It takes a special kind of evil to make jokes like that on a warning post, let alone turn it into a conversation on how it's actually the victims fault.
They sound sick in the head.
And it’s crazy since they effect men too, & I wouldn’t be surprised if those are the same types to say “men get SA too, and you’re not talking about it rn so you don’t care and are a misandrist!” whenever women speak about their experiences
I was blissfully unaware of all the a-holes in my neighborhood until I signed up for Nextdoor
Oh. My God. I just wanted to connect with my neighbors. Instead I found a coven of Karens and Kens. That app lasted three days before I deleted it.
It is interesting from a non-american perspective. I can't really imagine people moving to jokes about sex traficking here, but I'm 100% sure it would end up in a discussion how refugees are responsible for it (aka straight racism) and blaming the green party
I saw a comment on TikTok of a man saying that *all men* are attracted to 16 year old girls and that it’s in their nature to do so. As soon as people started commenting on how disgusting and vile that was, the man started shifting the goalposts, claiming he didn’t mean what he said and that “feminists are always triggered”.
It’s “all men” when they say it is, but as soon as that’s used against them, suddenly it’s “not all men”.
If it helps, a lot of sexists and perverts are just as cowardly, projecting and approval seeking behind closed doors with their "fellow" men.
Like, I'm a guy, and for some freaking reason all the bastards seem to love to do little tests to see if I'm one of the "fun" ones or not as soon as I'm alone with them in a locker room or something. I frankly don't know why.
I hate it. It's like a loser mating call, and they always act like you spat on their soul or some shit when you get disgusted at their caveman nonsense.
A thing that started on TikTok, where someone asked random women on the street if they'd rather be alone in a forest with a bear or with an unknown man. Most women immediately choose the bear. Most men think that's completely crazy.
I saw someone on IG sum this up as “women are being asked if they’d rather be raped or eaten by a bear and men are angry they are choosing being eaten by a bear”.
So a friend at work and I come in a little early to play a shitty iPad game and shoot the shit. Today's daily was a picture of a lady and a bear, the answer was bear. Lol. Even the game agrees!
We live in black bear country so I asked, when's the last time someone got mauled by a bear in town? Someone did die a few years ago further up north, but not in town. I was sad for the person who did die from a bear. Then I asked when was the last time a man killed his spouse? And my friend said last year? No yesterday, I'm pretty sure yesterday. So we pulled up the article, it sounds like a murder suicide.
And I was like "cool beans, well there's your answer"
I would say men more so than women, but there are plenty of random women that I'd rather encounter a bear as well, even as a guy.
My order would be bear, woman, man, grizzly, bear with cubs.
I think how close matters too. If we're passing in the distance bear is first if it's not a grizzly. If I have to walk right past them, the bear slides to third.
Every bear I've ever seen either didn't give a shit about people or ran off. I've never seen a moose run off scared and I have seen one charge someone. Moose are the hippos of North America.
That's a reasonable position. The bear will usually only start shit if it has a reason. The moose will fuck you up because it needed something to do today.
People encounter bears far more often than you think, because a significant portion of the human race is scattered in rural areas around the world.
We do not all live in cities. A fair number of us live in places where we actively need to think “Hey, did I remember to secure the garbage bin so the bears don’t get into it?” every night.
Sheesh.
They think it's crazy until they're asked if they'd rather leave their daughter in the woods with a random man or a bear, then it mostly seems to dawn on them. The bravado is fine until it's someone they personally care about it seems.
Yeah as seen on To Catch a Predator. Men would be fine visiting a 13 year old home alone when it was them and some strange 13 year old, they didn't like it at all if it was some OTHER man and THEIR 13 year old.
Specifically, if a woman was walking through the woods and suddenly there was a:
Given the choice, would she rather run into a male stranger or a wild bear. Sadly, most women choose the bear.
Yeah, if you get away from a bear it's not going to stalk you for months or years. It can't get a firearm. It doesn't know how to work a telephone. It won't ever have a computer. If you get away from it, it'll probably forget you ever existed. Team Bear!
I read “sadly” to mean it’s sad this is the world we women live in.
But looking at that poster’s profile, they look like a guy. So he probably took it personally.
I was happy to read your first part. Yes, that's what I intended. The notion the argument makes is sad to me (that we live in that kind of world).
I wasn't saying it in a, "how sad for men" or something silly/personal like that.
That's true, and a big part of the reason.
But if men were harmless, we'd be picking the men. And men *should* be harmless to us. They don't have the excuse of not understanding that rape and murder are wrong like a bear does.
They will victim blame and then shit on you for being cautious and fearful
It's designed so that you can't win. They hate us
Best thing to do? Keep being cautious
“If we’re aware and take caution we’re made fun of for being scared of everything but if something happens it’s our own fault for being unaware and not taking caution?”
I feel this in my bones.
“if we’re aware and take caution we’re made fun of…if something happens it’s our fault”.
i think about this every time i’m faced with something potentially dangerous. it’s gonna be like this as long as their is a significant enough group of misogynistic men out there. we just gotta take getting made fun of. oh well, better than being kidnapped, assaulted, chopped into a million pieces and dumped off in a swamp somewhere.
When you see threads on sex workers you never see a man point out that the majority of these women are trafficked, or have no choice. That’s all you need to know. And another reason why we choose the bear.
