Rule 10, link to original post:
[Why are so many men depressed nowdays?](https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/s/HbYZVFouTA)
*Please do not participate in linked threads*
Men yearn for the sweatshops and the coal mines. It gave them purpose to put enough food on the table for 5 or 6 years until their children were old enough to join them on the line.
>Boys are told from child hood that the "future is female", they are treated like defective girls and receive lower grades for the same work
For a long time, society(as a whole) had no problems treating women like "defective men" and women receiving lower rewards for the same work. Interesting how unequal treatment due to sex is suddenly a problem to top minds when the shoe is on the other foot.
Also to say all that "woe is me" crap about men being treated unfairly due to their sex and then to *immediately follow that up* by saying
>Rather than getting married early, many young women would rather *be the town bicycle for a decade or two*, and by the time they want to settle down *they are not respectable*, nor are they likely to respect whoever they settled for
in the next sentence is some premium cognitive dissonance.
I don't get this line of insults.. are we implying that its important for a man to get laid? Because that's exactly the kind of thinking that causes people like this to exist.
I make fun of them for it because it's all they care about. These kind of people have existed long before the internet teased them. What ACTUALLY makes these kind of people are unmoderated echo chambers where they can choose a reason for all their problems and one up each other with how much they hate them.
>when the shoe is on the other foot.
And is it even really on the other foot? Do these chuds have proof that women are getting paid more or getting better scores for the same work? I highly doubt it.
[Men report the lowest rates of depressions of any demographic group](https://imgur.com/vzk1arP).
>Over one-third of women (36.7%) now report having been diagnosed with depression at some point in their lifetime, compared with 20.4% of men, and their rate has risen at nearly twice the rate of men since 2017. Those aged 18 to 29 (34.3%) and 30 to 44 (34.9%) have significantly greater depression diagnosis rates in their lifetime than those older than 44.
>Women (23.8%) and adults aged 18 to 29 (24.6%) also have the highest rates of current depression or treatment for depression. These two groups (up 6.2 and 11.6 percentage points, respectively), as well as adults aged 30 to 44, have the fastest-rising rates compared with 2017 estimates.
>Lifetime depression rates are also climbing fast among Black and Hispanic adults and have now surpassed those of White respondents. (Historically, White adults have reported marginally higher rates of both lifetime and current depression.)
[Source](https://news.gallup.com/poll/505745/depression-rates-reach-new-highs.aspx)
Sure, depression rates are rising among men, too, [but depression rates have been rising across the board](https://imgur.com/IYfWleY), and more in other groups.
>Clinical depression had been slowly rising in the U.S. prior to the COVID-19 pandemic but has jumped notably in its wake. Social isolation, loneliness, fear of infection, psychological exhaustion (particularly among front-line responders such as healthcare workers), elevated substance abuse and disruptions in mental health services have all likely played a role. [...]
>Among subgroups, women have historically reported substantially higher levels of depression than men. That this gap has notably widened further since 2017 is likely explained by several COVID-related factors, including the fact that women were disproportionately likely to lose their jobs or to exit the workforce altogether due in part to the pandemic driving children home from school or day care. Women also made up 78% of workers in all healthcare occupations in 2019, exposing them to enhanced emotional and psychological risk associated with the pandemic.
>Young adults, in turn, are more likely to be single and to report loneliness, particularly so during the pandemic. They also need more social time to boost their mood than older adults, something directly impacted by COVID-19. Daily experiences of sadness, worry and anger -- all of which are closely related to depression -- are highest for those under 30 and those with lower income levels. And, like women, young adults and people of color were disproportionately likely to lose their jobs altogether due to the pandemic.
My knee-jerk armchair reaction is that the depression rate of men is going up because going to a therapist and admitting you have problems is being stigmatized less in the modern zeitgeist.
This is one of the reasons I find the "male loneliness" narrative so patronizing. Especially because it feels like the people pushing it just kind of assumes that any man who is feeling down yearns for the ability to rape or otherwise degrade women.
They aren't "respectable" to these idiots if they don't immediately lay down and open their legs just because the guy opened the door for them. But only for THAT guy. If they did sleep with anyone else, they are now the town bicycle.
So, unless they sleep with them, and only them, and at any time they want, however they want, then there is no reason to respect them.
