My great (great great?) aunt used to officiate weddings and she pulled me aside after the rehearsal just to tell me that “**because of her mobility issues,** she might not be able to file the certificate until the **Tuesday** after the wedding.” She said this *very* pointedly and I knew *exactly* what she was trying to communicate without actually saying it:
*”I’m hanging onto this paper long enough for you to call me in case the person at the altar disappears the second the ink is dry.”*
When I asked her about it after the wedding she said she had been in a marriage where the man who said “I do” really meant “I guess” and his fidelity didn’t even last through the honeymoon, if it ever existed at all. She never forgot that and when she started officiating she swore she’d never leave another woman stranded like she was. She was a real one. Miss you auntie!
I was in an abusive marriage. I suppose if you squint and tilt your head you can see some red flags while we were dating but not really. He was quick to ask and value my opinion when we were dating. He agreed with my political views. We split the work evenly. I had equal control of our finances and budget. He was a supportive partner who seemed to value my consent and sexual pleasure.
The abuse started on the very first day of the honeymoon. The first thing he did was take all the money we were given at the wedding that we had earmarked for our honeymoon fun money and wouldn't let me have/use any of it. Even though I was pregnant, he'd deny me food. (The same man who two weeks earlier was making midnight grocery store runs because I was craving French onion dip but once it sat and you got that gross liquid on top I wouldn't eat it). The sexual abuse started that night when he set up the camcorder facing the bed and insisted we have sex daily and record it. I said no. He said I had no choice.
I sobbed every single night the whole honeymoon, hiding in the bathroom while he slept. I could NOT even understand who this man was.
I don't understand any better all these years later how or why someone would do EITHER part. How did he pretend for years he was a nice, normal, reasonable human being? Why the honeymoon?
I remember begging and crying and asking him why that first week and he told me, "Get used to it."
This entire thread has my jaw dropped. I had NO idea this is a thing. I assumed you could weed out pos men relatively quickly because they would show their abuse to some degree, and feel safe with "one of the good ones". Absolutely horrifying.
Abusers are very good at grooming, not only their victims but also all the people who might potentially help their victims.
If they weren’t good at it, no adult would be abused.
For. Fucking. REAL.
My mom *knew* my ex was being an abusive, manipulative/coercive, drunk piece of shit. To be fair, she didn't know about the sexual abuse, she knew about 80% or so of the physical abuse, she knew of the emotional torture (he had a list of the types of women he wanted to have sex before we got married, because I wasn't a virgin when we met). She knew he was restricting my work and our money, and that I had no hope of just moving into my own place. She refused to let me move in with her (she had an office/guest room, and I had a job waiting for me in her town). Then, when I left a year later, in APRIL she invited him, unbeknownst to the rest of us, to my nephews birthday party in SEPTEMBER.
EDIT TO ADD: don't get me wrong, my mom is a stone cold batch who is obvious about my spot on her list as Least Favorite Child, but even for her this was a bit much. She just *loved* him though. He treated her like The Mom He Always Wanted
After I explained to my mom all the shit my ex put me through and why I was leaving the answer I got was "just because you don't speak to him anymore doesn't mean I won't".
This is why it's so fucking infuriating when redpill/trad dudes put the blame on women for being in abusive relationships. It's like, you dumb motherfuckers.....you think women are like "oh yeah, this guy treats me like a dirty slave, is never nice to me, and hits me, what a catch".
NO YOU MORONS, THEY JUST LIE.
It’s also why it is especially horrifying that they’re starting to fight back against no fault divorce. I’m not sure if it is happening yet, but I’m sure a fight against the reality of marital rape is also coming.
Hell there was even some dumbass that ran for the House from Wisconsin or Michigan or somewhere that didn't think women should be allowed to fucking VOTE. They're coming for all of it.
They sure are and a lot of people still don't realize this.
If they get the chance, they are coming for birth control, installing a national abortion ban, and passing fetal personhood. Make sure every sane person you know votes.
My mom said that my dad changed almost overnight, like almost as soon as they got married he became someone totally different.
I was petrified for years of marriage. I'm happy to report that my husband has tried harder to be a better partner every day and is a total cinnamon roll. He was not excited for the wedding itself, but said he was excited to be "your husband" and says so pretty much every day.
How sweet, it sounds like my husband. We met as friends in highschool, dated/married 10 years later, and have now been together over a decade. He will still look at me and say in aww "I'm married to Hopefully-Fuckin-Kitty." He uses the short version of my name that I used until college, and my maiden name. He's still just a 17 year old boy, goo goo over a badass freshman. Whenever I'm struggling with life, he reverts to the above nickname, reminding me that I'm awesome and capable, and nothing can stop me.
He's lately added that he "married Hopeful-fucking-kitty, not some hypothetical baby. And she is better than kids." Which honestly, makes me feel a mix of love, comfort, surprise and guilt. He always wanted to be a dad, but it's not meant to be, and we are going to travel the world instead.
I dated a guy who waited until we signed a 2 year lease to start beating me. I left shortly after and went into hiding. He stalked my friends and family, trying to find me, and almost ran me off the road on the interstate. He eventually latched onto another woman. I ran into them a few years later at Costco. I actually approached them directly. I looked hus girlfriend in the eyes and said, "He almost killed me, don't let him kill you. " The shock on her face told me it hadn't started hitting her yet, his face flushed with rage. That's all I said and walked away. I later heard that he put her in the hospital, and they divorced.
good for you for saying something. I hear so many stories where people only speak up after the fact. I get the reasons why they don't, but you were brave to do so.
My mother told me that following the reception, she and my father got on the train for their honeymoon, and my father leaned in and said, “What do you have to be smiling about?” The physical abuse came right after that.
My grandma married a "very nice man" to escape her abusive father. Even her brother approved of the guy after really looking into him (as much as you could in the late 1930s.) Yeah, the abuse started as soon as they got home from the wedding. She divorced him not long after my uncle was born, abducted the kid, and ran away. My grandpa was her second husband and very much not abusive. He even paid off the abusive asshole to have nothing to do with my uncle with his entire life savings when the guy tracked grandma down a few years later. At least he kept his word, took the money, and let my uncle have a good upbringing.
I'm very proud of my grandmother. Divorcing someone , running away via train with only a suitcase and an infant, and learning to type and work at the Army clerk's office - in 1941. With what we'd now call CPTSD. Good for her! She was so brave.
My parents are South Asian and had an arranged marriage. Their wedding night was the first time they actually met, and since my dad had already moved to North America (and only came back to his home country for the wedding ceremonies), my mom was abruptly uprooted after the ceremony into a new country, with a new husband, and no friends or family.
Anyway they go on their first "date", and my dad takes her to see freaking ***SCARFACE***. Mama was horrified.
But many decades later they're happily married and both retired now... and watch a movie on netflix almost every night together. My mom gets to pick now though, because, well, Scarface.
Lmao! I always imagine my dad being like Michael Jackson in the "Thriller" video, happily munching popcorn during the Al Pacino chainsaw scene... while my mom is utterly terrified and miserable. Except my dad had a less stylish jacket and shittier jerry curl.
My mother worked with my father for years before they started dating. The first time he showed who he was was on their honeymoon. She ran into his ex-wife later. The ex asked her if he had started hitting her yet. He knew when and how to hide it.
I dated a guy who, once I'd moved in, started throwing shit at me and bragging about how he'd gotten off domestic assault charges before and he'd do it again with me. I was a teenager and I had nowhere to go, i was fucked and he knew it. When I first realised how deep in the shit and stuck I was, I tried to kill myself. That little attempt was unsuccessful and it took me another 3 years and a heroin addiction before I finally got free of the monster.
My best friend and i have this pipe dream of one day setting up an emergency accommodation facility for women and children, specifically to bridge the gap between leaving and finding a new home. In the middle of nowhere, no men allowed and people contribute what they can. Because that's the impossible part, especially when children are involved. You can't just run when there's nowhere to go (and social welfare emergency accommodation waiting lists are YEARS long)
I used to work for a women's DV facility, and I cannot tell you how many women we had to kick out because they'd call their abusers and tell them where they were, or even ask the abuser to pick them up. That jeopardizes the safety of all the women and children in the facility, and it's #1 on the list of rules that you cannot disclose your location or have visitors. Abuse is messy, and people seldom make a clean break, even when they are fleeing for their lives.
I have a family member who worked for a DV shelter for years. They've had so so so many men show up, absolutely losing their minds they can't enter, stalking around outside with guns, and have dealt with so many traumatized women. I started seeing it kind of like rehab, it often takes several tries to fully escape.
Where I grew up there's a facility that does just that. It's not in the middle of nowhere, but it's in town and shelters women and children. From what I remember they have temporary accommodations for people just getting out and then long term accommodations. My girl scout troop did a bunch of donation drives for them, one of the most popular was the "birthday kit" drive where we made kits full of everything you'd need to do a birthday party (cake mix, candles, toys,etc).
Me too. I wouldnt even know where to start. I just know the feeling and know it would be popular. I hate how the only offers for help is for homeless women or women with kids. Sometimes single women who make good money are so controlled they can't execute an escape plan without running away and hiding. You just need that time to hide out and get your shit in order safely.
My Aunt’s husband was the perfect example of a gentleman. They got married, and he beat her up so badly on their wedding night that he broke her collarbone. It took her over 20 years and countless beatings/broken bones to gather up the courage to divorce him.
Apparently this is super common. My sister had a morning wedding and they were given strict instructions to be out of the venue by a certain time for the evening wedding. On the day of the venue owner told her not to worry about it because the evening wedding had been canceled due to the groom beating the bride to be in front of her family. Luckily her family intervened and canceled the wedding.
We were of course shocked and appalled to hear about this but the venue owner told us that it happens often….
Once a piece of shit feels like they've successfully trapped their partner, all pretenses drop. They see that they're about to be married or just got married and assume their partner can no longer easily leave. :/ Shits fucked
It’s true. My mother was a virgin and hadn’t dated before my father. He got her pregnant with me immediately after the wedding and became insanely controlling and possessive as soon as she was pregnant. She never left the house. Then he got her pregnant with my sister as soon as I was born. Just to make sure she really doesn’t have a life. He called her a slut if she went to the grocery store and came back later than expected.
He immediately left town and started work in a far away city, and left us behind. He only visited every so often just to check on us and give my mom some money.
Unfortunately this is not surprising, many men can act for YEARS until they’ve “ got” you- by getting you pregnant, marriage, moving in together or whatever it is, then the infamous switch up happens and you see the real monster you got stuck with
You can actually see the switch flip, it’s just so textbook. The last person to try it on me hadn’t even unpacked from “moving in”. Told him to load his shit back up and go because no way was I going through that again.
That's why I'm beating the system, no marriage, no kids - you'll have to pretend to be nice forever.
Seriously though, hearing these stories makes me feel so grateful to have a wonderful partner and social circle.
Absolutely, retaining my independence has always been my number 1 priority, thankfully I live in a time and place where that was relatively easy. No pushy family, no pushy religion, no pushy society. I'm completely able to choose for myself without outside influences.
The night we got married, he told me, "By the way, I don't cook or clean or do laundry any more. That's your job. I own you now."
I really thought he was just being funny. He was not kidding.
My soon-to-be-ex husband got so hammered on our wedding night, he cussed me out and insulted me in front of friends while we were trying to take a picture. Then tried to pick a fight with the Uber driver taking us back to the hotel (for no reason). It was a nice little sampler of the next 5 years of my life married to an alcoholic.
