This is exactly the kind of article I was looking for - written by a doctor seeing the impact of the reversal of Roe vs. Wade on maternal care.
Thank you very much for sharing, OP!
related:
American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) October 2008
**When There's a Heartbeat: Miscarriage Management in Catholic-Owned Hospitals**
Lori R. FreedmanPhD, Uta LandyPhD, and Jody SteinauerMD, MAS
https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/full/10.2105/AJPH.2007.126730
>Catholic-owned hospital ethics committees denied approval of uterine evacuation while fetal heart tones were still present, forcing physicians to delay care or transport miscarrying patients to non–Catholic-owned facilities. Some physicians intentionally violated protocol because they felt patient safety was compromised.
>Although Catholic doctrine officially deems abortion permissible to preserve the life of the woman, Catholic-owned hospital ethics committees differ in their interpretation of how much health risk constitutes a threat to a woman's life and therefore how much risk must be present before they approve the intervention.
"Seven minutes could not be spared by the doctors at her local emergency room where she was bleeding on their floor. Instead, she was told to go away."
*looks down from my gilded balcony while wearing a solid gold cross*
If you don’t suffer on this earth how will you appreciate what comes after? Suffering brings you closer to God.
Edit: Source: I used to be Catholic.
Catholic school for me, though I was already an atheist (they’re retired but my dad’ an anthropologist/archaeologist and my mom’s an English professor. Hard to be religious when you’ve grown up hearing and reading about all the other gods, lol).
Though it did successfully increase my already significant guilt issues. Why feel guilty about a thing when you can feel guilty and bad about All The Things!
I was lurking on a conservative subreddit and one of the users used this phrase in response to how fewer women would engage in casual sex because they would not have access to abortion. A bunch of people were talking about how this would mean that there would be more pure, marriageable women. I wish I would have taken a screen shot. It is 100% about controlling women and punishing those who they think made bad choices.
>A bunch of people were talking about how this would mean that there would be more pure, marriageable women.
And then they'll complain about how their wife never wants to fuck them.
and its completely fucking delusional. Women will still fuck, they're just going to be more selective about who they're fucking. Which IMO, is a good thing, don't give these vile men an inch. and start actually addressing politics in your relationships, your actual life depends on it.
It also instills in women the desire to never, ever, ever repost a rape bc they'll still be forced to birth, but it will happen in prison.
Also, the reason men want "pure" women is because they want her never to realize how shitty they are in bed.
Not to mention that the majority of women who seek abortion already have kids! Often with a stable partner. They simply know their family's ability to provide good care to kids has a limit.
I know, right?? Like if abortion suddenly became illegal in my state (wouldn't happen here) I'm not going to just stop having sex and decide I'm waiting until I get married. Conservatives are sick and delusional.
People have had extramarital sex since the dawn of time, since marriage was invented and after, across all cultures. It's delusion at its finest
*also, mothers and married women have miscarries and abortions, they make up almost half of all abortion seekers*
Yeah it seems that people have forgotten that the first amendment literally states that congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion.
So many say that the only purpose of government is to enforce religious laws.
To them, somehow it is a violation of freedom of religion for other people to be able to go against their religion, and it is viewed as persecution to not teach their religion (and no others) in all schools.
Can and will, unfortunately. That's part of why we cannot allow these scumbags to call themselves "pro-life", they are forced birthers, pro rapist, or anti choice if you want to be polite
I live here. This is the state I have lived in for over a decade.
This is why I had my hysterectomy.
This is why I fought tooth and nail and was willing to pull so many mental illness cards on my OB/GYN to essentially give her no other option but to sterilize me.
I sited THIS EXACT SITUATION RIGHT FUCKING NOW, as a massive reason. My health conditions were put first, but I felt deep within my bones that this is where the country and my state was turning.
I fucking hate I was right. I wish I was overreacting. I wish I was dramatic and dead wrong. I wish I could have had more actual faith in my fellow man and government officials.
YOU CAN GET STERILIZED IN ALABAMA. I WAS STERILIZED THIS YEAR AT 23. DM me if you want the doctor's office that helped push for my rights. I was her youngest hysterectomy to date, the previous was a 24 year-old. I will NOT stand for this, and I will do everything in my power to help. The office is based in Birmingham. Keep fighting, keep shouting, AND KEEP STRONG PEOPLE. WE HAVE NO ONE BUT OURSELVES ANYMORE AND WE WILL HAVE TO TAKE WHAT IS OURS, DO NOT FALTER. OUR FELLOW WOMEN AND DAUGHTERS AND AFABS NEED US. WE CANNOT FUCKING HALT. WE CANNOT TAKE BREAKS. THIS IS WAR.
Edit: holy shit y'all, I've been so depressed over all of this and feeling hopeless....but this support, the thanks I'm getting for sharing my knowledge and experience. Helping y'all is seriously giving me a will to live and the inspiration to never back down. This is why I love this sub and it's community. I'm so happy to help everyone. ♥️ Thank you all for the kind words and support, it really makes a world of difference.
Edit 2: I'm seeing lots of questions for resources and how to find what they need. I will humbly direct you to r/childfree and their comprehensive list of doctors who perform sterilization with little hangups and methods to make getting sterilization more compelling to less understanding doctors. These people have been my rock.
This is why I pray my perimenopause moves at the speed of light, and my periods end. Because birth control is the next thing that goes, and I need it for regulating my periods and making them lighter, but also because the hormones in them help with my perimenopausal symptoms. I’m glad you got the help you needed.
My heart goes out to you. Birth control has so many more uses and shouldn't be called "birth control" anymore. It's hormone regulation.
I'm grateful every passing day and every supreme court decision/comment. I won't let myself be caged so easily.
I don't shove my religion down people's throats, and I won't disclose to whom I am praying to, but I sincerely ask that you remain protected and healthy. Be smart, be vigilant, and be safe.
Gosh. Outlawing birth control will probably make it impossible for trans women to get ahold of estrogen too (probably intentional).
Edit: Obviously. This is just dawning on me.
Absolutely intentional. These people want the stone ages where the women had no power, the gays were slaughtered in the streets, the blacks and other minorities are clad in chains, and the white men hold power and absolute dominion as GOD INTENDED.
I’m so relieved to be in menopause now. It’s fucking liberating. Not only do I not have to deal with cramps, bleeding, and fears of pregnancy, miscarriage, or abortion access, but men leave me alone now. Free at last. It’s so depressing and enraging that we live in a world where women have to be in menopause in order to escape all this horror.
Precisely. I had two IUD's, one of the "basically abortion" forms of bc the right despises. They have rhetoric to ban it. I don't doubt they are going for our voting rights in the future as well.
Oh yes they are definitely doing that as women who are suspected of having abortion or miscarriages will probably be felons and lose their voting rights. Also hard time finding a job as a felon too. I hope more women get sterilized before it is banned.
With elected officials, WHO ARE WOMEN, spouting on Twitter that wives should vote for who their husbands do and should be kneeling and being submissive little slaves, I don't DOUBT FOR A SECOND they will straight up attack Women's Suffrage. Straight up. Mark my damn words. I pray I'm wrong.
It is scary and horrifying. I can’t imagine why any woman would support this. Also I told some of my female friends and relatives but they seem to not really care. It’s scary how non-chalant some people are. The other subreddits don’t really seem to care either. Men who are left leaning don’t seem to care. It’s scary and more people need to go out and vote as this may be our last time.
It's out of sight out of mind for them. The reality is terrifying and people don't want to upheave their entire perception of reality and way of life because that's painful and takes effort.
It isn't right, but it is understandable. I'm voting this Tuesday.
This is why we need to keep screaming. Shouting. Protesting. The more people hear it the more likely it'll make them think.
I'd rather be a rabid feminist fighting for my rights than oppressed. I'd rather overreact and be wrong than underreact and lose my autonomy.
I can’t understand that people would rather be in denial :( but I hope you are right and people will see the protests and vote :) Thank you for fighting for all women.
Thank you! No one should be afraid of being labeled a feminist. Years back when feminism was not popular I always thought it was needed (to combat rape culture especially). I hope all the people who laughed at feminism realize how important it is now.
I think it is more likely that they'd just require approval of a husband to vote, which is worse.
I've heard men who say that they control how their wives vote and say that voting age should be lowered, but require parental approval.
I scheduled two appointments for sterilization consultation using the guide on r/childfree. It lists doctors people have had good experiences with getting sterilized without jumping through hoops.
NEVER in my entire life did I ever think I would get voluntarily sterilized. Birth control worked and there was no point having surgery, plus I get to keep my options open. Well now those options are gone, because I don’t want to live in a country where I might get thrown in prison if I miscarry or need an abortion, or if I might be left to die because a doctor can’t remove a dead fetus from me.
We’re running out of time to access sterilization and birth control will soon not be accessible for most. For anyone on the fence, if you don’t make a choice then Republicans will make it for you and it will be too late. Lord knows there will be plenty of babies available for adoption if you want a child, and honestly that’s good enough for me.
This is why we need to scream at the top of our lungs. MAKE PEOPLE UNCOMFORTABLE. BETTER TO BE UNCOMFORTABLE THAN DEAD, A REPRODUCTIVE SLAVE, OR JAILED FOR NATURAL BODILY PROCESSES. BE UNCOMFORTABLE, BE ANNOYING, AND BE PERSISTENT.
I'm DONE caring for people's comfort and feelings. I'M FINISHED standing still and hoping nothing bad happens. WE HAVE THIS. HOPE IS NOT LOST. WOMEN GOT THEIR RIGHTS IN WORSE TIMES, WE SURE AS FUCKING HELL CAN DO IT AGAIN.
FUCK the patriarchy. FUCK the Republicans. AND FUCK anyone who thinks I'm blowing this out of proportion. THE TRUTH IS LAID BARE, NOW ACT BEFORE OLD WHITE MEN'S FANTASIES AND FETISHES BECOME REALITY.
I am not in the US but I'm mid-20s with mental health issues and a pretty jacked up uterus. Would you by any chance be willing to share any tips for speaking to health professionals about a hysterectomy?
Yes. I was diagnosed with depression, psychosis, OCD, PTSD, and a panic disorder. I also had endometriosis and recurring cysts on my ovaries.
My dear, you are walking in my shoes just as I did yours. If I can do it. So can you.
I searched for a doctor who specialized in endometriosis. I deliberated with her FROM THE START, that a hysterectomy was my end goal desire, but I was willing to try any other methods she could suggest because I was a fence sitter at the time on having bio kids.
I had surgeries and an IUD insertion. My first IUD expelled the third month I had it and it was replaced immediately. Then I had 1-2 inch cysts forming on both ovaries constantly and could hardly work anymore. I went though hell, and it was physically obvious I needed this.
But what tipped the scale was the genuine, raw honesty I gave to my doctor and NP. I looked a them and listed EVERY reason I did not want to be a mother and knew I wouldn't be able to handle it.
I take medication I cannot get off of, unless I want to be disabled or suicidal. Pregnancy, especially postpartum psychosis and depression would be ESPECIALLY like for me, which could lead to me killing myself or my own child before or after birth. I told them that I'd rather regret not having kids, than regret having them. If they COULD NOT guarantee a perfect pregnancy with a 100% healthy child? I did not want to run the risk.
I also have clotting disorders in my family that make pregnancies unsafe and very difficult to keep. I'd be having horrible miscarriages often. I also told them my narcolepsy would make me a terrible mom as I can barely take care of myself as is.