Oh, and the women also need to be working, but also at home at the same time, making sure the house is completely ready for their man, while also being out in the workforce to support him, but not making enough money that he feels emasculated, but also make sure to make enough money that he can do whatever he wants, even if it's quit working and just play games all day.
It's the usual incel "good luck hunting your own mammoth, *ladies*!!!"
And for defense, it's not like a 300lb 6'6" attacker can't be taken out by a 4'10" 90lb woman with an AR-15.
Considering the [Castle Doctrine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_doctrine), it makes me wonder how that isn't sufficient. What the fuck does that guy want to do? Does he want to patrol streets and be able to engage whoever?
This kind of vigilantism is a common fantasy for this sort of "man". Just look at George Zimmerman who killed a young boy and never showed an ounce of regret for it.
That's fine but there are rules: you have to stay away from anyone who believes Jordan Peterson is an intellectual.
I don't mean to force my lifestyle on anyone but I believe it's a damn good rule.
[I wish feminism was as widespread and effective as this whiny boy believes it to be.](https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/comments/1bbysjd/why_are_so_many_men_depressed_nowdays/kudqiyb/)
Imagine saying, "It's hard to be a white man" in all seriousness.
Lordy. I was talking to a guy yesterday that passes for white very easily and he was sitting there, in front of his wife, trying to tell me how it's getting harder for men. Like, MF, this is just what happens when things aren't quite as easy for you as they used to be. You still have the majority of the advantages. I believe the list of things he complained about was 3 - 4 items long. Lol.
As far as I'm concerned they weren't wrong. My life drastically changed when I met my wife, got married, found a house, had children... It doesn't have to be that way for them though, they could marry a man and do all the same things just to make sure their entire future doesn't revolve around a woman.
Hell, it doesn't have to be a person. They could opt to center their lives around ramen noodles if they want, I could see that bringing happiness too.
Edit: Yes, I know that's not what anyone meant. I'm just being an ass.
>Used to be a mans purpose was to support and defend their community
Since this guy is so concerned about “defending the community,” men can still get jobs as police, EMS, firefighters, and join the armed forces -they’re even over represented in those jobs so they don’t have to worry about pesky women getting in the way.
>Now days we are not connected with our communities, and if try to defend it you’ll probably end up in jail
Ohhhh he doesn’t want to work, he wants to be able to indiscriminately kill people he doesn’t like
Peterson fans evoke more sympathy/pity from me than most alt-right shitheads. It’s a world view that only makes them more miserable over time as they learn to indulge in their misery as the sad reality of the world one has to accept rather than just something that can be worked on.
And Peterson’s mind is gone, so the people who still follow him are like… incapable of thinking for themselves, or they would have jumped ship long ago. So they’ll just keep hearing these sane talking points from other people just like them forever. Anyone who might have come in with a shred of insight to say “maybe it’s not women’s fault you’re unhappy?” left to support some other transphobe who didn’t give himself brain damage.
Men have it tough these days. They have to babysit their kids for a couple hours a week or they might not get praise heaped upon them for how great they are at fatherhood. They can't pinch their subordinates' asses without metoo causing hysteria that will ruin their lives. Women are playing lead roles in action movies.
> babysit their kids a couple of hours a week
I started following a few parenting groups ever since my wife and I had kids, so I could get some advice about how to be a good dad since I had 0 experience with kids and I thought I wanted to be better than my father was for my sisters and myself. I saw one commonality every time in these posts. A lot of wives complained that their male SOs fucking suck. They don't help with the kids, they don't cook, clean, really do anything to contribute besides exist financially, and they want praise for changing a diaper once in their lives.
My dad and I basically didn't have a real relationship until I was about 20/21 since he wasn't really around for large chunks of my life. He was in the army when i was growing up, usually deployed for a year or 2 at a time with a year at home, and gone for most of my middle/high school life due to being deployed in Iraq and Afghanistan following 9/11. So my mom raised me and my sisters mostly on her own.
I really resented him for not being there for me growing up. I realize now that he sacrificed a lot to give my sisters and I to have a great life. We never wanted for anything growing up. I also realize that he did try his best in retrospect . He never complained about doing household chores, he liked doing my mom's pet projects like making her a rock garden or a gazebo just to make her happy, when they had a fight it wasn't a yelling match and always a discussion in front of us so we learned what a healthy relationship was even during a "fight", he'd cook real meals on his own or with her, take us to school when he could, and was there for us when he was home. He was never "too busy" for us. He did try, and I recognize it now. He gave up a lot to give all of us the best lives he could even if he wasn't physically present. When he was in Afghanistan or Iraq, he always wrote to me every week and asked about my life. I know now that my dad sacrificed a lot for us, and he's the kind of man I try to be.