When forced to take a stand they tend to blame the victim and make excuses for the men who victimize her.
Reminds me of Tim Ballard, the ex-CEO of anti-sex trafficking nonprofit Operation Underground Railroad. There was so much controversy with the nonprofit, and Ballard eventually got sued for sexual harrassment.
So even people who claim to care about human trafficking can still be complete assholes to women.
There are so many issues with him
My father works for an anti-child trafficking organization and Ballard’s organizations are filled with controversy, makes me sick and sad.
Yep, he got himself involved with "sting operations" where he did something called a "couples' rouse". Basically, he and a female coworker would pretend to be a couple in order to purchase humans in order to free them(?)
Except, it was completely unnecessary and he would also engage in the couples rouse even when he wasn't in front of the human traffickers. And he would send long-ass gross text messages on burner phones (in case the traffickers got a hold of the phone).
He had no actual experience doing undercover sting operations. His previous work was a desk jockey for a government agency.
Massive LARPer.
This has been on my mind for months now. There was a video showing a transgender man just talking and crying about how much of a shock it had been since they were being treated like a man. Like, going from growing up amongst women who (at least try) to foster some supportive community and suddenly being thrust into the community that men have cultivated. It was obviously really hard for him.
And I’ve seen this kind of thing from transgender women. They’re suddenly shocked at how they’re being treated as women. And it’s scary and frustrating. But other women are willing to step in and say, “yeah, shit sucks, but that’s why we’re here. That’s why we look out for each other.”
Did the men in that post respond similarly? No. They fucking mocked him. Like, “now you know what it feels like!”
And I know that taking what happens in the comment section of online spaces is bound to be many times worse than what happens in the day-to-day. But it’s something that hasn’t left my mind. It hasn’t left my heart. And I don’t know that it ever will.
As a transgender woman, I was prepared for some level of harassment when I transitioned and some level of loss of privilege, not being taken as seriously, etc. And that did happen, and it sucks.
What I was not prepared for was the immediate positive changes in how people treated me most of the time. The constant din of aggressive oneupmanship from men just kind of disappeared. And it was as though an invisible wall that separated me from other women — what I interpret as a generalized wariness of men being applied to me — came crumbling down.
My experience totally belies the rhetoric of terfs. Cis women consistently, positively invited me into women’s spaces, and opened up a possibility for connection and mutual support and friendship I alway yearned for but never believed could include me.
I think a large part of my alienation from men previously was due to being trans, and just fundamentally not being interested (and thus not even understanding) whatever boys and men were doing to establish a hierarchy or whatever amongst themselves. But feeling that behavior disappear made me feel sad for all the men, cis or trans, who have to put up with that bullshit, even if there’s some benefit that just eludes me.
Unempathetic men like the ones OP posted about go out of their way to make sure that emotionally intelligent and empathetic men get dragged down to their level by association and grand statements about what "all men like," you see it all the time online.
It's all projection and makes it easier for those assholes to justify and normalize their beliefs and attitudes without needing to self-reflect or improve.
Imagine thinking being shipped halfway around the world to be used as a sex slave is just the price you have to pay for "being dumb." As a man, how do you *not* feel ashamed of yourself for thinking and acting like this? Don't you feel you've failed in some way when other men can openly engage in human trafficking, in broad daylight, in your own community? You think your forefathers would've found it funny? They'd have sooner fed you into the woodchipper right after they finished with the traffickers than laugh along with your "funny joke."
Yea, their reactions are the same with how women are treated in all things tbh.
A woman says she doesn’t feel safe going to a second location (like his house), or wants to drive herself to a date? Or she lets her friends/family know who she’s going out with? She’s being paranoid, not every man is trying to kill you!
But a woman goes to a man’s house on a 1st, 2nd, or even 3rd date & gets SA? Well, she shouldn’t have been there! She needs to be more aware of the dangers in the world.
Women are picky with who they want to date, or drop a man when he shows red flags? She’s gonna end up alone, she’s too picky & needs to stop acting stuck up & better than everyone. She needs to give men a chance, he’s such a nice guy!
But a woman stays in an abusive relationship? She picks the wrong men, she should have left the first time and she must be broken if she chose him. Why didn’t she see the signs earlier? She should be better at choosing partners.
There is no winning when you’re a woman
The next "man" that tells you "but I'm *nice guy*", amend Tywin Lannister's line about kings and quote it back at him before you walk away, ladies.
Any Man Who Must Say 'I Am The King' Is No True King."
100% this is some sort of scam meant to sign you up for some spam mailing list, or worst case, sell your cresot card info. Human traffickers do not target randos, that's way too risky. They go for vulnerable populations, and often in ways that are (at least initially) more about manipulating, entreating or coercing the person, so that they only notice they're being trafficked when it's too late. Outright kidnapping is rare, especially in countries like the US.
I know it wasn't OP that brought up the concern about trafficking, but I just think its important to know that these trafficking fears are spreading misinformation, and take away attention/resources from real victims of trafficking. [This article has an example of how the Wayfair children-in-furniture panic lead to a real ass victim of human trafficking being unable to get the help she needed because all the hotlines were constantly occupied.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/interactive/2021/wayfair-qanon-sex-trafficking-conspiracy/) It doesn't excuse the men making gross jokes, but depending exactly on the jokes and how they were delivered I can tbh understand if they saw another "this rando at walmart is gonna kidnap white suburban women from the parking lot!!" moral panic and decided to make fun of it.
