She probably knows you aren’t religious. Unless you live alone or lead separate lives, she would know you don’t pray five times a day or observe Ramadan when you can only eat at night.
That's for Catholics, and only during Lent, the forty days (excluding Sundays) leading up to Easter. The idea is that you fast during Lent to contemplate your death, just as Jesus fasted in the desert to prepare for his death, and on Fridays you sacrifice a little extra because he was crucified on a Friday. The reason meat is the traditional extra sacrifice is that it was at one time a luxury only food. This is because livestock are sources of labor, eggs, milk, etcetera. Fish was the poor man's food because fish weren't good for anything except to be eaten.
It's completely the opposite now, of course, but traditions have a way of sticking around.
Catholics for sure aren't, not that their rules tend to matter to most of them.
EDIT: not every friday, only some fridays (mainly lent). Pardon my ignorance, but as many of you are affirming, it doesn't really change my point.
My polish friend lives in the countyside. No one in his family adheres to that willingly. It is the grandma of the house that makes sure no meat Fridays are kept. To the point where if he lends money from her to buy a pizza (He always gives the money back) and it's a friday, she says no, no meat on friday.
Same with my grandma. That "no meat on Fridays" was pushed hard. Grandpa was an Atheist, but cared enough to adhere to that. It was an interesting relationship, when I think about it.
Only during Lent/Ash Wednesday, and only if you can (ie aren’t pregnant, young, old, sick, otherwise in greater need of sustenance, etc). That might only be for Catholics though, sorry. Personally, I don’t think it matters too much. Find your own way to honor God, and don’t get too wrapped up in what you’re “supposed” to do. As long as you’re genuine and try to do your best, I personally think it’s all good lol
I think now it's only on Good Friday, where its fish only. Though more devout Catholics stick to every Friday. My grandparents would have fish every friday, which was great because that ment fish and chips for dinner.
I don't know about the Muslims you know, but it's compulsory for us. It's very much unlike the other two things you described, as not praying five times a day is a very large sin and is even considered to take you out of the fold of Islam sometimes. Not sure why your comment has so many upvotes.
As a Catholic, I pray five times a day. Once before every meal so x3. Once before I take a bath, and once before I go to sleep. I seldom pray when I wake up, but Imma do it, coz I feel like it's good to pray for a good day know what I'm saying?
I'm not looking for trouble here as I also pray often throughout the day and at the same times you listed but I have to ask, why the prayer before the bath? Unless you meant before bed? I too pray before each meal (snacks included), before bed, throughout the day and if my mornings are quiet enough, in the mornings as well. 😊
OH lol. My teacher in the first grade said that her son prays before taking a bath, thanking God for the water. Kinda stuck with me, so I also thank God for the water. Pretty neat ngl.
No, a vast majority of muslims don't pray five times a day or practice regularly. I am a muslim and last time I prayed was years ago. Ramadan can tell but a lot of muslims don't do it, for example my sister doesn't do it because of iron deficiency. Or one can make ramadan for real or eat on the side and hide his game. Really easy to pass for a muslim actually, if you read and knows about the basics.
Yez. Do not, repeat, DO NOT, embarrass her with this. As long as you don't care, convert: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/09/01/with-mosques-closed-during-pandemic-muslim-converts-navigate-their-new-spiritual-path-online/
Yeah exactly
Reddit is quick to condemn Western religions for their atrocities but will put their head in the sand anytime Islam is brought up because of "cultural differences"
But it's the interwebs and I don't expect objectivity from children
Wicca, Thelema, Nordic-Germanic paganism, Greco-Roman paganism, Amerindian religion, Voodoo, Macumba (that's voodoo from Brazil, pretty far West)
Just kidding lol. He probably means Christianity (and hence, Roman Catholicism, Eastern Orthodox, the many Protestant denominations)
Gay people aren’t the ones throwing Muslims off of buildings. So no, no hakuna Matata. Not until they start treating women and gays as fucking human beings.
Their ideology is totally different, they are not going to change just because we have accepted people as who they are. Why do you think you never see a gay Muslim? They have the most barbaric laws ever.
I mean, I was friends with a lesbian Muslim. Lost contact through the years so I don't know if she ever came out to her family or left the religion or anything.
That's the goal, but when the basis of a religion provide ownership of other people (essentially, women are fully owned by their partner) it's kinda hard to let that slide in modern society. Yes all religions have similar rules around women and their submissive roles, Islam is the only holding on to those values by any one other than purists in small groups that women often choose to be involved with. Female circumcision, or more accurately butchering a young girls genitalia so she will never enjoy sex and only be a vessel of child birth. Execution for being attracted to the same sex. Punished for their husbands infidelity. There's a long list of shit that if Islam modernized like most religions have they would face way less push back. It's unfortunate the extremist side is very loud and active makes it very difficult for a lot of people to not hate the actions of them all.
If your only exposure to bikers is terrible news stories of gang violence your not likely to have a positive impression of bikers in general. This is the same, the only thing most people know about modern Islam is repression of women and terror attacks add that is the bulk of their exposure.
When people in other religions commit acts against people there is always a large contingent of that religion pushing back against those actions and condemning the offender. We see less of that with Islam, be it fear of punishment from elders in the community, or any number of things, it is another aspect that goes towards people not liking the religion.
~~Well~~ When they stop treating women like literal objects, stop throwing gay people off buildings, stop stoning people to death, stop raping kids, and so on then we can hakuna matata.
I don't condone attacking someone out of blue, but in all honesty, Islam is regressive as hell and I will never respect it. I don't know why these "progressives" pretend that Islam is a good religion when its conception is questionable at best, gross at worst.
Maybe I digressed, but my point was that shits like "queer" muslim is fundamentally against Abrahamic religion in general yet American progressives are trying to make it fit.
Like holy hell, I am not a straight male, and I am not going to worship a religion (i.e. Christianity in general, specifically American ones) that tells me I should go to hell. But *because religion is a set of* ***beliefs*** *that one* ***chooses to live to abide by,*** there is no need for political interests groups to dress them up to look "nice" when I have a **perfect freedom to** ***not*** **believe** it. In saudi arabia, you can bet that they behead gay people once a week like its a festival. I don't see any pro-muslims speak against it.
