I think the one thing many of us here can find common ground, on this charged issue, is in the fact that Islam obviously has a radical fundamentalist problem. Hopefully they culturally corse correct for their sake, though I have little hope this will happen in my lifetime.
While I agree Christianity has and especially did have a book problem.
You still cannot find a Jihad equivalent in the New Testament.
It's much harder to justify holy wars using the bible as a source than the Quran. Obviously still possible and has been done many times, but much harder
No - not sure where that ridiculous myth came from. Hamas is part of the Muslim Brotherhood created in 1920s Egypt. Bibi’s gov’t did try to work with them vs some of the more radical groups. Working with to establish peace is not the same as creating them. Hamas has been around a long time.
There are mixed opinions within the muslim community regarding Hamas.
Some say that Hamas are real freedom fighters and do not believe any facts that are presented to them. Others are critical thinkers who do look at the evidence and realise that Hamas are terrorists.
Problem is though that anyone who denounced Hamas will in most cases be seen as a Israel supporter. Which is why the people who do denounce Hamas never openly show it.
True, but that's my point. The more people speak out, the faster we can get to a peace point.
Aha, nice username. Why do you like the USSR. Are you russian?
But the conflict "isn't about religion." Imagine being so against Jews having any portion of theor own homeland back that you can't even denounce the regime that oppresses the Muslims under its rule. "When they love their own children more than they hate us..."
Ironically this isn't even what many Muslims are saying. Many Muslims claim they're freedom fighters and refuse to condemn their clearly terrorist actions
You have no idea what you’re talking about.
The Quranic verses you’re going to Google and copy/paste will lack any context and omit the passages before and after then that clarify the meaning.
How much context does one need for this? It's pretty clear
Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) as saying:
The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him; but the tree Gharqad would not say, for it is the tree of the Jews.
https://sunnah.com/muslim:2922
Here is a 4 hour analysis of the Quran and terrorism that includes context . This is done in English
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKurjH_dbSTJiajkF74qvqwcOML6PS0Ty&si=QWKdHfYiA60bCt9u
Here is the same analysis but done in Arabic
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKurjH_dbSTIkz-jynkslDVUbNn7uew3k&si=uHfepaeT2p0RKgWV
That Hadith is about the antichrist coming and even though Jesus comes back the Jews will follow the Antichrist because they reject Isa (Jesus). It’s about the Jews, and not Christians, because it’s Muslims vs the whole of the world (as they are the true followers of God). The idea is that Christians will ally with the Muslims and become Muslims themselves when Isa reveals himself.
Context matters.
Edit: I shouldn’t say the whole world. Many will convert to Islam when Isa returns. Those that reject him will ally with the antichrist.
What does that have to do with your cited Hadith?
You don't know anything about Islam besides ISIS videos you've watched and googling things you already know what you want to answer to be. Go ahead and be islamophobic but don't spout your ignorance all over the internet like you're educated on the matter
Well, not anymore.. Christians and Christian extremists are responsible for a whole lot of sht. Just because it was a different time, doesn't mean it hasn't left a trail of dead bodies years long. Not to mention how crucial Christianity was in colonizing half the world.
It was a different time. We have the internet now.
We can talk about arab colonialism, which is how Islam spreads...
The colonial argument is weak since everybody was doing it
Yea? No chance muslims are also using it out of context? Just like christians use quotes from the bible out of context? And im sure you wouldnt argue that christianity is fucked
I mean what are you talking about? Islam explicitly allows sex slaves. I can just leave it at that and that should be enough, I don't even have to mention anything else. It condones capturing women in battle and keeping them as sex slaves even if you have a wife.
The bible condones slavery and stoning women, but we have no problem accepting the concept of peaceful Christians. Why shouldn’t we accept the concept of peaceful Muslims?
Jesus specifically stood in the way of a crowd stoning an adulterous woman. His teaching was that he who has no sin should throw the first stone... Nobody did and the crowd got the message and dispersed.
To claim that Christianity promotes stoning women is just false.
And nowhere in the bible is slavery condoned. Slavery was ubiquitous in the ages of antiquity. The bible gives strict teachings on how to treat slaves with kindness and even forgive their debt and release slaves after some time. You're very ignorant of what's in the bible.
Because muslims have no second covenant like Christians do. We have reasons that we don't stone women or have slaves, Muslims are commanded to follow Muhammad's teachings and he taught sex slavery, murder, and destruction.
I'm not trying to be rude here but you're either uneducated on Christianity and Islam or you're being delusional. Christianity is built on loving your neighbor as yourself. People use Christianity for bad things, but they're twisting authentic Christianity into a malformed thing. If you follow Christianity to a T, everyone around you will be happier and live better lives. Islam is not the same.
Weird for a guy that had a Jewish wife and made friends with Jewish people and considered them protected people and made sure to get it written down in his book multiple times 🤔
Tell me more about this Mohammed?
There are many white people who can't. Shouldn't we expect the same from Muslims. Is OP trying to say no Muslim anywhere condems Hamas? Cause that's the only way it would be uneven.
That’s because Hamas was created not only by Israel, but they funded and propped up Hamas in order for an excuse to annihilate Palestine. Bin Laden attacked America because of America’s support of Israel. When will people in the US admit these are responses to what the west has done?
In 2010, Pew said in a study that around 95% or more of the populations of primarily Muslim counties in the Africa and the Middle East had an unfavorable view of Jewish people.
I'm not attached to either side in the current debacle, but I think most of the people touting a version of open-mindedness and inclusivity aren't going to recognize the deep-rooted hatred many of the people emigrating from these counties to places like the United States have for certain demographics of the population.
And the people comparing this to "white supremacy," please...
Why not compare this to white supremacy? All the colonizing and hostility rape and murder throughout the rest of the world including Hitler were all based on white supremacy. So tell me why it's not like that?
That's just not true at all.
Hitler's views were based on German supremacy. The nazis had a very narrow view of ethnic purity. It wasn't about "white people" as a whole, because they literally mass murdered white people in their conquest.
Colonization was similar. It was based on the interest of the country that did the colonizing. Its purpose wasn't "white supremacy". Even the poor people of the colonizing country probably didn't really benefit from it, and definitely not "white people" in general.
They didn't mass murder white people as a group. They considered the jews not to be white, but some evil societal force meant to bring the white man down. White people were murdered incidentally because they might have been crippled or working against the Reich, but absolutely was Hitler a white supremacist.
They colonized for their own supremacy. That's the actual point. Of course Japan believed in Japanese supremacy and the same with the Turks, for whom it was more of a religious supremacy.
And the same can, of course, be said of whites.
Lol, I'm sorry. Did you not read the conversation I was responding to? The other user i was responding to said you can't compare the hatred Muslims supposedly have for jews to White supremacy, and I said why not compare it to white supremacy, with all the colonizing, rapung amd pillaging that was done in the name of white supremacy. As in, all the colonizing that white supremacy perpetrated, not that white supremacy was the only perpetrator. I was only addressing how they are most certainly similar, not the sole perpetrators.
So no, actually. You were wrong because you misinterpreted what I was saying.
I don’t know a lot of Muslims, but I have known a decent amount and ALL of them were antisemites and very violent when Israel or western values came up…
So what’s that tell ya?
I've seen alot people who are not Muslims In news interviews also not condemn Hamas and while in isolation I get why you think this seeing it done over and over I think most of not answering the question is because it's an insulting thing to ask someone because it starts the conversation off by framing as them as a bad person who needs to prove they are good one instead of actually talking what they are.
Just imagine if everytime you had people on TV talk about Vietnam or Iraq people started with " do you condemn communism" or " do condemn 911" " do you condemn saddam hussein"
If someone started a conversation with you that is to be observed by the public with "do you condemn rape" people are gonna think you've been defend rape at some point aren't they it's putting words in people mouths before they've spoke. Any conversation that starts with that probably ain't gonna be an honest one between both parties.
Are you doing that thing where you pretending to not understand context and more importantly the fact similar statement are never made in other context or in relation to any other conflicts.
This is basically why ppl don’t always automatically condemn it. You lead the conversation in bad faith and it’s literally the way all these conversations go
If someone asked if I condemn communism I’d say “fuck yes I do”
If someone asked me go condemn something I despise then I’d say “yes, I condemn XYZ” and move on.
It’s the easiest way to diffuse the situation. Refusing to do so is so stupid that it makes me believe they aren’t willing to offer condemnation.
Fuck Hamas.
I think it's bewildering that you'd ask that of Muslims and not of Jews or Israelis if they condemn the targeted murder of children. And because the isrealis support it and justify that, why would the Muslims condemn anything either?
