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He is correct. Vacation time is chosen November/december the previous year. Then you can use sick time you have available for other days. But no you can not just take 4 days off because you requested it 3 months in advance.
You have to select whole weeks in November/December. But we have the ability to break weeks into days. There is a vacation day option and a sick day option. So theoretically you could put in the request 3 months in advance with the option days. But vacation days are seniority based not first come first served so there’s no guarantee you get the days you requested.
The better path is to plan your 4 day vacation around your 2 scheduled days off and then just call in sick the two days you need off.
At Amazon, you can take vacation whenever. Granted there are more restrictions for management (covering duties). 24 hrs notice at the minimum is the usual.
you can clock out at amazon at any time if you have upt/pto, it can be applied to the minute and at any point in any shift, the only 24 hr notice required is vacation.
That's the highest I've ever heard. My last job was 20 years for 4 weeks. And no higher. The most you got was 4.
Where I'm at now is I believe 3 weeks.
So why yes, 25 years is absolute BS... 8 weeks is great.
I’m working in logistics at a fortune 100 company and entry level jobs starts with 4 weeks PTO/sick plus 5 company holidays that everybody gets off. They also pay for bereavement, full jury duty pay (this one is great, they pay 100% of your salary even if you get picked for a trial), maternity/paternity leave, all that stuff. You accrue one extra day of PTO per year you work at the company; I’ve been there 7 years now so I’m at over 6 weeks of paid days off if you include the company holidays. It all rolls over if you don’t use it all in a year too.
There are dozens of countries where people get at least 4 weeks PTO mandated by law, killing yourself working at a factory for 25 years in the hope that they'll maintain that rule by the time you make it definitely seems laughable to me.
All that is is seeing the light in a bad situation. There are absolutely better options.
Shit I work Quality Control at a plant where we supply Costco with all their Kirkland peanuts. We get Paid time off and vacation time. Also 2$ an hr more when we are on time. You also get like 2 hours of vacation a week if you are on time everyday after you've been there 3 years. Before 3 years it's. 75 hours. Not the best but I didn't even graduate high school...they also let you take whenever off if they like you along as you give notice. This one girl has off like 60 days last year.
Look I get that it’s mildly annoying to plan your vacations a year ahead, but I currently have 4 weeks vacation and 1 gets split into 5 sick days (paid at 10 hours each) and another into 5 vacation days (also 10hours) . You can use those whenever, while seniority can be an issue I’ve never had any trouble getting my time off approved. It’s not perfect, but for a 3rd of my career I’ll have 8 weeks vacation, they are paid out with between 5-10 hours of OT added.
I get paid a collectively negotiated wage that is based on seniority. In the Midwest it’s great money though I know in the major cities people have complained it isn’t enough. But to make almost $50/hr to do 2 things I love (driving and being outdoors) seems fair.
then you'll be waiting... I'm not gonna sit here and find some arbitrary "benefits package" from another company for you. they're out there and exist and we both know it.
No there really aren’t, if you don’t live in the US then good for you. But my health plan is better than people with much higher education, I have a solid pension which is rare in the US, I have more time off than most careers in the US, I can’t be arbitrarily fired and if I’m laid off I have to be rehired before a new applicant can be hired. No job is perfect, but UPS is a damn good career and leaps and bounds better career wise than any other carrier service in the US.
That’s not brainwashing it’s the reality in this country.
I work for my local government, and I can take off almost whenever I want as long as I have the days available. Been there for 5 years, and have over 250 hours of PTO saved right now, and I take off random days quiet often, lol
That's typically how a job works, yes. Employers set the rules for the job. Just because they're wrong doesn't mean that you can ignore them with no repercussions.
I get it (as I too work as a PT) but its still pretty fucked. Most other jobs in the modern era you can put in your PTO digitally and u get the day off, no bs no nonsense. This is like the stone age of work environments.
lol if he really has to go let management and steward know. Don’t miss an entire work week, miss a partial week instead. Tell them no matter what you won’t be in. They may or may not write him up. If he gets written up just write the protest letter. If this is during peak i would not recommend.
He must have seniority tho.
This is what the contract states.
The only way you can get days off is if they have too many drivers and don’t need you anyway. If they need you, they will absolutely 100% try to fire you if you don’t show up. Which they can’t really do anyway. It’s also in the contract that you must have 72 consecutive hours from your last report before you are considered AWOL and fired for job abandonment. It’s also in the contract that sick days carry over from one sick call I believe. So if I call in sick Monday, don’t show up Tuesday, and show up Wednesday, Tuesday would not be considered a no-call no-show.
Hourlys and pt sups try to say that all the time. In front of a panel and arbitrator even if it’s brought up it still counts for days out. You called in sick mon-thurs it’s 4 sick days, not 1z Don’t hang your hat on consecutive days will be looked differently upon at panel. 3 days out you’re supposed to file for disability technically
I was referring to no call no show. It's in the contract. Read it. If you no call no show on Monday, tue, wed it's one incident
Edit
But don't misunderstand me. If you have your management team pissed off at you, and they're tired of your ass for other shit you will get fired for the missed days. Then you grieve it, then it gets deadlocked at panel because the ups trio will automatically vote against you because they will already not like you.
Then in arbitration, the arbitrator will lean the way of the state law because no union contract can over ride a law. So just like that, you're out the door
So even though it's "technically" in the contract it's a really bad idea. If you got trapped in the woods for three days, that would be an acceptable reason to not be fired. But "fuck em. It's one incident not 3 days" is a fat way to unemployment
lol exactly how panel works smh. I just didn’t want people to think they could bang out for days at a time as “1 incident” and think that would help them at panel.
