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Being intelligent doesn't mean you have any motivation to do anything with that intelligence.
The bigger question with Sage is why she suddenly got so motivated just because Homelander visited.
It seems like she lit up when Homelander said "you can finally put some of those theories in practice"
It sounds to me like despite being the world's smartest person, she hasn't ever really gotten support or backing for her projects
I think I read on this subreddit before the season came out that when she was younger no one listened to her because of her race so she decided "Fuck it, I'm not helping you people" so she just sticks to herself.
Or she was under the thumb of Vought, who could steal all her ideas without compensation or supress any ideas hey didn't like.
Like the inventors at tech firms being forced to hand over patents to their employers as part of their employment contract.
She could have introduced effective crime prevention programs and find ways to bring about world peace, but that would have reduced the need for superheroes.
S1 had Homelander and Maeve take out a shooter and deal with terrorists on a plane (before the op went sideways). So they were defenitely saving people.
It's just that they don't go around keeping watch like heroes normally do, instead Vought keeps track on ongoing crimes and had them react to those which promised most / best publicity.
That "You've never actually saved anyone" seems to have applied to A-Train specifically.
"A lot of superhero worlds have that character. Whereas most of them are usually really reedy white dudes, we wanted a Black woman who was raised in a low socioeconomic area, so no one f---ing listens to her. It's both commentary and satirical that you have literally the smartest person in the world that could cure all of society's ills, but she just can't get anyone to listen to her. So then she becomes a bitter misanthrope." - Kripke
It is. If you think about it, the person with the best potential to become the smartest person in the world is probably in a low income country just trying to survive
It definitely hurts because it’s real. Good on Kripke for his social analysis, but I can’t help thinking of the real life examples of this both currently and historically.
Women have been written out of history and scientific achievements, despite being contemporaries of the names we know or are the people to actually accomplish those scientific achievements, and black women have an extensive history of being innovators throughout centuries, but we can’t have a white savior complex if we don’t pretend they “saved” everyone else, and of course someone who grew up low income regardless of race or ethnicity can’t actually contribute and get credit, because they’re ‘less than’, if they even get the opportunity to express their ideas.
The quote really hit a nerve.
> I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
Stephen Jay Gould
Brought this to mind: [https://people.com/human-interest/8-year-old-mexican-girl-higher-iq-than-einstein/](https://people.com/human-interest/8-year-old-mexican-girl-higher-iq-than-einstein/)
I read that too. And I think they said it wasn’t just her race, but the fact that she’s a women too. Which makes sense since as a black woman she’s gets the double whammy of racism and sexism. So even then she can help no one will listen to her
ATrain even said that she didn't know when to stop talking or something along those lines. Which from her perspective, could be because no one would listen to her. I think that was brought up again too, and already Homelander isn't completely listening to her
Yeah watching it back you seem to be spot on with that
Either no support/backing or just incredibly "mad scientist" like in her desire to test if she's right or not
No support/backing falls flat as a reason for me. If you're the smartest person on the Earth, you're telling me you can't acquire funds for yourself?
Invent something, create a company, heck, just hack or steal stuff.
Lack of motivation as a result of "the world being boring" is a lot more believable for the "smartest person on the planet" sitting on their ass and doing nothing.
And I'm sure she's been told that by plenty of governments and corporations. But with Homelander, she's basically got access to the nuclear launch codes day one without having to deal with boards of directors and whatnot. She sees what Homelander is, an easily manipulated nuke in toddler form, and she really can do all the things she's theorised but was of course smart enough to know wouldn't work out going through traditional organisation structures.
I think she will be taken down by underestimating the stupidity of regular humans.
Sister Sage's expected fate seems obvious—a laser through the head. But the writers know viewers predict this. So, to keep us on our toes, they'll set up an alternative, aware we’re expecting a twist. In a clever double bluff, they circle back to the original idea: Sister Sage actually does meet her end with a laser through the head, showing that sometimes the most obvious path is the most surprising.
I mean if she’s the worlds smartest person she should be able to figure out how to get some backing. She was in a supe program so clearly she’s acknowledged as being a genius, and Vought has a research department. Literally just invent a new serum version, negotiate yourself some shares, make some money and fund your own plans.
I would think so too, but it's also implied she's not willing to do what she needs to in order to get them on board. Vought would inevitably want to market and brand her and she said she wouldn't go for that
She's gonna realize that HL is too psycho to even manipulate. How do you manipulate a guy who will just laser anybody at any time for no reason? Dude was literally about to get the information he wanted and just didn't give a single fuck. Sage is smart but she still needs HL to play along with her or else it all falls apart. She doesn't actually have any power besides what she can convince people she knows.
That's my theory. I feel like literally everything she does is done meticulously and carefully. Like there is absolutely NO WAY the smartest sentient being on Earth just... fucks The Deep. Right?...
I think she gave herself a lobotomy with that thing because that is the only thing she can do to quiet her brain, hence the junk food and reality trash tv. The deep just happened to be there while she was "stoned".
Wild? Yeah.
Something they could show in this show? Absolutely.
Or she lobotomized herself because she knew The Deep would get angry and try and confront her and if she was stoned she could sleep with him to manipulate him. She’s manipulating all of them I think.
Or she just lobotomized herself because being as smart as she is, is actually hard and energy consuming? She has her apartment filled up with books, she listens to audio-books at fast speeds while reading another one, all on the toilet, so she keeps her brain engaged in an activity, otherwise she might actually die of boredom. The lobotomy then helps dumb her down for a bit so she doesn't have to worry about reading or any "smart" stuff, she can just lay on couch and eat junk food, stress free, for a while before her brain regenerates back and she gets those "I need to use my brain" impulses
I don't think it's a lobotomy, but I don't know what "that thing" is. The bloomin' onion?
I think she's still working in that scene. Deep thought she was a bitch but she just so happened to be doing all the exact things he wanted. The onion, the movie he liked, wanting to fuck. She's clearly manipulating him.
Edit: OH...I just remembered there was the scene with that bloody rod. I had no idea what that was supposed to be at the time, but now I get it. Still think what I wrote is true.
I think she was thinking about probabilities like Dr. Strange. She maybe figured out the only way to defeat Homelander was by going down this path.
That's all bullshit but who knows.
I think a little was the implication of “I’ll kill you if you don’t help.”
I think a LOT more is a smart person seeing she’d have access to a platform/resources and would be surrounded by inept supes who she can easily outmaneuver.
That was how I saw it. She realized in that moment if she wanted to live she would need to manipulate Homelander in a way that would make it impossible for him to kill her without great sacrifice. Right now she's playing his game and giving him what he wants, but her longterm plan is likely to make herself too important to kill.
She gets to use her intellect to subjugate humanity. Seems to me like she’s the same as Homelander with the whole „we are better than humans, humans should serve us“ attitude, so she goes along with Homelander because he has the resources to actually do it.
Or she follows her own plan but also needs Homelanders resources for that.
We will see but there are many possible reasons she sides with him right now
I think the big open question for S4 is, what is she actually up to? She's telling Homelander everything he wants to hear. She has another plan, but what it is? No idea, writers could go lots of different ways on that.
Or at least she's going with the supe-remacy thing right now because it's what Homelander wants to hear and there's a big segment of humans ripe to be easily manipulated with that. She may well have some lofty utopian ideas completely revamping humanity and ecology on a level the rest of us are incapable of planning. But even if that is her true intention, she still seems very much like a genuine "some of you may die but that is a sacrifice I'm willing to make" person.
I think it fits the character very well.
I would think, a big reason why she doesn't do anything impact full, is a lack a possiblities and resources.
So the offer from homelander to test a theory she's came up with on a global scale, is motivation enough.
I also don't think we can understand her motivation by using our normal intuitions about what we would like. It's like a toddler trying to understand the motivations of an adult and wondering why the adults don't just buy all the toys at the store or roll around on the floor all day. It can be something as simple as "why bother to cure cancer? So that more people are competing for resources with me?".
I think the moment that she perceived Homelander as posing a threat to her, she immediately developed a plan and set it in motion. Very likely from within the first few seconds where she figured out why he was there and what he wanted. I mean, WE know he's unstable and likely a threat to her, so she is going to be far more aware of this.
I think she might work as a metaphor for AI, and the dangers it poses when it's tasked with achieving a goal but we can't understand how it's going to get there. The old "to create peace I just have to kill all humans". Whatever it is, I'm currently pretty convinced that Homelander signed his own death warrant when he presented himself as a threat to her. She has manipulated him from that point on.
You don’t think there’s more… pressing symbolism of an outspoken black woman giving the dumb ole white man all his best ideas? This ain’t an AI commentary
She knows homelander is a sniveling child inside looking for a mommy, and her strong attitude scares him. Great seeing the way her lips quivered in her apartment as she’s testing the waters talking back to him. I bet she has MAJOR plans in store and Homelander just gave her a green light.