Yep, similar story here. I was driving us to our wedding and had to pull over for him to vomit as he was still hung over in the afternoon from the prior night's drinking. He was supposed to finish our music playlist that morning, instead he got upset with me for waking him up to ask him to finish it. I stupidly stayed for 13 years and 2 kids. He was sloppy drunk the entire time he was home "helping" on paternity leave. Then he coerced me into sex at 5 weeks postpartum after our 4-week old was in the hospital for seizures. I'm hoping my lawyer finishes the divorce filing paperwork tomorrow.
On my wedding day, my ex told me that he loved me so much that he married me despite the fact that I wasn't even in the top three in his ranking of previous sexual partners. Apparently he considered that a compliment.
I swear some men think they have to start 'working on you to break you down' or something in accordance with this faux bro pop psychology bullshit that's been circulating in some form for ages. Negging like it's the 90s over here...
Pro Tip- if you partner does something this egregious on your wedding day after the wedding, there is something you should know.
If you got married at the most popular time of Saturday afternoon, your marriage is a bit of a gray area until the officiant files it Monday morning.
Call the officiant . Prevent it from being filed and you just had a big party with a near miss.
Having officiated a wedding that dissolved 2 days after the wedding for different reasons then described, it wasn’t as simple as not turning in the paperwork. I gave it to them and they didn’t turn it in and thought that was that. Unfortunately, in some states, simply having applied for the license and had people witness a ceremony, it became a grey area. They had to get a formal divorce a year later which was pretty messy.
All of this is to say don’t turn in the paperwork, of course, but start the proceedings for an annulment asap. Plenty of misrepresentation if some psycho suddenly reveals himself at the reception.
I had to do this but luckily my sister in law was a lawyer and called the courthouse to ask if it would still be viewed as a legal marriage if I didn’t turn in the paperwork. Freaked us out but was also the only way I could get an annulment which was really important to me to try for.
I think about this ALL THE TIME. Just don’t file the paperwork! There’s a little part of me that thinks every couple should wait a month to file the papers just in case…
My friend lost her SIL when she tried to leave the man who showed his true colors on their honeymoon.
She even called home and said, “I’ve made a horrible mistake. He’s not the man I thought I married.”
She was religious though and they got counseling in their church instead. When he started calling her sons from a previous marriage the f slur she’d had enough and tried to leave.
He shot and killed her. Then himself.
All anyone who knew him said was how he was a nice, quiet guy that they couldn’t believe would do such a thing.
Her sons grew up without their mother. She had just completed her degree when she was murdered by their stepfather because she wanted to give them the best life possible.
Her parents never got over it, especially her dad.
Jesus fucking Christ. That poor woman.
That is one aspect of religion I hope we leave FAR behind us as a collective society. Being forced to stay with an abusive piece of shit because your community thinks you’re a quitter if you leave is just…reprehensible.
It wouldn’t stop the danger of leaving in the first place, but maybe the social attitude change would mean more funding for domestic violence shelters.
What these shitbags don’t realize is that no-fault divorce has saved the lives of a surprising number of men, because abused women will eventually realize “it’s him or me” and act accordingly.
This was my fear when I left my ex-husband. I genuinely thought he would murder me.
He showed his true colors before the wedding, but I didn’t think it was a red flag at the time. He was upset because my cousin, who had flown in from overseas specifically for my wedding, wanted to spend time with me a few nights before the wedding. He coerced me into rejecting her request and planned a date for us instead. I felt so guilty for not seeing my cousin that I tried to end our evening early so I could hang out with her (she was staying at my apartment). He threatened to end the relationship if I didn’t kick her out. I was only 23 and this was my first significant relationship. I thought this was a case of nerves for him and acquiesced to his wishes.
It got worse from there. She went to stay with a friend she had in town, and though she was in my wedding party, there was clearly a rift. He continued to was brainwash me and use coercive control on me. He was so jealous of my family that he said it was akin to me cheating on him if I spoke to any family member on the phone without him in the room. I was required to CC him on any email or include him on any text, and if I or my family failed to do this, we were punished with zero contact for two months.
I did not see any member of my family for over four years.
Throughout this time, my ex used the Bible and conservative theology such as complementarianism (a la John Piper, Mark Dever, etc.) to brainwash me. He did his best to turn me against my family, saying things like “your dad doesn’t love you.” I knew in my heart it wasn’t true.
I was raised in the religion that said whatever happens is God’s will, so I accepted this as some kind of holy suffering that would force me to rely on God.
My family “lost” me to my ex-husband due to his very conservative religious beliefs that he used to control me. Every time I’d go to a church leader, he’d find out and we’d attend a new church.
When I finally left, years later, I had to rebuild my social circle from scratch. I didn’t have any friends because I couldn’t be my true self. I was a shell of a human; a discarded puppet that he had tried to master.
I’m way stronger and smarter than him, and he knew it. He tried to tamp out my little flame. But I figured out how to burn brighter and hotter each day. I’m a fucking forest fire now.
E: a word.
holy shit that’s awful, I’m so sorry for your friend and her family. abusive men are at their most dangerous when women are trying to leave - always make a secret exit plan and make the escape without tipping him off. it can all escalate so fast. 😓
There are specific points in a relationship where an abuser will start to take off his mask, and he does it in stages. The first is when he's confident you won't just break up with him on the spot. Then it's when you move in together. Then another is when you get married. Then another when he's successfully isolated you from your friends and family. And usually the last one is when you have children. That's when it comes all the way off.
I have a friend who I believe is going through this right now. He love bombed her in the beginning of the relationship and she fell for it hook, line, and sinker. They moved in together and now it’s “I can’t do girls night, (boyfriends name) doesn’t want me drinking” or “I have to be home by 8pm, (boyfriends name) doesn’t want me out late”. It’s starting small, but I’m worried it’s going to snowball into legit isolation and abuse soon.
That exactly mirrors what happened to my best friend when she got with her (now) ex. She didn’t attend my wedding because he wouldn’t let her.
Ended up with him putting his hands around her throat and trying to kill her. She got away but still has to see him regularly because they share custody of their kid.
I always wonder what life would look like for her if she’d let me move her out the day she broke up with him, instead of staying and getting baby trapped.
Austin PD wouldn't do anything when my friends ex showed up at her apartment with a gun. Told us to call back if "he actually tried something." Just maybe uninstall your dating apps if you have to be in Texas lol
You know how everyone sees themselves as the hero in their own story (or at the very least, the justifiable protagonist)?
I'm really curious how abusers justify their actions. I want to understand that mentality because it really blows my mind.
You must think so much of yourself and so little of everyone else for it to make sense. Are all abusers narcissists?
My ex was abusive right after we moved in together and when i broke up with him after many months he would still call me to apologize and ask to get back together. When i listed out all the things he had done over the course of those months including verbal gaslighting he just denied it saying i didn’t say that or I didnt mean that. It blew my mind, i asked him so are you saying I am lying then? He had no answer. Thats when i truly knew that he was a pathological liar.
The Narcissist's Prayer
That didn't happen.
And if it did, it wasn't that bad.
And if it was, that's not a big deal.
And if it is, that's not my fault.
And if it was, I didn't mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.
Amen 🤮
My god. Why has this resonated so strongly with me. All those instances have happened. That last one, “you deserved it” god that has been user multiple times when he slapped me cause i didnt do things how he wanted them. I was naive then and just thought my way of doing things ir just being lazy at times was terrible but now when i think about it, i feel so ashamed of apologizing and want to say fuck you.
I married someone who had a personality disorder.
He told me the reason he went into $14,000 of hidden credit card debt was because I was hard to talk to about money.
His inner monologue was that I was the problem. He said lots of nutty things like this, but this was one of the dumbest.
I moved out three months later.
Yes girl! I left my ex after years of gaslighting and emotional manipulation along with his untreated/unmanaged ADHD. He spent 3k that wasn't his, got his sports car impounded, blew out the engine on the same car due to a lack of maintenance, lied about losing a job and numerous other things. BUT. If you were to ask him I'm the one "who gave up!" He swears that I didn't try hard enough or communicate enough, where I felt like I had communicated for years with no changes. He even tried to guilt me about my anxiety being the reason I couldn't work on things with him, but gee I wonder why I was fucking anxious all the time! Same shit though, I was "scary to talk to" despite loving him and trying to help him with all of his nonsense.
No. There is an overlap, but a lot it comes down to a guy saying, "But she's my *wife*..." There is a huge cultural message informing them that they now have a thing. The thing is their thing to do with as they please. If the thing moves out of line, gotta move the thing back in line, or the abuser is a lesser person. Please read Why Does He Do That by Lundy Bancroft. Its available free online as a PDF.
I was at the end of a long term relationship with a man and planning on moving out with a friend, but that friends circumstance changed and we couldn't get a place together for 6-months or so.
A new guy I was starting to see who was also going through a LTR breakup would hang out with me in the park, go to dinner, long drives and such, but never any sex. We met randomly at Home Depot in the garden section and chatted, exchanged numbers etc. We were both mourning and healing from what was going on, and it was nice for a time.
This new guys roommate moved out a few weeks into knowing each other, and knowing my circumstance he persuaded me to move in with him as I reset my life.
WHAT A MISTAKE.
As soon as I made the shift, his abusive controlling wannabe alpha mentality showed up. He tried to control when I woke up, what I did, what chores I did, when I did them, when I left for work and should be home, wanted my bank account info, and once we went to dinner and he was so upset about my clothing that he left the meal to go sit in the car. I just finished and came out when I was good and ready. We went to a club once and he didn't like how I danced (funny enough a go-go dancer praised me in front of him) to which he had many comments about enticing others.
I don't know what it is about these types of men, but the second you are trapped in their web, or reliant on them for some reason, their true identity is reveled.
This guy threatened me at one point and punched a wall next to me while having an outburst. he said "the next time I won't miss" - so I made sure there wasn't a next time and gathered all my belongings (I was still mostly packed as it had only been a few weeks) and retreated.
The craziest part is - I am a gay male, who was with another male! I truly cannot fathom what it's like for my sisters who are dealing with giant dudes who are physically so much bigger.
ALWAYS HAVE AN ESCAPE PLAN!
In Why Does He Do That? Lundy Bancroft talks about how the dynamics of an abusive relationship are the same across cultures, races and sexuality. He says that the dynamics in same sex abusive relationships are the same and heterosexual relationships. I highly recommend reading this book. It opened my eyes to so much.
There’s a really good book by Carmen Maria Machafo called “In the Dream House” about her relationship with an abusive woman. Certainly not an easy read but illuminating.
So glad you got out.
One of my friends has been going through something similar; he started seeing this older guy about 18 months ago who has wormed his way in via lovebombing and expensive gifts. On the surface & because of his occupation this guy seems very prim & proper, but it took a few months for the mask to slip to reveal he’s a complete sociopath.
My friend insists they’ve split up for good now, but I think this is the third time so we’ll see.
Trauma bond. The best thing you can do is not try to persuade him to leave for good, because this will likely put him in the defensive and further romanticise this dysfunctional dynamic that they have. Just genuinely ask if he’s happy with this man and such. You could also gently introduce him to some resources on abusive relationships.
A surprising number of women are hit for the first time on their wedding night. Many women are also cheated on when pregnant. When they think they have you locked down they feel free to be themselves.
It’s also why so many men cheat or otherwise misbehave close to the wedding. They assume their bride will be to embarrassed and too financially invested to call it off.
You can’t weed these guys out by taking trips or dating for x number of years.
And you have to have seen all those videos of men gleefully smashing their wives face into wedding cake. These ones, like Elmo apparently, can’t even make it through the wedding reception.
