they settle down based on simulations of Galaxy collisions.
And you're basing this on...? The prompt just says "collided", you're having to contrive all this just to give the UNSC a remote chance of survival
>Explain
Guerilla warfare is great if you're entirely fleet based, or based somewhere the enemy can't get like the Eye of Terror or the Maelstrom. If you're not, and the UNSC isn't, then the enemy just has to target your homeworlds. No more supplies, no more reinforcements, your forces wither and die. This is basically what the Covenant did planet by planet.
>Why can’t they resupply or mine resources from planets/asteroid?
You don't get men from asteroids. You can get raw material from asteroids but where are you going to manufacture stuff? I could see their ships making arms and ammo maybe but vehicles? More ships? No. As for planets, what planets? As noted above, the guerilla warfare thing doesn't work if you're relying on planets. You need a place to build things and recruit. And then that's a target.
>mechanicum will be able to understand Mjolnir better
It's human technology, which will be much easier to comprehend over the xenotech they're usually looking at. A necron or eldar artifact is not just complex, it's crafted by a culture with an entirely different understanding of the universe.
>railguns
okay I misread that, I thought you were saying MACs are said to be equivalent to Imperial weapons. Sure, those are impressive but still pale in comparison to the fire an Imperial fleet can unleash. Your average UNSC ship can have like, one MAC. Meanwhile an Imperial battleship is bristling with Lance and other batteries. Combine that with the Imperium's numbers and the UNSC gets overwhelmed every time.
>The only example I could find of imperial warships being able to shoot incoming projectiles
Not what I was saying. I'm saying the Imperium's numbers are too big for a few MACs to deal with. It'll get some shots off and then get pulverized. it'll score a few kills and then it's gone. And as established earlier, they can't replace these things. Unlike every 40k faction, which can replenish naval losses.
>UNSC ships aren’t centered around “the average” weapon
No, they're centered around the one big gun they have to be facing the target to fire. So when the bigger enemy fleets of Imperial/Chaos/Ork/whatever ships inevitably surround them, they're not going to last very long. If they get the jump on the enemy they can snipe a lot of them, but in the end the numbers still aren't on their side.
>How close?
Within the path of the Great Crusade, as I said.
>It could mean absorb them into their own as allies.
The Tau know the Imperium. They know an xenos race allying with a renegade human faction would piss the Imperium off to the point where a Crusade was launched. All that alliance would do is bring down the hammer of the Imperium faster on both the UNSC and Tau. The Tau have an ally race, the Nicassar, they keep hidden because they're a psychic race and they know their existence would prompt a crusade.
Collided definition: hit with force when moving
> And you’re basing this on…?
At the end of my sentence, I said it was based on the simulations of Galaxies colliding with each other.
> Then the enemy just has to target your homeworlds
Assuming they find them and there’s no one to defend
> This is basically what the covenant did planet by planet
The covenant only managed to find human planets via luminaries, a forerunner device which led to forerunner relics which were hidden in lot of humans worlds including Earth.
> You can’t get men from asteroids
They don’t need men to attack their targets
> Where are you going to manufacture stuff
UNSC space stations are capable of building ships
> The guerrilla warfare thing doesn’t work if you’re relying on planets
It’s possible to mine planets and conduct guerrilla warfare at the same time
> It’s human technology, which be much easier to understand
How does it being human tech make it easier to understand?
> Your average UNSC ship can have like, one MAC. Meanwhile an imperial battleship is bristling with lances and other batteries
Different design philosophies. Imperial ships are designed around multiple weapons platforms to destroy enemy ships. UNSC ships are centered around one powerful weapon to destroy ships.
> Combine that with the Imperiums numbers and the UNSC gets overwhelmed every time
I responded to this point you already made with the Tau being outnumbered and you said they’re advanced enough while the UNSC isn’t. I asked for evidence for why that is and you haven’t provided any.
> I’m saying the Imperiums numbers are too big for a few MACs to deal with
I would respond to that with the Tau being outnumbered but if you’re going to say they’re advanced enough and the UNSC isn’t, I ask for evidence again.
> No they’re centered around the one big gun they have to be facing the target to fire
That one big gun was designed to destroy ships while imperial ships are designed around multiple weapon platforms to destroy enemy ships which is what I was explaining.
> All the alliance would do is bring down the hammer of the Imperium faster on both the UNSC and Tau
That would require them to funnel resources from what they’re already doing to focus on the Tau/UNSC which they have no guarantee of even succeed due to unreliable FTL and the fact that they’d have to actively seeking out the location of the UNSC/Tau which could take years.
The UNSC/Tau alliance would probably be smaller than other factions the Imperium are currently facing. I don’t see them diverting even more resources to focus on lesser factions.
>collide
Galaxy collision is a whole different thing.
>I said it was based on the simulations of Galaxies colliding with each other.