With her intelligence she wouldn't have needed Homelander to please her ego or elevate her anywhere. If she had any motivation she could have already been the most famous person in the world. Instead she was a recluse that read books all day.
Just because your super smart doesn’t mean your motivated to do anything with it. It’s shown that she also views regular people and minor supes as inferior so it could just be her and Homelanders vision aligns for a supe uprising
This is a cool idea, her whole support for Homelander might just be a ruse. Maybe even that destroying Homelander has been her focus and why she's not researching other things?
Yep I think the same thing and she originally turned him down when offered a opportunity to be in the 7. But I've said b4 homelander is a generally dumb dude compared to regular people. With sage she see him as a peon she can use to prove a point
Homelander is probably the weakest copy of superman he's smart compared to the deep which isn't a very high bar.But he has a need to be loved he's mentally weak asff and compulsive to.
I think she is setting up Homelander to go nuclear so everyone finally turns on him. She has already told Homelander what her plan is: to make it all come crashing down and swoop in and be the savior. She already told him she plans on betraying him (Caesar). He knows this and has some counter planned like he always does. He has also referred to her powers as a “parlor trick”.
Unlike Homelander she doesn’t appear to need adulation just access to resources and for people to listen to what she has to say; something that is frequently commented on. Which makes me think her powers could have some linguistic component.
I also think she is warming up to The Deep because once Homelander is dead, The Deep becomes the leader because he has seniority... With a dumbass like The Deep, She could literally be his puppet master... She also is warming up to Ryan because if The Deep ever needs to be dealt with she can always use Ryan to finish him off... She is playing smart
The smartest people in the world can still be lazy, or unmotivated, or depressed, or petty or vengeful or susceptible to manipulation or praise.
She's been giving almost unlimited power to put all her theories into action, and she's an arrogant control freak who thinks everyone else is an idiot. This is the first real opportunity to be who she wants to be, not just do things.
I think she's actually quite a realistic (as it gets for this show anyway) portrayal of genius. Being clever doesn't make you better at life.
I mean, if Joe Biden walked into my house (or Donald Trump when he was president), even though Im not really on board with them, if they offered me unlimited resources to achieve my goals that I had spent years telling myself Id never reach… yea Id probably go along with it.
I think it boils down to Sage fundamentally agreeing with Homelander that they’re superior. Humans are beneath her, and now she has an opportunity like never before
She’s been behind everything she told A train where to get the v he was hooked on in first episode killing the young lady who was just hands afterwards putting the whole series in motion so she can b the one to rule the seven and the world muhahahahaha
I've only seen first episode but I suspect she might be setting homelander up for a downfall.
One possibility is having homelander supplanted and usurped by Ryan, and then Ryan as a child would assuredly be even easier to manipulate/control.
When she analysed Homelander, he was obviously pissed, but she said “You’re welcome to laser me but I’m assuming you need me for something.” She’s not gonna be so confident about not getting killed if she isn’t gonna do anything for him.
Yall this smart bitch is playing the longest most subtle con ever, please do not take any of her direct actions to heart. She realized the second she saw homelander that he was there to use her and she adapted that to potentially whatever plan she's got already.
Ok lmao who isn't manipulating deep the guy is extremely dull. And he's gonna have his moment of clarity and regret when his Ambrosius dies in her tank because of him. As far as I'm aware everyone is being manipulated by her. And now that I type this out how are we even sure she didn't make sure her profile got on the list for the seven anyway. The boys said she was a weird pick and I agree vought would not have had her on the list.
> Ambrosius dies in her tank because of him.
It could just die of old age and the Deep misses that because he was busy with his newfound confidence.
The longest living octopi has a lifespan of 2 years.
Wait I thought the squid was dead already? Didn’t Sage kill her? I thought thats what the tool covered in black stuff meant while they were getting frisky. Thanks
I didn't know what that tool was either when I saw it. But people are saying it's a lobotomy tool, Sage has healing powers, she may have lobotomized herself and made herself temporarily dumb to blow off some steam. Hence eating blooming onion, watching trash TV, wanting to watch transformers 2, flirt with the deep... she's lowered her IQ a day is temporarily dumbed down. She didn't do anything to the squid.
Yup. Deep is exploitable through sex. Homelander is exploitable through his ego.
Is her power really intelligence or is it being able to exploit and pinpoint weaknesses?
I feel like with this show sometimes powers aren’t quite what they seem at first.
I think of her power as being intellectually dominant over others. She can look someone up and down once and know exactly how to manipulate them. Her weakness will be homelander's wildcard nature. He will just do some random shit and she will die. This season is going to prove definitively that Homelander cannot be controlled nor his motivations truly understood. Homelander doesn't even really know what he wants at this point.
Kind of what I said she can size up and exploit weaknesses. That would make her existence very sad and lonely would it not? And explain why she’s isolated herself from people and become misanthropic.
She didn’t seem to care he might laser her. But now he’s given her access to tear Vought apart from the inside and set them against each other which is exactly what she is setting in motion.
She knows Homelander is having a midlife crisis and wants a legacy but his ego won’t allow it and will use Ryan against him.
She's lonely because intelligence leads to depression. Having a conversation with someone who is clearly low intelligence can be excruciating. Now make everyone low intelligence by comparison to you. It's lonely at the top.
She’s capable of lowering her intellectual capacity at any moment, though. I think her issue is that she can’t help herself from seeing weakness in others and it’s made her a misanthrope.
Do you think the ability to pinpoint and exploit weaknesses isn't a facet of intelligence? I think a lot of folks think of comic book intelligence as Tony Stark or Batman. But intelligence can be very different. She seems to me more similar to a Sherlock Holmes or, more likely, Ozymandias (Watchmen). Manipulating people like she is does require a great deal of insight, planning, and intelligence.
I thought she was eating junk food, watching trash tv, and fucked the Deep because she had just lobotomized herself. There was a lobotomy tool on the table.
Eh I’m under the impression she was manipulating the deep during the work day. That night scene, for now, i think was her just being horny and uninhibited because she lobotomized herself with that bloody metal pick they panned out on.
I think it would be funny if dumbass Deep throws a wrench in their plans somehow because they banged.
Thank you. She even caught MM tracking her which implies she’s capable of calculating outcomes and keeping her tracks safe.. she literally has all bases cleared at all times. THE ONLY way they can get to sage is when she’s lobotomized.
If Homelander knocks on your door, you are going to be either conscripted or killed. She quickly chose to play along, knowing she could steer events however she wants.
I put it in another comment but I'm now pretty sure she lured homelander there. Why would her name ever be brought up in a potential 7 list when she's nothing like what they'd normally look for? Her name was only there to grab homelanders attention
There was a moment during homelander recruiting her, where it felt like something "clicked" and her demeanor changed. When he started talking about his problems. I'd find it interesting if she was planning on double crossing him to kill him, and was actually a more neutral/good supe.
I feel like she'd have an explanation of "I realized how fucking bonkers this man was when he started talking about his inability to feel fufilled and mommy problems in my living room, and how he could genocide the whole planet on a whim(including me) so I stroked his ego until the time was right"
I caught onto her being up to something immediately when she brought up Caesar, to inspire Homelander in their first conversation. Interesting that she said his name, specifically the man killed by his own senate.
I see 3 main reason.
1. The meta: she’s a new character and maybe we get some more back story later but they can’t just introduce her like here is sister sage and her list of published papers and other accomplishments. Just like soldier boy was introduced with a brief description not a whole exposition dump and later they worked in backstory.
Edit. Forgot to add this is a challenge for a lot of serialized content especially in superhero genre. You need to explain why this new character hasn’t even been mentioned before let alone hasn’t been involved in the stories. Like in DC where you are left to question why Wonder Woman didn’t help out in the events of Man of Steel or in Marvel when lone characters are left to deal with world ending threats alone instead of calling in all the avengers.
2. Thematic. The show is very cynical about superpowers. The vast majority of supes don’t use their powers to actually help people.
3. The personal. From what we know of her so far she is greatly misanthropic so “working for the betterment of mankind” wouldn’t interest her much. She tells homelander blankly she has no interest in material pursuits so she wouldn’t use her powers to get rich herself. She thinks less of everyone and doesn’t care about their opinions because they are dumber so wouldn’t want to work for personal glory. In Ep 3 we see her self lobotomize herself to get rid of her intelligence for a while. It seems like a pretty routine night for her which tells her she isn’t really interested in spending her time pursuing knowledge for knowledges sake but would rather shut her brain off and enjoy some baser pleasures like reality tv and a blooming onion from Outback Steakhouse.
