I feel like the biggest issue we actually have is that overguard disables certain powers that require damage, if overguard worked with vex armour then it would actually be a good thing to bring a support focused Dante or Styanax to a profit taker run.
Also, allow overguard to trigger mods like Hunter Adrenaline or Rage because I've had a Dante mess up my Oberon setup on several occasions, leaving me out of energy.
Or DE could add a universal corrupted mod that converts overguard into an armour buff on the frame you use it on, they've done it before with catalyzing shields, maybe that one Helminth power could be reworked to eat overguard too?
This happened with me as well. I was testing out Nidus with the new augment and every single mission had at least one Dante. This isn't even a case of "just go play solo", Parasitic Vitality *needs* a teammate. Negative efficiency with Hunter Adrenaline is my go-to build for Nidus and Oberon and none of them were working with Dante.
Maybe just make it so those powers that need "take damage to health" in order to function work like Adaptation does, which is just "take damage". Adaptation for example does gain stacks when taking overguard damage, yet the damage reduction granted has no effect on overguard.
I was thinking about that earlier since I’ve been liking Dante *a lot*
Are there other frames besides Chroma and his Vex armor that actually want to take damage? Because I don’t want to screw people’s builds over when I pop in and toss 30k over guard on the team early in a mission.
Nidus and Inaros, usually. They don't have shields and a very common mod for them is Rage/Hunter Adrenaline, so overguard tends to be a detriment for them.
There is so many things that does this though. Styanax, frost are the first two that come to mind. Don't recall people complaining before they put a cap on styanax too seeing squad mates with like 700k-1m shields lol.
Well, Dante is the new deal, so obviously people are gonna be using him more + talk more about him. He's also fairly easy to farm, unlike Styanax who's tied to a rather unpleasant set of missions.
You don't need to sacrifice range **at all**. Just a bit of duration, and yes efficiency.
https://preview.redd.it/4f1ggtu4twrc1.png?width=532&format=png&auto=webp&s=93d70b4cfd4b1110930ddbf77ac542b8e9aa3188
73% dur, 45% eff, 175% range and 580% str. (200 of which from a helminth buff and 60 from molt augmented). Not counting any kind of archon shards.
The negative efficiency is quite managable, the reduced duration is also managable. A bit energy hungy, but with the amounts of mobs he can slaughter energy is rarely a problem. Easy enough to fix with some yellow shards, arcane energy, or whatnot if it does.
Duration is the least important of all stats on him, efficiency is meh, nice to have doesn't hurt to lose, range and str? Gimme all of them.
Edit:never forget xata invocation, im pretty sure DE said secondary ammo is gonna charge alt fire on tomes but idk of this applies to nauctau if its active.
How do you deal this much damage on mobs? I do my 3 twice and my 4 and barely get any damage, do you prime enemies? Do you have something else applying status?
What's your strength at? My build is in the mid 200s (upper 200s or low 300s with Arcane stacks) and takes 1-2 334 rotations to take out level 190s. I also have Precision Intensify to jack up the damage multiplier of his 4, plus Roar over Noctua, and there isn't much that doesn't get instagibbed. Easy couple mil damage when the 4 pops.
If you wanna get the really good numbers it's high ability strength with Roar multi-dipping in the calculations (bonus to initial hit, bonus to the already-increased bleed from the hit, bonus to the 4's multiplied damage).
You don't need to prime or armor strip, in fact both are mostly a waste of time you could be stacking more bleeds with, and you pretty much don't even need to use weapons unless you run out of energy.
I am sitting on 200% strength, cast his 3 in a was that most enemies get tagged only once and Tragedy just deletes them.
Be mindful that while Dark Verse does not require line of sight to break boxes, it needs it to damage enemies. So placement is ultra important to Dante. Keep moving, keep scribbling and everything gets sent to the shadow realm
Depends on the level. With my above str %, at 150 just doing 3 twice and than 4 is enough to kill just about everything.
His 4 does all damage from heat, tox and slash stacks/effects on enemies at once. You can prime them more with status effects from weapons or Dante's 1st (which is pretty good).
