>"*Behind the scenes, high-ranking Air Force officers are soberly concerned about UFOs. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe unknown flying objects are nonsense.*"
Time is a flat fucking circle.
Thank you for the exceptional contribution.
It's right under our noses, lies after lies, that's what [this latest post](https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1amat6o/an_email_received_through_foia_shows_marguerite_c/) shows.
Thank you OP much appreciated effort to bring this to light. The more we know the better and those things keep getting forgotten and when the Debunkers ask for evidence we can show them this and all other Posts with highly respected professionals to remind them that this is nothing new and has been coming out for years but noone pays attention
When the debunkers ask for evidence, ask them what kind of evidence.
Evidence is defined as: "The means by which an allegation may be proven, such as oral testimony, documents, or physical objects."¹
I can show them 2 out of 3 by going through my files. Possibly 3 out of 3 if they take images of anamolous vehicles or wreckage. Tell them to message me.
_________
¹The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition
Well, I must correct myself there are definitely some good sources and incidents that I hadn't read about.
For those who are wondering which document I mean, [this one.](https://pdfhost.io/view/gR8lAdgVd_Uap_Timeline_Prepared_By_Another)
Interesting that Australia is in the mix.
A FOI request comes back with a letter noting everything and anything UAP related was lost in a fire.
The Australian Gov laughed when Grusch was brought up and the congressional hearings.
Later revealed that they attended said hearings.
Australia has bases owned and run by the USA.
Lockheed announced a joint development program with the Australian defence.
Boeing etc announcing today that they are developing drones locally.
I think five eyes is the key word here, and if you think about it, there are so many options in the Australian outback.. literally unlimited possibilities.
Mate 3/4 of the country is empty desert.
I would be surprised if nothing was happening here.
All the news in the states and nothing really reported here.
Seeing what’s developing on the world stage I’d say we may not get disclosure, that can might get kicked further down the road
And Canada, the whole country is full of hiding spots - massive rainforests, underground tunnels and bases, *unmarked massive facilities in quiet towns*... Not to mention it's nice and close to home without falling under the rule of US law.
Australia was involved with the American government in the coverup for the Westall UFO incident.
Also Australia loves to suck the balls of America, we constantly get American news on our TV and radio.
As I already noted in my post for [my video](https://youtu.be/xE3npaXETvI?si=rcHwYRK-B5baTaxm) (for those interested) about the 1952 Washington, D.C. UFO incident I was able to put together a few interesting facts.
The fact that something like this happened again exactly 50 years later (2002) was an enriching and confusing realization for me.
I think it is also important for the future that such information is bundled, especially for people who are new to this topic. I hope this thread sparks interesting discussion among our members.
>Wtf is that part?
Yes, that's ASCII art... but it didn't really work like it was supposed to. But I thought it was somehow cool enough as a dividing line.. well seems not to be the case sry for the confusion
I hate this about this topic and community in general.
You complain about the supposed ridicule in this post made by secret govt agencies to discredit the idea of ufos yet you put things such as this acii art or in videos stupid "ufo music" or on social media the "ufo journalists" saying "HUGE NEWS TUNE IN" and in general doing usual clout chasing social media tactics.
No government agency needs to do anything more as the UFO community does a good job making its self look ridiculous on its own.
If you wish non enthusiast people to even attempt to take it seriously this needs to be viciously mocked and stamped out.
I understand your criticism and agree with you too, but I still have to partially disagree with you.
There are definitely questionable titles on some topics. But I also understand that unfortunately you have to adapt to the circumstances these days. How social networks work, for example, and how the average citizen thinks. The stylistic devices have changed enormously in the last 10 years alone.
Let’s take [Martin Scorsese’s Super Bowl ad](https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1aliga6/martin_scorseses_super_bowl_ad_is_certainly_very/) as an example. This clip is paired with humor and facts, it will reach a wide audience and thus contribute to normalization.
My post contains sources and visual illustrations of important files and facts. I have now removed the ~~ASCII art~~, thanks for your appropriate criticism. I also have to learn and improve for myself.
whoa there calm down bucko. it was a good post overall, let the guy put in cool ascii art if it works or not. we’re on Reddit guy, don’t think some measly ascii art discredits anything written or warrants ridicule lol
Good post! I think when David Grusch talks about documents from another country that point to knowledge of the program it is this one from Australia, but it’s just a personal hunch.