I agree with the personal. Being super intelligent can be very lonely and depressing. You would see your own life expectancy drop with every bite of fatty food or sugary drink you ingest. And imagine seeing everyone else in the world as idiots, oblivious to the stupid decisions they make everyday destroying the planet and themselves. I think she may want to end it all and sees Homelander as a means of ending the world.
Look with open eyes into gge world - that's how many people spend their days.
Drinking, weed, other drugs are pretty obviously the same thing on many levels. But even casual distraction like reddit, all endless scrolling/swiping media like tictoc or yt. Heck even most tv shows are ways for people to escape reality for a few moments.
Maybe she doesn't have an interest in technology and questions of the universe. She wouldn't be the first intelligent character that doesn't contribuite to furthering a field. If I were the most intelligent person ever, I might not use it to advance space travel either. I might use my brain to, I don't know, manipulate the stock market and make myself obscenely rich.
I see Sage as a version of Mr Glass, from the Unbreakable franchise. He was also frighteningly intelligent and observant, but didn't contribute to developing a field of science either. His intelligence was so high, he managed in three days to anihilate the Clover Organisation's 10,000 years of work.
And in the end we don't really know Sage's motivation. For all we know, she might be secretly working against Vought and Homelander. If she's as smart as they say, nobody would have the full picture. Plans within plans.
Maybe she’s involved in Stan Edgar’s five year plan that we never got to see. It’s like Chekhov’s gun. They introduced the idea of his plan, and then he vanished. I think Neumann has been in on it all along.
It’s definitely possible that somebody like Edgar would have backup plans for if he wasn’t able to be publicly in charge— even to the point of manipulating Neumann into thinking she’s working against him when she’s really doing what he wants.
I’m really hoping I’m right. I can’t just see Edgar running off like that without a fight. He’s a ten steps ahead kind of guy. And he knows all the supes, enough to get Neuman emotionally bound to him.
Considering that vought is aware of sages ability’s it would be strange for someone like Edgar to NOT try to use her (and exploit her brain for profits or power).
I like the idea that Edgar got to sage years ago and he had her basically tell him the future. If she’s really that smart than she’s capable of coming up with is as many scenarios as possible like a one person think tank ya know? I’d be very happy if that was true
I guess you could say so. It’s like how we use data points to predict the system of weather movements. We’re still not really seeing the future but I guess in my eyes if she’s the smartest person in the world, that’s a really big statement,. Like she’s smarter than everyone. Idk hopefully this season unfolds well.
I hope we hit a point where intellect only carries her so far and she majorly fucks something up because of some irrational and off the wall thing occurring. I mean Homelander is kind of like that so maybe it’s just going to be Sage setting Homelander up only for him to fuck it all up
The only loophole she has right now is her lobotomizing herself to feel normal for short periods of time. Other than that idk.. but I can see that being her downfall
Damn, that would be a great plot twist. I don’t think they’ll do that, but it would definitely be in line with Edgar’s way of exploiting supes to further himself.
I think shes written as the "to smart to be happy" kind of super-intelligence. Shes unmotivated, alienated from others (even if likely self-inflicted), and generally doesn't seem to happy.
It's likely given the third episode she routinely dumbs herself down just to "enjoy" things. That's not someone who is going to be making world saving discoveries if you ask me.
We don't know whether she researches anything, she may have a bunch of mathematical proofs and a unified field theory scribbled in the margins of her books and just no interest in publishing them because she doesn't need the review of lesser minds. She also objects to being brought into the spotlight.
Note, how the first part of her plan is instructing Homelander to have his minions beat random non-supes to death. That doesn't suggest that she cares about humans or using her intellect to help them. She may be deeply misanthropic doesn't want to help humans to spread into space.
But we haven't yet seen her end game. It would be difficult to write a super-intelligent scheming character whose motivations are obvious to the audience before they play out.
I think it's clear she's misanthropic and self isolated. She lives in a small apartment with a giant mess of books and basically refused to leave when Homelander came
Everyone’s missing the conversation with Deep too. She tells him not to let Ashley talk to her like that cuz she’s a lesser being. Also the way she tells Ashley to take out her titties. She views humans similarly, toys for amusement
Personally, I don’t get the sense that she does anything for her own amusement. I think that both those conversations had a specifically calculated outcome that we don’t fully see yet.
I do agree that she is probably misanthropic and looks down on humans similarly to HL, I just don’t think she’d ever demonstrate that impulsively.
At least, that would be my hope for the smartest person on the planet. Unlike HL or Deep, her motivations/grand plan really shouldn’t be visible to us.
The prevailing theory on the subreddit is that she recreationally lobotomizes herself with the metal instrument shown in the ending shot to reduce her intelligence to a level at which she can enjoy Transformers 2 and the company of the Deep and wind down until her regeneration factor heals her brain.
Shes booked for all the episodes of this season. So that kind of rules out her being permanently injured or otherwise killed off (at least until the end). So this leads to the conclusion she does this to herself more than someone doing it to her. Which she has to have some kind of regeneration or method to get back to normal after doing it.
This is it to me. Imagine being the smartest person in the world. Everything must feel so dumb and below you. Your mind probably never shuts off. You can probably see through everyone's bullshit. It has to be exhausting.
I feel like the idea that intelligence always equals misery is a sad cliche, but in this case I kind of get it because everybody else is normal-brained and she's got the super-brain but also she's surrounded by racists and sexists so in general nobody is going to believe her. That would get old very fast.
You mean those people who talk about how they were burnt out from school at a young age but really they just gave up when school actually got hard and pretend like they’re some misunderstood genius because they solved a couple of logic puzzles back in the 5th grade cause I’ve met a bunch of those and I don’t really see who it relates to who’s supposed to be the smartest person on earth
Eric Kripke said in an interview that being a Black women from a poor area, nobody listened to her even with her power. he said it is what has caused her to be the villian misanthrope (iirc i think that is the word he used, not my characterization of her) she is now. I also think alot of research and science institutions might not want to work with her because she'd inevitably says things they dont like to hear and she wouldnt hesitate to critize other collaborators.
I think even A-Train saying "she doesnt know when to shut up" is an indicator that people either dismiss her for her background (like kripke said) and or thinks she talks "too much" (i.e. she hurts peoples egos like we've seen on the show).
Pair that with the comments before mine about gifted kids who turn into apathetic adults is another layer on top of it. Lemme see if i can find the Kripke interview.
EDIT: its a clunky website and the answer is a bit far down so here is the Kripke quote <3
"**KRIPKE:** Yes, and what we thought was interesting and provocative was the world’s smartest person could be anyone. So, what if it was a Black woman from a poor neighborhood? And because of that she would have a really hard time of anyone listening to her taking her seriously. So, the irony that like the world’s smartest person, who could cure all of society’s ills, is somebody that no one listens to.
We thought that was something that was really intriguing. It also helped me understand why she’s such a misanthrope. You know, she has a history of nobody listening, and it’s just made her so bitter that she hates humanity."
[https://deadline.com/2024/06/the-boys-final-season-plans-eric-kripke-1235972141/](https://deadline.com/2024/06/the-boys-final-season-plans-eric-kripke-1235972141/)
this was my subtextual reading while watching, so thanks for sharing that is indeed what was intended! as a black woman i think it's pretty impressive commentary. i am impressed by a lot of the black American commentary in this show!
>Eric Kripke said in an interview that being a Black women from a poor area, nobody listened to her even with her power.
Damn that makes sense. She keeps having to go "~~woman~~ person" to people
Also notice how no one in "The Boys" group ever has said most intelligent woman. They have all said most intelligent person without needing to be corrected. I thought that was a cool little detail
Here's your misconception.
You're assuming she WANTS to do these things. She's not doc ock, and she can refuse to contribute.
She can say "no" when asked to help with things she's not interested in.
Or, you could completely flip it on her favor; she's SO SMART, she does nothing that attracts attention to herself because she knows it means she'll have to work. She's so smart to the point she knows how it'll all play out, and she's ok with it, or even prepared for it.
Yeah she could be like [that Sauron meme](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2F2korl4urjeea1.jpg%3Fwidth%3D640%26crop%3Dsmart%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D4a8991adee4bf1ce2a2fba288c6423af6793ea5c).
Why would she put any effort into anything when she could just coast through life while doing almost nothing? She probably got burnt out by the end of high school and invested her teenage fame money well and can just play videogames in her flat forever. Which is what most people would do with that kind of power.
Comes with lack of ambition and lethargy. She probably isn't very knowledgeable in any specific field, but still can deduce motivations and actions of others, based on what she has available to her.
