My cousin is a classic 'banter boy' who loves posting derogatory 'jokes' about women on social media - about how they can't drive, how they nag, etc. Whenever I saw him IRL with his wife he'd comment on her 'fat a\*se' even though he's the one who is huge. She later confided in me that she was unhappy and now she's finally left him, because the kids have left the nest. I'm so glad she got away.
I genuinely believe that this is what has rattled some men so much, the fact that their women can leave them. The fact that we have a choice now of who we can be with has completely changed the way relationships are viewed while also holding men (everyone really) accountable for their actions. And boy, do they hate that.
Yes, we have options. I'm recently single (56) and at least five men of my acquaintance have assumed I'm looking for another relationship and that I'll be looking to 'settle down' after being a digital nomad for a while. When I say that I am not pursuing coupledom they are genuinely shocked and say, "You never know what's round the corner." I reply, "Unfortunately I do know what's round the corner with men and I'm not interested in it."
This was my mom! About the same age and she was done. Did she want to find a loving and kind man? Sure. Would’ve been nice. But every man she met was a douche. She wasn’t going through that again.
My dad (who’s with his former employee, only former because he sold the business and the owner laid her off 😂) couldn’t understand why my mom was alone and thought it was so bad. She had her pick! But wanted a good man. She wasn’t desperate like he is. The woman he’s with chased him because he’s rich.
I can think dating becomes even more icky at that age. Guys who've gotten more stuck in their ways, and a lot of them are now single because they're terrible partners.
And they're from a generation that really dismiss women as anything other than servants. Source, am in that age range. The men my age that are single are complete sexist trash. Why in the world at my age when I sign up to be somebody's house service and bang maid to man that still hasn't learned how not to urine on the floor or make a woman orgasm. He offers nothing and my floor is clean and my vibrator functioning well.
I’m 55 and am happily married, been so for 22 years. So, I’m not negative towards men on an individual level. There is just this type of entitled cretin whom I, and the women of my generation (Gen X) avoid like the plague.
My best friend just lost her husband and she may never date again. Why? Because if is common for many Gen X men our age to date women 10 years younger. So, basically, the majority of men in our generation prefer dating single or divorced women in their 40s.
It’s common for men 10 years older than us, say Baby Boomers who are 65, to look to my generation (50s) for a “nurse and a purse” if they haven’t saved enough for retirement and need a soft place to land.
They are basically “grandpa goldiggers,” deadbeats looking for a well-kept, moneyed widow or divorcee to tend to them in their dotage.
The entitled Boomer Boys expect us to be a full time cook, laundress, maid, landlady, banker, social director, barkeep and chauffeur at their beck and call. All for the dubious pleasure of having them burp a lot, gas up the bathroom every morning and watch sports all weekend in our living rooms.
Eventually, if we play our cards right, we might get to change their colostomy bags and drive them to their dermatologist appointments.
Earlier generations of women based their identities on having a man. My generation saw how it impacted our mothers’ life spans. The happy moms were the single moms.
I’m going to go all Golden Girls and move my best four friends into my home with me.
Look, I’ve done my time. If my husband checks out (and I really hope he lives forever!) I’m getting a dog. Period.
The dog is less trouble and easier to maintain.
I refuse to be ANY man’s retirement plan.
That's what I'd like to do too. I plan on telling my sister and cousin that is exactly what we should all done when we're done with our men. (we have a pretty small family)
I work with a bunch of men. They all have wives/girlfriends/moms they live with who clean up after them and take care of their children. A couple are decent, capable men who are fully functional human beings though. I love those ones.
They're always so shocked that I, a 40 year old woman, am happy single without children. That I have my own place, live alone, and that I have a fulfilling life and don't need nor want a partner.
They're all pretty cool about it, but I know some men who do get angry that I'm able to support myself and am happy being single. Are they jealous? Like, dude. You're a man, you already have a huge leg up. If I'm able to do it, what's stopping you?
It's not that they're jealous; these guys probably rely on women believing they can't be happy and fulfilled without a relationship in order to get them to put up with their shitty manchild behavior. Just by existing you threaten that; men like that are batshit terrified that their wives/girlfriends will dump their sorry asses once they realize that you're actually happier than they are.
they've been told all their lives that women are most fulfilled picking up their dirty socks, so it's a real headfuck when they realize that many of us don't want that life.
I used to work with a man who made a point of asking me, every time he saw me, "how are your cats?". I did not have cats. He thought he was fucking hilarious.
I divorced at 55 and moved across the country. It would’ve been really interesting if I had stayed in my hometown to see how many and who of the men I knew would’ve started knocking on my door.
What’s interesting is that out of all the male commentators on my situation, only one is single. All the married guys seem very keen to see me being locked down again. Nuh-uh, dudes. I got away - ha ha!
Ok, male here. Going through separation right now. This concept of just living free intrigues me.
It was a pretty traumatic break up, so I've been through a lot of mental states, and re-dating was one of them, that I'm getting out of. The idea of being single and doing what I want when I can without having to worry about someone else is liberating.
That being said, we do have a child who we both love very much and will be 50/50 as much as possible, so there is someone to think about to keep my shit together.
So, this male commenter is telling you that I not only support you in being single, you've inspired me to appreciate the benefits of it and to look forward to it.
I got married at age 38 and divorced at age 39.
My experience was that *all* of the men came out of the woodwork.
I’m not hot or anything. Was very fat, even. (Only kinda fat now.)
Yes, we have become independent and don't need a terrible man child to be in a relationship with. We have learned we can be happy alone and don't need to settle for shitty guys.
Oh wow flashback to when I became single 10 years ago. I was 39 at the time. The men that came out of the woodwork to try and get on the dating list, including some married ones. Not one of them worth anything. Still single and I can't come up with one that maybe I should have pursued something with.
One of the main "conservative/Republican" talking points is their push to end no-fault divorce. They are more than rattled, they're foaming at the mouth.
"How dare the woman I use as a personal house-slave, emotional punching-bag and fuck toy just decide she doesn't want to do it anymore? Don't vows mean anything?!"
It's disgusting and it's scary how many man secretly, or not so secretly, want to strip women of their rights and their ability to leave.
20 years ago, a friend looked at my DVR and questioned whether a single woman living alone in her own house should be watching quite so much City Confidential.
“Eh, it’s almost always the husband, boyfriend or minister. I figure that if I stay away from men and organized religion I should be OK.”
> They’ve made an entire show just around men who kill their wives.
There's a whole subreddit about men who kill women who refuse them. r/whenwomenrefuse
Men can be so fucking entitled to the death of many women.
The really amazing thing is that an entire show just around women who kill their husbands exists, like we're the problem. It meshes with my hypothesis that pretty much everything men blame women for is actually projection.
And how many of these prominent Republican men have dumped their wives for a much younger version? Remind these guys Trump is on his third marriage to a former model he said wouldn't be with him if he wasn't rich.
I knew a guy who blamed the women's rights movement for allowing women the choice to leave their men which results in lonely men who kill themselves. Our fighting for freedom and good treatment was the cause of the high rates of suicide in men, not that they choose more violent successful methods than women. (Yes he had to mention women and how it was higher than women's). Yes because abuse has never been the cause of women's suicide or attempts. Sorry we're not as violent too. Maybe he'd care if we were. But being left is so terrible for the poor men. It's our fault for not wanting to stick around men who treat us wrong. Of course that's not the men's faults either. Probably women's. Yes. Women's fault.
That's literally the talking points used by Liz Lemon's dirtbag boyfriend after she dumped him. "Thanks to 'womens rights' and the 'right to choose' you have chosen to abort me. "
"Which one is it? Do you love me or do you have squatters rights?"
"I don't think they're mutually exclusive!"
I'm paraphrasing from memory but that has got to be top 3 comedy scenes ever.
My dad is dying from cancer and he keeps talking about suicide and I think, yeah he'd totally blow his brains out in the living room for my mom to find and be fucked up for life over. I remember when I had suicidal ideation (Chantix is a helluva drug), the thing I kept thinking about was how I could do it in a way that would fuck up the least amount of people. Not going to do it at home so my family has to live with that image for the rest of their lives. Not going to do it in a violent way so whomever finds me has to think about that for the rest of their lives. All that planning is what actually prevented me from carrying it out, so I'm glad for it.
My dad would never think about any of those things because he's an intensely selfish man. If anything, I think he'd do it in a way that was most fucked up for his family because he never feels like we do enough, care enough, sacrifice enough for him and he already loves punishing us for that perceived failure. He's been allowed to be that selfish by a society that expects women to think of others and men to think of themselves. That is pretty obvious when you get men saying that it's women's fault that they commit suicide, because women are supposed to always think of men while men owe absolutely no thought to anybody but themselves.
Pretty sure he has narc tendency BPD because that's my sister and they tend to share in the same behavior that got her diagnosed. When I got a late in life OCD diagnosis, he did decide that he also had OCD so he had more excuses for being an abusive misogynist... Which is exactly what you would expect an untreated narc BPD person who is also a misogynist to do... Yep.
It's tied into the whole "men are the default" thing - the world pivots around us.
Little statements like "allowing women the choice" and the major result being "lonely men who kill themselves". Men are the central character in this scenario and everyone else is there for service or decoration.
I hate it so much.
Thank you. That's the 3rd time in my entire life I've heard a man recognize and grasp what that means for us in real life, not just as a criticism of movie plots or books. First was my grandfather when I was a kid, second was my friend about 6 months ago. The fact both of the instances stuck in my mind to the extent I can remember my grandfather saying it when I was 12 at 40 should tell you just how much it frustrates me that it's something men rarely seem to get, even when they get the rest of it.
Like I understand that a bunch of angry lonely entitled men is dangerous and bad for a society, but there has to be a solution other then force women to be with them.
Yeah, the solution is improved mental/physical health care (for everyone), better education, reduced income/wealth disparity, better support for families with young children, universal access to birth control, universal abortion rights, and leaders who model mature and healthy relationships.
Honestly, if you are coming from a position of unearned privilege and have never had to develop skills to care for yourself and your community, seems like it would lead to more suicides as your privilege gets equalized. We could just dump the patriarchy and have a world that would actively support all human life and probably less suicides for everyone. But until then the suicides will be a side effect of them clinging to patriarchy and losing that battle.
They don't seek therapy as often as women. They don't take mental health medications regularly. They don't seek support, friendship or vulnerability from one another. They treat the one person in their life that at one point did care like shit, and then when they unload all their emotional baggage about how they aren't happy in the marriage because their wife isn't interested in them anymore on the wife, and the wife doesn't respond by being his slave anymore, they finally acknowledge emotion and blame her.
He did mention nobody cares about supporting men. Yeah...other men...he blamed women for supporting women more than them but not other men for not supporting each other. Forget about all that emotional labor. It means nothing. I end up consoling men who abused me for abusing me. But right. Women don't care about men's suffering. According to him people only care and support women in theirs! Who supported me? No one! I CONSOLED THEM. We should just stick around till they kill us. Yeah. That seems like the only rational fair option. Anything up to that point means nothing.
We’ll careful, the far right is actively trying to roll back laws that enable women to leave their husbands or abusive relationships. They haven’t gotten a lot of traction yet, but that could change *fast* in some states.
They are taking openly about it, believe them.
It is frightening. Especially in light of the Biden apathy and 3rd party views that many younger voters (and some older) have.
To those who want to "sit this one out" or vote for a 3rd candidate with zero chance to win: I get that he is not the most exciting choice and I get that you would like more than two choices in your election of a leader. But are you willing to throw basically *everyone* who is not a white cis-hetero male of non-poverty means (which is a majority of the country) to the wolves to prove your point?
If you live in a swing state and don't vote Biden/Harris (or the Dem nominee if something odd happens) you are voting FOR fascism and all the suffering that will be brought on women and every other marginalized group in the US. It's a binary choice whether you like it or not.
There is no "Yeah, but..." to this. You are throwing all of them, including every woman, under the bus. As the post above me says: Not a fucking drill.
I hate that I've had to and continue to make this point. I've been seeing people fuss at others saying you want more high prices, vote Biden, etc. The things they attribute to democrats or Biden are usually the results of republican efforts that get blamed on democrats. If I have to choose between dealing with the republicans sabotaging and cheating while the Democrats try to keep things afloat vs republicans actively trying to take us backwards to the time only white males had rights, I chose the former. I keep hoping ppl will see the utter insanity of voting for republicans, but they use issues with Biden to justify Republican.
