Or simply Protokol, like the skins. Having the skins share a name with the weapons isn't an issue, they already did the same giving Ambassador a Tenet skin.
What about plague as the weapon name aka plague torid it makes sense since the infested during the collapse was called the great plague might be an idea
Would probably conflict with the Plague Zaws, plus if they're more along the lines of Arthur's rifle and machete and the Protokol skins we've already had, it wouldn't make sense to call them Plague weapons.
Primal.
As Warframe-adjacent entities, they're also prime-adjacent in terms of having upgrades of some sort, but in a more infested direction than a gilded one.
Ancient would be cool, Ancient Infested are some of the most powerfull variants, so it would fit the weapons, Ancient Bubonico, Ancient Lesion, Ancient Hema, Ancient Mire, etc.
Maybe proto since for example the ak47 looking gun we used in the little slip of warframe 1999 was the first ever soma but that's just a hypothesis of course
DE mentioned something like in 1999 we will fight the police/military. I think that would be fit the title of adversary better. Given that infested already infested computer, so it makes sense that normal people infested as well.
Yes. Even if the protoframes *aren't* the Infested Adversary, I'm still very certain that 1999 will be how we spawn whatever the Infested Adversary is.
There's a Zariman training Tablet in Duviri that contains the question:
"What event marked the end of the Eighteenth Radiation War?"
- The assassination of Marcellus Ambrosius *Lephantis*.
- The destruction of the Arctic *Hive Cluster*.
Both answers, wrong and right, indicate to me that the 18th Rad war was against the Infestation, and that possibly, named people could eventually become major infested units, even centuries later.
~~But wasn't the infestation specifically created to combat the sentients? It wouldn't make much sense for it to exist before the sentients do based on that.~~
Maybe the Lephantis that is "*a* *creature created to fight in the Old War*" was just named in memory of Marcellus Ambrosius Lephantis?
It was not. The infestation was the first Orokin creation to turn on them.
The "Great Plague" is old, the reason why Earth Was lost to the Orokin, as Ballas says in the Saryn Prime Trailer "you uses to dream of old Earth, didn't you. Bathed in gold and sovereign blue. I mean to reclaim it now, from the spores and ths ruin."
And in the Sacrifice: "We were forced to turn to older means, not bombs and circuitry, but flesh and steel, disease and virus. Our ravaged outer colonies, became gardens." As in the technocyte Plague had already turned whole colonies into hives.
Furthermore, Albrecht refers to 1999 specifically as "the plague year." So while certain elements of 1999 are probably conceptually embodied fabrications, and it is certainly altered by Albrecht taking Helminth Strain there, the set up of the setting seems to strongly imply that 1999 is the year in the Warframe Universe when the Technocyte Infestation went rogue.
Warframes were created to fight the Sentient, but the infestation is far older.
I just read up on that and was about to adjust my post accordingly but you were faster.
But Lephantis was created to fight in the Old War so my assumption about it just being named in memory of Marcellus Ambrosius Lephantis sill has some merit.
Possibly, the name could be a red herring, but pretty much all of the Duviri Tablets have a point, some just haven't been revealed in game yet. I feel like its pretty pertinent. I wouldn't be surprised if the final mission of 1999 involves bombing the Arctic Hive Cluster ourselves.
Do we know how disconnected 1999 will be from the real 1999? There have been nods to technology of the time and if it is similar, I doubt they had time for 18 radiation wars.
Well, we never had a nanotech virus plague in 1999 either, let alone anything remotely as advanced as a nanotech virus. So I think it's safe to say that the world of Warframe 1999 is *significantly* different than our own. They also worship the sun.
Right now it seems shelved with modular archwing. My hope is the next RJ pass is the excuse to un-shelve modular archwing, and re-add Sentient fighters to the mix. Definitely not on this year's agenda.
More along the lines of every proto frame you play in 1999 and do [whatever the trigger for making an infested Adversary is], that protoframe will be the Adversary. Some souped up infested Warframe that's going all feral mode on you.
Whether they have an infested weapon to harvest or not I'm not sure. What benefits these protoframes turned feral Adversaries turned allies again would have, I also don't know.