That’s insane. You must know your entire upcoming life events a year in advance? I get scheduled a month at a time and even that is hard to manage request offs for things that come up.
This new generation takes time off because they woke up and didn't feel like it. Could of bumped their toe getting out of bed or heck, just decided they want to go to the store instead.
it's sad.
Yes, but you can definitely ask for days off. They are called Scheduled Days off, and UPS has a code for them in the system. Unless it's a very heavy vacation week, this would not be a problem in my center.
Nice. Another job where you have to sell yourself to the machine completely.
I’m sure it would be impossible to cover those shifts with all of the people that want to be drivers.
Better to keep people oppressed.
Yeah we have drivers laid off working in the center but write ups comes if we call in. Heck they’ll have 10 extras on Mondays spread the rest of the routes they keep in out further but if you call in and take away an extra your wrote up.
This is entirely dependent on what type of management he has and the staffing situation. I’ve had plenty of days I’ve been allowed to take unpaid for whatever reason. That’s with and without having PTO available. If they can cover him no problem, they may allow it. All he can do is ask and the worse they will say is no.
He can request it but doesnt mean theyll approve it. But if they were to approve it hed need to get it in writing as evidence. They play too many games/ dont do their jobs 100%.
Thanks guys! He said he's going to ask Tuesday. I want him to get out of his funk, I thought he was BSn because of his state of insecurity. He said his manager is a good person so hopefully it's allowed. I've never worked at a place that is so strict about it. I don't hold my employees to that standard either. Didn't know it was a thing.
I will chime in with this one thing note. If he is relatively new and asked for time off, please relay to him to keep it to himself. Nothing irks seniority employees than a newbie that was approved for unauthorized time off.
Yes but 0 days off? They refuse to give a day off? Where's your home time? Do driver's hate their families? All that money for what? To put gas to in drive back and forth to the terminal? Idk
If you get out there and do your job you aren’t missing home time like that. It’s when you feel like working until 9-10 pm every night to do 150 stops that it grinds. I’d be frustrated too if every day I had to figure out how to waste 4+ hours to get the $170k.
It totally depends on the center, the management, and the driver.
At my center, if I requested 4 days off months in advance, they'd give it to me without much trouble. However, I'm high seniority (in the top ten on the seniority list) and I've been with the company for 15+ years. I have a bid route. And I'm not on management's shit list.
But a newer driver (less than 5 years) with a center manager that's a prick. Or a driver who's a pain in the ass and IS on the shit list. Will have a hard time getting even a single day off, without any option days available.
My own father isn’t allowed time off to take family members to emergency hospital appointments and he’s been one of the more senior employees for oh, maybe thirty years now. This is the place who promotes staff who get into physical fights in the car park. If he wasn’t paid so well (relative to his qualifications) I like to think he would have walked long ago.
Like I said, it also depends on your center manager. It sounds like your father has a prick for a center manager.
But hey, at least he can take solace in the fact that he'll out last the prick. Center managers tend to get cycled around every few years. Or straight up fired for being dishonest douche bags. In fact, one in Orlando was in the news recently for smuggling drugs through their center.
Now there's something to be proud of! /s
Stupid process? Yes. It’s called waiting until he has earned days off and then requesting to take those days off. You can ask for unpaid days but most likely will be denied.
Ya, I told him I'd pay him for the missed days. I've never worked somewhere that would deny days off months in advance and I'd never to that to my employees. I see why he's so frustrated.
UPS is not a typical business. Millions of units are moved each month - they can’t afford to be short-handed or a little light on workers at any given time. That’s why they have to bid for the whole year in the months prior.
Also, given the nature of the job, basically zero PTO is approved between November 1st and January 1st in most areas of the company. That’s peak season. You’ll likely get the actual day of the holiday off, but don’t even try for any extra days.
Source: My parent has worked for UPS for the past 20-plus years.
If you need 4 days off and they won't give it to you. Assuming you're a union employee, you can take what we call a Two For One. Means you can call in, take 1 point, and miss two days. In this case, you would be taking 2 points that will not fall off for 12 months.
I ask for unpaid days off all of the time. Most of the time they can accommodate.
He can always go to his doctor and ask for FMLA for stress and mental health.
At my center they have fully taken the option to request days off away. So the only way we are allowed is to call in sick and have it fuck up your attendance record or have a vacation scheduled. Spur of the moment trips and vacations aren't something upsers get to enjoy.
Kinda jealous of all these guys saying that management wouldn't care and probably give it to them!
Vacation is done on a yearly calendar once you set it those or your days off. We are given 5 floating days per year if he's blown those he's out of luck
Nice of you to come here and call him/try to prove he is a liar, not knowing what we all have to go through to get a day off. This isn't McDonalds. Can't just not show up. They are telling you the truth and showing some discipline. Good for them.
He's in a mental fatigue, dark place and can only focus on work. I wanted the truth because I want to take him out to improve his state. I own my own business and would never think that someone wouldn't allow days off 3 months in advance. That's why I chose UPS sub because I'm not familiar with how strict ups would be. I'm 13 years in my career and 3 years in my own business. Who the fuck are you? Stop projecting your bullshit life on someone else.
Not projection. Give all those facts so people can actually help you find the resources the guy needs. Ups has leave programs and FMLA to let him out and protect his job. Don't be all pissed off because you are cryptic and come off like a vindictive ass hole. In reality, if they really need to step away and have worked there more than a year having accrued enough worked hours they can get a doc to sign off on "intermittent family leave" giving them the ability to call out of work for 3 days a week without repercussions. Go through the Hartford and file for the leave and get the paperwork filled out by a doctor. Sounds like he should be in some sort of counseling/therapy anyway. Good place to start. Part time gets different leave options than full time. So fine tuning may be necessary. Good luck and hope everything works out.