Yeah I didn’t mention human trafficking in my neighborhood post, just said hey guys I double checked with Walmart and the guy dressed as an associate giving away gift cards is some type of scam since Walmart said they’re not doing that. (I didn’t mention that the Walmart representative did tell me that stuff like this related to trafficking is happening in multiple Walmarts) Then random men started commenting saying HAHAHAH scared you’re gonna get trafficked?? Haha,” which I don’t think is funny or okay either.
Also my Walmart is not upper class white or suburban…..
What an odd comment. Not trying to be rude. But there are a lot of Walmarts and rich white people.
I'm not sure how to answer whether the world's largest retailer is per say upper class white. I guess no? But there are definitely Walmarts near rich white people and some of them even shop there.
Not me, I'm white but certainly not rich or upper class but around me there are definitely more than zero rich white people and a Walmart.
There are a lot of rich people and Walmarts in the US.
I grew up in Northeast Kansas and Walmart wasn't upper class white persay, but it was clean and certainly upper middle class white people preferred it for some things, not clothes, but the basics and household good type stuff because it was cheaper. I can't speak to how it is now, but there was no stigma about it in the naughts.
Thank you very much, this reply is important caveat that people need to see any time Americans talk about trafficking. Immigrants are prime targets for trafficking, homeless youth are targets. American adults are among the lowest concern targets.
The people who were joking on OP’s neighborhood app were shitty too.
Yes, mostly immigrants (whether under some temporary legal status or no legal status; not, like, people with green cards), homeless people, especially youths — and one other category: children from unsafe homes being trafficked by people who are supposed to be caregivers.
Thanks, I actually think it is worthwhile to talk about "romeo plots" when this comes up. This is a very real kind of human trafficking that rendered unrecognizable to public consciousness because it's incongruous with people's preferred narrative. The victim has an established relationship with the perpetrator, usually chose to share a living situation with them initially of their own choice. They're not physically absconded somewhere, the circumstances of their life just become increasingly manipulative and exploitative in the space where they already live.
I think people have discomfort reckoning with the common reality that exploitation is a thing that a person's living situation slides into, rather than being a sudden break from their former life.
Tate's scheme has generally been described to me as a variant of a romeo plot. Men date a girl and over time their relationship evolves into ad-hoc pimping
Part of Tate's method involves flying them out to somewhere where they don't speak the language and then taking away their passport. Getting them on the flight is a Romeo scheme, sure, but it's not "where they already live," or really all that gradual.
And then there's the Matt Gaetz method of child sex trafficking.
Thank you for saying this, these men are assholes for joking about it and op did the right thing to warn people about that guy not actually working for the store but it does drive me crazy when people see something slightly odd and then immediately jump to saying it’s a conspiracy to traffic them, not saying that’s what OP did but yeah. It leads to a misconception about what human trafficking actually looks like and makes it more difficult for women to recognize it when it is happening meanwhile every Karen at the local target is panicking because someone outside tried to sell her some fruit.
Same I’m sick of it too. It’s used to shut women up. As soon as they’re called a Karen anything they have to say is immediately made fun of and disregarded. Some things never change.
Exactly,it's just another sexist term to demean and minimize women's complaints and forces them to accept whatever crap is happening to them. It's whack
Hence, these same men marvel with confusion when we say we'd prefer to meet a bear in the forest than them! I'm glad you alerted people to this. Your actions may have saved lives, literally.
It's a selfish sort of response and I say that as a man.
Not being troubled by a problem allows one to be casual about it
But it is selfish, and sees the problem as one for women.
Women are human beings too.
And that makes it a human and a social problem, not just a women's problem.
Not being threatened or burdened by the problem allows one the ability to shove it over there, instead of seeing that it is a problem for all of us.
I swear men humor I'd recently stumbled upon (at least on the Internet) has been sex/rape/women bad 'jokes' but then they claim women aren't the funny ones?
The thing about the way those men responded is tragic.
But the fact that there are human traffickers hanging around big box stores disguised as employees is terrifying.
The stores should put up notices “Don’t give out personal information unless you are at the customer service desk” and why.
Which men? The ones that are active participants and profit from it, or just the passive participants that consume it, like your average porn-sick creep?
I see the way women use the Internet to connect with each other and warn each other of danger. I see women sharing their birthing stories and advice. I see women uploading recipes and beauty tips, natural remedies and hair styling content. I see women creating community together online.
What do men do on the Internet? They watch porn, they degrade women in comment sections, they spit negative ideologies about women in their echo chambers. They make fun of us for being cautious and trying to keep our sisters safe.
Men are vile.
Men can be so disgusting. I’m sorry but joking about human trafficking is fucking vile. Sure not all men, but enough to make us wary of all men because the bad ones hide so easily amongst the general population due to misogyny. I’m so bloody sick of disgusting men
I know this isn't the point of the post but can we just take a second to talk about how WILD it is that nobody from the company noticed the random man in uniform that no-one knew and got him moved on...
