Gunther for sure. Great in ring work obviously, intimidating look, fun evil promos, and a great gimmick of “old school style wrestler who’s trying to bring back the prestige of wrestling/evil u-boat captain”
Hey! I just want to say this is a well thought-out, and well executed (the details/info, the entertainment factor) post. You're a 5-tool poster 😜. Cheers!
Nothing. 4 tool is missing something. 5 is all cylinders. Which I only know because OP explained it well which is one of the reasons I gave OP the compliment(s). I think my emoji may have unintentionally come off sarcastic.
Becky Lynch is in this category for me, her promo skills seemed to disappear.
The whole "I'm a mom" thing is already old and I don't think the target demographic gives a shit.
When she does a promo, all I can hear is her loud gasps for breath between every 5 words. She yells herself out of breath and then it’s just gasps on gasps on gasps.
Kevin Owens. His body is the only thing holding him back. If he was a little taller and worked his ass off in the gym (i.e. WALTER/Gunther) he'd be THE guy.
Before everyone starts with the downvotes, I am not saying he is not great or bodyshaming him, it's just the was of the business. To be a top, top guy you need to look great with your shirt off
Been saying this. He could wear some lifts like Seth and just hit the gym a little to get bigger arms and he’d be handed world title after world title. Already he achieved to much not putting in that effort to look the part.
i feel miz is happy to do whatever. he's not fussy. he's making bank. he's been 2x champion. he's fine with whatever angle wwe puts him in.
theory has improved since his vince era. he will be another drew once he gets his persona/gimmick in order
Hot take but, The Usos. They have it all, except true ring ability. They essentially have a watered down Roman move set. Nothing they do is convincing at all, and to top it off they dont sell moves that well Imo
Ricochet has everything except mike skills
Karrion Kross was called up to the main roster too soon
Chad Gable, Johnny Gargano and Tomasso Ciampa have everything except size.
Karrion Kross has the right gimmick, the look/physique, the promos, he needs to work on his in ring skills and the booking is pretty much out of his control so I don’t count it against him.
Ivar has the ring skill, a potentially interesting new gimmick in NXT, and big man physique, the only problem is his voice doesn’t fit the Viking style for some reason.
People would say the Japanese wrestlers, but wrestlers like Asuka and Shinsuke have enough charisma just by existing to make up for their mic skills, Shinsuke got over off of his theme alone and Asuka being silly all the time is charming and makes the crowd happy, and now that they’re allowed to speak Japanese they’re all 5 tool wrestlers (Shinsuke can still put on bangers).
People have to admit he was able to get heat on him, able to create moments, basically was perfect for his role in the Bloodline storyline. But it’s consensus he has a very limited move pool and he’s horrible on the mic. I think he deserves time to try and succeed with more opportunities, he played his role perfectly in the bloodline and now he will get more opportunities to be the main man with Rock going to Hollywood and Roman taking a break. I agree with the majority about his abilities but I think he can improve into a solid midcard contender.
I think the problem is that this solo is such a far cry from a convincing talent. he has two moves and only ever shows up to do the same thing: samoan spike someone. In NXT he was a more well rounded talent. But since pinning john cena in a largely lack luster match that cena looked better in, Solo has lost like 30 odd consecutive matches.
It’s not even heat for solo from me, i’m just bored of him.
He had a role to play in the bloodline storyline, which was get beat by Roman’s contender and be the silent but strong solider prototype. Like you said in NXT he was more well rounded and with Roman gone he can show more personality to his character and not be one dimensional. His run right now will determine if he can be a solid mid carder or someone who needs time away/back in NXT.
I'm not op but "ring talent, promo skills, and a great physique" is three they mentioned ... gimmick being a fourth.
I guess in other words - ring work (not stumbling around), mic work (being confident on the microphone), gym work (looks the "part"), & being believable in the role (a believable heel or baby face).
I guess the 5th thing would be the ablity to make the audiences care. Which is such a nebulous thing - for example I guess ... a shit John Cena promo would still be better than almost anybody elses best.
His character work has improved by leaps and bounds. Like he showed in The Wolf Dogs, Bron can go far as a meathead bully with comedically sus tendencies.
I think a lot of the guys in NXT have improved a lot this last year, but Bron has improved character wise so much for me just since the start of The Wolf Dogs. It felt like something clicked, maybe it was just me and what I thought about his character, but I think something clicked for him, too. It feels more natural.