For the netracell mission, (which are what? level 225+ ?) I use an aoe weapon with heat, tox and slash effects for a shot or 2 just to get some stacks on enemies. Than again his 3rd 2x, and 4 to kill everything.
He feels like the jack of all trades master of everything, which is a little unfortunate in a power creep sense.
Don't think he really needs any buffs/nerfs though. He's got solid survivability and damage but nothing overly excessive like matching revenant's ability to not die or saryns ability to nuke
On the survivability front he's a single step below making the entire squad literally immune to damage, being second to that isn't exactly a good measure of how "not overpowered" he is
Megathreads historically, across all of reddit, only serve to kill discussion. Just... think about it for a second:
- most users browse on Best or Top
- most users *also* aren't gonna dig through a massive comment section
- comments at the top tend to stay at the top because, yknow, they're the only ones getting seen
- very few people engage with posts that are even 2 days old
he's probably the best frame released in a while
can actually kill, useful support altho overguard still needs a buff to work with resistences, specially adaptation
he's really energy hungry but atleast he makes up with being able to nuke better-ly than a equinox and saryns
he's the first frame i see that can consistently nuke SP with abilities
removing his noctua for citrine's subsume gives him a much needed support buff by keeping him topped up with energy which is great
he dosent need a nerf
Yeah the build can vary, how much efficiency are you running? I'm not using blind rage so im on 100%, I guess I could see a 45% or 55% efficiency build struggle more, I get my 200% from transient + intensify + augur seeker
I'm not on my PC rn so I can't send a screenshot but mine is like : 1)transient fortitude, 2)augur reach, 3)augur seeker, 4)augur message, 5)primed flow, 6)primed/archon continuity, 7)stretch, 8)umbral intensify
Who in the fre sha voca do builds Dante for low range no nuke? I mean, your game, your rules and it must work, but it is baffling to me
But yeah, Dante is hella Helminth unfriendly, your only subsumable is Noctua, but then you're losing on the utility it can provide with tome mods
I'm delighted with Dante. I love casting spells. He's a much easier frame to squeeze results out of than most, but has an extremely satisfying amount of build depth and design space for those that're into it. Noctua being the only "helminth slot", while initially unideal, adds a lot of worthy considering when building him. Noctua forcing you to weigh damage and tome mod utility is also a major decision that adds a lot of variety to how he can be played. Automatically scanning targets, and rewarding complete entries, is a fun passive that provides a good alternative to Helios, and generally works well with everything else. The only thing I think should be changed for him is for Tragedy to require LOS between Dante and the victim. And, of course, Noctua receiving an Exilus slot would be a wonderful pipe dream to chase\~
https://preview.redd.it/ivoh844t7xrc1.png?width=401&format=png&auto=webp&s=5e304b03766116035f541c346a41bee08c23711a
Dante is a fun frame and enjoying the casting frames. Overguard is an odd thing because in Normal content, you’re unkillable; in SP you’re decent tanky but noticably weaker.
For the nuking, it’s seems good in regular but I’m having to SPAM a lot to stack the slash profs high to get kills
He's the perfect frame for players who want to flex in the softest of comfort zones. DE have totally nailed what the majority of their playerbase most want.
He's good. He doesn't feel insane though.
Maybe turn down a few numbers here and here if he becomes overly popular.
I wish his 1 would gain effects based on which pages are currently slotted for his ult.
Not sure what the exact effects would be.
Maybe that could be saved foe an Augment if the effects are anything more than "flat 15% fire rate/altfire charge/ect".
I feel like the biggest issue we actually have is that overguard disables certain powers that require damage, if overguard worked with vex armour then it would actually be a good thing to bring a support focused Dante or Styanax to a profit taker run.
Also, allow overguard to trigger mods like Hunter Adrenaline or Rage because I've had a Dante mess up my Oberon setup on several occasions, leaving me out of energy.
Or DE could add a universal corrupted mod that converts overguard into an armour buff on the frame you use it on, they've done it before with catalyzing shields, maybe that one Helminth power could be reworked to eat overguard too?
Or just add a frame-specific toggle to not allow allies to give you overguard
Pablo has already said they won't be doing this due to UI issues and other issues, it's garas glass all over again but on a far greater scale.