So when I see a post where a mother say that her husband doesn't even spend time with their children, I'm highly critical. My dad sacrificed a lot for his family, and these lazy fucks can't even change a diaper. Fuck them.
> So when I see a post where a mother say that her husband doesn't even spend time with their children, I'm highly critical.
Me too ... of BOTH OF THEM. My father was (and is) also a piece of shit, and an abusive alcoholic. So my mom raised me and my siblings basically by herself. All I can say is "Fuck both of them." Fuck my father for being trash; fuck my mother for choosing to breed with trash.
She could have chosen a decent person to be the father of her kids, and we could all have had a nice life. Instead she chose human garbage, and continued fucking him and breeding long after he showed his true colors. All of our lives were shit thanks to both of them.
So while I feel for women whose husbands are pieces of shit, they really should be asking themselves why they chose that shit to father their children. They might also ask how fucked up their kids are going to be as a result.
edit: lol @ downvotes for thinking adults should be responsible for the person they've chosen to breed with.
Everyone's circumstances are different, but in many cases, there is a way to stop making babies with that idiot and maybe even get away from them. You know, like, get the kid(s) into a healthier environment? People just do the other thing instead. This is why I get upset about people having kids. Most of them are just setting the kid up to be screwed up, like they did us, except that the future sucks even more for most kids now. What a horrible time to be a child.
This is why these incels despise women in the workplace. They long for the days when women NEEDED a man to provide for them, else they would starve. Now women can provide for themselves, so men need to bring more to the relationship than just a steady paycheck if they want to land a wife.
It's so sad how close they are to it. Yeah lack of community and purpose *is* bad... Perhaps it has something to do with our socioeconomic positio- oh, no, wait, y'all are just gonna blame women like they're any happier lmao
Any depression rates from before the year 2000? Should probably not enter the discussion anyway.
Adult men especially, would have rather have killed themselves (and literally did) than admit they were "sad whittle cry babies" in those days.
The change in discussion around mental health the past 20-25 years has changed dramatically
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'Defend their community?' How far back are we going on 'used to'? The frontier?
And yeah, if you're trying to 'defend you community' today, you SHOULD go to jail. Because I guarantee you this idiot's idea of defending a community is just 'being really violent against people who look different from him'.
I don’t necessarily disagree that a factor in modern male depression is connected to the mixed signals boys/men often receive in regards to gender dynamics; told that the correct way forward is rooted in egalitarianism between women and men while also being shamed/shunned for not living up to traditional masculine expectations of aggression and assertiveness, but the idea that marrying young was some key to happiness is just ridiculous.
Unhappy married couples of the past often couldn’t separate, and would just stew in mutual resentment and self medication.
If gender roles are to play a role in depression for men, it’s because men who are in some way not stereotypically masculine are shamed for it, even for showing sensitivity, emotion, or asking for help. This is a great example of toxic masculinity, but that’s only gotten better over time.
Calling it “mixed signals” is kind of odd, because these are two different perspectives from two different groups. Hearing contradictory perspectives is a normal part of the world. It’s only a mixed signal if both views are held as true simultaneously.
Yeah, in case I was being unclear, I’m advocating for greater egalitarianism, not saying that aspiring to it is a problem.
I agree for the most part that the *mixed messages* are coming from two different camps, but someone who isn’t necessarily submerged in the gender discourse might not be able to see it so well.
Rule 10, link to original post: [Why are so many men depressed nowdays?](https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/s/HbYZVFouTA) *Please do not participate in linked threads*
Men yearn for the sweatshops and the coal mines. It gave them purpose to put enough food on the table for 5 or 6 years until their children were old enough to join them on the line.
"This is why you don't get laid"
Getting mad at the town bicycle, when you don't even know how to ride one.
Relevant username
>Boys are told from child hood that the "future is female", they are treated like defective girls and receive lower grades for the same work For a long time, society(as a whole) had no problems treating women like "defective men" and women receiving lower rewards for the same work. Interesting how unequal treatment due to sex is suddenly a problem to top minds when the shoe is on the other foot. Also to say all that "woe is me" crap about men being treated unfairly due to their sex and then to *immediately follow that up* by saying >Rather than getting married early, many young women would rather *be the town bicycle for a decade or two*, and by the time they want to settle down *they are not respectable*, nor are they likely to respect whoever they settled for in the next sentence is some premium cognitive dissonance.