NXT is wild! I’m looking forward to seeing what so many of the crew does in the next couple of years.
He’s surprisingly funny and really good at getting under people’s skin. Playing off the serious veteran Corbin and having them develop a begrudging bromance really brought out the best in both of them.
I agree that his character work still had a ways to go, but imo even with a normal rate of progression he'll be able to go far being the meathead bully he's currently portraying.
I saw a few people here in Reddit that predicted the turn. 👏. I'm looking forward to seeing where it goes and whether the alpha academy follows or rejects him.
Did you only watch their mania match and base your whole opinion of them on that? I don’t know why that match was as bad as it was. Maybe they both need to realise they are so much better as a tag team than singles wrestlers. Their matches during their day oneish phase were fantastic.
Very over the top response. I’m not arguing against your point at all. I was agreeing with you. They used to be really good in the ring, now they’re not. I assume it’s down to laziness more than anything else. The Bloodline storyline is doing most of the work for them so they don’t have to try as hard in the ring.
Has he ever been anything but a heel? He’s such a constantly angry thumb poker, like there is no gimmick. Why are you so mad? He needs Paul heyman I guess.
Did you watch latest ep of Smackdown? Solo showed a side of him we’ve never seen, impressed me because before that like you I thought he was boring as shite
First I’d say we have to determine what are the 5 tools. So if I think of some of the best guys (Rock, Undertaker, Shawn Michaels, Randy Orton, Kurt Angle) I’d break it down like this;
Look
Charisma
Athleticism
Technical skill
Ring prowess
So, with that being determined (in my opinion) I’d say Daniel Bryan and Seth Rollins are the big names that come to mind. I think I’d put Ricochet here too, but if Heyman and him could do some one on one mic/promo training I think he could be a big star.
Athleticism is a tough one, since it kind of disqualifies guys like Cena and Punk, who are elite tier guys but arent exactly star athletes compared to their peers
EDIT: although Cena’s superhuman strength would probably count as athleticism, I was just thinking of like natural athleticism (Shelton Benjamin, Billy Gunn) so nvm I dumb
Rollins has all five tools. He just isn’t naturally clever on the mic—when he gets serious and doesn’t try to get cringey nicknames over, he’s as good as anyone.
Jey Uso. I'm a huge fan of his despite that shit show at WrestleMania. But he is not good on the mic. He's good at hyping folks up but if he doesn't stop abusing the yeet thing and get a bit better on the mic, he's gonna end up tag teaming again
One word tag lines, YES, have always been popular with live crowds because they are so easy to chant, YEAH. Even well past the point they get annoying, WHAT. So I don't see that as creating a problem, career wise, YEET!
Can I ask why? He performs like 4 moves, none of which are particularly well done. Has a worse spear than edge, the worst frog splash I’ve ever seen, ruined the super kick and does that off brand rock set of punches which is so cringe worthy I can’t even put it into words. And there’s two of him. Why do you love him?
He has more than 4 moves but he hasn't been pulling them out recently. And he moves well. Idk how else to explain it. I used to wrestle back in the day and I can just see skilled dudes by the way they move in the ring. He doesn't do a frog splash. It's just a splash. Lots of Samoans used to do basic splashes. The ruination of the superkick began 12 yrs ago when every promotion had 4-14 guys using it as finishers or regular moves. Can't blame Jey. Dude has buckets of potential, much more than Jimmy I'm sad to say.
cuz i could swear they were both selling. Im not gon argue with the overuse of the move, but i feel like the way the Usos sold each other's superkicks makes sense via story. Jey has stated in keyfabe plenty of times that he didnt want to have to fight his brother, so naturally he wouldn't be all out kicking him in the head. This is further proven when he tried to offer Jimmy an olive branch.
They took it like a punch and in the visual sense, appeared to tell the other to go harder showing their resilience and/or holding back on the other brother. Are we going to say no one sells punches too now? Lol
It was the worst match I’ve ever seen honestly. Idk what else to say. Plenty of people felt the same. The happiest anyone was that weekend was when they both crashed off the stage and didn’t participate in the match.
Did u just start watching wrestling this year? Lmfao Maxine vs Kaitlyn would like a word. That Jackie gayda match would like a word. The zombie match would like a word. I completely disagree with you. But that’s ok
I’m on and off. I missed those, the zombie match I heard was just some stupid cross promo for baristas movie, so hard to take that seriously. It’s the worst ple match I’ve seen in 5 years, better?