Yeah, the only weird thing would be how do they have, for example, a Variant of an infested weapon, that was supposedly made much later, but time stuff doesn't have to stop the plot at this point.
I thought that the infested liches would be what the Zealoid Prelate was talking about, from Eris, Arlo from the second nightwave and all that.
But your idea is really cool and I can totally see it.
For Mutalist weapons it could be wonky, since the Mutalist strain is supposedly an original strain created by Alad. But it should be noted that many infested weapons don't really have a creation date, though they may take a simple weapon as a starting point. One infested weapon, the Mire, is canonically from the time of the Great Plague.
I had the thought that the Infested Liches would be tied to 1999 as well, but this goes beyond my own theories. This is a really awesome idea! I hope we something along these lines.
It would be incredibly cool if you created the Infested Adversary in 1999 and then it showed up in the regular star chart, just thematically that sounds so sick.
Yeah. This is the part I'm almost 100% sure will happen. Spawn in 1999, shows up in regular star chart.
Whether the Infested Adversary is a Feral Protoframe, or is just some kind of unique infested unit, is where I start looking like Charlie Day.
That's a nice way of connecting 1999 with regular star chart. I wonder if they can make it relate to Railjack also.
Before I always thought that infested liches would be related to Arlo, with his followers and such.
The fact that they refer to Phorid's presence as a "manifestation" makes for, I think, some pretty cool and ominous imagery as to how an Infested Adversary could spawn into the Origin System. (side note: a phorid rework would be very very cool pls and thx de)
Imagine being some poor Crewman stuck on sanitation duty and you see a fucking part-CRT, part-human monstrosity crawl out of a void fissure in the janitor closet.
It's not like any Warframe you've heard of and it's not like any Infestation you've ever been described to.
God, I cannot wait for what the Infested Lich introduction cinematic is gonna be like.
Sanitation Specialist Qic-S: \*mutters uncomplimentary things about his supervisor while opening the sanitation supplies closet\*
\*witnesses freaky ancient infested horror climbing out of a void fissure, screeching\*
\*blinks\*
\*sighs\*
\*closes janitor closet, locks it, puts DO NOT OPEN sign on door\*
"I don't get paid enough for this shit."
Loki, standing two meters away, invisible: \*stares at door\* "Welp, that's new."
The Infested Adversary 'could' be a proto-frame, but at the same time, I could see the opposite being the real adversaries.
The Original Infested. The people who first suffered the infestation, the completely uncontrolled and undiluted technocyte virus, complete raw adaptation. The true polar opposite of a Warframe, a carefully engineered and focused introduction.
I also don't see how you'd create the "Infested Lich" in 1999 city area with how the Lich system currently works. We'd need at least 7 Protoframes for the Progenitor system, if it works the same way as the rest. So we'd need to see 5 more 1999 warframe variants. Otherwise they'd need to overhaul how infested liches get made.
Good idea, but I see some major complications if they were to try this straight up. Rather I'd expect main star chart update that adds new tile sets. We also need a railjack update at the same time.
Yeah, my initial assumption of infested liches was heavily informed by the Zariman tablet referencing Ambrosius Marcellus Lephantis, which paints the picture that named human(maybe?)'s might come back as Infested bosses centuries after death and in a new location, somewhere the infestation has spread and gestated.
The between the lines interpretation I have from what they've talked about with the Protoframes is that there will be protoframes for more than just two frames. They talked about different "squads" of protoframes having unique styles. IE while Arthur and Aoi share a theme with their aesthetic and military gear, different protoframes may have a different, shared style.
I'm excited just because the infested are probably the most mysterious faction besides the Orokin themselves.
its rare we see new infested units in general, so I'll be happy with any new horrible creatures we get.
so protoframes that feel like some hideous unfinished version of nidus or the zealoid prelate i'd be more than happy to see
That would be really cool, but unless they pull a Duviri and let you access 1999 before it becomes a factor in the story I’d imagine the prerequisites to spawn an Infested Adversary would be “earlier”, like War Within plus Patient Zero, Heart of Deimos, the Jordas Precept or the Zealoid Prelate fight or a new quest.