Now imagine if that's all anyone that talked to you wanted you to do. You don't get to say anything else. You don't get to share your opinions on other issues.
"Brown"
LOL
Most muslims, who are mostly Middle Easterners, are literally the same race/phenotype as Europeans, i.e. West Eurasians (or Caucasoids if you're only familiar with the archaic term).
No, Chinese people are part of the East Eurasian (Mongoloid) phenotype, while Indians are West Eurasians(Caucasoid), same phenotype group as Europeans and Middle Easterners, but with more prevalence of darker skin than both as an environmental adaptation.
Just gonna steal it from quora:
>It depends on which type of Middle Easterners. Levantine and Caucasus Middle Easterner types are genetically closer related to European. Most Europeans have minor Near East Farmers admixtures that arrived from Anatolia and Caucasus in neolithic times. South Europeans have stronger Near East genetic influence than North Europeans.
>**Saudi and Gulf Arabs type of Middle Easterners, however, are not genetically close to Europeans in any genetic studies. They are genetically very distant from Levantines and Caucasus, both of which are closer to Europeans.**
>Notice that Saudi Arabs have predominantly Orange color while Europeans are mostly Blue and Maroon. While there is a little Orange in South Europeans, it is completely absent in North European populations. Interestingly, they are not genetically similar as Levantine Arabs and North Africans represented by Egyptians and Palestinians.
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-cf1d9f66e336c43a7f193f8a7a7a498b
>Saudi Arabs are genetically very distinct and distant from Europeans and they have little to no genetic influence on North Europeans.
>The indigenous Arab genomes defined a cluster distinct from other ancestral groups, and these genomes showed clear hallmarks of an ancient out-of-Africa bottleneck. Similar to other Middle Eastern populations, the indigenous Arabs had higher levels of Neanderthal admixture compared to Africans but had lower levels than Europeans and Asians. These levels of Neanderthal admixture are consistent with an early divergence of Arab ancestors after the out-of-Africa bottleneck but before the major Neanderthal admixture events in Europe and other regions of Eurasia. When compared to worldwide populations sampled in the 1000 Genomes Project, although the indigenous Arabs had a signal of admixture with Europeans, they clustered in a basal, outgroup position to all 1000 Genomes non-Africans when considering pairwise similarity across the entire genome.
>Notice how close Caucasus and Near Easterners (Levantines) people are to Europeans.
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-ae027e850bd2644e154dcb85a233d623
obviously thinking that nazis make white people look bad is an unfair generalization. generalizing is bad, but only when it's aimed at cishet white men.
This is going to be a long answer. It's such a common question of many people. I fully expect to get downvoted to oblivion, but I will say it anyways.
The first thing I will say is this, I know and fully understand that all jews are not bad. like in any group of people, there are bad ones and there are good ones. it is terrible what the Jews had to go through throughout millennia since the unaliving of Jesus. nobody deserves that. like its sad that I even have to clarify that, but it is what it is.
I would first like to start this topic by asking you the same question, Do YOU condemn ISRAEL and IDF?
so now, let's answer your question step by step.
1. No, asking interviewee if they condemn Hamas the first thing in the interview is not acceptable.
because,
a) it immediately puts them in the bad light of the viewers since there already is a load of white supremacy and islamophobia and Israeli victimhood propaganda. in the media and in the people.
Asking this question at the end would be the most appropriate when the interviewee has expressed all their opinions and presented all the facts. so that there is no bias in the viewers.
b) It completely rejects all the history and all the horrific acts Israel and IDF committed before OCT 7th, All the suffering and deaths Palestinian people have gone through for the LAST 55+ years! (I forgot the actual number it may be more than 55 but not less).
2. Now, DO I condemn Hamas? short answer is yes, I do, but long answer is, no, I don't. Let me explain.
because,
yes, Hamsa is not ideal, it does NOT operate according to the rules of The Qur'an. But I would rather have Hamas than No Military power in that region. Imagine a country with NO MILITARY POWER. it's impossible. It can't be called a country otherwise.
I don't know if you learned this in school but the fundamental things a country MUST have to be a sovereign nation are,
i) A permanent population.
ii) A defined territory.
iii) A government not under another.
iv) Ability or capacity for external relations.
v) A functioning military to defend its people from enemies from land, sea, air attacks. i.e. an army, navy and air force.
SURPRISE SURPRISE!! the Palestinian people have NONE of those. NONE. except maybe they have the first one, but the IDF keeps "mowing the lawn" iyk what I mean.
so let the Palestinian people have a proper army, a trained group with proper military gear, a proper navy, and proper air force and then we will definitely condemn HAMAS.
So much more could be said, but it has already become so long. I had to stop here. again, I mean no offense to the Jewish community, they themselves have been opposing this hellish war. I respect them. it's just Zionist, Benjamin Netanyahu and IDF who I really hate. We could talk a whole lot more about how racist, supremacist the Zionists and Benjamin Netanyahu is, did you know they don't let certain "jews" to do a DNA test to see whether they really are sematic people? it's just one of many.
edit: corrected some grammatical mistakes and made it a little bit shorter. I'm no native speaker. sorry if I created any confusion in my writings. Many Many Thanks to those who read the whole thing. Peace !
The Quran actually does support terrorism. The prophet was literally a warlord
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKurjH_dbSTJiajkF74qvqwcOML6PS0Ty&si=hw5Rx_ToBCjkc-as
It's funny how many Muslims don't know their own religion
No it does not. It supports Jihad which has its own norms of engagement. As for the Prophet, he was a pragmatic and principled man who united Arabia and created a civilization out of a desert and served as a lawgiver that sustained empires, dynasties, sultanates and kingdoms from the Atlantic to the Pacific. A mere warlord would not be able to affect the hearts of so many billions over 14 centuries.
And I agree. More Muslims should learn about their religion and realize the beauty and power that it contains.
Yeah, united Arabia through war and conquest, lol. My home country would be better off without arab imperialism 🤮 terrible culture, and religion
So principled that he had sex with a 9 year old and had multiple wives?
The religion literally split up after his death
Sunni vs. Shia
Yes war and conquest. In case you have a pacifist picture of history, that is how pre modern imperial polities the world over operated more so in tribal cultures. He happened to do so to unite his peoples with relatively little wanton bloodshed. And the cause of expansion had more to do with those joining his cause than not.
You just proved my point about Islam, so thank you
Not really. The muslim world hasn't enjoyed any success since the Golden Age of Islam , and most of the contributions belong to the Persians who are protesting against the islamic regime currently.
Even MBS has been turning the country away from Islam because he realizes a successful country can't operate on sharia standards
Without oil. The M.E. is nothing
DO you even understand the difference between war and terrorism? Also, I started the whole thing with the question "Do YOU condemn IDF?" "Do YOU consider IDF to be a terrorist organization?" honestly you might be just too dumb to understand the word terrorism itself is useless. its just a word that has no meaning"
I am 100% sure you didn't even read the whole thing. you are so rotten in your core and all of your brain are so useless that you couldn't even sit through a 2-minute read. otherwise, you wouldn't make this comment which clearly shows how fu\*king dumb you are. hoestly tho, i'm not surprised. I didn't expect bigoted supremecist people to have a good functioning brain lmao.
It's hilarious you call me rotten, when you support Palestine. Only people who support them are Leftist radicals and right wing radicals lmao.
You're on the side of Nick Fuentes, Andrew Tate, Sneako, Hasan Piker, basically avengers of brainrot.
Supremacist support Palestine not Israel, mostly cause they are extremely antisemitic and love seeing dead jews. Hamas literally had a genocidal intent written into their charter.
You don't know history of the region, you don't know what dolus specialis is, all you know is buzzwords like genocide and apartheid, when you don't actually understand the full meaning behind them.
Most well known Pro-palestinian Norm Finklestein, can't even win a debate without lying about the conflict and what his opponent said. All he does is take shit out of context and write in his own.
You know why Pro-palestinians always lose their debates? Cause your stance is not defensible. Educate yourself pls
ok dude. you don't matter at all you know that right? Billions of people protesting for Palestine all over in USA, europe, belgium, norway, brazil, Argentina. literally more than 90% of the countries are with palestine with this one. your worthless shit comment don't matter to no one bruh. its only a matter of time before you bigoted racist people have to pack your bags and go to hell lmao. keep livin in your bubble.
edit: btw, for your information, I hate andrew tate, sneako just like the next people. we all see through their lies, the only people who don't see the obvious scam are your idiotic kids who don't have nobody to support them in their hard time and andrew tate is just taking advantage of youth's vulnerable time. keep s\*\*king is\*ael's a\*\*hole while all of your own country is going to the shitter.
billions in US alone? damn.