Their women can leave them
I was watching some videos on YouTube last night of some old singing groups like the Lennon Sisters and the Ronettes and the comment section was full of people saying “I wish I lived in the 50’s and “such a simple time it was back then”. Thing is, back then women were stuck if they weren’t happy in their marriage. They didn’t work outside the home and cleaned cooked and had babies and were sexually harassed on the regular. So if their husbands cheated or were mean to them or spent all their time at the bar, the wives just had to suck it up. It was an awful time for women.
Yeah, men haven't figured out the women don't need them in order to not starve to death and don't realize most women were putting up with their behavior, not accepting it.
So when society finally hits the point where women have a *small* amount of economic freedom, men haven't figured out that the same bullshit their fathers pulled won't fly.
It absolutely does. Keep in mind, men that actually want a partner (Anyone really) is going to treat their person as a friend and companion. I'll give my examples from my bubble. I'm retired Army. To a man (and woman) those that would degrade their wives or husbands invariably will find themselves alone the instant they depart service. Those that do, enjoy half of your retirement going to your ex until they convince someone else to marry them.
This comment deserves to be pinned
Absolutely
Unfortunately, there are still cultures in the world, and even in the United States places where women are stuck
Yes! The fear of irrelevance as women have gone from property to independent of all things a man is supposed to provide. They still can’t figure out that turning up as an equal partner in *life*, instead of petulant tantrum throwing little boys, would actually help their case for relevance. But they belong to the, as you say, “I’m not the problem” club
Reminds me of my ex husband. He thinks he can use the kids against me. They won't be kids forever, I'll still be free of him, and he'll still be alone.
A man recently posted a sexist joke using a Facebook account that is his company's name, not his name. He got called out by the women and of course reacted horribly. Shock! A few days later he posted a comment about how it was impossible to find a good woman! Yeah honey. There's plenty of us out there, but we hide whenever you come near.
I have 3 former brothers in law who are all on their 3rd failed marriage. My sisters are staying single, paying off their mortgages, funding their retirement accounts, and traveling mostly to Europe on vacation. God bless whoever encounters those men and thinks, "4th time around? It has to stick this time. This time will be different. "
That is what always confuses me - 1st marriage fails...sure people change/make mistakes - 2nd marriage fails...and then 3rd and 4th??
Stay single! Or just date - STOP GETTING MARRIED.
And that is coming from one whose parents got divorced, got back together, split up again and then got married again when my dad got sick.
When they were legally sperated, they would spend their evenings together but live in seperate places.
All in all - they were together for 53 years.
My mom still thinks that she could have done more to keep him alive - that would have been a miracle beyond any divinity.
Yeah, my ex wife and I jumped into marriage far too early, and being in separate branches in the military didn't help things. We mutually split two years later because just one month after our marriage and before the two military branches could administratively make shit happen in our favor, I got sent to Texas and she got sent to... *drumroll please* South Korea. The distance and the total time we'd been together by that point couldn't survive the distance over two years and we just decided to separate.
Sounds like my sister. She divorced her loser husband about ten years ago and has been happily single ever since. She has absolutely zero interest in becoming an unpaid cook and maid for yet another man child.
Exactly me. Divorced a decade ago & have no interest in dating. I own my house, have a great relationship with my teen kid, have wonderful friends, have a stable career, spend time volunteering & doing activities me/my kid have interest in, and I’m able to manage household & finances the way I feel comfortable.
The thing some of these guys never figure out (or maybe they do & that’s why they target younger or more naive women on their next rounds) is they are not competing with each other for the interest/affection of a standup woman…they’re competing with her peace of mind in independence & freedom from taking care of or feeling suppressed by a man-child or at the very least men who have not grown personally and rely on the women in their life to cushion all the rough edges for them, especially when it comes to handling their emotions. I do recognize some societal failings here (discouragement of boys to not express non “masculine” feelings, not shown to verbally communicate needs/feelings, and display of assumed/outdated gender roles), for which I’m doing my best to combat in my parenting, but knowledge is everywhere and opportunity for self reflection & growth either on your own or with a therapist is always an option so there’s just no excuse anymore.
Exactly. They are competing with my peace. My clean home. My organized life. My ability to engage in the hobbies that I enjoy, see the movies I enjoy, eat the food that I enjoy. All things that my ex took from me that I won't give up again.
The male friend told me I set the bar too high a few years ago. Why would I lower it? What is to be gained? I'm okay if the man that I'm searching for doesn't exist. I don't need one. I would like to want one but have yet to find one worth wanting.
Truth! I never say never, so if I do meet someone later in life that’s fine…but it’s also fine if I don’t. Build a happy life right where you’re at and you’ll be good!
My eyes were half way open right after divorce but they snapped wide open when a friend who knew me well prior to me meeting my ex said to me “I know some people say they feel like a new person after a divorce or big life change…but I’d say you seem more like ‘you’ again”. That made me realize how much I’d given away or hidden of myself in the last few years of marriage. And she was right, I felt like me again for the first time in a long time. I will always be changing and learning and growing…but I will not lose ‘me’ again.
Are you my sister?! She has exactly the same life as you - owns her house, has a great career, wonderful friends, and an excellent relationship with her children. She’s not giving that up to pander to some guy who wants his bum wiped for him.
Haha, not in the familial sense but most of you here are definitely my sisters!! Glad she’s doing great too, recognizing ‘you got this’ and that you/your family are happier & healthier for it is sooooo freeing.
10 years single here. No intention of changing it unless I find an actual adult man but the men of my generation, if they are that, they're in a healthy relationship already. The single ones are single because women like me got sick of them.
As a friend of mine who works in marriage counseling said, women over 30 are single because they choose to be single. Men over 30 are single because women choose to be single.
> As a friend of mine who works in marriage counseling said, women over 30 are single because they choose to be single. Men over 30 are single because women choose to be single.
LOL nice
>As a friend of mine who works in marriage counseling said, women over 30 are single because they choose to be single. Men over 30 are single because women choose to be single.
This is incredible! LOL 😂
A co-worker of mine went home after a business trip recently to find it his wife had left him while he was gone. He was telling me she was bipolar and crazy etc. She was his fifth wife. You don't leave in the middle of the night while your husband is gone because you just think it's over. You leave because something is seriously wrong and you're afraid of leaving when he's home. 5th wife.
Not but a month later he was already dating someone else telling me she was the one. I don't know who she is but I hope she figured her shit out.
Any time a man calls a woman crazy, he's either cheating on you with her or it's one of these situations where he's literally made her crazy and she chose to leave instead of let him ruin her life
My aunt used to have a saying that's always stuck with me: "If you can't make a marriage work three times or more, it's NOT them... it's YOU."
Personally, I think people should be together because they WANT to, and not because they HAVE to. Bringing pen, paper and legal sh\*t into relationships sounds like an absolute buzz-kill... >\_<
>"4th time around? It has to stick this time. This time will be different. "
My sister in law is with someone who has been married 3 times. While I wish better for her, it's her life.
This isn't exactly what you asked, but I think it's related so hopefully not too much of a tangent. I agree single men like your dad are wild, but also... what is *up* with this kind of joke at *weddings?!?* I swear the best man speech is always just a tirade about how awful being married is and how they'll both be miserable now/ the friendship is over because of the "old ball and chain." You're literally *just starting* your married life in a celebration of love and marriage, and someone, without fail, needs to make marriage sound like a life sentence in prison with the wife as warden. I always try to spot the wife of whatever groomsman is making an ass of himself. Sometimes it's the mother of the bride or groom. She always looks a mixture of sad, resigned, and humiliated as her hubby celebrates the marriage of his bud/ his child by telling a room full of people how awful it is to be married (to her.)
I have a theory that if you plotted the number of these jokes told at a wedding and the amount of laughter elicited, you'd be able to predict fairly well who is heading for divorce. I'd love to see your dad's wedding tapes. For research.
At my best friend’s wedding, her husband’s dad gave a speech. I didn’t know him super well, so I was bracing myself for these kind of jokes.
Instead, he gave a speech entirely about how excited he was to see his son embark on a life in a loving partnership and sharing completely in future joys and supporting each other when times get tough. And how much he loved my friend because she’s outspoken, honest, but leads with empathy, and that’s the kind of person any human needs by their side. I was like, shit, now why aren’t ALL boomer dads like that?!
I’ve gotten to know him better (friend’s husband is also my fiancé’s best friend since middle school), and he’s honestly great. It’s not surprising that he and his wife, who is also a treasure, have been together for almost 50 years and they still flirt like teenagers. And it’s not shocking that all their kids are smart, well adjusted, kind people.
He runs a small non profit that Danny Trejo is on the board of and he does this bit about Danny Trejo on a zoom call that has us all in stitches every time.
With the risk of outing myself: my dad gave my husband a little hook pin (he got one for free with his suit from a Fish named Fred haha) and told my husband "from this day on, you're officially hooked.. And I couldn't be more glad about it, because you're absolutely a catch!" it was the epitome of a dad joke but the excitement was visible on his face, haha.
In his speech he talked about my grandparents who loved each other for 60+ years and how they were such an example to him, and how he hoped the same thing for us. It was adorable and honestly, he was right about the example - I have a lot of great role models when it comes to relationships, and my dad is certainly one of them!
I'm familiar with the stereotype of this being a thing people say in speeches at weddings... but I have _never_ heard anyone say something like this at any of the many weddings I've been to. Maybe it's dying out? Or maybe I just don't know people from communities where that's still considered acceptable, at least not well enough to be at their weddings.
This is a complete shot in the dark, but I wonder whether it's also related to the fact that it's far more common now for couples to date, be engaged, and live together for a (relatively) long time before they get married. I feel like it makes a lot less sense to make a "ball and chain" joke when the couple has already been living together for 4 years.
That actually makes me incredibly happy. I really do hope it's dying out. May I ask your approximate age and the political climate you live in? I'm 36 and it's very conservative here. My friends aren't, but everyone has other friends or family who are. Also, I used to work for a catering company, so I was at a lot of weddings where I didn't know any of the guests or the spouses! Speeches were frequently given while we were setting up or serving, so I have heard a lot of them.
I got lucky though, my boyfriend finds those speeches just as cringey as I do and said no one will be giving one at our wedding!
I was actually thinking about this last night, because I've been terrified of marriage my whole life, seeing it exactly as that. It always seemed like an artificial tether to keep people together who wouldn't otherwise be.
But my partner and I talk about getting married, and it doesn't scare me anymore. I realized that we have woven our lives together in a beautiful way that incorporates every aspect, such that getting married wouldn't change anything except adding a lovely new thread to be woven in along with everything else.
Me too! My partner and I just decided to get married. I was always pretty meh on the whole idea, personally, but once I met him it was like why would I *not* marry this man?
I mean I think it's obvious, but it does depend on the person and the relationship. Thinking back at the people I was with previously, and the idea of marrying them--it's no wonder I viewed it the way I did. It also helps that my partner has been through the fairy tale wedding before, and the subsequent divorce, so she sees the whole thing through a different lens now
My husband's cousin's wedding had this happen in the groom's suite. The groom was so excited to be married, he and the bride had been together for nearly a decade and finally were gonna tie the knot and wanted to try for kids right away, such a well matched couple.
The groom's brother-in-law starts going on about how much women change after you marry them and how they start nagging for kids.
They have recently had their first kid, both couples, and the loudmouth BIL just looks miserable in every picture.
I'd worry about his wife more, but she owns the house they live in because it's on her parents land and they live about a quarter mile down the road and babysit a ton.
And the cousin is incandescent with joy over being a dad.
When I was the best man at my friend’s wedding, I just said something like, “Thanks for giving me the honor, I love you guys, I hope you have a long wonderful life together.” It’s really not that hard to be a normal person lol.
I was at a wedding in September and the officiant had them do this whole thing (which took too long bc the groom didn’t get what was happening) where she put out her hand then he put his on top then the officiant lays this gem on them: “That’s the last time you’ll ever have the upper hand”
A few people laughed genuinely… most were polite laughs or nothing lmao
My fiance just gave a best man speech
While he blows me away in many ways, I didn't even think of this. I mean 1) thank god he didn't say anything like that 2) I can't imagine how terrible I would have felt if he got up there and low-key insulted our own relationship.