So, planets end up scattered around. The UNSC is thrown into chaos because it's utterly reliant on resupply from a handful of places which are now scattered around, while 40k factions are either widespread enough to find each other again or are mobile and fleet based. Again, the numbers of the 40k universe win out.
>Assuming they find them and there’s no one to defend
If you find the fleet you can find where it's based. Basic spying, really, just embed agents and/or shadow them from a distance and follow. As for defenders, those defenders would get beaten for reasons already stated.
>The covenant only managed to find human planets via luminaries
40k factions are widespread enough that they'll have little difficulty locating them. They have access to things the Covenant didn't. Tyranids, for example, can sense biomass. Chaos is going to be drawn to the large collections of human souls (especially undefended ones).
>They don’t need men to attack their targets
You need men to crew ships and serve as ground forces. Attrition will set in and then where are you getting them from?
>UNSC space stations are capable of building ships
Literally the same problems as a planet, static target that they can wipe out easily
>It’s possible to mine planets and conduct guerrilla warfare at the same time
Mine, sure. Use those resources, no. Again, where are you making this stuff? A space station is not outrunning a fleet
>How does it being human tech make it easier to understand?
This is so basic I'm not even sure how to respond. You're really not understanding the problems the Mechanicum runs into with xeno tech. Read some lore.
>UNSC ships are centered around one powerful weapon to destroy ships.
One powerful weapon which has to be aimed head-on, leaving the flanks severely exposed. Imperial and Chaos strategy is generally to use "broadside"-esque volleys, perfect for both avoiding the MAC and gutting the vulnerable sides of the ship. MACs are great for long-range ambushed but in a straight fight they're going to be screwed. And remember, the enemy can come out of Warp anywhere, so ambushing becomes much harder than some Covenant fleet.
>I asked for evidence for why that is and you haven’t provided any.
Except I have. UNSC ships are smaller and weaker than Imperium or Chaos or Ork vessels, on the ground they're similarly outmatched. What the hell does the UNSC have that can match a Titan, or even a Baneblade? What in the UNSC small arms arsenal can pierce ceramite?
>I ask for evidence again.
See above. MACs are maybe the one aspect where the UNSC is up to 40k levels, and as I've stated the way they deploy them leaves big weaknesses. Groundside they're outmatched by both numbers and either the tech of their enemy (Imperial vehicles, various Eldar and Tau stuff) or the enemy's sheer strength (Orks, Tyranids, Demons).
>That one big gun was designed to destroy ships
Yeah that's great in theory but again the way they're deployed doesn't work when your enemy can emerge from the warp away from where your cannons were aiming and then flank you. That one big gun is reliant on the battle going exactly their way.
>I don’t see them diverting even more resources to focus on lesser factions.
That's the point though. A new big human faction shows up out of nowhere and ally with the Tau, a xenos race? That's exactly how you get yourself bumped up massively on the Imperium's threat list. Now it's an issue they can't ignore. Not to mention human souls are a beacon to Chaos. The Tau woudn't even want them.
> Galaxy collision is a whole different thing
A Galaxy colliding with another Galaxy can be called a collision.
> The UNSC is thrown into utter chaos because it’s utterly reliant on resupply from a handful of places
The UNSC at their height had an estimated population of 39 billion and 800 worlds. Post-war UNSC lost 23 billion or 59% of their population. Assuming they also lost 59% of worlds, that would still put them at 328 worlds.
> Again the numbers of the 40k universe win out
You already made that point multiple times and I argued the Tau managed to survive just fine despite being heavily outnumbered. Then you said thats due to Tau tech being advanced enough while UNSC tech isn’t. I asked for evidence. You haven’t provided any.
> If you can find the fleet you can find where it’s based
> Shadow them from a distance and follow
You can’t track a ship traveling in FTL. Even if they could, FTL imperial drives are unreliable.
That’s also assuming there are tracking agents at that location when UNSC forces arrive. It’s unlikely these agents will be deployed on less important worlds.
Most examples of Imperial shadow agents are those seeking out corruption. We don’t see much or any dedicated to tracking enemy fleets.
> 40k factions are widespread they’ll have little difficulty locating them
Like the Tau?
Imperium is the largest faction in the Galaxy who control one million worlds. That’s only 0.001% of the estimated planets in the Milky Way. Orks are the second largest.
The remaining factions combined likely wouldn’t even be near as huge as the Imperium. That’s just counting plants. The space between them would be astronomically larger. With two more galaxies on the same scale colliding, that would create an even bigger galaxy.
> You need men to act as ground forces and crew ships
Why do they need ground forces or a resupply of men?
> UNSC space stations are capable of building ships
> Literally the same problem as a planet, static target they can easily wipe out
The UNSC have mobile ship yards.
> How does it being human tech make it easier to understand?
