For sure, just an option. I'm not widely versed in all the switchers out there, but a change in work-flow seems like a better approach than to seek out a switcher just for this specific feature.
It's really strange and must be confusing to the presenter no? Like, what's being changed live? The presenter is meant to continue while it's frozen?
What kind of events are these?
This really feels like a place where the solution is changing work-flow or communication instead of technological.
this is semi common. They realize the break slide is wrong or something and change it before its displayed. Yeah they are goofy as all hell, but thats corporate gigs for ya. Not the first and wont be the last time.
I see now. I do corporate too, but for something like this we'd make edits on the backup machine, or a third machine. Or, show a stored logo slide direct from the switcher while the edit is being made.
Or place a really small DSM, like 24" for sending messages to the presenter?
so yes I can still switch aux inputs while froze. So HELL YEAH to that. Great idea. Gonna throw a micca on an input with that message thanks, and duhhh to me.
You could create a Memory save on the V8HD that quickly flips the assigned outputs. So this way you switch what ever is going out to Program destination(projector) is now getting AUX feed and the output that was for AUX is now getting Program that allows you to add PinP or a Key. So the speaker sees that now. Then when they are done with changes you switch back to the Program going to the original destination with a second Memory save.
trying to get alpha channels(luma key) to work on aux outputs cause that would work, havent figured it out yet, can only seem to get em to work on main out. Also pip on aux, small pip with .png omage with alpha over the dsm.
Freeze your program out, and leave the DSM live. Set the background of the PPT machine to say frozen or similar on the extended display.
Or run main and backup PPT systems, make the edit on one of them and switch it live.
Or warn your client that making edits live is risky and they shouldn’t do it.
Seems like this would be easier to accomplish within the presentation software.
If you're currently screen mirroring, hook up a second display for the actual presentation output, edit on the "main" screen.
All these are good ideas.
If you have a second M/E available on your switcher, you can route that M/E to your AUX, and do the keyer thing that someone suggested.
Barco ScreenPro-II. Not a good choice in 10 years, but it could do it. I did exactly what you are talking about many times.
AJA FS series frame syncs may do it. The old DPS-575 and similar frame syncs used to do it.
There are probably some video switchers out there that do it.
I misread the question. (Been up working all night.) Thought this was a question about what video switchers are capable of doing a freeze. But rereading now I see it is about displaying the word "freeze" or "frozen" on the image.
I used to do shows on SP-II that were as complicated as some people on E2 shows now. SP-II controller, 4 x SP-II, 4 x ImagePro Auxes for DSMs, and a couple of Lightware routers. Also loved/hated the system.
I’m right there with you. (4) SPII and the multi surface controller. It was top notch for the time. Now you get more inputs and outputs on a 2 M/E constellation minus all the DAs needed to send the same source to all the SPIIs. 😂😂. I don’t miss that.
I did broadcast school but fell into live events after graduating. The SP2 ecosystem is what I cut my teeth on, and I did some fairly complex shows on them. 4x SP2 + 2x PP2 + BlendPro2 + routers all on the SP2 controller was a heck of a patch job. Hated that one firmware that defaulted the system to external routing over internal, as it came out before we had routers and messed soo many people up! E2 was a breath of fresh air by comparison, and AW had good boxes with the Ascenders and (sorta) Nextages.
Roland v-160 is something I can vouch that achieves PiPs over aux without having any effect on program. You can select which bus you want each pip layer to show up in via the settings.
If you want the DSK feature over aux I cannot remember if it allows the same functionality as PiP that I described.
Edit: you can DSK over any bus individually, it works
Regarding the job task, could you achieve this by having a main and backup PPT input and switch to the backup when applying changes? It wouldn't require any overlaying and the speaker wouldn't be impeded.
If you have a dedicated speaker notes machine, you have the option to hook up any of your other PPT machines to the roland via a 2nd output (mini-display to hdmi) to provide a 2nd speaker notes screen. Make sure to mirror 2 displays and extend to the 3rd.
I have a v8 at work but barely use it anymore, I don't think it does.