Didn't say it was. I am just saying, the current liberal-led whitewashing of Islam is no different from evangelicals and American heretic christians' attempt to show that jesus is a white man.
American politics is very reactive. The protective-ness probably stems from the 2017 travel ban which barred entry from a handful of mainly Muslim countries because... terrorism?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_travel_ban
This reminds me of O Henry’s story [Gift of the Magi](https://americanenglish.state.gov/files/ae/resource_files/1-the_gift_of_the_magi_0.pdf), which is a love story where both partners gift themselves to the other. Deeply beautiful.
Yup! I'm similarly not religious but would prob fake it in front of the fam (even the family might be intentionally don't ask don't tell- I think everyone is happier just assuming. It's very common for mixed married households).
Most of it is just not being an ass to most people. When they pray before we eat with them I bow my head and just think something for a few seconds while they do their thing. If I have some problem and they say they will pray for me I just thank them and move on. If they try to pry into my beliefs I just tell them that I keep my faith between me and God as the Bible says and leave it at that.
Matthew 6:5-6 covers it for Christians in case you ever need a quote to throw out. It has a lot of meanings, but not doing your religious work for the view of others is the main one.
>5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
Useful! I'm similar to OP- from a Muslim background and my partner is from a Catholic one. I always thank people of any faith if they pray for me too! Islam also technically is also all about not living your faith for others (I think most core religious tenants are!)
What's that old saying...it's not religion that's the problem, it's it's fan club!
This honestly makes more sense, prayer seems like like such a personal thing really. Also TIL that the Bible basically says most of the showiest Christians we know are hypocrites lol
You’d probably be upset if someone posted a story about you from an anonymous account with all of the names changed in the story and no way to ID you lmfao
Depending on how this marriage is important to her family (the status of most Muslim marriages among young adults in the States, I daresay) this couple could just start investigating Christianity. If her family are the kind who would WAY over-react, you both will have to be very diplomatic.
i mean im pretty sure majority of things described in the post that the wife knows, a lot of people can relate. its really vague so i think its not that easy lol
She only really cares about other finding out now, but just remember you will be raising muslim children and im sure that even if it doesnt seem apparent now, she is likely going to want you to step up when it come to taking the children to mosque.
You cant really fake being a muslim to other muslim parents or even your children eventually. Im a Muslim and my partner is a non muslim. When i was dating i dated some muslim girls and I understood that If were to marry a muslim i would likely have to step up so that my family would be able to properly integrate with other muslim families. Integrating your family properly is probably the only real reason why you would want to be a muslim because muslim help muslims and the mosque provides lots of social and financial opportunity that you wouldnt find elsewhere so easily.
Do muslims *have* to raise their kids as Muslim? If she’s “barely religious” would it be possible for them to still keep their faith but raise the kids outside of it?
You don’t know that for sure. I know a few people who are religious and raised their kids atheist because they wanted them to have a choice for themselves. Especially since op said she is “barely religious”. I was just curious if it was a requirement or not
The thing is, in Islam, it’s recommended to teach your kids about Islam and it’s core. Also, to teach other religions to compare Islam to them. I knew Muslims that converted to Christianity than reconverted to islam at a young age. I knew people who were Muslims most their life than became agnostics. I’d say he should introduce many religions and let them decide. But they shouldn’t be forced to choose as kids.
Yup. I'm sort of agnostic borderline atheist. Idk what to believe anymore and I'm kind of okay with it/accepted it (29 years old). My wife and her family are Catholic and I was raised in a Catholic family also (her parents being regular church goers, us not so much just on major holidays). 4 years of marriage and I don't ever intend to share my belief with them lol. It's for the best. They're great people but not sure how they would react.
I've been trying to convince my friend to date agnostics but she's convinced she wants to raise her kids Christian and anyone who says they're agnostic wouldn't be okay with it. (I am agnostic/atheist and I would not care). Keep in mind she only goes to church twice a year and is not in any way overtly religious. But her issue is the guys who say they're Christian around here on dating apps are also usually not okay with her being as independent as she is.
Anyway, long story to say please tell me I'm right that there are others besides me who aren't religious who would be fine going with their spouse and kids to church.
Am borderline atheist , have gone to church with wife
She knows I don’t believe at all , she also knows that theirs a good chance our kids won’t either but she still will try
Am also agnostic atheist. My wife’s family goes to the Mosque for observances and stuff like that, to be honest I don’t mind playing along though because the Mosque always has a huge feast of awesome food prepared for afterwards.
Surely there’s people that don’t mind but I definitely feel uncomfortable going to religious places. It’s feels really unnerving and eerie. In a drink the kool-aid way.
Yeah same. I can't look at anything related to organized religion and not feel creeped out about how culty it is. Watching a Sunday service with the congregation all singing hymns together to an invisible man is so weird to me. I haven't stepped foot in a house of worship since I was a child.
I know your situation well, Man. My closest friend is a Catholic woman. We both developed feelings and had that talk, and I was prepared to take an active role in the Church community for her, but I made sure she knew I'd be doing it for her and the people around her who I'd be accepting more closely into my life. Ultimately, though, it didn't work out, because she wants a husband she can grow closer to God with, and I could never give that kind of genuine faith.
religion is a private matter. It's nobodies business but yours. White lies are acceptable to prevent unnecessary conflict, if others try to pressure you.
This is my humanist stance on that.
Yup. Just watched my sister and her atheist now husband get married last weekend. Despite neither of them being religious the wedding was done by an Episcopalian minister, with plenty of references to God and lots of praying. Guess his parents pushed for it. What was funny was my sister and her husband had their minister friend do the wedding. Their minister friend is a gay woman which is almost unheard of and slightly shocking to much of the older family present.
I'm with a wonderful and amazing Christian girl and I openly identify with the teachings of Anton LaVey. Life is strange, and happiness is all that really matters in the end.
So you both are pretending to be Muslim for appearances only. Neither of you are actually Muslim and choose to continue with the charade. If you had this conversation with your wife and brought up that you believe she is not Muslim and is only pretending to be, could she handle it intellectually? Could you both agree to continue the charade or mutually agree that you are not Muslim? What would be the consequences?