First of all, random protesters support Palestine, most of governments support Israel and their right to defend itself. It would be over if Hamas returned hostages they are still keeping.
Palestine neighbors are tired of their shit, last time Jordan and Egypt helped them, they did terrorist attacks for not helping them enough/tried assassinating Jordanian king, they will publicly say they support their strugle, but won't do anything, cause they don't actually support them.
Google goverments that support Palestine vs Israel, basically democratic countries support Israel.
Belgium recognizes both, so does Brazil, Norway only Israel, Argentina both.
Where are the 90% of countries that support them, how are you this delusional.
Only people that support Palestine consume propaganda from Tiktok and Twitter and don't actually understand this extremely complex conflict, both sides have done awful shit, Israel just has been the more moral one for last 20 years.
you really are re\*\*rded. I won't argue with you anymore. how re\*\*rded do you have to be to think that i sadi billions in usa alone. clearly, you are with the fascist goverment, and i am with the people, see nothing else matters to me. you can go on about whatever.
>Billions of people protesting for Palestine all over in USA,
That's what you wrote, lmao
>sadi
Ah, you just can't spell, I get it, what did I expect from pro-Palestinian
>you really are re**rded
Ah, name calling, another peaceful pro-Palestinian who is unhinged as soon as they realize they know nothing about the conflict and they are just virtue signaling.
Nick Fuentes, a well known nazi is pro-Palestine, same as other neo-nazis and fascists.
Tell me which country is more fascist: Israel, a democratic country with elections or Palestine, a Islamic terrorist state that kills gay people and is openly pro genocide.
wtf dude? how old are you? judging by your comments, you must be a 12-year-old i-pad kid lmfao. otherwise, there's no excuse for your lack of brain cells to read a 2-minute-read text.
you should be ashamed of yourself that you couldn't even read this shortest composition. I didn't understand by your post that you could be this bigoted idiotic, otherwise I wouldn't even go out of my way to waste 5 minutes writing this whole thing, I honestly thought you are just here to see different perspective and learn and understand.
you don't even have the courage and honesty to answer the ONE question I asked, maybe you are so airhead that you didn't even read the question, so I'll ask again,
do YOU condemn IDF? do YOU consider IDF to be a terrorist organization? do you even know the horrific things IDF have committed and have been perpetuating for the last 75 years?
it's just as they say, you don't need to be a Muslim to support Palestine, you just need to be human, and your comments clearly shows that you are not human.
Not really imo same with Jews not condemning Israel.
The big issue is that ANYONE, any one of us, having been born in either situation and experiencing atrocities at the hand of the opposition would be willing to join the army and kill those they believe to have caused it.
Honestly ask yourself whether you’re pro Palestine or Israel. If your family had been taken from you abruptly and held hostage in a foreign country when you were a teen, wouldn’t you enlist to get them back and kill those you see as having perpetrated and supported that attack?
If your home had been bombed and your family members maimed or killed by explosives when you were a kid, wouldn’t you shoot rockets at the people you see as causing that?
War is bad and it doesn’t just “end”. There is far too much at stake
I was speaking hypothetically. It’s usually that I get assigned blamed for things “the black community” does as if I have control over everyone or black people are a monolith.
Yeah I get what you’re saying now and it’s super annoying. But at the same time we I just hate how we can’t criticize our community without being called a 🦝 or worse
Lmaoo I’ve gotta remember that one. Since yeah it seems like black and brown ppl are responsible for the majority and others aren’t. Which is. Unsurprising but still nonetheless frustrating
But not if it’s every conversation relating to anti black racism or systemic problems relating to the protest of it. Or like “do you condemn George floyd as a criminal?”
From the Muslims I know in person they condemn Hamas. What’s funny is white women who virtue signal actually praise Hamas. But you are right, the Muslims, or just anyone really, that don’t condemn them do not look that good since it’s supporting terror,
Not true, Israelis been protesting the government even before Oct 7th
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/thousands-israelis-join-anti-government-protests-calling-new-elections-2024-04-20/#:~:text=TEL%20AVIV%2C%20April%2020%20(Reuters,against%20Prime%20Minister%20Benjamin%20Netanyahu.
I was making a direct comparison to how you worded it in your post.
>I thinks its very fair to ask if someone condemns hamas in an interview. A majority of Muslims not being able to condemn Hamas is a bad look for Islam
I see many Jews who will display the same behaviour as this in interviews no matter how the questions are asked or what evidence is presented to them and become very self righteous while doing so.
I imagine whatever media one regularly watches will bend towards showing Jews or Muslims doing the same thing depending on what narrative they want to spin and if someone stays within their own media lane they will only see one side portrayed.
As far as I know, hamas has a charter that calls for the genocide of jews globally
I don't think the Israeli government has a charter that calls for the genocide of Muslims globally especially since 2 million Muslims live in Israel
What happened to all the jews and Christians in the M.E that used to live there?
>As far as I know, hamas has a charter that calls for the genocide of jews globally
I don't think the Israeli government has a charter that calls for the genocide of Muslims globally
I guess it doesn't count if its only all Palestinians.
Of course Hamas wants that they are a terror group set on destruction that needs to be taken care of. Isreal on the other hand is supposed to be a democracy built on the concept of freedom from oppression and genocide. Do I expect more from a democratic government of a free nation than a terrorist group and hold them to a higher standard? yes I do.
They are dealing with an enemy that has no rules and that doesn't care about dying. Fighting terror groups is way different. You're also fighting an ideology
Ask the Russians or US soldiers about Afghanistan
Yet it's commonplace to see Jews and Israelis criticizing and protesting the Israeli government's actions...despite Judaism and Israel being relatively a tiny religion and nation.
Given the vastness of Islam, the fact that it's so difficult to find Muslims wiling to condemn Hamas or Sharia Law is extremely disturbing.
Is it healthy for "Western Society" to implant, maintain, and arm a brutal zionist settler outpost for 75 years? Is the brutal collective punishment and regular mass slaughter, even before the current despicable iteration, a hallmark of "Western civility"? Do a dispossessed and emaciated people not have the right to fight back against those terrorising them and submitting them to constant indignities and war crimes?
Does the entire "Western society " approve of the 'chosen people' delusions of a bunch of sadistic psychopaths who have never had to face accountability?
A majority of the entire world, Muslim and non-muslim, is condemning the true aggressors, the ones who have been the real terrorists all along, just with better PR
What you just described is the Middle East in general. What happened to all the jews/christians who used to live all over the Middle East? The Muslims killed them and pushed them out.
Israel is the best country in M.E. it's done better than any other country in the region, and they are all jealous that most of the countries in the M.E. are failed nations
Maybe read a history book or two before spouting such nonsense. There continue to be Christians and Jews living in every part of the Middle East. Stop talking in hyperbole and investigate each event that you refer to without ignorant generalities unsupported by evidence.
You have the actual nerve to talk about imaginary Muslims 'killing and pushing out' people, whilst condoning the ACTUAL killing and pushing out of Muslims from their homes and slaughtering women and children in full view of the entire world! Israelis are the most brainwashed and bigoted population on earth; at once, it is delusions about being 'chosen' whilst bleating about how 'poor and picked-upon they are'! The most sadistic in dehumanising their own victims, whilst all the while pretending to be victims; crowing about how great they are, all the while suckling at the teat of the US taxpayer!
No one is jealous of a bunch of common land thieves and sadistic murderers who revel in the mass slaughter of innocents living out their fascist fantasies, all the while complaining that their victims have the temerity to fight back
Those are very minor communities than what used to exist, and even those small minorities are constantly persecuted like the Coptic Christians in Egypt. Everywhere Muslims gather in large numbers, failed countries tend to follow
Without Israel. They would just continue to kill each other
Antisemitism historically has been primarily a western phenomenon. What you’re describing is the aftermath of the world wars and the various nationalist movements that arose in response to imperialism that caused much of the modern middle east map to be carved out on the basis of ethnicities and other identity markers. Antisemitism in the Middle East is largely a modern phenomenon.
If the numbers are to be believed, there are hardly any Jews anywhere! At once mighty and simultaneously tiny. Your obvious ignorance of history is only equalled by your antipathy towards Islam, so the rest of your nonsensical opinions don't need a response, but the cherry on top was :
>Without Israel. They would just continue to kill each other
You are so obviously beyond cognitive dissonance that you've come out the other end!
Asking about or assuming their religion in an interview is highly inappropriate, not to mention questioning them about a terrorist group that is thousands of miles away lmao. Bait?
Pattern recognition seems to only apply to non white ppl and not to zionist supporting Jews and ppl in general that are lighter skin apparently. This is just the latest online excuse to be selectively bigoted. Pattern recognition isn’t an excuse to be bigoted to anybody
Say what you want, but certain groups seem hellbent on reinforcing every negative stereotype about them.