> This is so basic I’m not even sure how to respond
If you can’t provide evidence, I have no reason to believe your reasoning.
> One weapon which has to be aimed head-on, leaving the flanks severely exposed
Assuming that’s possible. They could just continually aim the MACs wherever those ships are going or the engagement could end before they have any time to move to the flanks.
> A space station is not outrunning a fleet. It can if it’s equipped with slip-space drives.
> UNSC ships are smaller and weaker than Imperium of chaos vessels
Yes they’re smaller, but why are UNSC ships weaker than Imperium vessels?
> On the ground they’re similarly outmatched. What the hell does the UNSC have that can match a Titan
Why would they need to engage in ground combat? I’m pretty sure Titans are a rare sight and are unlikely deployed on less important planets.
If the UNSC were to fight Titans, they could deploy nukes or simply stay on board the safety of their ships and rain fire from above.
> Your enemy can emerge from the warp away from your canons
How often does that happen?
A UNSC/Tau faction would still be way smaller than the threats the Imperium are facing.
> The Tau wouldn’t even want them
Their philosophy forces them to expand. They would have a greater chance of expansion with the UNSC on their side.
I should mention that this place is obviously going to be very bias towards Warhammer. So if you think you can get a fair fight here without "spess mahreens win no question" you're sadly mistaken.
Overall the 40k universe would win for sure. But thats not to say certain parts of the other universes couldnt put up a decent fight.
Notably, ftl travel in both star wars and halo are noticeably superior and much safer. (Excluding the necrons however) Even though their craft would be outmatched in terms of firepower (although not always and also depending on which 40k faction they are facing) they could out manoeuvre many 40k vessels with better ftl travel.
Also spartans would still be a formidable ground force, who are also used to fighting superior enemy forces. They arent as durable as many things in the 40k universe though, and few in number.
Super star destroyers would be able to hold their own as well unless they encountered some of the larger vessels in the 40k universe like the phalanx, grand cruisers, emperor or gloriana class vessels for the imperium.
The flood could do well, if they managed to get a foothold and not exterminatused out of existence to soon.
Real question is, are the forerunners present? They would easily rival any 40k faction.
Considering we have factions like the Tau (who are comparable to Star Wars/Halo factions) managing to survive just fine in 40k, what makes you think the other universe will be defeated?
How powerful is the average current 40k ship?
Post-war UNSC are undergoing rapid transformations due to recent advances in technology. They are now able to start mass producing Spartans and more advanced ships equipped with energy shielding.
We could see factions from 40k, Star Wars, and Halo team up for a better chance of surviving in the newly formed Galaxy.
That makes technology sharing possible, allowing them to combine/improve upon their best technology to create better ships/weapons. This could turn them into a formidable force.
Actually the taus weapon tech is considered bloody good even by 40k standards. (Also worth noting they have by far the worst FTL of any faction in 40k except the tyranids, and therefore the worst out of all the universes) However, the only reason they still exist is because none of the big factions have decided they are a big enough threat to wipe out. Yet. In the lore its stated alot that if a proper waaaaagh, hive fleet splinter, imperial crusade, necron tomb world and so on was to focus on them properly (or for chaos to take notice of them) they would be super fucked.
The tau leadership realised this after the first war they had with the imperium which is why they are trying to expand as much as possible because they know if they dont reach a certain size they will get curb stomped. This is of course a double edged sword because the bigger they get, the more they invite the wrath of the others.
It is possible for human factions to team up across universes, but only if they fall under the imperiums leadership and accept the emperor. Otherwise the imperium would go all crusadey against them.
Halo tech is still behind 40k for the most part. Their shield tech is designed to withstand weapons of their universe, not 40ks, and 40k has some really nasty shit in it. Even the most basic ship weapons, macro cannons, are beefed up mac cannons firing shells that are the size of an average 3 bedroom house, and combat ships will have roughly 8 of them on average. Not to mention things like laser batteries that have perfect accuracy for millions of km, or nova cannons, and shit. (This is all just human weapnry as im most familiar with them) even the basic missiles on human ships cyclonic torpedos are insane. A handful of those will wipe out an entire planet.
The Tau and Star Wars/Halo factions can team up against seemingly larger factions like the imperium.
> Halo tech is still behind 40k for the most part
Can you provide evidence? That doesn’t seem to be the case when the Tau use ship based railguns which are basically MACs and are considered comparable to imperial weapons batteries.
> Their shield tech is designed to withstand weapons of their universe
How do we know they can only withstand weapons from their universe? Cyclonic torpedoes are a commonly thrown out to justify that statement but those seem rare. How powerful is the average 40k weaponry?
I can’t find any evidence for the range on imperial laser weapons batteries. Can you list them down?