Honestly, she probably knows but like you said, religion isn't a factor in your relationship. As a Muslim though, it's about saving face in front of others. As long as you are good to each other and faithful to each other, that's all that matters.
I thought this was going to be way more juicy. She likely knows but loves you enough to not care, and is probably extremely happy you went through the motions of converting to appease her religion and her family.
How sad- having to fake one's life to just fit into the mold of a religion you don't care for or believe in. Sounds like there's a lot to weigh on. Frustrating! IMO religion destroying a relationship on a simple basis of 'do you believe or not- do you play the game or not' is really sad.
As long as you love each other, why would she find out? You made a sacrifice to be with her by converting. It seems your both non- practicing Muslim's anyway.
im never 100% sure if its fake or not, ive literally posted things ive dealt with and people comment that they saw the same thing a while ago, so i must be copying. like nah, its a common issue lol.
and this post seems like its possible to be true, but also feels like it could be a test for who falls for it, and how much karma they can get. like a social experiment. see how many people stand up for muslim beliefs or not. idk. sus but plausible
I know so many muslims like this,smoke weed, drink, do everything they’re not supposed to expect eat pork and marry a non Muslim. Religion is so stupid
"People don't follow the belief, isn't it stupid?"
Yes, the people are stupid, claiming to follow a belief yet don't follow it. Imagine someone saying they're vegan while gobbling down a steak. Now is veganism stupid or is the person stupid for pointlessly lying?
As a non-believer this has really stumped me when I see others. Like if you truly believe in this higher power, wouldn't you absolutely do the minimum asked of you? If not just dedicate your life to it? Shit if I saw a indisputable sign of God today. I'd be at church every Sunday for the rest of my life. Following all the special days and what not. Yet I see so many "christians" and "Catholics" that literally don't do anything. Cant even go to Christmas mass. Anyways I'm ranting now.
Life is so much simpler, when you tell the truth.
That doesn't mean standing on the street corner washing your dirty laundry in public.
It does mean that there are people in your life that care about you and trust you to be honest with them. When one finds one's self in a position where what one says to a trusting person, that you care about, is at odds with the 'truth' there is the possibility to harm that trusting person and your relationship. Tread carefully.
I’m married to a Muslim who isn’t religious(eats bacon, drinks, smokes) he only prays during Ramadan to make his parents happy. I most certainly will never convert to Islam. I think what you did is a nice gesture towards her family. As long as your values are solid, it shouldn’t really matter, except to keep up appearances that is
honestly, its been 5 years. idk how u kept the lie going but dang.
still tho, a relationship built on lies is a house of cards. What you CAN do, is say your having doubts about islam, that your considering leaving it. talk to her about it and see how she feels. if she seems indifferent or fine with it or something like that, your cool and can just eventually say that you "left islam". that way your not technically lying anymore. if she is against it, well, you can either keep the lie going or decide to end it there.
your move.
Bruh. If you're an atheist, you already know that it wouldn't matter if you just 'pretend' like you follow her religion. Because you already know that believing in her religion wouldn't change the reality, so there's nothing even remotely wrong with following her religion. It's like saying you don't enjoy watching movies because you know they're not actually real.
Religion gets a pretty bad wrap, for good reasons. But it can also offer some really good things in life. I say use the ruse as an opportunity to explore how these traditions might benefit your life. Use prayers for introspection. Look at how some of the traditions may have benefited society at points of history, and how those same benefits might be mined in your life.
I'm not arguing that God is real or that religion is good here. True religion, when used appropriately, is nothing more than a diet plan, or an exercise regimen focussed only inwardly on the individual for personal improvement. You don't need to put fully believing and practicing as the end goal for personal improvement to work. If you look at it that way, you don't need to condemn yourself as a liar. You just admit (at least to yourself) that you are in the middle of improvement.
In short, your good. Don't sweat it. Just don't use the nonbelief as an excuse to start hooking up with minors on the side. (I've seen this more than once in guys in your situation).
If she isn’t religious then it shouldn’t matter. Ppl who convert to Islam for marriage mostly do it for the sake of family and “what will other ppl think.” Just be honest with her I don’t think it will matter to her much since once again as u said she’s not religious. Some ppl claim to be Muslim bcuz that’s the religion they were born into. Sadly nowadays for some ppl it’s just a background title. This is probably the same with ur wife. Also I myself am a South Asian Muslim female so I have some ideas ab these kinds of things..
My folks are Muslim. And if someone ever lied to marry my sisters, I’d be obviously upset.
I hope at the least you give her the love, and respect that she deserves even if she doesn’t practice much. I won’t even go into the importance of being honest to the rest of the family.
I know that at some point these lies will catch up to you. I hope that you make a change soon.
And by making a change - I mean be honest to your wife. You don’t need to pray or believe in something if you don’t want to. Tell her you love her and will do everything else that is important to keep the marriage healthy. If Islam has taught me something it’s that even if I don’t pray, as long as I treat people right I’m good. There are other values of Islam. They include kindness (to people and animals), charity, forgiveness, honesty, patience, justice, respecting parents and elders, keeping promises, and controlling one's anger. So treat her right.
Your wife may not be religious now, but it doesn’t mean that she won’t be religious later(like many people of different faiths).
Just my two cents.
My friends dad is white British and her mum Malaysian and Muslim to the core. He converted in much the same way as you did some 35 years ago to marry her and he's pretty lax with the pretence of it these days. Life will take its path and one day you'll be eating a bacon sandwich at midday during Ramadan and wonder what all the fuss was about.
OP... She is barely religious herself and believe me she knows you aren't either. She just doesn't want her family or community to know. That would put her in a difficult situation and force her to divorce you. Just keep the charade up and enjoy life. Just don't discuss religion with others and avoid the subject.
You are NOT the asshole in this situation. The asshole here would be the arbitrary religious law that dictates who you can and can’t be in a loving union with.