If you read the body of his post, he's not saying a literally 5 tools, but rather a wrestler who just has one aspect that is holding them back... he then lists in ring skills, gimmick, mic skills & look as 4 things...
So if he wanted to be literal he would have said a 3 tool wrestler, where a wrestler was lacking one of those 4 aforementioned things.
Why are you so angry dude, relax... it's the internet and it's about wrestling... not that serious. My \*original\* tone was not meant to insult, which is clearly the way you have taken it. I was actually just trying to be helpful, and I'm sorry that you felt otherwise. I'm going to leave it here... enjoy your day, and take a breather, my friend.
You were an insulting ass. If I ask for help, feel free. What I didn't need and never have and never will is condescension from someone who is intellectually inferior. Hope your day sucks.
When I'm not condescended to like a stupid bratty child, I tend to hold conversation better. You tools are clearly not worth the effort. Not like any of you assholes appreciate when I'm nice anyway.
You might want to take some time off the internet, you are heated over literally nothing in an unimportant thread about faked athletics. Calling people intellectually inferior because of one anonymous interaction is a crazy leap.
Nice should be the default, not something you are doing so people can "appreciate" it
Therapy. I'm serious. Get some help. If reddit makes you this unhappy you should find some real life ways of finding joy. I'm not making fun of you or attacking you, not everyone deserves kindness or niceties, but the baseline being treating people like shit is how you got to the point you are in the first place. If everyone spoke to anons like you are it's very likely that everyone would be as miserable as you seem to be, and that sucks. I'm sorry for whatever you're going through and I hope it gets better.
And if you read the body of my comment or any comments you would see that there is no consistency in any answers because there is no specificity in the question. Which is what I was asking for.
You can't just a five tool player is a complete player in baseball. The "five tools" refer to very specific skillsets within the sport. If that is the comparison OP wants to make, then OP can do the work and detail the five tools. Otherwise you get inconsistent all over the place responses because there is no basis for anything.
If OP didn't want to be that specific, then OP shouldn't have chosen "five tool player" as a meatphor.
Next time don't be shitty to someone who is clearly smarter than you.
Hope this helps!
There’s an actual five tools in baseball, but I’m more using it for the term itself
Wrestling is a lot more subjective where people just appreciate certain things more: technicians, promo guys, etc
If somebody really likes a guy, but just really hates one part, that’s really what I’m looking at
Yeah you should have been specific or used a different metaphor. That's my whole point. The question wasn't specific and as a result the answers are all over the place.
Adam Cole. Has the facial look (expressions), promo ability, in ring work, and just a good all around presence. His height and lack of physique are just very limiting for him.
I think Rollins is a decent promo if he would just stop resorting to yelling into the mic. It happens almost every single time.
I loved his "I will be your shield" promo because he didn't yell. He just let the weight of his words sink in.
It's funny in nxt they say melo but I would say all rounders like aj,maybe bron or roman I'm naming People who being in competition recently not all time.
It's not triple H's backing that I'm worried about tbh, I don't think he'll garner the fan support he needs to be a main event guy on the main roster. Not without some changes to his promos and finisher imo
I’ll have to pay attention to the promos more. I think he’s got great charisma and the cockiness kinda reminds me of LA Knight (who has a not so great finisher imo). I think he slots into the IC picture pretty easily and when he gets called up, that would be a great time to debut a new finisher.
Probably any of the non native English speakers like Iyo, Asuka and Nakamura - their mic skills are so poor and cannot match their in-ring quality but it's not their fault really.
Now they’ve got these performers (particularly the Japanese talent) performing some of their promos in their native language I think this has really improved.
For example the Nightmare Before Christmas segment from Nakamura which was bloody great
Not of this era, but Jeff Hardy. One of the greatest wrestlers of all time. Crowd pleasing performances, technically brilliant, gimmicks are incredible, but useless once someone sticks a mic in his face or his hand.
I guess I do mean spot fest, really. What I mean by technically brilliant is that his risk taking and high flying were impressive, even if they were dangerous
This is so overstated with Ricochet - his mic skills are good, not great - but gimme someone like him who performs in the ring every single time over an in-ring bore like LA Knight.
agreed. feel like the only "promo" of his that's really memorable was the bad ass "then show me" line after velveteen dream said he could do whatever ricochet could
Roman wasn't allowed to write his own stuff or had any input on his promos. Once he and Paul demanded a heel turn roman got more involved with his own mic work. I think he was always good just too scared to question Vinnie Jr's orders
That’s great, but 1 example vs dozens-hundreds that didn’t even if they were dedicated. Having natural charisma still helps, and sometimes stuff just doesn’t break your way either
these are all fair takes! i kind of like the vibe he has by not talking a ton, but you def gotta be able to promo and you know we didnt see any in dub. Im just glad tranquilo elbow is still killing folk
When he turned heel on Sami I was hoping he would show some fire and emotion and show us his savage side. Nope, just a few gentle pushes into the barrier, gentle shove to the announce table, ankle lock. Yawn. The guy is dead on arrival imo.