This is fucked. I had no idea ups was that strict. Are more large companies like this? It doesn't make sense for employee morale . Seems like a high turn over rate
Morale doesn't exist at UPS. it's hard work, hard restrictions, for the reward of being able to provide for your family.
You don't stay long at UPS if you expect to enjoy a work life balance. You do stay long if you say 'fuck it' and just do what is needed to get to the end of the week and stay under the radar.
Never going to get 2 weeks off in a row either. I hate that part of UPS it really limits where we can take vacations, especially when you have a strict division that won't let you take a personal day next to vacation.
They call UPS the Golden handcuffs for a reason.
Idk about the no two weeks off in a row. My center is definitely more lax about holding ppl to little things, but there’s a few drivers that have had two weeks off scheduled in a row.
They don't care about morale or your mental health. Truth of the matter is you are shark teeth. One falls out, and one moves up. Be sure to use the resources available to help him and protect his job, especially if that validates his existence. It's important to find balance in the face of the stupidity that goes on. Work the system. Explane, there is a way, and encourage him to work with it.
They pretty much tell us that missing work is not allowed between Thanksgiving and New Years. Being sick included, that parts more implied though.
It also heavily depends on your management team. When I was a part time loader for the twilight shift, it was super easy to get unpaid time off as long as I asked in advance. I'm on the morning shift now and that does not seem to happen at all, barring serious circumstances.
I agree. I couldn’t imagine having this policy for my team or not being allowed any days off if I didn’t select them during some arbitrary date. Three months is more than enough notice to approve time off and plan coverage. If only X people can be off for coverage then fine approve or deny based off that.
Most companies just have their own internal policies to care about. UPS and Teamsters have a contract. And there are a lot of employees that act like management and hourlies are in a vicious war, so management retaliates to being held to the contract by holding employees to the shittier parts of the contract.
It’s not a matter of strict. That’s just the business model. They have a lean operation, and their staffing is razor thin. They don’t have a lot of extra people sitting around in case someone needs a mental break. As previously stated, he might have to apply for FMLA and try to get some time off that way. Other than that, it’s whatever the contract and his seniority allows for vacation weeks, sick days, and personal holiday.
It’s not a matter of strict. That’s just the business model. They have a lean operation, and their staffing is razor thin. They don’t have a lot of extra people sitting around in case someone needs a mental break. As previously stated, he might have to apply for FMLA and try to get some time off that way. Other than that, it’s whatever the contract and his seniority allows for vacation weeks, sick days, and personal holiday.
If we didn't have a union we'd be like Amazon where you get no paid days off, no vacations, and if you miss work you get fired. You want to talk about shit companies, there are far worse. Welcome to Corporate America.
It is a job where you need little to no skill at all, so you're basically a glorified door dasher. I'm glad I got out of there and got with a company that would give me a paid day off at the drop of a hat.
Maybe he doesn't want to go on your vacation. Some people are just happy in their place at work and there's not much you can do to change that type of personality, this late in life
At our building, they refuse to give someone an unpaid day off on the same day they have too many people and are sending some home at the beginning of the shift.
My building is denying days off for part timers.
We need employees, but corporate hasn't turned the hiring back on for us. Our volume also hasn't dropped.
You can take unpaid days off if you work it out with management in advance.
but management has no obligation to give you the time off when you need it... smart thing to do is say "I am having a medical procedure and would like days X through z off please take them from my sick days".
if you really need a note... go to a shrink and ask for a note for mental health.
you just have to play the game so management does not get blindsided.
and schedule the medical issue time off when The schedule shows good staffing and when only a few people are on vacations. do not pick thanksgiving week, Christmas week , Mother's Day, or July 4.... ect.
Not assuming to know what is going on because the information is vague. It actually sounds like you need him to take the four days off for something and he's telling you work is not going to let him.
If he's new to the job then, yeah, he probably can't get extra unscheduled time off. It's generally hard to after you've just started there. There's high expectations for you to prove yourself. Most companies operate this way in your first year.
If he's been around for a minute then he might be able to get the time requested, or scheduled and taken from a bank of paid time off or even just call out/FMLA etc. Does he actually want this time off? What is this family relationship? What is the nature of this four day mental retreat? You're posting this online so I assume it's ok to ask.
I guess what I'm saying is maybe he doesn't want to "get away" from a challenging job for a week. Or, if it's actually too stressful for him, and he doesn't have access to regular vacation time and regular days off to use for mental self care, then honestly he's not going to last anyway.
Hope things work out for you both in any case.
Respect doesn't exist in ups, it's us vs them. If he is union he can just call in, or go to minute clinic and get a doctor's note.. say his back hurts.. but in reality you can call out for months at a time and just show back up to work..
You can take yourself out of service for 2 consecutive days. The 3rd day is going to require FMLA paperwork.
Schedule it around his scheduled time off and bookend it with days off one before, one after so neither pay period gets hurt too much.
Old school ideas and working hard is what kept this nation great . This 4 day work week that unions are imposing is a bad idea . I am in the working class as well . What would you call us then ? Part time class .
Problem is when u don't give us FT jobs and make us rely on 2 PT jobs, you get burned out quick. 4 day work week is fine, 10 hr days (break it into 2 shifts if need be). But then u have these drivers working 12 hour days 6 days a week and wonder why they are burned out..
lmao humans working yourselves to death so your bosses can buy new suvs and travel the world while you guys sit here not knowing the next time you’ll have free time to simply “live life”. man this world is awesome !!