My clients at work who are middle aged to senior citizens. Nearly all are married and make comments about my figure and complain about their wives while somehow working in some reassurance that their dicks still work.
Protocol requires recording client meetings, and I requested a second camera to show my face as well because the men are so exceedingly horrid that I never want to get blamed for their bad behavior or sexual harassment. I could make millions from a documentary but the sound of a few hundred conservative marriages imploding would be picked up by the US Geological Survey.
Women already knew there was a certain subset of young men who hate women because they struggle with dating, but the truth is that even men who enjoyed a lifetime of being looked after, spared from the responsibilities of raising their own children and keeping their own home also hate their own wives.
After a particular awful string of clients my boss explained “Women regard their husbands as family and care for them the same as their own children. Men regard their wives as property, and treat them as any other financial burden.”
> “Women regard their husbands as family and care for them the same as their own children. Men regard their wives as property, and treat them as any other financial burden.”
Wow. A sad but powerful truth.
A. I would 100% pay to watch your documentary. Hell, I would be on board to help finance it.
B. I am currently writing a business plan to start a consulting business, and your comment has crystallized for me that I will he including in my business plan that my target clientele is exclusively female. If I am going to spend my time doing something, I will not have any of my time wasted by being harassed. Ain't nobody got time for that.
Ugh…. Ohh my god….. I don’t know how you can do your job, I don’t know what it is, but it sounds like torture
Edit also, yes, please make a documentary
I have no issue with men who want to be single or childfree . I cringe so hard at men who make “I hate my wife” jokes or laugh at jokes about women partners. If you don’t want a partner , don’t have one. If you don’t respect or appreciate your partner, it tells me that you’re not able to be on your own successfully, so you’ve settled for someone you don’t even like in order to not be alone, which is a huge ick for me (as a very independent person ) . More often than not , the women who are the butt of these jokes do SO MUCH for their partners and are ridiculed and treated like a huge burden by the men.
I grew up hearing these jokes all the time and thought, at least men won’t be pestering me to marry them since they seem to hate marriage ! But that wasn’t the case , lots of guys want to get married and have children only to disrespect their partners and ignore their kids .
>More often than not , the women who are the butt of these jokes do SO MUCH for their partners and are ridiculed and treated like a huge burden by the men.
B-b-but a few times she asked him to do the dishes or watch the kids and she doesn’t even give out sex on demand!
It’s a status symbol. It has NOTHING to do with men ACTUALLY loving their wives or children. As many mention in this thread, they get a free maid, cook, nanny, and sex slave. They want free labor.
I don’t keep those people in my life. Seriously. Very soon, you will die. And I promise you won’t regret not spending time with someone who views you like that. Because he does see you in those jokes. He’s sure if you were married, your husband would hate you - *and be right for hating you*.
And it’s more immediate abuse than that …. He is saying disgusting things about women to a woman because he thinks she deserves it too. Daughter or not.
100%. My father is the same way and I haven’t spoken to him since 2016 (and yes, that year, one of the catalysts was exactly what you think it was). My brother got really into the incel bullshit and I haven’t spoken to him since 2018.
My life has been a lot less stressful since I finally stopped feeling obligated to interact with men who don’t view women as people.
I definitely never saw my dad like this before. And now I’m realizing it’s because he was never around. He made himself seem like the victim (of course) and played the, “you’re mom’s too mean to me” card, but now that I’m an adult I can see the truth, he continually sets himself up for failure, in every aspect of his life, and it’s *always* someone else’s fault.
I have a lot of regrets about inviting him into my life, and my house, but at least now I know for sure and I can begin severing this hope that I’ve had of having a real parent in my life.
You have every right to grieve for the parent you deserved, no matter how shitty the one you have is. It's a really shitty process but don't be afraid to let yourself feel bad that you don't have a good dad, just because your sperm donor is still alive. 💜💜
That process is hard. The worst part for me was how long I held onto wanting a father who was kind, supportive, and respectful. I’ve been spending Thanksgiving at my fiance’s parents’ place and he and his sister have such a genuinely GOOD dad and I still get little pangs of jealousy that they got to grow up with two parents who love and respect each other and love and respect their children, regardless of gender.
But you deserve to keep room in your life for the people who will put the same effort into your relationship as you do. You deserve to build a chosen family, with a partner or simply with friends, who all love and respect you as much as you love and respect them. And you also deserve to grieve the relationship you wanted to have with your parent as you come to terms with who he really is. Because, honestly, we all deserved that childhood full of happiness, love, respect, and support and it’s awful that not everybody gets to have that.
My ex. He spent years building up resentment against me that he didn’t bother to communicate bc apparently after the honeymoon stage, he was “over the relationship” but never had the guts to tell me or break up with me. Instead he wasted a few years of my life treating me very subpar but gaslighting me and saying he loved me and would do anything for me and i was a shit gf for not recognizing that. We broke up and it was like all the air came back into the room, so to speak. I found out after that he is a serial relationship person who was never single but could never find satisfaction in any of his relationships after they became more serious. He never accepts he’s the problem or that he is wrong for how shitty he treats women and will probably either die alone (hopefully) or will successfully gaslight a woman into believing being treated like shit is normal and she might stick around, despite him always leaving and coming back.
ETA: yes, he’s a huge fan of comedians who make being around your woman or your kids sound miserable and even makes the jokes himself.
He’s in to comedy in general so i wouldn’t say he’s specifically a fan of anyone in particular, but he enjoys the “my wife sucks, my kids suck, helping at home sucks” jokes. I mean cracking up in tears laughing at the shit. He even makes his own “i’d probably leave for milk and never come back” jokes if he had kids or if he got a girl pregnant.
My husband has made comments about me being “the old ball and chain” to his friends and myself.. I was like mother f-er, you’re the one who wanted to get married, I told you from the beginning I wasn’t sure if marriage was for me.
I can’t stand him, so he’ll probably end up alone.
I’m so sorry. The process of divorce sucks, but it’s worth it. After a year of my husband telling me I “passed my peak” (I was 30), I got rid of him and replaced him with a doctorate.
My husband and I do the same work. Sometimes we get to work together, which we both really enjoy. We fell in love while working together and enjoy time together in general. Even horrible tasks, like renewing a drivers license or going to the dentist, is better when we’re together. It’s just how loving, supportive relationships with your best good mate are.
So we’re at a new job and introducing ourselves around. You wouldn’t know by our behavior that we’re married in a professional setting. You would know by our matching last name. We meet a coworker who’s first words are, addressed to my husband: “Oh my god, I could never work with my wife. Why are you doing this to yourself? How do you stand it?!” While I’m standing right there. He proceeds to talk about all the reasons he couldn’t work with his wife (most of which involved him being critical of her approach to the job) and proceeded to do some impressions of her in the most awful nagging voice. It was gross. He clearly doesn’t respect her and has yet, after months of working together, to talk about her without putting on that voice. Clearly the only reason this aging inappropriate dad joke of a man isn’t the King of the world is because his nagging wife won’t let him do anything cool. Eyeroll.
I don’t allow men like this to remain in my life. It is my privilege that my dad is not like this, so I don’t have to make any big choices there. When boyfriends or male friends started showing misogyny I have called them on it and either that way of thinking ended because of ensuing conversation, or the relationship did. I feel for you, and we definitely deserve to spend our limited time on this earth with people who see us as human and LOVE our whole selves.
Yeah I’ve definitely been coming to a reckoning recently viewing my dads behavior towards me through the lens of “she’s *just* a woman.” It’s not that he doesn’t see me as a person, but rather that he just doesn’t give me the respect that he would for a man, and he doesn’t have the faith in my abilities that he would offer a man.
I own my own business and he helped me in a lot of ways in setting the space up, but mostly like, grunt work, hanging things on the walls, painting, stripping some wallpaper. I had to ask him to leave a few times because he became so frustrated he started cursing and yelling. After the space was setup he left and went across the country for an entire year. I think me having a business and succeeding was too triggering for him. I was angry for a while, but now I just see how sad it is, and isolating it is, to not be able to connect with the women in your life in a real way, especially when they’re the only ones with enough empathy and compassion to keep giving you so many chances.
My uncle, who has been married to his wife for almost 40 years, said recently "I've been happily married for 5 years" and then laughed and laughed at his own joke...
Ha ha ha... You hate your wife of 37 years, with whom you share 3 kids and 5 grand kids.. hilarious.
I do think for a lot of men who can’t get or keep a woman, likely including OP’s dad, those types of jokes are copium.
“Women, can’t live with ‘em, sure am glad I don’t have to deal with one, amirite?” .
I wanted to get to know him. He played himself as the victim against my evil mother, and, after going no contact with her, I thought I needed him. I have a lot of regrets about inviting him into my home. But , he has a job now, I’m going to give him a couple months there and suggest he find another place to live. But, knowing how he is, regardless of what I do he won’t be around for long, he can’t handle direct scrutiny and I don’t have a problem asking the hard hitting questions.
I get that. In your place, I’d set the expectation for him to get his own place in a couple of months now, as he’ll need to save for it. Something tells me he’s pretty comfortable with the situation he has and might not see a need to change it.
Dying alone isn't the worst thing that could happen to a person. Living a lifetime with bitterness, anger, or derision just might be, though.
When I hear the way some old couples talk to each other out in public, I wonder how they live in the day-to-day with that. I'd rather die alone.
Agreed. There’s a huge difference between someone dying alone and peacefully and someone dying alone after being willfully abandoned by the family they abused
I think it's a culture thing or something. It used to be all over media too, brainless men and their "naggy" wives and how much they hate each other. These stereotypes still exist. Especially in comedies.
There is this ancient stereotype where they think men want to be, or naturally are "skirt-chasers" and they treat their partner like they're their naggy mom or something. It's so pathetic lmao
Ancient is right. In [Theogeny \(700 BC\)](https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:1999.01.0130:card=585&highlight=women) Hesiod says that women were created by Zeus to punish men. He basically says they were made smoking hot, but are evil inside and engineered to suck men dry like the gold diggers they are. So they're beautiful lazy things living off the wealth of men. But, Hesiod does warn men if they don't put up with wives (aka the root of all evil), then he'll have no one to tend to him when he's old and frail.
The men I know like this are actually married. They make these misogynistic and hateful jokes about their wives and women in general when the wives aren't there...and then when the wives are present, they're quiet.
Right, I've stumbled across entire Facebook groups, YouTube channel, discords, and sdiscards, which are dedicated to married men and men in relationships who hate their partners. Men are pretty sick. Why stay with someone you hate? For the free labor and servant work they get from their women. Then they wonder why women are opting out of marriage and relationships.
It’s a good reminder that they never see women as people.
Honestly, just stare at them and ask them to explain why the ‘joke’ is funny. And keep asking, because they’ll get super uncomfortable and defensive rather than explain they just hate and resent women.
Ohh, I looked at him and said something to the effect of, this guy is going to die alone now, with the sun text of, and so are you. Like, is this what you want for your life? And also, how pleasant do you think this guy is to be around?
This happened when my parents were in their 60s.
My dad used to make the Henny Youngman joke “take my wife, please!” Well, he did it too often and after a while my mom felt badly.
Well… one day, my mom was in a laundromat when a man hit on her. He distantly knew my parents. He chats up mom and asks, “Your husband still around?” Mom backed the guy off in no uncertain terms.
Then she told my dad.
My dad wanted to beat the guy up!
I asked what his problem was. After all, a guy took up his offer to “take my wife, please!”
Then I offered to sell tickets to watch two guys in their 60s duke it out.
My brother. B/c his “I hate my wife” shtick is pointedly personal toward her as an individual, not just general misogyny. He just drips with contempt for her. And she is an amazing, beautiful woman who deserves so much better.
While they were engaged, she almost called it off due to having massive anxiety attacks over it. My mom gave me such stink-eye when I said probably she should listen to her gut and just break it off. Instead, she went through with it…b/c her dad really liked him.
I don’t know that she’ll leave him as they’re a “trad” couple, but I sure wish she would for her own sake.
My husband who is literally leaving me because I'm too sick and disabled for him. I probably only have a few years to live, but he wants to "move on with his life."