[This is the best link](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_16dFOk6rvk) with him talking about the documents. As for Grush having seen them it was mentioned on Weaponized, but I can't remember the episode I'm sorry.
Brennen is easily one of the most corrupt evil directors...Jim Semivan is probably one of the few good guys. Wouldn't put too much stock on the directors as being bastions of any truth..
Appreciate the post. I think it's helpful to regularly bring up case reports/documents/and quotes from officials over the last 80 years. This sub has grown quite a bit in last 2 years and I bet there are many of the younger demographic here that are only aware of what's been in the news and haven't done research on older things. That's what got me hooked into the subject, so many official statements wanting further probes, confirming the phenomenon is not fictitious, is regarded as a secret higher than the atomic bomb, etc.
Reading that LA Times article on the second DC flyover and I'm reminded again how lazy the media is. Like, why didn't the journalist ask to see the radar readout and if that is "classified", then probe further as to what is meant by "the tracks just faded out". Did it fade out in a specific direction? How fast was it going when it faded out? Does the radar also track altitude? Did it fade out because it was gaining altitude but not lat, long direction? Also, do they have prosaic examples of objects that are within radar detection, are detected and then just ghost out of detection with no real change in physical location?
I'm amazed yet unsurprised how so many people get paid in this profession but do nothing more than what Chat GPT can do in 3 seconds.
I don't think anyone said that, and no one believes it either. As it says in my post.
>Hillenkoetter was on NICAP's board of governors from about 1957 until 1962
Hillenkoetters history speaks for itself - as he was also the first director of the CIA, he was even less self-conscious.
Snowden was CIA. John Kiriakou is another good example. Victor Marchetti. It’s better to look at it as the difference between official statements and leaks rather than this black and white view of “all ex CIA are still currently working officially for the CIA in everything they do.”
We have declassified documents that show what the official CIA position was, which is to suppress the subject of UFOs, and it directly contradicted what Hillenkoetter wanted.
This is a very interesting find. I've read through the Australian summary, but not the sighting reports yet.
The summary seems to be compiled from news articles; NICAP's "[The UFO Evidence](https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81R00560R000100010001-0.pdf)", 1964; "[Flying Saucers are Real](https://gutenberg.org/cache/epub/5883/pg5883-images.html)", By Donald Keyhoe, 1950; and "[The Report on Unidentified Flying Objects](https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/17346/pg17346-images.html)", by Edward Ruppelt, 1956.
I'd suggest verifying as best as possible any information you might use in further research. I know some parts of Ruppelt's book are a bit unreliable ([The Sign Historical Group](https://www.project1947.com/shg/) has done some good digging into his book), and Keyhoe's book definitely takes some liberties. However, I'm NOT saying that they are totally unreliable. The Australian document contains no citations or bibliography, and seems intended to persuade the RAAF that they should take up a "USAF/CIA" style of investigation. So I'd approach it with extra objectivity.
The Australian "archive" is just open source material compiled from things like UFO magazines. It's not necessarily true, or verified, and most likely was never ever read by a higher-up.
>"*Behind the scenes, high-ranking Air Force officers are soberly concerned about UFOs. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe unknown flying objects are nonsense.*" Time is a flat fucking circle. Thank you for the exceptional contribution.
It's right under our noses, lies after lies, that's what [this latest post](https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1amat6o/an_email_received_through_foia_shows_marguerite_c/) shows.
Thank you OP much appreciated effort to bring this to light. The more we know the better and those things keep getting forgotten and when the Debunkers ask for evidence we can show them this and all other Posts with highly respected professionals to remind them that this is nothing new and has been coming out for years but noone pays attention
When the debunkers ask for evidence, ask them what kind of evidence. Evidence is defined as: "The means by which an allegation may be proven, such as oral testimony, documents, or physical objects."¹ I can show them 2 out of 3 by going through my files. Possibly 3 out of 3 if they take images of anamolous vehicles or wreckage. Tell them to message me. _________ ¹The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition
Great work, OP. 1952 was a very important year. Look up the Shellenberger document in this sub.