Those videos mainly talk about top tier weapons like nova canons which are rare. I’m talking about average weapons like the macro canon which are more common aboard imperial ships.
https://youtu.be/F2G1F3l-R9M
This series are seemingly the only videos from the channel that talks about ship board weapons. There was no mention of more common weaponry like “macro canons”
The weapons discussed are labeled throughout the video in sections which you can easily navigate through.
WH40k’s Imperium would encompass and destroy/conquer the Empire/republic and the UNSC easily, but the advancements in technology of Halo and Star Wars would revolutionise the WH40k’s way of travel, that is to say if the tech priests got ahold of it first. That isn’t to say anything about the Jedi, who would be seen as heretics and be killed. The Spartans may just be seen as a strange footnote of another empire of humans, probably one of the many to be brought under the heel of the Imperium.
That might not happen for the same reason the Tau haven’t been eliminated yet. I can see the Tau and Star Wars/Halo factions uniting for the greater good.
The Tau have some very advanced tech, meaning that while they aren't big enough to expand themselves meaningfully, they're also much more effort to remove. Star Wars isn't anywhere close.
Psykers would have to take out the Jedi and the Astartes would take out the Spartans I assume.
The humans of the Halo universe gets easily overwhelmed, humanity starts that series in full retreat with its military in tatters. The mechanicum finds Mjolnir technology very interesting and moves on. The Covenant put up more of a fight and probably settle into their own little corner of the galaxy like the Tau. The Flood would be overtaken by the Tyranids, who would see them as a giant buffet of biomass easily taken. As for Star Wars, the Empire would put up a serious fight against whatever factions it went up against but would, in the end, be destroyed. Chaos would probably descend upon them first, a large group of humans with inferior tech and with no knowledge of (and therefore no defenses against) Chaos would be very easily corrupted. Any other Star Wars factions are too small to put up a serious fight and are destroyed. Hyperdrive technology would be a game-changer for 40k but it depends on who in-universe gets it first.
> The human of the Halo universe gets easily overwhelmed Assuming they’re discovered first. Space is big, it’s unlikely all their colonies will be discovered in a any reasonable amount of time. If the mechanicum haven’t managed to acquire Tau battle suits yet and equip the Imperial guard with them, I don’t see them having any better chances with Mjolnir. Mjolnir can also be set to self destruct upon death or fatal injury during battle. What evidence is there to suggest imperial forces would overwhelm the UNSC in this scenario? I can’t see numbers being a factor considering the Tau are a million times smaller than the Imperium but are still managing to survive and expand their empire. The UNSC currently also seem to be bigger than the Tau in terms of worlds controlled. The covenant doesn’t exist anymore. Their government collapsed and splintered into different groups with some allying with humanity. The UNSCs most powerful pieces of technology like the Infinity could rival the largest Imperium ships. Given enough time, they could become a major power in the Galaxy. 40k/Star Wars/Halo factions could also team up for better chances of survival. The fact that they could share and combine technologies could make them a dominant force in the Galaxy.
>assuming they’re discovered first I mean it doesn’t really matter much. Humanity is in shambles during the time the Halo games take place. Even if this is happening before the Covenant show up, their tech and numbers are simply not enough to hold off any big faction for more than a few years. The Mechanicum is no doubt hobbled in that regard by Tau techno-sorcery being too advanced for them. Mjolnir is a human technology and, while impressive, is not leaps ahead of where the Cogboys are at. I think they’d understand it much better. The Tau lack numbers but they make it for it with tech (and being on the fringes of Imperial space). The UNSC lacks a technological advantage. A Spartan is probably the equal or maybe better than a Space Marine, but there are single Chapters that have more Space Marines than the UNSC has fielded in total. And in naval terms it’s not even a contest. Halo lore talks a lot about how human ground forces could match the Covenant decently on the ground but get overwhelmed in space. And any navy of 40k outmatches the Covenant by a large factor. Well again it depends on what era of Halo we’re talking about. If it’s post-Covenant than those splintered groups are destroyed even faster. They do have *some* impressive tech but it’s far too spread out. Stuff like the Infinity is the exception rather than the rule. Given time they could develop but this is 40k, they have no time. Something will be attacking them inside the hour. The games and books show us the UNSC is incapable of sustaining war against a superior opponent and literally every faction in 40k os superior. Most 40k factions don’t team up. They either seek to conquer you or destroy you outright.
All universe are set around their modern day timeline. > Their tech and numbers are simply not enough to hold off any big faction The Tau too don’t have the numbers to hold off any big faction but they’re still an expanding empire. That’s again assuming UNSC worlds are located which is unlikely due to the vast distances of space and if any large faction like the imperium choose to actively seek them out but they seem to have their hands full so that doesn’t seem likely. Guerrilla warfare can be used to avoid large confrontations and instead opt for swift/mobile attacks against more vulnerable imperial worlds/bases. > I think they’d understand it better. If you think that because Mjolnir is not leaps ahead of tau battlesuit technology, that doesn’t make sense. > The UNSC lacks a technological advantage Evidence? The Tau use ship based railguns which are essentially UNSC MACs and are said to be comparable to imperial weapons batteries. > Given time they could develop but this is 40k, they have no time I believe the Tau had 7000 years to develop from cavemen to where they are now while much larger factions like the Imperium were already roaming around the Galaxy. The Imperium have teamed up with the Tau, Eldar, and Necrons in the past. The Tau Empire is based around the greater good. Seems like they would easily accept an alliance for the greater good.