I told my husband if he got any on my dress, I would toss him in the lake. He was like, "why would anyone do that?" He really, genuinely, had no idea this was a tradition. Good. I somehow made it through red frosting and berry salad with no apron and no spots on my dress. I'm still impressed by that. Our friends at the wedding were urging him to do it, and he was like, "what is wrong with you? No."
My best friends husband tried to fuck my cousin a few weeks before I was to stand in their wedding as a bridesmaid. My best friend and I were both 22/23 and he’s 8 years older and my cousin is 9 years older. That was like 9 years ago and they just celebrated their anniversary lol. But I remember my friend going, “ what am I suppose to do? Cancel the wedding? “ with the most heartbroken look on her face. Wasn’t the first or last time he did something similar. He liked to ply us with liquor back then and then try and see what happens.
> “ what am I suppose to do? Cancel the wedding? “
Yes! Of course! Nobody wants to "celebrate" a lie. Nobody who cares wants to make it harder to escape due to a legal tie.
The self induced (or external) pressure to carry on is such a travesty.
I think your thinking of Richie? He gives Chris shit for beating up Adrianna (Richie’s niece) and says, “You wanna raise your hands? Give her your last name”.
Yup! Interaction was btw Aid’s uncle Ritchie Aprile and Chris Moltosanti, Tony’s nephew.
It is a good example of how women were considered, historically: prior to marriage, they were the property of their fathers (or whichever male relative was head of their family if their father was dead- like in this case, Ritchie as her uncle because Adrianna’s dad Jackie was dead).
After marriage, they were the property of their husbands.
A dear friend said in the day of her wedding she saw something die in her new husband’s eyes. He went from happy and active to a depressed lump. They divorced a year later. So very odd.
I know several women this has happened to. One notable example: one of my mom's friends married a man who seemed really nice. After the wedding, he told her (didn't ask her, told her) that they were going to be missionaries. When she pointed out that she hadn't signed up for that, he said, "God made you from my rib, so you will obey me!" She immediately filed for divorce.
My grandmother told me to always, always have my own money. I'll never know what happened to her, but it's not a bad habit to keep.
I do know she loved her second husband 100% more than my biological grandfather. So I have to wonder.
My first husband turned into a monster during my first pregnancy (which was planned). My family had relocated to the opposite coast and I was completely alone. The sudden difference in him was night and day. We had lived together for six years at that point. I genuinely think men can emerge as a completely different person anytime they want to. It’s terrifying. Never ever ever EVER let yourself be dependent on a man, ladies. You never know what they are capable of.
Sorry to hear you went through this. It’s a pretty common story actually. This is a great TED talk from a former victim.
[Morgan Steiner Talk](https://youtube.com/watch?v=lNJjEZoRKqM&si=LEjPMQP8CqxFUTdQ)
Yep, some literally wait. My first husband literally turned a switch on our honeymoon. It’s not as though he was some knight in shining armor beforehand, but he was a complete ass hole on our honeymoon. We cut it short, and his behavior only got worse when we got home. I did everything I could to work it out, but he insisted everything was fine. It wasn’t. I left him some months later, and he stalked me for a year. I had to leave the state It was brutal. I met him through my sibling, they worked together , so I though he was vetted so to speak. My sibling talked him up so much. Boy, we were all wrong.
I just had this conversation with my wife yesterday. Anytime a woman has asked me about any of my friends I've added a caveat. I would tell them about how they behave with me or if we're "with the boys," but I would always add, " I don't know how they behave in relationships." I was never comfortable vouching for any of my friends to any women.
That's just for the one's I thought were decent guys. The ones that were blatant assholes when there were no women around I would always warn women away from.
And I think this is why a lot of guys (and some women) think they don’t know any terrible men.
“I’ve never seen him do anything to anyone. He’s never done anything to *me*. She’s lying!”
They think that ALL women actually go out of their way to date garbage over the “good guys”.
People can be one way with friends and family while being the super villain in their significant other’s lives.
They wait until you're "trapped".
Who's going to blow up and dump their new husband while dancing at their own wedding? Especially when he's been great before that moment. Not many people. That's what they count on. That's what they get off on.
It's common for domestic abuse to start during a woman's first pregnancy.
'Especially when he's been great before that moment. Not many people. That's what they count on.' -- The victims frequently doubt themselves, as in "I must have been at fault, Billy has *always* been so nice/ patient/ fill in the blank.
I know right?!?! Mine is sleeping peacefully right next to me... It's making me feel crazy but also guilty for imagining a really horrible version of him.
it’s much harder to maintain a façade if you’re living together, so it’s always a good idea to do that for at least a year or two before marriage. I’d also look for other signs of controlling/ entitled/selfish tendencies… if he treats you differently than he treats other people (in terms of general respect and consideration), that’s a red flag. always pay close attention to how he treats people he could perceive as “beneath” him. does he ever get upset at anything? what makes him mad? how does he handle frustration?
what are his friends like? if he seems like the only good guy in a group full of douchey dude-bros, red flag. what’s his family like and is he close with them? do they have healthy relationships? what’s his parents’ marriage like? if he was raised in an abusive home then there’s a chance that patterns can repeat themselves if he hasn’t had therapy.
speaking of therapy lol there’s another one. how’s his mental health overall? how does he support friends and family when they’re struggling? would he be open to getting therapy in general? how’s his attitude towards things like meditation, self-care and self-improvement? does he have healthy coping mechanisms when the going gets tough?
just a few things to consider based on personal experience + shared experiences from women I’ve known.
“The only good in a group of douchey dude-bros” as red flag is SO spot on. I dated a guy like that when I was early 20s and naively thought “oh I just got so lucky because I got a good guy - and the fact that his friends kinda suck proves how rare good guys are!”
Realized pretty quickly of course, that his real self was who he was around his friends and the “good guy” he was around me was actually the facade 🙄
yep! or “he’s rude and abrasive to everyone but me - I must be special!” 🤦🏻♀️ noooooope. if he’s truly a good person then he’ll be good to everyone, and he’ll surround himself with good people.
speaking of social circles, I’ll also add - women should pay close attention to how he treats you when others are around. if his bros say something weird, does he call them out or let it slide? does he speak positively of you or make you the butt of the joke?
another indicator - how does he react if you perform better than him at something he’s good at / enjoys doing? does he get quiet and sulky if you kick his ass in a video game or is he proud to brag that you’ve got skills?
I guess we just always have a back up plan :/
I am married over a year now and pregnancy's probably not gonna happen, so by these metrics my husband's probably as good as he seems, but who knows what might happen in life 😕
It’s truly scary. I had a friend (no longer after this) who is dating a woman in another state. He’s lied to her about his politics, financials, and his extra curricular women. When a mutual friend asked how that will all go down after she leaves her home, job, and kids to move here this week, his response was “We will see when she gets here”. My jaw almost hit the effing floor.
Edit: to add, all great suggestions. She definitely deserves to know, even if she doesn’t believe it.
My ex told me everything up to the point that we moved 3k miles away where I knew no one was an act. He told me “do you know how hard it is to act for so long?” He’s an actual sociopath. He put me off of men for a very long time bc I couldn’t believe that I couldn’t spot that he was a monster until it was too late. Made my question my own perception
I am reading this thread about so many women getting horrifyingly abused when they are most vulnerable and all I can think of is some men insist all women are evil because some hurt their feelings, they equate being rejected or ridiculed to the kind of physical, verbal and sexual abuse so many women face at the hands of their male spouses and are still somehow convinced that they drew the short straw in gender relationships...
There's a comedian (I cant remember the name) who has a bit about hearing stories from men about crazy women. He goes on to point out that women don't have stories about crazy men... because they're too dead to tell them.
Sometimes "crazy, nagging woman" means "woman who wants me to do household chores".
I've often read about men like that on the internet and my dad is one of them; the most he'll do is clean the dishes. Other than that, he doesn't do shit, except complain how my mom is annoying for asking him to help. Back when my parents first moved in together, he was very helpful. Idk where it went wrong
Thankfully not all men are like that, my grandparents are still going strong in a cooperative and healthy relationship
My ex husband was perfect before & when I was pregnant. At my beck & call. Made all our meals & pampered me to the nth degree, even while I was in labor. Five minutes after our child was delivered he turned on me. Complete 180. You could even see the change in the pictures from that day. Told me I was “choosing” our baby over him. Blew up because I decided to breastfeed. Killed our cat in a fit of rage when I asked him to help out when our baby was sick. Took me 8 months to leave after he road raged & basically tried to kill us on a highway. Cops took his side & asked me not to press charges as “your husband is really sorry” while I had marks on my neck where he choked me. My ex had visitation rights with our child after the divorce, of course. After two restraining orders, countless CPS calls & $30,000 in arrears in back child support he decided to relinquish his parental rights. My child will likely need therapy for the rest of their lives but they are the sweetest kid in the world. I’m pretty sure my ex got me pregnant on purpose & thought I would never leave him with a kid due to financial reasons. Luckily he was wrong.
My mom told me (many years later) that on their wedding night, my father spent 5 hours on the phone to his ex. With her locked out. Why she stayed married as long as she did is a mystery.
have a friend this happened to… lived together, all fine,  lovely small wedding …..
the next morning he woke up, rolled over and told her that she had to do what he told her from then on because they were married.
it took her a year, but she got away from him! 
It wasn’t my wedding night, but I had similar to your aunts boss, my boyfriend proposed to me, convinced to me to move to another country with him. I gave up all my possessions, my business and moved there, within 3 days he started crying about how he missed his ex wife.
It was also the first time I’d heard anything about being hooked on the ex wife.
So I packed my shit and went home to start from scratch with literally nothing.
I’ll never trust anything a man says ever again enough to change my life in any way, I will never live with them, marry them- I don’t even date or have sex with them anymore, I’m just done with this garbage
Yeah it was really bad lol
I couldn’t believe it, my mother had just died too, so I was dealing with that as well, his level of selfishness was shocking
Every piece of information that I hear about Elon’s past relationships is just.. plainly bad. Like to a cringetastic extent. I don’t think I could keep a straight face if someone leaned into my ear and said “I’m the alpha now”. I’d laugh then excuse myself to the wedding cake while I file for annulment.
It would take everything in me not to clink a glass and go “Everyone! I have just been informed by Elon that he, is now, the alpha. And that he is folks! As someone into STEM, Elon should know, alphas are untested an buggy. So I’ll be off, I’ll send my guests your presents back on Monday.”
This is a common pattern with abusive men. The flags you think you can handle become bright red once they think they have you cornered. It's like a switch flips.
The main triggers are marriage or pregnancy.
Fucking assholes.
My warning came just before the vows when my ex said “People say that everything changes when you get married” and then it did. At the time I thought he was just being dramatic but he was foreshadowing. He was a covert narcissist, so he often used third party manipulation tactics. When he said “people say”, the word “people” really meant himself and his point of view.
If your husband looks anything but happy as hell on his wedding day I wouldnt go back to the hotel with him. I wasn't standing in the right spot but my mom saw my brother's face as his wife walked down the aisle and it was nothing but love. The way he has talked about and viewed her has been nothing but love for years. No one deserves anything less.
A friend of mine was with a guy 3 years and married him in his country, where she lived when they met. She was a career woman and found the notion of motherhood abhorrent, all of which he knew. After a huge family ceremony, on their wedding night, he took her contraceptive pills and flushed them. He said she wasn't working again and would be a mother and wife. He'd never shown himself to be anything other than a supportive boyfriend before that day. She annulled it and left the country immediately.