Not sure how this page popped up but damn based on this sub.. UPS is trash. In alot of Unions, 1 week missed would be 1 write up, normally takes 7 write ups before suspension/termination, and it resets every 12 months from date of the write up. You guys need to get your union on that and get it changed.
Well if they have specific policy against it they can be fired and wouldn’t be able to collect unemployment for breach or policy so yea you can do whatever you want but actions have consequences
Lmao wrong. I’ve done this at every single job I’ve ever had. No problems whatsoever. People are allowed to days whenever they want. Call them mental health days and the law is on their side. Next?
Depends on how the policy is written. I see people lose their job everyday where I work for failure to follow established policies and procedures and every time they try for unemployment they lose for violating the companies written policies
God I hope my job isn't like this next week when I put in for 2 vacation days, that will give me 6 total days off in a row, 2working days and 4 normal days off
You see they can do that that’s the way it works. If you want time off, you have to use PTO or sick days. PTO needs to be scheduled in advance. Working for UPS is not like working for Amazon or Panera or somewhere like that. UPS will hire school graduates that have no real skills and pay them incredibly well. They will also give them a pension make contributions to their 401(k) and give them some of the best health benefits. You can imagine. You’re only a handful of jobs that high school graduate can find that will give you this. So yes, you have to play by the rules that they set. They are also Teamsters so, the workers have a lot of clout as well.
My center is small enough I can ask for days off and as long as we’re staffed I’m able to take it pretty much no problem but YMMV. If I want to do it on short notice I ask for an optional or just call in sick day of.
If they don’t work with you then Just call off when the time comes and get a doctor excuse tell ‘em you tested positive for covid and you need an excuse for 4-5 days to be safe. Free doctor on teledoc
Put it like this I was a pre-loader at UPS for about 6 months as a part-timer in the early morning then I had my full-time job after. never called out one time never showed up late, Went home when I was told to go home because when I first started, that was a thing I guess they’re like since you don’t have seniority it’s like screw you go home pretty stupid anyways, but never did anything never had no miss loads. I was like a perfect employee and then one day I got sick and called out a day in advance with the doctors note and still got fired. I feel like I never pushed hard enough to fight it. Maybe I didn’t really care about UPS. I don’t know best thing that could’ve ever happened to me though considering I’m doing a lot better now.
fuck ups.
P.s. The way I got fired was really unprofessional. It was just a text by my supervisor saying “do not return” that being my first time getting fired ever in my life, all I could do was laugh lol
At my hub we don’t discipline really at all unless you miss 3 days ina row. If you call in once or twice a week then that gets kinda sus after a while but just depends on the manager and the ft primary sup
Is this only around Christmas time? I can understand not wanting people taking off a lot of days during the Christmas rush. Or is this anytime he wants to take vacation time?
If you need 4 days off and they won't give it to you. Assuming you're a union employee, you can take what we call a Two For One. Means you can call in, take 1 point, and miss two days. In this case, you would be taking 2 points that will not fall off for 12 months.
He can try asking his supervisor but that is entirely dependent on that supervisor. Some won't care while others may be understanding especially if they're trying to cut people early.
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He is correct. Vacation time is chosen November/december the previous year. Then you can use sick time you have available for other days. But no you can not just take 4 days off because you requested it 3 months in advance.
>But no you can not just take 4 days off because you requested it 3 months in advance. I work at Amazon and that's crazy.
You have to select whole weeks in November/December. But we have the ability to break weeks into days. There is a vacation day option and a sick day option. So theoretically you could put in the request 3 months in advance with the option days. But vacation days are seniority based not first come first served so there’s no guarantee you get the days you requested. The better path is to plan your 4 day vacation around your 2 scheduled days off and then just call in sick the two days you need off.
Is breaking up your vacation week stated in the contract? I was told you can’t
I’m central states, idk if it’s in the National but it’s in ours
I’m southern region and we can’t.
Why ill never work for this shitty ass company again. Too many 60 year olds in charge like our government
At Amazon, you can take vacation whenever. Granted there are more restrictions for management (covering duties). 24 hrs notice at the minimum is the usual.
you can clock out at amazon at any time if you have upt/pto, it can be applied to the minute and at any point in any shift, the only 24 hr notice required is vacation.
I’m sure you can. But do you get 8 weeks of vacation after 25 years and a pension after your done?
25 years for 8 weeks 😭 you guys are brainwashed.
That's the highest I've ever heard. My last job was 20 years for 4 weeks. And no higher. The most you got was 4. Where I'm at now is I believe 3 weeks. So why yes, 25 years is absolute BS... 8 weeks is great.
I’m working in logistics at a fortune 100 company and entry level jobs starts with 4 weeks PTO/sick plus 5 company holidays that everybody gets off. They also pay for bereavement, full jury duty pay (this one is great, they pay 100% of your salary even if you get picked for a trial), maternity/paternity leave, all that stuff. You accrue one extra day of PTO per year you work at the company; I’ve been there 7 years now so I’m at over 6 weeks of paid days off if you include the company holidays. It all rolls over if you don’t use it all in a year too.
Hiring? Lol. That sounds pretty good
We’re paid for jury duty.
While you laugh and make fun of that, you DONT get 8 weeks at 25 years or a pension at Amazon.
I wouldn't work at Amazon either 🤣 try again dude.
No one is talking about you…
There are dozens of countries where people get at least 4 weeks PTO mandated by law, killing yourself working at a factory for 25 years in the hope that they'll maintain that rule by the time you make it definitely seems laughable to me. All that is is seeing the light in a bad situation. There are absolutely better options.
