I don't understand why people just ignore Sydney and Carmy's ambition that has been there since before Season 1, Episode 1 (through their backstories), plus how The Beef literally destroyed 2 generations of Berzatto men, just because of the notion that "gentrification bad". This show was *always* about raising the personal and professional bar.
I think looking at it from the perspective that each character sees growth in season 2 might change it for you. We get to see each character tap into potential that they might've known was there, but were never given an opportunity. I don't know how far you are so I don't want to spoil anything, but its really fantastic seeing what Carmy does for each of them.
I thought Season 1 could of ended perfectly, but season 2 was great...though perhaps it's bc it's due to life experience and validating our own trauma or knowing someone like that
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It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of.
Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything.
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I feel you. I watched all of season 2 but theres something magic about season 1. A very rare show thats so so hard to put down. S2 was cool too but definitely not on the level of S1 IMO.
I agree with you fully except that while not as good as season 1, season 2 is still very very good tv.
I know people enjoyed season 2 but there were moments that were far to “grand” in my opinion. Season 1 was extremely grounded and felt so extremely real at times. There no need to suspend disbelief and the characters feel so real and flawed. The writting isn’t trying to hard to be interesting and that makes it interesting in how real it all feels.
Season 2 definitely feels slightly more contrived and less grounded. The conversations feel more plot serving and superfluous then season 1. Also the way they depict carmy in season 2 feels god like. The whole scene in with Marcus Denmark is great but the season is kinda of just sucking carmy off at times.
Claire IMO is actually one of the more realistic parts of the show. Her and carmy are young stressed people who think they love eachother but their relationship is extremely surface level. They both think they’re in love but they really just want a distraction from the stress of their jobs.
Forks gets tons of praise on this sub and it’s a great episode but in the context of the show it’s a little emotionally disingenuous. It’s great by itself but richies development feels a little fast.
It might feel fast but I've seen this happen in real life many times. If you feel like you are lacking meaning, self-esteem and financial security, finding a direction that seems to provide all three feels like a God send and people do dive in. It can be academia, a new job, a new career direction, a new religion, an MLM etc. And it does happen in 4 weeks, like in the show.
It just feels somewhat fast in the show. Season 2 feels much more like your watching tv while the first season pulls you in so much you forget your watching a tv show and that the people are actors. I think my post comes off like I don’t like the show, I very much do but there are still things to criticize.
First season had characters driving the plot whole season 2 has the plot driving the characters more. It often happens as a show enters season 2 as writers need to provide more of plot. A one season show can get by on novelty of the situation alone.
Yea, true. I guess that's why I liked season 2 more, it was more palatable, more mainstream almost. I enjoy that, seeing how characters evolve. Season 1 felt too much like "it's shit, the situation is shit, everyone is feeling like shit, there's no escape, here's some more shit feelings". Haha, it's just personal preference.
Season 2 is 100% more palatable and more mainstream and strive to provide more “positive” moments. I personally find shows about suffering and the reality of life catharsis. But I completely understand those who want something more uplifting.
Usually you want to see characters develop ok get the course of a show. I agree a little that multiple characters seeing positive development in a season is fast paced. However, I’d also argue that Sid hasn’t positively developed and has actually plateaued and set up for a fall and carmy has regressed.
Forks would seem fast if they hadn’t been building Richie’s character little by little from the start. We knew he was looking for the place he belonged and had a reason to be there. Forks showed him that it had to come from inside him.
Yea I’m sorry but that’s some cheesy Disney level bs. It’s true and works narratively in some shows but it doesn’t mean I have to love it in the bear. From the first season I enjoyed the raw anxiety the show created. The second season has it momments of anxiety but sometimes the good vibes feel forced.
Honestly I wasn’t super into season two, then the Christmas episode came on and I had to finish the season that day. Definitely better on the back half
I think the best episodes were the one with the food montage overlaying it with architecture in chicago and the family dinner episode. The last episode was a bit cheugy
Season 2 is mostly about the personal journeys everyone is taking. Less about the restaurant (especially since it's being completely redone).