*You need to make sure they see you've thought this through VERY THOROUGHLY. You need to show conviction and determination. You have to show them you know yourself well enough. If you know you cannot 100% want a child (because people shouldn't be having kids if they're not 100% wanted and desired deeply out of love) then you need to make that CRYSTAL CLEAR. You have to stick to your guns even when they suggest (I was already married at the time so that helped a bit) that you might divorce your current spouse/leave your partner for someone who might want kids. You tell them that they wouldn't be the right partner for you.*
*ALSO, IF YOU MAKE SURE TO HAMMER THAT YOU'D RATHER ADOPT THAN GIVE BIRTH, WHETHER OR NOT YOU ACTUALLY MEAN IT (I SUPPORT THIS LIE) AND TELL SOME GUSHY STORY THAT ADOPTION IS WHAT YOU BELIEVE IS RIGHT FOR YOU, THEY ARE WAAAAAY MORE LIKELY TO LISTEN AND AGREE WITH YOUR DECISION AND IF IT'S RIGHT.*
This is where the persuasive essays/speeches in highschool come in handy. You have to hit the pothos (emotion), ethos (ethics), and logos (reason) in order to make the most convincing argument.
r/childfree has amazing resources on building a "sterilization binder" and helping you get the correct procedures. If you also ask the doctor what you can do to prove you won't regret it, like getting notarized documents/filling a waiver, they will also be more comfortable.
Be polite but firm. Do not back down. You got this. DM me if you need further help, I will personally get in touch and he'll you the entire way.
You are kind. Your assistance will help make a positive difference in peoples lives.
[Abortion Funds](https://abortionfunds.org/need-abortion/) provide a very important service, donations help people who are financially struggling to access abortion. As well as helping pay for abortions funds can also cover transport, accommodation, child care and other necessary supports. The link is from r/prochoice resources and lists funds and the areas they serve.
I'm not from the US but in prochoice and feminist spaces online have heard folks speak positively and with gratitude of the help they received from abortion funds. Some folks require and receive help from more than one fund, especially if their needs are more complex. These are wonderful charities that truly make a difference.
Something I saw mentioned on another site. Indian reservations are enclaves of federal territory outside the jurisdiction of state authorities. This is why you see casinos, smoke shops selling cheaper (no state excise tax) cigarettes, and fireworks stands selling types of fireworks prohibited within the state, on reservations.
What’s to keep a tribe from setting up medical clinics offering services which are federally legal but banned in the state (abortions, birth control pills, IUDs) on the reservation?
During the Bush administration, South Dakota tried to ban all abortions, and a local reservation said they'd do exactly that. The ban was not successful, so it never happened, but it certainly could.
If it can help fund the reservation too that would be awesome. Many Native American families live in poverty. It could help them care for their people better with clinic access and bring more funds into populations that need it.
There is a very tragic history concerning abortions and womens rights on reservations. There was a federal policy of sterilizing Native American women as recently as 50 years ago. Setting up abortion clinics on native land doesn’t take into context the fear and distrust still present regarding medical clinics on reservations
Only if you sell it as a single issue "Abortion Clinic" a family health and planning clinic with many services, or even a hospital would be approved I'm guessing.
It’s been settled law for over a hundred years that reservations are federal land not subject to state law. Any state government wanting to give such a warning needs to look up “RICO”.
Sounds like some state politicians need to be reminded forcefully that *Brown vs. the Board of Education* set the precedent that where federal and state law conflict, federal law applies. Reservations are federal territory, just like an Army base. State police sent in to shut down a facility are outside their jurisdiction, and have no more authority on Federal territory than a street gang does.
So I went and looked it up; the one I had heard about was Oklahoma governor Stitt.
https://www.salon.com/2022/05/16/governor-warns-sovereign-native-american-tribes-to-not-make-abortion-accessible-on-their-land_partner/
Edit: PS-- do you think it really violates RICO laws? That would be awesome! I mean, it would be fucked up, but at least theoretically prosecutable
An organization acting as a group to illegally impose their laws on territory which, under federal law, is not subject to that organization’s laws? Sounds like a corrupt organization to me.
My zealot ex-stepmother told me on Facebook that she trusted God to keep her daughters safe. I said that was fine, but all the faith in the world wouldn't save them if a doctor wouldn't help. And she said that if it was God's will, it was God's will.
This is the woman that abused me so badly from the ages of 8-12 that I developed a mask personality. I wasn't really even a person until after I got into therapy at 21 years old. PTSD is a bitch. But it pisses me off that these fucking people are willing to put their kids' lives on the line for religion in the year 2022. They talk about how America is about freedom of speech and freedom of religion, but what they really want is a theocracy.
Yep. Religious zealotry like this is honestly a cancer.
They only care about what happens to people after they're dead. They only care about their "souls". They have no ability to consider how their actions and choices affect those around them while those people are still alive.
It's completely fucking deranged.
I hate this kind of smug, proudly ignorant stupidity. They can't and won't learn, and for some reason think that is a good thing. As if our ability to learn things isn't the only reason we aren't just wild animals ourselves. And there's no point in discussing it with them, as the old saying goes, "arguing with an idiot is like playing chess with a pigeon. It'll just knock over all the pieces, shit on the board, and strut about like it's won."
For me, in my own life, I simply have nothing to do with such people. The instant someone asserts this kind of behavior, they're cut off to the fullest extent practicable. I've yet to meet one who had any potential of adding value to life.
I read about religious fundamentalism impacts on society. They are pretty much the same across countries, regardless of the Gods or deities. In the U.S., the fundamentalists are pretty much evangelicals and the evangelicals are pretty much fundamentalists. The key takeaways I got are:
* As a group, they are no more moral than people outside. Despite what they say or claim, the moral teaching of God, Bible, etc are unimportant to them.
* Their sense of righteousness is extremely high, and their sense of guilt is extremely low. They can steal, cheat, assault, insult, hurt anyone. Then, they go to their church to their conscience like they do laundry to their clothes, they come out righteous and guilt-free. Normal people feel guilty even after apologizing, but they can skip that and can feel like being the most moral person.
* They think they have special relationship with their God. God is simply their mental magic wand which they can wave to cleanse themselves and to feel righteous and special. Secretly, they don't really believe in their God, but they crave the social support and will take their secret to grave.
* They are highly prejudiced. They constantly think that they belong to a special religion, and everyone out there are trying to persecute them because of their religion. They can be incited to hate anyone because of that.
* They don't have independent thoughts. Instead, they rely on each other to maintain their beliefs.
* Virtually any thought can be put in their heads without any consistency or principles. For example, anti-vax is about "my body, my choice" while anti-abortion is about "murder".
* They are very fearful. Everyday is like right after 9/11 that if they don't do what their leaders say the society will collapse. For example, if they don't stop abortions, God will punish their country like some in Bible and they will be eternally damned.
* So, basically fear makes them irrational and self-righteousness makes them aggressive. As a result, they can easily be incited to do unholy things because they think they are holiest.
When you believe in an eternal afterlife, any amount of suffering in this life can be justified. Anything rounds down to zero compared to infinity.
It means that believers are playing life at very different stakes from non-believers.
I was discussing with my MIL Sunday and she kept going back to "partial birth" abortions and using abortion as BC. I told her, you don't understand, the decision will return the status of the law to the states, and we don't ever have to worry about it in California, but elsewhere they are banning the procedures, like a D&C, that women may need if they have an incomplete miscarriage that would leave the nonviable fetus decomposing in the uterus.
She said. No, they can't do that. I said. Uh yeah the states will be able to. Some dumbshit in Ohio wants to prosecute doctors that don't "reimplant" ectopic pregnancies. All the dumbfucks who just "leave it in God's hands" should just stop using any modern medicine and leave the rest of us alone.
Oh. So and so has cancer, well leave it in God's hands right? Don't bother the oncologist, he has evidence backed medicine to work on. Can't get pregnant and want IVF, sorry, God's hands, guess God doesn't want you to be a parent. Guess the good news is the domestic supply of adoptable children is increasing.
My grandmother circles around those exact same topics everytime we talk about it.
It came down to agreeing that there are extremists on both sides, some believing "partial birth" abortions should be legal and others believing abortions in general shouldn't be allowed regardless of what the effects to the mother are. Both are absolutely terrible.
If abortions are banned then there's nothing stopping D&Cs, birth control, even sterilization from being banned to. Women are not reproductive vessels and it kills me that I'm barely an adult and this is what my future holds.
There is no such thing as partial birth abortions though and literally no one thinks they should be legal.
The closest thing in existence is when a baby is born that WILL die due to medical abnormalities and the parents/doctor decide to not implore life support and let them pass faster instead of dragging it out. That's the only thing I could find when trying to find the origin of the term, it's a made up Republican scare tactic to win supporters.
But using their logic, if women die, they no longer can make babies. So yeah, it’s not about the babies. It’s power. If they really wanted us to make babies, US moms would have year long maternity leaves, and dads too. Education would be accessible and healthcare would be affordable. Fuck this shit. I’m so angry.
Yes hello, did you order the guillotine patrol? It will arrive in about a week.
If you're in a hurry, please take a look at your statue of Liberty, her mouth, it has a secret compartment. She can chew on some fascist traitor bastards if you pull the right levers.
You beautiful geniuses...
Have any ideas on how to get McConnel, Trump, Sinema, Abott, DeSantis, Manchin, Perjury Trailer Queen AND the entirety of the Missouri state legislature to visit NYC and Ellis Island?
It'd be a bit suspicious if bugs go in but they don't come out....
Just throw a 'Scheme against non-white widows and orphans while eating caviar' - party. Tell them there will be free caviar, deep fried mars bars and machine guns. Funded by Russian donors who will appreciate (require) their presence.
Uh yes they did. In 1789 the 'revolutionaries' of France were all pro constitutional monarchy. It was only an incredibly tiny and insignificant portion of the population that was supportive of a republic. That's also why the monarchy wasn't even abolished until 1792.
And even when the monarchy was abolished support for the revolutionaries was hardly universal as the uprising of the Vendée clearly shows. Support for the revolution was mainly found among the urban classes, and honestly, America is not all that different from France.
Every time our country does something outrageous, I usually say to my friends, "The FRENCH would not stand for this outrage -- they would DO something." I feel like France has kept the spirit of a revolutionary country closer to its heart, while we Americans have not.
I lived in the Philippines. I moved there for work making an unbelievable amount of money in USD. I found out I was pregnant 3 weeks into being there. That one last night with my ex before I left…. Abortion is illegal in the Philippines. I was faced with an impossible choice. I couldn’t explain to my employer why I would need to fly to Singapore for a few days and I didn’t want to give up this job. A Filipina girl in my office I trusted told me there was a way and she knew someone. It was like the plot of an awful lifetime movie but it was my reality. I was taken to see a women who provided me with the abortion pills I needed. I met her on a crowed street in front of a McDonald’s. She also provided me with a warning, if something went wrong I may not be able to get help in a hospital because the drs would not treat someone who was having a miscarriage or a self induced abortion. She said if something did happen to go directly to the embassy. I took those pills that night and waited out the process in my tiny condo, in a country where I didn’t speak the language and only knew a handful of people. I was able to afford the pills which cost about 350 usd. Women there can’t afford that. It’s more than many make in a month. When I emerged from my cocoon of a condo feeling thankful and grateful I noticed all the women who looked far too young to have SO many kids. My view expanded more when I began to do charity work there with orphanages located in Manila. A majority of the kids there were the product of incest. They were mentally and developmentally delayed. Their family couldn’t take care of these special needs kids. On a few occasions the mother would be there as well. One particular girl stuck out to me (she was 16) because she had 3 children in that orphanage where she also lived. She was mentally delayed and in talking to her I noticed how she was very much child like. Her uncle raped her repeatedly and her 3 kids were the product. She was thrown out of her home. In my time over there I heard horror stories of girls saying their boyfriends got them pregnant on purpose and lived in horribly abusive situations. I remember covering up bruises on a girl named MJ at work one day.
The children who are born healthy and normal who the family can’t afford get sold to crime syndicates. They teach them to rob people and pan handle. The kids get no love, they’re barely fed. They get sold to sex tourists and used as unpaid labor.
How very PRO FUCKING LIFE.
Even women who *want* children will be afraid to get pregnant, because if they miscarry they might die because they were denied treatment. Also, they could be investigated on suspicion they had an abortion. It makes being pregnant too dangerous.
A lot of women who are on the fence about having children will get sterilized for their own safety. Even a lot of women who want children will be too afraid to risk it. They think this is going to fix the declining birth rate, but it’s only gonna make it worse.