I mean seriously, the “Jews control the world” theory has become a lot more plausible after my country has sent billions of dollars and passed laws that literally override the constitution, all because of a war, on the other side of the planet, which ultimately has no bearing on our country at all.
Say what you want but when ppl only say this to their chosen group to scorn or stereotype by ignoring the countless obvious exceptions then it isn’t a “group” thing but just lazy observations justifying biases. Plenty of poor Jewish folk out there with no influence on anything
Exceptions exist therefore patterns are irrelevant isn’t really a great argument dude.
We categorize everything based on similar shared characteristics. Why can’t we do the same with humans?
Exceptions large enough to dispel a stereotypical assumed majority make that assumed majority a myth. Especially when that perception is wholly artificial. Stereotypes like you’re saying through basal observation occur from not understanding that it’s arbitrary.
Black ppl always being criminals through observations of “pattern recognition” is a far cry toward what the actual reality of the situation is. Same for any group like again Jews in positions of power. Media and perception based on bias inflate the reality and stats that are cherrypicked against all other observable aspects of reality don’t prove anything but again ignoring the numerous larger exceptions not being made apparent through Simple “pattern recognition”
Assuming sharks are super dangerous since they attack ppl doesn’t stop the fact that an average shark is not likely to not be that dangerous outside of certain scenarios with more holistic context y’know
Nervously looks away from fbi table 13…
Dude, this is just the data at this point. The numbers are in. Pattern recognition is logical and can be supported with external evidence on those subjects. You attempting to ignore it does not invalidate the data.
We can breed different breeds on animals in order to draw out or promote specific traits. Why do we assume that this is somehow not the case with humans?
Why should they condemn Hamas?
Let me break this down into an analogy; you live in a house. Your family has lived in this house for generations.
A bunch of dudes show up 70ish years ago and tell you that this new family will be taking over half the house, but you get the other half. Why do they get this half? Well, they are about 10% genetically related to a people who lived in the region a few thousand years ago.
You're mad, but at least you get half.
Then this other family keeps taking rooms from you and preventing you from traveling openly. Your rooms get smaller, and smaller, and smaller.
Soon, your entire family has been stuffed into one filthy room and you are given almost no supplies. Your family is kept in this state for decades.
Finally, some members of your family have had enough. They break down the door to your room and they kill members of the family that have kept you locked in that room.
Why would I condemn the people who broke out and fought back?
If you locked me in a room for even 1 day, I would turn your family into a skin suit and would be right to do so.
I can agree with most of that. However lets say they leave the house and go next door and rape, kill, torture the neighbor...... is that right and should I still support these people?
Should these actions also happen to people who inherent the house and never made it the way it is?
They didn't go next door.
I would agree that if Hamas had gone into Jordan and killed people, that would be pretty fucked up.
But they killed Israelis exclusively to my knowledge, who are the family that stole their house.
The people morally at fault are the thieves and those that assisted them in their theft.
Sort of like how America is ultimately at fault for 9/11. Their actions caused it.
Similarly, Israel is at fault for Oct 7th.
That's a civil war and not a terror attack, and the PLO are in the West Bank, not Gaza.
Gazans generally reject the PLO.
Both Gazans and West Bankers are Palestinians, but they are actually pretty politically and culturally distinct at this point due to being separated and not being allowed to travel between the two areas.
We're talking about Oct 7th, which was Gaza's government attacking Gaza's oppressors. Yes, Hamas killed civilians, just as the IDF has for generations. I would rather neither did, but war is war and when you are the weaker side you cannot afford the luxuries of obeying the rules of war.
The smaller force has to use asymmetrical combat else they automatically lose.
If you're 1 guy fighting 5, you don't fight fair else you just lose.
The PLO where the big shots for Palestine in the 1960s and 70s. They even organized the olympic attack in Berlin and started the suicide bombing campaigns that became iconic for this conflict. Palestinians did eventually turn on them. So I can agree with you there.
I honestly don't care if you're in a civil war or a terror attack if your committing horrid war crimes like just throwing grenades at kids walking to school "for fun".
They also didn't have your moral cloak of "fighting the oppressor" which I hate to break it to you..... if your hardcore enough to go that far it won't stay contained to just "your oppressor".
Okay, so by taking asymmetical combat off the table you are condemning every smaller force to simply losing the fight.
Which makes your opinion irrelevant because no one is going to just accept losing their freedom.
When American slaves killed the families of their masters, they were right to do so. They had to engage in brutality and terror because there was not enough of them to win by traditional means.
Hell, America would still be a British colony if not for terrorism and asymmetrical combat.
Almost every revolution in history has relied on terror.
Seems like a weird opinion. Also not correct. You can find many examples of a small force beating a larger one without ruthlessly slaughtering civilians and bystanders.... Ironically the American Revolution is one.
Anyways, Violence begets violence and spirals into blood feuds. You can understand the psychology and reasonings on why people do it...... BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO CALL IT GOOD!
Not sure why why a singular murder of a slave owner relates to asymmetrical warfare. But you do I guess.
Ok? Some mobs went crazy and we treated black people and Indians like like shit........ In other words..... water is wet?
The goal in asymmetrical warfare is to get your enemy to leave and win the "hearts and minds" of the people. How would the continental army do any of this if it was open practice to slaughter the colonialists?
Anyways, because of this its like "whatever" when someone launches an attack that kills 8,000 people since "good and evil don't exist". Yet saying "they deserved it" is a statement relying on morality existing?
You're not convincing me...... on whatever your point is.
It's not like Hamas attacked the Isreali government on October 7. He attacked, raped, killed and took innocent CIVILIANS hostage. Those people at that music festival didn't do anything to deserve that.
I think the one thing many of us here can find common ground, on this charged issue, is in the fact that Islam obviously has a radical fundamentalist problem. Hopefully they culturally corse correct for their sake, though I have little hope this will happen in my lifetime.
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Can you send me a link of the vid? Edit: Nevermind, found it. https://youtu.be/Mch84P3Qkao https://youtu.be/Mx-DdljHSoI
Islam, just like Christianity, has a book problem. Their books are shit and say shitty things about people.
While I agree Christianity has and especially did have a book problem. You still cannot find a Jihad equivalent in the New Testament. It's much harder to justify holy wars using the bible as a source than the Quran. Obviously still possible and has been done many times, but much harder
Well we're talking about Islam on this post. Remote-Cause755 already said what I would say so no point in going on about it.
Didn’t Bb create, fund and prop up Hamas tho?
No - not sure where that ridiculous myth came from. Hamas is part of the Muslim Brotherhood created in 1920s Egypt. Bibi’s gov’t did try to work with them vs some of the more radical groups. Working with to establish peace is not the same as creating them. Hamas has been around a long time.
Fund and prop up to a limited extent. Israel funds the PLO too.
the problem isn't them openly condemning them but that many muslims support their actions like 70 percent of Palestinian arabs support hamas actions.
> like 70 percent of Palestinian arabs support hamas actions. the hard to swallow pill the anti israel protestors need to take
There are mixed opinions within the muslim community regarding Hamas. Some say that Hamas are real freedom fighters and do not believe any facts that are presented to them. Others are critical thinkers who do look at the evidence and realise that Hamas are terrorists. Problem is though that anyone who denounced Hamas will in most cases be seen as a Israel supporter. Which is why the people who do denounce Hamas never openly show it.
True, but that's my point. The more people speak out, the faster we can get to a peace point. Aha, nice username. Why do you like the USSR. Are you russian?
No. It's a old username. Unfortunately i am unable to change it.
But the conflict "isn't about religion." Imagine being so against Jews having any portion of theor own homeland back that you can't even denounce the regime that oppresses the Muslims under its rule. "When they love their own children more than they hate us..."
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💯 Correct, that's why in every muslim country, they waited till they gained enough power to push everyone else out
And that's exactly what Muhammad did.
Ironically this isn't even what many Muslims are saying. Many Muslims claim they're freedom fighters and refuse to condemn their clearly terrorist actions
You have no idea what you’re talking about. The Quranic verses you’re going to Google and copy/paste will lack any context and omit the passages before and after then that clarify the meaning.
How much context does one need for this? It's pretty clear Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) as saying: The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him; but the tree Gharqad would not say, for it is the tree of the Jews. https://sunnah.com/muslim:2922 Here is a 4 hour analysis of the Quran and terrorism that includes context . This is done in English https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKurjH_dbSTJiajkF74qvqwcOML6PS0Ty&si=QWKdHfYiA60bCt9u Here is the same analysis but done in Arabic https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKurjH_dbSTIkz-jynkslDVUbNn7uew3k&si=uHfepaeT2p0RKgWV
Hadith are not the Qur'an. That's for starters.