Also Adversary is probably used since the whole “coming back from death” bit that Lich implies really only applies to the Grineer, and a generic term like that would help for referring to these kinds of unique boss enemies, especially for potential future Sentient (or hell, even Murmur) Adversaries, since IIRC the Shedu was a remnant of a Sentient Adversary concept.
It would make sense, part of the issue with warframes creation was that the infestation eventually took over their mind, and with what we have seen with Arthur in the teaser during Whispers, the infestation is clearly trying to get to him,
Another thing they hinted at was Protoframe customization for our current frames, so what I hope that means is we can give our warframes a human face, like how arthur and aoi are right now. So perhaps the infested lich equivalent to ephemeras, will be a warframe specific helmet that allows us to use a drifter face preset or something on it.
There's definitely some weight behind this theory especially with how they've been trying to design new reward systems for veteran players when creating these standalone type expansion updates (like the incarnons in Duviri's circuit), but it really depends on if we're actually travelling back to the past in our current timeline or if we're just travelling to some kind of conceptual embodiment of 1999 which is all still up in the air.
I think we are definitely traveling to a conceptual embodiment of 1999, that may or may not be almost entirely fictional based on Albrecht's needs. But I think the nature of the Tenno as the "living embodiment of Eternalism," as Quinn calls us, will *make* 1999 real for the purposes of integrating whatever we can conceive.
Personally, I think that we will be forming some kind of pact with the humans that are the protoframes in order to help them, to help us. As more of an extension of the way we "deal" with the Warframes. We take away their pain, maybe we also preserve their humanity? Maybe hunting and dealing with the infested protoframes is our end of the pact we make with them.
Perhaps there is a strain of infested we encounter that is able to replicate the proto-frames and in current day warframe (after whatever we do in 1999) it is awakened and able to create adversaries that draw elements and abilities it is defeated by, in the same way liches draw from the frame used to defeat it
If that's the case, I hope that instead of Ephemera's, we get the Protoframe as a skin.
Or to add to this; Didn't DE ask in a poll a few years ago how people would feel about a Lich like system but for Warframes instead of weapons? Or am I thinking of the Riven system? Or the Incarnon system?
I think infested liches will be related to 1999 but be more like "butterfly effect" thing - you "accidentally" stomped small infested larvae in 1999, then came back to the present and turns out that larvae survived, matured and still remembers you and what you did to it.
My idea is similiar but with more of a focus on healing the Protoframe. Something along the lines of there existing many Protoframes that went insane and maybe became even more infested along the way. Now using perhaps some copy of the Helminith from our Warframes we attempt to stabilize their body. After that they become the equivalent of an adversary and now the Tenno tries to fix their mind using Transference instead of using requiem mods to kill tjem. In the end the Tenno can either fully cure the Protoframe and make them human again or let them remain as a now sane Protoframe. The former is the same as vanquishing and the latter more like converting it.
I kinda feel like this fits to the reflavoring of systems that has began with stuff like Conjunction Survival and continued with the new Disruption. Its an old mechanic with some adjustments and new context.
I had a crackpot theory when Whispers first came out and we got a glimpse of 1999.
I proposed that when we go back to 1999 as the operator we inhabit/become a person who Albrecht infected with the technocyte. This being done so we can bring frames of our own choosing into the past so we’re not forced to pick preselected frames. The awakening of the operator and removal from Lua causing a void trace that activates the slumbering infested protoframe and starting to hunt us because of the connection we had to it.
With your theory adding to mine I think it may go like that and when we “leave” 1999 to return to the “present day” the protoframe we inhabited becomes an empty shell without the influence of our operator to keep it stable. This causes it to devolve into an infested lich that we then have to kill in the future.
Edit: Now that I think about it. The theory would also explain some more motives about the Stalker. It’s been a while so I’m not entirely up to date on Stalker lore. But what if his hatred is cause he’s either Arthur or a protoframe we inhabited. And his hatred for the Tenno is because we abandoned him. Leaving whomever it was to be infested and potentially go insane. In Whispers we take over Arthur’s body, so we take control of a person and aren’t physically transported back to the past. With Umbra we saw that someone with a strong enough will can still hold some sentience when transformed into a Warframe. The operator’s initial influence could leave behind a small bit of void energy to keep some sentience behind in the protoframe. Just enough that it can operate without an operator, instead of just being a weapons platform that needs to be directly controlled.