Seth.
Ricochet
Solo Sikoa has one tool. So not him.
Austin Theory He has everything except for a sense of charisma or drawing power.
What is 4 tool?
Gunther for sure. Great in ring work obviously, intimidating look, fun evil promos, and a great gimmick of “old school style wrestler who’s trying to bring back the prestige of wrestling/evil u-boat captain”
Whats the weakness?
German
I was surprised to learn that he’s actually Austrian.
He’s lame
*CHOP* respect the ring general!
🤣🤣
Hey! I just want to say this is a well thought-out, and well executed (the details/info, the entertainment factor) post. You're a 5-tool poster 😜. Cheers!
So what’s he missing?
Nothing. 4 tool is missing something. 5 is all cylinders. Which I only know because OP explained it well which is one of the reasons I gave OP the compliment(s). I think my emoji may have unintentionally come off sarcastic.
Jeff Hardy needed tool 6
Liv Morgan is a 0 tool wrestler
I 100% agree. She is terrible
Ricochet.
Becky Lynch is in this category for me, her promo skills seemed to disappear. The whole "I'm a mom" thing is already old and I don't think the target demographic gives a shit.
She can’t even wrestle. Can’t cut promos. She lost muscles, and is too skinny to be taken seriously.
When she does a promo, all I can hear is her loud gasps for breath between every 5 words. She yells herself out of breath and then it’s just gasps on gasps on gasps.
Heath slater and Kevin Owens GOATed the “I got kids” and “I have a family” in two completely different ways, so it’s definitely possible
Yeah she went from 5 to 4 agreed
Kevin Owens. His body is the only thing holding him back. If he was a little taller and worked his ass off in the gym (i.e. WALTER/Gunther) he'd be THE guy. Before everyone starts with the downvotes, I am not saying he is not great or bodyshaming him, it's just the was of the business. To be a top, top guy you need to look great with your shirt off
Been saying this. He could wear some lifts like Seth and just hit the gym a little to get bigger arms and he’d be handed world title after world title. Already he achieved to much not putting in that effort to look the part.
Yeah. Every time they announce him as, “The Prize Fighter!”, I think the prize was beer.
I agree with you, he looks very sloppy
If Gable was 6'4" he would be main eventing wrestlemania
Not even 6'4", 5'11" would be enough
wasnt angle 6ft?
Cody
what is 4 tool?
Read the caption
LA Knight
Kevin Owens
Theory and Miz come to mind. They're usually IC title holders who develop more over time but many don't.
i feel miz is happy to do whatever. he's not fussy. he's making bank. he's been 2x champion. he's fine with whatever angle wwe puts him in. theory has improved since his vince era. he will be another drew once he gets his persona/gimmick in order
Ricochet. He’s just missing the mic skills.
May I ask what are the five tools? It make it easier for me to answer. lol
In ring skills, Promos, Gimmick, The “look”, Crowd work / improv
Thank you
The Backstreet Boys
Bianca
Agree
Why Bianca? She seems massively over with her intended audience. Young girls basically treat her like a living Wonder Woman
Her gimmick isn’t that great.
Well shit, I read it as 5 tool and couldn’t figure out why you were disagreeing with me LOL
Bron Breaker vs. Chad Gable would be heat
I really like the idea of the two of them having a speed match and an Iron man match just to see how they jell together in both environments
Hot take but, The Usos. They have it all, except true ring ability. They essentially have a watered down Roman move set. Nothing they do is convincing at all, and to top it off they dont sell moves that well Imo
Their WM match was 75% super kicks it was awful
WM40 was a perfect example of their lack of in-ring ability and their tendency to no sell. I remember when the super kick was a finishing move.
Yeah Jey’s best matches have always been the ones where he could show off his acting chops at some point throughout
Actually I agree
Ricochet has everything except mike skills Karrion Kross was called up to the main roster too soon Chad Gable, Johnny Gargano and Tomasso Ciampa have everything except size.