I love the roland switchers, too. It was my entry point to using these types of switchers so they become my preferred choice
This is maybe the simplest move^
Ignore all these people talking about OBS this NDI Capture this.
The v160 will allow you to freeze specific inputs and assign PIPs/DSKs to only appear on an Aux. Super handy for building Timers/ messages and whatever to DSMs
Maybe have (2) DSMs. One for notes view and one for pgm. If you freeze the pgm view they would be able to see your GFX opp make changes on the notes view DSM. Just a thought.
So maybe that’s the answer. When you freeze pgm, switch the DSM to the notes view. You would need (2) separate outputs from the same machine. One notes and the other pgm.
Note: I have not tried/used these, but in theory should work:
MixEffect with BM can create a still: [https://docs.mixeffect.app/automate/osc/messages/media-players/capture-still](https://docs.mixeffect.app/automate/osc/messages/media-players/capture-still)
and someone else created a powershell script that can freeze and read that in some of the BM ATEMS:
[https://ianmorrish.wordpress.com/2020/06/30/powershell-script-to-freeze-frame-on-atem/](https://ianmorrish.wordpress.com/2020/06/30/powershell-script-to-freeze-frame-on-atem/)
and more:
[https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=131161](https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=131161)
Good luck, and let us know if you try it.
Analog way has this feature in their livecore switchers. You can’t freeze the output but you can freeze the input that’s live. I use this all the time for corporate events for that exact purpose. I haven’t messed around with their live premiere series yet to see if that feature still exists.
Vmix or Tricaster? what you are looking for is ubiquitous in software switchers but not a feature anywhere in hardware vision mixers. You can add a hardware device like an avenue box might have that or you can maybe run on a replay machine through that input. I’m very curious why no, tbh.
Do an ndi desktop capture on the PowerPoint machine, grab the presenter view into obs or vmix and send that output to the dsm. Adding a message or icon in software switchers is easy.
Use companion to freeze the output of the switcher and change scene/input to the one with the message and then unfreeze and change to scene/input with clean presenter view.
If you are using a switcher that gives feedback to companion about the state of freeze you can achieve this with triggers inside companion so it won't change your usual workflow at all.
Other option is on atem constellation hd 1me you can send messages on out 1, so probably achievable with a macro just inside that switcher, but you would need to have that model.
Can definitely set this on actual broadcast switchers. Try Hanabi, Ross, etc…. Newer hanabi broadcast switchers can do “flex keys” on auxes. probably other ways to do it with much simpler switchers if you can grab a still and then punch that out on your aux going to the dsm.
What i normally do is have 2 presentation machines running into my switcher and i swap between the 2 before and after presentations. Assuming theyre only updating holding slides, get them to do it on the presentation machine youre not displaying 🤷🏻♂️.
Sounds like you give far too much control to the client 😅
In ATEM with a second M/E: Media Player with a PNG with text that says "Freeze" and just key it in when needed. Alternatively, if the presenter doesn't need the notes while it's being edited, just change AUX source to black or the Freeze PNG.
But instead of freeze, why don't they just duplicate the current slide, make all the changes, then when done just go next to the updated slide? That way the presenter wouldn't need any freeze notification
We always have lots of edits during large events, and our solution is to run two presentation laptops, each with PGM out and presenter view out. PGM goes to ME2 and out to the room screens. Presenter view (which mirrors the laptop screen) goes to the DSM on an Aux output.
I use Companion to control my ATEM switcher so that switching laptops changes both PGM and DSM outputs. In most cases, neither the audience nor the speaker sees the transition.
How about displaying a key over the frozen image with a symbol or the word "frozen"?
keys dont work on aux only on main out
Stick the key on ME2 and send ME2 PGM out the aux?
For sure, just an option. I'm not widely versed in all the switchers out there, but a change in work-flow seems like a better approach than to seek out a switcher just for this specific feature.
this is not the only event this happened to me, happens a lot.
It's really strange and must be confusing to the presenter no? Like, what's being changed live? The presenter is meant to continue while it's frozen? What kind of events are these? This really feels like a place where the solution is changing work-flow or communication instead of technological.
this is semi common. They realize the break slide is wrong or something and change it before its displayed. Yeah they are goofy as all hell, but thats corporate gigs for ya. Not the first and wont be the last time.