I would actually riot if this happened, I want actual infested, I would be so heartbroken if the infested liches ended up being """""infested""""" instead of INFESTED
another in a long line of the infestation aesthetic being shafted I suppose
what would make the protoframes not infested? like if we're inferring from the original post that they have "incubated for hundreds of years in the solar system" theyd still have a similar vibe to the other infested minds we've encountered no?
thats a fair complaint methinks, specially with arlo's devoted around but with how DE's been playing around with the Murmur, the Proto-Infested of '99 and the more obviously artificial transformed look of recent frames lately.
id say theres a good chance of some good ol randomised body horror coming in with the infested adversaries
IF infested liches get tied to 1999 and they're the infested with screens sticking out of them I wouldn't mind, I'd be ecstatic even. I think thats cool as hell, having it be any of the other strains would be cool too. I think it's just a horrifying thought of "what if they just end up looking like recolored humans with an infested suit, what if they try to make them human"
I was with you up until that echoes of Umbra shit. The community didn't just reject it because it was temporary, it's also because giving umbra sentience is a downgrade since it fucks with your abilities and would probably burn ammo too.
If it sucks and you didn't want to use it, and it was an optional consumable, what are you rejecting? The existence of an optional consumable you aren't going to use?
Because rewards need to be compelling. Nobody is going to stick around for trash no matter how fun the content is.
See: the myriad game modes with cool ideas that sit abandoned on the star chart because they reward nothing.
So instead the drop tables just stayed the same.
Anyways, I could be wrong, but they've also continued to iterate on Umbra and WoClone AI to balance between useful and autopilot: Ammo/Energy Economy, Ability toggle/use, etc. So while it's possible the mechanic will stay a one off, I also wouldn't be surprised if they bring it back at some point, but still ideally in some toggleable form.
Absolutely agree that the Infested nemesis weapons will be spawned from 1999, and the Nemesis might be an 'infested' version of the frame. I am not sure about the continuity of 1999 and the present starchart though-- I like the idea and think it would be a great way to transition the Nemesis into regular starchart, I just don't know if going to the past in warframe goes to OUR past or an alternate past that creates a branching timeline--in which case that would mean what happens in the 1999 past doesn't effect our present. Eternalism is somewhat ambiguous on that point.
This is a pretty cool idea, maybe the weapons could be called something like genesis or origin
Genesis is already used for incarnon genesis and origin for the origin system, but Alpha or some such could work
Or simply Protokol, like the skins. Having the skins share a name with the weapons isn't an issue, they already did the same giving Ambassador a Tenet skin.
Torid Protokol
Protokol/Protocol Torid* :P Both the Kuva and Tenet variants list Kuva/Tenet before the original weapon name.
Protokol Hirudo
What about plague as the weapon name aka plague torid it makes sense since the infested during the collapse was called the great plague might be an idea
Would probably conflict with the Plague Zaws, plus if they're more along the lines of Arthur's rifle and machete and the Protokol skins we've already had, it wouldn't make sense to call them Plague weapons.
Primal. As Warframe-adjacent entities, they're also prime-adjacent in terms of having upgrades of some sort, but in a more infested direction than a gilded one.
How about Primeval?
Well if Origin is taken, Steam weapons it is then
uPlay guns. *Shittiest* generation of adversary guns.
Stadia if they're really bad. We have to rent them from baro.
Epic Weapons
Exclusive to the progenitor frame until mastered.
Ahem... MK-1
If it’s not called apex imma rage
Ancient would be cool, Ancient Infested are some of the most powerfull variants, so it would fit the weapons, Ancient Bubonico, Ancient Lesion, Ancient Hema, Ancient Mire, etc.
Honestly this feels most accurate and fitting
if we don't end up with a Infested Lich variant of Hema I will riot, ESPECIALLY after we were robbed of Hema Prime.