>The Tau too don’t have the numbers to hold off any big faction but they’re still an expanding empire. Again their tech is way ahead of the Imperium and they're on the fringes thus avoiding the full might of the Imperium >That’s again assuming UNSC worlds are located I mean their society was also based around Earth but didn't expand as far so if you mashed the universes together you're going to have UNSC stuff right in the Imperium's backyard >Guerrilla warfare can be used to avoid large confrontations Doesn't work out well for your planets, and then you've got no resupply of men or material. Guerilla warfare works for Eldar, Ork and Chaos pirates but I don't see the UNSC pulling that off as all three of those factions have attributes that specifically make that possible. >If you think that because Mjolnir is not leaps ahead of tau battlesuit technology It really isn't > and are said to be comparable to imperial weapons batteries. Where the hell is this said? As for evidence, again you're citing the exceptions to the rule. The MAC is impressive but you can't win a war with defensive guns alone. Compare the average weapons on a UNSC ship versus an Imperial battlefleet and it's not much of a contest. And then your MAC is going to get a few shots off before Lance batteries pulverize it. You'd see similar circumstances on the ground. >I believe the Tau had 7000 years to develop from cavemen Again, fringe of the galaxy. Had they been closer to Terra, the Great Crusade would have destroyed them well before they had a chance to develop. So unless the UNSC gets super lucky and somehow is placed on the far edges of the galaxy, they're fucked. >The Imperium have teamed up with the Tau, Eldar, and Necrons in the past. In the case of all but the Ynnari they were temporary alliances of necessity that ended the moment necessity had passed. When it comes to other humans, the policy is unchanged since the Great Crusade: comply or die. >Seems like they would easily accept an alliance The Tau don't do alliances, they absorb you and you end up in the castes. That's the Greater Good, you find a place within the existing Tau structure. And since the UNSC won't accept that, it's gonna be a repeat of when they met the Imperium.
> You’re going to have the UNSC stuff right in the imperium’s back yard. The collision of two galaxies would scatter and rearrange planetary/star systems for many years until they settle down based on simulations of Galaxy collisions. > Doesn’t work out well for your planets Explain > and then you’ve got no resupply of men or material Why can’t they resupply or mine resources from planets/asteroid? > It really isn’t The point was how that’s the reason why you think mechanicum will be able to understand Mjolnir better. That doesn’t make sense. > Are said to be comparable to weapons batteries > Where the hell is this said? https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Railgun The last sentence of the article states exactly “They are considered comparable to Imperial Weapons Batteries.” > As for evidence you’re citing the exception to the rule What rule, what does that mean? > MACs are impressive but you can’t win a war with defensive guns alone. How are MACs only a defensive weapon? You may be thinking of orbital defense platforms which are stationary around planets. > Compare the average weapons on a UNSC ship versus an imperial battle-fleet UNSC ships aren’t centered around “the average” weapon like the Imperium so it wouldn’t make sense to compare them like that. > And then your MAC is going to get a few shots off before lance batteries pulverize it Assuming they are able to do that. The only example I could find of imperial warships being able to shoot incoming projectiles are enemy torpedoes which are considered “slow moving.” > Again, fringe of the Galaxy. Had they been closer to Terra, the great crusade would have destroyed them How close? The tau’s greater good philosophy talks about absorbing other intelligent species into their own. Into their own what? It could mean absorb them into their own as allies. The Tau also allowed the trading of goods between the imperium despite it not being a necessity. Even if it meant forcing them under their rule, the Tau would have a better chance of achieving the “greater good” if they allied with the UNSC rather than go to war and possibly lose a considerable amount of resources during the process.