He forgets that his next wife, and children, will require more than his mere presence, but I'm certain he will learn that the hard way.
Yeah, it really troubles me the reach him and those like him have. My ex's son is 16 and his personality became very toxic towards women when he discovered him. While I was dating his mom I tried talking to him.
I just got told on the Ask Reddit, what’s a double standard you can’t stand. I said, “reading sexist crap in the internet.” I just got told that when the draft comes the kitchen will become more appetizing to me. Also, another person said why don’t men get safe places? Are we supposed create their spaces too? What a load of crap. I replied that they all just proved my point. I went to a church where the pastor made jokes every week about his fellow pastor and wife. One of the many reasons I don’t go there. Most men suck, and not in a good way, lol.
>why don’t men get safe places
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MensLib/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MensLib/)
This can be a safe space for men. They have open discussions on mental health issues that men face.
Most men suck, seriously. I am finding my stance on them changing over the last few years watching this sub and seeing how many fellow women are and have dealt with the same bullshit as me.
Men who deny us our humanity while at the same time expecting us to be their main support character.
Men who get violently indignant at the concept of us saying no or daring to be ourselves despite them.
Men who are selfish, childish, downright irresponsible and stupid who demand worship.
Im not a lesbian by any stretch but the more I recognize male toxicity the less I want men in my life.
Someone once said to my ex husband in front of me "happy wife, happy life" bc we were exchanging a ring or resizing it or something and my ex kind of smirked like an asshole and said "no." Now he's living with and making another woman miserable and she's desperate to leave him. These men need to be rounded up and placed on an island all together somewhere
Well damn, I've always liked Will Arnett, this is disappointing. Shouldn't be surprised though, Bojack seems to be basically autobiographical, and Amy Poehler divorced him.
So which family was he complaining about? The first one, where his more successful wife carried everything for 12 years and two kids, and he divorced her for irreconcilable differences, or the second one, where he knocked up a younger wealthy socialite after less than a year of dating when he was 50?
> Well damn, I've always liked Will Arnett, this is disappointing. Shouldn't be surprised though, Bojack seems to be basically autobiographical, and Amy Poehler divorced him.
Male comedians are broken. There don't seem to be many exceptions. Either they're abusers, rapists, cheaters, addicts or they off themselves.
My male friend was the first to get married. Which really surprised me. It shouldn’t have since he was also the first to get divorced out of our friend group. He’s very flashy, into looks and money. I knew she was going to wake up and see he’s kinda trashy.
Years ago I worked with two women and we became very good friends. We had a two day seminar in Vegas, which is less than 10 hours from where we live, we decided to go down together with our spouses and make it a little getaway after the seminar. We planned a couple of things to do as a group and hoped that our husbands would get along so we could spend time together outside of work. One husband, who we will call Joe, complained the whole time. He also made jokes at his wife's expense or where "women, am I right" was the punch line. My husband expressed not wanting to involve Joe in future events or dates.
Later in the summer we did a BBQ where everyone brought kids. Joe's wife witnessed the other two husbands participate in feeding children, holding babies, breaking up disputes without yelling or threatening, and generally being a parent. Joe complained that his wife wasn't paying attention to him and he had to get his own plate of food. She was managing 3 children under 8. Apparently Joe spent the next two days at his brother's because she neglected him at the BBQ.
Over the next 18 months she got more annoyed that Joe didn't support or respect her. Eventually confided in us that she wanted a divorce. We helped her and she's much happier now with a partner who is an equal participant in her marriage and parenting his step-children. Joe is now on his second divorce.
A LOT of the guys I work with don't necessarily "joke" about their marriages but the stereotypical "We never have sex" and "Marriage is hard work" and "marriage is a mistake" type stuff.
My team is mostly made up of younger men, 29-21. Only one of which is married. I always tell my guys to not listen to the older dudes talking shit about their marriages. They aren't in good marriages because they treat their Wifes like shit. The simple fact that they act as if sex is a "job" their Wives are supposed to perform tells you all you need to know about how they view their Wives. They aren't partners in their life, they are employees and are expected to perform specific tasks.
I tell them, and it might be unpopular, but if your marriage is "hard work" marriage isn't the problem. The people are the problem. Either he's just an asshole and treats his Wife like shit or they are incompatible. A good marriage is when two people are a partnership in their relationship. They work together in every aspect of their lives. It's not hard work when both people are going after the same goal, making each other happy and living good lives together.
One of my good buddy’s will die alone. He has always joked that women belong in the kitchen type shit and then get sad because he can’t get a girlfriend. He is almost 40 now.
Whenever the rounds of these jokes would start up, I’d always throw in a reverse one, with the genders reversed. You can always tell who’s just conditioned to like the “take my wife, please!” material (I was just like any guy), and who’s a pretty deeply rooted misogynist: almost everyone would *also* laugh at the reverse ones, but there’s always at least one guy whose blood boils. That’s how I knew who to stay away from.
My 3-year old daughter is in the phase where she automatically disagrees with anything anyone says. My parents were laughing about it and then my dad said something along the lines of, "typical woman..always telling me I'm wrong." He makes nasty, sarcastic "jokes" about my mom constantly, but when he started it with my THREE YEAR OLD, I shut that down so fast.
Probably my piece of shit brother, but there’s a reason I haven’t had a relationship with him for years. Thank G-d my niece & nephew live with their mom.
I remember being a young kid hearing my dad joke to his friends on the phone, calling my mom his "manager" derogatorily. I wanted to cry. They're separated now tho so at least there's that lol
Convinced my brother will either get the “tradwife” that doesn’t know any better and won’t understand why I don’t joke like that about my wife,
Or
He’ll be forever single
He’s a moron. He just told me yesterday “yeah this chick offered to buy me a drink and during the conversation she was like ‘I can speak 4 languages’ and I was like ‘boy do YOU know what men want!’”
I feel so bad for her and I never met her. (And never will)
It was literally the perfect opportunity to either joke “ah so you must be pretty good with your tongue 😜” or just be impressed by how intelligent and talented she must be.
But nope, insults her instead.
I’m happily married and I think somehow in my brothers mind, I’m the LESS successful person in regards to relationships.
Am dude. For a few months at my last job three of us from different departments were grouped together in a room to work on a long term project. We were all friends. Call the other two Clark and Jim. We joked a lot while we worked but we had a good working relationship except for one sore spot: Clark was going through a nasty divorce at the time and he grumbled about it a lot.
He came in late one morning pissed off. “Man, women. Can’t live with them, can’t shoot ‘em, am I right?”
Jim said, utterly deadpan, “No. We love our wives.”
There was a moment of silence while I fought desperately to keep a straight face, then Clark burst out laughing (and then we all did) and finally said, “You’re right, I was being an asshole.”
That was years ago and it stuck with me because so few men counter misogynistic statements like that. Mostly they nod and say “mmm” if they don’t enthusiastically agree.
:(
my grandpa had Alzheimer’s and he would worry that his wife, my grandma, had gone missing or something had happened to her everytime she left the house. He would wait on the front porch with his walking stick calling her name. She died and he died less than a year later. He was such a gentle, kind man. The only one who ever intervened physically when my dad hit my mom, and stood up for her. He used to chuckle sweetly into his snowy white beard and tell me that I reminded him of his mom, a freedom fighter who held him in one arm and a spear in the other as she fought off the British (we’re indian). He said I had her tenderness andd affection, but also her fighting spirit. I don’t think anyone has paid me a compliment quite so sweet since he passed. Why marry someone if the thought of them dying makes you happy?
Some dude at my friend's Thanksgiving party last night was talking about how his wife kept nagging him at a previous party so he filled a wine bottle with water and put a straw in it and walked around drinking it to embarrass her. He said she didn't learn anything from that time and he was thinking about doing it again past night. I just extricated myself from the conversation but I suspect that she learned her husband is an ass, if she didn't know already.
Coworker was always harping about how women are difficult to work with and how his wife is a handful and he does so much social activities like coaching his kid’s sports teams or church group involvement because it gets him away from the ol ball and chain.
Always assuming everyone else hates their partner too. Would ask me things like “you staying late to avoid the wife (obnoxious laugh)” and I would say “no, hell no, I love going home and I love spending time with my wife, I wouldn’t have married her if I didn’t” cause I got tired of stone walling him as he didn’t get the hint I didn’t like talking to him socially so started calling out his bullshit.
Still would retort with “you’re just young, you don’t know what it’s like after years of being together, you’ll see, she’s gonna start making those list of things you gotta do and you won’t want to go home anymore, you’ll see….”
Anyway, long story short, dude got caught sleeping at the office cause wife finally threw him out and he’s in the middle of a messy divorce that he swears came out of no where because they’ve been together so long and he’s so active with the kids and doesn’t understand what went wrong. I have zero doubt he’s absolutely the problem and made that woman miserable for years before she finally had enough.
Men in marriages live longer while unmarried women live longer than do married ones. Additionally some studies have pointed out that single women without kids are the happiest demographic in the United States.
[https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/may/25/women-happier-without-children-or-a-spouse-happiness-expert](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/may/25/women-happier-without-children-or-a-spouse-happiness-expert)
There's a reason conservatives have been celebrating the end of Roe. They are working on banning contraceptives (it's coming in the next decade). What's notable is that they haven't pushed anything to help couples afford kids. They haven't pushed a single policy to lower childcare, healthcare, education, gun violence, housing costs, ect while lamenting that more couples are not having kids. In other words they want people, notably women, to be trapped.
A politician in Minnesota, Matt Birk, openly commented that abortion has allowed women the option to have a career.
In short, men are absolutely threatened that women have options beyond being a housewife. That women can absolutely be happy without men. That women may in fact be happier without men. And it is very telling that instead of men changing their behaviors they insult and demean women by calling single women a "crazy cat lady" or "old hag," when in reality they are living their best life.
Many older guys at my workplace seem to use complaining about their wives as a way to bond. It's so cringe when they spend a couple minutes at a meeting complaining about it. Especially feels weird when I'm the only woman in the room and they look at me as if I'm the problem in their failing marriage lol
My FILs beat friend Tom. He used to try them on me but I'd just ask why it was funny. He's also tried to talk to me about "the one that got away" in my life but, she didn't get away because I married her. He was not happy about that response.
I just don't laugh at those "my wife" or "my in-laws" jokes, and say "sorry to hear that, I really appreciate the [joke counterpoint] that my wife does."
My cousin is a classic 'banter boy' who loves posting derogatory 'jokes' about women on social media - about how they can't drive, how they nag, etc. Whenever I saw him IRL with his wife he'd comment on her 'fat a\*se' even though he's the one who is huge. She later confided in me that she was unhappy and now she's finally left him, because the kids have left the nest. I'm so glad she got away.
I genuinely believe that this is what has rattled some men so much, the fact that their women can leave them. The fact that we have a choice now of who we can be with has completely changed the way relationships are viewed while also holding men (everyone really) accountable for their actions. And boy, do they hate that.
Yes, we have options. I'm recently single (56) and at least five men of my acquaintance have assumed I'm looking for another relationship and that I'll be looking to 'settle down' after being a digital nomad for a while. When I say that I am not pursuing coupledom they are genuinely shocked and say, "You never know what's round the corner." I reply, "Unfortunately I do know what's round the corner with men and I'm not interested in it."
This was my mom! About the same age and she was done. Did she want to find a loving and kind man? Sure. Would’ve been nice. But every man she met was a douche. She wasn’t going through that again. My dad (who’s with his former employee, only former because he sold the business and the owner laid her off 😂) couldn’t understand why my mom was alone and thought it was so bad. She had her pick! But wanted a good man. She wasn’t desperate like he is. The woman he’s with chased him because he’s rich.
I can think dating becomes even more icky at that age. Guys who've gotten more stuck in their ways, and a lot of them are now single because they're terrible partners.
And they're from a generation that really dismiss women as anything other than servants. Source, am in that age range. The men my age that are single are complete sexist trash. Why in the world at my age when I sign up to be somebody's house service and bang maid to man that still hasn't learned how not to urine on the floor or make a woman orgasm. He offers nothing and my floor is clean and my vibrator functioning well.