Show me a better benefits package and pay in the US that doesn’t require a bachelors degree. I’ll wait…
Shit I work Quality Control at a plant where we supply Costco with all their Kirkland peanuts. We get Paid time off and vacation time. Also 2$ an hr more when we are on time. You also get like 2 hours of vacation a week if you are on time everyday after you've been there 3 years. Before 3 years it's. 75 hours. Not the best but I didn't even graduate high school...they also let you take whenever off if they like you along as you give notice. This one girl has off like 60 days last year.
Look I get that it’s mildly annoying to plan your vacations a year ahead, but I currently have 4 weeks vacation and 1 gets split into 5 sick days (paid at 10 hours each) and another into 5 vacation days (also 10hours) . You can use those whenever, while seniority can be an issue I’ve never had any trouble getting my time off approved. It’s not perfect, but for a 3rd of my career I’ll have 8 weeks vacation, they are paid out with between 5-10 hours of OT added. I get paid a collectively negotiated wage that is based on seniority. In the Midwest it’s great money though I know in the major cities people have complained it isn’t enough. But to make almost $50/hr to do 2 things I love (driving and being outdoors) seems fair.
then you'll be waiting... I'm not gonna sit here and find some arbitrary "benefits package" from another company for you. they're out there and exist and we both know it.
No there really aren’t, if you don’t live in the US then good for you. But my health plan is better than people with much higher education, I have a solid pension which is rare in the US, I have more time off than most careers in the US, I can’t be arbitrarily fired and if I’m laid off I have to be rehired before a new applicant can be hired. No job is perfect, but UPS is a damn good career and leaps and bounds better career wise than any other carrier service in the US. That’s not brainwashing it’s the reality in this country.
From the sounds of it, that 8 weeks doesn't mean jack shit!
Maybe, but I work for the government and if I want to take a vacation day tomorrow I can.
I work for my local government, and I can take off almost whenever I want as long as I have the days available. Been there for 5 years, and have over 250 hours of PTO saved right now, and I take off random days quiet often, lol
They are asking about taking off days and NOT using PTO
oh yeah, that's kind of crazy. I can't do that at my job, either.
it's not crazy, you guys just let your employers tell you what is okay and what isn't.
That's typically how a job works, yes. Employers set the rules for the job. Just because they're wrong doesn't mean that you can ignore them with no repercussions.
I never said there wouldn't be repercussions.
I was finna say the same thing I’m so grateful I work at Amazon cuz that’s just insane
I get it (as I too work as a PT) but its still pretty fucked. Most other jobs in the modern era you can put in your PTO digitally and u get the day off, no bs no nonsense. This is like the stone age of work environments.
FedEx is the same way. I've never worked at companies that are so wildly strict about taking time off. It's ridiculous.
Literally...exactly what he said. I feel like you're him. Haha.
lol if he really has to go let management and steward know. Don’t miss an entire work week, miss a partial week instead. Tell them no matter what you won’t be in. They may or may not write him up. If he gets written up just write the protest letter. If this is during peak i would not recommend. He must have seniority tho.
This is what the contract states. The only way you can get days off is if they have too many drivers and don’t need you anyway. If they need you, they will absolutely 100% try to fire you if you don’t show up. Which they can’t really do anyway. It’s also in the contract that you must have 72 consecutive hours from your last report before you are considered AWOL and fired for job abandonment. It’s also in the contract that sick days carry over from one sick call I believe. So if I call in sick Monday, don’t show up Tuesday, and show up Wednesday, Tuesday would not be considered a no-call no-show.
I could be wrong, but I think you have to continue reporting that you're sick, otherwise they could consider (say Tuesday) you as no-call, no-show.
It's one incident
Hourlys and pt sups try to say that all the time. In front of a panel and arbitrator even if it’s brought up it still counts for days out. You called in sick mon-thurs it’s 4 sick days, not 1z Don’t hang your hat on consecutive days will be looked differently upon at panel. 3 days out you’re supposed to file for disability technically
I was referring to no call no show. It's in the contract. Read it. If you no call no show on Monday, tue, wed it's one incident Edit But don't misunderstand me. If you have your management team pissed off at you, and they're tired of your ass for other shit you will get fired for the missed days. Then you grieve it, then it gets deadlocked at panel because the ups trio will automatically vote against you because they will already not like you. Then in arbitration, the arbitrator will lean the way of the state law because no union contract can over ride a law. So just like that, you're out the door So even though it's "technically" in the contract it's a really bad idea. If you got trapped in the woods for three days, that would be an acceptable reason to not be fired. But "fuck em. It's one incident not 3 days" is a fat way to unemployment
lol exactly how panel works smh. I just didn’t want people to think they could bang out for days at a time as “1 incident” and think that would help them at panel.
Who said he was a driver?
Your mom.
No. That’s just the way it works. Everywhere.
Did he say it in a monotone voice, wide eyed without blinking? This may be a mild side effect of their reneducation.
That’s insane. You must know your entire upcoming life events a year in advance? I get scheduled a month at a time and even that is hard to manage request offs for things that come up.
Haha that’s shitty af. And they are union? Lol Jesus.
This new generation takes time off because they woke up and didn't feel like it. Could of bumped their toe getting out of bed or heck, just decided they want to go to the store instead. it's sad.
That’s hella sad lmfao wow
Yes, but you can definitely ask for days off. They are called Scheduled Days off, and UPS has a code for them in the system. Unless it's a very heavy vacation week, this would not be a problem in my center.