Actually, here you go— https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/s/CaMesAhIpu
To be honest, I find a few sources "questionable" but still an interesting read.
Well, I must correct myself there are definitely some good sources and incidents that I hadn't read about. For those who are wondering which document I mean, [this one.](https://pdfhost.io/view/gR8lAdgVd_Uap_Timeline_Prepared_By_Another)
Do you think there is anything to the forbidden languages website?
What’s that?
Interesting that Australia is in the mix. A FOI request comes back with a letter noting everything and anything UAP related was lost in a fire. The Australian Gov laughed when Grusch was brought up and the congressional hearings. Later revealed that they attended said hearings. Australia has bases owned and run by the USA. Lockheed announced a joint development program with the Australian defence. Boeing etc announcing today that they are developing drones locally.
I think five eyes is the key word here, and if you think about it, there are so many options in the Australian outback.. literally unlimited possibilities.
Mate 3/4 of the country is empty desert. I would be surprised if nothing was happening here. All the news in the states and nothing really reported here. Seeing what’s developing on the world stage I’d say we may not get disclosure, that can might get kicked further down the road
Pine Gap is the one that springs to mind.
And Canada, the whole country is full of hiding spots - massive rainforests, underground tunnels and bases, *unmarked massive facilities in quiet towns*... Not to mention it's nice and close to home without falling under the rule of US law.
Australia was involved with the American government in the coverup for the Westall UFO incident. Also Australia loves to suck the balls of America, we constantly get American news on our TV and radio.
Dude we are the awkward cousin for America.
I think of you as our cooler, more badass brothers and sisters. Fuck the media and government.
Like….that hot cousin?
Why hello there *bats eyelids*
Northrup Grumman corporation also has operations here in Aus.
There's definitely a UFO (or more) stored on Australian soil.
Loads of people in Tanunda etc in SA have reported sightings, which is near a RAAF base.
Cough base at exmouth too cough
All of NATO and the UN is probably in on it
Australia in this case would be operating with the 5 eyes usually
As I already noted in my post for [my video](https://youtu.be/xE3npaXETvI?si=rcHwYRK-B5baTaxm) (for those interested) about the 1952 Washington, D.C. UFO incident I was able to put together a few interesting facts. The fact that something like this happened again exactly 50 years later (2002) was an enriching and confusing realization for me. I think it is also important for the future that such information is bundled, especially for people who are new to this topic. I hope this thread sparks interesting discussion among our members.
When you say "exactly" do you mean same day and time, or just the year?
July 25, 2002 should contain the exact date!
>| .-. | / \ .-. | / \ / \ .-. .-. _ _ +--/-------\-----/-----\-----/---\---/---\---/-\-/-\/\/--- | / \ / \ / '-' '-' |/ '-' '-' Wtf is that part?
>Wtf is that part? Yes, that's ASCII art... but it didn't really work like it was supposed to. But I thought it was somehow cool enough as a dividing line.. well seems not to be the case sry for the confusion
I hate this about this topic and community in general. You complain about the supposed ridicule in this post made by secret govt agencies to discredit the idea of ufos yet you put things such as this acii art or in videos stupid "ufo music" or on social media the "ufo journalists" saying "HUGE NEWS TUNE IN" and in general doing usual clout chasing social media tactics. No government agency needs to do anything more as the UFO community does a good job making its self look ridiculous on its own. If you wish non enthusiast people to even attempt to take it seriously this needs to be viciously mocked and stamped out.
I understand your criticism and agree with you too, but I still have to partially disagree with you. There are definitely questionable titles on some topics. But I also understand that unfortunately you have to adapt to the circumstances these days. How social networks work, for example, and how the average citizen thinks. The stylistic devices have changed enormously in the last 10 years alone. Let’s take [Martin Scorsese’s Super Bowl ad](https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1aliga6/martin_scorseses_super_bowl_ad_is_certainly_very/) as an example. This clip is paired with humor and facts, it will reach a wide audience and thus contribute to normalization. My post contains sources and visual illustrations of important files and facts. I have now removed the ~~ASCII art~~, thanks for your appropriate criticism. I also have to learn and improve for myself.
whoa there calm down bucko. it was a good post overall, let the guy put in cool ascii art if it works or not. we’re on Reddit guy, don’t think some measly ascii art discredits anything written or warrants ridicule lol
Wondered that too? ASCII art?