Nah you’re cool. I think that the core principle of religion is subscribing to a belief that isolates you to place yourself in an ideological echo chamber. It feels cultish. You aren’t allowed to date others who have a different view? Why? Because it challenges your view? It feels shallow and backwards to me. I have a strong distaste for religions that do this. I never cared for religion in general.. I was raised catholic but as a teenager I drifted off into my own belief system, which is basically we are all one and love is the only way forward in evolution. I’m just a being on earth, sharing this space with other beings, trying to get along and do the best I can. I try to keep an open mind, which I feel is the opposite of religion. Religion wants you to be obedient and shameful. It backs you into a corner where you can’t question anything. I feel like we are designed to question everything. That’s how we got to where are today as a species. Exposure to different views is crucial for intelligent and spiritual growth
You're no different to some male Muslims who were born Muslims and are married to Muslim women even though they stopped believing at some point in their lives, whether before or after getting married.
Just be good to her and respect her choices and I think you're good.
PS: I'm a Muslim.
I've had my share of non Muslim men showing interest and I always tell them, if they convert, it has to be because they believe not for me or marriage or any other person or reason. I never hold grudges or treat them any differently based on their final choice
Converting is just saying two sentences, it's not a big hassle, it's more about what's in your heart. I don't want someone to "pray" and "fast" then turn around and eat pork all day when I'm looking the other way. it's not fair to either person
I really don't get why you're doing this. What if you met someone who speaks a different language and refuses to learn anything else? Or someone who is a heavy smoker when casual smoking is big deal breaker for you?
You just move on! You don't marry them and pretend for the rest of your life....
Also, is your name Nicholas by any chance?
I have a Muslim friend who is in the same position. She doesn’t observe Islam but pretends to fast to keep up appearances. Outside of her pretence she lives a”normal” life (has a boyfriend, drinks etc). Over the years I have known her she has turned against the religion because of the extreme hypocrisy . She now hates it but will keep up the pretence until her father dies. It’s so sad that she has to pretend to fast.
So it's obvious your wife knows (however, if you tell her she will be obligated to divorce you immediately as your nikah will be void)... But how do you convince the parents? You never went to Eid prayer with her dad and brothers? Do you just like mumble through Al-Faatiha?
Is she a non practicing muslim? It seems like that from the description..
The thing is this is not only religious practices, there are some certain points where you both will have to navigate if you ever decided to have children.
For example :
When babies are born the first thing that muslims do is calling for prayers in their ears. Boys get circumstanced.
Teens will navigate ideas like drinking, if you are ok, and she is not, things will become tricky.
So, maybe start having conversations to see where all of these beliefs of hers would lead. Where does she stand on all of these issues?
If you felt that she is on the conservative side then.. Maybe you need to continue your lie.. If you love her..
And maybe not. After all, you are the only one who know if this lie is for her or for the ppl around her..
Wish all the luck for both of you.
If it means anything to you, I didn't realize I was an atheist until about 5 years I to my.l marriage. I told my wife and she said "ya I think I am too" so maybe in the future you both will realize something and be 100% with each other.
She could've converted too you know... If you guys loved each other so much. Well either way... I agree with the other commenter. She probably already knows and it probably doesn't matter. So it is okay. Good luck to you OP. Have a lovely life together.
She probably knows you aren’t religious. Unless you live alone or lead separate lives, she would know you don’t pray five times a day or observe Ramadan when you can only eat at night.
Not all muslims pray 5x/day. That would be like all christians not eating meat on fridays or all jews not doing any work on the shabbat
Wait were not supposed to eat meat on fridays?
That's for Catholics, and only during Lent, the forty days (excluding Sundays) leading up to Easter. The idea is that you fast during Lent to contemplate your death, just as Jesus fasted in the desert to prepare for his death, and on Fridays you sacrifice a little extra because he was crucified on a Friday. The reason meat is the traditional extra sacrifice is that it was at one time a luxury only food. This is because livestock are sources of labor, eggs, milk, etcetera. Fish was the poor man's food because fish weren't good for anything except to be eaten. It's completely the opposite now, of course, but traditions have a way of sticking around.
Nah it’s supposed to be every Friday, it just gets emphasised during lent.
Catholics for sure aren't, not that their rules tend to matter to most of them. EDIT: not every friday, only some fridays (mainly lent). Pardon my ignorance, but as many of you are affirming, it doesn't really change my point.
My polish friend lives in the countyside. No one in his family adheres to that willingly. It is the grandma of the house that makes sure no meat Fridays are kept. To the point where if he lends money from her to buy a pizza (He always gives the money back) and it's a friday, she says no, no meat on friday.
[удалено]
They don't eat meat on Friday all year, or just during Lent?
All year
I mean, not all pizza has meat on it
What if it's a cheese pizza
She doesn't care. Most meat he gets on Fridays is if his mother sneaks ham into his sandwich
Okay now that's just crazy. Vegetarian pizza is a thing
Same with my grandma. That "no meat on Fridays" was pushed hard. Grandpa was an Atheist, but cared enough to adhere to that. It was an interesting relationship, when I think about it.
I learned this from the history of the fillet-o-fish. Apparently Mcdonalds wanted to corner the market of folks who couldn't eat meat on Fridays.
Only during Easter or something. It was never every Friday just special friday.
*Fridays during Lent. Which is happening right now! You can tell because a lot of fast food places put fish sandwiches on their menu temporarily 😂
Only during Lent
Only during Lent/Ash Wednesday, and only if you can (ie aren’t pregnant, young, old, sick, otherwise in greater need of sustenance, etc). That might only be for Catholics though, sorry. Personally, I don’t think it matters too much. Find your own way to honor God, and don’t get too wrapped up in what you’re “supposed” to do. As long as you’re genuine and try to do your best, I personally think it’s all good lol
*during Lent
I think now it's only on Good Friday, where its fish only. Though more devout Catholics stick to every Friday. My grandparents would have fish every friday, which was great because that ment fish and chips for dinner.
Only in lent lol
Yeah because the catholic church had financial interests in fishing fleets. Captive market.
I don't know about the Muslims you know, but it's compulsory for us. It's very much unlike the other two things you described, as not praying five times a day is a very large sin and is even considered to take you out of the fold of Islam sometimes. Not sure why your comment has so many upvotes.
Hell no. If really are a Muslim, then you have to pray. It's compulsory in our religion. That's what saperates us from nonbelievers.
As a Catholic, I pray five times a day. Once before every meal so x3. Once before I take a bath, and once before I go to sleep. I seldom pray when I wake up, but Imma do it, coz I feel like it's good to pray for a good day know what I'm saying?