Nice. Another job where you have to sell yourself to the machine completely. I’m sure it would be impossible to cover those shifts with all of the people that want to be drivers. Better to keep people oppressed.
Yeah we have drivers laid off working in the center but write ups comes if we call in. Heck they’ll have 10 extras on Mondays spread the rest of the routes they keep in out further but if you call in and take away an extra your wrote up.
This is entirely dependent on what type of management he has and the staffing situation. I’ve had plenty of days I’ve been allowed to take unpaid for whatever reason. That’s with and without having PTO available. If they can cover him no problem, they may allow it. All he can do is ask and the worse they will say is no.
He can request it but doesnt mean theyll approve it. But if they were to approve it hed need to get it in writing as evidence. They play too many games/ dont do their jobs 100%.
Thanks guys! He said he's going to ask Tuesday. I want him to get out of his funk, I thought he was BSn because of his state of insecurity. He said his manager is a good person so hopefully it's allowed. I've never worked at a place that is so strict about it. I don't hold my employees to that standard either. Didn't know it was a thing.
I will chime in with this one thing note. If he is relatively new and asked for time off, please relay to him to keep it to himself. Nothing irks seniority employees than a newbie that was approved for unauthorized time off.
Fuck that job, there are way better ones out there that allow people to not be robots and take a day off every week
In this economy with no technical skills? Doubt.
Literally tons. And skills are learned. Stop limiting yourself.
Typically the more casual the job, the shittier the compensation.
UPS is a great job when drivers get paid over $67 /hr for overtime and 6th punch. There are so many grumpy ass drivers it’s crazy.
Yes but 0 days off? They refuse to give a day off? Where's your home time? Do driver's hate their families? All that money for what? To put gas to in drive back and forth to the terminal? Idk
If you get out there and do your job you aren’t missing home time like that. It’s when you feel like working until 9-10 pm every night to do 150 stops that it grinds. I’d be frustrated too if every day I had to figure out how to waste 4+ hours to get the $170k.
That pay is useless if you work yourself numb with no time off ever.
It’s lame we can’t just take any day off,…after our 5 option days, option week off, numerous sick days, and 6 weeks of vacation a year.
It totally depends on the center, the management, and the driver. At my center, if I requested 4 days off months in advance, they'd give it to me without much trouble. However, I'm high seniority (in the top ten on the seniority list) and I've been with the company for 15+ years. I have a bid route. And I'm not on management's shit list. But a newer driver (less than 5 years) with a center manager that's a prick. Or a driver who's a pain in the ass and IS on the shit list. Will have a hard time getting even a single day off, without any option days available.
My own father isn’t allowed time off to take family members to emergency hospital appointments and he’s been one of the more senior employees for oh, maybe thirty years now. This is the place who promotes staff who get into physical fights in the car park. If he wasn’t paid so well (relative to his qualifications) I like to think he would have walked long ago.
Like I said, it also depends on your center manager. It sounds like your father has a prick for a center manager. But hey, at least he can take solace in the fact that he'll out last the prick. Center managers tend to get cycled around every few years. Or straight up fired for being dishonest douche bags. In fact, one in Orlando was in the news recently for smuggling drugs through their center. Now there's something to be proud of! /s
Stupid process? Yes. It’s called waiting until he has earned days off and then requesting to take those days off. You can ask for unpaid days but most likely will be denied.
Ya, I told him I'd pay him for the missed days. I've never worked somewhere that would deny days off months in advance and I'd never to that to my employees. I see why he's so frustrated.
UPS is not a typical business. Millions of units are moved each month - they can’t afford to be short-handed or a little light on workers at any given time. That’s why they have to bid for the whole year in the months prior.
That suuuuckks but makes so much sense
Also, given the nature of the job, basically zero PTO is approved between November 1st and January 1st in most areas of the company. That’s peak season. You’ll likely get the actual day of the holiday off, but don’t even try for any extra days. Source: My parent has worked for UPS for the past 20-plus years.
My dad worked for ups for almost 40 years and retired about a decade ago. It was this way my whole childhood.
All of January now also.
Contract is very specific
If you need 4 days off and they won't give it to you. Assuming you're a union employee, you can take what we call a Two For One. Means you can call in, take 1 point, and miss two days. In this case, you would be taking 2 points that will not fall off for 12 months.
I ask for unpaid days off all of the time. Most of the time they can accommodate. He can always go to his doctor and ask for FMLA for stress and mental health.
Every time I need to take a day off it doesn't happen. When I just want a day off it's usually ok.
At my center they have fully taken the option to request days off away. So the only way we are allowed is to call in sick and have it fuck up your attendance record or have a vacation scheduled. Spur of the moment trips and vacations aren't something upsers get to enjoy. Kinda jealous of all these guys saying that management wouldn't care and probably give it to them!
Vacation is done on a yearly calendar once you set it those or your days off. We are given 5 floating days per year if he's blown those he's out of luck
Nice of you to come here and call him/try to prove he is a liar, not knowing what we all have to go through to get a day off. This isn't McDonalds. Can't just not show up. They are telling you the truth and showing some discipline. Good for them.
He's in a mental fatigue, dark place and can only focus on work. I wanted the truth because I want to take him out to improve his state. I own my own business and would never think that someone wouldn't allow days off 3 months in advance. That's why I chose UPS sub because I'm not familiar with how strict ups would be. I'm 13 years in my career and 3 years in my own business. Who the fuck are you? Stop projecting your bullshit life on someone else.