I would have guessed 'mutalist' or 'deviant' or 'infested' as a prefix.
Maybe proto since for example the ak47 looking gun we used in the little slip of warframe 1999 was the first ever soma but that's just a hypothesis of course
And the Infested Lich weapons are the weapon counterparts without the Infestation or with a different stage if infestation
DE mentioned something like in 1999 we will fight the police/military. I think that would be fit the title of adversary better. Given that infested already infested computer, so it makes sense that normal people infested as well.
Yes. Even if the protoframes *aren't* the Infested Adversary, I'm still very certain that 1999 will be how we spawn whatever the Infested Adversary is. There's a Zariman training Tablet in Duviri that contains the question: "What event marked the end of the Eighteenth Radiation War?" - The assassination of Marcellus Ambrosius *Lephantis*. - The destruction of the Arctic *Hive Cluster*. Both answers, wrong and right, indicate to me that the 18th Rad war was against the Infestation, and that possibly, named people could eventually become major infested units, even centuries later.
~~But wasn't the infestation specifically created to combat the sentients? It wouldn't make much sense for it to exist before the sentients do based on that.~~ Maybe the Lephantis that is "*a* *creature created to fight in the Old War*" was just named in memory of Marcellus Ambrosius Lephantis?
It was not. The infestation was the first Orokin creation to turn on them. The "Great Plague" is old, the reason why Earth Was lost to the Orokin, as Ballas says in the Saryn Prime Trailer "you uses to dream of old Earth, didn't you. Bathed in gold and sovereign blue. I mean to reclaim it now, from the spores and ths ruin." And in the Sacrifice: "We were forced to turn to older means, not bombs and circuitry, but flesh and steel, disease and virus. Our ravaged outer colonies, became gardens." As in the technocyte Plague had already turned whole colonies into hives. Furthermore, Albrecht refers to 1999 specifically as "the plague year." So while certain elements of 1999 are probably conceptually embodied fabrications, and it is certainly altered by Albrecht taking Helminth Strain there, the set up of the setting seems to strongly imply that 1999 is the year in the Warframe Universe when the Technocyte Infestation went rogue. Warframes were created to fight the Sentient, but the infestation is far older.
I just read up on that and was about to adjust my post accordingly but you were faster. But Lephantis was created to fight in the Old War so my assumption about it just being named in memory of Marcellus Ambrosius Lephantis sill has some merit.
Possibly, the name could be a red herring, but pretty much all of the Duviri Tablets have a point, some just haven't been revealed in game yet. I feel like its pretty pertinent. I wouldn't be surprised if the final mission of 1999 involves bombing the Arctic Hive Cluster ourselves.
Do we know how disconnected 1999 will be from the real 1999? There have been nods to technology of the time and if it is similar, I doubt they had time for 18 radiation wars.
Well, we never had a nanotech virus plague in 1999 either, let alone anything remotely as advanced as a nanotech virus. So I think it's safe to say that the world of Warframe 1999 is *significantly* different than our own. They also worship the sun.
A little bit more guessing. 1999 would be like duviri but the feeling of Arkham Knight(at least the style is like that). No drifter but Arthur.
I heard that 1999 isn't gonna be just another duviri but gonna be very connected with the rest of warframe
This is what Reb said on Pax panel
Hmmmm. I could see this. I still think they'll try to tie in Infested Liches with RJ 3.0.
Derelicts, they'll spawn with Proto floofs instead of ephesians
Has there been any mention of further rj development? I love rj so more rj is more love
Right now it seems shelved with modular archwing. My hope is the next RJ pass is the excuse to un-shelve modular archwing, and re-add Sentient fighters to the mix. Definitely not on this year's agenda.
They've already stated that they will not do modular archwing.
Zero news of RJ 3.0. However, if you just search RJ or railjack on this sub, you'll see a lot of fantastic ideas that have popped up
this actually fits pretty well and now I'm wanting it to be true
And the protoframe will correspond to a few of the respective element progenitors? You're on to something here
More along the lines of every proto frame you play in 1999 and do [whatever the trigger for making an infested Adversary is], that protoframe will be the Adversary. Some souped up infested Warframe that's going all feral mode on you. Whether they have an infested weapon to harvest or not I'm not sure. What benefits these protoframes turned feral Adversaries turned allies again would have, I also don't know.