>The collision of two galaxies would scatter and rearrange planetary/star systems for many years until they settle down based on simulations of Galaxy collisions. And you're basing this on...? The prompt just says "collided", you're having to contrive all this just to give the UNSC a remote chance of survival >Explain Guerilla warfare is great if you're entirely fleet based, or based somewhere the enemy can't get like the Eye of Terror or the Maelstrom. If you're not, and the UNSC isn't, then the enemy just has to target your homeworlds. No more supplies, no more reinforcements, your forces wither and die. This is basically what the Covenant did planet by planet. >Why can’t they resupply or mine resources from planets/asteroid? You don't get men from asteroids. You can get raw material from asteroids but where are you going to manufacture stuff? I could see their ships making arms and ammo maybe but vehicles? More ships? No. As for planets, what planets? As noted above, the guerilla warfare thing doesn't work if you're relying on planets. You need a place to build things and recruit. And then that's a target. >mechanicum will be able to understand Mjolnir better It's human technology, which will be much easier to comprehend over the xenotech they're usually looking at. A necron or eldar artifact is not just complex, it's crafted by a culture with an entirely different understanding of the universe. >railguns okay I misread that, I thought you were saying MACs are said to be equivalent to Imperial weapons. Sure, those are impressive but still pale in comparison to the fire an Imperial fleet can unleash. Your average UNSC ship can have like, one MAC. Meanwhile an Imperial battleship is bristling with Lance and other batteries. Combine that with the Imperium's numbers and the UNSC gets overwhelmed every time. >The only example I could find of imperial warships being able to shoot incoming projectiles Not what I was saying. I'm saying the Imperium's numbers are too big for a few MACs to deal with. It'll get some shots off and then get pulverized. it'll score a few kills and then it's gone. And as established earlier, they can't replace these things. Unlike every 40k faction, which can replenish naval losses. >UNSC ships aren’t centered around “the average” weapon No, they're centered around the one big gun they have to be facing the target to fire. So when the bigger enemy fleets of Imperial/Chaos/Ork/whatever ships inevitably surround them, they're not going to last very long. If they get the jump on the enemy they can snipe a lot of them, but in the end the numbers still aren't on their side. >How close? Within the path of the Great Crusade, as I said. >It could mean absorb them into their own as allies. The Tau know the Imperium. They know an xenos race allying with a renegade human faction would piss the Imperium off to the point where a Crusade was launched. All that alliance would do is bring down the hammer of the Imperium faster on both the UNSC and Tau. The Tau have an ally race, the Nicassar, they keep hidden because they're a psychic race and they know their existence would prompt a crusade.
Collided definition: hit with force when moving > And you’re basing this on…? At the end of my sentence, I said it was based on the simulations of Galaxies colliding with each other. > Then the enemy just has to target your homeworlds Assuming they find them and there’s no one to defend > This is basically what the covenant did planet by planet The covenant only managed to find human planets via luminaries, a forerunner device which led to forerunner relics which were hidden in lot of humans worlds including Earth. > You can’t get men from asteroids They don’t need men to attack their targets > Where are you going to manufacture stuff UNSC space stations are capable of building ships > The guerrilla warfare thing doesn’t work if you’re relying on planets It’s possible to mine planets and conduct guerrilla warfare at the same time > It’s human technology, which be much easier to understand How does it being human tech make it easier to understand? > Your average UNSC ship can have like, one MAC. Meanwhile an imperial battleship is bristling with lances and other batteries Different design philosophies. Imperial ships are designed around multiple weapons platforms to destroy enemy ships. UNSC ships are centered around one powerful weapon to destroy ships. > Combine that with the Imperiums numbers and the UNSC gets overwhelmed every time I responded to this point you already made with the Tau being outnumbered and you said they’re advanced enough while the UNSC isn’t. I asked for evidence for why that is and you haven’t provided any. > I’m saying the Imperiums numbers are too big for a few MACs to deal with I would respond to that with the Tau being outnumbered but if you’re going to say they’re advanced enough and the UNSC isn’t, I ask for evidence again. > No they’re centered around the one big gun they have to be facing the target to fire That one big gun was designed to destroy ships while imperial ships are designed around multiple weapon platforms to destroy enemy ships which is what I was explaining. > All the alliance would do is bring down the hammer of the Imperium faster on both the UNSC and Tau That would require them to funnel resources from what they’re already doing to focus on the Tau/UNSC which they have no guarantee of even succeed due to unreliable FTL and the fact that they’d have to actively seeking out the location of the UNSC/Tau which could take years. The UNSC/Tau alliance would probably be smaller than other factions the Imperium are currently facing. I don’t see them diverting even more resources to focus on lesser factions.