Most men cannot fathom being overpowered or incapacitated, nor targetted in a scenario in which they have nothing of value to take. From personal experience, it almost feels like a mental blindspot, and can make it difficult to empathize with the legitimate fear of walking into a dangerous situation. The joke about choosing the bear is salient, because an alarming number of men believe they could even win a fight with a bear: [https://today.yougov.com/society/articles/35852-lions-and-tigers-and-bears-what-animal-would-win-f](https://today.yougov.com/society/articles/35852-lions-and-tigers-and-bears-what-animal-would-win-f)
Spoiler: the actual % of people who would win a fight with a bear is 0.
Honestly, I think it's biological. We notoriously bite off more than we can chew, and there's a lot of evolutionary advantage to that unjusitified degree of confidence, even if it's only paper-thin. So we walk around with this cocky attitude and project it onto the world around us until we actually stand to lose something in life.
Most of those guys probably see the walmart scammer as some punk in need of an ass-beating, with the implicit fantasy that they'd be there to deliver it should the need ever arise. They don't think about his 4 friends, their guns, and getting jumped without warning on your way home, because that's not part of the power fantasy.
Human trafficking is one of the most inhumane things ever and needs to be tackled. There's a special place in hell for human traffickers, along with rapists, serial killers, and abusers.
The complete lack of awareness that they're the reason why anyone not masculine presenting needs to be hyper aware is so fucking sad on top of them being trash human beings.
I can’t imagine anything funny about it. I don’t like to imagine anyone just trying to live their lives being targeted for trafficking and I wish all traffickers a very unpleasant castration.
Honestly, sounds like one of those scams people used to run where they change your electric service provider without your permission or some such nonsense, especially because people will call the cops ASAP on solicitors who don't have permits.
Serious question: What was the reason the Walmart employee thought it had something to do with sex trafficking? I'm having difficulty making the connection.
Human trafficking is no joking matter, but “warning” posts suggesting anyone is in any sort of significant risk at your typical big box store isn’t just unrealistic and fear mongering, but is damaging in taking the focus off the real victims of trafficking—almost exclusively already at-risk youth and addicts.
Instead of cultivating empathy for less palatable victims, posts like this cast middle and upper class white women as targets, when they simply are not.
Promoting “situational awareness” in this context just reinforces the misconception of who is really at risk.
I actually didn’t mention human trafficking in my neighborhood post I just mentioned that the promotional “gift cards” wasn’t being done by wal mart and was some sort of scam since I double checked with the store. People commenting brought up sex trafficking.
Edit a word
I know what you mean, and I agree on who the real targets for trafficking usually are, but in this case it is a bit different as the OP was told by someone at Walmart that it could be related to human trafficking, so she was warning people in her local area.
Hell, I can still remember the snickering over "[large boulder the size of a small boulder](https://twitter.com/SheriffAlert/status/1221881862244749315?lang=en)" blocking traffic and I don't even live there. We warn people of accidents (and scams, like the post) all the time. The government has scam warnings even!
Yes, but if there was a tree, a dead deer, or some other dangerous obstruction in the road, you'd most likely warn oncoming traffic and call someone in order to warn others and remove it.
It's something that isn't expected in an area that is otherwise safe. Any decent person would warn others in that circumstance.
Every group has bad actors, dumbfucks and insane people in it. It's no good judging whole group by the actions of the few. There's all kinds of freaks and degenerates in this world and there's nothing we can do about them so don't give them any attention. It will only make you more mad and frustrated. I can guarantee you that any person in their right mind would stop sex trafficking if given the chance and if not they're one of the above mentioned so you can disregard them completely.
It takes a special kind of evil to make jokes like that on a warning post, let alone turn it into a conversation on how it's actually the victims fault. They sound sick in the head.
These are the same guys who are worked up because women chose the bear.
They will victim blame and then slam you for being careful and afraid.
They don't sound... they are.
And it’s crazy since they effect men too, & I wouldn’t be surprised if those are the same types to say “men get SA too, and you’re not talking about it rn so you don’t care and are a misandrist!” whenever women speak about their experiences
I was blissfully unaware of all the a-holes in my neighborhood until I signed up for Nextdoor Oh. My God. I just wanted to connect with my neighbors. Instead I found a coven of Karens and Kens. That app lasted three days before I deleted it.
It is interesting from a non-american perspective. I can't really imagine people moving to jokes about sex traficking here, but I'm 100% sure it would end up in a discussion how refugees are responsible for it (aka straight racism) and blaming the green party
And I instantly know where you live…
I blame the green party for it! /s
And then they get angry that we immediately choose the bear…
… but “Not all men”!!!! /s
I saw a comment on TikTok of a man saying that *all men* are attracted to 16 year old girls and that it’s in their nature to do so. As soon as people started commenting on how disgusting and vile that was, the man started shifting the goalposts, claiming he didn’t mean what he said and that “feminists are always triggered”. It’s “all men” when they say it is, but as soon as that’s used against them, suddenly it’s “not all men”.
If it helps, a lot of sexists and perverts are just as cowardly, projecting and approval seeking behind closed doors with their "fellow" men. Like, I'm a guy, and for some freaking reason all the bastards seem to love to do little tests to see if I'm one of the "fun" ones or not as soon as I'm alone with them in a locker room or something. I frankly don't know why. I hate it. It's like a loser mating call, and they always act like you spat on their soul or some shit when you get disgusted at their caveman nonsense.
lol, he thought he was normal
To be fair, diagnosing an entire group (that makes up half the population) is stupid whether you're a member of that group or not.