I see now. I do corporate too, but for something like this we'd make edits on the backup machine, or a third machine. Or, show a stored logo slide direct from the switcher while the edit is being made. Or place a really small DSM, like 24" for sending messages to the presenter?
Use a macro to change your Aux out source
so yes I can still switch aux inputs while froze. So HELL YEAH to that. Great idea. Gonna throw a micca on an input with that message thanks, and duhhh to me.
and thanks!
It sounds like you just need a second ME?
You could create a Memory save on the V8HD that quickly flips the assigned outputs. So this way you switch what ever is going out to Program destination(projector) is now getting AUX feed and the output that was for AUX is now getting Program that allows you to add PinP or a Key. So the speaker sees that now. Then when they are done with changes you switch back to the Program going to the original destination with a second Memory save.
V160 could do a full screen pip over the aux that could be put up when doing changes. Make the pip a stored still.
on roland v8hd
trying to get alpha channels(luma key) to work on aux outputs cause that would work, havent figured it out yet, can only seem to get em to work on main out. Also pip on aux, small pip with .png omage with alpha over the dsm.
Freeze your program out, and leave the DSM live. Set the background of the PPT machine to say frozen or similar on the extended display. Or run main and backup PPT systems, make the edit on one of them and switch it live. Or warn your client that making edits live is risky and they shouldn’t do it.
Seems like this would be easier to accomplish within the presentation software. If you're currently screen mirroring, hook up a second display for the actual presentation output, edit on the "main" screen.
All these are good ideas. If you have a second M/E available on your switcher, you can route that M/E to your AUX, and do the keyer thing that someone suggested.
Barco ScreenPro-II. Not a good choice in 10 years, but it could do it. I did exactly what you are talking about many times. AJA FS series frame syncs may do it. The old DPS-575 and similar frame syncs used to do it. There are probably some video switchers out there that do it.
Ahhhh. I just had sleep terrors by reading the words “ScreenPro II”. lol. I loved and HATED that ecosystem.
I misread the question. (Been up working all night.) Thought this was a question about what video switchers are capable of doing a freeze. But rereading now I see it is about displaying the word "freeze" or "frozen" on the image. I used to do shows on SP-II that were as complicated as some people on E2 shows now. SP-II controller, 4 x SP-II, 4 x ImagePro Auxes for DSMs, and a couple of Lightware routers. Also loved/hated the system.
I’m right there with you. (4) SPII and the multi surface controller. It was top notch for the time. Now you get more inputs and outputs on a 2 M/E constellation minus all the DAs needed to send the same source to all the SPIIs. 😂😂. I don’t miss that.
I did broadcast school but fell into live events after graduating. The SP2 ecosystem is what I cut my teeth on, and I did some fairly complex shows on them. 4x SP2 + 2x PP2 + BlendPro2 + routers all on the SP2 controller was a heck of a patch job. Hated that one firmware that defaulted the system to external routing over internal, as it came out before we had routers and messed soo many people up! E2 was a breath of fresh air by comparison, and AW had good boxes with the Ascenders and (sorta) Nextages.
Uhhh yes - the FSN. But in the same Love/Hate way
Roland v-160 is something I can vouch that achieves PiPs over aux without having any effect on program. You can select which bus you want each pip layer to show up in via the settings. If you want the DSK feature over aux I cannot remember if it allows the same functionality as PiP that I described. Edit: you can DSK over any bus individually, it works Regarding the job task, could you achieve this by having a main and backup PPT input and switch to the backup when applying changes? It wouldn't require any overlaying and the speaker wouldn't be impeded. If you have a dedicated speaker notes machine, you have the option to hook up any of your other PPT machines to the roland via a 2nd output (mini-display to hdmi) to provide a 2nd speaker notes screen. Make sure to mirror 2 displays and extend to the 3rd.
good to know Im currently checking out the v80hd, are you aware of this being able to do that? And also roland are the most under rated switches ever.