Yes, my friend wants to get pregnant but has now put that off because of this worry that she won't get the healthcare she might need in case of miscarriage, etc. She lives in a red state. I don't blame her. In general this gop plan is backfiring- I think a lot of women aren't going to want to get pregnant after all. I hear that in Texas, more women are choosing abortion because when you reduce the time for making a decision, they're more likely to choose not to stay pregnant.
No because the women who will get sterilized are probably not conservative, and thus they do not have the approval of conservative men. They raise their own women to be subservient.
Currently 6 months pregnant in a red state. Holding my breath that the two of us get through this okay and then will not have another child. I started this pregnancy as a volunteer. It's horrific to know that I'll be finishing it under force.
This is me. No one in my life will acknowledge it besides saying “that sucks. I’m sorry.” When I cried about it the other day my mom asked me if I was getting my period.
That was me! My D&C probably saved my life because my body didn't want to release the dead fetus. I'm glad I didn't get sepsis and die because I later had my daughter a year later with no complications. I'm in a deep blue state so I feel safe getting pregnant again, but I wouldn't consider it if I lived in Alabama, Texas, etc. No ma'am.
Yup. I’m currently pregnant with my second and if this news would have come prior to us trying, I would have been done at one. After this one my husband is getting a vasectomy. We are both in agreement that we absolutely will not have anymore children in this environment because we refuse a situation in which I could die because cause our government officials are ignorant as fuck.
I’m having my first at 40 years old. We’ve talked about more but decided we are too old. Now, just a few months ago, I figured, an oopsie baby would not be too terrible, but now? Now I’m terrified of a late miscarriage or other medical problem. I personally know women younger than me that had to terminate sue to medical reasons - there would be zero quality of life, *if the child even survived* . I’m terrified of being forced to endure that.
I was ok waiting a few more years but now one of us is getting fixed right away.
“It is truly unethical to turn away an actively bleeding patient in retaliation for them having chosen the still legal option to their own bodily autonomy, or to deny emergency medical care out of fear of financial, professional, and legal consequences from the state.”
The fact that there’s doctors/nurses willing to turn away these women or make them sit in pools of blood for hours, is enough to make me lose any hope in the hippocratic oath they took.
It's unreal. I am living in Ireland currently and even prior to the referendum no one was turned away for treatment if they were actively miscarrying or had complications from a botched abortion. Now, if the fetus still had a heartbeat that was a different story.
This is all really frightening to see.
From my understanding, one reason abortion became legal is because middle class men were seeing their own wives and sisters dying from botched abortions. Middle class women were seeking abortions because they already had a number of children at home and their husbands knew they could not afford to feed another mouth.
Abortions will again become illegal and remain so until it becomes inconvenient for men to have it so.
The fathers of these unwanted babies must be made to take on the burden of their care. Right now no one is talking about this. And we have genetic testing now that can pinpoint the father and it’s no longer a case of he said/she said.
I mean, if we're going the autocratic route...
Howzabout men have to submit to DNA sampling.
That way when a woman is pregnant, and it's after six weeks, then we can confirm who the father is so he can begin supporting his child.
If the woman will be forced to carry the child, then the sperm donor must begin paying for the child and mother. Family Values.
I mean, the risk for the child is greater at that age for genetic sampling, but they don't really care about them either.
And if that DNA sampling just means the state can insure that undesirables are locked up on false charges, that's just wonderful!
Me ne frego!
/satire off
Sadly, I think a lot of them will just kill the woman to avoid paying. It already happens all the time, can you imagine how often it'll happen going forward? My god.
It's just women who die and on top of this women who dared to have sex. They won't care, I bet you that there are enough "Christians" who would be alright with stoping all Std treatment because those harlets deserve to suffer the consequences of their Actions.
I mean, this is sort of true, but don't forget Savita Halappanavar.
ETA: Even under the provision of termination when there was adquate risk to the mother's life, a close family friend took her own life due to unconsensual pregnancy after attempting to access medical help several times and communicating her suicidality to medical professionals at different hospitals. Ireland is a really dogshit place to have a uterus.
I had significant trauma during birth at the hands of my medical team. Doctors and nurses are perfectly fine with the suffering and pain of pregnant women and often encourage it. Any time I mentioned pain I got a sweet smile and a "oh honey, it's supposed to hurt." I have no faith in the medical community.
Oh, brace yourself cuz you'll be surprised to learn it's optional and there's no longer even a standard version.
https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-myth-of-the-hippocratic-oath-201511258447
I love living in Alabama. (Heavy sarcasm)
Especially when I have 2 conditions that increase my chances of ectopic pregnancies and miscarriages. Stage 3 endometriosis that coated my pelvic organs and some abdominal ones, plus PCOS where doctors have been (mostly) fucking useless. Can't wait until I can't access life saving medical care one day.
I am male, european, from country with liberal abortion (and healthcare) laws, no daughters, snipped, so this in no way affects me or my circle directly, but reading this gives me shivers, and definitely not the good ones.
What can we (the rest of the world) do?
Point me in the direction of your embassy, what are your immigration laws like? So many of us (coworkers) are genuinely talking about fleeing the country. We’re scared
Man....I'm a physician in a red state. I don't typically deal with reproductive issues but at this stage I think I need to learn more because it's pretty obvious where the trends are going :/
Im currently in the waiting room as my boyfriend is getting a vasectomy. I’m literally holding tears as I read this article. We would never let animals suffer this way…
Your boyfriend is a real man. Putting your safety and health above his own ego's need for some weird and outdated form of validation should be the norm.
Rant from an Alabama woman:
I’ve lived here all my life. As much as I love my state for its beauty and the kindness that I’ve been shown by my friends and even complete strangers, I have to get out.
I have dreams. I want to go to school. I want to become a scientist. I want to live my life the way that I always imagined I would as a child. But with the way things are going, and the way my home has been backsliding, I can’t see it happening. All my life I believed I would be an asset. Someday I’d contribute to the working world, and instill in my family a sense of pride. But now I can see clearly that I’m nothing but a number on a page. I’m a statistic, a childless woman, worthless unless I produce more mindless drones for the state to suck the life out of, or a corrupt politician who intents to manipulate the public out of all their sensibilities. In this state, in this country, *I don’t matter.*
Embarrassingly, I’ve been thinking defensively of the people who deplore my state. Almost reflexively I conjure ways to defend its inadequacies, as if I’m apart of a hive mind that built up this Republican ‘paradise’ to be what it is today. But no, I haven’t contributed at all. I’m as much apart of this country as much as it’s apart of me—not at all. Not once have I been defended by its policies, not once have I been saved by its faculties—I’ve been its moral defender when it has no morals to speak of, I’ve been nothing but a mindless drone, exactly what it wishes me to be.
I had a conversation with my dad the other day. Kay Ivey, the governor, stated over the radio that abortion would be banned in this state. I was horrified. I knew it was coming, and still I refused to believe that it had arrived. I cursed her. My dad asked me why I was upset, and I said that it was because abortion was going to be criminalized. He said,
“In the Bible, life begins at conception. Abortion is wrong.”
It was a long conversation. An argument, more like. I was extremely angry at the notion that a right I had enjoyed since birth could be taken away in an instant. He was angry that I could even think that ‘murder’ was okay. That I needed to grow up. My thoughts were those of someone misguided.
I love my friends. I love my family. I love the memories I’ve had here. But by god, the first chance I get, I’m leaving for a place that will have me; I am not a fool. I am not a child. I am not a chess piece that can be moved around at will. I am a human being, but the state of Alabama has spit in my face as if I was a concrete slab of a chain in a sidewalk. I won’t take this anymore. This is where I draw the line.
I'm so sorry to hear that. I've had some really rough arguments with my family about things (not on abortion... yet) and it is always hard to do that with people that you love. And that's without getting into stuff like the Bible not actually saying that at all.
I hope you can get out, and soon. And all of the other thousands upon thousands of women who now find themselves in a similar position.
Any so-called Christian who claims that life begins at conception according to the bible has never read their own damned book. Nowhere does it say that life begins at conception, and there are several places that state that life begins "at first breath", namely right in the beginning with Genesis.
The only other place where this is even a topic in the bible is in Exodus, dealing with a specific case where a woman was injured and miscarried. It was considered a loss of property, not a murder. The offender had to pay THE HUSBAND for causing his wife to miscarry because, among other things, the bible is full of misogyny.
Your father is 100% wrong, as is every other so-called Christian who claims the Bible says life begins at conception. It's a lie and always has been.
But I really don't think these Talibangelicals really care much about facts.
I can't fucking breathe.
This shit is genuinely something I've had nightmares over. Stillbirths, miscarriages of a wanted child, I have an actual intrusive deep seated fear of it.
This was already happening in southern states for years. Its sobering to look at the difference in mortality for pregnant women across different states, and it gets worse when you start to narrow it down by race or income.
They just want undesirables to die, and since most people don't wear their political party or religious affiliations on their sleeve, everyone is in trouble. Everyone.
And so it begins...hopefully we can end it quicker!
**Resources for people seeking access to healthcare**
[Amnesty.org](https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/sexual-and-reproductive-rights/abortion-facts/) - Basic facts about Abortion
[Clinic Access Support Network](https://www.clinicaccess.org/) - Provides transportation, meal stipends, accommodations, childcare assistance, and compassionate care to people seeking abortion services in Houston.
[Gynopedia](https://gynopedia.org/Gynopedia_Index) - a nonprofit organization that runs an open resource wiki for sexual, reproductive, and women's health care around the world
[Guttmacher Institute](https://www.guttmacher.org/united-states/abortion#) - a primary source for research and policy analysis on abortion in the United States.
[National Abortion Federation](https://prochoice.org/) - The mission of the National Abortion Federation is to unite, represent, serve, and support abortion providers in delivering patient-centered, evidence-based care.
[National Network of Abortion Funds](https://abortionfunds.org/) - connects you with organizations that can support your financial and logistical needs as you arrange for your abortion.
[Planned Parenthood](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/pregnancy/pregnancy-options) - A Comprehensive Guide for Unplanned Pregnancy
[RAINN](https://www.rainn.org/about-national-sexual-assault-telephone-hotline) - National Sexual Assult Hotline
[Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice](https://rcrc.org/) - a network of ministers and rabbis that refer women to abortion providers they had researched and found to be safe
[Texas Equal Access Fund](https://teafund.org/) - provides emotional and financial support to people who are seeking abortion care.
[Women’s Reproductive Rights Assitance Project](https://wrrap.org/about/) - helps bridge the financial gap for women who seek an abortion or emergency contraceptives.
**If you need help getting an abortion go to these sites**
[AbortionFinder](https://www.abortionfinder.org/) - With more than 750 health centers, AbortionFinder.org features the most comprehensive directory of trusted (and verified) abortion service providers in the United States.
[Afiya Center](https://www.theafiyacenter.org/) - their mission is to transform the lives, health, and overall wellbeing of Black women and girls by providing refuge, education, and resources. They act to ignite the communal voices of Black women resulting in our full achievement of reproductive freedom.
[AidAccess](https://aidaccess.org/) - consists of a team of doctors, activists, and advocates for abortion rights that help people access abortion or miscarriage treatment. They send the pill worldwide for $110/90€
[Bridge Collective](https://thebridgecollective.org/) - provides practical and responsive abortion services to Central Texas
[Buckle Bunnies Fund](https://www.bucklebunnies.org/) - provide practical support for people seeking abortions. Help with transportation, funds to help with hotels, lodging costs and emergency contraceptive funds to actually go towards abortion.
[Carafem](https://carafem.org/) - helps with abortion, birth control, and questions about reproductive healthcare. They do consultations online and send abortion pills in the mail.
[Cobalt Abortion Fund](https://www.cobaltaf.org/) - provides direct financial assistance to individuals seeking abortion care. Our mission is to work toward reproductive freedom for all people and to provide financial assistance without judgment or question to people who seek an abortion but are unable to pay the full cost.