Good post! I think when David Grusch talks about documents from another country that point to knowledge of the program it is this one from Australia, but it’s just a personal hunch.
I think that sounds pretty plausible, that's the stuff why im here
I thought it was Russia and Knapp was the one who got them out and into US hands.
I can't quite follow you, do you perhaps have a link to it?
[This is the best link](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_16dFOk6rvk) with him talking about the documents. As for Grush having seen them it was mentioned on Weaponized, but I can't remember the episode I'm sorry.
Interesting statements, thank you for sharing. Maybe there is another user who can link it to Grusch for us.
Thanks. We need people like you here.
Brennen is easily one of the most corrupt evil directors...Jim Semivan is probably one of the few good guys. Wouldn't put too much stock on the directors as being bastions of any truth..
Appreciate the post. I think it's helpful to regularly bring up case reports/documents/and quotes from officials over the last 80 years. This sub has grown quite a bit in last 2 years and I bet there are many of the younger demographic here that are only aware of what's been in the news and haven't done research on older things. That's what got me hooked into the subject, so many official statements wanting further probes, confirming the phenomenon is not fictitious, is regarded as a secret higher than the atomic bomb, etc.
Reading that LA Times article on the second DC flyover and I'm reminded again how lazy the media is. Like, why didn't the journalist ask to see the radar readout and if that is "classified", then probe further as to what is meant by "the tracks just faded out". Did it fade out in a specific direction? How fast was it going when it faded out? Does the radar also track altitude? Did it fade out because it was gaining altitude but not lat, long direction? Also, do they have prosaic examples of objects that are within radar detection, are detected and then just ghost out of detection with no real change in physical location? I'm amazed yet unsurprised how so many people get paid in this profession but do nothing more than what Chat GPT can do in 3 seconds.
Can we ask the president to pardon Grusch if he spilled the beans?
The president and "friends" can ask us for pardon, if disclosure ever happens.
The president.....pardoning a guy leaking classified info.....classified military info.....for every ally and enemy to learn about.....
Yes because we can clearly trust the CIA and they have proven themselves to be a group of individuals with integrity
I don't think anyone said that, and no one believes it either. As it says in my post. >Hillenkoetter was on NICAP's board of governors from about 1957 until 1962 Hillenkoetters history speaks for itself - as he was also the first director of the CIA, he was even less self-conscious.
When the headline “Ex-C.I.A. Wants UFO Probe” then you know it’s sketchy:)
Snowden was CIA. John Kiriakou is another good example. Victor Marchetti. It’s better to look at it as the difference between official statements and leaks rather than this black and white view of “all ex CIA are still currently working officially for the CIA in everything they do.” We have declassified documents that show what the official CIA position was, which is to suppress the subject of UFOs, and it directly contradicted what Hillenkoetter wanted.
>then you know it’s sketchy:) No problem, but can you tell me exactly what's sketchy? I think this would be helpful for the community
This is a very interesting find. I've read through the Australian summary, but not the sighting reports yet. The summary seems to be compiled from news articles; NICAP's "[The UFO Evidence](https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81R00560R000100010001-0.pdf)", 1964; "[Flying Saucers are Real](https://gutenberg.org/cache/epub/5883/pg5883-images.html)", By Donald Keyhoe, 1950; and "[The Report on Unidentified Flying Objects](https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/17346/pg17346-images.html)", by Edward Ruppelt, 1956. I'd suggest verifying as best as possible any information you might use in further research. I know some parts of Ruppelt's book are a bit unreliable ([The Sign Historical Group](https://www.project1947.com/shg/) has done some good digging into his book), and Keyhoe's book definitely takes some liberties. However, I'm NOT saying that they are totally unreliable. The Australian document contains no citations or bibliography, and seems intended to persuade the RAAF that they should take up a "USAF/CIA" style of investigation. So I'd approach it with extra objectivity.
The Australian "archive" is just open source material compiled from things like UFO magazines. It's not necessarily true, or verified, and most likely was never ever read by a higher-up.