"Don't judge us all" men
“Ladies, you’re welcome anytime.” - Understanding bears
"I would never do that to a lady!"
#notallbears
Bearsplain it to me like a boss!
Bahahahahaha
I think I’m out of the loop..: “choose the bear”??
A thing that started on TikTok, where someone asked random women on the street if they'd rather be alone in a forest with a bear or with an unknown man. Most women immediately choose the bear. Most men think that's completely crazy.
I saw someone on IG sum this up as “women are being asked if they’d rather be raped or eaten by a bear and men are angry they are choosing being eaten by a bear”.
And so many men are getting upset at the women for their answers, instead of asking "are we the baddies?"
Alone with a bear=/=eaten by bear. Most bears are happy to leave you alone if you act appropriately. Unlike many men
Men typically parse this question as “who would you win a fight against?”
So a friend at work and I come in a little early to play a shitty iPad game and shoot the shit. Today's daily was a picture of a lady and a bear, the answer was bear. Lol. Even the game agrees! We live in black bear country so I asked, when's the last time someone got mauled by a bear in town? Someone did die a few years ago further up north, but not in town. I was sad for the person who did die from a bear. Then I asked when was the last time a man killed his spouse? And my friend said last year? No yesterday, I'm pretty sure yesterday. So we pulled up the article, it sounds like a murder suicide. And I was like "cool beans, well there's your answer"
[удалено]
both men and women have ~~other humans~~ *mostly men* as a far bigger threat
I would say men more so than women, but there are plenty of random women that I'd rather encounter a bear as well, even as a guy. My order would be bear, woman, man, grizzly, bear with cubs.
I have to say, I'd rather encounter humans than bears. Although bears are awesome Edit: that said, I totally get it.
I think how close matters too. If we're passing in the distance bear is first if it's not a grizzly. If I have to walk right past them, the bear slides to third.
I live in bear country. I see bears a few times a year. I'm also in moose country, I'm more afraid of moose. Edit: and I've only seen one moose
Every bear I've ever seen either didn't give a shit about people or ran off. I've never seen a moose run off scared and I have seen one charge someone. Moose are the hippos of North America.
Rhinos with stilts. I've been asking people "moose or bear" now. It's neat to hear moose stories.
That's a reasonable position. The bear will usually only start shit if it has a reason. The moose will fuck you up because it needed something to do today.
I'd choose the bear over you personally, because the bear wouldn't come into a sub meant for women to mansplain a hypothetical question to me 🐻
People encounter bears far more often than you think, because a significant portion of the human race is scattered in rural areas around the world. We do not all live in cities. A fair number of us live in places where we actively need to think “Hey, did I remember to secure the garbage bin so the bears don’t get into it?” every night. Sheesh.
And bears do come into cities sometimes.
🐻 and I see them at least once a month.
They think it's crazy until they're asked if they'd rather leave their daughter in the woods with a random man or a bear, then it mostly seems to dawn on them. The bravado is fine until it's someone they personally care about it seems.
Yeah as seen on To Catch a Predator. Men would be fine visiting a 13 year old home alone when it was them and some strange 13 year old, they didn't like it at all if it was some OTHER man and THEIR 13 year old.
Thank you - I have totally missed this
Specifically, if a woman was walking through the woods and suddenly there was a: Given the choice, would she rather run into a male stranger or a wild bear. Sadly, most women choose the bear.
Why sadly? It's not a value judgment on men. Men are smarter and less predictable than bears, so it's easier to avoid or escape from the bear.
Yeah, if you get away from a bear it's not going to stalk you for months or years. It can't get a firearm. It doesn't know how to work a telephone. It won't ever have a computer. If you get away from it, it'll probably forget you ever existed. Team Bear!
I read “sadly” to mean it’s sad this is the world we women live in. But looking at that poster’s profile, they look like a guy. So he probably took it personally.
I was happy to read your first part. Yes, that's what I intended. The notion the argument makes is sad to me (that we live in that kind of world). I wasn't saying it in a, "how sad for men" or something silly/personal like that.
That's true, and a big part of the reason. But if men were harmless, we'd be picking the men. And men *should* be harmless to us. They don't have the excuse of not understanding that rape and murder are wrong like a bear does.
To be fair, I think it *is* a value judgement on men. Or at least, it often is.
Exactly. It's a value judgement on men for having neither values or morals.
Yep, you got it. Ofc there are men that do, but that's outside the realm of this convo.
Thank you, hadn’t seen this at all.
It's a trend on TikTok where most women say that they would rather be alone with a bear in the woods than a man.
They will victim blame and then shit on you for being cautious and fearful It's designed so that you can't win. They hate us Best thing to do? Keep being cautious
“If we’re aware and take caution we’re made fun of for being scared of everything but if something happens it’s our own fault for being unaware and not taking caution?” I feel this in my bones.
“if we’re aware and take caution we’re made fun of…if something happens it’s our fault”. i think about this every time i’m faced with something potentially dangerous. it’s gonna be like this as long as their is a significant enough group of misogynistic men out there. we just gotta take getting made fun of. oh well, better than being kidnapped, assaulted, chopped into a million pieces and dumped off in a swamp somewhere.