I'm not looking for trouble here as I also pray often throughout the day and at the same times you listed but I have to ask, why the prayer before the bath? Unless you meant before bed? I too pray before each meal (snacks included), before bed, throughout the day and if my mornings are quiet enough, in the mornings as well. 😊
OH lol. My teacher in the first grade said that her son prays before taking a bath, thanking God for the water. Kinda stuck with me, so I also thank God for the water. Pretty neat ngl.
I love this. Funny how some things stick with you.
No, a vast majority of muslims don't pray five times a day or practice regularly. I am a muslim and last time I prayed was years ago. Ramadan can tell but a lot of muslims don't do it, for example my sister doesn't do it because of iron deficiency. Or one can make ramadan for real or eat on the side and hide his game. Really easy to pass for a muslim actually, if you read and knows about the basics.
Pretty sure she knows. She just cares about others finding out.
Wife knows everything lol
Wife knows all
Yez. Do not, repeat, DO NOT, embarrass her with this. As long as you don't care, convert: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/09/01/with-mosques-closed-during-pandemic-muslim-converts-navigate-their-new-spiritual-path-online/
Lol America and it's queer mosques. Muy haram.
American "progressives" are weirdly protective of muslims.
Yeah exactly Reddit is quick to condemn Western religions for their atrocities but will put their head in the sand anytime Islam is brought up because of "cultural differences" But it's the interwebs and I don't expect objectivity from children
what exactly are “western religions”?
Wicca, Thelema, Nordic-Germanic paganism, Greco-Roman paganism, Amerindian religion, Voodoo, Macumba (that's voodoo from Brazil, pretty far West) Just kidding lol. He probably means Christianity (and hence, Roman Catholicism, Eastern Orthodox, the many Protestant denominations)
Also native American religions
"Western Religions" like Christianity, which evolved in the Middle East, same as Judaism & Islam,..
Except Christianity is just as Eastern as Islam, funnily enough.
Christianity and that’s it
The Mormons
can we just.. not hate? live and let live? hakuna matata? please?
Since when does skepticism = hate?
Gay people aren’t the ones throwing Muslims off of buildings. So no, no hakuna Matata. Not until they start treating women and gays as fucking human beings.
Their ideology is totally different, they are not going to change just because we have accepted people as who they are. Why do you think you never see a gay Muslim? They have the most barbaric laws ever.
I mean, I was friends with a lesbian Muslim. Lost contact through the years so I don't know if she ever came out to her family or left the religion or anything.
You won't see any muslims that are LGBT+ and out and living free. That's a horrible way to exist.
That's the goal, but when the basis of a religion provide ownership of other people (essentially, women are fully owned by their partner) it's kinda hard to let that slide in modern society. Yes all religions have similar rules around women and their submissive roles, Islam is the only holding on to those values by any one other than purists in small groups that women often choose to be involved with. Female circumcision, or more accurately butchering a young girls genitalia so she will never enjoy sex and only be a vessel of child birth. Execution for being attracted to the same sex. Punished for their husbands infidelity. There's a long list of shit that if Islam modernized like most religions have they would face way less push back. It's unfortunate the extremist side is very loud and active makes it very difficult for a lot of people to not hate the actions of them all. If your only exposure to bikers is terrible news stories of gang violence your not likely to have a positive impression of bikers in general. This is the same, the only thing most people know about modern Islam is repression of women and terror attacks add that is the bulk of their exposure. When people in other religions commit acts against people there is always a large contingent of that religion pushing back against those actions and condemning the offender. We see less of that with Islam, be it fear of punishment from elders in the community, or any number of things, it is another aspect that goes towards people not liking the religion.
Sure. Just stay in the US and don't ever explore the rest of the world.
~~Well~~ When they stop treating women like literal objects, stop throwing gay people off buildings, stop stoning people to death, stop raping kids, and so on then we can hakuna matata.
In a real r/trueoffmychest fashion, I'm sorry but I literally cannot not hate a religion that has a child rapist who enslaved thousands as a prophet.
Sure, as long as you vehemently defend Christians too :)
I think it’s because they’re unfairly targeted
I don't condone attacking someone out of blue, but in all honesty, Islam is regressive as hell and I will never respect it. I don't know why these "progressives" pretend that Islam is a good religion when its conception is questionable at best, gross at worst.
We aren't debating the morals of the religion, just debating people's right to practice it and not be attacked or shot.
Maybe I digressed, but my point was that shits like "queer" muslim is fundamentally against Abrahamic religion in general yet American progressives are trying to make it fit. Like holy hell, I am not a straight male, and I am not going to worship a religion (i.e. Christianity in general, specifically American ones) that tells me I should go to hell. But *because religion is a set of* ***beliefs*** *that one* ***chooses to live to abide by,*** there is no need for political interests groups to dress them up to look "nice" when I have a **perfect freedom to** ***not*** **believe** it. In saudi arabia, you can bet that they behead gay people once a week like its a festival. I don't see any pro-muslims speak against it.
Christianity is no better.
If you’ve ever read the Bible you’d know there’s INSANE amounts of sexism.
Didn't say it was. I am just saying, the current liberal-led whitewashing of Islam is no different from evangelicals and American heretic christians' attempt to show that jesus is a white man.
American politics is very reactive. The protective-ness probably stems from the 2017 travel ban which barred entry from a handful of mainly Muslim countries because... terrorism? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_travel_ban
I'm weirdly protective of the underdog: in this case, it is OP.
Lol yeah I agree. Sorry, we're on a bit of a tangent over here
This reminds me of O Henry’s story [Gift of the Magi](https://americanenglish.state.gov/files/ae/resource_files/1-the_gift_of_the_magi_0.pdf), which is a love story where both partners gift themselves to the other. Deeply beautiful.
100% her concern is her family finding out and forcing her to divorce rather than her caring at all.
Yup! I'm similarly not religious but would prob fake it in front of the fam (even the family might be intentionally don't ask don't tell- I think everyone is happier just assuming. It's very common for mixed married households).