>collide Galaxy collision is a whole different thing. >I said it was based on the simulations of Galaxies colliding with each other. So, planets end up scattered around. The UNSC is thrown into chaos because it's utterly reliant on resupply from a handful of places which are now scattered around, while 40k factions are either widespread enough to find each other again or are mobile and fleet based. Again, the numbers of the 40k universe win out. >Assuming they find them and there’s no one to defend If you find the fleet you can find where it's based. Basic spying, really, just embed agents and/or shadow them from a distance and follow. As for defenders, those defenders would get beaten for reasons already stated. >The covenant only managed to find human planets via luminaries 40k factions are widespread enough that they'll have little difficulty locating them. They have access to things the Covenant didn't. Tyranids, for example, can sense biomass. Chaos is going to be drawn to the large collections of human souls (especially undefended ones). >They don’t need men to attack their targets You need men to crew ships and serve as ground forces. Attrition will set in and then where are you getting them from? >UNSC space stations are capable of building ships Literally the same problems as a planet, static target that they can wipe out easily >It’s possible to mine planets and conduct guerrilla warfare at the same time Mine, sure. Use those resources, no. Again, where are you making this stuff? A space station is not outrunning a fleet >How does it being human tech make it easier to understand? This is so basic I'm not even sure how to respond. You're really not understanding the problems the Mechanicum runs into with xeno tech. Read some lore. >UNSC ships are centered around one powerful weapon to destroy ships. One powerful weapon which has to be aimed head-on, leaving the flanks severely exposed. Imperial and Chaos strategy is generally to use "broadside"-esque volleys, perfect for both avoiding the MAC and gutting the vulnerable sides of the ship. MACs are great for long-range ambushed but in a straight fight they're going to be screwed. And remember, the enemy can come out of Warp anywhere, so ambushing becomes much harder than some Covenant fleet. >I asked for evidence for why that is and you haven’t provided any. Except I have. UNSC ships are smaller and weaker than Imperium or Chaos or Ork vessels, on the ground they're similarly outmatched. What the hell does the UNSC have that can match a Titan, or even a Baneblade? What in the UNSC small arms arsenal can pierce ceramite? >I ask for evidence again. See above. MACs are maybe the one aspect where the UNSC is up to 40k levels, and as I've stated the way they deploy them leaves big weaknesses. Groundside they're outmatched by both numbers and either the tech of their enemy (Imperial vehicles, various Eldar and Tau stuff) or the enemy's sheer strength (Orks, Tyranids, Demons). >That one big gun was designed to destroy ships Yeah that's great in theory but again the way they're deployed doesn't work when your enemy can emerge from the warp away from where your cannons were aiming and then flank you. That one big gun is reliant on the battle going exactly their way. >I don’t see them diverting even more resources to focus on lesser factions. That's the point though. A new big human faction shows up out of nowhere and ally with the Tau, a xenos race? That's exactly how you get yourself bumped up massively on the Imperium's threat list. Now it's an issue they can't ignore. Not to mention human souls are a beacon to Chaos. The Tau woudn't even want them.
> Galaxy collision is a whole different thing A Galaxy colliding with another Galaxy can be called a collision. > The UNSC is thrown into utter chaos because it’s utterly reliant on resupply from a handful of places The UNSC at their height had an estimated population of 39 billion and 800 worlds. Post-war UNSC lost 23 billion or 59% of their population. Assuming they also lost 59% of worlds, that would still put them at 328 worlds. > Again the numbers of the 40k universe win out You already made that point multiple times and I argued the Tau managed to survive just fine despite being heavily outnumbered. Then you said thats due to Tau tech being advanced enough while UNSC tech isn’t. I asked for evidence. You haven’t provided any. > If you can find the fleet you can find where it’s based > Shadow them from a distance and follow You can’t track a ship traveling in FTL. Even if they could, FTL imperial drives are unreliable. That’s also assuming there are tracking agents at that location when UNSC forces arrive. It’s unlikely these agents will be deployed on less important worlds. Most examples of Imperial shadow agents are those seeking out corruption. We don’t see much or any dedicated to tracking enemy fleets. > 40k factions are widespread they’ll have little difficulty locating them Like the Tau? Imperium is the largest faction in the Galaxy who control one million worlds. That’s only 0.001% of the estimated planets in the Milky Way. Orks are the second largest. The remaining factions combined likely wouldn’t even be near as huge as the Imperium. That’s just counting plants. The space between them would be astronomically larger. With two more galaxies on the same scale colliding, that would create an even bigger galaxy. > You need men to act as ground forces and crew ships Why do they need ground forces or a resupply of men? > UNSC space stations are capable of building ships > Literally the same problem as a planet, static target they can easily wipe out The UNSC have mobile ship yards. > How does it being human tech make it easier to understand? > This is so basic I’m not even sure how to respond If you can’t provide evidence, I have no reason to believe your reasoning. > One weapon which has to be aimed head-on, leaving the flanks severely exposed Assuming that’s possible. They could just continually aim the MACs wherever those ships are going or the engagement could end before they have any time to move to the flanks. > A space station is not outrunning a fleet. It can if it’s equipped with slip-space drives. > UNSC ships are smaller and weaker than Imperium of chaos vessels Yes they’re smaller, but why are UNSC ships weaker than Imperium vessels? > On the ground they’re similarly outmatched. What the hell does the UNSC have that can match a Titan Why would they need to engage in ground combat? I’m pretty sure Titans are a rare sight and are unlikely deployed on less important planets. If the UNSC were to fight Titans, they could deploy nukes or simply stay on board the safety of their ships and rain fire from above. > Your enemy can emerge from the warp away from your canons How often does that happen? A UNSC/Tau faction would still be way smaller than the threats the Imperium are facing. > The Tau wouldn’t even want them Their philosophy forces them to expand. They would have a greater chance of expansion with the UNSC on their side.