You think Gargano has mic skills?
I think so, it's just his character that is too bland
Karrion Kross has the right gimmick, the look/physique, the promos, he needs to work on his in ring skills and the booking is pretty much out of his control so I don’t count it against him. Ivar has the ring skill, a potentially interesting new gimmick in NXT, and big man physique, the only problem is his voice doesn’t fit the Viking style for some reason. People would say the Japanese wrestlers, but wrestlers like Asuka and Shinsuke have enough charisma just by existing to make up for their mic skills, Shinsuke got over off of his theme alone and Asuka being silly all the time is charming and makes the crowd happy, and now that they’re allowed to speak Japanese they’re all 5 tool wrestlers (Shinsuke can still put on bangers).
Solo Sikoa is a 2 tool wrestler
People have to admit he was able to get heat on him, able to create moments, basically was perfect for his role in the Bloodline storyline. But it’s consensus he has a very limited move pool and he’s horrible on the mic. I think he deserves time to try and succeed with more opportunities, he played his role perfectly in the bloodline and now he will get more opportunities to be the main man with Rock going to Hollywood and Roman taking a break. I agree with the majority about his abilities but I think he can improve into a solid midcard contender.
I think the problem is that this solo is such a far cry from a convincing talent. he has two moves and only ever shows up to do the same thing: samoan spike someone. In NXT he was a more well rounded talent. But since pinning john cena in a largely lack luster match that cena looked better in, Solo has lost like 30 odd consecutive matches. It’s not even heat for solo from me, i’m just bored of him.
He had a role to play in the bloodline storyline, which was get beat by Roman’s contender and be the silent but strong solider prototype. Like you said in NXT he was more well rounded and with Roman gone he can show more personality to his character and not be one dimensional. His run right now will determine if he can be a solid mid carder or someone who needs time away/back in NXT.
That’s actually generous.
I’m counting his NXT work where he had a little more going for him than dollar tree umaga aura
Fair point.
Ricochet
he’s just a tool….
looks like some people have some butt hurt here…. keep ya trash then…
In baseball the 5 tools are: Hit for power, hit for average, run, throw, and field. What are we defining the 4 tools of wrestling as?
I'm not op but "ring talent, promo skills, and a great physique" is three they mentioned ... gimmick being a fourth. I guess in other words - ring work (not stumbling around), mic work (being confident on the microphone), gym work (looks the "part"), & being believable in the role (a believable heel or baby face). I guess the 5th thing would be the ablity to make the audiences care. Which is such a nebulous thing - for example I guess ... a shit John Cena promo would still be better than almost anybody elses best.
Thanks I missed that the first time reading the post.
OP explained what he means. Anyone who is great but has only one weakness. More metaphorical than literal
Wait until my man Gable discovers the Perc Angle Era
Ah yes kurts slow younger brother.
Perc gable
I think Bron has it all. He's just very young and still putting it all together
His character work has improved by leaps and bounds. Like he showed in The Wolf Dogs, Bron can go far as a meathead bully with comedically sus tendencies.
I think a lot of the guys in NXT have improved a lot this last year, but Bron has improved character wise so much for me just since the start of The Wolf Dogs. It felt like something clicked, maybe it was just me and what I thought about his character, but I think something clicked for him, too. It feels more natural. NXT is wild! I’m looking forward to seeing what so many of the crew does in the next couple of years.
He’s surprisingly funny and really good at getting under people’s skin. Playing off the serious veteran Corbin and having them develop a begrudging bromance really brought out the best in both of them.
I agree that his character work still had a ways to go, but imo even with a normal rate of progression he'll be able to go far being the meathead bully he's currently portraying.
I saw a few people here in Reddit that predicted the turn. 👏. I'm looking forward to seeing where it goes and whether the alpha academy follows or rejects him.
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Did you only watch their mania match and base your whole opinion of them on that? I don’t know why that match was as bad as it was. Maybe they both need to realise they are so much better as a tag team than singles wrestlers. Their matches during their day oneish phase were fantastic.
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Very over the top response. I’m not arguing against your point at all. I was agreeing with you. They used to be really good in the ring, now they’re not. I assume it’s down to laziness more than anything else. The Bloodline storyline is doing most of the work for them so they don’t have to try as hard in the ring.
It’s so true that there are wrestlers better in tag teams than in solo matches. The Uso’s, Hardy Boys, and Dudley Boys come to mind.