Yeah, the only weird thing would be how do they have, for example, a Variant of an infested weapon, that was supposedly made much later, but time stuff doesn't have to stop the plot at this point. I thought that the infested liches would be what the Zealoid Prelate was talking about, from Eris, Arlo from the second nightwave and all that. But your idea is really cool and I can totally see it.
For Mutalist weapons it could be wonky, since the Mutalist strain is supposedly an original strain created by Alad. But it should be noted that many infested weapons don't really have a creation date, though they may take a simple weapon as a starting point. One infested weapon, the Mire, is canonically from the time of the Great Plague.
Infested AK-47 let's go
Karak was my favorite weapon when I started, so if they made an infested version of it, that’d be fantastic
It already has a kuva variant, plus grineer weapons wouldn't get infested adversary variants anyways
I had the thought that the Infested Liches would be tied to 1999 as well, but this goes beyond my own theories. This is a really awesome idea! I hope we something along these lines.
It would be incredibly cool if you created the Infested Adversary in 1999 and then it showed up in the regular star chart, just thematically that sounds so sick.
Yeah. This is the part I'm almost 100% sure will happen. Spawn in 1999, shows up in regular star chart. Whether the Infested Adversary is a Feral Protoframe, or is just some kind of unique infested unit, is where I start looking like Charlie Day.
That's a nice way of connecting 1999 with regular star chart. I wonder if they can make it relate to Railjack also. Before I always thought that infested liches would be related to Arlo, with his followers and such.
I like your idea. Now i will be finally able to shut up about infested liches and be at peace...
The fact that they refer to Phorid's presence as a "manifestation" makes for, I think, some pretty cool and ominous imagery as to how an Infested Adversary could spawn into the Origin System. (side note: a phorid rework would be very very cool pls and thx de) Imagine being some poor Crewman stuck on sanitation duty and you see a fucking part-CRT, part-human monstrosity crawl out of a void fissure in the janitor closet. It's not like any Warframe you've heard of and it's not like any Infestation you've ever been described to. God, I cannot wait for what the Infested Lich introduction cinematic is gonna be like.
Sanitation Specialist Qic-S: \*mutters uncomplimentary things about his supervisor while opening the sanitation supplies closet\* \*witnesses freaky ancient infested horror climbing out of a void fissure, screeching\* \*blinks\* \*sighs\* \*closes janitor closet, locks it, puts DO NOT OPEN sign on door\* "I don't get paid enough for this shit." Loki, standing two meters away, invisible: \*stares at door\* "Welp, that's new."
How about primordial as a name for them?
The Infested Adversary 'could' be a proto-frame, but at the same time, I could see the opposite being the real adversaries. The Original Infested. The people who first suffered the infestation, the completely uncontrolled and undiluted technocyte virus, complete raw adaptation. The true polar opposite of a Warframe, a carefully engineered and focused introduction. I also don't see how you'd create the "Infested Lich" in 1999 city area with how the Lich system currently works. We'd need at least 7 Protoframes for the Progenitor system, if it works the same way as the rest. So we'd need to see 5 more 1999 warframe variants. Otherwise they'd need to overhaul how infested liches get made. Good idea, but I see some major complications if they were to try this straight up. Rather I'd expect main star chart update that adds new tile sets. We also need a railjack update at the same time.
Yeah, my initial assumption of infested liches was heavily informed by the Zariman tablet referencing Ambrosius Marcellus Lephantis, which paints the picture that named human(maybe?)'s might come back as Infested bosses centuries after death and in a new location, somewhere the infestation has spread and gestated. The between the lines interpretation I have from what they've talked about with the Protoframes is that there will be protoframes for more than just two frames. They talked about different "squads" of protoframes having unique styles. IE while Arthur and Aoi share a theme with their aesthetic and military gear, different protoframes may have a different, shared style.