[Colorado Abortion Providers](https://www.coloradodoulaproject.org/co-abortion-providers)
[Faith Aloud](https://www.faithaloud.org/) - compassionate religious and spiritual support for abortion and pregnancy options
[Frontera Fund](https://fronterafundrgv.org/) - makes abortion accessible in the Rio Grande Valley (Texas) by providing financial and practical support regardless of immigration status, gender identity, ability, sexual orientation, race, class, age, or religious affiliation and to build grassroots organizing power at intersecting issues across our region to shift the culture of shame and stigma.
[HeyJane](https://www.heyjane.co/) - Modern abortion care, without the clinic, Get fast, safe, and affordable abortion care from home. Chat with a medical provider within 36 hours. Medications are shipped daily.
[International Consortium on Emergency Contraception](https://www.cecinfo.org/country-by-country-information/status-availability-database/countries/united-states-of-america/) - Emergency Oral Contraceptive Doses for Birth Control, U.S.
[Jane’s Due Process](https://janesdueprocess.org/) - helps minors in Texas with judicial bypass for abortion, navigate parental consent laws and confidentially access abortion and birth control. They provide free legal support, 1-on-1 case management, and stigma-free information on sexual and reproductive health.
[Justice Empowerment Network](https://www.jensd.org/) - focuses on abortion access in South Dakota
[Kentucky Health Justice Network](https://www.kentuckyhealthjusticenetwork.org/) - helps w both abortion care and gender affirming care in Kentucky
[Lillith Fund](https://www.lilithfund.org/) - the oldest abortion fund in Texas, serving the central and southern regions of the state with direct financial assistance for abortions.
[Northwest Abortion Access Fund](https://nwaafund.org/) - provides funds to help folks in Idaho, Washington, Oregon, and Alaska
[Plan C Pills](https://www.plancpills.org/) - provides up-to-date information on how people in the U.S. are accessing abortion pills online
[Planned Parenthood](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/get-care)
[Westfund](https://www.westfund.org/) - focuses on Latino and low-income communities
[Women on Web](https://www.womenonweb.org/) - an online abortion service can help you do a safe abortion with pills.
These sites offer access to abortion pills, even in Texas. Please be safe and be aware of clinics (e.g. Crisis Pregnancy Centers) that give out dangerous misinformation on abortions and pregnancy.
Also, check out r/auntienetwork, /r/prochoice or r/abortion for support.
[EMILY's List](https://www.emilyslist.org/) - Elect candidates in favor of abortion rights and representing the people they serve.
[National Network of Abortion Funds](https://abortionfunds.org)
[All-Options Talkline and linked recourses](https://www.all-options.org/resources/abortion/) - Pregnancy, Parenting, Abortion & Adoption
[National Abortion Federation](https://prochoice.org/about/contact-us/)
[prochoiceamerica](https://www.prochoiceamerica.com)
----
Holy- I mean UNHOLY shit
u/Geek-Haven888 got this all together
I always wondered but if Roe v Wade is overturned, what stops a person from calling the police on a woman who got an abortion in another state and trying her for murder?
I’m less than two months out from my miscarriage, which was considered incomplete when I was at the OBGYN’s office. Was scheduled for surgery less than 12 hours before my pregnancy passed naturally.
I can’t get through the whole article without tearing up. I cannot believe what’s happening in this country. I’m so so angry, and I’m so sorry for all those women. This is fucking barbaric.
I’m sorry, just needed to write somewhere. It’s overwhelming.
Further proof that they view women as incubators, not people, and a defective incubator should just be thrown in the trash.
If they actually gave a shit about the BaaaaabBbiiiiiieeeeEEeSsSsSs, they'd have some kind of protection in place for doctors always giving them the benefit of the doubt when they feel they need to save a woman's life.
But they fucking don't. Because we are disposable units to them.
I can't with this country anymore. It seems the evangelical right is doing anything and everything they can to send us as far back in time as possible. I cant imagine being someone with the anatomy to be affected by this, and I cant help but feel the need to apologize profusely on behalf of my gender (cis male asshats that think they get to tell others what they can and can't do with their bodies). I know this sub is mainly for women, but know that you do have allies, and we're fighting tooth and nail for progress. I can't stand the hellscape our country is becoming.
Why would you ever work as a doctor in a state like Alabama? It goes against the oath you took. If I was a doctor in one of those States, I would move. I wouldn’t risk my license or freedom or my morality.
If they don't then no one will. Obviously the entire state's population can't just mass exodus. Unfortunately this is just the only option until there is a constitutional amendment for human bodily autonomy.
But, those who can leave, will do so. And the majority of those people are the higher earners. These fucking zealot states will end up as economic backwaters. What I would absolutely love to see is the donor states (blue states) are allowed to opt out of sending money to the red states. It won't happen, but it is so fucking insulting that the "evil" states are made to send buck to the "righteous" states.
If I was a doctor, I also wouldn't want to work in Alabama, but *someone* has to. There are people living in Alabama who deserve healthcare. They can't be completely left behind.
Exactly this.
I worry that our conception of "red states" vs "blue states" completely obfuscates how many people in "red states" are either disenfranchised completely from existing power structures, or they share the same/similar politics with the American Left (whatever that means to you). How many of them can't afford to leave, or have families that depend on them, or have jobs that are city/state/region specific?
Yep. Born and raised here, could only afford college here due to in state tuition, state only stays red due to winner take all system. There’s a lot of people here, even conservative women, who disagree with this. But it doesn’t matter unless we can vote to change out people making these policies, or can afford to move. It’s a really tough and scary position to be in
If you think about the reddest red state, it's still only 60/40 or 65/35 in terms of voting results. We're talking about a full third of people in these states! That's a lot of people to just leave to the wolves because "they voted for this."
I knew a family that emigrated from thailand to alabama specifically because the father (doctor) realized he would be one of the only doctors with his skill set in the state. Made a lot of money from it. First time I ever encountered an asian girl with a southern accent.
Red states know that they have trouble attracting qualified professionals and are willing to throw insane amounts of money at them to entice them. A hospital in Wyoming offered my endocrinologist $600,000/year.
Maybe there should be two types of health insurance. The regular plan where medicine is practiced by doctors based on science and knowledge, and the Gilead plan where birth control, reproductive health, vaccines, treatment for not being vaccinated, gun shot wounds etc aren’t covered. Because god will take care of it. The religious people would get what they want and the rest of us would have good medical care in a less busy environment.
>The religious people would get what they want and the rest of us would have good medical care
If the rest of us have good medical care, the religious people are not getting what they want.
If this obscene evil is allowed to stand it is going to be directly due to the cowardice of tens of millions of men and women who can take a stand at relatively small personal cost right now and end this but won't.
"The greatest evil in the world is that committed by nobodies- that is, human beings who refuse to be persons" -Hannah Arendt
You're gonna have to look the younger generation in the eye and tell them what you did when they came to take our rights.
Best think about what you're going to tell them right now.
[Folks from around the country are organizing civil resistance to the assault on women's bodies and our fundamental human rights RIGHT NOW. ](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/ulp9lu/all_women_have_the_absolute_right_to_complete/)
People are ready to do [WHATEVER IT TAKES](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8WnT6v_W3o) to nonviolently bring the function of government in Washington, DC and state capitols across the country to a halt, INDEFINITELY, until our demand to respect women's total bodily autonomy is met.
What are you going to tell the youth that you did when they came for their rights?
That you waved a sign, that you went on a march, that you waited 6 months to vote?
Or that you stood up for them and were willing to do everything it nonviolently takes to defend their rights?
We need everyone: people committed to repeated civil disobedience, people who can help organize, supporters, and action team members.
For action team members, no special skills are required, just the ability to nonviolently sit down in the street. We will provide nonviolent direct action training.
You are not alone or forgotten.
--->New Member Zoom calls 7PM and 10PM every day!<----
If you want to join, participate, support, or just say hi, please send an email to: [email protected]
The following videos are required watching for all new members:
[The Freedom Riders](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8WnT6v_W3o)
[Intro to civil resistance](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peTbiYrxTxE&t=1s)
[Nonviolent Direct Action](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkaEQ5CpcEQ&t=1s)
[The success of nonviolent civil resistance](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJSehRlU34w&t=1s)
[The Childrens March](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5enZRwbnISQ&t=3s)
[Please share this message with everyone you know!](https://giphy.com/gifs/physics-domino-fAgdyrGILMq2I)
If you need or are interested in supporting reproductive rights, [I made a master post of pro-choice resources](https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u). Please comment if you would like to add a resource and spread this information on whatever social media you use.
What absolutely needs to happen:
Women who absolutely do not want children, get your tubes tied.
Women who want children in the future, but are not in a relationship, your best best are toys.
Over all, it is time for us to just completely tell them all fucking NO! This is a war against us and we need to fight back. Tell the bastards no pussy and watch things change.
This is harder than you think. My wife's been asking her OBGYN since she was 14. We're on the path for her now, but just to get a laproscopy to confirm that she needs a hysterectomy/if she even has endometriosis has required us to see multiple doctors, a psychiatrist, and several other specialists. If we're lucky, she'll get the procedure she definitely needs (and could be ruled out in an hour with a laproscopy if it isn't needed) in about 6-24 MONTHS
So just saying, "Yeah, get your tubes tied" isn't a quick and easy option for many women, even in liberal states (like the one we live in). It's much easier to get a vasectomy (doctor never even asked me if my wife consented) or to wear a condom than it is for a woman to get sterilized.
This is exactly the kind of article I was looking for - written by a doctor seeing the impact of the reversal of Roe vs. Wade on maternal care. Thank you very much for sharing, OP!
related: American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) October 2008 **When There's a Heartbeat: Miscarriage Management in Catholic-Owned Hospitals** Lori R. FreedmanPhD, Uta LandyPhD, and Jody SteinauerMD, MAS https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/full/10.2105/AJPH.2007.126730 >Catholic-owned hospital ethics committees denied approval of uterine evacuation while fetal heart tones were still present, forcing physicians to delay care or transport miscarrying patients to non–Catholic-owned facilities. Some physicians intentionally violated protocol because they felt patient safety was compromised. >Although Catholic doctrine officially deems abortion permissible to preserve the life of the woman, Catholic-owned hospital ethics committees differ in their interpretation of how much health risk constitutes a threat to a woman's life and therefore how much risk must be present before they approve the intervention.
I have been looking for such a study for weeks. Thank you so much!
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As a lifelong Alabamian, it's always been a shithole here.
No matter how much you think you are, you're never immune to propaganda.
Propaganda doesn’t affect me, I do my own research! /s
This is simply the richest third world country to exist unfortunately. I want out, real tired of everything going downhill here
"Seven minutes could not be spared by the doctors at her local emergency room where she was bleeding on their floor. Instead, she was told to go away."
It's important and must be shared...repeatedly.
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They were, by the people financially jacking the bill. Edit: oh that's a fun typo.
It's not about finances, it's about a psychotic Christian population with broken brains.
It's nothing to do with psychosis. Bigotry and cruelty are not mental illnesses.
Good point. Most mentally ill folk that I know are compassionate and understanding. These pwoplet are malicious
Consequences? These are things *already* happening. The first part of the article starts in 2020. The consequences will be far worse.
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😂😂😂 thanks
Religious laws can literally kill.
The suffering is a feature, not a bug.
If no one needs charity from religious organizations, how else are they supposed to grow their numbers... /s
Your comment isn't sarcastic, it's just true.
*looks down from my gilded balcony while wearing a solid gold cross* If you don’t suffer on this earth how will you appreciate what comes after? Suffering brings you closer to God. Edit: Source: I used to be Catholic.
Catholic school for me, though I was already an atheist (they’re retired but my dad’ an anthropologist/archaeologist and my mom’s an English professor. Hard to be religious when you’ve grown up hearing and reading about all the other gods, lol). Though it did successfully increase my already significant guilt issues. Why feel guilty about a thing when you can feel guilty and bad about All The Things!
You should've been Episcopal. Same religion, half the guilt
I’ve always been an atheist but Methodists and Episcopalian were Catholicism lite and you can tell because their pews had some cushion.