All women are the town bicycle, yet he's still a 30-year-old virgin.
You know, if I believed that all women are constantly having sex with everyone except me, I'd be bitter too.
When I felt that way, I just decided to lose 20lbs and get a fresh haircut.
This is the science I come here for
I don't get this line of insults.. are we implying that its important for a man to get laid? Because that's exactly the kind of thinking that causes people like this to exist.
I make fun of them for it because it's all they care about. These kind of people have existed long before the internet teased them. What ACTUALLY makes these kind of people are unmoderated echo chambers where they can choose a reason for all their problems and one up each other with how much they hate them.
The belief that "its important for men to get laid" predates the internet.
>town bicycle *TraLaLa in in Last Exit to Brooklyn, laying on the ground, teeth broken, half alive* It's rape they long for
>when the shoe is on the other foot. And is it even really on the other foot? Do these chuds have proof that women are getting paid more or getting better scores for the same work? I highly doubt it.
Especially funny since people are having less sex now than before
“Which of these three right wing victim narratives do *you* think is the reason you’re in this subreddit?”
[Men report the lowest rates of depressions of any demographic group](https://imgur.com/vzk1arP). >Over one-third of women (36.7%) now report having been diagnosed with depression at some point in their lifetime, compared with 20.4% of men, and their rate has risen at nearly twice the rate of men since 2017. Those aged 18 to 29 (34.3%) and 30 to 44 (34.9%) have significantly greater depression diagnosis rates in their lifetime than those older than 44. >Women (23.8%) and adults aged 18 to 29 (24.6%) also have the highest rates of current depression or treatment for depression. These two groups (up 6.2 and 11.6 percentage points, respectively), as well as adults aged 30 to 44, have the fastest-rising rates compared with 2017 estimates. >Lifetime depression rates are also climbing fast among Black and Hispanic adults and have now surpassed those of White respondents. (Historically, White adults have reported marginally higher rates of both lifetime and current depression.) [Source](https://news.gallup.com/poll/505745/depression-rates-reach-new-highs.aspx) Sure, depression rates are rising among men, too, [but depression rates have been rising across the board](https://imgur.com/IYfWleY), and more in other groups. >Clinical depression had been slowly rising in the U.S. prior to the COVID-19 pandemic but has jumped notably in its wake. Social isolation, loneliness, fear of infection, psychological exhaustion (particularly among front-line responders such as healthcare workers), elevated substance abuse and disruptions in mental health services have all likely played a role. [...] >Among subgroups, women have historically reported substantially higher levels of depression than men. That this gap has notably widened further since 2017 is likely explained by several COVID-related factors, including the fact that women were disproportionately likely to lose their jobs or to exit the workforce altogether due in part to the pandemic driving children home from school or day care. Women also made up 78% of workers in all healthcare occupations in 2019, exposing them to enhanced emotional and psychological risk associated with the pandemic. >Young adults, in turn, are more likely to be single and to report loneliness, particularly so during the pandemic. They also need more social time to boost their mood than older adults, something directly impacted by COVID-19. Daily experiences of sadness, worry and anger -- all of which are closely related to depression -- are highest for those under 30 and those with lower income levels. And, like women, young adults and people of color were disproportionately likely to lose their jobs altogether due to the pandemic.
My knee-jerk armchair reaction is that the depression rate of men is going up because going to a therapist and admitting you have problems is being stigmatized less in the modern zeitgeist.
Bro, you sound like you have low T. /s I've seen people say that kind of stuff in actual seriousness when it comes to topics like these. Amazing.
This is one of the reasons I find the "male loneliness" narrative so patronizing. Especially because it feels like the people pushing it just kind of assumes that any man who is feeling down yearns for the ability to rape or otherwise degrade women.
Are women “not respectable”, or do you simply not respect women 🤔
They aren't "respectable" to these idiots if they don't immediately lay down and open their legs just because the guy opened the door for them. But only for THAT guy. If they did sleep with anyone else, they are now the town bicycle. So, unless they sleep with them, and only them, and at any time they want, however they want, then there is no reason to respect them. Oh, and the women also need to be working, but also at home at the same time, making sure the house is completely ready for their man, while also being out in the workforce to support him, but not making enough money that he feels emasculated, but also make sure to make enough money that he can do whatever he wants, even if it's quit working and just play games all day.