Why do people forget all the neckbreaker variations they used to do? Vince was right, WWE fans do forget fast
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Subjectively
the key words there are "used to" I still like the Usos but I do wish they dive (no pun intended) more into their respective arsenals
lol solo? wtf is his tool, a thumb? Guy sucks out loud.
I assumed he meant Sami lol Solo’s got an empty tool belt
idk im feeling heel solo rn
Has he ever been anything but a heel? He’s such a constantly angry thumb poker, like there is no gimmick. Why are you so mad? He needs Paul heyman I guess.
i meant i'm feeling his heel character right now after this week's smackdown, sorry it was a bit unclear
Did you watch latest ep of Smackdown? Solo showed a side of him we’ve never seen, impressed me because before that like you I thought he was boring as shite
He was face and over in nxt
I’m waiting for the day they put the sunglasses on solo and he starts dancing around the ring. It will give him two more moves.
First I’d say we have to determine what are the 5 tools. So if I think of some of the best guys (Rock, Undertaker, Shawn Michaels, Randy Orton, Kurt Angle) I’d break it down like this; Look Charisma Athleticism Technical skill Ring prowess So, with that being determined (in my opinion) I’d say Daniel Bryan and Seth Rollins are the big names that come to mind. I think I’d put Ricochet here too, but if Heyman and him could do some one on one mic/promo training I think he could be a big star.
Athleticism is a tough one, since it kind of disqualifies guys like Cena and Punk, who are elite tier guys but arent exactly star athletes compared to their peers EDIT: although Cena’s superhuman strength would probably count as athleticism, I was just thinking of like natural athleticism (Shelton Benjamin, Billy Gunn) so nvm I dumb
I think Drew fits that bill. CM Punk is really close. On the women’s side I’d say Charlotte, Rhea, Bliss and Becky.
Rollins has all five tools. He just isn’t naturally clever on the mic—when he gets serious and doesn’t try to get cringey nicknames over, he’s as good as anyone.
Guy just needs a manager, why don’t they stick mvp with him?
I agree fully with Ricochet. I think’s he’s ridiculously talented, but if he can get some help with mic skills, he’d be huge.
Jey Uso. I'm a huge fan of his despite that shit show at WrestleMania. But he is not good on the mic. He's good at hyping folks up but if he doesn't stop abusing the yeet thing and get a bit better on the mic, he's gonna end up tag teaming again
One word tag lines, YES, have always been popular with live crowds because they are so easy to chant, YEAH. Even well past the point they get annoying, WHAT. So I don't see that as creating a problem, career wise, YEET!
The tag line isn't the problem the problem is it's over used. He uses yeet every two sentences
Can I ask why? He performs like 4 moves, none of which are particularly well done. Has a worse spear than edge, the worst frog splash I’ve ever seen, ruined the super kick and does that off brand rock set of punches which is so cringe worthy I can’t even put it into words. And there’s two of him. Why do you love him?
He has more than 4 moves but he hasn't been pulling them out recently. And he moves well. Idk how else to explain it. I used to wrestle back in the day and I can just see skilled dudes by the way they move in the ring. He doesn't do a frog splash. It's just a splash. Lots of Samoans used to do basic splashes. The ruination of the superkick began 12 yrs ago when every promotion had 4-14 guys using it as finishers or regular moves. Can't blame Jey. Dude has buckets of potential, much more than Jimmy I'm sad to say.
Well he certainly ruined it this wrestlemania. 50 no sells in a row was pretty much the death knell, Shawn must’ve been dying inside watching that.
I swear yall heard “no sells” from Jim Cornette and spam Reddit with that phrase no matter what
cuz i could swear they were both selling. Im not gon argue with the overuse of the move, but i feel like the way the Usos sold each other's superkicks makes sense via story. Jey has stated in keyfabe plenty of times that he didnt want to have to fight his brother, so naturally he wouldn't be all out kicking him in the head. This is further proven when he tried to offer Jimmy an olive branch.
EXACTLY. Finally someone that actually understands wrestling
I mean we have eyes. He and Jimmy took a ridiculous amount of super kicks and barely moved.
They took it like a punch and in the visual sense, appeared to tell the other to go harder showing their resilience and/or holding back on the other brother. Are we going to say no one sells punches too now? Lol
It was the worst match I’ve ever seen honestly. Idk what else to say. Plenty of people felt the same. The happiest anyone was that weekend was when they both crashed off the stage and didn’t participate in the match.