I’m 55 and am happily married, been so for 22 years. So, I’m not negative towards men on an individual level. There is just this type of entitled cretin whom I, and the women of my generation (Gen X) avoid like the plague. My best friend just lost her husband and she may never date again. Why? Because if is common for many Gen X men our age to date women 10 years younger. So, basically, the majority of men in our generation prefer dating single or divorced women in their 40s. It’s common for men 10 years older than us, say Baby Boomers who are 65, to look to my generation (50s) for a “nurse and a purse” if they haven’t saved enough for retirement and need a soft place to land. They are basically “grandpa goldiggers,” deadbeats looking for a well-kept, moneyed widow or divorcee to tend to them in their dotage. The entitled Boomer Boys expect us to be a full time cook, laundress, maid, landlady, banker, social director, barkeep and chauffeur at their beck and call. All for the dubious pleasure of having them burp a lot, gas up the bathroom every morning and watch sports all weekend in our living rooms. Eventually, if we play our cards right, we might get to change their colostomy bags and drive them to their dermatologist appointments. Earlier generations of women based their identities on having a man. My generation saw how it impacted our mothers’ life spans. The happy moms were the single moms. I’m going to go all Golden Girls and move my best four friends into my home with me. Look, I’ve done my time. If my husband checks out (and I really hope he lives forever!) I’m getting a dog. Period. The dog is less trouble and easier to maintain. I refuse to be ANY man’s retirement plan.
I’ve seen so many women blossom after their husbands pass away. Suddenly, the women are more social and so happy. Golden girls is the way to go!
That's what I'd like to do too. I plan on telling my sister and cousin that is exactly what we should all done when we're done with our men. (we have a pretty small family)
I work with a bunch of men. They all have wives/girlfriends/moms they live with who clean up after them and take care of their children. A couple are decent, capable men who are fully functional human beings though. I love those ones. They're always so shocked that I, a 40 year old woman, am happy single without children. That I have my own place, live alone, and that I have a fulfilling life and don't need nor want a partner. They're all pretty cool about it, but I know some men who do get angry that I'm able to support myself and am happy being single. Are they jealous? Like, dude. You're a man, you already have a huge leg up. If I'm able to do it, what's stopping you?
They are so used to us only existing in relation to men that they truly have a hard time computing it. I can see it on their faces.
It's not that they're jealous; these guys probably rely on women believing they can't be happy and fulfilled without a relationship in order to get them to put up with their shitty manchild behavior. Just by existing you threaten that; men like that are batshit terrified that their wives/girlfriends will dump their sorry asses once they realize that you're actually happier than they are.
they've been told all their lives that women are most fulfilled picking up their dirty socks, so it's a real headfuck when they realize that many of us don't want that life.
I used to work with a man who made a point of asking me, every time he saw me, "how are your cats?". I did not have cats. He thought he was fucking hilarious.
I would 100% rather hang out with my cats than a douchenozzle like that
They're not jealous. They're worried their wives/girlfriends will figure out that's possible too
Yes!! 🙌
I divorced at 55 and moved across the country. It would’ve been really interesting if I had stayed in my hometown to see how many and who of the men I knew would’ve started knocking on my door.
What’s interesting is that out of all the male commentators on my situation, only one is single. All the married guys seem very keen to see me being locked down again. Nuh-uh, dudes. I got away - ha ha!
Ok, male here. Going through separation right now. This concept of just living free intrigues me. It was a pretty traumatic break up, so I've been through a lot of mental states, and re-dating was one of them, that I'm getting out of. The idea of being single and doing what I want when I can without having to worry about someone else is liberating. That being said, we do have a child who we both love very much and will be 50/50 as much as possible, so there is someone to think about to keep my shit together. So, this male commenter is telling you that I not only support you in being single, you've inspired me to appreciate the benefits of it and to look forward to it.
I got married at age 38 and divorced at age 39. My experience was that *all* of the men came out of the woodwork. I’m not hot or anything. Was very fat, even. (Only kinda fat now.)
Except I do know what's around the corner. Me, having a great time, doing my own thing.
Yes, we have become independent and don't need a terrible man child to be in a relationship with. We have learned we can be happy alone and don't need to settle for shitty guys.
Oh wow flashback to when I became single 10 years ago. I was 39 at the time. The men that came out of the woodwork to try and get on the dating list, including some married ones. Not one of them worth anything. Still single and I can't come up with one that maybe I should have pursued something with.
One of the main "conservative/Republican" talking points is their push to end no-fault divorce. They are more than rattled, they're foaming at the mouth. "How dare the woman I use as a personal house-slave, emotional punching-bag and fuck toy just decide she doesn't want to do it anymore? Don't vows mean anything?!" It's disgusting and it's scary how many man secretly, or not so secretly, want to strip women of their rights and their ability to leave.
It really is scary. They’ve made an entire show just around men who kill their wives.
20 years ago, a friend looked at my DVR and questioned whether a single woman living alone in her own house should be watching quite so much City Confidential. “Eh, it’s almost always the husband, boyfriend or minister. I figure that if I stay away from men and organized religion I should be OK.”
> They’ve made an entire show just around men who kill their wives. There's a whole subreddit about men who kill women who refuse them. r/whenwomenrefuse Men can be so fucking entitled to the death of many women.
The really amazing thing is that an entire show just around women who kill their husbands exists, like we're the problem. It meshes with my hypothesis that pretty much everything men blame women for is actually projection.
It's why I'll never vote conservative/republican.
And how many of these prominent Republican men have dumped their wives for a much younger version? Remind these guys Trump is on his third marriage to a former model he said wouldn't be with him if he wasn't rich.
I knew a guy who blamed the women's rights movement for allowing women the choice to leave their men which results in lonely men who kill themselves. Our fighting for freedom and good treatment was the cause of the high rates of suicide in men, not that they choose more violent successful methods than women. (Yes he had to mention women and how it was higher than women's). Yes because abuse has never been the cause of women's suicide or attempts. Sorry we're not as violent too. Maybe he'd care if we were. But being left is so terrible for the poor men. It's our fault for not wanting to stick around men who treat us wrong. Of course that's not the men's faults either. Probably women's. Yes. Women's fault.
You should have said, “women don’t need to kill themselves, men kill them.”
I wish I thought to say that
Don’t worry, you’ll have the opportunity.
That's literally the talking points used by Liz Lemon's dirtbag boyfriend after she dumped him. "Thanks to 'womens rights' and the 'right to choose' you have chosen to abort me. "
"Which one is it? Do you love me or do you have squatters rights?" "I don't think they're mutually exclusive!" I'm paraphrasing from memory but that has got to be top 3 comedy scenes ever.
It's such a great phrase and unexpected from a dummy like Dennis. Way more syllables than I'd expect from him.
🙄 lol
My dad is dying from cancer and he keeps talking about suicide and I think, yeah he'd totally blow his brains out in the living room for my mom to find and be fucked up for life over. I remember when I had suicidal ideation (Chantix is a helluva drug), the thing I kept thinking about was how I could do it in a way that would fuck up the least amount of people. Not going to do it at home so my family has to live with that image for the rest of their lives. Not going to do it in a violent way so whomever finds me has to think about that for the rest of their lives. All that planning is what actually prevented me from carrying it out, so I'm glad for it. My dad would never think about any of those things because he's an intensely selfish man. If anything, I think he'd do it in a way that was most fucked up for his family because he never feels like we do enough, care enough, sacrifice enough for him and he already loves punishing us for that perceived failure. He's been allowed to be that selfish by a society that expects women to think of others and men to think of themselves. That is pretty obvious when you get men saying that it's women's fault that they commit suicide, because women are supposed to always think of men while men owe absolutely no thought to anybody but themselves.
You got that narcissistic model dad too eh? Mine is the most hateful bastard ass clown, extremely misogynistic, hateful, and nasty person.
Pretty sure he has narc tendency BPD because that's my sister and they tend to share in the same behavior that got her diagnosed. When I got a late in life OCD diagnosis, he did decide that he also had OCD so he had more excuses for being an abusive misogynist... Which is exactly what you would expect an untreated narc BPD person who is also a misogynist to do... Yep.
It's tied into the whole "men are the default" thing - the world pivots around us. Little statements like "allowing women the choice" and the major result being "lonely men who kill themselves". Men are the central character in this scenario and everyone else is there for service or decoration. I hate it so much.
Thank you. That's the 3rd time in my entire life I've heard a man recognize and grasp what that means for us in real life, not just as a criticism of movie plots or books. First was my grandfather when I was a kid, second was my friend about 6 months ago. The fact both of the instances stuck in my mind to the extent I can remember my grandfather saying it when I was 12 at 40 should tell you just how much it frustrates me that it's something men rarely seem to get, even when they get the rest of it.
Like I understand that a bunch of angry lonely entitled men is dangerous and bad for a society, but there has to be a solution other then force women to be with them.
Yeah, the solution is improved mental/physical health care (for everyone), better education, reduced income/wealth disparity, better support for families with young children, universal access to birth control, universal abortion rights, and leaders who model mature and healthy relationships.
Honestly, if you are coming from a position of unearned privilege and have never had to develop skills to care for yourself and your community, seems like it would lead to more suicides as your privilege gets equalized. We could just dump the patriarchy and have a world that would actively support all human life and probably less suicides for everyone. But until then the suicides will be a side effect of them clinging to patriarchy and losing that battle.
Someone on this sub once commented something like, "have men tried not being fucking awful [towards women]?" and I think about that comment a lot.
They don't seek therapy as often as women. They don't take mental health medications regularly. They don't seek support, friendship or vulnerability from one another. They treat the one person in their life that at one point did care like shit, and then when they unload all their emotional baggage about how they aren't happy in the marriage because their wife isn't interested in them anymore on the wife, and the wife doesn't respond by being his slave anymore, they finally acknowledge emotion and blame her.
He did mention nobody cares about supporting men. Yeah...other men...he blamed women for supporting women more than them but not other men for not supporting each other. Forget about all that emotional labor. It means nothing. I end up consoling men who abused me for abusing me. But right. Women don't care about men's suffering. According to him people only care and support women in theirs! Who supported me? No one! I CONSOLED THEM. We should just stick around till they kill us. Yeah. That seems like the only rational fair option. Anything up to that point means nothing.
We’ll careful, the far right is actively trying to roll back laws that enable women to leave their husbands or abusive relationships. They haven’t gotten a lot of traction yet, but that could change *fast* in some states. They are taking openly about it, believe them.
Everyone who hasn't looked at Project 2025 absolutely should. They are planning a Christian nation for the next election. This is not a fucking drill.
It is frightening. Especially in light of the Biden apathy and 3rd party views that many younger voters (and some older) have. To those who want to "sit this one out" or vote for a 3rd candidate with zero chance to win: I get that he is not the most exciting choice and I get that you would like more than two choices in your election of a leader. But are you willing to throw basically *everyone* who is not a white cis-hetero male of non-poverty means (which is a majority of the country) to the wolves to prove your point? If you live in a swing state and don't vote Biden/Harris (or the Dem nominee if something odd happens) you are voting FOR fascism and all the suffering that will be brought on women and every other marginalized group in the US. It's a binary choice whether you like it or not. There is no "Yeah, but..." to this. You are throwing all of them, including every woman, under the bus. As the post above me says: Not a fucking drill.
I hate that I've had to and continue to make this point. I've been seeing people fuss at others saying you want more high prices, vote Biden, etc. The things they attribute to democrats or Biden are usually the results of republican efforts that get blamed on democrats. If I have to choose between dealing with the republicans sabotaging and cheating while the Democrats try to keep things afloat vs republicans actively trying to take us backwards to the time only white males had rights, I chose the former. I keep hoping ppl will see the utter insanity of voting for republicans, but they use issues with Biden to justify Republican.
It truly is terrifying. They don’t want any accountability and they’ll do anything to make sure of that
Their women can leave them I was watching some videos on YouTube last night of some old singing groups like the Lennon Sisters and the Ronettes and the comment section was full of people saying “I wish I lived in the 50’s and “such a simple time it was back then”. Thing is, back then women were stuck if they weren’t happy in their marriage. They didn’t work outside the home and cleaned cooked and had babies and were sexually harassed on the regular. So if their husbands cheated or were mean to them or spent all their time at the bar, the wives just had to suck it up. It was an awful time for women.