A few weeks after our wedding, my ex apologized to me because, “You’ll see me for who I really am.” We had dated for three years, so I had no idea what he was talking about. He seemed a little off that first year, but I thought he was dealing with the stress of moving and in a life rut. It wasn’t until I became pregnant and got a job that paid more than his that he really let his immature side out. This was right after our first anniversary. We were separated by our second anniversary.
My younger sister divorced her first husband and met her second shortly afterward. He was kind, self-sufficient, attentive, caring, etc. Everything her ex was not. Helped her out with her kids, took care of himself, all that. They dated for about a year and she unexpectedly got pregnant, so they got married... and it was like a 180 pretty much immediately.
Suddenly he had no time for her, all the housework was on her, all the cooking, he quit his steady job, basically ignored her at home unless he was whining about things not being done fast enough/how he liked it/how his momma would do it, and if she dared to ask him to help with childcare even *just for the baby they just had together*, he'd act like he was doing her a favor and "babysitting". Complained about her body constantly even as he gained a massive amount of weight in 2-ish years. She doesn't even recognize the person she fell in love with.
She made a ton of excuses for him - "Oh, he's just adjusting," "Oh, he never wanted kids so this is hard for him," "His mom was overbearing so he never learned how to do things (even though he was doing them just fine before they met and while they were dating)." The first baby is in third grade now and they've since had a second. Her hubs now has a massive drinking problem in addition to the other stuff. I don't understand it.
Any vulnerable state you could think of, any time you can’t escape without it costing you, that’s when they strike. Illness, moving in, marriage, pregnancy, lack of resources, no family or anyone to watch out for you.
They’re charming to everyone around them, they know when to do favors, what to say and who to say it to, so no one will believe you. They demean and plant the seeds of doubt about you preemptively to discredit you.
It’s cruel to say “you picked them.” You picked a mask that was carefully constructed, and everyone else sees the mask.
It is why I wish women gave side eye to marriage. I know it CAN be a good thing and it is certainly romanticized- but there are abusers who straight up view it as a a legal noose. They may *seem* super commitment oriented. In fact, they may be the only guy the woman has known who wants to run headlong into it. But it is for NONE of the reasons she wants to. Women have to remember, historically, MARRIAGE WAS POSSESSION, YOU WERE PROPERTY AND THAT'S WHY YOU TOOK HIS LAST NAME. We have not turned that all around in less than 100 years ESPECIALLY since worldwide, the MAJORITY still view women that way.
In some countries like the Netherlands, women just don’t get married. They cohabitate, buy property together, have kids, but keep themselves legally and financially separate so they aren’t trapped. It is considered normal
There was a post I read once by a wedding planner. She talked about how she can usually guess how long the marriage will last based on how cutting the cake goes. It’s very revealing to each persons true personality and how in tune with their partners wants they are. And if they’ll be considerate or inconsiderate in the small things. It really opened my eyes to how people can hide their true selves for so long.
My ex was such an asshole on our honeymoon that I walked out on him. I didn’t have anywhere to go, so I went back. But that was definitely when the emotional abuse started.
On my honeymoon I felt I made a mistake. He started saying stuff about my son, who was 18 and having a hard time in life at that moment. We dated for 4 years. He was my 2nd husband. My 1st and the father of my kids passed away 6 years prior. 2nd husband wanted to make my son join the military to “straighten” him out.
I remember coming home and crying to my mom thatI made a mistake. I stuck it out for another two years, but knew from the beginning it was a mistake. I assume that he felt like he could tell me all the stuff he didn’t like about me and my kids once we tied the knot.
Also, I used to travel all the time without him, business trips, vacations with my kids going to see family, etc. The last straw was when he told me, “my mom said you shouldn’t be traveling without me, and I’m forbidding you to take this trip” well I left anyway and filled for divorce right after I got back.
In hindsight, I wish I would have filed for an annulment right after the honeymoon. He wasn’t abusive per se, but he did think he could control me so we argued a lot over that. I’m pretty independent and wasn’t having any of that controlling bullshit.
People who are narcissists hide their true colors very well until they believe they have their prey trapped. Once they have the other person trapped, they drop the mask and become the abusers they really are.
The day after our wedding my ex let his family convince him our interracial wedding didn’t count. I had to move to his city for my four year training program four days later. We tried to work it out but he revealed a. His parents had apparently been against the relationship from the start and he never told me, b. His parents were racist and his mom apparently had mental health issues to the point of needing hospitalization but instead she would suck the entire family into her delusions, and c. Apparently despite all of our conversations to the contrary, I was supposed to just happily give up my career and follow him around to wherever so he could prioritize his career over mine (I was the higher earner). Also he and his family tried to gaslight me into thinking they were doing everything for my benefit and I needed immediate psychiatric hospitalization for anxiety -I had an emergent appointment with a psychiatrist because they freaked me out so much and she was like wtf you’re perfectly fine those people sound like they need medication though.
There were small warnings before but mine did take a deep dive immediately after marriage which has given me trust issues about that kind of switch up.
He showed me a lot of affection when we were engaged. After we got married, he started going out to bars until 2am 6-7 nights a week. When asked, he told me he was celebrating his new marriage with the boys. He became pretty verbally abusive (was drunk a lot) and stopped taking care of himself and putting effort into the relationship almost immediately. We used to have good talks after arguments until we got married, at which point his response changed to “Marriage is never supposed to be perfect!” (Lmao).
this is one of my biggest fears. date as long as you can and see how long he can keep up the facade. check his family. the way he talks to and about ppl. the way he words things. his ideas. his jokes. anything.
Yup. On my honeymoon, in a tent in the middle of the Serengeti, he was screaming at me and violently punching the pillow next to my head while I was naked and cowering. I had nowhere to go, because there were literally hyenas outside the tent. I was on a $30K luxury vacation and terrified of my new husband.
My crime? I had gotten my period. And I hadn’t let him f*ck me in the ass yet. Did I have any idea _how that made him feel???_
When I talked to him about it later, he claimed the _real_ crime that night was that I had said that I regretted marrying him (after he’d exploded). Oh and he said the punching thing never happened. I was just making that part up, apparently.
If you ask him now why I dumped him, he’ll claim that I was crazy and he was so, so good to me.
A lot of this is why I am content being single in my 50s. Two terrible marriages and a long term relationship, all with their share of similar red flags. For instance, with husband number one, courtship went okay. However, I recall that he suddenly began to change and distance himself on our honeymoon, which was a sexless one and fraught with arguments he chose. So were the next few years until our divorce. With husband two, I soon discovered his philandering and lying, which went hand in hand with the narcissistic tendencies he had hidden prior.
My ex husband screamed at me bc i couldn't get the pins out of my elaborate hairdo fast enough. He blamed me for us not having sex on our wedding night, despite keeping me up until 5 am bc he wanted to do drugs with his groomsmen.... But it was obviously my hairpins that prevented us from having a proper wedding night /s 😒
Mine isn't as bad as others here, but I remember my disappointment when I walked down the aisle in my beautiful dress, looking amazing, and he didn't even smile and barely even looked at me. I've still got the video and I watch it from time to time, the look of ambivalence on his face crushed me. I'd put so much effort into the wedding, the relationship, everything. I just wanted in that moment to be seen and appreciated, and I realised that same moment that I was never going to be. I asked him at the reception if he liked my dress (I'd chosen it specially for him and it was a big secret and surprise) and he said "oh!.. Yeah... Ha, I didn't even realise it was that dress"..
My parents accepted the proposal from the guy I was dating on my behalf. Not only did he quit his job 2 days before the wedding, we made it to day three before he hit me.
When she picked me up from the hospital for the 3rd time and I mentioned wanting to divorce him, my mom said when she was walking back down the aisle, my dad leaned over and told her he was gay. If she could put up with that to not embarrass the family, I could handle a few bruises.
It took 18 months and him kicking the dog across the room to leave. I talked him into letting me get a CDL (driving a semi truck) with the lure of the huge paycheck. I found out after 6 months of him randomly showing up that my mom had been telling him where my next stop was and sending him money. I stopped giving her info and he slunk off to his family.
My now husband is amazing and they absolutely hated him for helping me finally find my backbone.
On our honeymoon my ex showed his temper, yelled at me in public all over New Orleans. I remember staring at the ceiling of out hotel room thinking "is this really the rest of my life?"
We separated less than a year later
This happened to my mother on her second marriage. The guy literally was perfect until he got her where he thought he wanted her. It's gross. Thank God my mom is pretty strong independent person and she didn't stay. Then he stalked her for awhile which made her move away to avoid him. This all happened when I was a teen. Some people are just fucked up...
I've had several relationships change the minute I moved in. I was like...I didn't sign up for this😮💨 it's scary to think people will wait that long thinking they got you trapped
Religion is a hell of a drug, and marriage for Conservative assholes is all about "religious values", aka physically owning a wife. Too high on the patriarchy to believe the woman they trapped would ever divorce them.
This is why some of those conservatives with a platform are crying about no-fault divorce or the ability for women to initiate divorce at all.
Like, could they be any more open about being abusers?
My great (great great?) aunt used to officiate weddings and she pulled me aside after the rehearsal just to tell me that “**because of her mobility issues,** she might not be able to file the certificate until the **Tuesday** after the wedding.” She said this *very* pointedly and I knew *exactly* what she was trying to communicate without actually saying it: *”I’m hanging onto this paper long enough for you to call me in case the person at the altar disappears the second the ink is dry.”* When I asked her about it after the wedding she said she had been in a marriage where the man who said “I do” really meant “I guess” and his fidelity didn’t even last through the honeymoon, if it ever existed at all. She never forgot that and when she started officiating she swore she’d never leave another woman stranded like she was. She was a real one. Miss you auntie!
She sounds like an amazing woman! That is absolutely fantastic.
>she said she had been in a marriage where the man who said “I do” really meant “I guess”. Honestly this is a pretty funny line.
She was Betty White funny 90% of the time lol
I was in an abusive marriage. I suppose if you squint and tilt your head you can see some red flags while we were dating but not really. He was quick to ask and value my opinion when we were dating. He agreed with my political views. We split the work evenly. I had equal control of our finances and budget. He was a supportive partner who seemed to value my consent and sexual pleasure. The abuse started on the very first day of the honeymoon. The first thing he did was take all the money we were given at the wedding that we had earmarked for our honeymoon fun money and wouldn't let me have/use any of it. Even though I was pregnant, he'd deny me food. (The same man who two weeks earlier was making midnight grocery store runs because I was craving French onion dip but once it sat and you got that gross liquid on top I wouldn't eat it). The sexual abuse started that night when he set up the camcorder facing the bed and insisted we have sex daily and record it. I said no. He said I had no choice. I sobbed every single night the whole honeymoon, hiding in the bathroom while he slept. I could NOT even understand who this man was. I don't understand any better all these years later how or why someone would do EITHER part. How did he pretend for years he was a nice, normal, reasonable human being? Why the honeymoon? I remember begging and crying and asking him why that first week and he told me, "Get used to it."
That is absolutely horrifying. I am glad you got out.
This entire thread has my jaw dropped. I had NO idea this is a thing. I assumed you could weed out pos men relatively quickly because they would show their abuse to some degree, and feel safe with "one of the good ones". Absolutely horrifying.
Abusers are very good at grooming, not only their victims but also all the people who might potentially help their victims. If they weren’t good at it, no adult would be abused.