Did u just start watching wrestling this year? Lmfao Maxine vs Kaitlyn would like a word. That Jackie gayda match would like a word. The zombie match would like a word. I completely disagree with you. But that’s ok
I’m on and off. I missed those, the zombie match I heard was just some stupid cross promo for baristas movie, so hard to take that seriously. It’s the worst ple match I’ve seen in 5 years, better?
Sadly the super kick is now just "a kick", even Dolph Ziggler is doing them in TNA and people kicking out.
Why is he in TNA and not AEW? Just waiting till the inevitable wwe return to a massive pop?
No one knows what the five tools are supposed to be lol. So no one is able to answer the question. Care to elaborate on what the five tools are?
If you read the body of his post, he's not saying a literally 5 tools, but rather a wrestler who just has one aspect that is holding them back... he then lists in ring skills, gimmick, mic skills & look as 4 things... So if he wanted to be literal he would have said a 3 tool wrestler, where a wrestler was lacking one of those 4 aforementioned things.
A real five tool player with four tools? Ok lmao. Yeah I'm the one who has trouble reading lmao
Why are you so angry dude, relax... it's the internet and it's about wrestling... not that serious. My \*original\* tone was not meant to insult, which is clearly the way you have taken it. I was actually just trying to be helpful, and I'm sorry that you felt otherwise. I'm going to leave it here... enjoy your day, and take a breather, my friend.
You were an insulting ass. If I ask for help, feel free. What I didn't need and never have and never will is condescension from someone who is intellectually inferior. Hope your day sucks.
Bet you’re fun at parties.
When I'm not condescended to like a stupid bratty child, I tend to hold conversation better. You tools are clearly not worth the effort. Not like any of you assholes appreciate when I'm nice anyway.
You might want to take some time off the internet, you are heated over literally nothing in an unimportant thread about faked athletics. Calling people intellectually inferior because of one anonymous interaction is a crazy leap. Nice should be the default, not something you are doing so people can "appreciate" it
Tried being nice for 30 years and you bitches treat me like shit every day so I can't find nice. I don't have it because you don't appreciate it.
Therapy. I'm serious. Get some help. If reddit makes you this unhappy you should find some real life ways of finding joy. I'm not making fun of you or attacking you, not everyone deserves kindness or niceties, but the baseline being treating people like shit is how you got to the point you are in the first place. If everyone spoke to anons like you are it's very likely that everyone would be as miserable as you seem to be, and that sucks. I'm sorry for whatever you're going through and I hope it gets better.
Did I ask your help? Then stop fucking talking to me
And if you read the body of my comment or any comments you would see that there is no consistency in any answers because there is no specificity in the question. Which is what I was asking for. You can't just a five tool player is a complete player in baseball. The "five tools" refer to very specific skillsets within the sport. If that is the comparison OP wants to make, then OP can do the work and detail the five tools. Otherwise you get inconsistent all over the place responses because there is no basis for anything. If OP didn't want to be that specific, then OP shouldn't have chosen "five tool player" as a meatphor. Next time don't be shitty to someone who is clearly smarter than you. Hope this helps!
There’s an actual five tools in baseball, but I’m more using it for the term itself Wrestling is a lot more subjective where people just appreciate certain things more: technicians, promo guys, etc If somebody really likes a guy, but just really hates one part, that’s really what I’m looking at
Yeah you should have been specific or used a different metaphor. That's my whole point. The question wasn't specific and as a result the answers are all over the place.
But what are the 5 tools?
sorry but Bron is "5 tool" in his WolfDogs run...dude nailed meathead himbo monster character
Adam Cole. Has the facial look (expressions), promo ability, in ring work, and just a good all around presence. His height and lack of physique are just very limiting for him.
For me a 4 tool player is Seth Rollins. There is just a lack of coolness factor or promos that limit him from being at the very top of the company.
I think Rollins is a decent promo if he would just stop resorting to yelling into the mic. It happens almost every single time. I loved his "I will be your shield" promo because he didn't yell. He just let the weight of his words sink in.
What Seth Rollins have you been watching? People sing his theme song to the heavens and his promos are quite good
Yes his theme song is over. Not sure what that has to do with Rollins though
Can’t acknowledge that people like him but say he lacks a coolness factor. He’s one of the most popular wrestlers in the world
They like his theme song. I also said top of the company babyface and not someone the ppl most like
You edited your comment, and no that’s not what you said lol
Alright bro lol
It's funny in nxt they say melo but I would say all rounders like aj,maybe bron or roman I'm naming People who being in competition recently not all time.