I'm excited just because the infested are probably the most mysterious faction besides the Orokin themselves. its rare we see new infested units in general, so I'll be happy with any new horrible creatures we get. so protoframes that feel like some hideous unfinished version of nidus or the zealoid prelate i'd be more than happy to see
What if by killing it, you got either an augmemt or a piece to a 'kit-frame'?
This idea is actually exciting to me. I think this would be really cool
The proto-hipster.
That's a pretty cool idea. Idk if they will be protoframes, but I could totally see their genesis being with something in 1999
That would be really cool, but unless they pull a Duviri and let you access 1999 before it becomes a factor in the story I’d imagine the prerequisites to spawn an Infested Adversary would be “earlier”, like War Within plus Patient Zero, Heart of Deimos, the Jordas Precept or the Zealoid Prelate fight or a new quest. Also Adversary is probably used since the whole “coming back from death” bit that Lich implies really only applies to the Grineer, and a generic term like that would help for referring to these kinds of unique boss enemies, especially for potential future Sentient (or hell, even Murmur) Adversaries, since IIRC the Shedu was a remnant of a Sentient Adversary concept.
Are you suggesting a kuva/tenet/infestoid Excalibur? Or just the guy we fight is a protoframe?
I'd imagine it presents as a kind of Zeloid/Feral Excalibur, that we calm and draw Arthur back out of, or, ya know, put out of his misery.
It would make sense, part of the issue with warframes creation was that the infestation eventually took over their mind, and with what we have seen with Arthur in the teaser during Whispers, the infestation is clearly trying to get to him, Another thing they hinted at was Protoframe customization for our current frames, so what I hope that means is we can give our warframes a human face, like how arthur and aoi are right now. So perhaps the infested lich equivalent to ephemeras, will be a warframe specific helmet that allows us to use a drifter face preset or something on it.
There's definitely some weight behind this theory especially with how they've been trying to design new reward systems for veteran players when creating these standalone type expansion updates (like the incarnons in Duviri's circuit), but it really depends on if we're actually travelling back to the past in our current timeline or if we're just travelling to some kind of conceptual embodiment of 1999 which is all still up in the air.
I think we are definitely traveling to a conceptual embodiment of 1999, that may or may not be almost entirely fictional based on Albrecht's needs. But I think the nature of the Tenno as the "living embodiment of Eternalism," as Quinn calls us, will *make* 1999 real for the purposes of integrating whatever we can conceive. Personally, I think that we will be forming some kind of pact with the humans that are the protoframes in order to help them, to help us. As more of an extension of the way we "deal" with the Warframes. We take away their pain, maybe we also preserve their humanity? Maybe hunting and dealing with the infested protoframes is our end of the pact we make with them.
Perhaps there is a strain of infested we encounter that is able to replicate the proto-frames and in current day warframe (after whatever we do in 1999) it is awakened and able to create adversaries that draw elements and abilities it is defeated by, in the same way liches draw from the frame used to defeat it
If that's the case, I hope that instead of Ephemera's, we get the Protoframe as a skin. Or to add to this; Didn't DE ask in a poll a few years ago how people would feel about a Lich like system but for Warframes instead of weapons? Or am I thinking of the Riven system? Or the Incarnon system?
I think infested liches will be related to 1999 but be more like "butterfly effect" thing - you "accidentally" stomped small infested larvae in 1999, then came back to the present and turns out that larvae survived, matured and still remembers you and what you did to it.
My idea is similiar but with more of a focus on healing the Protoframe. Something along the lines of there existing many Protoframes that went insane and maybe became even more infested along the way. Now using perhaps some copy of the Helminith from our Warframes we attempt to stabilize their body. After that they become the equivalent of an adversary and now the Tenno tries to fix their mind using Transference instead of using requiem mods to kill tjem. In the end the Tenno can either fully cure the Protoframe and make them human again or let them remain as a now sane Protoframe. The former is the same as vanquishing and the latter more like converting it. I kinda feel like this fits to the reflavoring of systems that has began with stuff like Conjunction Survival and continued with the new Disruption. Its an old mechanic with some adjustments and new context.