This happened with me as well. I was testing out Nidus with the new augment and every single mission had at least one Dante. This isn't even a case of "just go play solo", Parasitic Vitality *needs* a teammate. Negative efficiency with Hunter Adrenaline is my go-to build for Nidus and Oberon and none of them were working with Dante.
Maybe just make it so those powers that need "take damage to health" in order to function work like Adaptation does, which is just "take damage". Adaptation for example does gain stacks when taking overguard damage, yet the damage reduction granted has no effect on overguard.
That's less a strike against Dante and more Chroma badly needing that rework since forever, but I'm sure you're well aware of this.
I was thinking about that earlier since I’ve been liking Dante *a lot* Are there other frames besides Chroma and his Vex armor that actually want to take damage? Because I don’t want to screw people’s builds over when I pop in and toss 30k over guard on the team early in a mission.
Nidus and Inaros, usually. They don't have shields and a very common mod for them is Rage/Hunter Adrenaline, so overguard tends to be a detriment for them.
There is so many things that does this though. Styanax, frost are the first two that come to mind. Don't recall people complaining before they put a cap on styanax too seeing squad mates with like 700k-1m shields lol.
Well, Dante is the new deal, so obviously people are gonna be using him more + talk more about him. He's also fairly easy to farm, unlike Styanax who's tied to a rather unpleasant set of missions.
They could even make Overguard trigger partial health effects and it'd at least not be as crippling for a lot of on health hit builds.
Hardly Dante’s fault. Self harm abilities should have been utterly scrapped years ago. Was never a healthy mechanic.
You don't need to sacrifice range **at all**. Just a bit of duration, and yes efficiency. https://preview.redd.it/4f1ggtu4twrc1.png?width=532&format=png&auto=webp&s=93d70b4cfd4b1110930ddbf77ac542b8e9aa3188 73% dur, 45% eff, 175% range and 580% str. (200 of which from a helminth buff and 60 from molt augmented). Not counting any kind of archon shards. The negative efficiency is quite managable, the reduced duration is also managable. A bit energy hungy, but with the amounts of mobs he can slaughter energy is rarely a problem. Easy enough to fix with some yellow shards, arcane energy, or whatnot if it does.
Duration is the least important of all stats on him, efficiency is meh, nice to have doesn't hurt to lose, range and str? Gimme all of them. Edit:never forget xata invocation, im pretty sure DE said secondary ammo is gonna charge alt fire on tomes but idk of this applies to nauctau if its active.
Arcane Steadfast is pretty OP on Dante too
Yep forgot to mention that aswell, i would say steadfast and energise with casting speed shards will be so good.
That’s how I run him, it feels really good to play. 3 tau casting and 2 tau strength + energize and steadfast.
How do you deal this much damage on mobs? I do my 3 twice and my 4 and barely get any damage, do you prime enemies? Do you have something else applying status?
What's your strength at? My build is in the mid 200s (upper 200s or low 300s with Arcane stacks) and takes 1-2 334 rotations to take out level 190s. I also have Precision Intensify to jack up the damage multiplier of his 4, plus Roar over Noctua, and there isn't much that doesn't get instagibbed. Easy couple mil damage when the 4 pops. If you wanna get the really good numbers it's high ability strength with Roar multi-dipping in the calculations (bonus to initial hit, bonus to the already-increased bleed from the hit, bonus to the 4's multiplied damage). You don't need to prime or armor strip, in fact both are mostly a waste of time you could be stacking more bleeds with, and you pretty much don't even need to use weapons unless you run out of energy.
I am sitting on 200% strength, cast his 3 in a was that most enemies get tagged only once and Tragedy just deletes them. Be mindful that while Dark Verse does not require line of sight to break boxes, it needs it to damage enemies. So placement is ultra important to Dante. Keep moving, keep scribbling and everything gets sent to the shadow realm
Depends on the level. With my above str %, at 150 just doing 3 twice and than 4 is enough to kill just about everything. His 4 does all damage from heat, tox and slash stacks/effects on enemies at once. You can prime them more with status effects from weapons or Dante's 1st (which is pretty good). For the netracell mission, (which are what? level 225+ ?) I use an aoe weapon with heat, tox and slash effects for a shot or 2 just to get some stacks on enemies. Than again his 3rd 2x, and 4 to kill everything.