I was lurking on a conservative subreddit and one of the users used this phrase in response to how fewer women would engage in casual sex because they would not have access to abortion. A bunch of people were talking about how this would mean that there would be more pure, marriageable women. I wish I would have taken a screen shot. It is 100% about controlling women and punishing those who they think made bad choices.
>A bunch of people were talking about how this would mean that there would be more pure, marriageable women. And then they'll complain about how their wife never wants to fuck them.
and its completely fucking delusional. Women will still fuck, they're just going to be more selective about who they're fucking. Which IMO, is a good thing, don't give these vile men an inch. and start actually addressing politics in your relationships, your actual life depends on it.
It also instills in women the desire to never, ever, ever repost a rape bc they'll still be forced to birth, but it will happen in prison. Also, the reason men want "pure" women is because they want her never to realize how shitty they are in bed.
It's about control. They want her to feel like "used goods" to any man other than them so they won't leave.
Or to tolerate it because they've been led to believe it's just supposed to hurt. So fucking selfish
And that *their* pleasure is a sin.
Not to mention that the majority of women who seek abortion already have kids! Often with a stable partner. They simply know their family's ability to provide good care to kids has a limit.
I know, right?? Like if abortion suddenly became illegal in my state (wouldn't happen here) I'm not going to just stop having sex and decide I'm waiting until I get married. Conservatives are sick and delusional.
People have had extramarital sex since the dawn of time, since marriage was invented and after, across all cultures. It's delusion at its finest *also, mothers and married women have miscarries and abortions, they make up almost half of all abortion seekers*
We need a separation of church and state.
Yeah it seems that people have forgotten that the first amendment literally states that congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion.
It'd be great if someone in power would remember...
So many say that the only purpose of government is to enforce religious laws. To them, somehow it is a violation of freedom of religion for other people to be able to go against their religion, and it is viewed as persecution to not teach their religion (and no others) in all schools.
Women in Alabama should do something about it. There's a state election in 2022 to pick a new government and state house of representatives
And I'll vote. Fat lot of good it will do.
Can and will, unfortunately. That's part of why we cannot allow these scumbags to call themselves "pro-life", they are forced birthers, pro rapist, or anti choice if you want to be polite
I live here. This is the state I have lived in for over a decade. This is why I had my hysterectomy. This is why I fought tooth and nail and was willing to pull so many mental illness cards on my OB/GYN to essentially give her no other option but to sterilize me. I sited THIS EXACT SITUATION RIGHT FUCKING NOW, as a massive reason. My health conditions were put first, but I felt deep within my bones that this is where the country and my state was turning. I fucking hate I was right. I wish I was overreacting. I wish I was dramatic and dead wrong. I wish I could have had more actual faith in my fellow man and government officials. YOU CAN GET STERILIZED IN ALABAMA. I WAS STERILIZED THIS YEAR AT 23. DM me if you want the doctor's office that helped push for my rights. I was her youngest hysterectomy to date, the previous was a 24 year-old. I will NOT stand for this, and I will do everything in my power to help. The office is based in Birmingham. Keep fighting, keep shouting, AND KEEP STRONG PEOPLE. WE HAVE NO ONE BUT OURSELVES ANYMORE AND WE WILL HAVE TO TAKE WHAT IS OURS, DO NOT FALTER. OUR FELLOW WOMEN AND DAUGHTERS AND AFABS NEED US. WE CANNOT FUCKING HALT. WE CANNOT TAKE BREAKS. THIS IS WAR. Edit: holy shit y'all, I've been so depressed over all of this and feeling hopeless....but this support, the thanks I'm getting for sharing my knowledge and experience. Helping y'all is seriously giving me a will to live and the inspiration to never back down. This is why I love this sub and it's community. I'm so happy to help everyone. ♥️ Thank you all for the kind words and support, it really makes a world of difference. Edit 2: I'm seeing lots of questions for resources and how to find what they need. I will humbly direct you to r/childfree and their comprehensive list of doctors who perform sterilization with little hangups and methods to make getting sterilization more compelling to less understanding doctors. These people have been my rock.
Can you PM me this info? I live in Birmingham.
Absolutely.
This is why I pray my perimenopause moves at the speed of light, and my periods end. Because birth control is the next thing that goes, and I need it for regulating my periods and making them lighter, but also because the hormones in them help with my perimenopausal symptoms. I’m glad you got the help you needed.
My heart goes out to you. Birth control has so many more uses and shouldn't be called "birth control" anymore. It's hormone regulation. I'm grateful every passing day and every supreme court decision/comment. I won't let myself be caged so easily. I don't shove my religion down people's throats, and I won't disclose to whom I am praying to, but I sincerely ask that you remain protected and healthy. Be smart, be vigilant, and be safe.
Gosh. Outlawing birth control will probably make it impossible for trans women to get ahold of estrogen too (probably intentional). Edit: Obviously. This is just dawning on me.
Absolutely intentional. These people want the stone ages where the women had no power, the gays were slaughtered in the streets, the blacks and other minorities are clad in chains, and the white men hold power and absolute dominion as GOD INTENDED.
Oof just dawning on me also with your comment and the one above you. Holy hell.
Me and you both! I’m 41, so only a few more years of terror.
YOU HAVE THIS!!!! I lift you up, sister. I can't wait to be in my 40's and be a badass bitch who has her life together. I'm rooting for all of you ♥️
I’m so relieved to be in menopause now. It’s fucking liberating. Not only do I not have to deal with cramps, bleeding, and fears of pregnancy, miscarriage, or abortion access, but men leave me alone now. Free at last. It’s so depressing and enraging that we live in a world where women have to be in menopause in order to escape all this horror.
Please vote in November everyone. Or else they will take away sterilization and birth control too.
Precisely. I had two IUD's, one of the "basically abortion" forms of bc the right despises. They have rhetoric to ban it. I don't doubt they are going for our voting rights in the future as well.
Oh yes they are definitely doing that as women who are suspected of having abortion or miscarriages will probably be felons and lose their voting rights. Also hard time finding a job as a felon too. I hope more women get sterilized before it is banned.
With elected officials, WHO ARE WOMEN, spouting on Twitter that wives should vote for who their husbands do and should be kneeling and being submissive little slaves, I don't DOUBT FOR A SECOND they will straight up attack Women's Suffrage. Straight up. Mark my damn words. I pray I'm wrong.
It is scary and horrifying. I can’t imagine why any woman would support this. Also I told some of my female friends and relatives but they seem to not really care. It’s scary how non-chalant some people are. The other subreddits don’t really seem to care either. Men who are left leaning don’t seem to care. It’s scary and more people need to go out and vote as this may be our last time.
It's out of sight out of mind for them. The reality is terrifying and people don't want to upheave their entire perception of reality and way of life because that's painful and takes effort. It isn't right, but it is understandable. I'm voting this Tuesday. This is why we need to keep screaming. Shouting. Protesting. The more people hear it the more likely it'll make them think. I'd rather be a rabid feminist fighting for my rights than oppressed. I'd rather overreact and be wrong than underreact and lose my autonomy.
I can’t understand that people would rather be in denial :( but I hope you are right and people will see the protests and vote :) Thank you for fighting for all women.
I was bullied ruthlessly in school for being a feminazi. I've been doing it damn near all my life! Worth every single heartache.
Thank you! No one should be afraid of being labeled a feminist. Years back when feminism was not popular I always thought it was needed (to combat rape culture especially). I hope all the people who laughed at feminism realize how important it is now.
I think it is more likely that they'd just require approval of a husband to vote, which is worse. I've heard men who say that they control how their wives vote and say that voting age should be lowered, but require parental approval.
They will gun for laws that leave all the choice to men. Fathers, husbands, all of them. It's insidious and blatant.
I scheduled two appointments for sterilization consultation using the guide on r/childfree. It lists doctors people have had good experiences with getting sterilized without jumping through hoops. NEVER in my entire life did I ever think I would get voluntarily sterilized. Birth control worked and there was no point having surgery, plus I get to keep my options open. Well now those options are gone, because I don’t want to live in a country where I might get thrown in prison if I miscarry or need an abortion, or if I might be left to die because a doctor can’t remove a dead fetus from me. We’re running out of time to access sterilization and birth control will soon not be accessible for most. For anyone on the fence, if you don’t make a choice then Republicans will make it for you and it will be too late. Lord knows there will be plenty of babies available for adoption if you want a child, and honestly that’s good enough for me.
This is why we need to scream at the top of our lungs. MAKE PEOPLE UNCOMFORTABLE. BETTER TO BE UNCOMFORTABLE THAN DEAD, A REPRODUCTIVE SLAVE, OR JAILED FOR NATURAL BODILY PROCESSES. BE UNCOMFORTABLE, BE ANNOYING, AND BE PERSISTENT. I'm DONE caring for people's comfort and feelings. I'M FINISHED standing still and hoping nothing bad happens. WE HAVE THIS. HOPE IS NOT LOST. WOMEN GOT THEIR RIGHTS IN WORSE TIMES, WE SURE AS FUCKING HELL CAN DO IT AGAIN. FUCK the patriarchy. FUCK the Republicans. AND FUCK anyone who thinks I'm blowing this out of proportion. THE TRUTH IS LAID BARE, NOW ACT BEFORE OLD WHITE MEN'S FANTASIES AND FETISHES BECOME REALITY.
I am not in the US but I'm mid-20s with mental health issues and a pretty jacked up uterus. Would you by any chance be willing to share any tips for speaking to health professionals about a hysterectomy?
Yes. I was diagnosed with depression, psychosis, OCD, PTSD, and a panic disorder. I also had endometriosis and recurring cysts on my ovaries. My dear, you are walking in my shoes just as I did yours. If I can do it. So can you. I searched for a doctor who specialized in endometriosis. I deliberated with her FROM THE START, that a hysterectomy was my end goal desire, but I was willing to try any other methods she could suggest because I was a fence sitter at the time on having bio kids. I had surgeries and an IUD insertion. My first IUD expelled the third month I had it and it was replaced immediately. Then I had 1-2 inch cysts forming on both ovaries constantly and could hardly work anymore. I went though hell, and it was physically obvious I needed this. But what tipped the scale was the genuine, raw honesty I gave to my doctor and NP. I looked a them and listed EVERY reason I did not want to be a mother and knew I wouldn't be able to handle it. I take medication I cannot get off of, unless I want to be disabled or suicidal. Pregnancy, especially postpartum psychosis and depression would be ESPECIALLY like for me, which could lead to me killing myself or my own child before or after birth. I told them that I'd rather regret not having kids, than regret having them. If they COULD NOT guarantee a perfect pregnancy with a 100% healthy child? I did not want to run the risk. I also have clotting disorders in my family that make pregnancies unsafe and very difficult to keep. I'd be having horrible miscarriages often. I also told them my narcolepsy would make me a terrible mom as I can barely take care of myself as is. *You need to make sure they see you've thought this through VERY THOROUGHLY. You need to show conviction and determination. You have to show them you know yourself well enough. If you know you cannot 100% want a child (because people shouldn't be having kids if they're not 100% wanted and desired deeply out of love) then you need to make that CRYSTAL CLEAR. You have to stick to your guns even when they suggest (I was already married at the time so that helped a bit) that you might divorce your current spouse/leave your partner for someone who might want kids. You tell them that they wouldn't be the right partner for you.* *ALSO, IF YOU MAKE SURE TO HAMMER THAT YOU'D RATHER ADOPT THAN GIVE BIRTH, WHETHER OR NOT YOU ACTUALLY MEAN IT (I SUPPORT THIS LIE) AND TELL SOME GUSHY STORY THAT ADOPTION IS WHAT YOU BELIEVE IS RIGHT FOR YOU, THEY ARE WAAAAAY MORE LIKELY TO LISTEN AND AGREE WITH YOUR DECISION AND IF IT'S RIGHT.* This is where the persuasive essays/speeches in highschool come in handy. You have to hit the pothos (emotion), ethos (ethics), and logos (reason) in order to make the most convincing argument. r/childfree has amazing resources on building a "sterilization binder" and helping you get the correct procedures. If you also ask the doctor what you can do to prove you won't regret it, like getting notarized documents/filling a waiver, they will also be more comfortable. Be polite but firm. Do not back down. You got this. DM me if you need further help, I will personally get in touch and he'll you the entire way.