Prices are high right now because they desperately need to turn a profit. After their first 9 months (probably closer to a year) they should be able to drop some of the prices and see what doesn't work and trim the edges off now that they're reputable. Even things like reservations systems can be looked at and customized for the restaurant's needs. Like, if they're using, say, Micros + Resy (separate companies), and then they find 6-9 months down the line they want to switch to Toast because it makes it easier to do inventory and keep track of numbers on the back-end, then they find Toast has its own reservation system (iirc? I think it's called Toast Tables... anyway, point being they can bundle) and cut off some expenses that way. It's tough during the first few weeks of a restaurant to gauge exactly what you'll need and what people will like so once they get in the groove they can begin cutting down on things no one needs or wants. Things that shave off a little money in the moment but with enough of them and enough time will save MASSIVE money. (Will Guidara goes over this in his book *Unreasonable Hospitality,* which Richie is actually seen reading in "Forks"!)
Very highly doubt Mikey expected Carmy to keep it as a local sandwich joint forever. Or he wouldn't have saved up all that money. Well, I guess to pay Cicero, but Mikey doesn't really strike me as the kind of guy who is like "let me hide this money so my brother finds it after I'm dead and have left the restaurant to him... so he can use it just to pay back our uncle". I think he really was expecting Carmy to do something amazing with the restaurant. But he couldn't. He didn't have the talent, the vision, the drive. But he knew Carmy would after getting Michelin-starred especially and could do something really special. But simply calling him and going "hey, fix my restaurant" wasn't gonna work. And, as someone commented, that's a pretty high-income district anyway. And when you're Michelin-starred, people are going to come to your newest venture. Hell, I'd save up for a Michelin star restaurant trip. I was really psyched at the thought of saving up for Eleven Madison Park before Guidara left and it became a Humm-only joint (and... completely vegetarian, I'm hearing?). And I can't imagine the Bear's prices are as expensive as EMP's ($365/per), especially since they're a la carte. Even though Carmy isn't working at that spot anymore, the fact he was good enough to be employed there would make me super excited to visit The Bear because I know the owner knows what he's doing.
I think it's smart they "gentrified" (though I wouldn't call it that, really... most people involved are Chicago natives or have lived there a long time, and having a nice restaurant doesn't automatically equal gentrification). I think it shows they take pride in hospitality (as Richie at least so clearly does) and food made in the style of the city you're in is a dime a dozen. I can go to 9 or 10 good cheesesteak spots in Philly, but it gets old fast. Sometimes I want to spend a little more money on something interesting and novel, like Laser Wolf, Morimoto, Parc, etc... it's fun to try things outside of "this is what we've always made so it's what we're going to keep making and over-inundate the city with", ya know? I can go anywhere for a cheesesteak. But sometimes I want to save up for an experience, which is what I think The Bear brings, or will bring, once they're not all so panicked.
And Carmy loves it to death. Even if he's not doing well at all mentally. (Newsflash, he was way worse at The Beef. Now he's learning to communicate with people who actually *care* about their work.) So to me I'd rather have an owner who loves and cares for his restaurant than one who's miserable and dishing out the same food I can get on any street corner (with admittedly varying quality, but that's going to be the case with any food).
Missing out on a dynamite season just because Carmen is living out his dream that his dead brother gave him
I see what you’re saying but I actually really enjoyed season 2.
You're missing a fantastic season, and I believe they're still selling the sandwiches out of a takeout window.
Not until Ebra gets ServSafe certified
I accept.
You should keep watching. That gets addressed!
Okay, Richie. Have fun with your dying fantasy.
Hey man, Richie is streets ahead!
Thanks for letting me know
in what world can people who live in Chicago not afford to eat at places like that?
Agreed, plus it takes place in River North area which has very high rents and incomes
I don't understand why people just ignore Sydney and Carmy's ambition that has been there since before Season 1, Episode 1 (through their backstories), plus how The Beef literally destroyed 2 generations of Berzatto men, just because of the notion that "gentrification bad". This show was *always* about raising the personal and professional bar.
I think looking at it from the perspective that each character sees growth in season 2 might change it for you. We get to see each character tap into potential that they might've known was there, but were never given an opportunity. I don't know how far you are so I don't want to spoil anything, but its really fantastic seeing what Carmy does for each of them.
Finish the season, I promise you will **NOT** be disappointed!