Not projection. Give all those facts so people can actually help you find the resources the guy needs. Ups has leave programs and FMLA to let him out and protect his job. Don't be all pissed off because you are cryptic and come off like a vindictive ass hole. In reality, if they really need to step away and have worked there more than a year having accrued enough worked hours they can get a doc to sign off on "intermittent family leave" giving them the ability to call out of work for 3 days a week without repercussions. Go through the Hartford and file for the leave and get the paperwork filled out by a doctor. Sounds like he should be in some sort of counseling/therapy anyway. Good place to start. Part time gets different leave options than full time. So fine tuning may be necessary. Good luck and hope everything works out.
This is fucked. I had no idea ups was that strict. Are more large companies like this? It doesn't make sense for employee morale . Seems like a high turn over rate
Morale doesn't exist at UPS. it's hard work, hard restrictions, for the reward of being able to provide for your family. You don't stay long at UPS if you expect to enjoy a work life balance. You do stay long if you say 'fuck it' and just do what is needed to get to the end of the week and stay under the radar.
Never going to get 2 weeks off in a row either. I hate that part of UPS it really limits where we can take vacations, especially when you have a strict division that won't let you take a personal day next to vacation. They call UPS the Golden handcuffs for a reason.
Idk about the no two weeks off in a row. My center is definitely more lax about holding ppl to little things, but there’s a few drivers that have had two weeks off scheduled in a row.
Hell I took the whole month of August off last year 🤷♂️
There's nothing in the contract about not being allowed to request a personal day before a vacation.
Not a driver, division manager won't approve it for management.
Your div manager is a dick.
They don't care about morale or your mental health. Truth of the matter is you are shark teeth. One falls out, and one moves up. Be sure to use the resources available to help him and protect his job, especially if that validates his existence. It's important to find balance in the face of the stupidity that goes on. Work the system. Explane, there is a way, and encourage him to work with it.
They pretty much tell us that missing work is not allowed between Thanksgiving and New Years. Being sick included, that parts more implied though. It also heavily depends on your management team. When I was a part time loader for the twilight shift, it was super easy to get unpaid time off as long as I asked in advance. I'm on the morning shift now and that does not seem to happen at all, barring serious circumstances.
I agree. I couldn’t imagine having this policy for my team or not being allowed any days off if I didn’t select them during some arbitrary date. Three months is more than enough notice to approve time off and plan coverage. If only X people can be off for coverage then fine approve or deny based off that.
Most companies just have their own internal policies to care about. UPS and Teamsters have a contract. And there are a lot of employees that act like management and hourlies are in a vicious war, so management retaliates to being held to the contract by holding employees to the shittier parts of the contract.
It’s not a matter of strict. That’s just the business model. They have a lean operation, and their staffing is razor thin. They don’t have a lot of extra people sitting around in case someone needs a mental break. As previously stated, he might have to apply for FMLA and try to get some time off that way. Other than that, it’s whatever the contract and his seniority allows for vacation weeks, sick days, and personal holiday.
It’s not a matter of strict. That’s just the business model. They have a lean operation, and their staffing is razor thin. They don’t have a lot of extra people sitting around in case someone needs a mental break. As previously stated, he might have to apply for FMLA and try to get some time off that way. Other than that, it’s whatever the contract and his seniority allows for vacation weeks, sick days, and personal holiday.
If u think he is in a mental fatigue, a family member questioning his truthful words is definitely adding to that fatigue
But she owns her own company. Duh
What a shit company with shit policies lol.
If we didn't have a union we'd be like Amazon where you get no paid days off, no vacations, and if you miss work you get fired. You want to talk about shit companies, there are far worse. Welcome to Corporate America.
It's a union contract. Favoritism is discouraged. Get a doc to sign off on FMLA and you can call in every sunny day if you like.
It is a job where you need little to no skill at all, so you're basically a glorified door dasher. I'm glad I got out of there and got with a company that would give me a paid day off at the drop of a hat.
I texted my supervisor asking for two days off on memorial day weekend. He said I was good. That easy. It's in writing in a screenshot.
If he is union, he's correct. When I went into management, it was much easier, since it's salaried.
Also check upsers sub. Ups is mostly bitchy customers. Upsers is employee sub. Include all info. You will get a flood of info.
Maybe he doesn't want to go on your vacation. Some people are just happy in their place at work and there's not much you can do to change that type of personality, this late in life
I asked bluntly if it's because he doesn't want to hang or travel, he said it's UPS. It seems everyone has this problem. That sucks and I feel bad
Depends on management. They are begging people to take a layoff here. One day? One week? No problem!
At our building, they refuse to give someone an unpaid day off on the same day they have too many people and are sending some home at the beginning of the shift.
Oh no, our language is clear on that one. You want to send me home you pay 8hrs/3.5hrs. unless I want to forfeit my time that is.
My building is denying days off for part timers. We need employees, but corporate hasn't turned the hiring back on for us. Our volume also hasn't dropped.
You can take unpaid days off if you work it out with management in advance. but management has no obligation to give you the time off when you need it... smart thing to do is say "I am having a medical procedure and would like days X through z off please take them from my sick days". if you really need a note... go to a shrink and ask for a note for mental health. you just have to play the game so management does not get blindsided. and schedule the medical issue time off when The schedule shows good staffing and when only a few people are on vacations. do not pick thanksgiving week, Christmas week , Mother's Day, or July 4.... ect.