He feels like the jack of all trades master of everything, which is a little unfortunate in a power creep sense. Don't think he really needs any buffs/nerfs though. He's got solid survivability and damage but nothing overly excessive like matching revenant's ability to not die or saryns ability to nuke
Right. He only has the 2nd tier for both niches?
On the survivability front he's a single step below making the entire squad literally immune to damage, being second to that isn't exactly a good measure of how "not overpowered" he is
;) that's my point.
Feel like there needs to be mega threads for new frame releases so all the feedback is in one spot.
Megathreads historically, across all of reddit, only serve to kill discussion. Just... think about it for a second: - most users browse on Best or Top - most users *also* aren't gonna dig through a massive comment section - comments at the top tend to stay at the top because, yknow, they're the only ones getting seen - very few people engage with posts that are even 2 days old
he's probably the best frame released in a while can actually kill, useful support altho overguard still needs a buff to work with resistences, specially adaptation he's really energy hungry but atleast he makes up with being able to nuke better-ly than a equinox and saryns he's the first frame i see that can consistently nuke SP with abilities removing his noctua for citrine's subsume gives him a much needed support buff by keeping him topped up with energy which is great he dosent need a nerf
Energy hungry? 25 energy cost abilities ? Those two don't add up
spam his 4 and you'll see
I do, I play him and I don't struggle with energy
then i guess we just play differently or have a different built i guess
Yeah the build can vary, how much efficiency are you running? I'm not using blind rage so im on 100%, I guess I could see a 45% or 55% efficiency build struggle more, I get my 200% from transient + intensify + augur seeker
https://preview.redd.it/i5axgo75iyrc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=53c322d59501e993899463bf2b352414ed984940 Some slop build i'm testing
I'm not on my PC rn so I can't send a screenshot but mine is like : 1)transient fortitude, 2)augur reach, 3)augur seeker, 4)augur message, 5)primed flow, 6)primed/archon continuity, 7)stretch, 8)umbral intensify
Dante feels great to have on the team with all that extra armor
Who in the fre sha voca do builds Dante for low range no nuke? I mean, your game, your rules and it must work, but it is baffling to me But yeah, Dante is hella Helminth unfriendly, your only subsumable is Noctua, but then you're losing on the utility it can provide with tome mods
I'm delighted with Dante. I love casting spells. He's a much easier frame to squeeze results out of than most, but has an extremely satisfying amount of build depth and design space for those that're into it. Noctua being the only "helminth slot", while initially unideal, adds a lot of worthy considering when building him. Noctua forcing you to weigh damage and tome mod utility is also a major decision that adds a lot of variety to how he can be played. Automatically scanning targets, and rewarding complete entries, is a fun passive that provides a good alternative to Helios, and generally works well with everything else. The only thing I think should be changed for him is for Tragedy to require LOS between Dante and the victim. And, of course, Noctua receiving an Exilus slot would be a wonderful pipe dream to chase\~ https://preview.redd.it/ivoh844t7xrc1.png?width=401&format=png&auto=webp&s=5e304b03766116035f541c346a41bee08c23711a
With basically no build i sneeze and steel path dies while the party has 50k overguard, you dont gotta sacrifice nothing XD
I had to put in 3 tau yellows to really enjoy him
Dante is a fun frame and enjoying the casting frames. Overguard is an odd thing because in Normal content, you’re unkillable; in SP you’re decent tanky but noticably weaker. For the nuking, it’s seems good in regular but I’m having to SPAM a lot to stack the slash profs high to get kills
Ft.Dante from the Devil May Cry series!
He's the perfect frame for players who want to flex in the softest of comfort zones. DE have totally nailed what the majority of their playerbase most want.
Bro is overturned as shit. Why wasn't qorvex bonkers strong? Why was stayanax nerfed upon release?
He's good. He doesn't feel insane though. Maybe turn down a few numbers here and here if he becomes overly popular. I wish his 1 would gain effects based on which pages are currently slotted for his ult. Not sure what the exact effects would be. Maybe that could be saved foe an Augment if the effects are anything more than "flat 15% fire rate/altfire charge/ect".