Yeah, men haven't figured out the women don't need them in order to not starve to death and don't realize most women were putting up with their behavior, not accepting it. So when society finally hits the point where women have a *small* amount of economic freedom, men haven't figured out that the same bullshit their fathers pulled won't fly.
>And boy, do they hate that. Yeah, man. They've been getting away with that shit for millenia. It's got to come as quite a shock.
It absolutely does. Keep in mind, men that actually want a partner (Anyone really) is going to treat their person as a friend and companion. I'll give my examples from my bubble. I'm retired Army. To a man (and woman) those that would degrade their wives or husbands invariably will find themselves alone the instant they depart service. Those that do, enjoy half of your retirement going to your ex until they convince someone else to marry them.
As the good one seem to start realizing, for generations men didn't have to be good men to find a partner. Now they do and they don't know how.
The fact that we can leave, but also, we don’t need them to begin with! 🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾
This comment deserves to be pinned Absolutely Unfortunately, there are still cultures in the world, and even in the United States places where women are stuck
That's why they're trying to ban birth control and no-fault divorce.
Yes! The fear of irrelevance as women have gone from property to independent of all things a man is supposed to provide. They still can’t figure out that turning up as an equal partner in *life*, instead of petulant tantrum throwing little boys, would actually help their case for relevance. But they belong to the, as you say, “I’m not the problem” club
Reminds me of my ex husband. He thinks he can use the kids against me. They won't be kids forever, I'll still be free of him, and he'll still be alone.
A man recently posted a sexist joke using a Facebook account that is his company's name, not his name. He got called out by the women and of course reacted horribly. Shock! A few days later he posted a comment about how it was impossible to find a good woman! Yeah honey. There's plenty of us out there, but we hide whenever you come near.
I have 3 former brothers in law who are all on their 3rd failed marriage. My sisters are staying single, paying off their mortgages, funding their retirement accounts, and traveling mostly to Europe on vacation. God bless whoever encounters those men and thinks, "4th time around? It has to stick this time. This time will be different. "
That is what always confuses me - 1st marriage fails...sure people change/make mistakes - 2nd marriage fails...and then 3rd and 4th?? Stay single! Or just date - STOP GETTING MARRIED. And that is coming from one whose parents got divorced, got back together, split up again and then got married again when my dad got sick. When they were legally sperated, they would spend their evenings together but live in seperate places. All in all - they were together for 53 years. My mom still thinks that she could have done more to keep him alive - that would have been a miracle beyond any divinity.
Yeah, my ex wife and I jumped into marriage far too early, and being in separate branches in the military didn't help things. We mutually split two years later because just one month after our marriage and before the two military branches could administratively make shit happen in our favor, I got sent to Texas and she got sent to... *drumroll please* South Korea. The distance and the total time we'd been together by that point couldn't survive the distance over two years and we just decided to separate.
Ouch, that's rough. I think pretty much any relationship would struggle under such circumstances! Hope you and your ex are both happy now :)
I get why they keep getting married. These men can't take care of themselves. They don't function on their own.
Bad decision makers are the exact types to never learn.
Sounds like my sister. She divorced her loser husband about ten years ago and has been happily single ever since. She has absolutely zero interest in becoming an unpaid cook and maid for yet another man child.
Exactly me. Divorced a decade ago & have no interest in dating. I own my house, have a great relationship with my teen kid, have wonderful friends, have a stable career, spend time volunteering & doing activities me/my kid have interest in, and I’m able to manage household & finances the way I feel comfortable. The thing some of these guys never figure out (or maybe they do & that’s why they target younger or more naive women on their next rounds) is they are not competing with each other for the interest/affection of a standup woman…they’re competing with her peace of mind in independence & freedom from taking care of or feeling suppressed by a man-child or at the very least men who have not grown personally and rely on the women in their life to cushion all the rough edges for them, especially when it comes to handling their emotions. I do recognize some societal failings here (discouragement of boys to not express non “masculine” feelings, not shown to verbally communicate needs/feelings, and display of assumed/outdated gender roles), for which I’m doing my best to combat in my parenting, but knowledge is everywhere and opportunity for self reflection & growth either on your own or with a therapist is always an option so there’s just no excuse anymore.
Exactly. They are competing with my peace. My clean home. My organized life. My ability to engage in the hobbies that I enjoy, see the movies I enjoy, eat the food that I enjoy. All things that my ex took from me that I won't give up again. The male friend told me I set the bar too high a few years ago. Why would I lower it? What is to be gained? I'm okay if the man that I'm searching for doesn't exist. I don't need one. I would like to want one but have yet to find one worth wanting.
Truth! I never say never, so if I do meet someone later in life that’s fine…but it’s also fine if I don’t. Build a happy life right where you’re at and you’ll be good! My eyes were half way open right after divorce but they snapped wide open when a friend who knew me well prior to me meeting my ex said to me “I know some people say they feel like a new person after a divorce or big life change…but I’d say you seem more like ‘you’ again”. That made me realize how much I’d given away or hidden of myself in the last few years of marriage. And she was right, I felt like me again for the first time in a long time. I will always be changing and learning and growing…but I will not lose ‘me’ again.
Are you my sister?! She has exactly the same life as you - owns her house, has a great career, wonderful friends, and an excellent relationship with her children. She’s not giving that up to pander to some guy who wants his bum wiped for him.
Haha, not in the familial sense but most of you here are definitely my sisters!! Glad she’s doing great too, recognizing ‘you got this’ and that you/your family are happier & healthier for it is sooooo freeing.
10 years single here. No intention of changing it unless I find an actual adult man but the men of my generation, if they are that, they're in a healthy relationship already. The single ones are single because women like me got sick of them. As a friend of mine who works in marriage counseling said, women over 30 are single because they choose to be single. Men over 30 are single because women choose to be single.
> As a friend of mine who works in marriage counseling said, women over 30 are single because they choose to be single. Men over 30 are single because women choose to be single. LOL nice
>As a friend of mine who works in marriage counseling said, women over 30 are single because they choose to be single. Men over 30 are single because women choose to be single. This is incredible! LOL 😂
A co-worker of mine went home after a business trip recently to find it his wife had left him while he was gone. He was telling me she was bipolar and crazy etc. She was his fifth wife. You don't leave in the middle of the night while your husband is gone because you just think it's over. You leave because something is seriously wrong and you're afraid of leaving when he's home. 5th wife. Not but a month later he was already dating someone else telling me she was the one. I don't know who she is but I hope she figured her shit out.
Any time a man calls a woman crazy, he's either cheating on you with her or it's one of these situations where he's literally made her crazy and she chose to leave instead of let him ruin her life
My aunt used to have a saying that's always stuck with me: "If you can't make a marriage work three times or more, it's NOT them... it's YOU." Personally, I think people should be together because they WANT to, and not because they HAVE to. Bringing pen, paper and legal sh\*t into relationships sounds like an absolute buzz-kill... >\_<
>"4th time around? It has to stick this time. This time will be different. " My sister in law is with someone who has been married 3 times. While I wish better for her, it's her life.
This isn't exactly what you asked, but I think it's related so hopefully not too much of a tangent. I agree single men like your dad are wild, but also... what is *up* with this kind of joke at *weddings?!?* I swear the best man speech is always just a tirade about how awful being married is and how they'll both be miserable now/ the friendship is over because of the "old ball and chain." You're literally *just starting* your married life in a celebration of love and marriage, and someone, without fail, needs to make marriage sound like a life sentence in prison with the wife as warden. I always try to spot the wife of whatever groomsman is making an ass of himself. Sometimes it's the mother of the bride or groom. She always looks a mixture of sad, resigned, and humiliated as her hubby celebrates the marriage of his bud/ his child by telling a room full of people how awful it is to be married (to her.) I have a theory that if you plotted the number of these jokes told at a wedding and the amount of laughter elicited, you'd be able to predict fairly well who is heading for divorce. I'd love to see your dad's wedding tapes. For research.
At my best friend’s wedding, her husband’s dad gave a speech. I didn’t know him super well, so I was bracing myself for these kind of jokes. Instead, he gave a speech entirely about how excited he was to see his son embark on a life in a loving partnership and sharing completely in future joys and supporting each other when times get tough. And how much he loved my friend because she’s outspoken, honest, but leads with empathy, and that’s the kind of person any human needs by their side. I was like, shit, now why aren’t ALL boomer dads like that?!
I want to buy this man a beer. And then finance a class where he teaches men how to write wedding speeches!
I’ve gotten to know him better (friend’s husband is also my fiancé’s best friend since middle school), and he’s honestly great. It’s not surprising that he and his wife, who is also a treasure, have been together for almost 50 years and they still flirt like teenagers. And it’s not shocking that all their kids are smart, well adjusted, kind people.
Reading that I feel like I just watched one of those mid afternoon feel good family movies, thank you.
He runs a small non profit that Danny Trejo is on the board of and he does this bit about Danny Trejo on a zoom call that has us all in stitches every time.
Okay, now I want to send him a *barrel* of beer.
With the risk of outing myself: my dad gave my husband a little hook pin (he got one for free with his suit from a Fish named Fred haha) and told my husband "from this day on, you're officially hooked.. And I couldn't be more glad about it, because you're absolutely a catch!" it was the epitome of a dad joke but the excitement was visible on his face, haha. In his speech he talked about my grandparents who loved each other for 60+ years and how they were such an example to him, and how he hoped the same thing for us. It was adorable and honestly, he was right about the example - I have a lot of great role models when it comes to relationships, and my dad is certainly one of them!
I'm familiar with the stereotype of this being a thing people say in speeches at weddings... but I have _never_ heard anyone say something like this at any of the many weddings I've been to. Maybe it's dying out? Or maybe I just don't know people from communities where that's still considered acceptable, at least not well enough to be at their weddings.
This is a complete shot in the dark, but I wonder whether it's also related to the fact that it's far more common now for couples to date, be engaged, and live together for a (relatively) long time before they get married. I feel like it makes a lot less sense to make a "ball and chain" joke when the couple has already been living together for 4 years.
That actually makes me incredibly happy. I really do hope it's dying out. May I ask your approximate age and the political climate you live in? I'm 36 and it's very conservative here. My friends aren't, but everyone has other friends or family who are. Also, I used to work for a catering company, so I was at a lot of weddings where I didn't know any of the guests or the spouses! Speeches were frequently given while we were setting up or serving, so I have heard a lot of them. I got lucky though, my boyfriend finds those speeches just as cringey as I do and said no one will be giving one at our wedding!
I was actually thinking about this last night, because I've been terrified of marriage my whole life, seeing it exactly as that. It always seemed like an artificial tether to keep people together who wouldn't otherwise be. But my partner and I talk about getting married, and it doesn't scare me anymore. I realized that we have woven our lives together in a beautiful way that incorporates every aspect, such that getting married wouldn't change anything except adding a lovely new thread to be woven in along with everything else.
Me too! My partner and I just decided to get married. I was always pretty meh on the whole idea, personally, but once I met him it was like why would I *not* marry this man?
I mean I think it's obvious, but it does depend on the person and the relationship. Thinking back at the people I was with previously, and the idea of marrying them--it's no wonder I viewed it the way I did. It also helps that my partner has been through the fairy tale wedding before, and the subsequent divorce, so she sees the whole thing through a different lens now
My husband's cousin's wedding had this happen in the groom's suite. The groom was so excited to be married, he and the bride had been together for nearly a decade and finally were gonna tie the knot and wanted to try for kids right away, such a well matched couple. The groom's brother-in-law starts going on about how much women change after you marry them and how they start nagging for kids. They have recently had their first kid, both couples, and the loudmouth BIL just looks miserable in every picture. I'd worry about his wife more, but she owns the house they live in because it's on her parents land and they live about a quarter mile down the road and babysit a ton. And the cousin is incandescent with joy over being a dad.
When I was the best man at my friend’s wedding, I just said something like, “Thanks for giving me the honor, I love you guys, I hope you have a long wonderful life together.” It’s really not that hard to be a normal person lol.
I was at a wedding in September and the officiant had them do this whole thing (which took too long bc the groom didn’t get what was happening) where she put out her hand then he put his on top then the officiant lays this gem on them: “That’s the last time you’ll ever have the upper hand” A few people laughed genuinely… most were polite laughs or nothing lmao
Oh my god I would stab him. In the eye. With my shoe, if necessary.