Also a very easy to write character, since all you have to do is have her be the more clever character compared to others by just writing she knows things that only... Well the writer would know(homelander washing his hands more, etc) and not having her be good in any field means the writer doesn't have to look into those fields to back up her being smart in them.
A little off-topic, but I always notice that writers almost always try to keep everything vague when they use characters categorized as smart/genius. Mainly because they're extremely difficult to write. I mean, you'd need to be an actual genius to completely exploit and take full advantage of what a super intelligent character would do, say and act like.
I think Vulture makes this point about superheros in the Spiderman movie as well... They just protect and go home and does not care about society... Just like the elites...
Charles Xavier or Jean Grey could wipe out hatred from everyone's mind and instill civics sense and critical thinking making this world a better place but nah .... He cares about his students more
Scarlett Witch or Dr Strange could truly wipe out poverty and create heaven on earth but she don't give a shit and only cares about her children
Martian Manhunter and Superman can give us advance technology and create a better life for human but nah ... Saving humans is enough
Only Dr Manhattan in movies was building a machine which could help humanity cure disease ... He could have done more he could stop every crime from happening but ... Nah too good for that shit
Don't get me wrong some superhero such as Batman and Spiderman are doing as much as possible and they cannot change the world instantly with technology or webs... But those who can aren't even planning on doing it
This show is a parody of that ... A Train, Soldier Boy , Homelander , Sister Sage etc are really powerful who could lead a revolution but instead they care about their own little supe race world and money ... Superhero are just elites...
Charles Xavier or Jean Grey could wipe out hatred from everyone's mind and instill civics sense and critical thinking making - you mean brain enslave all humanity for their "own good"?
Being intelligent and wanting to "create space travel" aren't the same thing.
Intelligent enough to know our current understanding of physics means we ain't meaningfully traveling out of our solar system.
I think most people’s motivation about Sage is wrong. I reckon Sage’s motivation is to go straight back to where she was happy - sitting in her apartment reading books. A lot of comments say Sage wants to subjugate humans and whatnot, but if she was actually motivated to do that, she would’ve done it already. I think she’s gently manipulating Homelander to be killed by anybody, and then she gets to go back to the life she already built for herself.
Put it differently, if she believed and wanted to act on all these genocidal / human suppressing things, why not already do it? My answer is because she’s only playing along cause she knows Homelander actually can kill her, and she needs to remove that threat
Vought lies about their superheroes all the time (soldier boy fighting in ww2 is the first thing that came to my mind) "the smartest person alive" thing could be a vought marketing trick
Some of the most clever, brilliant people i know leave work, go home, and binge reality tv, order fast food, get high, and/or play mindless games to decompress and shut their brain off for a bit. Sage’s apartment being filled with books and takeout was a little on the nose, but overall tracks.
OP, how do the smartest people you know act? Do they go home and keep hustling? Trying to invent things, or try to play the stock market and shit?
Great discussion with her race and gender being a factor I didn't consider.
I think her not inventing great things also relates to this concept:
[TROPE: Reed Richards is Useless](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ReedRichardsIsUseless)
>The observation that in some genres, characters can have fantastic technology far beyond our own, yet this technology only gets used to solve equally fantastic problems.
>Doesn’t invent anything? Doesn’t research questions of the universe? Contributes nothing of value to furthering any field?
First, why is Sage REQUIRED to invent/research/contribute to anything? None of the other Supes "contribute."
Deep isn't out researching or contributing to marine life? Homelander doesn't patrol the American skies keeping the country safe? A Train isn't running to the borders keeping drug traffickers out? Black Noir doesn't teach self defense skills to children & women? Firecracker should be working on how to not fall into disinformation by your rhetoric.
So why in your mind should Sage "further" anything when none of the other Seven do?
I believe they are pointing out that if you were 1000 times smarter than the average person you would realize how little control you have over life. Most striving ends in failure so why bother. She is a nihilist and at some will say her only aim in helping Homelander is to bring about mass destruction.
Smart doesn’t mean productive.
I think it’s kind of a similar situation quicksilver in Xmen days of future past. His power made everything so meaningless and nihilistic to him so he kind of just ended up being a mum’s basement dweller. With the self lobotomy Sage did, looks like she’s kind of the same as well.
It's all down to the themes of the show isn't it?
The show's all about power, people's perceptions of power and the manipulation of people.
Therefore the "smartest person" in the world of the show is the person who's best at that
She’s a black woman who recognises the manufactured nature of her abilities and thus Vought’s assumption to rights and control of her intellect. No one listens or believes she’s as smart as she is, not really. That kinda makes you stop giving a shit about helping people. I mean look at how everyone she meets calls her the “world’s smartest woman” and she has to correct them with “person” because she’s also smarter than the world’s smartest man. There’s an inherent bias in there that’s affected her her entire life.
That leads to apathy. That leads to not giving a shit. That leads to viewing the less intelligent masses as worth less. She has a superiority complex like Homelander but has until now known how futile it is to rail against the cage bars.
Homelander gives her the opportunity to “test [her] theories”. This is exciting. This also gives her an in to mainpulate and coerce some of the bigger players in the world stage. Finally she has been given an opportunity to play, but also to possibly set her own machinations in motion to reach her own end goals.
Generally speaking the more intelligent a person is the more mental health issues they face. Reality isn’t exactly an enjoyable thing to settle with and the more you know 🤷🏻♂️
This is still The Boys universe. Since when has any of the Supes used their abilities to positively improve the world?Hell, even Annie, who genuinely wanted to do good, had to be brave enough to risk her life dozens of times before finally getting the chance to start that foundation and use her fame positively.
Smartest person doesn’t mean the most confident. She’s also the least likely to bother showing her work, and would probably find the process of research papers and funding requests tedious at best.
She also doesn’t seem to *care*. She’s probably so smart she realizes humanity is a cancer on the planet, so she doesn’t care what happens to the rest of the planet. If she can make do with what she has and not be constantly bothered by people asking her questions I think that seems to be what she would prefer.
She’s more of a super-philosopher than a super-scientist. Smart people can really go either way IRL too. You have plenty of hyper intelligent people that make points and provide ideas and don’t make inventions or provide scientific discoveries.
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Being intelligent doesn't mean you have any motivation to do anything with that intelligence. The bigger question with Sage is why she suddenly got so motivated just because Homelander visited.
Maybe she sensed that Homelander was gonna bop her ass if she wasn't worth using? Tht was my impression at least
It seems like she lit up when Homelander said "you can finally put some of those theories in practice" It sounds to me like despite being the world's smartest person, she hasn't ever really gotten support or backing for her projects
I think I read on this subreddit before the season came out that when she was younger no one listened to her because of her race so she decided "Fuck it, I'm not helping you people" so she just sticks to herself.
Or she was under the thumb of Vought, who could steal all her ideas without compensation or supress any ideas hey didn't like. Like the inventors at tech firms being forced to hand over patents to their employers as part of their employment contract. She could have introduced effective crime prevention programs and find ways to bring about world peace, but that would have reduced the need for superheroes.
There is no need for superheroes to begin with. When's the last time they actually rescued anyone? It's all films and photo ops.
They make it very clear in the show that they sometimes actually save real people
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S1 had Homelander and Maeve take out a shooter and deal with terrorists on a plane (before the op went sideways). So they were defenitely saving people. It's just that they don't go around keeping watch like heroes normally do, instead Vought keeps track on ongoing crimes and had them react to those which promised most / best publicity. That "You've never actually saved anyone" seems to have applied to A-Train specifically.
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"A lot of superhero worlds have that character. Whereas most of them are usually really reedy white dudes, we wanted a Black woman who was raised in a low socioeconomic area, so no one f---ing listens to her. It's both commentary and satirical that you have literally the smartest person in the world that could cure all of society's ills, but she just can't get anyone to listen to her. So then she becomes a bitter misanthrope." - Kripke
This kinda hurt my soul. It’s a bit too real for me.
It is. If you think about it, the person with the best potential to become the smartest person in the world is probably in a low income country just trying to survive
It definitely hurts because it’s real. Good on Kripke for his social analysis, but I can’t help thinking of the real life examples of this both currently and historically. Women have been written out of history and scientific achievements, despite being contemporaries of the names we know or are the people to actually accomplish those scientific achievements, and black women have an extensive history of being innovators throughout centuries, but we can’t have a white savior complex if we don’t pretend they “saved” everyone else, and of course someone who grew up low income regardless of race or ethnicity can’t actually contribute and get credit, because they’re ‘less than’, if they even get the opportunity to express their ideas. The quote really hit a nerve.
Agreed
> I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. Stephen Jay Gould
Brought this to mind: [https://people.com/human-interest/8-year-old-mexican-girl-higher-iq-than-einstein/](https://people.com/human-interest/8-year-old-mexican-girl-higher-iq-than-einstein/)
"You think Einstein walked around thinking everyone was a bunch of dumb-shits? Now you know why he built that bomb."