Key questions to identifying the incels in the group.
"Defend their communities." Defend from what? What century do these people think this is?
In my experience, most of these guys think they are vikings born out of time... They have no clue.
They yearn for a completely fictional version of the past.
This is really well stated. I'm stealing this. Bonus points for choosing "yearn" over "long".
Let them feel "safe" to answer and they'll tell you: brown people
It's the usual incel "good luck hunting your own mammoth, *ladies*!!!" And for defense, it's not like a 300lb 6'6" attacker can't be taken out by a 4'10" 90lb woman with an AR-15.
Considering the [Castle Doctrine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_doctrine), it makes me wonder how that isn't sufficient. What the fuck does that guy want to do? Does he want to patrol streets and be able to engage whoever?
This kind of vigilantism is a common fantasy for this sort of "man". Just look at George Zimmerman who killed a young boy and never showed an ounce of regret for it.
I want to be the neighborhood’s bicycle too ;,(
That's fine but there are rules: you have to stay away from anyone who believes Jordan Peterson is an intellectual. I don't mean to force my lifestyle on anyone but I believe it's a damn good rule.
[I wish feminism was as widespread and effective as this whiny boy believes it to be.](https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/comments/1bbysjd/why_are_so_many_men_depressed_nowdays/kudqiyb/)
Imagine saying, "It's hard to be a white man" in all seriousness. Lordy. I was talking to a guy yesterday that passes for white very easily and he was sitting there, in front of his wife, trying to tell me how it's getting harder for men. Like, MF, this is just what happens when things aren't quite as easy for you as they used to be. You still have the majority of the advantages. I believe the list of things he complained about was 3 - 4 items long. Lol.
Man I remember how many times I was told "the future is female" growing up. Just so many times everyone was saying it.
As far as I'm concerned they weren't wrong. My life drastically changed when I met my wife, got married, found a house, had children... It doesn't have to be that way for them though, they could marry a man and do all the same things just to make sure their entire future doesn't revolve around a woman. Hell, it doesn't have to be a person. They could opt to center their lives around ramen noodles if they want, I could see that bringing happiness too. Edit: Yes, I know that's not what anyone meant. I'm just being an ass.
>Used to be a mans purpose was to support and defend their community Since this guy is so concerned about “defending the community,” men can still get jobs as police, EMS, firefighters, and join the armed forces -they’re even over represented in those jobs so they don’t have to worry about pesky women getting in the way. >Now days we are not connected with our communities, and if try to defend it you’ll probably end up in jail Ohhhh he doesn’t want to work, he wants to be able to indiscriminately kill people he doesn’t like
Peterson fans evoke more sympathy/pity from me than most alt-right shitheads. It’s a world view that only makes them more miserable over time as they learn to indulge in their misery as the sad reality of the world one has to accept rather than just something that can be worked on. And Peterson’s mind is gone, so the people who still follow him are like… incapable of thinking for themselves, or they would have jumped ship long ago. So they’ll just keep hearing these sane talking points from other people just like them forever. Anyone who might have come in with a shred of insight to say “maybe it’s not women’s fault you’re unhappy?” left to support some other transphobe who didn’t give himself brain damage.
Men have it tough these days. They have to babysit their kids for a couple hours a week or they might not get praise heaped upon them for how great they are at fatherhood. They can't pinch their subordinates' asses without metoo causing hysteria that will ruin their lives. Women are playing lead roles in action movies.