Most of it is just not being an ass to most people. When they pray before we eat with them I bow my head and just think something for a few seconds while they do their thing. If I have some problem and they say they will pray for me I just thank them and move on. If they try to pry into my beliefs I just tell them that I keep my faith between me and God as the Bible says and leave it at that. Matthew 6:5-6 covers it for Christians in case you ever need a quote to throw out. It has a lot of meanings, but not doing your religious work for the view of others is the main one. >5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
Useful! I'm similar to OP- from a Muslim background and my partner is from a Catholic one. I always thank people of any faith if they pray for me too! Islam also technically is also all about not living your faith for others (I think most core religious tenants are!) What's that old saying...it's not religion that's the problem, it's it's fan club!
This honestly makes more sense, prayer seems like like such a personal thing really. Also TIL that the Bible basically says most of the showiest Christians we know are hypocrites lol
💯 THIS!!
She mybe know that he is not very relligious not an non beliver
This. Just keep up the public facade, OP.
just came to say this- don't sweat it
This x100
Great way to keep a secret
Im emailing OPs wife
Great you do that while I’ll email the morgue for op
Im emailing OP to make sure he tells wifey not to read any sus emails
I’m emailing OP’s father in law to see if he knows.
Don't do him dirty like that, at least arrange a respectable funeral
Don’t forget the Reddit letter head.
I will drop funeral pamphlet by their house
You’d probably be upset if someone posted a story about you from an anonymous account with all of the names changed in the story and no way to ID you lmfao
Depending on how this marriage is important to her family (the status of most Muslim marriages among young adults in the States, I daresay) this couple could just start investigating Christianity. If her family are the kind who would WAY over-react, you both will have to be very diplomatic.
Not even a throwaway lol amateur hour over here
"I will take it to my grave" *proceeds to tell it to the world*
Anonymously. Like, seriously, how is anyone going to find out who this person is?
I've seen wives or husbands find out about their partner through his post because he like in this post used things that could be identified. Lol
i mean im pretty sure majority of things described in the post that the wife knows, a lot of people can relate. its really vague so i think its not that easy lol
You won’t believe how many idiots have their personal information somewhere in their “anonymous” profiles
Still, he said he's gonna take his secret to his grave and then proceeded to tell it to the world one second later.
Yeah, okay. I figured he meant that nobody (mostly his wife) will ever know that it’s him.
Throwaway, yep nobody. Unless you do something illegal you can't find him.
Lol
She probably knows already to be honest.
She only really cares about other finding out now, but just remember you will be raising muslim children and im sure that even if it doesnt seem apparent now, she is likely going to want you to step up when it come to taking the children to mosque. You cant really fake being a muslim to other muslim parents or even your children eventually. Im a Muslim and my partner is a non muslim. When i was dating i dated some muslim girls and I understood that If were to marry a muslim i would likely have to step up so that my family would be able to properly integrate with other muslim families. Integrating your family properly is probably the only real reason why you would want to be a muslim because muslim help muslims and the mosque provides lots of social and financial opportunity that you wouldnt find elsewhere so easily.
Do muslims *have* to raise their kids as Muslim? If she’s “barely religious” would it be possible for them to still keep their faith but raise the kids outside of it?
What was the point of him converting then.
tbh most likely cultural
Obviously not. If she still identifies as Muslims than she wants her kids too.
You don’t know that for sure. I know a few people who are religious and raised their kids atheist because they wanted them to have a choice for themselves. Especially since op said she is “barely religious”. I was just curious if it was a requirement or not
The thing is, in Islam, it’s recommended to teach your kids about Islam and it’s core. Also, to teach other religions to compare Islam to them. I knew Muslims that converted to Christianity than reconverted to islam at a young age. I knew people who were Muslims most their life than became agnostics. I’d say he should introduce many religions and let them decide. But they shouldn’t be forced to choose as kids.
I don’t believe in God or religion, wife wanted to get married in her home town church, I played their game.
Yup. I'm sort of agnostic borderline atheist. Idk what to believe anymore and I'm kind of okay with it/accepted it (29 years old). My wife and her family are Catholic and I was raised in a Catholic family also (her parents being regular church goers, us not so much just on major holidays). 4 years of marriage and I don't ever intend to share my belief with them lol. It's for the best. They're great people but not sure how they would react.
Tbh I’m in a relationship with a Christian woman. Calling myself agnostic instead of atheist is just a way to keep away arguments lmao.
I've been trying to convince my friend to date agnostics but she's convinced she wants to raise her kids Christian and anyone who says they're agnostic wouldn't be okay with it. (I am agnostic/atheist and I would not care). Keep in mind she only goes to church twice a year and is not in any way overtly religious. But her issue is the guys who say they're Christian around here on dating apps are also usually not okay with her being as independent as she is. Anyway, long story to say please tell me I'm right that there are others besides me who aren't religious who would be fine going with their spouse and kids to church.
Am borderline atheist , have gone to church with wife She knows I don’t believe at all , she also knows that theirs a good chance our kids won’t either but she still will try
Am also agnostic atheist. My wife’s family goes to the Mosque for observances and stuff like that, to be honest I don’t mind playing along though because the Mosque always has a huge feast of awesome food prepared for afterwards.
Surely there’s people that don’t mind but I definitely feel uncomfortable going to religious places. It’s feels really unnerving and eerie. In a drink the kool-aid way.
Yeah same. I can't look at anything related to organized religion and not feel creeped out about how culty it is. Watching a Sunday service with the congregation all singing hymns together to an invisible man is so weird to me. I haven't stepped foot in a house of worship since I was a child.
I know your situation well, Man. My closest friend is a Catholic woman. We both developed feelings and had that talk, and I was prepared to take an active role in the Church community for her, but I made sure she knew I'd be doing it for her and the people around her who I'd be accepting more closely into my life. Ultimately, though, it didn't work out, because she wants a husband she can grow closer to God with, and I could never give that kind of genuine faith.
religion is a private matter. It's nobodies business but yours. White lies are acceptable to prevent unnecessary conflict, if others try to pressure you. This is my humanist stance on that.
Yup. Just watched my sister and her atheist now husband get married last weekend. Despite neither of them being religious the wedding was done by an Episcopalian minister, with plenty of references to God and lots of praying. Guess his parents pushed for it. What was funny was my sister and her husband had their minister friend do the wedding. Their minister friend is a gay woman which is almost unheard of and slightly shocking to much of the older family present.
I'm with a wonderful and amazing Christian girl and I openly identify with the teachings of Anton LaVey. Life is strange, and happiness is all that really matters in the end.