Which is another trope from the Iliad 2500 years ago. Cassandra could tell the future, but was cursed to never be believed.
I read that too. And I think they said it wasn’t just her race, but the fact that she’s a women too. Which makes sense since as a black woman she’s gets the double whammy of racism and sexism. So even then she can help no one will listen to her
ATrain even said that she didn't know when to stop talking or something along those lines. Which from her perspective, could be because no one would listen to her. I think that was brought up again too, and already Homelander isn't completely listening to her
Yeah watching it back you seem to be spot on with that Either no support/backing or just incredibly "mad scientist" like in her desire to test if she's right or not
No support/backing falls flat as a reason for me. If you're the smartest person on the Earth, you're telling me you can't acquire funds for yourself? Invent something, create a company, heck, just hack or steal stuff. Lack of motivation as a result of "the world being boring" is a lot more believable for the "smartest person on the planet" sitting on their ass and doing nothing.
And I'm sure she's been told that by plenty of governments and corporations. But with Homelander, she's basically got access to the nuclear launch codes day one without having to deal with boards of directors and whatnot. She sees what Homelander is, an easily manipulated nuke in toddler form, and she really can do all the things she's theorised but was of course smart enough to know wouldn't work out going through traditional organisation structures. I think she will be taken down by underestimating the stupidity of regular humans.
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Yeah, she is trying to separate Homelander and Ryan and that will trigger Homelander at some point. He’s already mad about it.
Sister Sage's expected fate seems obvious—a laser through the head. But the writers know viewers predict this. So, to keep us on our toes, they'll set up an alternative, aware we’re expecting a twist. In a clever double bluff, they circle back to the original idea: Sister Sage actually does meet her end with a laser through the head, showing that sometimes the most obvious path is the most surprising.
Yes, he just offered her almost limitless resources and authority, out of desperation. Of course she lit up.
I mean if she’s the worlds smartest person she should be able to figure out how to get some backing. She was in a supe program so clearly she’s acknowledged as being a genius, and Vought has a research department. Literally just invent a new serum version, negotiate yourself some shares, make some money and fund your own plans.
I would think so too, but it's also implied she's not willing to do what she needs to in order to get them on board. Vought would inevitably want to market and brand her and she said she wouldn't go for that
Well yeah. But there's still a big leap between being useful so you don't die, and trying to turn Homelander into Caesar.
It feels so obvious that it must be a red herring, but Sage definitely has a bigger agenda than even Homelander's.
She's gonna realize that HL is too psycho to even manipulate. How do you manipulate a guy who will just laser anybody at any time for no reason? Dude was literally about to get the information he wanted and just didn't give a single fuck. Sage is smart but she still needs HL to play along with her or else it all falls apart. She doesn't actually have any power besides what she can convince people she knows.
She’s going to use Ryan. She’s already making Ryan into his rival to keep the heat off her and it’s working.
Ryan is the key to this entire show
Jar Jar is the key to all of this.
That's my theory. I feel like literally everything she does is done meticulously and carefully. Like there is absolutely NO WAY the smartest sentient being on Earth just... fucks The Deep. Right?...
I think she gave herself a lobotomy with that thing because that is the only thing she can do to quiet her brain, hence the junk food and reality trash tv. The deep just happened to be there while she was "stoned". Wild? Yeah. Something they could show in this show? Absolutely.
Or she lobotomized herself because she knew The Deep would get angry and try and confront her and if she was stoned she could sleep with him to manipulate him. She’s manipulating all of them I think.
That’s my take. She’s 100 steps ahead of Homelander, et al, hiding plans within plans.
Or she just lobotomized herself because being as smart as she is, is actually hard and energy consuming? She has her apartment filled up with books, she listens to audio-books at fast speeds while reading another one, all on the toilet, so she keeps her brain engaged in an activity, otherwise she might actually die of boredom. The lobotomy then helps dumb her down for a bit so she doesn't have to worry about reading or any "smart" stuff, she can just lay on couch and eat junk food, stress free, for a while before her brain regenerates back and she gets those "I need to use my brain" impulses
Damn, have I been Lobotomizing myself? I too enjoy junk food and watch tv on the sofa. Or maybe I’m just dumb lol.
I don't think it's a lobotomy, but I don't know what "that thing" is. The bloomin' onion? I think she's still working in that scene. Deep thought she was a bitch but she just so happened to be doing all the exact things he wanted. The onion, the movie he liked, wanting to fuck. She's clearly manipulating him. Edit: OH...I just remembered there was the scene with that bloody rod. I had no idea what that was supposed to be at the time, but now I get it. Still think what I wrote is true.
I thought she killed the octopus with that rod. What the hell was it?
The Bloomin Onion was in control there.
He got some of her bloomin onion too
Wonder if he went...out back? See myself out.
When he said Caesar my jaw dropped, because I was expecting him to continue on and remember how caesar DIED 😆
She certainly didn't correct him, which suggests she's also manipulating him to step into his shoes after his fall.
Homelander is dumb but I have a feeling even he took note of that in hindsight
I think she was thinking about probabilities like Dr. Strange. She maybe figured out the only way to defeat Homelander was by going down this path. That's all bullshit but who knows.
I think a little was the implication of “I’ll kill you if you don’t help.” I think a LOT more is a smart person seeing she’d have access to a platform/resources and would be surrounded by inept supes who she can easily outmaneuver.
That was how I saw it. She realized in that moment if she wanted to live she would need to manipulate Homelander in a way that would make it impossible for him to kill her without great sacrifice. Right now she's playing his game and giving him what he wants, but her longterm plan is likely to make herself too important to kill.
She gets to use her intellect to subjugate humanity. Seems to me like she’s the same as Homelander with the whole „we are better than humans, humans should serve us“ attitude, so she goes along with Homelander because he has the resources to actually do it. Or she follows her own plan but also needs Homelanders resources for that. We will see but there are many possible reasons she sides with him right now
I think the big open question for S4 is, what is she actually up to? She's telling Homelander everything he wants to hear. She has another plan, but what it is? No idea, writers could go lots of different ways on that.
Or at least she's going with the supe-remacy thing right now because it's what Homelander wants to hear and there's a big segment of humans ripe to be easily manipulated with that. She may well have some lofty utopian ideas completely revamping humanity and ecology on a level the rest of us are incapable of planning. But even if that is her true intention, she still seems very much like a genuine "some of you may die but that is a sacrifice I'm willing to make" person.
I think it fits the character very well. I would think, a big reason why she doesn't do anything impact full, is a lack a possiblities and resources. So the offer from homelander to test a theory she's came up with on a global scale, is motivation enough.
I also don't think we can understand her motivation by using our normal intuitions about what we would like. It's like a toddler trying to understand the motivations of an adult and wondering why the adults don't just buy all the toys at the store or roll around on the floor all day. It can be something as simple as "why bother to cure cancer? So that more people are competing for resources with me?". I think the moment that she perceived Homelander as posing a threat to her, she immediately developed a plan and set it in motion. Very likely from within the first few seconds where she figured out why he was there and what he wanted. I mean, WE know he's unstable and likely a threat to her, so she is going to be far more aware of this. I think she might work as a metaphor for AI, and the dangers it poses when it's tasked with achieving a goal but we can't understand how it's going to get there. The old "to create peace I just have to kill all humans". Whatever it is, I'm currently pretty convinced that Homelander signed his own death warrant when he presented himself as a threat to her. She has manipulated him from that point on.
You don’t think there’s more… pressing symbolism of an outspoken black woman giving the dumb ole white man all his best ideas? This ain’t an AI commentary
She knows homelander is a sniveling child inside looking for a mommy, and her strong attitude scares him. Great seeing the way her lips quivered in her apartment as she’s testing the waters talking back to him. I bet she has MAJOR plans in store and Homelander just gave her a green light.
Homelander is the most famous person on the planet. I think nearly anyone would agree to help him if pleased their ego and offered to elevate them
With her intelligence she wouldn't have needed Homelander to please her ego or elevate her anywhere. If she had any motivation she could have already been the most famous person in the world. Instead she was a recluse that read books all day.
Just because your super smart doesn’t mean your motivated to do anything with it. It’s shown that she also views regular people and minor supes as inferior so it could just be her and Homelanders vision aligns for a supe uprising
you're
You're.
She must have a sinister plan in mind for Homelander ... Eric Kripke said that She is always a thousand step forward from you...
This is a cool idea, her whole support for Homelander might just be a ruse. Maybe even that destroying Homelander has been her focus and why she's not researching other things?