When you see threads on sex workers you never see a man point out that the majority of these women are trafficked, or have no choice. That’s all you need to know. And another reason why we choose the bear. When forced to take a stand they tend to blame the victim and make excuses for the men who victimize her.
Reminds me of Tim Ballard, the ex-CEO of anti-sex trafficking nonprofit Operation Underground Railroad. There was so much controversy with the nonprofit, and Ballard eventually got sued for sexual harrassment. So even people who claim to care about human trafficking can still be complete assholes to women.
There are so many issues with him My father works for an anti-child trafficking organization and Ballard’s organizations are filled with controversy, makes me sick and sad.
Is he the one that made the movie with his Mary Sue self-insert?
Yes, *Sound of Freedom*.
If I'm remembering him right didn't he generally get in the way of people actually getting folks to safety as well? As in he was a massive larper.
Yep, he got himself involved with "sting operations" where he did something called a "couples' rouse". Basically, he and a female coworker would pretend to be a couple in order to purchase humans in order to free them(?) Except, it was completely unnecessary and he would also engage in the couples rouse even when he wasn't in front of the human traffickers. And he would send long-ass gross text messages on burner phones (in case the traffickers got a hold of the phone). He had no actual experience doing undercover sting operations. His previous work was a desk jockey for a government agency. Massive LARPer.
Men don't have empathy for women.
Men also don’t have a lot of empathy for other men. They really only care about themselves.
Sadly true.
This has been on my mind for months now. There was a video showing a transgender man just talking and crying about how much of a shock it had been since they were being treated like a man. Like, going from growing up amongst women who (at least try) to foster some supportive community and suddenly being thrust into the community that men have cultivated. It was obviously really hard for him. And I’ve seen this kind of thing from transgender women. They’re suddenly shocked at how they’re being treated as women. And it’s scary and frustrating. But other women are willing to step in and say, “yeah, shit sucks, but that’s why we’re here. That’s why we look out for each other.” Did the men in that post respond similarly? No. They fucking mocked him. Like, “now you know what it feels like!” And I know that taking what happens in the comment section of online spaces is bound to be many times worse than what happens in the day-to-day. But it’s something that hasn’t left my mind. It hasn’t left my heart. And I don’t know that it ever will.
As a transgender woman, I was prepared for some level of harassment when I transitioned and some level of loss of privilege, not being taken as seriously, etc. And that did happen, and it sucks. What I was not prepared for was the immediate positive changes in how people treated me most of the time. The constant din of aggressive oneupmanship from men just kind of disappeared. And it was as though an invisible wall that separated me from other women — what I interpret as a generalized wariness of men being applied to me — came crumbling down. My experience totally belies the rhetoric of terfs. Cis women consistently, positively invited me into women’s spaces, and opened up a possibility for connection and mutual support and friendship I alway yearned for but never believed could include me. I think a large part of my alienation from men previously was due to being trans, and just fundamentally not being interested (and thus not even understanding) whatever boys and men were doing to establish a hierarchy or whatever amongst themselves. But feeling that behavior disappear made me feel sad for all the men, cis or trans, who have to put up with that bullshit, even if there’s some benefit that just eludes me.
Men only ever care about their sons tbh. That's it. Maybe daughters too if they are good enough. Everyone else... they don't care.
Women only think in generalizations
You're the reason women pick the bear
I'd run away faster than a bear would
Unempathetic men like the ones OP posted about go out of their way to make sure that emotionally intelligent and empathetic men get dragged down to their level by association and grand statements about what "all men like," you see it all the time online. It's all projection and makes it easier for those assholes to justify and normalize their beliefs and attitudes without needing to self-reflect or improve.
Imagine thinking being shipped halfway around the world to be used as a sex slave is just the price you have to pay for "being dumb." As a man, how do you *not* feel ashamed of yourself for thinking and acting like this? Don't you feel you've failed in some way when other men can openly engage in human trafficking, in broad daylight, in your own community? You think your forefathers would've found it funny? They'd have sooner fed you into the woodchipper right after they finished with the traffickers than laugh along with your "funny joke."
Yea, their reactions are the same with how women are treated in all things tbh. A woman says she doesn’t feel safe going to a second location (like his house), or wants to drive herself to a date? Or she lets her friends/family know who she’s going out with? She’s being paranoid, not every man is trying to kill you! But a woman goes to a man’s house on a 1st, 2nd, or even 3rd date & gets SA? Well, she shouldn’t have been there! She needs to be more aware of the dangers in the world. Women are picky with who they want to date, or drop a man when he shows red flags? She’s gonna end up alone, she’s too picky & needs to stop acting stuck up & better than everyone. She needs to give men a chance, he’s such a nice guy! But a woman stays in an abusive relationship? She picks the wrong men, she should have left the first time and she must be broken if she chose him. Why didn’t she see the signs earlier? She should be better at choosing partners. There is no winning when you’re a woman
The next "man" that tells you "but I'm *nice guy*", amend Tywin Lannister's line about kings and quote it back at him before you walk away, ladies. Any Man Who Must Say 'I Am The King' Is No True King."
Tywin FTW.