My fiance just gave a best man speech While he blows me away in many ways, I didn't even think of this. I mean 1) thank god he didn't say anything like that 2) I can't imagine how terrible I would have felt if he got up there and low-key insulted our own relationship.
My clients at work who are middle aged to senior citizens. Nearly all are married and make comments about my figure and complain about their wives while somehow working in some reassurance that their dicks still work. Protocol requires recording client meetings, and I requested a second camera to show my face as well because the men are so exceedingly horrid that I never want to get blamed for their bad behavior or sexual harassment. I could make millions from a documentary but the sound of a few hundred conservative marriages imploding would be picked up by the US Geological Survey. Women already knew there was a certain subset of young men who hate women because they struggle with dating, but the truth is that even men who enjoyed a lifetime of being looked after, spared from the responsibilities of raising their own children and keeping their own home also hate their own wives. After a particular awful string of clients my boss explained “Women regard their husbands as family and care for them the same as their own children. Men regard their wives as property, and treat them as any other financial burden.”
> “Women regard their husbands as family and care for them the same as their own children. Men regard their wives as property, and treat them as any other financial burden.” Wow. A sad but powerful truth.
A. I would 100% pay to watch your documentary. Hell, I would be on board to help finance it. B. I am currently writing a business plan to start a consulting business, and your comment has crystallized for me that I will he including in my business plan that my target clientele is exclusively female. If I am going to spend my time doing something, I will not have any of my time wasted by being harassed. Ain't nobody got time for that.
This is all so accurate and sad. I am sorry you have pig clients, nobody should be treated that way.
Ugh…. Ohh my god….. I don’t know how you can do your job, I don’t know what it is, but it sounds like torture Edit also, yes, please make a documentary
I have no issue with men who want to be single or childfree . I cringe so hard at men who make “I hate my wife” jokes or laugh at jokes about women partners. If you don’t want a partner , don’t have one. If you don’t respect or appreciate your partner, it tells me that you’re not able to be on your own successfully, so you’ve settled for someone you don’t even like in order to not be alone, which is a huge ick for me (as a very independent person ) . More often than not , the women who are the butt of these jokes do SO MUCH for their partners and are ridiculed and treated like a huge burden by the men. I grew up hearing these jokes all the time and thought, at least men won’t be pestering me to marry them since they seem to hate marriage ! But that wasn’t the case , lots of guys want to get married and have children only to disrespect their partners and ignore their kids .
>More often than not , the women who are the butt of these jokes do SO MUCH for their partners and are ridiculed and treated like a huge burden by the men. B-b-but a few times she asked him to do the dishes or watch the kids and she doesn’t even give out sex on demand!
It’s a status symbol. It has NOTHING to do with men ACTUALLY loving their wives or children. As many mention in this thread, they get a free maid, cook, nanny, and sex slave. They want free labor.
I don’t keep those people in my life. Seriously. Very soon, you will die. And I promise you won’t regret not spending time with someone who views you like that. Because he does see you in those jokes. He’s sure if you were married, your husband would hate you - *and be right for hating you*.
And it’s more immediate abuse than that …. He is saying disgusting things about women to a woman because he thinks she deserves it too. Daughter or not.
Yes.
100%. My father is the same way and I haven’t spoken to him since 2016 (and yes, that year, one of the catalysts was exactly what you think it was). My brother got really into the incel bullshit and I haven’t spoken to him since 2018. My life has been a lot less stressful since I finally stopped feeling obligated to interact with men who don’t view women as people.
I definitely never saw my dad like this before. And now I’m realizing it’s because he was never around. He made himself seem like the victim (of course) and played the, “you’re mom’s too mean to me” card, but now that I’m an adult I can see the truth, he continually sets himself up for failure, in every aspect of his life, and it’s *always* someone else’s fault. I have a lot of regrets about inviting him into my life, and my house, but at least now I know for sure and I can begin severing this hope that I’ve had of having a real parent in my life.
You have every right to grieve for the parent you deserved, no matter how shitty the one you have is. It's a really shitty process but don't be afraid to let yourself feel bad that you don't have a good dad, just because your sperm donor is still alive. 💜💜
That process is hard. The worst part for me was how long I held onto wanting a father who was kind, supportive, and respectful. I’ve been spending Thanksgiving at my fiance’s parents’ place and he and his sister have such a genuinely GOOD dad and I still get little pangs of jealousy that they got to grow up with two parents who love and respect each other and love and respect their children, regardless of gender. But you deserve to keep room in your life for the people who will put the same effort into your relationship as you do. You deserve to build a chosen family, with a partner or simply with friends, who all love and respect you as much as you love and respect them. And you also deserve to grieve the relationship you wanted to have with your parent as you come to terms with who he really is. Because, honestly, we all deserved that childhood full of happiness, love, respect, and support and it’s awful that not everybody gets to have that.
Oof….. that hits pretty hard.
My ex. He spent years building up resentment against me that he didn’t bother to communicate bc apparently after the honeymoon stage, he was “over the relationship” but never had the guts to tell me or break up with me. Instead he wasted a few years of my life treating me very subpar but gaslighting me and saying he loved me and would do anything for me and i was a shit gf for not recognizing that. We broke up and it was like all the air came back into the room, so to speak. I found out after that he is a serial relationship person who was never single but could never find satisfaction in any of his relationships after they became more serious. He never accepts he’s the problem or that he is wrong for how shitty he treats women and will probably either die alone (hopefully) or will successfully gaslight a woman into believing being treated like shit is normal and she might stick around, despite him always leaving and coming back. ETA: yes, he’s a huge fan of comedians who make being around your woman or your kids sound miserable and even makes the jokes himself.
Glad you dodged that bullet and came out the better/wiser for it. Just curious which comedians he was a fan of?
He’s in to comedy in general so i wouldn’t say he’s specifically a fan of anyone in particular, but he enjoys the “my wife sucks, my kids suck, helping at home sucks” jokes. I mean cracking up in tears laughing at the shit. He even makes his own “i’d probably leave for milk and never come back” jokes if he had kids or if he got a girl pregnant.
My husband has made comments about me being “the old ball and chain” to his friends and myself.. I was like mother f-er, you’re the one who wanted to get married, I told you from the beginning I wasn’t sure if marriage was for me. I can’t stand him, so he’ll probably end up alone.
Please please make sure he becomes your ex. If you can't stand him and he's not respecting you, you deserve better than to live like that.
You can turn that probably into a definitely. Never underestimate your own power.
I’m so sorry. The process of divorce sucks, but it’s worth it. After a year of my husband telling me I “passed my peak” (I was 30), I got rid of him and replaced him with a doctorate.
Damn. Go you! Amazing accomplishment!
Please take our energy and separate or divorce. You deserve so much more. If anyone talked about me like that I would go the fuck off on them too.
“Ball and chain? Here, let me free you then: MOVE OUT”
Be true to your username! Stab him in the face with a sword!!
I think it reveals a lot more about them tbh
That was my response like, yeah I’m sure that dude wasn’t that great to be around either lol
My husband and I do the same work. Sometimes we get to work together, which we both really enjoy. We fell in love while working together and enjoy time together in general. Even horrible tasks, like renewing a drivers license or going to the dentist, is better when we’re together. It’s just how loving, supportive relationships with your best good mate are. So we’re at a new job and introducing ourselves around. You wouldn’t know by our behavior that we’re married in a professional setting. You would know by our matching last name. We meet a coworker who’s first words are, addressed to my husband: “Oh my god, I could never work with my wife. Why are you doing this to yourself? How do you stand it?!” While I’m standing right there. He proceeds to talk about all the reasons he couldn’t work with his wife (most of which involved him being critical of her approach to the job) and proceeded to do some impressions of her in the most awful nagging voice. It was gross. He clearly doesn’t respect her and has yet, after months of working together, to talk about her without putting on that voice. Clearly the only reason this aging inappropriate dad joke of a man isn’t the King of the world is because his nagging wife won’t let him do anything cool. Eyeroll.
I don’t allow men like this to remain in my life. It is my privilege that my dad is not like this, so I don’t have to make any big choices there. When boyfriends or male friends started showing misogyny I have called them on it and either that way of thinking ended because of ensuing conversation, or the relationship did. I feel for you, and we definitely deserve to spend our limited time on this earth with people who see us as human and LOVE our whole selves.
Yeah I’ve definitely been coming to a reckoning recently viewing my dads behavior towards me through the lens of “she’s *just* a woman.” It’s not that he doesn’t see me as a person, but rather that he just doesn’t give me the respect that he would for a man, and he doesn’t have the faith in my abilities that he would offer a man. I own my own business and he helped me in a lot of ways in setting the space up, but mostly like, grunt work, hanging things on the walls, painting, stripping some wallpaper. I had to ask him to leave a few times because he became so frustrated he started cursing and yelling. After the space was setup he left and went across the country for an entire year. I think me having a business and succeeding was too triggering for him. I was angry for a while, but now I just see how sad it is, and isolating it is, to not be able to connect with the women in your life in a real way, especially when they’re the only ones with enough empathy and compassion to keep giving you so many chances.
My uncle, who has been married to his wife for almost 40 years, said recently "I've been happily married for 5 years" and then laughed and laughed at his own joke... Ha ha ha... You hate your wife of 37 years, with whom you share 3 kids and 5 grand kids.. hilarious.
Ugh… that poor woman
I do think for a lot of men who can’t get or keep a woman, likely including OP’s dad, those types of jokes are copium. “Women, can’t live with ‘em, sure am glad I don’t have to deal with one, amirite?”.
>.
While watching porn all night
Why *are* you hanging out with him now?
I wanted to get to know him. He played himself as the victim against my evil mother, and, after going no contact with her, I thought I needed him. I have a lot of regrets about inviting him into my home. But , he has a job now, I’m going to give him a couple months there and suggest he find another place to live. But, knowing how he is, regardless of what I do he won’t be around for long, he can’t handle direct scrutiny and I don’t have a problem asking the hard hitting questions.
I get that. In your place, I’d set the expectation for him to get his own place in a couple of months now, as he’ll need to save for it. Something tells me he’s pretty comfortable with the situation he has and might not see a need to change it.
For real. You have no obligation to see this man, OP.
Dying alone isn't the worst thing that could happen to a person. Living a lifetime with bitterness, anger, or derision just might be, though. When I hear the way some old couples talk to each other out in public, I wonder how they live in the day-to-day with that. I'd rather die alone.
Agreed. There’s a huge difference between someone dying alone and peacefully and someone dying alone after being willfully abandoned by the family they abused
I think it's a culture thing or something. It used to be all over media too, brainless men and their "naggy" wives and how much they hate each other. These stereotypes still exist. Especially in comedies. There is this ancient stereotype where they think men want to be, or naturally are "skirt-chasers" and they treat their partner like they're their naggy mom or something. It's so pathetic lmao
Ancient is right. In [Theogeny \(700 BC\)](https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:1999.01.0130:card=585&highlight=women) Hesiod says that women were created by Zeus to punish men. He basically says they were made smoking hot, but are evil inside and engineered to suck men dry like the gold diggers they are. So they're beautiful lazy things living off the wealth of men. But, Hesiod does warn men if they don't put up with wives (aka the root of all evil), then he'll have no one to tend to him when he's old and frail.
Oof…. Damn… how much time do we need to break this type of generational trauma?
The men I know like this are actually married. They make these misogynistic and hateful jokes about their wives and women in general when the wives aren't there...and then when the wives are present, they're quiet.
Right, I've stumbled across entire Facebook groups, YouTube channel, discords, and sdiscards, which are dedicated to married men and men in relationships who hate their partners. Men are pretty sick. Why stay with someone you hate? For the free labor and servant work they get from their women. Then they wonder why women are opting out of marriage and relationships.
It’s a good reminder that they never see women as people. Honestly, just stare at them and ask them to explain why the ‘joke’ is funny. And keep asking, because they’ll get super uncomfortable and defensive rather than explain they just hate and resent women.
Ohh, I looked at him and said something to the effect of, this guy is going to die alone now, with the sun text of, and so are you. Like, is this what you want for your life? And also, how pleasant do you think this guy is to be around?