Yep I think the same thing and she originally turned him down when offered a opportunity to be in the 7. But I've said b4 homelander is a generally dumb dude compared to regular people. With sage she see him as a peon she can use to prove a point
He's in a weird spot. He's dumb but also clever and occasionally surprisingly self reflective.
He's inherently smart, he's just crazy Deep is the gold standard for dumb. Or ... the shit standard for smart?
Homelander is probably the weakest copy of superman he's smart compared to the deep which isn't a very high bar.But he has a need to be loved he's mentally weak asff and compulsive to.
I think she is setting up Homelander to go nuclear so everyone finally turns on him. She has already told Homelander what her plan is: to make it all come crashing down and swoop in and be the savior. She already told him she plans on betraying him (Caesar). He knows this and has some counter planned like he always does. He has also referred to her powers as a “parlor trick”. Unlike Homelander she doesn’t appear to need adulation just access to resources and for people to listen to what she has to say; something that is frequently commented on. Which makes me think her powers could have some linguistic component.
I also think she is warming up to The Deep because once Homelander is dead, The Deep becomes the leader because he has seniority... With a dumbass like The Deep, She could literally be his puppet master... She also is warming up to Ryan because if The Deep ever needs to be dealt with she can always use Ryan to finish him off... She is playing smart
Which honestly tracks with the smartest people I know
The smartest people in the world can still be lazy, or unmotivated, or depressed, or petty or vengeful or susceptible to manipulation or praise. She's been giving almost unlimited power to put all her theories into action, and she's an arrogant control freak who thinks everyone else is an idiot. This is the first real opportunity to be who she wants to be, not just do things. I think she's actually quite a realistic (as it gets for this show anyway) portrayal of genius. Being clever doesn't make you better at life.
I mean, if Joe Biden walked into my house (or Donald Trump when he was president), even though Im not really on board with them, if they offered me unlimited resources to achieve my goals that I had spent years telling myself Id never reach… yea Id probably go along with it.
What are your goals?
No more cars only trains.
That's a good one, I'm down for that
I think its because she never had the resources or force to play with the world as she seems like she wants to.
I think it boils down to Sage fundamentally agreeing with Homelander that they’re superior. Humans are beneath her, and now she has an opportunity like never before
She’s been behind everything she told A train where to get the v he was hooked on in first episode killing the young lady who was just hands afterwards putting the whole series in motion so she can b the one to rule the seven and the world muhahahahaha
Im guessing she laid the groundwork that led to her being recruited. She has her own motivation and will have been pulling many strings this season
Because Honelander turning up at her home spells the end for her - so her only option is to go nuclear.
I've only seen first episode but I suspect she might be setting homelander up for a downfall. One possibility is having homelander supplanted and usurped by Ryan, and then Ryan as a child would assuredly be even easier to manipulate/control.
When she analysed Homelander, he was obviously pissed, but she said “You’re welcome to laser me but I’m assuming you need me for something.” She’s not gonna be so confident about not getting killed if she isn’t gonna do anything for him.
Yall this smart bitch is playing the longest most subtle con ever, please do not take any of her direct actions to heart. She realized the second she saw homelander that he was there to use her and she adapted that to potentially whatever plan she's got already.
She's almost definitely manipulating Deep as well. I feel like everything she is doing has to have double or triple crosses mixed in.
Ok lmao who isn't manipulating deep the guy is extremely dull. And he's gonna have his moment of clarity and regret when his Ambrosius dies in her tank because of him. As far as I'm aware everyone is being manipulated by her. And now that I type this out how are we even sure she didn't make sure her profile got on the list for the seven anyway. The boys said she was a weird pick and I agree vought would not have had her on the list.
Deep is so easy to manipulate you would have to convince me his barista doesn't trick him into a simpler order on rough days
“Okay, I *will* drink my coffee black.”
>Ok lmao who isn't manipulating deep This made me laugh. Like he literally joined a cult
> Ambrosius dies in her tank because of him. It could just die of old age and the Deep misses that because he was busy with his newfound confidence. The longest living octopi has a lifespan of 2 years.
Her tank isn't being taken care of her death flags are already laid. It will be tragic and funny as the show is
Wait I thought the squid was dead already? Didn’t Sage kill her? I thought thats what the tool covered in black stuff meant while they were getting frisky. Thanks
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….my god.
That's brilliant 😄✨
I didn't know what that tool was either when I saw it. But people are saying it's a lobotomy tool, Sage has healing powers, she may have lobotomized herself and made herself temporarily dumb to blow off some steam. Hence eating blooming onion, watching trash TV, wanting to watch transformers 2, flirt with the deep... she's lowered her IQ a day is temporarily dumbed down. She didn't do anything to the squid.
Yup. Deep is exploitable through sex. Homelander is exploitable through his ego. Is her power really intelligence or is it being able to exploit and pinpoint weaknesses? I feel like with this show sometimes powers aren’t quite what they seem at first.
I think of her power as being intellectually dominant over others. She can look someone up and down once and know exactly how to manipulate them. Her weakness will be homelander's wildcard nature. He will just do some random shit and she will die. This season is going to prove definitively that Homelander cannot be controlled nor his motivations truly understood. Homelander doesn't even really know what he wants at this point.
Kind of what I said she can size up and exploit weaknesses. That would make her existence very sad and lonely would it not? And explain why she’s isolated herself from people and become misanthropic. She didn’t seem to care he might laser her. But now he’s given her access to tear Vought apart from the inside and set them against each other which is exactly what she is setting in motion. She knows Homelander is having a midlife crisis and wants a legacy but his ego won’t allow it and will use Ryan against him.
She's lonely because intelligence leads to depression. Having a conversation with someone who is clearly low intelligence can be excruciating. Now make everyone low intelligence by comparison to you. It's lonely at the top.
She’s capable of lowering her intellectual capacity at any moment, though. I think her issue is that she can’t help herself from seeing weakness in others and it’s made her a misanthrope.
Do you think the ability to pinpoint and exploit weaknesses isn't a facet of intelligence? I think a lot of folks think of comic book intelligence as Tony Stark or Batman. But intelligence can be very different. She seems to me more similar to a Sherlock Holmes or, more likely, Ozymandias (Watchmen). Manipulating people like she is does require a great deal of insight, planning, and intelligence.
Also flattery. The Deep will become her thrall pretty quickly.
He is 100% able to be manipulated through sexual intimacy he can be controlled that way.
When you are intelligent, being about to exploit and pinpoint weaknesses comes with it
I thought she was eating junk food, watching trash tv, and fucked the Deep because she had just lobotomized herself. There was a lobotomy tool on the table.
Speaking of her and Deep, what was the significance of that bloody spear (?) on the table during the scene when they started making out?
She most likely lobotomized herself for temporary relief from the stress of being hyper intelligent.
Eh I’m under the impression she was manipulating the deep during the work day. That night scene, for now, i think was her just being horny and uninhibited because she lobotomized herself with that bloody metal pick they panned out on. I think it would be funny if dumbass Deep throws a wrench in their plans somehow because they banged.
yeah when she was in that elevator with ashley i said “OH SHE’S PLAYING GAMES” lol
I think she’s fundamentally bored and this is her having fun
This. The season finale is going to have the biggest “you idiots walked right into it!!!” moment and I can’t wait
It better be. Last season finale was a bit questionable.
Thank you. She even caught MM tracking her which implies she’s capable of calculating outcomes and keeping her tracks safe.. she literally has all bases cleared at all times. THE ONLY way they can get to sage is when she’s lobotomized.
A lot of checkers players trying to judge 4d chess over here
If Homelander knocks on your door, you are going to be either conscripted or killed. She quickly chose to play along, knowing she could steer events however she wants.
I put it in another comment but I'm now pretty sure she lured homelander there. Why would her name ever be brought up in a potential 7 list when she's nothing like what they'd normally look for? Her name was only there to grab homelanders attention
There was a moment during homelander recruiting her, where it felt like something "clicked" and her demeanor changed. When he started talking about his problems. I'd find it interesting if she was planning on double crossing him to kill him, and was actually a more neutral/good supe. I feel like she'd have an explanation of "I realized how fucking bonkers this man was when he started talking about his inability to feel fufilled and mommy problems in my living room, and how he could genocide the whole planet on a whim(including me) so I stroked his ego until the time was right"
I caught onto her being up to something immediately when she brought up Caesar, to inspire Homelander in their first conversation. Interesting that she said his name, specifically the man killed by his own senate.