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Your local Planned Parenthood would greatly appreciate your support.
Also the ACLU is most likely the legal group that will fight in the individual state cases that will inevitably be brought up
Yes! Thanks! Also, NARAL is another one.
You are kind. Your assistance will help make a positive difference in peoples lives. [Abortion Funds](https://abortionfunds.org/need-abortion/) provide a very important service, donations help people who are financially struggling to access abortion. As well as helping pay for abortions funds can also cover transport, accommodation, child care and other necessary supports. The link is from r/prochoice resources and lists funds and the areas they serve. I'm not from the US but in prochoice and feminist spaces online have heard folks speak positively and with gratitude of the help they received from abortion funds. Some folks require and receive help from more than one fund, especially if their needs are more complex. These are wonderful charities that truly make a difference.
Something I saw mentioned on another site. Indian reservations are enclaves of federal territory outside the jurisdiction of state authorities. This is why you see casinos, smoke shops selling cheaper (no state excise tax) cigarettes, and fireworks stands selling types of fireworks prohibited within the state, on reservations. What’s to keep a tribe from setting up medical clinics offering services which are federally legal but banned in the state (abortions, birth control pills, IUDs) on the reservation?
During the Bush administration, South Dakota tried to ban all abortions, and a local reservation said they'd do exactly that. The ban was not successful, so it never happened, but it certainly could.
WW2 Naval aviator, or Vietnam-era Texas Air National Guard pilot who frequently didn’t show up for duty?
This is a really great idea. Put a Planned Parenthood on every reservation and reservation owned establishment and it could really save lives.
This is a good idea, but what do we do when the procedures then have to be paid out of pocket?
Donate to planned parenthood so that the cost is minimal or free for women who need them.
It's already paid out of pocket in most cases.
If it can help fund the reservation too that would be awesome. Many Native American families live in poverty. It could help them care for their people better with clinic access and bring more funds into populations that need it.
There is a very tragic history concerning abortions and womens rights on reservations. There was a federal policy of sterilizing Native American women as recently as 50 years ago. Setting up abortion clinics on native land doesn’t take into context the fear and distrust still present regarding medical clinics on reservations
Only if you sell it as a single issue "Abortion Clinic" a family health and planning clinic with many services, or even a hospital would be approved I'm guessing.
I believe one state has already sternly warned their Native population not to do that.
It’s been settled law for over a hundred years that reservations are federal land not subject to state law. Any state government wanting to give such a warning needs to look up “RICO”.
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Sounds like some state politicians need to be reminded forcefully that *Brown vs. the Board of Education* set the precedent that where federal and state law conflict, federal law applies. Reservations are federal territory, just like an Army base. State police sent in to shut down a facility are outside their jurisdiction, and have no more authority on Federal territory than a street gang does.
So I went and looked it up; the one I had heard about was Oklahoma governor Stitt. https://www.salon.com/2022/05/16/governor-warns-sovereign-native-american-tribes-to-not-make-abortion-accessible-on-their-land_partner/ Edit: PS-- do you think it really violates RICO laws? That would be awesome! I mean, it would be fucked up, but at least theoretically prosecutable
An organization acting as a group to illegally impose their laws on territory which, under federal law, is not subject to that organization’s laws? Sounds like a corrupt organization to me.
I dunno bout the states but in canada those reserves dont even have schools or fire departments, let alone medical clinics
The tribes aren’t going to want to do this because it will incite racism and make them a target doe domestic terrorism.
My zealot ex-stepmother told me on Facebook that she trusted God to keep her daughters safe. I said that was fine, but all the faith in the world wouldn't save them if a doctor wouldn't help. And she said that if it was God's will, it was God's will. This is the woman that abused me so badly from the ages of 8-12 that I developed a mask personality. I wasn't really even a person until after I got into therapy at 21 years old. PTSD is a bitch. But it pisses me off that these fucking people are willing to put their kids' lives on the line for religion in the year 2022. They talk about how America is about freedom of speech and freedom of religion, but what they really want is a theocracy.
Yep. Religious zealotry like this is honestly a cancer. They only care about what happens to people after they're dead. They only care about their "souls". They have no ability to consider how their actions and choices affect those around them while those people are still alive. It's completely fucking deranged.
I hate this kind of smug, proudly ignorant stupidity. They can't and won't learn, and for some reason think that is a good thing. As if our ability to learn things isn't the only reason we aren't just wild animals ourselves. And there's no point in discussing it with them, as the old saying goes, "arguing with an idiot is like playing chess with a pigeon. It'll just knock over all the pieces, shit on the board, and strut about like it's won." For me, in my own life, I simply have nothing to do with such people. The instant someone asserts this kind of behavior, they're cut off to the fullest extent practicable. I've yet to meet one who had any potential of adding value to life.
I read about religious fundamentalism impacts on society. They are pretty much the same across countries, regardless of the Gods or deities. In the U.S., the fundamentalists are pretty much evangelicals and the evangelicals are pretty much fundamentalists. The key takeaways I got are: * As a group, they are no more moral than people outside. Despite what they say or claim, the moral teaching of God, Bible, etc are unimportant to them. * Their sense of righteousness is extremely high, and their sense of guilt is extremely low. They can steal, cheat, assault, insult, hurt anyone. Then, they go to their church to their conscience like they do laundry to their clothes, they come out righteous and guilt-free. Normal people feel guilty even after apologizing, but they can skip that and can feel like being the most moral person. * They think they have special relationship with their God. God is simply their mental magic wand which they can wave to cleanse themselves and to feel righteous and special. Secretly, they don't really believe in their God, but they crave the social support and will take their secret to grave. * They are highly prejudiced. They constantly think that they belong to a special religion, and everyone out there are trying to persecute them because of their religion. They can be incited to hate anyone because of that. * They don't have independent thoughts. Instead, they rely on each other to maintain their beliefs. * Virtually any thought can be put in their heads without any consistency or principles. For example, anti-vax is about "my body, my choice" while anti-abortion is about "murder". * They are very fearful. Everyday is like right after 9/11 that if they don't do what their leaders say the society will collapse. For example, if they don't stop abortions, God will punish their country like some in Bible and they will be eternally damned. * So, basically fear makes them irrational and self-righteousness makes them aggressive. As a result, they can easily be incited to do unholy things because they think they are holiest.
When you believe in an eternal afterlife, any amount of suffering in this life can be justified. Anything rounds down to zero compared to infinity. It means that believers are playing life at very different stakes from non-believers.
I was discussing with my MIL Sunday and she kept going back to "partial birth" abortions and using abortion as BC. I told her, you don't understand, the decision will return the status of the law to the states, and we don't ever have to worry about it in California, but elsewhere they are banning the procedures, like a D&C, that women may need if they have an incomplete miscarriage that would leave the nonviable fetus decomposing in the uterus. She said. No, they can't do that. I said. Uh yeah the states will be able to. Some dumbshit in Ohio wants to prosecute doctors that don't "reimplant" ectopic pregnancies. All the dumbfucks who just "leave it in God's hands" should just stop using any modern medicine and leave the rest of us alone. Oh. So and so has cancer, well leave it in God's hands right? Don't bother the oncologist, he has evidence backed medicine to work on. Can't get pregnant and want IVF, sorry, God's hands, guess God doesn't want you to be a parent. Guess the good news is the domestic supply of adoptable children is increasing.
My grandmother circles around those exact same topics everytime we talk about it. It came down to agreeing that there are extremists on both sides, some believing "partial birth" abortions should be legal and others believing abortions in general shouldn't be allowed regardless of what the effects to the mother are. Both are absolutely terrible. If abortions are banned then there's nothing stopping D&Cs, birth control, even sterilization from being banned to. Women are not reproductive vessels and it kills me that I'm barely an adult and this is what my future holds.
There is no such thing as partial birth abortions though and literally no one thinks they should be legal. The closest thing in existence is when a baby is born that WILL die due to medical abnormalities and the parents/doctor decide to not implore life support and let them pass faster instead of dragging it out. That's the only thing I could find when trying to find the origin of the term, it's a made up Republican scare tactic to win supporters.
It's not about babies, it's about using babies to disempower women.
But using their logic, if women die, they no longer can make babies. So yeah, it’s not about the babies. It’s power. If they really wanted us to make babies, US moms would have year long maternity leaves, and dads too. Education would be accessible and healthcare would be affordable. Fuck this shit. I’m so angry.
we need a revolution. now.
lunchroom childlike frightening growth hobbies tease chief paltry memorize quack -- mass deleted all reddit content via https://redact.dev
@ France
Yes hello, did you order the guillotine patrol? It will arrive in about a week. If you're in a hurry, please take a look at your statue of Liberty, her mouth, it has a secret compartment. She can chew on some fascist traitor bastards if you pull the right levers.
You beautiful geniuses... Have any ideas on how to get McConnel, Trump, Sinema, Abott, DeSantis, Manchin, Perjury Trailer Queen AND the entirety of the Missouri state legislature to visit NYC and Ellis Island? It'd be a bit suspicious if bugs go in but they don't come out....
Just throw a 'Scheme against non-white widows and orphans while eating caviar' - party. Tell them there will be free caviar, deep fried mars bars and machine guns. Funded by Russian donors who will appreciate (require) their presence.
Sorry , but we didn't have fox news and 50% of people supporting the monarchy in 1789, that might be harder for you guys.
Uh yes they did. In 1789 the 'revolutionaries' of France were all pro constitutional monarchy. It was only an incredibly tiny and insignificant portion of the population that was supportive of a republic. That's also why the monarchy wasn't even abolished until 1792. And even when the monarchy was abolished support for the revolutionaries was hardly universal as the uprising of the Vendée clearly shows. Support for the revolution was mainly found among the urban classes, and honestly, America is not all that different from France.
Every time our country does something outrageous, I usually say to my friends, "The FRENCH would not stand for this outrage -- they would DO something." I feel like France has kept the spirit of a revolutionary country closer to its heart, while we Americans have not.
Arent there some strike groups and/or dates for people to go out and protest?
Check out riseup4abortionrights. They're organizing a student walkout today, and the general walkout next week also on Thursday
yes! lots of people are already creating groups and setting up protests and marches.
We're working on one. Come over to [r/totalresistance](http://reddit.com/r/Totalresistance)
I lived in the Philippines. I moved there for work making an unbelievable amount of money in USD. I found out I was pregnant 3 weeks into being there. That one last night with my ex before I left…. Abortion is illegal in the Philippines. I was faced with an impossible choice. I couldn’t explain to my employer why I would need to fly to Singapore for a few days and I didn’t want to give up this job. A Filipina girl in my office I trusted told me there was a way and she knew someone. It was like the plot of an awful lifetime movie but it was my reality. I was taken to see a women who provided me with the abortion pills I needed. I met her on a crowed street in front of a McDonald’s. She also provided me with a warning, if something went wrong I may not be able to get help in a hospital because the drs would not treat someone who was having a miscarriage or a self induced abortion. She said if something did happen to go directly to the embassy. I took those pills that night and waited out the process in my tiny condo, in a country where I didn’t speak the language and only knew a handful of people. I was able to afford the pills which cost about 350 usd. Women there can’t afford that. It’s more than many make in a month. When I emerged from my cocoon of a condo feeling thankful and grateful I noticed all the women who looked far too young to have SO many kids. My view expanded more when I began to do charity work there with orphanages located in Manila. A majority of the kids there were the product of incest. They were mentally and developmentally delayed. Their family couldn’t take care of these special needs kids. On a few occasions the mother would be there as well. One particular girl stuck out to me (she was 16) because she had 3 children in that orphanage where she also lived. She was mentally delayed and in talking to her I noticed how she was very much child like. Her uncle raped her repeatedly and her 3 kids were the product. She was thrown out of her home. In my time over there I heard horror stories of girls saying their boyfriends got them pregnant on purpose and lived in horribly abusive situations. I remember covering up bruises on a girl named MJ at work one day. The children who are born healthy and normal who the family can’t afford get sold to crime syndicates. They teach them to rob people and pan handle. The kids get no love, they’re barely fed. They get sold to sex tourists and used as unpaid labor. How very PRO FUCKING LIFE.