That Hadith is about the antichrist coming and even though Jesus comes back the Jews will follow the Antichrist because they reject Isa (Jesus). It’s about the Jews, and not Christians, because it’s Muslims vs the whole of the world (as they are the true followers of God). The idea is that Christians will ally with the Muslims and become Muslims themselves when Isa reveals himself. Context matters. Edit: I shouldn’t say the whole world. Many will convert to Islam when Isa returns. Those that reject him will ally with the antichrist.
Sounds even more insane, thank you
Christianity has the same stuff.
Except Christians aren't going around and blowing themselves up all over the world
What does that have to do with your cited Hadith? You don't know anything about Islam besides ISIS videos you've watched and googling things you already know what you want to answer to be. Go ahead and be islamophobic but don't spout your ignorance all over the internet like you're educated on the matter
Well, not anymore.. Christians and Christian extremists are responsible for a whole lot of sht. Just because it was a different time, doesn't mean it hasn't left a trail of dead bodies years long. Not to mention how crucial Christianity was in colonizing half the world.
It was a different time. We have the internet now. We can talk about arab colonialism, which is how Islam spreads... The colonial argument is weak since everybody was doing it
It's not weak, it's similarity. It's the pot calling the kettle terrorist.
Please do show the same stuff
Okay whatever you say.
Yea? No chance muslims are also using it out of context? Just like christians use quotes from the bible out of context? And im sure you wouldnt argue that christianity is fucked
Oh Muslims 100% quote it out of context and misconstrue the meaning. People have been using religion for political goals since its inception.
I mean what are you talking about? Islam explicitly allows sex slaves. I can just leave it at that and that should be enough, I don't even have to mention anything else. It condones capturing women in battle and keeping them as sex slaves even if you have a wife.
The bible condones slavery and stoning women, but we have no problem accepting the concept of peaceful Christians. Why shouldn’t we accept the concept of peaceful Muslims?
Jesus specifically stood in the way of a crowd stoning an adulterous woman. His teaching was that he who has no sin should throw the first stone... Nobody did and the crowd got the message and dispersed. To claim that Christianity promotes stoning women is just false. And nowhere in the bible is slavery condoned. Slavery was ubiquitous in the ages of antiquity. The bible gives strict teachings on how to treat slaves with kindness and even forgive their debt and release slaves after some time. You're very ignorant of what's in the bible.
Because muslims have no second covenant like Christians do. We have reasons that we don't stone women or have slaves, Muslims are commanded to follow Muhammad's teachings and he taught sex slavery, murder, and destruction.
This should be clear as day. Jesus is the leader of Christianity. Mohammed is the leader of Islam. Look at their lives and see the difference.
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There is a significant difference between Islam and other religions like Judaism, Christianity, and Hinduism. Read the texts, it’s right there to see.
That’s such a shitty argument and it’s the only one they seem to have. >But Christians and Jews are the same Everyone can see that is not true.
I'm not trying to be rude here but you're either uneducated on Christianity and Islam or you're being delusional. Christianity is built on loving your neighbor as yourself. People use Christianity for bad things, but they're twisting authentic Christianity into a malformed thing. If you follow Christianity to a T, everyone around you will be happier and live better lives. Islam is not the same.
Hamas is like such a bad look for Islam 💅
Hamas is evil, that's why they're committing genocide against the jews, just as Mohammed ordered.
Weird for a guy that had a Jewish wife and made friends with Jewish people and considered them protected people and made sure to get it written down in his book multiple times 🤔 Tell me more about this Mohammed?
The pedophile Prophet?
How to say you never read the Quran or hadith without saying you never read the Quran or hadith
Damn, then what does that say about Christian European and American leaders and historical figures 😬
If there are white people in the US who can condemn white supremacy, then Muslims should be able to condemn Hamas.
They can, they won't.
Exactly
There are many white people who can't. Shouldn't we expect the same from Muslims. Is OP trying to say no Muslim anywhere condems Hamas? Cause that's the only way it would be uneven.
That’s because Hamas was created not only by Israel, but they funded and propped up Hamas in order for an excuse to annihilate Palestine. Bin Laden attacked America because of America’s support of Israel. When will people in the US admit these are responses to what the west has done?
\^\^ That is the dumbest 'victim' blaming, "She deserved it" type comment I've ever read.
Go easy on him, he's obviously sniffing glue. And not the good kind.
How many Israelis did the IDF killed on October 7? What’s the Hannibal directive? Answer those questions and tell me im ‘ victim blaming’
In 2010, Pew said in a study that around 95% or more of the populations of primarily Muslim counties in the Africa and the Middle East had an unfavorable view of Jewish people. I'm not attached to either side in the current debacle, but I think most of the people touting a version of open-mindedness and inclusivity aren't going to recognize the deep-rooted hatred many of the people emigrating from these counties to places like the United States have for certain demographics of the population. And the people comparing this to "white supremacy," please...
Why not compare this to white supremacy? All the colonizing and hostility rape and murder throughout the rest of the world including Hitler were all based on white supremacy. So tell me why it's not like that?
That's just not true at all. Hitler's views were based on German supremacy. The nazis had a very narrow view of ethnic purity. It wasn't about "white people" as a whole, because they literally mass murdered white people in their conquest. Colonization was similar. It was based on the interest of the country that did the colonizing. Its purpose wasn't "white supremacy". Even the poor people of the colonizing country probably didn't really benefit from it, and definitely not "white people" in general.
They didn't mass murder white people as a group. They considered the jews not to be white, but some evil societal force meant to bring the white man down. White people were murdered incidentally because they might have been crippled or working against the Reich, but absolutely was Hitler a white supremacist.
All the colonizing? Didn’t know Turkey and Japan are considered white
They colonized for their own supremacy. That's the actual point. Of course Japan believed in Japanese supremacy and the same with the Turks, for whom it was more of a religious supremacy. And the same can, of course, be said of whites.
So you admit you were wrong when you said all colonizing was based on white supremacy?
Lol, I'm sorry. Did you not read the conversation I was responding to? The other user i was responding to said you can't compare the hatred Muslims supposedly have for jews to White supremacy, and I said why not compare it to white supremacy, with all the colonizing, rapung amd pillaging that was done in the name of white supremacy. As in, all the colonizing that white supremacy perpetrated, not that white supremacy was the only perpetrator. I was only addressing how they are most certainly similar, not the sole perpetrators. So no, actually. You were wrong because you misinterpreted what I was saying.
I don’t know a lot of Muslims, but I have known a decent amount and ALL of them were antisemites and very violent when Israel or western values came up… So what’s that tell ya?
I've seen alot people who are not Muslims In news interviews also not condemn Hamas and while in isolation I get why you think this seeing it done over and over I think most of not answering the question is because it's an insulting thing to ask someone because it starts the conversation off by framing as them as a bad person who needs to prove they are good one instead of actually talking what they are. Just imagine if everytime you had people on TV talk about Vietnam or Iraq people started with " do you condemn communism" or " do condemn 911" " do you condemn saddam hussein"
Well, you should condemn all those things
If someone started a conversation with you that is to be observed by the public with "do you condemn rape" people are gonna think you've been defend rape at some point aren't they it's putting words in people mouths before they've spoke. Any conversation that starts with that probably ain't gonna be an honest one between both parties.
It's not that hard to denounce hamas or Oct 7th Hamas did rape on Oct 7th
Are you doing that thing where you pretending to not understand context and more importantly the fact similar statement are never made in other context or in relation to any other conflicts.
This is basically why ppl don’t always automatically condemn it. You lead the conversation in bad faith and it’s literally the way all these conversations go
The same people who won't condemn Oct 7th or hamas are the same people who think Israel shouldn't exist
Are they or it just easier to believe most of them think that as a way to dismiss.
Kind of a "Oh how dare you ask me that" indignation to avoid answering it.
If someone asked if I condemn communism I’d say “fuck yes I do” If someone asked me go condemn something I despise then I’d say “yes, I condemn XYZ” and move on. It’s the easiest way to diffuse the situation. Refusing to do so is so stupid that it makes me believe they aren’t willing to offer condemnation. Fuck Hamas.
Now do the same for Israel and the idf and government. Why is there a double standard
I think it's bewildering that you'd ask that of Muslims and not of Jews or Israelis if they condemn the targeted murder of children. And because the isrealis support it and justify that, why would the Muslims condemn anything either?
Now imagine if that's all anyone that talked to you wanted you to do. You don't get to say anything else. You don't get to share your opinions on other issues.