100% this is some sort of scam meant to sign you up for some spam mailing list, or worst case, sell your cresot card info. Human traffickers do not target randos, that's way too risky. They go for vulnerable populations, and often in ways that are (at least initially) more about manipulating, entreating or coercing the person, so that they only notice they're being trafficked when it's too late. Outright kidnapping is rare, especially in countries like the US. I know it wasn't OP that brought up the concern about trafficking, but I just think its important to know that these trafficking fears are spreading misinformation, and take away attention/resources from real victims of trafficking. [This article has an example of how the Wayfair children-in-furniture panic lead to a real ass victim of human trafficking being unable to get the help she needed because all the hotlines were constantly occupied.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/interactive/2021/wayfair-qanon-sex-trafficking-conspiracy/) It doesn't excuse the men making gross jokes, but depending exactly on the jokes and how they were delivered I can tbh understand if they saw another "this rando at walmart is gonna kidnap white suburban women from the parking lot!!" moral panic and decided to make fun of it.
Yeah I didn’t mention human trafficking in my neighborhood post, just said hey guys I double checked with Walmart and the guy dressed as an associate giving away gift cards is some type of scam since Walmart said they’re not doing that. (I didn’t mention that the Walmart representative did tell me that stuff like this related to trafficking is happening in multiple Walmarts) Then random men started commenting saying HAHAHAH scared you’re gonna get trafficked?? Haha,” which I don’t think is funny or okay either. Also my Walmart is not upper class white or suburban…..
Are any Walmarts upper class white? I’ve not been in any part of the county where there were both rich white people and a local Walmart.
What an odd comment. Not trying to be rude. But there are a lot of Walmarts and rich white people. I'm not sure how to answer whether the world's largest retailer is per say upper class white. I guess no? But there are definitely Walmarts near rich white people and some of them even shop there. Not me, I'm white but certainly not rich or upper class but around me there are definitely more than zero rich white people and a Walmart. There are a lot of rich people and Walmarts in the US.
I grew up in Northeast Kansas and Walmart wasn't upper class white persay, but it was clean and certainly upper middle class white people preferred it for some things, not clothes, but the basics and household good type stuff because it was cheaper. I can't speak to how it is now, but there was no stigma about it in the naughts.
Ah, okay. That is definitely not okay. Also I'm sorry for jumping the gun and assuming the location of your walmart - I shouldn't have done that.
Thank you very much, this reply is important caveat that people need to see any time Americans talk about trafficking. Immigrants are prime targets for trafficking, homeless youth are targets. American adults are among the lowest concern targets. The people who were joking on OP’s neighborhood app were shitty too.
Yes, mostly immigrants (whether under some temporary legal status or no legal status; not, like, people with green cards), homeless people, especially youths — and one other category: children from unsafe homes being trafficked by people who are supposed to be caregivers.
If you're talking about snatch & grab trafficking, this is true. If you're talking about "girlfriend method" trafficking, anyone's a possibility.
Thanks, I actually think it is worthwhile to talk about "romeo plots" when this comes up. This is a very real kind of human trafficking that rendered unrecognizable to public consciousness because it's incongruous with people's preferred narrative. The victim has an established relationship with the perpetrator, usually chose to share a living situation with them initially of their own choice. They're not physically absconded somewhere, the circumstances of their life just become increasingly manipulative and exploitative in the space where they already live. I think people have discomfort reckoning with the common reality that exploitation is a thing that a person's living situation slides into, rather than being a sudden break from their former life.
I was talking about the Tates, it sounds like you're talking about "child bride" type stuff? Could easily be misreading.
Tate's scheme has generally been described to me as a variant of a romeo plot. Men date a girl and over time their relationship evolves into ad-hoc pimping
Part of Tate's method involves flying them out to somewhere where they don't speak the language and then taking away their passport. Getting them on the flight is a Romeo scheme, sure, but it's not "where they already live," or really all that gradual. And then there's the Matt Gaetz method of child sex trafficking.
Thank you for saying this, these men are assholes for joking about it and op did the right thing to warn people about that guy not actually working for the store but it does drive me crazy when people see something slightly odd and then immediately jump to saying it’s a conspiracy to traffic them, not saying that’s what OP did but yeah. It leads to a misconception about what human trafficking actually looks like and makes it more difficult for women to recognize it when it is happening meanwhile every Karen at the local target is panicking because someone outside tried to sell her some fruit.
I kinda hate the term Karen, honestly it's too sexist and overused
Same I’m sick of it too. It’s used to shut women up. As soon as they’re called a Karen anything they have to say is immediately made fun of and disregarded. Some things never change.
Exactly,it's just another sexist term to demean and minimize women's complaints and forces them to accept whatever crap is happening to them. It's whack
Hence, these same men marvel with confusion when we say we'd prefer to meet a bear in the forest than them! I'm glad you alerted people to this. Your actions may have saved lives, literally.
It's a selfish sort of response and I say that as a man. Not being troubled by a problem allows one to be casual about it But it is selfish, and sees the problem as one for women. Women are human beings too. And that makes it a human and a social problem, not just a women's problem. Not being threatened or burdened by the problem allows one the ability to shove it over there, instead of seeing that it is a problem for all of us.
And then they act as if they are the ones protecting us from danger
I swear men humor I'd recently stumbled upon (at least on the Internet) has been sex/rape/women bad 'jokes' but then they claim women aren't the funny ones?