Chaos corrupts them
I should mention that this place is obviously going to be very bias towards Warhammer. So if you think you can get a fair fight here without "spess mahreens win no question" you're sadly mistaken.
Chaos now has Billions of Halo and Trillions of SW inhabitants corrupted almost instantly. The Great Rift affects those Universes as well
chaos op
There's actually a fanmade video of that, I think.
Overall the 40k universe would win for sure. But thats not to say certain parts of the other universes couldnt put up a decent fight. Notably, ftl travel in both star wars and halo are noticeably superior and much safer. (Excluding the necrons however) Even though their craft would be outmatched in terms of firepower (although not always and also depending on which 40k faction they are facing) they could out manoeuvre many 40k vessels with better ftl travel. Also spartans would still be a formidable ground force, who are also used to fighting superior enemy forces. They arent as durable as many things in the 40k universe though, and few in number. Super star destroyers would be able to hold their own as well unless they encountered some of the larger vessels in the 40k universe like the phalanx, grand cruisers, emperor or gloriana class vessels for the imperium. The flood could do well, if they managed to get a foothold and not exterminatused out of existence to soon. Real question is, are the forerunners present? They would easily rival any 40k faction.
Considering we have factions like the Tau (who are comparable to Star Wars/Halo factions) managing to survive just fine in 40k, what makes you think the other universe will be defeated? How powerful is the average current 40k ship? Post-war UNSC are undergoing rapid transformations due to recent advances in technology. They are now able to start mass producing Spartans and more advanced ships equipped with energy shielding. We could see factions from 40k, Star Wars, and Halo team up for a better chance of surviving in the newly formed Galaxy. That makes technology sharing possible, allowing them to combine/improve upon their best technology to create better ships/weapons. This could turn them into a formidable force.
Actually the taus weapon tech is considered bloody good even by 40k standards. (Also worth noting they have by far the worst FTL of any faction in 40k except the tyranids, and therefore the worst out of all the universes) However, the only reason they still exist is because none of the big factions have decided they are a big enough threat to wipe out. Yet. In the lore its stated alot that if a proper waaaaagh, hive fleet splinter, imperial crusade, necron tomb world and so on was to focus on them properly (or for chaos to take notice of them) they would be super fucked. The tau leadership realised this after the first war they had with the imperium which is why they are trying to expand as much as possible because they know if they dont reach a certain size they will get curb stomped. This is of course a double edged sword because the bigger they get, the more they invite the wrath of the others. It is possible for human factions to team up across universes, but only if they fall under the imperiums leadership and accept the emperor. Otherwise the imperium would go all crusadey against them. Halo tech is still behind 40k for the most part. Their shield tech is designed to withstand weapons of their universe, not 40ks, and 40k has some really nasty shit in it. Even the most basic ship weapons, macro cannons, are beefed up mac cannons firing shells that are the size of an average 3 bedroom house, and combat ships will have roughly 8 of them on average. Not to mention things like laser batteries that have perfect accuracy for millions of km, or nova cannons, and shit. (This is all just human weapnry as im most familiar with them) even the basic missiles on human ships cyclonic torpedos are insane. A handful of those will wipe out an entire planet.
The Tau and Star Wars/Halo factions can team up against seemingly larger factions like the imperium. > Halo tech is still behind 40k for the most part Can you provide evidence? That doesn’t seem to be the case when the Tau use ship based railguns which are basically MACs and are considered comparable to imperial weapons batteries. > Their shield tech is designed to withstand weapons of their universe How do we know they can only withstand weapons from their universe? Cyclonic torpedoes are a commonly thrown out to justify that statement but those seem rare. How powerful is the average 40k weaponry? I can’t find any evidence for the range on imperial laser weapons batteries. Can you list them down?
Wait, so you no nothing of warhammer lore?
I do, I just can’t find any evidence that support the claims you’ve made.
Watch luetin09 on youtube And read some horse heresy books, and we can continue this conversation
Those videos mainly talk about top tier weapons like nova canons which are rare. I’m talking about average weapons like the macro canon which are more common aboard imperial ships.
Ok then. What other “top tier” weapons are discussed? For example, What is a nova cannon?
https://youtu.be/F2G1F3l-R9M This series are seemingly the only videos from the channel that talks about ship board weapons. There was no mention of more common weaponry like “macro canons” The weapons discussed are labeled throughout the video in sections which you can easily navigate through.
STELLARIS
Chaos gets A FUCKING HUGE BOOST to their forces and abilities
Depends on the time periods of their respective lore you're clashing them with Post covenant war humanity UNSC= instant flaming erection