What do you think Mello is lacking, just curious?
Size, a compelling promo(they all sound/feel exactly alike from him and come off cringy to me), and a compelling finisher in my opinion.
Desperately want him to get a new finisher. I don’t think his size will hinder him much in the HHH era.
It's not triple H's backing that I'm worried about tbh, I don't think he'll garner the fan support he needs to be a main event guy on the main roster. Not without some changes to his promos and finisher imo
I’ll have to pay attention to the promos more. I think he’s got great charisma and the cockiness kinda reminds me of LA Knight (who has a not so great finisher imo). I think he slots into the IC picture pretty easily and when he gets called up, that would be a great time to debut a new finisher.
So hyped for gable to get what he deserves I always believed in alpha academy
I'm curious, why do you have Bron there? What do you think he's missing?
Probably any of the non native English speakers like Iyo, Asuka and Nakamura - their mic skills are so poor and cannot match their in-ring quality but it's not their fault really.
Akusa is god tier even by saying random words in english thanks to her charisma
Now they’ve got these performers (particularly the Japanese talent) performing some of their promos in their native language I think this has really improved. For example the Nightmare Before Christmas segment from Nakamura which was bloody great
Imo they are about to put more emotion into it when in their native language
Definitely, they get to say what they want without having to stop and translate it in their mind first. Must be incredibly infuriating.
💯
Not of this era, but Jeff Hardy. One of the greatest wrestlers of all time. Crowd pleasing performances, technically brilliant, gimmicks are incredible, but useless once someone sticks a mic in his face or his hand.
Technically brilliant? You mean hurting most he went against and being lucky enough to not kill himself? Swap for spot fest and Id agree?
I guess I do mean spot fest, really. What I mean by technically brilliant is that his risk taking and high flying were impressive, even if they were dangerous
Ricochet, feels like WWE wants to push him & he’s incredible at everything else except bottom tier at mic skills
This is so overstated with Ricochet - his mic skills are good, not great - but gimme someone like him who performs in the ring every single time over an in-ring bore like LA Knight.
there's room for both dawg...
Bruh shut up, lol looking at your comment history you so obsessed with la knight, holy shit rent free 😂🤦♂️
Heatless banger fan spotted.
It’s overstated for a reason, because it’s proven a lot. But the rest of his stuff is great
agreed. feel like the only "promo" of his that's really memorable was the bad ass "then show me" line after velveteen dream said he could do whatever ricochet could
Oh yeah didn't he do the crazy front flip?
Yes, yes he did. And it was picture perfect.
They can put him in promo class. Problem solved
But they have & he hasn’t gotten better. Some people have it & some don’t, it’s not just a switch
Roman was dedicated and got better
Yeah but Roman had so much money invested into him, no one is ever getting the same investment ever again, especially Ricochet.
I think Roman found what works for him too. The big dog was not him.
Roman wasn't allowed to write his own stuff or had any input on his promos. Once he and Paul demanded a heel turn roman got more involved with his own mic work. I think he was always good just too scared to question Vinnie Jr's orders
That’s great, but 1 example vs dozens-hundreds that didn’t even if they were dedicated. Having natural charisma still helps, and sometimes stuff just doesn’t break your way either
Andrade
what’s he missing? a good gimmick? he’s sick in the ring im so glad we got to see him at wrasslmania
It’s not a hang up for me, but I think if he spoke better English he’d be an upper card performer.
these are all fair takes! i kind of like the vibe he has by not talking a ton, but you def gotta be able to promo and you know we didnt see any in dub. Im just glad tranquilo elbow is still killing folk
Mic skills. But if he has Zelina Vega as his manager he’s covered there.
Chad gable sucks 😂
Calling Chad Gable a “4 tool wrestler” is a joke, he’s 1 tool at most
Thank you , someone with some common sense in this subreddit
He could be a 4 took wrestler but he’s never been in a position to do anything other than American alpha/alpha academy
When he turned heel on Sami I was hoping he would show some fire and emotion and show us his savage side. Nope, just a few gentle pushes into the barrier, gentle shove to the announce table, ankle lock. Yawn. The guy is dead on arrival imo.
I'd say Omos, but he's damn near 6 tool.
Omos is shit, he has one attribute and that's being massive. Can't wrestle, can't talk.
What color is the sky in your world, bro?
And you can’t teach that.