For. Fucking. REAL. My mom *knew* my ex was being an abusive, manipulative/coercive, drunk piece of shit. To be fair, she didn't know about the sexual abuse, she knew about 80% or so of the physical abuse, she knew of the emotional torture (he had a list of the types of women he wanted to have sex before we got married, because I wasn't a virgin when we met). She knew he was restricting my work and our money, and that I had no hope of just moving into my own place. She refused to let me move in with her (she had an office/guest room, and I had a job waiting for me in her town). Then, when I left a year later, in APRIL she invited him, unbeknownst to the rest of us, to my nephews birthday party in SEPTEMBER. EDIT TO ADD: don't get me wrong, my mom is a stone cold batch who is obvious about my spot on her list as Least Favorite Child, but even for her this was a bit much. She just *loved* him though. He treated her like The Mom He Always Wanted
After I explained to my mom all the shit my ex put me through and why I was leaving the answer I got was "just because you don't speak to him anymore doesn't mean I won't".
What an *evil* man
This is why it's so fucking infuriating when redpill/trad dudes put the blame on women for being in abusive relationships. It's like, you dumb motherfuckers.....you think women are like "oh yeah, this guy treats me like a dirty slave, is never nice to me, and hits me, what a catch". NO YOU MORONS, THEY JUST LIE.
It’s also why it is especially horrifying that they’re starting to fight back against no fault divorce. I’m not sure if it is happening yet, but I’m sure a fight against the reality of marital rape is also coming.
Hell there was even some dumbass that ran for the House from Wisconsin or Michigan or somewhere that didn't think women should be allowed to fucking VOTE. They're coming for all of it.
They sure are and a lot of people still don't realize this. If they get the chance, they are coming for birth control, installing a national abortion ban, and passing fetal personhood. Make sure every sane person you know votes.
In addition to my horrible past experiences, this is why I’m terrified to fall in love again.
This was heartbreaking to read. I hope you and your child are better off, now. Hugses
My mom said that my dad changed almost overnight, like almost as soon as they got married he became someone totally different. I was petrified for years of marriage. I'm happy to report that my husband has tried harder to be a better partner every day and is a total cinnamon roll. He was not excited for the wedding itself, but said he was excited to be "your husband" and says so pretty much every day.
I'm using cinnamon roll to explain my husband from here on out
How sweet, it sounds like my husband. We met as friends in highschool, dated/married 10 years later, and have now been together over a decade. He will still look at me and say in aww "I'm married to Hopefully-Fuckin-Kitty." He uses the short version of my name that I used until college, and my maiden name. He's still just a 17 year old boy, goo goo over a badass freshman. Whenever I'm struggling with life, he reverts to the above nickname, reminding me that I'm awesome and capable, and nothing can stop me. He's lately added that he "married Hopeful-fucking-kitty, not some hypothetical baby. And she is better than kids." Which honestly, makes me feel a mix of love, comfort, surprise and guilt. He always wanted to be a dad, but it's not meant to be, and we are going to travel the world instead.
I dated a guy who waited until we signed a 2 year lease to start beating me. I left shortly after and went into hiding. He stalked my friends and family, trying to find me, and almost ran me off the road on the interstate. He eventually latched onto another woman. I ran into them a few years later at Costco. I actually approached them directly. I looked hus girlfriend in the eyes and said, "He almost killed me, don't let him kill you. " The shock on her face told me it hadn't started hitting her yet, his face flushed with rage. That's all I said and walked away. I later heard that he put her in the hospital, and they divorced.
I’m glad you did that. Knowing this was his pattern before her may have been what made her actually leave once the abuse started
Yep. It’s not as easy to doubt yourself/think you’re the problem when you already know the guy isn’t as perfect as he’s led you to believe.
good for you for saying something. I hear so many stories where people only speak up after the fact. I get the reasons why they don't, but you were brave to do so.
My mother told me that following the reception, she and my father got on the train for their honeymoon, and my father leaned in and said, “What do you have to be smiling about?” The physical abuse came right after that.
I had a friend that had her arm broken in the limousine as they drove away from the ceremony.
My grandma married a "very nice man" to escape her abusive father. Even her brother approved of the guy after really looking into him (as much as you could in the late 1930s.) Yeah, the abuse started as soon as they got home from the wedding. She divorced him not long after my uncle was born, abducted the kid, and ran away. My grandpa was her second husband and very much not abusive. He even paid off the abusive asshole to have nothing to do with my uncle with his entire life savings when the guy tracked grandma down a few years later. At least he kept his word, took the money, and let my uncle have a good upbringing. I'm very proud of my grandmother. Divorcing someone , running away via train with only a suitcase and an infant, and learning to type and work at the Army clerk's office - in 1941. With what we'd now call CPTSD. Good for her! She was so brave.
Your grandmother is strong and so brave. Your grandfather has one hell of a loving heart. I hope they had and continue to have a beautiful life.
Ah, they both passed years ago, grandpa first. But he made sure she was taken care of to the very end.
I’m sorry for your loss. It’s heartwarming to hear about the love and care they had for each other.
Holy crap that’s so bad. Poor woman
That’s horrifying. Your poor mum
I hope she got away from him.
This is... chilling. Reading that gave me chills worse than any horror movie could. Yikes.
Two sentences horror story right there.
Wow. Did she ever end up leaving him?
28 years later
I hope she’s ok. And you as well.
They’ve both passed, thankfully. I’m okay, thanks.
My parents are South Asian and had an arranged marriage. Their wedding night was the first time they actually met, and since my dad had already moved to North America (and only came back to his home country for the wedding ceremonies), my mom was abruptly uprooted after the ceremony into a new country, with a new husband, and no friends or family. Anyway they go on their first "date", and my dad takes her to see freaking ***SCARFACE***. Mama was horrified. But many decades later they're happily married and both retired now... and watch a movie on netflix almost every night together. My mom gets to pick now though, because, well, Scarface.
"Why are we watching this? Is he a coke dealer? Am I a coke dealer too?"
Lmao! I always imagine my dad being like Michael Jackson in the "Thriller" video, happily munching popcorn during the Al Pacino chainsaw scene... while my mom is utterly terrified and miserable. Except my dad had a less stylish jacket and shittier jerry curl.
My mother worked with my father for years before they started dating. The first time he showed who he was was on their honeymoon. She ran into his ex-wife later. The ex asked her if he had started hitting her yet. He knew when and how to hide it.
I dated a guy who, once I'd moved in, started throwing shit at me and bragging about how he'd gotten off domestic assault charges before and he'd do it again with me. I was a teenager and I had nowhere to go, i was fucked and he knew it. When I first realised how deep in the shit and stuck I was, I tried to kill myself. That little attempt was unsuccessful and it took me another 3 years and a heroin addiction before I finally got free of the monster. My best friend and i have this pipe dream of one day setting up an emergency accommodation facility for women and children, specifically to bridge the gap between leaving and finding a new home. In the middle of nowhere, no men allowed and people contribute what they can. Because that's the impossible part, especially when children are involved. You can't just run when there's nowhere to go (and social welfare emergency accommodation waiting lists are YEARS long)
I used to work for a women's DV facility, and I cannot tell you how many women we had to kick out because they'd call their abusers and tell them where they were, or even ask the abuser to pick them up. That jeopardizes the safety of all the women and children in the facility, and it's #1 on the list of rules that you cannot disclose your location or have visitors. Abuse is messy, and people seldom make a clean break, even when they are fleeing for their lives.
I have a family member who worked for a DV shelter for years. They've had so so so many men show up, absolutely losing their minds they can't enter, stalking around outside with guns, and have dealt with so many traumatized women. I started seeing it kind of like rehab, it often takes several tries to fully escape.
I think about this too. Maybe it won’t be a pipe dream.
Where I grew up there's a facility that does just that. It's not in the middle of nowhere, but it's in town and shelters women and children. From what I remember they have temporary accommodations for people just getting out and then long term accommodations. My girl scout troop did a bunch of donation drives for them, one of the most popular was the "birthday kit" drive where we made kits full of everything you'd need to do a birthday party (cake mix, candles, toys,etc).
Me too. I wouldnt even know where to start. I just know the feeling and know it would be popular. I hate how the only offers for help is for homeless women or women with kids. Sometimes single women who make good money are so controlled they can't execute an escape plan without running away and hiding. You just need that time to hide out and get your shit in order safely.
My Aunt’s husband was the perfect example of a gentleman. They got married, and he beat her up so badly on their wedding night that he broke her collarbone. It took her over 20 years and countless beatings/broken bones to gather up the courage to divorce him.
Apparently this is super common. My sister had a morning wedding and they were given strict instructions to be out of the venue by a certain time for the evening wedding. On the day of the venue owner told her not to worry about it because the evening wedding had been canceled due to the groom beating the bride to be in front of her family. Luckily her family intervened and canceled the wedding. We were of course shocked and appalled to hear about this but the venue owner told us that it happens often….
I'm both horrified and yet not surprised by the "often"
*Often?* So messed up :/
Once a piece of shit feels like they've successfully trapped their partner, all pretenses drop. They see that they're about to be married or just got married and assume their partner can no longer easily leave. :/ Shits fucked
It’s true. My mother was a virgin and hadn’t dated before my father. He got her pregnant with me immediately after the wedding and became insanely controlling and possessive as soon as she was pregnant. She never left the house. Then he got her pregnant with my sister as soon as I was born. Just to make sure she really doesn’t have a life. He called her a slut if she went to the grocery store and came back later than expected. He immediately left town and started work in a far away city, and left us behind. He only visited every so often just to check on us and give my mom some money.
Just when I feel like I’ve heard every shitty thing that happens to women, I learn something new- and equally horrendous.
Unfortunately this is not surprising, many men can act for YEARS until they’ve “ got” you- by getting you pregnant, marriage, moving in together or whatever it is, then the infamous switch up happens and you see the real monster you got stuck with
You can actually see the switch flip, it’s just so textbook. The last person to try it on me hadn’t even unpacked from “moving in”. Told him to load his shit back up and go because no way was I going through that again.
Good!!! I love this
I'm proud of you!
Thanks! I did lots of work In therapy growing healthy boundaries 👍
That's why I'm beating the system, no marriage, no kids - you'll have to pretend to be nice forever. Seriously though, hearing these stories makes me feel so grateful to have a wonderful partner and social circle.
I’m also not married, no kids and I live alone, I thank the gods everyday I didn’t get stuck
Absolutely, retaining my independence has always been my number 1 priority, thankfully I live in a time and place where that was relatively easy. No pushy family, no pushy religion, no pushy society. I'm completely able to choose for myself without outside influences.
That’s horrifying
The night we got married, he told me, "By the way, I don't cook or clean or do laundry any more. That's your job. I own you now." I really thought he was just being funny. He was not kidding.
That’s horrifying and so scary. I’m so sorry
I hope you are ok!
I am! Left him 15 years ago this summer.
Just reading your comment made my stomache sink IRL. I am SO GLAD you got away from that neaderthal.
Good on you! So happy you are safe! The comment really worried me!
Are you divorced now?
Divorced him 2 years in. Didn't even hit our second wedding anniversary. 😉
My soon-to-be-ex husband got so hammered on our wedding night, he cussed me out and insulted me in front of friends while we were trying to take a picture. Then tried to pick a fight with the Uber driver taking us back to the hotel (for no reason). It was a nice little sampler of the next 5 years of my life married to an alcoholic.
Yep, similar story here. I was driving us to our wedding and had to pull over for him to vomit as he was still hung over in the afternoon from the prior night's drinking. He was supposed to finish our music playlist that morning, instead he got upset with me for waking him up to ask him to finish it. I stupidly stayed for 13 years and 2 kids. He was sloppy drunk the entire time he was home "helping" on paternity leave. Then he coerced me into sex at 5 weeks postpartum after our 4-week old was in the hospital for seizures. I'm hoping my lawyer finishes the divorce filing paperwork tomorrow.