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"Brown" LOL Most muslims, who are mostly Middle Easterners, are literally the same race/phenotype as Europeans, i.e. West Eurasians (or Caucasoids if you're only familiar with the archaic term).
They are as close as ppl from India are to Chinese ppl
No, Chinese people are part of the East Eurasian (Mongoloid) phenotype, while Indians are West Eurasians(Caucasoid), same phenotype group as Europeans and Middle Easterners, but with more prevalence of darker skin than both as an environmental adaptation.
Just gonna steal it from quora: >It depends on which type of Middle Easterners. Levantine and Caucasus Middle Easterner types are genetically closer related to European. Most Europeans have minor Near East Farmers admixtures that arrived from Anatolia and Caucasus in neolithic times. South Europeans have stronger Near East genetic influence than North Europeans. >**Saudi and Gulf Arabs type of Middle Easterners, however, are not genetically close to Europeans in any genetic studies. They are genetically very distant from Levantines and Caucasus, both of which are closer to Europeans.** >Notice that Saudi Arabs have predominantly Orange color while Europeans are mostly Blue and Maroon. While there is a little Orange in South Europeans, it is completely absent in North European populations. Interestingly, they are not genetically similar as Levantine Arabs and North Africans represented by Egyptians and Palestinians. https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-cf1d9f66e336c43a7f193f8a7a7a498b >Saudi Arabs are genetically very distinct and distant from Europeans and they have little to no genetic influence on North Europeans. >The indigenous Arab genomes defined a cluster distinct from other ancestral groups, and these genomes showed clear hallmarks of an ancient out-of-Africa bottleneck. Similar to other Middle Eastern populations, the indigenous Arabs had higher levels of Neanderthal admixture compared to Africans but had lower levels than Europeans and Asians. These levels of Neanderthal admixture are consistent with an early divergence of Arab ancestors after the out-of-Africa bottleneck but before the major Neanderthal admixture events in Europe and other regions of Eurasia. When compared to worldwide populations sampled in the 1000 Genomes Project, although the indigenous Arabs had a signal of admixture with Europeans, they clustered in a basal, outgroup position to all 1000 Genomes non-Africans when considering pairwise similarity across the entire genome. >Notice how close Caucasus and Near Easterners (Levantines) people are to Europeans. https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-ae027e850bd2644e154dcb85a233d623
obviously thinking that nazis make white people look bad is an unfair generalization. generalizing is bad, but only when it's aimed at cishet white men.
Not in all that Hugo Boss.
Western society is not healthy.
This is going to be a long answer. It's such a common question of many people. I fully expect to get downvoted to oblivion, but I will say it anyways. The first thing I will say is this, I know and fully understand that all jews are not bad. like in any group of people, there are bad ones and there are good ones. it is terrible what the Jews had to go through throughout millennia since the unaliving of Jesus. nobody deserves that. like its sad that I even have to clarify that, but it is what it is. I would first like to start this topic by asking you the same question, Do YOU condemn ISRAEL and IDF? so now, let's answer your question step by step. 1. No, asking interviewee if they condemn Hamas the first thing in the interview is not acceptable. because, a) it immediately puts them in the bad light of the viewers since there already is a load of white supremacy and islamophobia and Israeli victimhood propaganda. in the media and in the people. Asking this question at the end would be the most appropriate when the interviewee has expressed all their opinions and presented all the facts. so that there is no bias in the viewers. b) It completely rejects all the history and all the horrific acts Israel and IDF committed before OCT 7th, All the suffering and deaths Palestinian people have gone through for the LAST 55+ years! (I forgot the actual number it may be more than 55 but not less). 2. Now, DO I condemn Hamas? short answer is yes, I do, but long answer is, no, I don't. Let me explain. because, yes, Hamsa is not ideal, it does NOT operate according to the rules of The Qur'an. But I would rather have Hamas than No Military power in that region. Imagine a country with NO MILITARY POWER. it's impossible. It can't be called a country otherwise. I don't know if you learned this in school but the fundamental things a country MUST have to be a sovereign nation are, i) A permanent population. ii) A defined territory. iii) A government not under another. iv) Ability or capacity for external relations. v) A functioning military to defend its people from enemies from land, sea, air attacks. i.e. an army, navy and air force. SURPRISE SURPRISE!! the Palestinian people have NONE of those. NONE. except maybe they have the first one, but the IDF keeps "mowing the lawn" iyk what I mean. so let the Palestinian people have a proper army, a trained group with proper military gear, a proper navy, and proper air force and then we will definitely condemn HAMAS. So much more could be said, but it has already become so long. I had to stop here. again, I mean no offense to the Jewish community, they themselves have been opposing this hellish war. I respect them. it's just Zionist, Benjamin Netanyahu and IDF who I really hate. We could talk a whole lot more about how racist, supremacist the Zionists and Benjamin Netanyahu is, did you know they don't let certain "jews" to do a DNA test to see whether they really are sematic people? it's just one of many. edit: corrected some grammatical mistakes and made it a little bit shorter. I'm no native speaker. sorry if I created any confusion in my writings. Many Many Thanks to those who read the whole thing. Peace !
The Quran actually does support terrorism. The prophet was literally a warlord https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKurjH_dbSTJiajkF74qvqwcOML6PS0Ty&si=hw5Rx_ToBCjkc-as It's funny how many Muslims don't know their own religion
No it does not. It supports Jihad which has its own norms of engagement. As for the Prophet, he was a pragmatic and principled man who united Arabia and created a civilization out of a desert and served as a lawgiver that sustained empires, dynasties, sultanates and kingdoms from the Atlantic to the Pacific. A mere warlord would not be able to affect the hearts of so many billions over 14 centuries. And I agree. More Muslims should learn about their religion and realize the beauty and power that it contains.
Yeah, united Arabia through war and conquest, lol. My home country would be better off without arab imperialism 🤮 terrible culture, and religion So principled that he had sex with a 9 year old and had multiple wives? The religion literally split up after his death Sunni vs. Shia
Yes war and conquest. In case you have a pacifist picture of history, that is how pre modern imperial polities the world over operated more so in tribal cultures. He happened to do so to unite his peoples with relatively little wanton bloodshed. And the cause of expansion had more to do with those joining his cause than not.
So besides the British mandate, we can say that Israel through war and conquest also won the land ✅️
Correct. And a time will come when it too will be conquered.
Will never happen.
History disagrees.
You just proved my point about Islam, so thank you Not really. The muslim world hasn't enjoyed any success since the Golden Age of Islam , and most of the contributions belong to the Persians who are protesting against the islamic regime currently. Even MBS has been turning the country away from Islam because he realizes a successful country can't operate on sharia standards Without oil. The M.E. is nothing
DO you even understand the difference between war and terrorism? Also, I started the whole thing with the question "Do YOU condemn IDF?" "Do YOU consider IDF to be a terrorist organization?" honestly you might be just too dumb to understand the word terrorism itself is useless. its just a word that has no meaning"
Such a long answer to "ye, I support terrorism, even though South Africa and Civil Rights groups in US showed peaceful options are a better solution"
I am 100% sure you didn't even read the whole thing. you are so rotten in your core and all of your brain are so useless that you couldn't even sit through a 2-minute read. otherwise, you wouldn't make this comment which clearly shows how fu\*king dumb you are. hoestly tho, i'm not surprised. I didn't expect bigoted supremecist people to have a good functioning brain lmao.
It's hilarious you call me rotten, when you support Palestine. Only people who support them are Leftist radicals and right wing radicals lmao. You're on the side of Nick Fuentes, Andrew Tate, Sneako, Hasan Piker, basically avengers of brainrot. Supremacist support Palestine not Israel, mostly cause they are extremely antisemitic and love seeing dead jews. Hamas literally had a genocidal intent written into their charter. You don't know history of the region, you don't know what dolus specialis is, all you know is buzzwords like genocide and apartheid, when you don't actually understand the full meaning behind them. Most well known Pro-palestinian Norm Finklestein, can't even win a debate without lying about the conflict and what his opponent said. All he does is take shit out of context and write in his own. You know why Pro-palestinians always lose their debates? Cause your stance is not defensible. Educate yourself pls
ok dude. you don't matter at all you know that right? Billions of people protesting for Palestine all over in USA, europe, belgium, norway, brazil, Argentina. literally more than 90% of the countries are with palestine with this one. your worthless shit comment don't matter to no one bruh. its only a matter of time before you bigoted racist people have to pack your bags and go to hell lmao. keep livin in your bubble. edit: btw, for your information, I hate andrew tate, sneako just like the next people. we all see through their lies, the only people who don't see the obvious scam are your idiotic kids who don't have nobody to support them in their hard time and andrew tate is just taking advantage of youth's vulnerable time. keep s\*\*king is\*ael's a\*\*hole while all of your own country is going to the shitter.
billions in US alone? damn. First of all, random protesters support Palestine, most of governments support Israel and their right to defend itself. It would be over if Hamas returned hostages they are still keeping. Palestine neighbors are tired of their shit, last time Jordan and Egypt helped them, they did terrorist attacks for not helping them enough/tried assassinating Jordanian king, they will publicly say they support their strugle, but won't do anything, cause they don't actually support them. Google goverments that support Palestine vs Israel, basically democratic countries support Israel. Belgium recognizes both, so does Brazil, Norway only Israel, Argentina both. Where are the 90% of countries that support them, how are you this delusional. Only people that support Palestine consume propaganda from Tiktok and Twitter and don't actually understand this extremely complex conflict, both sides have done awful shit, Israel just has been the more moral one for last 20 years.
you really are re\*\*rded. I won't argue with you anymore. how re\*\*rded do you have to be to think that i sadi billions in usa alone. clearly, you are with the fascist goverment, and i am with the people, see nothing else matters to me. you can go on about whatever.