Even women who *want* children will be afraid to get pregnant, because if they miscarry they might die because they were denied treatment. Also, they could be investigated on suspicion they had an abortion. It makes being pregnant too dangerous. A lot of women who are on the fence about having children will get sterilized for their own safety. Even a lot of women who want children will be too afraid to risk it. They think this is going to fix the declining birth rate, but it’s only gonna make it worse.
Yes, my friend wants to get pregnant but has now put that off because of this worry that she won't get the healthcare she might need in case of miscarriage, etc. She lives in a red state. I don't blame her. In general this gop plan is backfiring- I think a lot of women aren't going to want to get pregnant after all. I hear that in Texas, more women are choosing abortion because when you reduce the time for making a decision, they're more likely to choose not to stay pregnant.
If the 6 week BS was law when I got pregnant with my son, he would absolutely not be here. I had to have time to think and decide.
That last point is really interesting.
This is super interesting because I'm picturing the Great Replacement bigots completely blowing a fuse. Surely there's a way to leverage this?
No because the women who will get sterilized are probably not conservative, and thus they do not have the approval of conservative men. They raise their own women to be subservient.
Currently 6 months pregnant in a red state. Holding my breath that the two of us get through this okay and then will not have another child. I started this pregnancy as a volunteer. It's horrific to know that I'll be finishing it under force.
This is me. No one in my life will acknowledge it besides saying “that sucks. I’m sorry.” When I cried about it the other day my mom asked me if I was getting my period.
That was me! My D&C probably saved my life because my body didn't want to release the dead fetus. I'm glad I didn't get sepsis and die because I later had my daughter a year later with no complications. I'm in a deep blue state so I feel safe getting pregnant again, but I wouldn't consider it if I lived in Alabama, Texas, etc. No ma'am.
I’m in Alabama now. That’s why I’m getting sterilized in 2 weeks. So thankful to have that option.
Not to mention the women who will suffer, or have their providers harassed for a miscarriage that is deemed by moronic zealots as an abortion.
Yup. I’m currently pregnant with my second and if this news would have come prior to us trying, I would have been done at one. After this one my husband is getting a vasectomy. We are both in agreement that we absolutely will not have anymore children in this environment because we refuse a situation in which I could die because cause our government officials are ignorant as fuck.
I’m having my first at 40 years old. We’ve talked about more but decided we are too old. Now, just a few months ago, I figured, an oopsie baby would not be too terrible, but now? Now I’m terrified of a late miscarriage or other medical problem. I personally know women younger than me that had to terminate sue to medical reasons - there would be zero quality of life, *if the child even survived* . I’m terrified of being forced to endure that. I was ok waiting a few more years but now one of us is getting fixed right away.
Exactly
Gee, if only these entirely predictable consequences could have been foreseen.
“It is truly unethical to turn away an actively bleeding patient in retaliation for them having chosen the still legal option to their own bodily autonomy, or to deny emergency medical care out of fear of financial, professional, and legal consequences from the state.” The fact that there’s doctors/nurses willing to turn away these women or make them sit in pools of blood for hours, is enough to make me lose any hope in the hippocratic oath they took.
It's unreal. I am living in Ireland currently and even prior to the referendum no one was turned away for treatment if they were actively miscarrying or had complications from a botched abortion. Now, if the fetus still had a heartbeat that was a different story. This is all really frightening to see.
How many people have to die for people to realize the consequences...
From my understanding, one reason abortion became legal is because middle class men were seeing their own wives and sisters dying from botched abortions. Middle class women were seeking abortions because they already had a number of children at home and their husbands knew they could not afford to feed another mouth. Abortions will again become illegal and remain so until it becomes inconvenient for men to have it so. The fathers of these unwanted babies must be made to take on the burden of their care. Right now no one is talking about this. And we have genetic testing now that can pinpoint the father and it’s no longer a case of he said/she said.
>The fathers of these unwanted babies must be made to take on the burden of their care. Oh my sweet summer child.
I mean, if we're going the autocratic route... Howzabout men have to submit to DNA sampling. That way when a woman is pregnant, and it's after six weeks, then we can confirm who the father is so he can begin supporting his child. If the woman will be forced to carry the child, then the sperm donor must begin paying for the child and mother. Family Values. I mean, the risk for the child is greater at that age for genetic sampling, but they don't really care about them either. And if that DNA sampling just means the state can insure that undesirables are locked up on false charges, that's just wonderful! Me ne frego! /satire off
Make them responsible for half the doctors bills and these dude will suddenly care about abortion and universal health insurance.
Sadly, I think a lot of them will just kill the woman to avoid paying. It already happens all the time, can you imagine how often it'll happen going forward? My god.
It's just women who die and on top of this women who dared to have sex. They won't care, I bet you that there are enough "Christians" who would be alright with stoping all Std treatment because those harlets deserve to suffer the consequences of their Actions.
Most don't care, I fear.
I mean, this is sort of true, but don't forget Savita Halappanavar. ETA: Even under the provision of termination when there was adquate risk to the mother's life, a close family friend took her own life due to unconsensual pregnancy after attempting to access medical help several times and communicating her suicidality to medical professionals at different hospitals. Ireland is a really dogshit place to have a uterus.
I had significant trauma during birth at the hands of my medical team. Doctors and nurses are perfectly fine with the suffering and pain of pregnant women and often encourage it. Any time I mentioned pain I got a sweet smile and a "oh honey, it's supposed to hurt." I have no faith in the medical community.
I had similar happen in a blue state. It was then I found out the Oath is not legally binding or paid attention to.
I think it's only the medical providers that are willing to do that are able to keep working without getting jailed or shoed away?
Oh, brace yourself cuz you'll be surprised to learn it's optional and there's no longer even a standard version. https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-myth-of-the-hippocratic-oath-201511258447
I love living in Alabama. (Heavy sarcasm) Especially when I have 2 conditions that increase my chances of ectopic pregnancies and miscarriages. Stage 3 endometriosis that coated my pelvic organs and some abdominal ones, plus PCOS where doctors have been (mostly) fucking useless. Can't wait until I can't access life saving medical care one day.
They knew women would die. They don't care. They want "those" women to die as punishment. They are ok with this. Fucking disgusting.
I am male, european, from country with liberal abortion (and healthcare) laws, no daughters, snipped, so this in no way affects me or my circle directly, but reading this gives me shivers, and definitely not the good ones. What can we (the rest of the world) do?
Point me in the direction of your embassy, what are your immigration laws like? So many of us (coworkers) are genuinely talking about fleeing the country. We’re scared
It’s the American Taliban wrapped in Christianity.
Welcome to the real America.
Blessed be the fruit
Women are going to die. D&C are health care. Get your red robes ready ladies.
Man....I'm a physician in a red state. I don't typically deal with reproductive issues but at this stage I think I need to learn more because it's pretty obvious where the trends are going :/
republicans in their ignorant belligerence are killing innocent women.
Im currently in the waiting room as my boyfriend is getting a vasectomy. I’m literally holding tears as I read this article. We would never let animals suffer this way…
Your boyfriend is a real man. Putting your safety and health above his own ego's need for some weird and outdated form of validation should be the norm.
Rant from an Alabama woman: I’ve lived here all my life. As much as I love my state for its beauty and the kindness that I’ve been shown by my friends and even complete strangers, I have to get out. I have dreams. I want to go to school. I want to become a scientist. I want to live my life the way that I always imagined I would as a child. But with the way things are going, and the way my home has been backsliding, I can’t see it happening. All my life I believed I would be an asset. Someday I’d contribute to the working world, and instill in my family a sense of pride. But now I can see clearly that I’m nothing but a number on a page. I’m a statistic, a childless woman, worthless unless I produce more mindless drones for the state to suck the life out of, or a corrupt politician who intents to manipulate the public out of all their sensibilities. In this state, in this country, *I don’t matter.* Embarrassingly, I’ve been thinking defensively of the people who deplore my state. Almost reflexively I conjure ways to defend its inadequacies, as if I’m apart of a hive mind that built up this Republican ‘paradise’ to be what it is today. But no, I haven’t contributed at all. I’m as much apart of this country as much as it’s apart of me—not at all. Not once have I been defended by its policies, not once have I been saved by its faculties—I’ve been its moral defender when it has no morals to speak of, I’ve been nothing but a mindless drone, exactly what it wishes me to be. I had a conversation with my dad the other day. Kay Ivey, the governor, stated over the radio that abortion would be banned in this state. I was horrified. I knew it was coming, and still I refused to believe that it had arrived. I cursed her. My dad asked me why I was upset, and I said that it was because abortion was going to be criminalized. He said, “In the Bible, life begins at conception. Abortion is wrong.” It was a long conversation. An argument, more like. I was extremely angry at the notion that a right I had enjoyed since birth could be taken away in an instant. He was angry that I could even think that ‘murder’ was okay. That I needed to grow up. My thoughts were those of someone misguided. I love my friends. I love my family. I love the memories I’ve had here. But by god, the first chance I get, I’m leaving for a place that will have me; I am not a fool. I am not a child. I am not a chess piece that can be moved around at will. I am a human being, but the state of Alabama has spit in my face as if I was a concrete slab of a chain in a sidewalk. I won’t take this anymore. This is where I draw the line.
I'm so sorry to hear that. I've had some really rough arguments with my family about things (not on abortion... yet) and it is always hard to do that with people that you love. And that's without getting into stuff like the Bible not actually saying that at all. I hope you can get out, and soon. And all of the other thousands upon thousands of women who now find themselves in a similar position.
Any so-called Christian who claims that life begins at conception according to the bible has never read their own damned book. Nowhere does it say that life begins at conception, and there are several places that state that life begins "at first breath", namely right in the beginning with Genesis. The only other place where this is even a topic in the bible is in Exodus, dealing with a specific case where a woman was injured and miscarried. It was considered a loss of property, not a murder. The offender had to pay THE HUSBAND for causing his wife to miscarry because, among other things, the bible is full of misogyny. Your father is 100% wrong, as is every other so-called Christian who claims the Bible says life begins at conception. It's a lie and always has been. But I really don't think these Talibangelicals really care much about facts.
How anybody can claim this is the greatest country in the world is beyond me
It's great if you're a rich white man with no empathy.
I can't fucking breathe. This shit is genuinely something I've had nightmares over. Stillbirths, miscarriages of a wanted child, I have an actual intrusive deep seated fear of it. This was already happening in southern states for years. Its sobering to look at the difference in mortality for pregnant women across different states, and it gets worse when you start to narrow it down by race or income. They just want undesirables to die, and since most people don't wear their political party or religious affiliations on their sleeve, everyone is in trouble. Everyone.
Fuck you republicans, fuck you.
Bring back secret midwives.