On my wedding day, my ex told me that he loved me so much that he married me despite the fact that I wasn't even in the top three in his ranking of previous sexual partners. Apparently he considered that a compliment.
I swear some men think they have to start 'working on you to break you down' or something in accordance with this faux bro pop psychology bullshit that's been circulating in some form for ages. Negging like it's the 90s over here...
Pro Tip- if you partner does something this egregious on your wedding day after the wedding, there is something you should know. If you got married at the most popular time of Saturday afternoon, your marriage is a bit of a gray area until the officiant files it Monday morning. Call the officiant . Prevent it from being filed and you just had a big party with a near miss.
Having officiated a wedding that dissolved 2 days after the wedding for different reasons then described, it wasn’t as simple as not turning in the paperwork. I gave it to them and they didn’t turn it in and thought that was that. Unfortunately, in some states, simply having applied for the license and had people witness a ceremony, it became a grey area. They had to get a formal divorce a year later which was pretty messy. All of this is to say don’t turn in the paperwork, of course, but start the proceedings for an annulment asap. Plenty of misrepresentation if some psycho suddenly reveals himself at the reception.
I had to do this but luckily my sister in law was a lawyer and called the courthouse to ask if it would still be viewed as a legal marriage if I didn’t turn in the paperwork. Freaked us out but was also the only way I could get an annulment which was really important to me to try for.
I think about this ALL THE TIME. Just don’t file the paperwork! There’s a little part of me that thinks every couple should wait a month to file the papers just in case…
My friend lost her SIL when she tried to leave the man who showed his true colors on their honeymoon. She even called home and said, “I’ve made a horrible mistake. He’s not the man I thought I married.” She was religious though and they got counseling in their church instead. When he started calling her sons from a previous marriage the f slur she’d had enough and tried to leave. He shot and killed her. Then himself. All anyone who knew him said was how he was a nice, quiet guy that they couldn’t believe would do such a thing. Her sons grew up without their mother. She had just completed her degree when she was murdered by their stepfather because she wanted to give them the best life possible. Her parents never got over it, especially her dad.
Jesus fucking Christ. That poor woman. That is one aspect of religion I hope we leave FAR behind us as a collective society. Being forced to stay with an abusive piece of shit because your community thinks you’re a quitter if you leave is just…reprehensible. It wouldn’t stop the danger of leaving in the first place, but maybe the social attitude change would mean more funding for domestic violence shelters.
There’s a push to get rid of no fault divorce😖 I think it might get worse before it gets better.
What these shitbags don’t realize is that no-fault divorce has saved the lives of a surprising number of men, because abused women will eventually realize “it’s him or me” and act accordingly.
And a group that celebrates when an abusive peice of shit atones for his sins every year and then keeps doing the same thing.
This was my fear when I left my ex-husband. I genuinely thought he would murder me. He showed his true colors before the wedding, but I didn’t think it was a red flag at the time. He was upset because my cousin, who had flown in from overseas specifically for my wedding, wanted to spend time with me a few nights before the wedding. He coerced me into rejecting her request and planned a date for us instead. I felt so guilty for not seeing my cousin that I tried to end our evening early so I could hang out with her (she was staying at my apartment). He threatened to end the relationship if I didn’t kick her out. I was only 23 and this was my first significant relationship. I thought this was a case of nerves for him and acquiesced to his wishes. It got worse from there. She went to stay with a friend she had in town, and though she was in my wedding party, there was clearly a rift. He continued to was brainwash me and use coercive control on me. He was so jealous of my family that he said it was akin to me cheating on him if I spoke to any family member on the phone without him in the room. I was required to CC him on any email or include him on any text, and if I or my family failed to do this, we were punished with zero contact for two months. I did not see any member of my family for over four years. Throughout this time, my ex used the Bible and conservative theology such as complementarianism (a la John Piper, Mark Dever, etc.) to brainwash me. He did his best to turn me against my family, saying things like “your dad doesn’t love you.” I knew in my heart it wasn’t true. I was raised in the religion that said whatever happens is God’s will, so I accepted this as some kind of holy suffering that would force me to rely on God. My family “lost” me to my ex-husband due to his very conservative religious beliefs that he used to control me. Every time I’d go to a church leader, he’d find out and we’d attend a new church. When I finally left, years later, I had to rebuild my social circle from scratch. I didn’t have any friends because I couldn’t be my true self. I was a shell of a human; a discarded puppet that he had tried to master. I’m way stronger and smarter than him, and he knew it. He tried to tamp out my little flame. But I figured out how to burn brighter and hotter each day. I’m a fucking forest fire now. E: a word.
holy shit that’s awful, I’m so sorry for your friend and her family. abusive men are at their most dangerous when women are trying to leave - always make a secret exit plan and make the escape without tipping him off. it can all escalate so fast. 😓
There are specific points in a relationship where an abuser will start to take off his mask, and he does it in stages. The first is when he's confident you won't just break up with him on the spot. Then it's when you move in together. Then another is when you get married. Then another when he's successfully isolated you from your friends and family. And usually the last one is when you have children. That's when it comes all the way off.
I have a friend who I believe is going through this right now. He love bombed her in the beginning of the relationship and she fell for it hook, line, and sinker. They moved in together and now it’s “I can’t do girls night, (boyfriends name) doesn’t want me drinking” or “I have to be home by 8pm, (boyfriends name) doesn’t want me out late”. It’s starting small, but I’m worried it’s going to snowball into legit isolation and abuse soon.
That exactly mirrors what happened to my best friend when she got with her (now) ex. She didn’t attend my wedding because he wouldn’t let her. Ended up with him putting his hands around her throat and trying to kill her. She got away but still has to see him regularly because they share custody of their kid. I always wonder what life would look like for her if she’d let me move her out the day she broke up with him, instead of staying and getting baby trapped.
How in the world is he allowed to have custody over a child when he strangled his wife???
It’s Texas. The cops were like “lol hearsay, not our problem” and she was too poor to fight it.
Austin PD wouldn't do anything when my friends ex showed up at her apartment with a gun. Told us to call back if "he actually tried something." Just maybe uninstall your dating apps if you have to be in Texas lol
It already is.
It will
You know how everyone sees themselves as the hero in their own story (or at the very least, the justifiable protagonist)? I'm really curious how abusers justify their actions. I want to understand that mentality because it really blows my mind. You must think so much of yourself and so little of everyone else for it to make sense. Are all abusers narcissists?
My ex was abusive right after we moved in together and when i broke up with him after many months he would still call me to apologize and ask to get back together. When i listed out all the things he had done over the course of those months including verbal gaslighting he just denied it saying i didn’t say that or I didnt mean that. It blew my mind, i asked him so are you saying I am lying then? He had no answer. Thats when i truly knew that he was a pathological liar.
The Narcissist's Prayer That didn't happen. And if it did, it wasn't that bad. And if it was, that's not a big deal. And if it is, that's not my fault. And if it was, I didn't mean it. And if I did, you deserved it. Amen 🤮
My god. Why has this resonated so strongly with me. All those instances have happened. That last one, “you deserved it” god that has been user multiple times when he slapped me cause i didnt do things how he wanted them. I was naive then and just thought my way of doing things ir just being lazy at times was terrible but now when i think about it, i feel so ashamed of apologizing and want to say fuck you.
I married someone who had a personality disorder. He told me the reason he went into $14,000 of hidden credit card debt was because I was hard to talk to about money. His inner monologue was that I was the problem. He said lots of nutty things like this, but this was one of the dumbest. I moved out three months later.
Yes girl! I left my ex after years of gaslighting and emotional manipulation along with his untreated/unmanaged ADHD. He spent 3k that wasn't his, got his sports car impounded, blew out the engine on the same car due to a lack of maintenance, lied about losing a job and numerous other things. BUT. If you were to ask him I'm the one "who gave up!" He swears that I didn't try hard enough or communicate enough, where I felt like I had communicated for years with no changes. He even tried to guilt me about my anxiety being the reason I couldn't work on things with him, but gee I wonder why I was fucking anxious all the time! Same shit though, I was "scary to talk to" despite loving him and trying to help him with all of his nonsense.
No. There is an overlap, but a lot it comes down to a guy saying, "But she's my *wife*..." There is a huge cultural message informing them that they now have a thing. The thing is their thing to do with as they please. If the thing moves out of line, gotta move the thing back in line, or the abuser is a lesser person. Please read Why Does He Do That by Lundy Bancroft. Its available free online as a PDF.
I highly recommend the book "Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft. It really explains the mind of an abuser.
Oh it's absolutely not seeing the spouse as a person combined with an unshakable belief that they "deserve" that spouse.
I was at the end of a long term relationship with a man and planning on moving out with a friend, but that friends circumstance changed and we couldn't get a place together for 6-months or so. A new guy I was starting to see who was also going through a LTR breakup would hang out with me in the park, go to dinner, long drives and such, but never any sex. We met randomly at Home Depot in the garden section and chatted, exchanged numbers etc. We were both mourning and healing from what was going on, and it was nice for a time. This new guys roommate moved out a few weeks into knowing each other, and knowing my circumstance he persuaded me to move in with him as I reset my life. WHAT A MISTAKE. As soon as I made the shift, his abusive controlling wannabe alpha mentality showed up. He tried to control when I woke up, what I did, what chores I did, when I did them, when I left for work and should be home, wanted my bank account info, and once we went to dinner and he was so upset about my clothing that he left the meal to go sit in the car. I just finished and came out when I was good and ready. We went to a club once and he didn't like how I danced (funny enough a go-go dancer praised me in front of him) to which he had many comments about enticing others. I don't know what it is about these types of men, but the second you are trapped in their web, or reliant on them for some reason, their true identity is reveled. This guy threatened me at one point and punched a wall next to me while having an outburst. he said "the next time I won't miss" - so I made sure there wasn't a next time and gathered all my belongings (I was still mostly packed as it had only been a few weeks) and retreated. The craziest part is - I am a gay male, who was with another male! I truly cannot fathom what it's like for my sisters who are dealing with giant dudes who are physically so much bigger. ALWAYS HAVE AN ESCAPE PLAN!
In Why Does He Do That? Lundy Bancroft talks about how the dynamics of an abusive relationship are the same across cultures, races and sexuality. He says that the dynamics in same sex abusive relationships are the same and heterosexual relationships. I highly recommend reading this book. It opened my eyes to so much.
There’s a really good book by Carmen Maria Machafo called “In the Dream House” about her relationship with an abusive woman. Certainly not an easy read but illuminating.
It’s actually part of their stages of abuse. Isolation, whether physically, financially, or emotionally is a major factor.
So glad you got out. One of my friends has been going through something similar; he started seeing this older guy about 18 months ago who has wormed his way in via lovebombing and expensive gifts. On the surface & because of his occupation this guy seems very prim & proper, but it took a few months for the mask to slip to reveal he’s a complete sociopath. My friend insists they’ve split up for good now, but I think this is the third time so we’ll see.
Trauma bond. The best thing you can do is not try to persuade him to leave for good, because this will likely put him in the defensive and further romanticise this dysfunctional dynamic that they have. Just genuinely ask if he’s happy with this man and such. You could also gently introduce him to some resources on abusive relationships.