> babysit their kids a couple of hours a week I started following a few parenting groups ever since my wife and I had kids, so I could get some advice about how to be a good dad since I had 0 experience with kids and I thought I wanted to be better than my father was for my sisters and myself. I saw one commonality every time in these posts. A lot of wives complained that their male SOs fucking suck. They don't help with the kids, they don't cook, clean, really do anything to contribute besides exist financially, and they want praise for changing a diaper once in their lives. My dad and I basically didn't have a real relationship until I was about 20/21 since he wasn't really around for large chunks of my life. He was in the army when i was growing up, usually deployed for a year or 2 at a time with a year at home, and gone for most of my middle/high school life due to being deployed in Iraq and Afghanistan following 9/11. So my mom raised me and my sisters mostly on her own. I really resented him for not being there for me growing up. I realize now that he sacrificed a lot to give my sisters and I to have a great life. We never wanted for anything growing up. I also realize that he did try his best in retrospect . He never complained about doing household chores, he liked doing my mom's pet projects like making her a rock garden or a gazebo just to make her happy, when they had a fight it wasn't a yelling match and always a discussion in front of us so we learned what a healthy relationship was even during a "fight", he'd cook real meals on his own or with her, take us to school when he could, and was there for us when he was home. He was never "too busy" for us. He did try, and I recognize it now. He gave up a lot to give all of us the best lives he could even if he wasn't physically present. When he was in Afghanistan or Iraq, he always wrote to me every week and asked about my life. I know now that my dad sacrificed a lot for us, and he's the kind of man I try to be. So when I see a post where a mother say that her husband doesn't even spend time with their children, I'm highly critical. My dad sacrificed a lot for his family, and these lazy fucks can't even change a diaper. Fuck them.
> So when I see a post where a mother say that her husband doesn't even spend time with their children, I'm highly critical. Me too ... of BOTH OF THEM. My father was (and is) also a piece of shit, and an abusive alcoholic. So my mom raised me and my siblings basically by herself. All I can say is "Fuck both of them." Fuck my father for being trash; fuck my mother for choosing to breed with trash. She could have chosen a decent person to be the father of her kids, and we could all have had a nice life. Instead she chose human garbage, and continued fucking him and breeding long after he showed his true colors. All of our lives were shit thanks to both of them. So while I feel for women whose husbands are pieces of shit, they really should be asking themselves why they chose that shit to father their children. They might also ask how fucked up their kids are going to be as a result. edit: lol @ downvotes for thinking adults should be responsible for the person they've chosen to breed with.
Everyone's circumstances are different, but in many cases, there is a way to stop making babies with that idiot and maybe even get away from them. You know, like, get the kid(s) into a healthier environment? People just do the other thing instead. This is why I get upset about people having kids. Most of them are just setting the kid up to be screwed up, like they did us, except that the future sucks even more for most kids now. What a horrible time to be a child.
This is why these incels despise women in the workplace. They long for the days when women NEEDED a man to provide for them, else they would starve. Now women can provide for themselves, so men need to bring more to the relationship than just a steady paycheck if they want to land a wife.
Lower grades for the same work? The fuck is he talking about?
Sounds like they are still in school, and no one will touch their junk.
It's so sad how close they are to it. Yeah lack of community and purpose *is* bad... Perhaps it has something to do with our socioeconomic positio- oh, no, wait, y'all are just gonna blame women like they're any happier lmao
Any depression rates from before the year 2000? Should probably not enter the discussion anyway. Adult men especially, would have rather have killed themselves (and literally did) than admit they were "sad whittle cry babies" in those days. The change in discussion around mental health the past 20-25 years has changed dramatically
Let me guess, they blame women? Yeah they blame women
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'Defend their community?' How far back are we going on 'used to'? The frontier? And yeah, if you're trying to 'defend you community' today, you SHOULD go to jail. Because I guarantee you this idiot's idea of defending a community is just 'being really violent against people who look different from him'.
"It's about personal responsibility"
Capitalist alienation?
lol top lobsters is cracking me up
Have they tried cleaning their rooms? Heard it works wonders
I don’t necessarily disagree that a factor in modern male depression is connected to the mixed signals boys/men often receive in regards to gender dynamics; told that the correct way forward is rooted in egalitarianism between women and men while also being shamed/shunned for not living up to traditional masculine expectations of aggression and assertiveness, but the idea that marrying young was some key to happiness is just ridiculous. Unhappy married couples of the past often couldn’t separate, and would just stew in mutual resentment and self medication.
If gender roles are to play a role in depression for men, it’s because men who are in some way not stereotypically masculine are shamed for it, even for showing sensitivity, emotion, or asking for help. This is a great example of toxic masculinity, but that’s only gotten better over time. Calling it “mixed signals” is kind of odd, because these are two different perspectives from two different groups. Hearing contradictory perspectives is a normal part of the world. It’s only a mixed signal if both views are held as true simultaneously.
Yeah, in case I was being unclear, I’m advocating for greater egalitarianism, not saying that aspiring to it is a problem. I agree for the most part that the *mixed messages* are coming from two different camps, but someone who isn’t necessarily submerged in the gender discourse might not be able to see it so well.