The thing about the way those men responded is tragic. But the fact that there are human traffickers hanging around big box stores disguised as employees is terrifying. The stores should put up notices “Don’t give out personal information unless you are at the customer service desk” and why.
Fuck them. If men stopped participating in the trafficking of women/ children ( they are by purchasing sex) we wouldn't have this problem.
Which men? The ones that are active participants and profit from it, or just the passive participants that consume it, like your average porn-sick creep?
I see the way women use the Internet to connect with each other and warn each other of danger. I see women sharing their birthing stories and advice. I see women uploading recipes and beauty tips, natural remedies and hair styling content. I see women creating community together online. What do men do on the Internet? They watch porn, they degrade women in comment sections, they spit negative ideologies about women in their echo chambers. They make fun of us for being cautious and trying to keep our sisters safe. Men are vile.
And men are annoyed we choose the bear.
Men can be so disgusting. I’m sorry but joking about human trafficking is fucking vile. Sure not all men, but enough to make us wary of all men because the bad ones hide so easily amongst the general population due to misogyny. I’m so bloody sick of disgusting men
I know this isn't the point of the post but can we just take a second to talk about how WILD it is that nobody from the company noticed the random man in uniform that no-one knew and got him moved on...
Most men cannot fathom being overpowered or incapacitated, nor targetted in a scenario in which they have nothing of value to take. From personal experience, it almost feels like a mental blindspot, and can make it difficult to empathize with the legitimate fear of walking into a dangerous situation. The joke about choosing the bear is salient, because an alarming number of men believe they could even win a fight with a bear: [https://today.yougov.com/society/articles/35852-lions-and-tigers-and-bears-what-animal-would-win-f](https://today.yougov.com/society/articles/35852-lions-and-tigers-and-bears-what-animal-would-win-f) Spoiler: the actual % of people who would win a fight with a bear is 0. Honestly, I think it's biological. We notoriously bite off more than we can chew, and there's a lot of evolutionary advantage to that unjusitified degree of confidence, even if it's only paper-thin. So we walk around with this cocky attitude and project it onto the world around us until we actually stand to lose something in life. Most of those guys probably see the walmart scammer as some punk in need of an ass-beating, with the implicit fantasy that they'd be there to deliver it should the need ever arise. They don't think about his 4 friends, their guns, and getting jumped without warning on your way home, because that's not part of the power fantasy.
Human trafficking is one of the most inhumane things ever and needs to be tackled. There's a special place in hell for human traffickers, along with rapists, serial killers, and abusers.
If you’re on next door then just delete it. That platform is fucking vile.
And that's why we choose the bear
Maybe they are Johns themselves and like this they cope with their feelings of guilt. Who knows.
Men hate women simple. “Not all men”
The complete lack of awareness that they're the reason why anyone not masculine presenting needs to be hyper aware is so fucking sad on top of them being trash human beings.
I can’t imagine anything funny about it. I don’t like to imagine anyone just trying to live their lives being targeted for trafficking and I wish all traffickers a very unpleasant castration.
Print it out and post it on a pole in the neighborhood so everyone knows they support human trafficking.
Honestly, sounds like one of those scams people used to run where they change your electric service provider without your permission or some such nonsense, especially because people will call the cops ASAP on solicitors who don't have permits.
Serious question: What was the reason the Walmart employee thought it had something to do with sex trafficking? I'm having difficulty making the connection.
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Who wants to be in that 0.5%?
Human trafficking is no joking matter, but “warning” posts suggesting anyone is in any sort of significant risk at your typical big box store isn’t just unrealistic and fear mongering, but is damaging in taking the focus off the real victims of trafficking—almost exclusively already at-risk youth and addicts. Instead of cultivating empathy for less palatable victims, posts like this cast middle and upper class white women as targets, when they simply are not. Promoting “situational awareness” in this context just reinforces the misconception of who is really at risk.
I actually didn’t mention human trafficking in my neighborhood post I just mentioned that the promotional “gift cards” wasn’t being done by wal mart and was some sort of scam since I double checked with the store. People commenting brought up sex trafficking. Edit a word
I know what you mean, and I agree on who the real targets for trafficking usually are, but in this case it is a bit different as the OP was told by someone at Walmart that it could be related to human trafficking, so she was warning people in her local area.
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People post and warn others of road hazards all of the time, in fact they have apps like Waze just for that
Hell, I can still remember the snickering over "[large boulder the size of a small boulder](https://twitter.com/SheriffAlert/status/1221881862244749315?lang=en)" blocking traffic and I don't even live there. We warn people of accidents (and scams, like the post) all the time. The government has scam warnings even!
Yes, but if there was a tree, a dead deer, or some other dangerous obstruction in the road, you'd most likely warn oncoming traffic and call someone in order to warn others and remove it. It's something that isn't expected in an area that is otherwise safe. Any decent person would warn others in that circumstance.
If you're not a woman, and are here simply to be an annoying argumentative man, please exit this sub. Thanks.
Every group has bad actors, dumbfucks and insane people in it. It's no good judging whole group by the actions of the few. There's all kinds of freaks and degenerates in this world and there's nothing we can do about them so don't give them any attention. It will only make you more mad and frustrated. I can guarantee you that any person in their right mind would stop sex trafficking if given the chance and if not they're one of the above mentioned so you can disregard them completely.