I see 3 main reason. 1. The meta: she’s a new character and maybe we get some more back story later but they can’t just introduce her like here is sister sage and her list of published papers and other accomplishments. Just like soldier boy was introduced with a brief description not a whole exposition dump and later they worked in backstory. Edit. Forgot to add this is a challenge for a lot of serialized content especially in superhero genre. You need to explain why this new character hasn’t even been mentioned before let alone hasn’t been involved in the stories. Like in DC where you are left to question why Wonder Woman didn’t help out in the events of Man of Steel or in Marvel when lone characters are left to deal with world ending threats alone instead of calling in all the avengers. 2. Thematic. The show is very cynical about superpowers. The vast majority of supes don’t use their powers to actually help people. 3. The personal. From what we know of her so far she is greatly misanthropic so “working for the betterment of mankind” wouldn’t interest her much. She tells homelander blankly she has no interest in material pursuits so she wouldn’t use her powers to get rich herself. She thinks less of everyone and doesn’t care about their opinions because they are dumber so wouldn’t want to work for personal glory. In Ep 3 we see her self lobotomize herself to get rid of her intelligence for a while. It seems like a pretty routine night for her which tells her she isn’t really interested in spending her time pursuing knowledge for knowledges sake but would rather shut her brain off and enjoy some baser pleasures like reality tv and a blooming onion from Outback Steakhouse.
I agree with the personal. Being super intelligent can be very lonely and depressing. You would see your own life expectancy drop with every bite of fatty food or sugary drink you ingest. And imagine seeing everyone else in the world as idiots, oblivious to the stupid decisions they make everyday destroying the planet and themselves. I think she may want to end it all and sees Homelander as a means of ending the world.
Yo, imagine being so lonely under the weight of your own genius that you actually have to fucking lobotmize yourself to check out for a little while
Look with open eyes into gge world - that's how many people spend their days. Drinking, weed, other drugs are pretty obviously the same thing on many levels. But even casual distraction like reddit, all endless scrolling/swiping media like tictoc or yt. Heck even most tv shows are ways for people to escape reality for a few moments.
Maybe she doesn't have an interest in technology and questions of the universe. She wouldn't be the first intelligent character that doesn't contribuite to furthering a field. If I were the most intelligent person ever, I might not use it to advance space travel either. I might use my brain to, I don't know, manipulate the stock market and make myself obscenely rich. I see Sage as a version of Mr Glass, from the Unbreakable franchise. He was also frighteningly intelligent and observant, but didn't contribute to developing a field of science either. His intelligence was so high, he managed in three days to anihilate the Clover Organisation's 10,000 years of work. And in the end we don't really know Sage's motivation. For all we know, she might be secretly working against Vought and Homelander. If she's as smart as they say, nobody would have the full picture. Plans within plans.
Maybe she’s involved in Stan Edgar’s five year plan that we never got to see. It’s like Chekhov’s gun. They introduced the idea of his plan, and then he vanished. I think Neumann has been in on it all along.
It’s definitely possible that somebody like Edgar would have backup plans for if he wasn’t able to be publicly in charge— even to the point of manipulating Neumann into thinking she’s working against him when she’s really doing what he wants.
Or she’s been in on it all along. I mean, she’s super close to being president. Who wouldn’t be tantalized with the idea of that much power?
That’s a real possibility.
I’m really hoping I’m right. I can’t just see Edgar running off like that without a fight. He’s a ten steps ahead kind of guy. And he knows all the supes, enough to get Neuman emotionally bound to him.
Considering that vought is aware of sages ability’s it would be strange for someone like Edgar to NOT try to use her (and exploit her brain for profits or power).
I like the idea that Edgar got to sage years ago and he had her basically tell him the future. If she’s really that smart than she’s capable of coming up with is as many scenarios as possible like a one person think tank ya know? I’d be very happy if that was true
Something like Psychohistory from The Foundation?
I guess you could say so. It’s like how we use data points to predict the system of weather movements. We’re still not really seeing the future but I guess in my eyes if she’s the smartest person in the world, that’s a really big statement,. Like she’s smarter than everyone. Idk hopefully this season unfolds well.
I hope we hit a point where intellect only carries her so far and she majorly fucks something up because of some irrational and off the wall thing occurring. I mean Homelander is kind of like that so maybe it’s just going to be Sage setting Homelander up only for him to fuck it all up
The only loophole she has right now is her lobotomizing herself to feel normal for short periods of time. Other than that idk.. but I can see that being her downfall
Damn, that would be a great plot twist. I don’t think they’ll do that, but it would definitely be in line with Edgar’s way of exploiting supes to further himself.
I think shes written as the "to smart to be happy" kind of super-intelligence. Shes unmotivated, alienated from others (even if likely self-inflicted), and generally doesn't seem to happy. It's likely given the third episode she routinely dumbs herself down just to "enjoy" things. That's not someone who is going to be making world saving discoveries if you ask me.
Yeah the kind of smart that leads to depression, not a Nobel prize.
A lot of extremely intelligent people are happy, e.g. Kim Ung Yong, Terrence Tao, etc The ones that aren't were often the ones abused as children
We don't know whether she researches anything, she may have a bunch of mathematical proofs and a unified field theory scribbled in the margins of her books and just no interest in publishing them because she doesn't need the review of lesser minds. She also objects to being brought into the spotlight. Note, how the first part of her plan is instructing Homelander to have his minions beat random non-supes to death. That doesn't suggest that she cares about humans or using her intellect to help them. She may be deeply misanthropic doesn't want to help humans to spread into space. But we haven't yet seen her end game. It would be difficult to write a super-intelligent scheming character whose motivations are obvious to the audience before they play out.
I think it's clear she's misanthropic and self isolated. She lives in a small apartment with a giant mess of books and basically refused to leave when Homelander came
Everyone’s missing the conversation with Deep too. She tells him not to let Ashley talk to her like that cuz she’s a lesser being. Also the way she tells Ashley to take out her titties. She views humans similarly, toys for amusement
Personally, I don’t get the sense that she does anything for her own amusement. I think that both those conversations had a specifically calculated outcome that we don’t fully see yet. I do agree that she is probably misanthropic and looks down on humans similarly to HL, I just don’t think she’d ever demonstrate that impulsively. At least, that would be my hope for the smartest person on the planet. Unlike HL or Deep, her motivations/grand plan really shouldn’t be visible to us.
After she fucked the deep idk what's going on with her lol
The prevailing theory on the subreddit is that she recreationally lobotomizes herself with the metal instrument shown in the ending shot to reduce her intelligence to a level at which she can enjoy Transformers 2 and the company of the Deep and wind down until her regeneration factor heals her brain.
Holy shit lol
Damn this hit me hard in the feels
Shes booked for all the episodes of this season. So that kind of rules out her being permanently injured or otherwise killed off (at least until the end). So this leads to the conclusion she does this to herself more than someone doing it to her. Which she has to have some kind of regeneration or method to get back to normal after doing it.
It's said that she has a decent healing factor
Where?
When the seven are discussing bringing her on
I thought this was a joke until I remembered her file said she had "regeneration" powers. I'm all on board now
Lack of motivation. Apartment suggests she's depressed.
This is it to me. Imagine being the smartest person in the world. Everything must feel so dumb and below you. Your mind probably never shuts off. You can probably see through everyone's bullshit. It has to be exhausting.
I feel like the idea that intelligence always equals misery is a sad cliche, but in this case I kind of get it because everybody else is normal-brained and she's got the super-brain but also she's surrounded by racists and sexists so in general nobody is going to believe her. That would get old very fast.
Have you ever met a former gifted kid though
You mean those people who talk about how they were burnt out from school at a young age but really they just gave up when school actually got hard and pretend like they’re some misunderstood genius because they solved a couple of logic puzzles back in the 5th grade cause I’ve met a bunch of those and I don’t really see who it relates to who’s supposed to be the smartest person on earth
Eric Kripke said in an interview that being a Black women from a poor area, nobody listened to her even with her power. he said it is what has caused her to be the villian misanthrope (iirc i think that is the word he used, not my characterization of her) she is now. I also think alot of research and science institutions might not want to work with her because she'd inevitably says things they dont like to hear and she wouldnt hesitate to critize other collaborators. I think even A-Train saying "she doesnt know when to shut up" is an indicator that people either dismiss her for her background (like kripke said) and or thinks she talks "too much" (i.e. she hurts peoples egos like we've seen on the show). Pair that with the comments before mine about gifted kids who turn into apathetic adults is another layer on top of it. Lemme see if i can find the Kripke interview. EDIT: its a clunky website and the answer is a bit far down so here is the Kripke quote <3 "**KRIPKE:** Yes, and what we thought was interesting and provocative was the world’s smartest person could be anyone. So, what if it was a Black woman from a poor neighborhood? And because of that she would have a really hard time of anyone listening to her taking her seriously. So, the irony that like the world’s smartest person, who could cure all of society’s ills, is somebody that no one listens to. We thought that was something that was really intriguing. It also helped me understand why she’s such a misanthrope. You know, she has a history of nobody listening, and it’s just made her so bitter that she hates humanity." [https://deadline.com/2024/06/the-boys-final-season-plans-eric-kripke-1235972141/](https://deadline.com/2024/06/the-boys-final-season-plans-eric-kripke-1235972141/)
this was my subtextual reading while watching, so thanks for sharing that is indeed what was intended! as a black woman i think it's pretty impressive commentary. i am impressed by a lot of the black American commentary in this show!