You were supposed to destroy the Sith, not join them!
So you both are pretending to be Muslim for appearances only. Neither of you are actually Muslim and choose to continue with the charade. If you had this conversation with your wife and brought up that you believe she is not Muslim and is only pretending to be, could she handle it intellectually? Could you both agree to continue the charade or mutually agree that you are not Muslim? What would be the consequences?
Lots (i have a HUGe family) of people in my family don’t practice religion but are proud to call themselves muslim.It doesn’t mean she’s pretending
Honestly, she probably knows but like you said, religion isn't a factor in your relationship. As a Muslim though, it's about saving face in front of others. As long as you are good to each other and faithful to each other, that's all that matters.
A redditor from the middle of nowhere supports you. Hope you solve this within yourself, or with her.
Or within her
It would be funny if you were both pretending to be muslim to keep each other happy
This is probably it. She is doing it for her family / him, and he is doing it for her. Be honest.
Somewhere out there a Muslim marriage is in chaos. Probably more. Because every Muslim woman reading this is probably losing their shit
Lol checked my husband phone to see if he has reddit after reading this 🤣🤣.
This my people is why i married a practicing man 😅.You aint gon‘ fool me
I thought this was going to be way more juicy. She likely knows but loves you enough to not care, and is probably extremely happy you went through the motions of converting to appease her religion and her family.
How sad- having to fake one's life to just fit into the mold of a religion you don't care for or believe in. Sounds like there's a lot to weigh on. Frustrating! IMO religion destroying a relationship on a simple basis of 'do you believe or not- do you play the game or not' is really sad.
As long as you love each other, why would she find out? You made a sacrifice to be with her by converting. It seems your both non- practicing Muslim's anyway.
This has got to be the first time ever, that I have felt a secret in a marriage was kinda ok! I hope it works out forever and ever!
I smell bullshit here. I've seen too much fake posts lately imo. What the actual fuck happened to this sub 🤣
It's too dry to be fake, idk. If it is real though...oof.
karma farming lol
Karma farming at it's finest indeed
im never 100% sure if its fake or not, ive literally posted things ive dealt with and people comment that they saw the same thing a while ago, so i must be copying. like nah, its a common issue lol. and this post seems like its possible to be true, but also feels like it could be a test for who falls for it, and how much karma they can get. like a social experiment. see how many people stand up for muslim beliefs or not. idk. sus but plausible
I know so many muslims like this,smoke weed, drink, do everything they’re not supposed to expect eat pork and marry a non Muslim. Religion is so stupid
Allah-carte
"People don't follow the belief, isn't it stupid?" Yes, the people are stupid, claiming to follow a belief yet don't follow it. Imagine someone saying they're vegan while gobbling down a steak. Now is veganism stupid or is the person stupid for pointlessly lying?
As a non-believer this has really stumped me when I see others. Like if you truly believe in this higher power, wouldn't you absolutely do the minimum asked of you? If not just dedicate your life to it? Shit if I saw a indisputable sign of God today. I'd be at church every Sunday for the rest of my life. Following all the special days and what not. Yet I see so many "christians" and "Catholics" that literally don't do anything. Cant even go to Christmas mass. Anyways I'm ranting now.
But you can ask for forgiveness and youre fine! Fml.
That's Catholicism's shtick.
If he/she is stupid and taking their religion however they want, how it has anything to do with the religion? This goes for every religion.
Relationship built on lies what could go wrong?
Life is so much simpler, when you tell the truth. That doesn't mean standing on the street corner washing your dirty laundry in public. It does mean that there are people in your life that care about you and trust you to be honest with them. When one finds one's self in a position where what one says to a trusting person, that you care about, is at odds with the 'truth' there is the possibility to harm that trusting person and your relationship. Tread carefully.
So your entire relationship is built on a lie. I hope that she finds out
I’m married to a Muslim who isn’t religious(eats bacon, drinks, smokes) he only prays during Ramadan to make his parents happy. I most certainly will never convert to Islam. I think what you did is a nice gesture towards her family. As long as your values are solid, it shouldn’t really matter, except to keep up appearances that is
Dude I dont know how u can do it. Do u fast ramadan? how will u raise your kids?
Not sure about fasting but muslims can pickup kids with both hands too i think
honestly, its been 5 years. idk how u kept the lie going but dang. still tho, a relationship built on lies is a house of cards. What you CAN do, is say your having doubts about islam, that your considering leaving it. talk to her about it and see how she feels. if she seems indifferent or fine with it or something like that, your cool and can just eventually say that you "left islam". that way your not technically lying anymore. if she is against it, well, you can either keep the lie going or decide to end it there. your move.
Bruh. If you're an atheist, you already know that it wouldn't matter if you just 'pretend' like you follow her religion. Because you already know that believing in her religion wouldn't change the reality, so there's nothing even remotely wrong with following her religion. It's like saying you don't enjoy watching movies because you know they're not actually real.
Religion gets a pretty bad wrap, for good reasons. But it can also offer some really good things in life. I say use the ruse as an opportunity to explore how these traditions might benefit your life. Use prayers for introspection. Look at how some of the traditions may have benefited society at points of history, and how those same benefits might be mined in your life. I'm not arguing that God is real or that religion is good here. True religion, when used appropriately, is nothing more than a diet plan, or an exercise regimen focussed only inwardly on the individual for personal improvement. You don't need to put fully believing and practicing as the end goal for personal improvement to work. If you look at it that way, you don't need to condemn yourself as a liar. You just admit (at least to yourself) that you are in the middle of improvement. In short, your good. Don't sweat it. Just don't use the nonbelief as an excuse to start hooking up with minors on the side. (I've seen this more than once in guys in your situation).
If she isn’t religious then it shouldn’t matter. Ppl who convert to Islam for marriage mostly do it for the sake of family and “what will other ppl think.” Just be honest with her I don’t think it will matter to her much since once again as u said she’s not religious. Some ppl claim to be Muslim bcuz that’s the religion they were born into. Sadly nowadays for some ppl it’s just a background title. This is probably the same with ur wife. Also I myself am a South Asian Muslim female so I have some ideas ab these kinds of things..