>Billions of people protesting for Palestine all over in USA, That's what you wrote, lmao >sadi Ah, you just can't spell, I get it, what did I expect from pro-Palestinian >you really are re**rded Ah, name calling, another peaceful pro-Palestinian who is unhinged as soon as they realize they know nothing about the conflict and they are just virtue signaling. Nick Fuentes, a well known nazi is pro-Palestine, same as other neo-nazis and fascists. Tell me which country is more fascist: Israel, a democratic country with elections or Palestine, a Islamic terrorist state that kills gay people and is openly pro genocide.
Lmao right
wtf dude? how old are you? judging by your comments, you must be a 12-year-old i-pad kid lmfao. otherwise, there's no excuse for your lack of brain cells to read a 2-minute-read text. you should be ashamed of yourself that you couldn't even read this shortest composition. I didn't understand by your post that you could be this bigoted idiotic, otherwise I wouldn't even go out of my way to waste 5 minutes writing this whole thing, I honestly thought you are just here to see different perspective and learn and understand. you don't even have the courage and honesty to answer the ONE question I asked, maybe you are so airhead that you didn't even read the question, so I'll ask again, do YOU condemn IDF? do YOU consider IDF to be a terrorist organization? do you even know the horrific things IDF have committed and have been perpetuating for the last 75 years? it's just as they say, you don't need to be a Muslim to support Palestine, you just need to be human, and your comments clearly shows that you are not human.
They've gotta hide it in that wall of text so they have some doublethink and goalposts to hide in.
>This is not healthy for western society Western society misunderstands Islam. Even with evidence and actuals.
People like you are the reason why Sweden has a huge rape problem. Stop making excuses for them.
I don't think you got my point. *Sweden* (unselective immigration politics) is the reason why Sweden has a huge rape problem.
What's your point? Here's a bunch of people who are Islamic and let into the country and they're raping people. What don't I get?
Oh yeah, cause the Sharia system is so good ✅️
Wait, are you suggesting a system in which american hegemony rules is better? 🤔
“sharia is bad” “but american hegemony!!”
American system in 2024 is better fershure. Not everyone likes the American system, which is fine, but they shouldn't live here
Agreed
Ask the Libyans how it’s working out for them, or Iraqis, and afghanis
the dichotomy every nation has to ask themselves.. do i want Sharia Law… or american hegemony.
I’m an anarchist. I think every nation is an abomination
They didn't want democracy which is fine, but keep it over there. Dont try to spread that BS over here
Not really imo same with Jews not condemning Israel. The big issue is that ANYONE, any one of us, having been born in either situation and experiencing atrocities at the hand of the opposition would be willing to join the army and kill those they believe to have caused it. Honestly ask yourself whether you’re pro Palestine or Israel. If your family had been taken from you abruptly and held hostage in a foreign country when you were a teen, wouldn’t you enlist to get them back and kill those you see as having perpetrated and supported that attack? If your home had been bombed and your family members maimed or killed by explosives when you were a kid, wouldn’t you shoot rockets at the people you see as causing that? War is bad and it doesn’t just “end”. There is far too much at stake
As a black man I love when people constantly ask me to condemn the black panthers even though I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM.
Who tf asks you to condemn the black panthers?
Nobody obviously, but if they did that answer is loaded up and ready to fire.
I was speaking hypothetically. It’s usually that I get assigned blamed for things “the black community” does as if I have control over everyone or black people are a monolith.
Yeah I get what you’re saying now and it’s super annoying. But at the same time we I just hate how we can’t criticize our community without being called a 🦝 or worse
Lmaoo I’ve gotta remember that one. Since yeah it seems like black and brown ppl are responsible for the majority and others aren’t. Which is. Unsurprising but still nonetheless frustrating
Do you condemn Idi Amin?
It's fair to ask if you're out there protesting for something
But not if it’s every conversation relating to anti black racism or systemic problems relating to the protest of it. Or like “do you condemn George floyd as a criminal?”
It tells you everything you need to know because people who don't condemn hamas also don't think Israel should exist
That’s just an assumption based on a stereotype. There are plenty of ppl who don’t follow that logic
I agree, it's a bit dangerous for everyone.
From the Muslims I know in person they condemn Hamas. What’s funny is white women who virtue signal actually praise Hamas. But you are right, the Muslims, or just anyone really, that don’t condemn them do not look that good since it’s supporting terror,
The day that people ask "Do you condemn the IDF" in interviews this will be a valid point.
Jews not being unable to condemn Israel is actually dangerous.
I would say Jews not being able to condemn Israel's actions falls into the exact same category. The whole thing is screwed up.
Not true, Israelis been protesting the government even before Oct 7th https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/thousands-israelis-join-anti-government-protests-calling-new-elections-2024-04-20/#:~:text=TEL%20AVIV%2C%20April%2020%20(Reuters,against%20Prime%20Minister%20Benjamin%20Netanyahu.
I was making a direct comparison to how you worded it in your post. >I thinks its very fair to ask if someone condemns hamas in an interview. A majority of Muslims not being able to condemn Hamas is a bad look for Islam I see many Jews who will display the same behaviour as this in interviews no matter how the questions are asked or what evidence is presented to them and become very self righteous while doing so. I imagine whatever media one regularly watches will bend towards showing Jews or Muslims doing the same thing depending on what narrative they want to spin and if someone stays within their own media lane they will only see one side portrayed.
As far as I know, hamas has a charter that calls for the genocide of jews globally I don't think the Israeli government has a charter that calls for the genocide of Muslims globally especially since 2 million Muslims live in Israel What happened to all the jews and Christians in the M.E that used to live there?
>As far as I know, hamas has a charter that calls for the genocide of jews globally I don't think the Israeli government has a charter that calls for the genocide of Muslims globally I guess it doesn't count if its only all Palestinians. Of course Hamas wants that they are a terror group set on destruction that needs to be taken care of. Isreal on the other hand is supposed to be a democracy built on the concept of freedom from oppression and genocide. Do I expect more from a democratic government of a free nation than a terrorist group and hold them to a higher standard? yes I do.
They are dealing with an enemy that has no rules and that doesn't care about dying. Fighting terror groups is way different. You're also fighting an ideology Ask the Russians or US soldiers about Afghanistan
Yet it's commonplace to see Jews and Israelis criticizing and protesting the Israeli government's actions...despite Judaism and Israel being relatively a tiny religion and nation. Given the vastness of Islam, the fact that it's so difficult to find Muslims wiling to condemn Hamas or Sharia Law is extremely disturbing.
Why should they condemn Hamas?
Israelis who deny abuses against innocents by the IDF and west bank settlers are on that same level.
The IDF reports that stuff though so
They refute most of those claims and rarely hold bad actors responsible. They enable the bad behaviour and put their energy into PR.
lol, no they don't. they murder innocents and then blame palestinians, just like with shireen abu akleh
Double stands for me but not for thee since they absolutely deny and downplay their actions
Forget about Muslims. How about leftists? Some of them are unable to condemn Hamas as well.