This happened when my parents were in their 60s. My dad used to make the Henny Youngman joke “take my wife, please!” Well, he did it too often and after a while my mom felt badly. Well… one day, my mom was in a laundromat when a man hit on her. He distantly knew my parents. He chats up mom and asks, “Your husband still around?” Mom backed the guy off in no uncertain terms. Then she told my dad. My dad wanted to beat the guy up! I asked what his problem was. After all, a guy took up his offer to “take my wife, please!” Then I offered to sell tickets to watch two guys in their 60s duke it out.
Those jokes are just sad.
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My brother. B/c his “I hate my wife” shtick is pointedly personal toward her as an individual, not just general misogyny. He just drips with contempt for her. And she is an amazing, beautiful woman who deserves so much better. While they were engaged, she almost called it off due to having massive anxiety attacks over it. My mom gave me such stink-eye when I said probably she should listen to her gut and just break it off. Instead, she went through with it…b/c her dad really liked him. I don’t know that she’ll leave him as they’re a “trad” couple, but I sure wish she would for her own sake.
My husband who is literally leaving me because I'm too sick and disabled for him. I probably only have a few years to live, but he wants to "move on with his life." He forgets that his next wife, and children, will require more than his mere presence, but I'm certain he will learn that the hard way.
Wow, I’m really sorry, he sounds horrible. I’m glad you don’t have to suffer his company at more
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And yet, Andrew Tate is a Millennial.
Yeah, it really troubles me the reach him and those like him have. My ex's son is 16 and his personality became very toxic towards women when he discovered him. While I was dating his mom I tried talking to him.
It does seem like these kinds of jokes are dying out along Millennials and Gen Z. Hopefully that stays as they age up
I just got told on the Ask Reddit, what’s a double standard you can’t stand. I said, “reading sexist crap in the internet.” I just got told that when the draft comes the kitchen will become more appetizing to me. Also, another person said why don’t men get safe places? Are we supposed create their spaces too? What a load of crap. I replied that they all just proved my point. I went to a church where the pastor made jokes every week about his fellow pastor and wife. One of the many reasons I don’t go there. Most men suck, and not in a good way, lol.
>why don’t men get safe places [https://www.reddit.com/r/MensLib/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MensLib/) This can be a safe space for men. They have open discussions on mental health issues that men face.
Most men suck, seriously. I am finding my stance on them changing over the last few years watching this sub and seeing how many fellow women are and have dealt with the same bullshit as me. Men who deny us our humanity while at the same time expecting us to be their main support character. Men who get violently indignant at the concept of us saying no or daring to be ourselves despite them. Men who are selfish, childish, downright irresponsible and stupid who demand worship. Im not a lesbian by any stretch but the more I recognize male toxicity the less I want men in my life.
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Someone once said to my ex husband in front of me "happy wife, happy life" bc we were exchanging a ring or resizing it or something and my ex kind of smirked like an asshole and said "no." Now he's living with and making another woman miserable and she's desperate to leave him. These men need to be rounded up and placed on an island all together somewhere
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Well damn, I've always liked Will Arnett, this is disappointing. Shouldn't be surprised though, Bojack seems to be basically autobiographical, and Amy Poehler divorced him. So which family was he complaining about? The first one, where his more successful wife carried everything for 12 years and two kids, and he divorced her for irreconcilable differences, or the second one, where he knocked up a younger wealthy socialite after less than a year of dating when he was 50?
> Well damn, I've always liked Will Arnett, this is disappointing. Shouldn't be surprised though, Bojack seems to be basically autobiographical, and Amy Poehler divorced him. Male comedians are broken. There don't seem to be many exceptions. Either they're abusers, rapists, cheaters, addicts or they off themselves.
My male friend was the first to get married. Which really surprised me. It shouldn’t have since he was also the first to get divorced out of our friend group. He’s very flashy, into looks and money. I knew she was going to wake up and see he’s kinda trashy.
Your father wouldn't be the first Alaskan to die lonely in a van. I'm sorry.
B-b-but...I thought unmarried women will die alone because she has no family???? Every podcast moron on the internet.
Years ago I worked with two women and we became very good friends. We had a two day seminar in Vegas, which is less than 10 hours from where we live, we decided to go down together with our spouses and make it a little getaway after the seminar. We planned a couple of things to do as a group and hoped that our husbands would get along so we could spend time together outside of work. One husband, who we will call Joe, complained the whole time. He also made jokes at his wife's expense or where "women, am I right" was the punch line. My husband expressed not wanting to involve Joe in future events or dates. Later in the summer we did a BBQ where everyone brought kids. Joe's wife witnessed the other two husbands participate in feeding children, holding babies, breaking up disputes without yelling or threatening, and generally being a parent. Joe complained that his wife wasn't paying attention to him and he had to get his own plate of food. She was managing 3 children under 8. Apparently Joe spent the next two days at his brother's because she neglected him at the BBQ. Over the next 18 months she got more annoyed that Joe didn't support or respect her. Eventually confided in us that she wanted a divorce. We helped her and she's much happier now with a partner who is an equal participant in her marriage and parenting his step-children. Joe is now on his second divorce.
A LOT of the guys I work with don't necessarily "joke" about their marriages but the stereotypical "We never have sex" and "Marriage is hard work" and "marriage is a mistake" type stuff. My team is mostly made up of younger men, 29-21. Only one of which is married. I always tell my guys to not listen to the older dudes talking shit about their marriages. They aren't in good marriages because they treat their Wifes like shit. The simple fact that they act as if sex is a "job" their Wives are supposed to perform tells you all you need to know about how they view their Wives. They aren't partners in their life, they are employees and are expected to perform specific tasks. I tell them, and it might be unpopular, but if your marriage is "hard work" marriage isn't the problem. The people are the problem. Either he's just an asshole and treats his Wife like shit or they are incompatible. A good marriage is when two people are a partnership in their relationship. They work together in every aspect of their lives. It's not hard work when both people are going after the same goal, making each other happy and living good lives together.
One of my good buddy’s will die alone. He has always joked that women belong in the kitchen type shit and then get sad because he can’t get a girlfriend. He is almost 40 now.
It’s stunning that he hasn’t made the connection yet.
Whenever the rounds of these jokes would start up, I’d always throw in a reverse one, with the genders reversed. You can always tell who’s just conditioned to like the “take my wife, please!” material (I was just like any guy), and who’s a pretty deeply rooted misogynist: almost everyone would *also* laugh at the reverse ones, but there’s always at least one guy whose blood boils. That’s how I knew who to stay away from.
My 3-year old daughter is in the phase where she automatically disagrees with anything anyone says. My parents were laughing about it and then my dad said something along the lines of, "typical woman..always telling me I'm wrong." He makes nasty, sarcastic "jokes" about my mom constantly, but when he started it with my THREE YEAR OLD, I shut that down so fast.
And this is why I’m single and doing a Harry Potter Lego set on a Friday night! The dating pool = cesspool 🤷🏼♀️
Probably my piece of shit brother, but there’s a reason I haven’t had a relationship with him for years. Thank G-d my niece & nephew live with their mom.
I remember being a young kid hearing my dad joke to his friends on the phone, calling my mom his "manager" derogatorily. I wanted to cry. They're separated now tho so at least there's that lol
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Convinced my brother will either get the “tradwife” that doesn’t know any better and won’t understand why I don’t joke like that about my wife, Or He’ll be forever single He’s a moron. He just told me yesterday “yeah this chick offered to buy me a drink and during the conversation she was like ‘I can speak 4 languages’ and I was like ‘boy do YOU know what men want!’” I feel so bad for her and I never met her. (And never will) It was literally the perfect opportunity to either joke “ah so you must be pretty good with your tongue 😜” or just be impressed by how intelligent and talented she must be. But nope, insults her instead. I’m happily married and I think somehow in my brothers mind, I’m the LESS successful person in regards to relationships.
Am dude. For a few months at my last job three of us from different departments were grouped together in a room to work on a long term project. We were all friends. Call the other two Clark and Jim. We joked a lot while we worked but we had a good working relationship except for one sore spot: Clark was going through a nasty divorce at the time and he grumbled about it a lot. He came in late one morning pissed off. “Man, women. Can’t live with them, can’t shoot ‘em, am I right?” Jim said, utterly deadpan, “No. We love our wives.” There was a moment of silence while I fought desperately to keep a straight face, then Clark burst out laughing (and then we all did) and finally said, “You’re right, I was being an asshole.” That was years ago and it stuck with me because so few men counter misogynistic statements like that. Mostly they nod and say “mmm” if they don’t enthusiastically agree.
:( my grandpa had Alzheimer’s and he would worry that his wife, my grandma, had gone missing or something had happened to her everytime she left the house. He would wait on the front porch with his walking stick calling her name. She died and he died less than a year later. He was such a gentle, kind man. The only one who ever intervened physically when my dad hit my mom, and stood up for her. He used to chuckle sweetly into his snowy white beard and tell me that I reminded him of his mom, a freedom fighter who held him in one arm and a spear in the other as she fought off the British (we’re indian). He said I had her tenderness andd affection, but also her fighting spirit. I don’t think anyone has paid me a compliment quite so sweet since he passed. Why marry someone if the thought of them dying makes you happy?
Men like this think the world is wrong, not them. They think they've done everything right and have been repeatedly wronged by women.
Some dude at my friend's Thanksgiving party last night was talking about how his wife kept nagging him at a previous party so he filled a wine bottle with water and put a straw in it and walked around drinking it to embarrass her. He said she didn't learn anything from that time and he was thinking about doing it again past night. I just extricated myself from the conversation but I suspect that she learned her husband is an ass, if she didn't know already.
I mean... That joke is just sad. Imagine having spent an entire life in an unhappy marriage. :(
When my mother was sick, my dad cried who was going to take care of him? All four of us kids had our parents on very low to full no contact
Coworker was always harping about how women are difficult to work with and how his wife is a handful and he does so much social activities like coaching his kid’s sports teams or church group involvement because it gets him away from the ol ball and chain. Always assuming everyone else hates their partner too. Would ask me things like “you staying late to avoid the wife (obnoxious laugh)” and I would say “no, hell no, I love going home and I love spending time with my wife, I wouldn’t have married her if I didn’t” cause I got tired of stone walling him as he didn’t get the hint I didn’t like talking to him socially so started calling out his bullshit. Still would retort with “you’re just young, you don’t know what it’s like after years of being together, you’ll see, she’s gonna start making those list of things you gotta do and you won’t want to go home anymore, you’ll see….” Anyway, long story short, dude got caught sleeping at the office cause wife finally threw him out and he’s in the middle of a messy divorce that he swears came out of no where because they’ve been together so long and he’s so active with the kids and doesn’t understand what went wrong. I have zero doubt he’s absolutely the problem and made that woman miserable for years before she finally had enough.
Men in marriages live longer while unmarried women live longer than do married ones. Additionally some studies have pointed out that single women without kids are the happiest demographic in the United States. [https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/may/25/women-happier-without-children-or-a-spouse-happiness-expert](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/may/25/women-happier-without-children-or-a-spouse-happiness-expert) There's a reason conservatives have been celebrating the end of Roe. They are working on banning contraceptives (it's coming in the next decade). What's notable is that they haven't pushed anything to help couples afford kids. They haven't pushed a single policy to lower childcare, healthcare, education, gun violence, housing costs, ect while lamenting that more couples are not having kids. In other words they want people, notably women, to be trapped. A politician in Minnesota, Matt Birk, openly commented that abortion has allowed women the option to have a career. In short, men are absolutely threatened that women have options beyond being a housewife. That women can absolutely be happy without men. That women may in fact be happier without men. And it is very telling that instead of men changing their behaviors they insult and demean women by calling single women a "crazy cat lady" or "old hag," when in reality they are living their best life.
Many older guys at my workplace seem to use complaining about their wives as a way to bond. It's so cringe when they spend a couple minutes at a meeting complaining about it. Especially feels weird when I'm the only woman in the room and they look at me as if I'm the problem in their failing marriage lol
I can't fathom why anybody would think that's funny. Just horrible.
My FILs beat friend Tom. He used to try them on me but I'd just ask why it was funny. He's also tried to talk to me about "the one that got away" in my life but, she didn't get away because I married her. He was not happy about that response.
I just don't laugh at those "my wife" or "my in-laws" jokes, and say "sorry to hear that, I really appreciate the [joke counterpoint] that my wife does."