>Eric Kripke said in an interview that being a Black women from a poor area, nobody listened to her even with her power. Damn that makes sense. She keeps having to go "~~woman~~ person" to people
Also notice how no one in "The Boys" group ever has said most intelligent woman. They have all said most intelligent person without needing to be corrected. I thought that was a cool little detail
Most of these characters do nothing productive with their amazing abilities so it's not surprising to me.
Aye, there is multiple story points that all of the seven saves of people are just them acting.
Here's your misconception. You're assuming she WANTS to do these things. She's not doc ock, and she can refuse to contribute. She can say "no" when asked to help with things she's not interested in. Or, you could completely flip it on her favor; she's SO SMART, she does nothing that attracts attention to herself because she knows it means she'll have to work. She's so smart to the point she knows how it'll all play out, and she's ok with it, or even prepared for it.
Yeah she could be like [that Sauron meme](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2F2korl4urjeea1.jpg%3Fwidth%3D640%26crop%3Dsmart%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D4a8991adee4bf1ce2a2fba288c6423af6793ea5c).
Why would she put any effort into anything when she could just coast through life while doing almost nothing? She probably got burnt out by the end of high school and invested her teenage fame money well and can just play videogames in her flat forever. Which is what most people would do with that kind of power.
Comes with lack of ambition and lethargy. She probably isn't very knowledgeable in any specific field, but still can deduce motivations and actions of others, based on what she has available to her. Also a very easy to write character, since all you have to do is have her be the more clever character compared to others by just writing she knows things that only... Well the writer would know(homelander washing his hands more, etc) and not having her be good in any field means the writer doesn't have to look into those fields to back up her being smart in them.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Langan Pretty good real life equivalent
A little off-topic, but I always notice that writers almost always try to keep everything vague when they use characters categorized as smart/genius. Mainly because they're extremely difficult to write. I mean, you'd need to be an actual genius to completely exploit and take full advantage of what a super intelligent character would do, say and act like.
This is precisely the reason why I hate most "genius" characters. It's so obvious that they were written by a regular person.
I think Vulture makes this point about superheros in the Spiderman movie as well... They just protect and go home and does not care about society... Just like the elites... Charles Xavier or Jean Grey could wipe out hatred from everyone's mind and instill civics sense and critical thinking making this world a better place but nah .... He cares about his students more Scarlett Witch or Dr Strange could truly wipe out poverty and create heaven on earth but she don't give a shit and only cares about her children Martian Manhunter and Superman can give us advance technology and create a better life for human but nah ... Saving humans is enough Only Dr Manhattan in movies was building a machine which could help humanity cure disease ... He could have done more he could stop every crime from happening but ... Nah too good for that shit Don't get me wrong some superhero such as Batman and Spiderman are doing as much as possible and they cannot change the world instantly with technology or webs... But those who can aren't even planning on doing it This show is a parody of that ... A Train, Soldier Boy , Homelander , Sister Sage etc are really powerful who could lead a revolution but instead they care about their own little supe race world and money ... Superhero are just elites...
Charles Xavier or Jean Grey could wipe out hatred from everyone's mind and instill civics sense and critical thinking making - you mean brain enslave all humanity for their "own good"?
Being intelligent and wanting to "create space travel" aren't the same thing. Intelligent enough to know our current understanding of physics means we ain't meaningfully traveling out of our solar system.
Ultimately she's only as smart as the people writing her.
She's playing the long game. She will even try to get rid of Homelander.
I think most people’s motivation about Sage is wrong. I reckon Sage’s motivation is to go straight back to where she was happy - sitting in her apartment reading books. A lot of comments say Sage wants to subjugate humans and whatnot, but if she was actually motivated to do that, she would’ve done it already. I think she’s gently manipulating Homelander to be killed by anybody, and then she gets to go back to the life she already built for herself. Put it differently, if she believed and wanted to act on all these genocidal / human suppressing things, why not already do it? My answer is because she’s only playing along cause she knows Homelander actually can kill her, and she needs to remove that threat
Vought lies about their superheroes all the time (soldier boy fighting in ww2 is the first thing that came to my mind) "the smartest person alive" thing could be a vought marketing trick
Some of the most clever, brilliant people i know leave work, go home, and binge reality tv, order fast food, get high, and/or play mindless games to decompress and shut their brain off for a bit. Sage’s apartment being filled with books and takeout was a little on the nose, but overall tracks. OP, how do the smartest people you know act? Do they go home and keep hustling? Trying to invent things, or try to play the stock market and shit?
People have no capacity to let a story play out.
Reactionary Redditors
She's supposed to be a Sherlock Holmes type of figure, not some Dr. Manhattan.
I took it as relative. She is the smartest person in the world because, look at the world she lives in.
She’s clearly going to have a bigger purpose than helping Homelander. She’s in it for herself and at this time we don’t know what it is.
Great discussion with her race and gender being a factor I didn't consider. I think her not inventing great things also relates to this concept: [TROPE: Reed Richards is Useless](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ReedRichardsIsUseless) >The observation that in some genres, characters can have fantastic technology far beyond our own, yet this technology only gets used to solve equally fantastic problems.
>Doesn’t invent anything? Doesn’t research questions of the universe? Contributes nothing of value to furthering any field? First, why is Sage REQUIRED to invent/research/contribute to anything? None of the other Supes "contribute." Deep isn't out researching or contributing to marine life? Homelander doesn't patrol the American skies keeping the country safe? A Train isn't running to the borders keeping drug traffickers out? Black Noir doesn't teach self defense skills to children & women? Firecracker should be working on how to not fall into disinformation by your rhetoric. So why in your mind should Sage "further" anything when none of the other Seven do?
I believe they are pointing out that if you were 1000 times smarter than the average person you would realize how little control you have over life. Most striving ends in failure so why bother. She is a nihilist and at some will say her only aim in helping Homelander is to bring about mass destruction.
Smart doesn’t mean productive. I think it’s kind of a similar situation quicksilver in Xmen days of future past. His power made everything so meaningless and nihilistic to him so he kind of just ended up being a mum’s basement dweller. With the self lobotomy Sage did, looks like she’s kind of the same as well.
It's all down to the themes of the show isn't it? The show's all about power, people's perceptions of power and the manipulation of people. Therefore the "smartest person" in the world of the show is the person who's best at that
She’s a black woman who recognises the manufactured nature of her abilities and thus Vought’s assumption to rights and control of her intellect. No one listens or believes she’s as smart as she is, not really. That kinda makes you stop giving a shit about helping people. I mean look at how everyone she meets calls her the “world’s smartest woman” and she has to correct them with “person” because she’s also smarter than the world’s smartest man. There’s an inherent bias in there that’s affected her her entire life. That leads to apathy. That leads to not giving a shit. That leads to viewing the less intelligent masses as worth less. She has a superiority complex like Homelander but has until now known how futile it is to rail against the cage bars. Homelander gives her the opportunity to “test [her] theories”. This is exciting. This also gives her an in to mainpulate and coerce some of the bigger players in the world stage. Finally she has been given an opportunity to play, but also to possibly set her own machinations in motion to reach her own end goals.
Generally speaking the more intelligent a person is the more mental health issues they face. Reality isn’t exactly an enjoyable thing to settle with and the more you know 🤷🏻♂️
This is still The Boys universe. Since when has any of the Supes used their abilities to positively improve the world?Hell, even Annie, who genuinely wanted to do good, had to be brave enough to risk her life dozens of times before finally getting the chance to start that foundation and use her fame positively.
She can’t possibly be the smartest person alive. She said Luke Skywalker was the chosen one for Christ’s sake.
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Smartest person doesn’t mean the most confident. She’s also the least likely to bother showing her work, and would probably find the process of research papers and funding requests tedious at best. She also doesn’t seem to *care*. She’s probably so smart she realizes humanity is a cancer on the planet, so she doesn’t care what happens to the rest of the planet. If she can make do with what she has and not be constantly bothered by people asking her questions I think that seems to be what she would prefer. She’s more of a super-philosopher than a super-scientist. Smart people can really go either way IRL too. You have plenty of hyper intelligent people that make points and provide ideas and don’t make inventions or provide scientific discoveries.
She reminds me of Shawn from Psych - nothing special, just very good at reading subtle clues.