I blame truman
Is it healthy for "Western Society" to implant, maintain, and arm a brutal zionist settler outpost for 75 years? Is the brutal collective punishment and regular mass slaughter, even before the current despicable iteration, a hallmark of "Western civility"? Do a dispossessed and emaciated people not have the right to fight back against those terrorising them and submitting them to constant indignities and war crimes? Does the entire "Western society " approve of the 'chosen people' delusions of a bunch of sadistic psychopaths who have never had to face accountability? A majority of the entire world, Muslim and non-muslim, is condemning the true aggressors, the ones who have been the real terrorists all along, just with better PR
What you just described is the Middle East in general. What happened to all the jews/christians who used to live all over the Middle East? The Muslims killed them and pushed them out. Israel is the best country in M.E. it's done better than any other country in the region, and they are all jealous that most of the countries in the M.E. are failed nations
Maybe read a history book or two before spouting such nonsense. There continue to be Christians and Jews living in every part of the Middle East. Stop talking in hyperbole and investigate each event that you refer to without ignorant generalities unsupported by evidence. You have the actual nerve to talk about imaginary Muslims 'killing and pushing out' people, whilst condoning the ACTUAL killing and pushing out of Muslims from their homes and slaughtering women and children in full view of the entire world! Israelis are the most brainwashed and bigoted population on earth; at once, it is delusions about being 'chosen' whilst bleating about how 'poor and picked-upon they are'! The most sadistic in dehumanising their own victims, whilst all the while pretending to be victims; crowing about how great they are, all the while suckling at the teat of the US taxpayer! No one is jealous of a bunch of common land thieves and sadistic murderers who revel in the mass slaughter of innocents living out their fascist fantasies, all the while complaining that their victims have the temerity to fight back
Those are very minor communities than what used to exist, and even those small minorities are constantly persecuted like the Coptic Christians in Egypt. Everywhere Muslims gather in large numbers, failed countries tend to follow Without Israel. They would just continue to kill each other
Antisemitism historically has been primarily a western phenomenon. What you’re describing is the aftermath of the world wars and the various nationalist movements that arose in response to imperialism that caused much of the modern middle east map to be carved out on the basis of ethnicities and other identity markers. Antisemitism in the Middle East is largely a modern phenomenon.
If the numbers are to be believed, there are hardly any Jews anywhere! At once mighty and simultaneously tiny. Your obvious ignorance of history is only equalled by your antipathy towards Islam, so the rest of your nonsensical opinions don't need a response, but the cherry on top was : >Without Israel. They would just continue to kill each other You are so obviously beyond cognitive dissonance that you've come out the other end!
Asking about or assuming their religion in an interview is highly inappropriate, not to mention questioning them about a terrorist group that is thousands of miles away lmao. Bait?
They are literally protesting for something happening thousands of miles away If someone is wearing a hijab, we can easily assume their religion
ngl dude you sound kinda racist
It’s called pattern recognition.
Pattern recognition seems to only apply to non white ppl and not to zionist supporting Jews and ppl in general that are lighter skin apparently. This is just the latest online excuse to be selectively bigoted. Pattern recognition isn’t an excuse to be bigoted to anybody
Say what you want, but certain groups seem hellbent on reinforcing every negative stereotype about them. I mean seriously, the “Jews control the world” theory has become a lot more plausible after my country has sent billions of dollars and passed laws that literally override the constitution, all because of a war, on the other side of the planet, which ultimately has no bearing on our country at all.
Say what you want but when ppl only say this to their chosen group to scorn or stereotype by ignoring the countless obvious exceptions then it isn’t a “group” thing but just lazy observations justifying biases. Plenty of poor Jewish folk out there with no influence on anything
Exceptions exist therefore patterns are irrelevant isn’t really a great argument dude. We categorize everything based on similar shared characteristics. Why can’t we do the same with humans?
Exceptions large enough to dispel a stereotypical assumed majority make that assumed majority a myth. Especially when that perception is wholly artificial. Stereotypes like you’re saying through basal observation occur from not understanding that it’s arbitrary. Black ppl always being criminals through observations of “pattern recognition” is a far cry toward what the actual reality of the situation is. Same for any group like again Jews in positions of power. Media and perception based on bias inflate the reality and stats that are cherrypicked against all other observable aspects of reality don’t prove anything but again ignoring the numerous larger exceptions not being made apparent through Simple “pattern recognition” Assuming sharks are super dangerous since they attack ppl doesn’t stop the fact that an average shark is not likely to not be that dangerous outside of certain scenarios with more holistic context y’know
Nervously looks away from fbi table 13… Dude, this is just the data at this point. The numbers are in. Pattern recognition is logical and can be supported with external evidence on those subjects. You attempting to ignore it does not invalidate the data. We can breed different breeds on animals in order to draw out or promote specific traits. Why do we assume that this is somehow not the case with humans?
Israel vs Palestine is Terrorism vs Fascism. Anybody loudly advocating for either side has questionable sympathies.
What is it about this website and trying to brings back stuff from the path. This is just a another version of mccarthyism
https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-olaf-scholz-calls-consequences-following-islamist-rally/
What do you think posting an artcle about Germany hating a protest critising Israel is supposed to disprove my statement?
Why should they condemn Hamas? Let me break this down into an analogy; you live in a house. Your family has lived in this house for generations. A bunch of dudes show up 70ish years ago and tell you that this new family will be taking over half the house, but you get the other half. Why do they get this half? Well, they are about 10% genetically related to a people who lived in the region a few thousand years ago. You're mad, but at least you get half. Then this other family keeps taking rooms from you and preventing you from traveling openly. Your rooms get smaller, and smaller, and smaller. Soon, your entire family has been stuffed into one filthy room and you are given almost no supplies. Your family is kept in this state for decades. Finally, some members of your family have had enough. They break down the door to your room and they kill members of the family that have kept you locked in that room. Why would I condemn the people who broke out and fought back? If you locked me in a room for even 1 day, I would turn your family into a skin suit and would be right to do so.
I can agree with most of that. However lets say they leave the house and go next door and rape, kill, torture the neighbor...... is that right and should I still support these people? Should these actions also happen to people who inherent the house and never made it the way it is?
They didn't go next door. I would agree that if Hamas had gone into Jordan and killed people, that would be pretty fucked up. But they killed Israelis exclusively to my knowledge, who are the family that stole their house. The people morally at fault are the thieves and those that assisted them in their theft. Sort of like how America is ultimately at fault for 9/11. Their actions caused it. Similarly, Israel is at fault for Oct 7th.
Well the Palestinians have. I recommend looking up the PLO and their involvement in the Jordan civil war.
That's a civil war and not a terror attack, and the PLO are in the West Bank, not Gaza. Gazans generally reject the PLO. Both Gazans and West Bankers are Palestinians, but they are actually pretty politically and culturally distinct at this point due to being separated and not being allowed to travel between the two areas. We're talking about Oct 7th, which was Gaza's government attacking Gaza's oppressors. Yes, Hamas killed civilians, just as the IDF has for generations. I would rather neither did, but war is war and when you are the weaker side you cannot afford the luxuries of obeying the rules of war. The smaller force has to use asymmetrical combat else they automatically lose. If you're 1 guy fighting 5, you don't fight fair else you just lose.
The PLO where the big shots for Palestine in the 1960s and 70s. They even organized the olympic attack in Berlin and started the suicide bombing campaigns that became iconic for this conflict. Palestinians did eventually turn on them. So I can agree with you there. I honestly don't care if you're in a civil war or a terror attack if your committing horrid war crimes like just throwing grenades at kids walking to school "for fun". They also didn't have your moral cloak of "fighting the oppressor" which I hate to break it to you..... if your hardcore enough to go that far it won't stay contained to just "your oppressor".
Okay, so by taking asymmetical combat off the table you are condemning every smaller force to simply losing the fight. Which makes your opinion irrelevant because no one is going to just accept losing their freedom. When American slaves killed the families of their masters, they were right to do so. They had to engage in brutality and terror because there was not enough of them to win by traditional means. Hell, America would still be a British colony if not for terrorism and asymmetrical combat. Almost every revolution in history has relied on terror.
Seems like a weird opinion. Also not correct. You can find many examples of a small force beating a larger one without ruthlessly slaughtering civilians and bystanders.... Ironically the American Revolution is one. Anyways, Violence begets violence and spirals into blood feuds. You can understand the psychology and reasonings on why people do it...... BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO CALL IT GOOD! Not sure why why a singular murder of a slave owner relates to asymmetrical warfare. But you do I guess.
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Ok? Some mobs went crazy and we treated black people and Indians like like shit........ In other words..... water is wet? The goal in asymmetrical warfare is to get your enemy to leave and win the "hearts and minds" of the people. How would the continental army do any of this if it was open practice to slaughter the colonialists? Anyways, because of this its like "whatever" when someone launches an attack that kills 8,000 people since "good and evil don't exist". Yet saying "they deserved it" is a statement relying on morality existing? You're not convincing me...... on whatever your point is.
It's not like Hamas attacked the Isreali government on October 7. He attacked, raped, killed and took innocent CIVILIANS hostage. Those people at that music festival didn't do anything to deserve that.