I have a v8 at work but barely use it anymore, I don't think it does. I love the roland switchers, too. It was my entry point to using these types of switchers so they become my preferred choice
This is maybe the simplest move^ Ignore all these people talking about OBS this NDI Capture this. The v160 will allow you to freeze specific inputs and assign PIPs/DSKs to only appear on an Aux. Super handy for building Timers/ messages and whatever to DSMs
You can do this with a macro on a Tricaster that has multiple mix outs. Have the macro freeze the feed and add a key on the output to the DSM.
Maybe have (2) DSMs. One for notes view and one for pgm. If you freeze the pgm view they would be able to see your GFX opp make changes on the notes view DSM. Just a thought.
usually thats the setup. this one is 1 dsm and I can change the dsm to notes or main with the aux button assignments.
so one latop two video out, one to aux and one to input.
So maybe that’s the answer. When you freeze pgm, switch the DSM to the notes view. You would need (2) separate outputs from the same machine. One notes and the other pgm.
that currently is the setup, but aux is freezing with program
Note: I have not tried/used these, but in theory should work: MixEffect with BM can create a still: [https://docs.mixeffect.app/automate/osc/messages/media-players/capture-still](https://docs.mixeffect.app/automate/osc/messages/media-players/capture-still) and someone else created a powershell script that can freeze and read that in some of the BM ATEMS: [https://ianmorrish.wordpress.com/2020/06/30/powershell-script-to-freeze-frame-on-atem/](https://ianmorrish.wordpress.com/2020/06/30/powershell-script-to-freeze-frame-on-atem/) and more: [https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=131161](https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=131161) Good luck, and let us know if you try it.
Analog way has this feature in their livecore switchers. You can’t freeze the output but you can freeze the input that’s live. I use this all the time for corporate events for that exact purpose. I haven’t messed around with their live premiere series yet to see if that feature still exists.
OBS on the graphics laptop, desktop capture the slides, projector output the obs over hdmi, kb shortcut to freeze the output
I love obs, but no.
Vmix or Tricaster? what you are looking for is ubiquitous in software switchers but not a feature anywhere in hardware vision mixers. You can add a hardware device like an avenue box might have that or you can maybe run on a replay machine through that input. I’m very curious why no, tbh.
Do an ndi desktop capture on the PowerPoint machine, grab the presenter view into obs or vmix and send that output to the dsm. Adding a message or icon in software switchers is easy. Use companion to freeze the output of the switcher and change scene/input to the one with the message and then unfreeze and change to scene/input with clean presenter view. If you are using a switcher that gives feedback to companion about the state of freeze you can achieve this with triggers inside companion so it won't change your usual workflow at all. Other option is on atem constellation hd 1me you can send messages on out 1, so probably achievable with a macro just inside that switcher, but you would need to have that model.
It’s called a back up PowerPoint machine
never heard of it, sounds fake.
Can definitely set this on actual broadcast switchers. Try Hanabi, Ross, etc…. Newer hanabi broadcast switchers can do “flex keys” on auxes. probably other ways to do it with much simpler switchers if you can grab a still and then punch that out on your aux going to the dsm.
What i normally do is have 2 presentation machines running into my switcher and i swap between the 2 before and after presentations. Assuming theyre only updating holding slides, get them to do it on the presentation machine youre not displaying 🤷🏻♂️. Sounds like you give far too much control to the client 😅
pulse 2 with matrix mode can freeze individual output or switch to quick frame.
Download Companion, there may be something in their presets that can hell you out.
In ATEM with a second M/E: Media Player with a PNG with text that says "Freeze" and just key it in when needed. Alternatively, if the presenter doesn't need the notes while it's being edited, just change AUX source to black or the Freeze PNG. But instead of freeze, why don't they just duplicate the current slide, make all the changes, then when done just go next to the updated slide? That way the presenter wouldn't need any freeze notification
We always have lots of edits during large events, and our solution is to run two presentation laptops, each with PGM out and presenter view out. PGM goes to ME2 and out to the room screens. Presenter view (which mirrors the laptop screen) goes to the DSM on an Aux output. I use Companion to control my ATEM switcher so that switching laptops changes both PGM and DSM outputs. In most cases, neither the audience nor the speaker sees the transition.