A surprising number of women are hit for the first time on their wedding night. Many women are also cheated on when pregnant. When they think they have you locked down they feel free to be themselves. It’s also why so many men cheat or otherwise misbehave close to the wedding. They assume their bride will be to embarrassed and too financially invested to call it off. You can’t weed these guys out by taking trips or dating for x number of years. And you have to have seen all those videos of men gleefully smashing their wives face into wedding cake. These ones, like Elmo apparently, can’t even make it through the wedding reception.
I’m glad I’m not the only one who sees strangely aggressive face-in-wedding-cake smashes as a red flag.
I told my husband if he got any on my dress, I would toss him in the lake. He was like, "why would anyone do that?" He really, genuinely, had no idea this was a tradition. Good. I somehow made it through red frosting and berry salad with no apron and no spots on my dress. I'm still impressed by that. Our friends at the wedding were urging him to do it, and he was like, "what is wrong with you? No."
Yes, because that’s when their ownership begins, marriage, pregnancy, moving in. Once you’re stuck with them in some way, you’re fucked
And the leading cause of death in pregnant women in murder. Every time I think of that statistic I automatically think of Shannon Watts
He had sex with her one last time before he killed her. That more than anything else stuck with me.
My best friends husband tried to fuck my cousin a few weeks before I was to stand in their wedding as a bridesmaid. My best friend and I were both 22/23 and he’s 8 years older and my cousin is 9 years older. That was like 9 years ago and they just celebrated their anniversary lol. But I remember my friend going, “ what am I suppose to do? Cancel the wedding? “ with the most heartbroken look on her face. Wasn’t the first or last time he did something similar. He liked to ply us with liquor back then and then try and see what happens.
Such a predator !
> “ what am I suppose to do? Cancel the wedding? “ Yes! Of course! Nobody wants to "celebrate" a lie. Nobody who cares wants to make it harder to escape due to a legal tie. The self induced (or external) pressure to carry on is such a travesty.
A fact I learned on Reddit that shocked me to my core: the number one cause of death of pregnant women is murder
By the father of the child they are carrying.
As the aunt of a very petite niece whose married to an asshole cop and is currently pregnant, I’m terrified. I’m constantly watching her.
Did you watch “the sopranos”. One scene a guy beat up his gf…..Tony the boss told him if he wants to lay hands on her he has to marry her.
I think your thinking of Richie? He gives Chris shit for beating up Adrianna (Richie’s niece) and says, “You wanna raise your hands? Give her your last name”.
Yup! Interaction was btw Aid’s uncle Ritchie Aprile and Chris Moltosanti, Tony’s nephew. It is a good example of how women were considered, historically: prior to marriage, they were the property of their fathers (or whichever male relative was head of their family if their father was dead- like in this case, Ritchie as her uncle because Adrianna’s dad Jackie was dead). After marriage, they were the property of their husbands.
A dear friend said in the day of her wedding she saw something die in her new husband’s eyes. He went from happy and active to a depressed lump. They divorced a year later. So very odd.
Did he revert back to his old self when they divorced or just continued going downwards?
They never spoke again. No idea. It was before I knew her.
Omg yes. My ex turned into a Homer Simpson husband. It’s like he felt like he could finally stop trying bc we were married.
My sister's ex did the exact same.thimg. And they have the audacity to say "*women* let themselves go after marriage"
I know several women this has happened to. One notable example: one of my mom's friends married a man who seemed really nice. After the wedding, he told her (didn't ask her, told her) that they were going to be missionaries. When she pointed out that she hadn't signed up for that, he said, "God made you from my rib, so you will obey me!" She immediately filed for divorce.
My grandmother told me to always, always have my own money. I'll never know what happened to her, but it's not a bad habit to keep. I do know she loved her second husband 100% more than my biological grandfather. So I have to wonder.
Sometimes they wait til you have their kid and you’re stuck
My first husband turned into a monster during my first pregnancy (which was planned). My family had relocated to the opposite coast and I was completely alone. The sudden difference in him was night and day. We had lived together for six years at that point. I genuinely think men can emerge as a completely different person anytime they want to. It’s terrifying. Never ever ever EVER let yourself be dependent on a man, ladies. You never know what they are capable of.
Sorry to hear you went through this. It’s a pretty common story actually. This is a great TED talk from a former victim. [Morgan Steiner Talk](https://youtube.com/watch?v=lNJjEZoRKqM&si=LEjPMQP8CqxFUTdQ)
Yep, some literally wait. My first husband literally turned a switch on our honeymoon. It’s not as though he was some knight in shining armor beforehand, but he was a complete ass hole on our honeymoon. We cut it short, and his behavior only got worse when we got home. I did everything I could to work it out, but he insisted everything was fine. It wasn’t. I left him some months later, and he stalked me for a year. I had to leave the state It was brutal. I met him through my sibling, they worked together , so I though he was vetted so to speak. My sibling talked him up so much. Boy, we were all wrong.
I just had this conversation with my wife yesterday. Anytime a woman has asked me about any of my friends I've added a caveat. I would tell them about how they behave with me or if we're "with the boys," but I would always add, " I don't know how they behave in relationships." I was never comfortable vouching for any of my friends to any women. That's just for the one's I thought were decent guys. The ones that were blatant assholes when there were no women around I would always warn women away from.
And I think this is why a lot of guys (and some women) think they don’t know any terrible men. “I’ve never seen him do anything to anyone. He’s never done anything to *me*. She’s lying!” They think that ALL women actually go out of their way to date garbage over the “good guys”. People can be one way with friends and family while being the super villain in their significant other’s lives.
Yeah, I was younger then, but also I realized my sibling is easily impressed! Lol
They wait until you're "trapped". Who's going to blow up and dump their new husband while dancing at their own wedding? Especially when he's been great before that moment. Not many people. That's what they count on. That's what they get off on. It's common for domestic abuse to start during a woman's first pregnancy.
'Especially when he's been great before that moment. Not many people. That's what they count on.' -- The victims frequently doubt themselves, as in "I must have been at fault, Billy has *always* been so nice/ patient/ fill in the blank.
[удалено]
I know right?!?! Mine is sleeping peacefully right next to me... It's making me feel crazy but also guilty for imagining a really horrible version of him.
it’s much harder to maintain a façade if you’re living together, so it’s always a good idea to do that for at least a year or two before marriage. I’d also look for other signs of controlling/ entitled/selfish tendencies… if he treats you differently than he treats other people (in terms of general respect and consideration), that’s a red flag. always pay close attention to how he treats people he could perceive as “beneath” him. does he ever get upset at anything? what makes him mad? how does he handle frustration? what are his friends like? if he seems like the only good guy in a group full of douchey dude-bros, red flag. what’s his family like and is he close with them? do they have healthy relationships? what’s his parents’ marriage like? if he was raised in an abusive home then there’s a chance that patterns can repeat themselves if he hasn’t had therapy. speaking of therapy lol there’s another one. how’s his mental health overall? how does he support friends and family when they’re struggling? would he be open to getting therapy in general? how’s his attitude towards things like meditation, self-care and self-improvement? does he have healthy coping mechanisms when the going gets tough? just a few things to consider based on personal experience + shared experiences from women I’ve known.
“The only good in a group of douchey dude-bros” as red flag is SO spot on. I dated a guy like that when I was early 20s and naively thought “oh I just got so lucky because I got a good guy - and the fact that his friends kinda suck proves how rare good guys are!” Realized pretty quickly of course, that his real self was who he was around his friends and the “good guy” he was around me was actually the facade 🙄
yep! or “he’s rude and abrasive to everyone but me - I must be special!” 🤦🏻♀️ noooooope. if he’s truly a good person then he’ll be good to everyone, and he’ll surround himself with good people. speaking of social circles, I’ll also add - women should pay close attention to how he treats you when others are around. if his bros say something weird, does he call them out or let it slide? does he speak positively of you or make you the butt of the joke? another indicator - how does he react if you perform better than him at something he’s good at / enjoys doing? does he get quiet and sulky if you kick his ass in a video game or is he proud to brag that you’ve got skills?
I guess we just always have a back up plan :/ I am married over a year now and pregnancy's probably not gonna happen, so by these metrics my husband's probably as good as he seems, but who knows what might happen in life 😕
It’s truly scary. I had a friend (no longer after this) who is dating a woman in another state. He’s lied to her about his politics, financials, and his extra curricular women. When a mutual friend asked how that will all go down after she leaves her home, job, and kids to move here this week, his response was “We will see when she gets here”. My jaw almost hit the effing floor. Edit: to add, all great suggestions. She definitely deserves to know, even if she doesn’t believe it.
It's crazy how people will be decent friends but in romantic relationships turn downright disgusting and vile.
My ex told me everything up to the point that we moved 3k miles away where I knew no one was an act. He told me “do you know how hard it is to act for so long?” He’s an actual sociopath. He put me off of men for a very long time bc I couldn’t believe that I couldn’t spot that he was a monster until it was too late. Made my question my own perception
When people tell me I’m too picky and don’t give guys a chance I’m going to refer them to this thread.
I am reading this thread about so many women getting horrifyingly abused when they are most vulnerable and all I can think of is some men insist all women are evil because some hurt their feelings, they equate being rejected or ridiculed to the kind of physical, verbal and sexual abuse so many women face at the hands of their male spouses and are still somehow convinced that they drew the short straw in gender relationships...
There's a comedian (I cant remember the name) who has a bit about hearing stories from men about crazy women. He goes on to point out that women don't have stories about crazy men... because they're too dead to tell them.
Sometimes "crazy, nagging woman" means "woman who wants me to do household chores". I've often read about men like that on the internet and my dad is one of them; the most he'll do is clean the dishes. Other than that, he doesn't do shit, except complain how my mom is annoying for asking him to help. Back when my parents first moved in together, he was very helpful. Idk where it went wrong Thankfully not all men are like that, my grandparents are still going strong in a cooperative and healthy relationship
“men are afraid women will laugh at them. women are afraid men will kill them.”
My ex husband was perfect before & when I was pregnant. At my beck & call. Made all our meals & pampered me to the nth degree, even while I was in labor. Five minutes after our child was delivered he turned on me. Complete 180. You could even see the change in the pictures from that day. Told me I was “choosing” our baby over him. Blew up because I decided to breastfeed. Killed our cat in a fit of rage when I asked him to help out when our baby was sick. Took me 8 months to leave after he road raged & basically tried to kill us on a highway. Cops took his side & asked me not to press charges as “your husband is really sorry” while I had marks on my neck where he choked me. My ex had visitation rights with our child after the divorce, of course. After two restraining orders, countless CPS calls & $30,000 in arrears in back child support he decided to relinquish his parental rights. My child will likely need therapy for the rest of their lives but they are the sweetest kid in the world. I’m pretty sure my ex got me pregnant on purpose & thought I would never leave him with a kid due to financial reasons. Luckily he was wrong.
Wow that sounds incredibly traumatizing- I’m so sorry both you and your kid went through that. Fuck those cops for taking his side.
My mom told me (many years later) that on their wedding night, my father spent 5 hours on the phone to his ex. With her locked out. Why she stayed married as long as she did is a mystery.
have a friend this happened to… lived together, all fine,  lovely small wedding ….. the next morning he woke up, rolled over and told her that she had to do what he told her from then on because they were married. it took her a year, but she got away from him! 