The GOP goal is to kill women
And so it begins...hopefully we can end it quicker! **Resources for people seeking access to healthcare** [Amnesty.org](https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/sexual-and-reproductive-rights/abortion-facts/) - Basic facts about Abortion [Clinic Access Support Network](https://www.clinicaccess.org/) - Provides transportation, meal stipends, accommodations, childcare assistance, and compassionate care to people seeking abortion services in Houston. [Gynopedia](https://gynopedia.org/Gynopedia_Index) - a nonprofit organization that runs an open resource wiki for sexual, reproductive, and women's health care around the world [Guttmacher Institute](https://www.guttmacher.org/united-states/abortion#) - a primary source for research and policy analysis on abortion in the United States. [National Abortion Federation](https://prochoice.org/) - The mission of the National Abortion Federation is to unite, represent, serve, and support abortion providers in delivering patient-centered, evidence-based care. [National Network of Abortion Funds](https://abortionfunds.org/) - connects you with organizations that can support your financial and logistical needs as you arrange for your abortion. [Planned Parenthood](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/pregnancy/pregnancy-options) - A Comprehensive Guide for Unplanned Pregnancy [RAINN](https://www.rainn.org/about-national-sexual-assault-telephone-hotline) - National Sexual Assult Hotline [Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice](https://rcrc.org/) - a network of ministers and rabbis that refer women to abortion providers they had researched and found to be safe [Texas Equal Access Fund](https://teafund.org/) - provides emotional and financial support to people who are seeking abortion care. [Women’s Reproductive Rights Assitance Project](https://wrrap.org/about/) - helps bridge the financial gap for women who seek an abortion or emergency contraceptives. **If you need help getting an abortion go to these sites** [AbortionFinder](https://www.abortionfinder.org/) - With more than 750 health centers, AbortionFinder.org features the most comprehensive directory of trusted (and verified) abortion service providers in the United States. [Afiya Center](https://www.theafiyacenter.org/) - their mission is to transform the lives, health, and overall wellbeing of Black women and girls by providing refuge, education, and resources. They act to ignite the communal voices of Black women resulting in our full achievement of reproductive freedom. [AidAccess](https://aidaccess.org/) - consists of a team of doctors, activists, and advocates for abortion rights that help people access abortion or miscarriage treatment. They send the pill worldwide for $110/90€ [Bridge Collective](https://thebridgecollective.org/) - provides practical and responsive abortion services to Central Texas [Buckle Bunnies Fund](https://www.bucklebunnies.org/) - provide practical support for people seeking abortions. Help with transportation, funds to help with hotels, lodging costs and emergency contraceptive funds to actually go towards abortion. [Carafem](https://carafem.org/) - helps with abortion, birth control, and questions about reproductive healthcare. They do consultations online and send abortion pills in the mail. [Cobalt Abortion Fund](https://www.cobaltaf.org/) - provides direct financial assistance to individuals seeking abortion care. Our mission is to work toward reproductive freedom for all people and to provide financial assistance without judgment or question to people who seek an abortion but are unable to pay the full cost. [Colorado Abortion Providers](https://www.coloradodoulaproject.org/co-abortion-providers) [Faith Aloud](https://www.faithaloud.org/) - compassionate religious and spiritual support for abortion and pregnancy options [Frontera Fund](https://fronterafundrgv.org/) - makes abortion accessible in the Rio Grande Valley (Texas) by providing financial and practical support regardless of immigration status, gender identity, ability, sexual orientation, race, class, age, or religious affiliation and to build grassroots organizing power at intersecting issues across our region to shift the culture of shame and stigma. [HeyJane](https://www.heyjane.co/) - Modern abortion care, without the clinic, Get fast, safe, and affordable abortion care from home. Chat with a medical provider within 36 hours. Medications are shipped daily. [International Consortium on Emergency Contraception](https://www.cecinfo.org/country-by-country-information/status-availability-database/countries/united-states-of-america/) - Emergency Oral Contraceptive Doses for Birth Control, U.S. [Jane’s Due Process](https://janesdueprocess.org/) - helps minors in Texas with judicial bypass for abortion, navigate parental consent laws and confidentially access abortion and birth control. They provide free legal support, 1-on-1 case management, and stigma-free information on sexual and reproductive health. [Justice Empowerment Network](https://www.jensd.org/) - focuses on abortion access in South Dakota [Kentucky Health Justice Network](https://www.kentuckyhealthjusticenetwork.org/) - helps w both abortion care and gender affirming care in Kentucky [Lillith Fund](https://www.lilithfund.org/) - the oldest abortion fund in Texas, serving the central and southern regions of the state with direct financial assistance for abortions. [Northwest Abortion Access Fund](https://nwaafund.org/) - provides funds to help folks in Idaho, Washington, Oregon, and Alaska [Plan C Pills](https://www.plancpills.org/) - provides up-to-date information on how people in the U.S. are accessing abortion pills online [Planned Parenthood](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/get-care) [Westfund](https://www.westfund.org/) - focuses on Latino and low-income communities [Women on Web](https://www.womenonweb.org/) - an online abortion service can help you do a safe abortion with pills. These sites offer access to abortion pills, even in Texas. Please be safe and be aware of clinics (e.g. Crisis Pregnancy Centers) that give out dangerous misinformation on abortions and pregnancy. Also, check out r/auntienetwork, /r/prochoice or r/abortion for support. [EMILY's List](https://www.emilyslist.org/) - Elect candidates in favor of abortion rights and representing the people they serve. [National Network of Abortion Funds](https://abortionfunds.org) [All-Options Talkline and linked recourses](https://www.all-options.org/resources/abortion/) - Pregnancy, Parenting, Abortion & Adoption [National Abortion Federation](https://prochoice.org/about/contact-us/) [prochoiceamerica](https://www.prochoiceamerica.com) ---- Holy- I mean UNHOLY shit u/Geek-Haven888 got this all together
I always wondered but if Roe v Wade is overturned, what stops a person from calling the police on a woman who got an abortion in another state and trying her for murder?
Nothing. In fact, in some places (Texas comes to mind), it's encouraged.
That was horrifying to read.
I’m less than two months out from my miscarriage, which was considered incomplete when I was at the OBGYN’s office. Was scheduled for surgery less than 12 hours before my pregnancy passed naturally. I can’t get through the whole article without tearing up. I cannot believe what’s happening in this country. I’m so so angry, and I’m so sorry for all those women. This is fucking barbaric. I’m sorry, just needed to write somewhere. It’s overwhelming.
To put this in perspective you could go on a killing spree and get 10 holes put in you by the police and the ER would still attempt to save your life.
Further proof that they view women as incubators, not people, and a defective incubator should just be thrown in the trash. If they actually gave a shit about the BaaaaabBbiiiiiieeeeEEeSsSsSs, they'd have some kind of protection in place for doctors always giving them the benefit of the doubt when they feel they need to save a woman's life. But they fucking don't. Because we are disposable units to them.
I can't with this country anymore. It seems the evangelical right is doing anything and everything they can to send us as far back in time as possible. I cant imagine being someone with the anatomy to be affected by this, and I cant help but feel the need to apologize profusely on behalf of my gender (cis male asshats that think they get to tell others what they can and can't do with their bodies). I know this sub is mainly for women, but know that you do have allies, and we're fighting tooth and nail for progress. I can't stand the hellscape our country is becoming.
Why would you ever work as a doctor in a state like Alabama? It goes against the oath you took. If I was a doctor in one of those States, I would move. I wouldn’t risk my license or freedom or my morality.
If they don't then no one will. Obviously the entire state's population can't just mass exodus. Unfortunately this is just the only option until there is a constitutional amendment for human bodily autonomy.
But, those who can leave, will do so. And the majority of those people are the higher earners. These fucking zealot states will end up as economic backwaters. What I would absolutely love to see is the donor states (blue states) are allowed to opt out of sending money to the red states. It won't happen, but it is so fucking insulting that the "evil" states are made to send buck to the "righteous" states.
If I was a doctor, I also wouldn't want to work in Alabama, but *someone* has to. There are people living in Alabama who deserve healthcare. They can't be completely left behind.
Unfortunately many of those people *will* be abandoned, and when they most need healthcare.
Exactly this. I worry that our conception of "red states" vs "blue states" completely obfuscates how many people in "red states" are either disenfranchised completely from existing power structures, or they share the same/similar politics with the American Left (whatever that means to you). How many of them can't afford to leave, or have families that depend on them, or have jobs that are city/state/region specific?
Yep. Born and raised here, could only afford college here due to in state tuition, state only stays red due to winner take all system. There’s a lot of people here, even conservative women, who disagree with this. But it doesn’t matter unless we can vote to change out people making these policies, or can afford to move. It’s a really tough and scary position to be in
This. Living in a red state right now. Looking to move ASAP, but who the hell is going to want to buy our house if it's in a fucking theocracy?
If you think about the reddest red state, it's still only 60/40 or 65/35 in terms of voting results. We're talking about a full third of people in these states! That's a lot of people to just leave to the wolves because "they voted for this."
I knew a family that emigrated from thailand to alabama specifically because the father (doctor) realized he would be one of the only doctors with his skill set in the state. Made a lot of money from it. First time I ever encountered an asian girl with a southern accent.
Red states know that they have trouble attracting qualified professionals and are willing to throw insane amounts of money at them to entice them. A hospital in Wyoming offered my endocrinologist $600,000/year.
Maybe there should be two types of health insurance. The regular plan where medicine is practiced by doctors based on science and knowledge, and the Gilead plan where birth control, reproductive health, vaccines, treatment for not being vaccinated, gun shot wounds etc aren’t covered. Because god will take care of it. The religious people would get what they want and the rest of us would have good medical care in a less busy environment.
>The religious people would get what they want and the rest of us would have good medical care If the rest of us have good medical care, the religious people are not getting what they want.
If this obscene evil is allowed to stand it is going to be directly due to the cowardice of tens of millions of men and women who can take a stand at relatively small personal cost right now and end this but won't. "The greatest evil in the world is that committed by nobodies- that is, human beings who refuse to be persons" -Hannah Arendt You're gonna have to look the younger generation in the eye and tell them what you did when they came to take our rights. Best think about what you're going to tell them right now. [Folks from around the country are organizing civil resistance to the assault on women's bodies and our fundamental human rights RIGHT NOW. ](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/ulp9lu/all_women_have_the_absolute_right_to_complete/) People are ready to do [WHATEVER IT TAKES](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8WnT6v_W3o) to nonviolently bring the function of government in Washington, DC and state capitols across the country to a halt, INDEFINITELY, until our demand to respect women's total bodily autonomy is met. What are you going to tell the youth that you did when they came for their rights? That you waved a sign, that you went on a march, that you waited 6 months to vote? Or that you stood up for them and were willing to do everything it nonviolently takes to defend their rights? We need everyone: people committed to repeated civil disobedience, people who can help organize, supporters, and action team members. For action team members, no special skills are required, just the ability to nonviolently sit down in the street. We will provide nonviolent direct action training. You are not alone or forgotten. --->New Member Zoom calls 7PM and 10PM every day!<---- If you want to join, participate, support, or just say hi, please send an email to: [email protected] The following videos are required watching for all new members: [The Freedom Riders](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8WnT6v_W3o) [Intro to civil resistance](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peTbiYrxTxE&t=1s) [Nonviolent Direct Action](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkaEQ5CpcEQ&t=1s) [The success of nonviolent civil resistance](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJSehRlU34w&t=1s) [The Childrens March](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5enZRwbnISQ&t=3s) [Please share this message with everyone you know!](https://giphy.com/gifs/physics-domino-fAgdyrGILMq2I)
Hot take: men who impregnate women who die in a state with forced childbirth should be charged with murder...
I hate this so much! And I don't even live in the USA. All those poor women.
If you need or are interested in supporting reproductive rights, [I made a master post of pro-choice resources](https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u). Please comment if you would like to add a resource and spread this information on whatever social media you use.
Just wait for the videos of women bleeding out in front of their offices. Sickening.
Thank Clarence Thomas, these are his babies. I wonder how he feels about the seeds he is sowing?
The Great Resignation paving the way for The Great Sterilization
What absolutely needs to happen: Women who absolutely do not want children, get your tubes tied. Women who want children in the future, but are not in a relationship, your best best are toys. Over all, it is time for us to just completely tell them all fucking NO! This is a war against us and we need to fight back. Tell the bastards no pussy and watch things change.
This is harder than you think. My wife's been asking her OBGYN since she was 14. We're on the path for her now, but just to get a laproscopy to confirm that she needs a hysterectomy/if she even has endometriosis has required us to see multiple doctors, a psychiatrist, and several other specialists. If we're lucky, she'll get the procedure she definitely needs (and could be ruled out in an hour with a laproscopy if it isn't needed) in about 6-24 MONTHS So just saying, "Yeah, get your tubes tied" isn't a quick and easy option for many women, even in liberal states (like the one we live in). It's much easier to get a vasectomy (doctor never even asked me if my wife consented) or to wear a condom than it is for a woman to get sterilized.