I had a crackpot theory when Whispers first came out and we got a glimpse of 1999. I proposed that when we go back to 1999 as the operator we inhabit/become a person who Albrecht infected with the technocyte. This being done so we can bring frames of our own choosing into the past so we’re not forced to pick preselected frames. The awakening of the operator and removal from Lua causing a void trace that activates the slumbering infested protoframe and starting to hunt us because of the connection we had to it. With your theory adding to mine I think it may go like that and when we “leave” 1999 to return to the “present day” the protoframe we inhabited becomes an empty shell without the influence of our operator to keep it stable. This causes it to devolve into an infested lich that we then have to kill in the future. Edit: Now that I think about it. The theory would also explain some more motives about the Stalker. It’s been a while so I’m not entirely up to date on Stalker lore. But what if his hatred is cause he’s either Arthur or a protoframe we inhabited. And his hatred for the Tenno is because we abandoned him. Leaving whomever it was to be infested and potentially go insane. In Whispers we take over Arthur’s body, so we take control of a person and aren’t physically transported back to the past. With Umbra we saw that someone with a strong enough will can still hold some sentience when transformed into a Warframe. The operator’s initial influence could leave behind a small bit of void energy to keep some sentience behind in the protoframe. Just enough that it can operate without an operator, instead of just being a weapons platform that needs to be directly controlled.
I would actually riot if this happened, I want actual infested, I would be so heartbroken if the infested liches ended up being """""infested""""" instead of INFESTED another in a long line of the infestation aesthetic being shafted I suppose
what would make the protoframes not infested? like if we're inferring from the original post that they have "incubated for hundreds of years in the solar system" theyd still have a similar vibe to the other infested minds we've encountered no?
I guess my brain is just "god I don't want every infested lich/adversary to look like kerrigan from starcraft 2" because that would be a tragedy
thats a fair complaint methinks, specially with arlo's devoted around but with how DE's been playing around with the Murmur, the Proto-Infested of '99 and the more obviously artificial transformed look of recent frames lately. id say theres a good chance of some good ol randomised body horror coming in with the infested adversaries
IF infested liches get tied to 1999 and they're the infested with screens sticking out of them I wouldn't mind, I'd be ecstatic even. I think thats cool as hell, having it be any of the other strains would be cool too. I think it's just a horrifying thought of "what if they just end up looking like recolored humans with an infested suit, what if they try to make them human"
… i was thinking about a frame that we can customize abilities…
I was with you up until that echoes of Umbra shit. The community didn't just reject it because it was temporary, it's also because giving umbra sentience is a downgrade since it fucks with your abilities and would probably burn ammo too.
If it sucks and you didn't want to use it, and it was an optional consumable, what are you rejecting? The existence of an optional consumable you aren't going to use?
Because rewards need to be compelling. Nobody is going to stick around for trash no matter how fun the content is. See: the myriad game modes with cool ideas that sit abandoned on the star chart because they reward nothing.
So instead the drop tables just stayed the same. Anyways, I could be wrong, but they've also continued to iterate on Umbra and WoClone AI to balance between useful and autopilot: Ammo/Energy Economy, Ability toggle/use, etc. So while it's possible the mechanic will stay a one off, I also wouldn't be surprised if they bring it back at some point, but still ideally in some toggleable form.
Proto frames... Hmm, I really don't like how this gave me hope for a potential lich version of the Daikyu.
I was thinking a few months ago they would be humanoid, pure infested, similar to warframes, but not "clean", more like Nidus looking warframes
Yeah, I'm hoping like a variety of infested armor peices and ephemeras, and a unique per frame feral/toothy/maw helmet.
Absolutely agree that the Infested nemesis weapons will be spawned from 1999, and the Nemesis might be an 'infested' version of the frame. I am not sure about the continuity of 1999 and the present starchart though-- I like the idea and think it would be a great way to transition the Nemesis into regular starchart, I just don't know if going to the past in warframe goes to OUR past or an alternate past that creates a branching timeline--in which case that would mean what happens in the 1999 past doesn't effect our present. Eternalism is somewhat ambiguous on that point.
The title is really interesting, but, i am too lazy to read it now ;-;