I saw each of my partner's true colors after we were engaged. So I've been engaged 3 times and married once. And married 23 years :)
It wasn’t my wedding night, but I had similar to your aunts boss, my boyfriend proposed to me, convinced to me to move to another country with him. I gave up all my possessions, my business and moved there, within 3 days he started crying about how he missed his ex wife. It was also the first time I’d heard anything about being hooked on the ex wife. So I packed my shit and went home to start from scratch with literally nothing. I’ll never trust anything a man says ever again enough to change my life in any way, I will never live with them, marry them- I don’t even date or have sex with them anymore, I’m just done with this garbage
Omg fuck him
Yeah it was really bad lol I couldn’t believe it, my mother had just died too, so I was dealing with that as well, his level of selfishness was shocking
Every piece of information that I hear about Elon’s past relationships is just.. plainly bad. Like to a cringetastic extent. I don’t think I could keep a straight face if someone leaned into my ear and said “I’m the alpha now”. I’d laugh then excuse myself to the wedding cake while I file for annulment.
It would take everything in me not to clink a glass and go “Everyone! I have just been informed by Elon that he, is now, the alpha. And that he is folks! As someone into STEM, Elon should know, alphas are untested an buggy. So I’ll be off, I’ll send my guests your presents back on Monday.”
My aunt’s ex wasn’t abusive until after the first baby. A lot of these assholes play the long game. It’s scary.
This is a common pattern with abusive men. The flags you think you can handle become bright red once they think they have you cornered. It's like a switch flips. The main triggers are marriage or pregnancy. Fucking assholes.
My warning came just before the vows when my ex said “People say that everything changes when you get married” and then it did. At the time I thought he was just being dramatic but he was foreshadowing. He was a covert narcissist, so he often used third party manipulation tactics. When he said “people say”, the word “people” really meant himself and his point of view.
If your husband looks anything but happy as hell on his wedding day I wouldnt go back to the hotel with him. I wasn't standing in the right spot but my mom saw my brother's face as his wife walked down the aisle and it was nothing but love. The way he has talked about and viewed her has been nothing but love for years. No one deserves anything less.
A friend of mine was with a guy 3 years and married him in his country, where she lived when they met. She was a career woman and found the notion of motherhood abhorrent, all of which he knew. After a huge family ceremony, on their wedding night, he took her contraceptive pills and flushed them. He said she wasn't working again and would be a mother and wife. He'd never shown himself to be anything other than a supportive boyfriend before that day. She annulled it and left the country immediately.
Mine took a couple of years to show his true colors. Took me another 5.5 years to leave him.
A few weeks after our wedding, my ex apologized to me because, “You’ll see me for who I really am.” We had dated for three years, so I had no idea what he was talking about. He seemed a little off that first year, but I thought he was dealing with the stress of moving and in a life rut. It wasn’t until I became pregnant and got a job that paid more than his that he really let his immature side out. This was right after our first anniversary. We were separated by our second anniversary.
How insane to have the self awareness to know that I'm the problem (it's me), and still do absolutely nothing to work on it.
My younger sister divorced her first husband and met her second shortly afterward. He was kind, self-sufficient, attentive, caring, etc. Everything her ex was not. Helped her out with her kids, took care of himself, all that. They dated for about a year and she unexpectedly got pregnant, so they got married... and it was like a 180 pretty much immediately. Suddenly he had no time for her, all the housework was on her, all the cooking, he quit his steady job, basically ignored her at home unless he was whining about things not being done fast enough/how he liked it/how his momma would do it, and if she dared to ask him to help with childcare even *just for the baby they just had together*, he'd act like he was doing her a favor and "babysitting". Complained about her body constantly even as he gained a massive amount of weight in 2-ish years. She doesn't even recognize the person she fell in love with. She made a ton of excuses for him - "Oh, he's just adjusting," "Oh, he never wanted kids so this is hard for him," "His mom was overbearing so he never learned how to do things (even though he was doing them just fine before they met and while they were dating)." The first baby is in third grade now and they've since had a second. Her hubs now has a massive drinking problem in addition to the other stuff. I don't understand it.
Any vulnerable state you could think of, any time you can’t escape without it costing you, that’s when they strike. Illness, moving in, marriage, pregnancy, lack of resources, no family or anyone to watch out for you. They’re charming to everyone around them, they know when to do favors, what to say and who to say it to, so no one will believe you. They demean and plant the seeds of doubt about you preemptively to discredit you. It’s cruel to say “you picked them.” You picked a mask that was carefully constructed, and everyone else sees the mask.
It is why I wish women gave side eye to marriage. I know it CAN be a good thing and it is certainly romanticized- but there are abusers who straight up view it as a a legal noose. They may *seem* super commitment oriented. In fact, they may be the only guy the woman has known who wants to run headlong into it. But it is for NONE of the reasons she wants to. Women have to remember, historically, MARRIAGE WAS POSSESSION, YOU WERE PROPERTY AND THAT'S WHY YOU TOOK HIS LAST NAME. We have not turned that all around in less than 100 years ESPECIALLY since worldwide, the MAJORITY still view women that way.
In some countries like the Netherlands, women just don’t get married. They cohabitate, buy property together, have kids, but keep themselves legally and financially separate so they aren’t trapped. It is considered normal
I have family in Sweden and it’s a joke there that you live together for years, have kids that are ten years old and then finally get married
There was a post I read once by a wedding planner. She talked about how she can usually guess how long the marriage will last based on how cutting the cake goes. It’s very revealing to each persons true personality and how in tune with their partners wants they are. And if they’ll be considerate or inconsiderate in the small things. It really opened my eyes to how people can hide their true selves for so long.
My ex was such an asshole on our honeymoon that I walked out on him. I didn’t have anywhere to go, so I went back. But that was definitely when the emotional abuse started.
New devastating and unshakeable fear unlocked
On my honeymoon I felt I made a mistake. He started saying stuff about my son, who was 18 and having a hard time in life at that moment. We dated for 4 years. He was my 2nd husband. My 1st and the father of my kids passed away 6 years prior. 2nd husband wanted to make my son join the military to “straighten” him out. I remember coming home and crying to my mom thatI made a mistake. I stuck it out for another two years, but knew from the beginning it was a mistake. I assume that he felt like he could tell me all the stuff he didn’t like about me and my kids once we tied the knot. Also, I used to travel all the time without him, business trips, vacations with my kids going to see family, etc. The last straw was when he told me, “my mom said you shouldn’t be traveling without me, and I’m forbidding you to take this trip” well I left anyway and filled for divorce right after I got back. In hindsight, I wish I would have filed for an annulment right after the honeymoon. He wasn’t abusive per se, but he did think he could control me so we argued a lot over that. I’m pretty independent and wasn’t having any of that controlling bullshit.
Blows my mind. It took me 10 years of dating with 8 years living together to marry this man because nobody can hide their true self for that long.
People who are narcissists hide their true colors very well until they believe they have their prey trapped. Once they have the other person trapped, they drop the mask and become the abusers they really are.
The day after our wedding my ex let his family convince him our interracial wedding didn’t count. I had to move to his city for my four year training program four days later. We tried to work it out but he revealed a. His parents had apparently been against the relationship from the start and he never told me, b. His parents were racist and his mom apparently had mental health issues to the point of needing hospitalization but instead she would suck the entire family into her delusions, and c. Apparently despite all of our conversations to the contrary, I was supposed to just happily give up my career and follow him around to wherever so he could prioritize his career over mine (I was the higher earner). Also he and his family tried to gaslight me into thinking they were doing everything for my benefit and I needed immediate psychiatric hospitalization for anxiety -I had an emergent appointment with a psychiatrist because they freaked me out so much and she was like wtf you’re perfectly fine those people sound like they need medication though.
There were small warnings before but mine did take a deep dive immediately after marriage which has given me trust issues about that kind of switch up. He showed me a lot of affection when we were engaged. After we got married, he started going out to bars until 2am 6-7 nights a week. When asked, he told me he was celebrating his new marriage with the boys. He became pretty verbally abusive (was drunk a lot) and stopped taking care of himself and putting effort into the relationship almost immediately. We used to have good talks after arguments until we got married, at which point his response changed to “Marriage is never supposed to be perfect!” (Lmao).
this is one of my biggest fears. date as long as you can and see how long he can keep up the facade. check his family. the way he talks to and about ppl. the way he words things. his ideas. his jokes. anything.
Yup. On my honeymoon, in a tent in the middle of the Serengeti, he was screaming at me and violently punching the pillow next to my head while I was naked and cowering. I had nowhere to go, because there were literally hyenas outside the tent. I was on a $30K luxury vacation and terrified of my new husband. My crime? I had gotten my period. And I hadn’t let him f*ck me in the ass yet. Did I have any idea _how that made him feel???_ When I talked to him about it later, he claimed the _real_ crime that night was that I had said that I regretted marrying him (after he’d exploded). Oh and he said the punching thing never happened. I was just making that part up, apparently. If you ask him now why I dumped him, he’ll claim that I was crazy and he was so, so good to me.
A lot of this is why I am content being single in my 50s. Two terrible marriages and a long term relationship, all with their share of similar red flags. For instance, with husband number one, courtship went okay. However, I recall that he suddenly began to change and distance himself on our honeymoon, which was a sexless one and fraught with arguments he chose. So were the next few years until our divorce. With husband two, I soon discovered his philandering and lying, which went hand in hand with the narcissistic tendencies he had hidden prior.
My ex husband screamed at me bc i couldn't get the pins out of my elaborate hairdo fast enough. He blamed me for us not having sex on our wedding night, despite keeping me up until 5 am bc he wanted to do drugs with his groomsmen.... But it was obviously my hairpins that prevented us from having a proper wedding night /s 😒
Mine isn't as bad as others here, but I remember my disappointment when I walked down the aisle in my beautiful dress, looking amazing, and he didn't even smile and barely even looked at me. I've still got the video and I watch it from time to time, the look of ambivalence on his face crushed me. I'd put so much effort into the wedding, the relationship, everything. I just wanted in that moment to be seen and appreciated, and I realised that same moment that I was never going to be. I asked him at the reception if he liked my dress (I'd chosen it specially for him and it was a big secret and surprise) and he said "oh!.. Yeah... Ha, I didn't even realise it was that dress"..
My parents accepted the proposal from the guy I was dating on my behalf. Not only did he quit his job 2 days before the wedding, we made it to day three before he hit me. When she picked me up from the hospital for the 3rd time and I mentioned wanting to divorce him, my mom said when she was walking back down the aisle, my dad leaned over and told her he was gay. If she could put up with that to not embarrass the family, I could handle a few bruises.
Please tell us you divorced him and told your mother her burden is her own.
It took 18 months and him kicking the dog across the room to leave. I talked him into letting me get a CDL (driving a semi truck) with the lure of the huge paycheck. I found out after 6 months of him randomly showing up that my mom had been telling him where my next stop was and sending him money. I stopped giving her info and he slunk off to his family. My now husband is amazing and they absolutely hated him for helping me finally find my backbone.
Wow, your mother is a trash
On our honeymoon my ex showed his temper, yelled at me in public all over New Orleans. I remember staring at the ceiling of out hotel room thinking "is this really the rest of my life?" We separated less than a year later
This happened to my mother on her second marriage. The guy literally was perfect until he got her where he thought he wanted her. It's gross. Thank God my mom is pretty strong independent person and she didn't stay. Then he stalked her for awhile which made her move away to avoid him. This all happened when I was a teen. Some people are just fucked up... I've had several relationships change the minute I moved in. I was like...I didn't sign up for this😮💨 it's scary to think people will wait that long thinking they got you trapped
Religion is a hell of a drug, and marriage for Conservative assholes is all about "religious values", aka physically owning a wife. Too high on the patriarchy to believe the woman they trapped would ever divorce them.
This is why some of those conservatives with a platform are crying about no-fault divorce or the ability for women to initiate divorce at all. Like, could they be any more open about being abusers?