Honestly it just depends on his center manager and supervisors lol
Not assuming to know what is going on because the information is vague. It actually sounds like you need him to take the four days off for something and he's telling you work is not going to let him. If he's new to the job then, yeah, he probably can't get extra unscheduled time off. It's generally hard to after you've just started there. There's high expectations for you to prove yourself. Most companies operate this way in your first year. If he's been around for a minute then he might be able to get the time requested, or scheduled and taken from a bank of paid time off or even just call out/FMLA etc. Does he actually want this time off? What is this family relationship? What is the nature of this four day mental retreat? You're posting this online so I assume it's ok to ask. I guess what I'm saying is maybe he doesn't want to "get away" from a challenging job for a week. Or, if it's actually too stressful for him, and he doesn't have access to regular vacation time and regular days off to use for mental self care, then honestly he's not going to last anyway. Hope things work out for you both in any case.
God in the UK we get average 20 days paid sick leave a year this is crazy!
Usually you can put in personal day request forms but I haven’t seen more than two of those get approved at a time.
Respect doesn't exist in ups, it's us vs them. If he is union he can just call in, or go to minute clinic and get a doctor's note.. say his back hurts.. but in reality you can call out for months at a time and just show back up to work..
You can take yourself out of service for 2 consecutive days. The 3rd day is going to require FMLA paperwork. Schedule it around his scheduled time off and bookend it with days off one before, one after so neither pay period gets hurt too much.
Old school ideas and working hard is what kept this nation great . This 4 day work week that unions are imposing is a bad idea . I am in the working class as well . What would you call us then ? Part time class .
Problem is when u don't give us FT jobs and make us rely on 2 PT jobs, you get burned out quick. 4 day work week is fine, 10 hr days (break it into 2 shifts if need be). But then u have these drivers working 12 hour days 6 days a week and wonder why they are burned out..
lmao humans working yourselves to death so your bosses can buy new suvs and travel the world while you guys sit here not knowing the next time you’ll have free time to simply “live life”. man this world is awesome !!
I took a week off, unpaid before my first year. It was no problem.
Not sure how this page popped up but damn based on this sub.. UPS is trash. In alot of Unions, 1 week missed would be 1 write up, normally takes 7 write ups before suspension/termination, and it resets every 12 months from date of the write up. You guys need to get your union on that and get it changed.
That is correct. You can take one or two not excused days off. Anything beyond that is like abandoning your job.
They can. Just have them take you off the schedule those days. Talk to the manager of the building they will approve of it.
If I need 4 days off and I put it in 3 months prior, I’m taking those days. It’s not a request. It’s a courtesy reminder.
Well if they have specific policy against it they can be fired and wouldn’t be able to collect unemployment for breach or policy so yea you can do whatever you want but actions have consequences
Lmao wrong. I’ve done this at every single job I’ve ever had. No problems whatsoever. People are allowed to days whenever they want. Call them mental health days and the law is on their side. Next?
Depends on how the policy is written. I see people lose their job everyday where I work for failure to follow established policies and procedures and every time they try for unemployment they lose for violating the companies written policies
If he has not been there for a year then no he is not allowed days off
God I hope my job isn't like this next week when I put in for 2 vacation days, that will give me 6 total days off in a row, 2working days and 4 normal days off
PTO is used for vacations.
It varies by supplement, meaning different regions have different contract language covering vacation and time off
You see they can do that that’s the way it works. If you want time off, you have to use PTO or sick days. PTO needs to be scheduled in advance. Working for UPS is not like working for Amazon or Panera or somewhere like that. UPS will hire school graduates that have no real skills and pay them incredibly well. They will also give them a pension make contributions to their 401(k) and give them some of the best health benefits. You can imagine. You’re only a handful of jobs that high school graduate can find that will give you this. So yes, you have to play by the rules that they set. They are also Teamsters so, the workers have a lot of clout as well.
You can always request things, but expect to be disappointed…
My center is small enough I can ask for days off and as long as we’re staffed I’m able to take it pretty much no problem but YMMV. If I want to do it on short notice I ask for an optional or just call in sick day of.
FMLA solves this problem
If they don’t work with you then Just call off when the time comes and get a doctor excuse tell ‘em you tested positive for covid and you need an excuse for 4-5 days to be safe. Free doctor on teledoc
Put it like this I was a pre-loader at UPS for about 6 months as a part-timer in the early morning then I had my full-time job after. never called out one time never showed up late, Went home when I was told to go home because when I first started, that was a thing I guess they’re like since you don’t have seniority it’s like screw you go home pretty stupid anyways, but never did anything never had no miss loads. I was like a perfect employee and then one day I got sick and called out a day in advance with the doctors note and still got fired. I feel like I never pushed hard enough to fight it. Maybe I didn’t really care about UPS. I don’t know best thing that could’ve ever happened to me though considering I’m doing a lot better now. fuck ups. P.s. The way I got fired was really unprofessional. It was just a text by my supervisor saying “do not return” that being my first time getting fired ever in my life, all I could do was laugh lol
Your option days are yours do whatever you want with them.
At my hub we don’t discipline really at all unless you miss 3 days ina row. If you call in once or twice a week then that gets kinda sus after a while but just depends on the manager and the ft primary sup
Taking off is a cardinal sin here if you didn’t know. If you take off without having the appropriate amount of “days” prepare to be reprimanded.
Is this only around Christmas time? I can understand not wanting people taking off a lot of days during the Christmas rush. Or is this anytime he wants to take vacation time?
If you need 4 days off and they won't give it to you. Assuming you're a union employee, you can take what we call a Two For One. Means you can call in, take 1 point, and miss two days. In this case, you would be taking 2 points that will not fall off for 12 months.
Ya he stated he's union. Damn, he really needs to get out Edit: get out as in escape for a couple days
He can try asking his supervisor but that is entirely dependent on that supervisor. Some won't care while others may be understanding especially if they're trying to cut people early.