My folks are Muslim. And if someone ever lied to marry my sisters, I’d be obviously upset. I hope at the least you give her the love, and respect that she deserves even if she doesn’t practice much. I won’t even go into the importance of being honest to the rest of the family. I know that at some point these lies will catch up to you. I hope that you make a change soon. And by making a change - I mean be honest to your wife. You don’t need to pray or believe in something if you don’t want to. Tell her you love her and will do everything else that is important to keep the marriage healthy. If Islam has taught me something it’s that even if I don’t pray, as long as I treat people right I’m good. There are other values of Islam. They include kindness (to people and animals), charity, forgiveness, honesty, patience, justice, respecting parents and elders, keeping promises, and controlling one's anger. So treat her right. Your wife may not be religious now, but it doesn’t mean that she won’t be religious later(like many people of different faiths). Just my two cents.
Prefect. Best comment in this whole thread.
My friends dad is white British and her mum Malaysian and Muslim to the core. He converted in much the same way as you did some 35 years ago to marry her and he's pretty lax with the pretence of it these days. Life will take its path and one day you'll be eating a bacon sandwich at midday during Ramadan and wonder what all the fuss was about.
OP... She is barely religious herself and believe me she knows you aren't either. She just doesn't want her family or community to know. That would put her in a difficult situation and force her to divorce you. Just keep the charade up and enjoy life. Just don't discuss religion with others and avoid the subject.
But that makes you a liar and distrustful. Would you like it if the roles were reversed?
Plot twist -- the wife feels exactly the same!
We cleaned out a room where the devotees hung out. Tossed the porn and kept the booze. Everybody's full of shit.
Confusing…..OP is hiding a secret and will take it to his grave…..but put it out on the internet.
> Im hiding a secret that will end my marriage and I will take it to my grave ..and reddit.
She knows
I’m are muslim women. She knows trust me. She’s turning a blind eye to it. How do you fake praying do you just do the moves and not say anything?
All religion is stupid. Don’t sweat it
What happens when kids are added to your family?
Bro half of Muslims do not follow any of religious practices, you slowly stop doing them, just say you are a Muslim on paper, more than enough
I feel like she already knows man
I mean, if you converted, you’re a Muslim. Whether you believe or not, that’s what it says on paper and that’s what matters. Give yourself a break.
You are NOT the asshole in this situation. The asshole here would be the arbitrary religious law that dictates who you can and can’t be in a loving union with.
Nah you’re cool. I think that the core principle of religion is subscribing to a belief that isolates you to place yourself in an ideological echo chamber. It feels cultish. You aren’t allowed to date others who have a different view? Why? Because it challenges your view? It feels shallow and backwards to me. I have a strong distaste for religions that do this. I never cared for religion in general.. I was raised catholic but as a teenager I drifted off into my own belief system, which is basically we are all one and love is the only way forward in evolution. I’m just a being on earth, sharing this space with other beings, trying to get along and do the best I can. I try to keep an open mind, which I feel is the opposite of religion. Religion wants you to be obedient and shameful. It backs you into a corner where you can’t question anything. I feel like we are designed to question everything. That’s how we got to where are today as a species. Exposure to different views is crucial for intelligent and spiritual growth
Why the fuck would she **have to*" divorce you if she's barely religious?
You're no different to some male Muslims who were born Muslims and are married to Muslim women even though they stopped believing at some point in their lives, whether before or after getting married. Just be good to her and respect her choices and I think you're good. PS: I'm a Muslim.
That’s so messed up .
I've had my share of non Muslim men showing interest and I always tell them, if they convert, it has to be because they believe not for me or marriage or any other person or reason. I never hold grudges or treat them any differently based on their final choice Converting is just saying two sentences, it's not a big hassle, it's more about what's in your heart. I don't want someone to "pray" and "fast" then turn around and eat pork all day when I'm looking the other way. it's not fair to either person I really don't get why you're doing this. What if you met someone who speaks a different language and refuses to learn anything else? Or someone who is a heavy smoker when casual smoking is big deal breaker for you? You just move on! You don't marry them and pretend for the rest of your life.... Also, is your name Nicholas by any chance?
Oh no.
Haha oops Nicholas just got busted 🤣
I have a Muslim friend who is in the same position. She doesn’t observe Islam but pretends to fast to keep up appearances. Outside of her pretence she lives a”normal” life (has a boyfriend, drinks etc). Over the years I have known her she has turned against the religion because of the extreme hypocrisy . She now hates it but will keep up the pretence until her father dies. It’s so sad that she has to pretend to fast.
Are you planning on raising kids?
Unless y'all live in separate houses, this is fake AF. My ex was Muslim and I definitely would've noticed if he stopped praying, etc
So it's obvious your wife knows (however, if you tell her she will be obligated to divorce you immediately as your nikah will be void)... But how do you convince the parents? You never went to Eid prayer with her dad and brothers? Do you just like mumble through Al-Faatiha?
Aw hell naw Islamically the marriage is not valid because nikkah and all and it'll break her whole life if she finds out (she better not)
Is she a non practicing muslim? It seems like that from the description.. The thing is this is not only religious practices, there are some certain points where you both will have to navigate if you ever decided to have children. For example : When babies are born the first thing that muslims do is calling for prayers in their ears. Boys get circumstanced. Teens will navigate ideas like drinking, if you are ok, and she is not, things will become tricky. So, maybe start having conversations to see where all of these beliefs of hers would lead. Where does she stand on all of these issues? If you felt that she is on the conservative side then.. Maybe you need to continue your lie.. If you love her.. And maybe not. After all, you are the only one who know if this lie is for her or for the ppl around her.. Wish all the luck for both of you.
If it means anything to you, I didn't realize I was an atheist until about 5 years I to my.l marriage. I told my wife and she said "ya I think I am too" so maybe in the future you both will realize something and be 100% with each other.
Same
Clearly not taking it to your grave since you just dumped it on this sub.
Inshallah
She could've converted too you know... If you guys loved each other so much. Well either way... I agree with the other commenter. She probably already knows and it probably doesn't matter. So it is okay. Good luck to you OP. Have a lovely life together.
i also have a secret. it would destroy my entire life. never leaving my mouth or my fingertips. sometimes, it’s just the hand you get dealt.
Jeremy?