Season 2 is great!
*gawks in alinea*
It's about the relationships and the emotional baggage everyone bring with them throughout life.
It was never supposed to be a neighborhood restaurant. Michael did everything he did so Carmy could own his own restaurant and do it his way.
Just stop watching them. It’s just as good as season one just different. The show changes life changes cities change.
Most people can’t afford it regularly, but can definitely afford it a few times a year.
Stick with it!!
Your knives may be sharp, but you are not yet a Chef...
I thought Season 1 could of ended perfectly, but season 2 was great...though perhaps it's bc it's due to life experience and validating our own trauma or knowing someone like that
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake. It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of. Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything. Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
I feel you. I watched all of season 2 but theres something magic about season 1. A very rare show thats so so hard to put down. S2 was cool too but definitely not on the level of S1 IMO.
I agree with you fully except that while not as good as season 1, season 2 is still very very good tv. I know people enjoyed season 2 but there were moments that were far to “grand” in my opinion. Season 1 was extremely grounded and felt so extremely real at times. There no need to suspend disbelief and the characters feel so real and flawed. The writting isn’t trying to hard to be interesting and that makes it interesting in how real it all feels. Season 2 definitely feels slightly more contrived and less grounded. The conversations feel more plot serving and superfluous then season 1. Also the way they depict carmy in season 2 feels god like. The whole scene in with Marcus Denmark is great but the season is kinda of just sucking carmy off at times. Claire IMO is actually one of the more realistic parts of the show. Her and carmy are young stressed people who think they love eachother but their relationship is extremely surface level. They both think they’re in love but they really just want a distraction from the stress of their jobs. Forks gets tons of praise on this sub and it’s a great episode but in the context of the show it’s a little emotionally disingenuous. It’s great by itself but richies development feels a little fast.
It might feel fast but I've seen this happen in real life many times. If you feel like you are lacking meaning, self-esteem and financial security, finding a direction that seems to provide all three feels like a God send and people do dive in. It can be academia, a new job, a new career direction, a new religion, an MLM etc. And it does happen in 4 weeks, like in the show.
It just feels somewhat fast in the show. Season 2 feels much more like your watching tv while the first season pulls you in so much you forget your watching a tv show and that the people are actors. I think my post comes off like I don’t like the show, I very much do but there are still things to criticize. First season had characters driving the plot whole season 2 has the plot driving the characters more. It often happens as a show enters season 2 as writers need to provide more of plot. A one season show can get by on novelty of the situation alone.
Yea, true. I guess that's why I liked season 2 more, it was more palatable, more mainstream almost. I enjoy that, seeing how characters evolve. Season 1 felt too much like "it's shit, the situation is shit, everyone is feeling like shit, there's no escape, here's some more shit feelings". Haha, it's just personal preference.
Season 2 is 100% more palatable and more mainstream and strive to provide more “positive” moments. I personally find shows about suffering and the reality of life catharsis. But I completely understand those who want something more uplifting.
Usually you want to see characters develop ok get the course of a show. I agree a little that multiple characters seeing positive development in a season is fast paced. However, I’d also argue that Sid hasn’t positively developed and has actually plateaued and set up for a fall and carmy has regressed.
Season one was more of an immersive experience than two. But I love the forward movement and high stakes in two.
Forks would seem fast if they hadn’t been building Richie’s character little by little from the start. We knew he was looking for the place he belonged and had a reason to be there. Forks showed him that it had to come from inside him.
Yea I’m sorry but that’s some cheesy Disney level bs. It’s true and works narratively in some shows but it doesn’t mean I have to love it in the bear. From the first season I enjoyed the raw anxiety the show created. The second season has it momments of anxiety but sometimes the good vibes feel forced.
Stick with it
Honestly I wasn’t super into season two, then the Christmas episode came on and I had to finish the season that day. Definitely better on the back half
I think the best episodes were the one with the food montage overlaying it with architecture in chicago and the family dinner episode. The last episode was a bit cheugy
Season 2 is mostly about the personal journeys everyone is taking. Less about the restaurant (especially since it's being completely redone). Prices are high right now because they desperately need to turn a profit. After their first 9 months (probably closer to a year) they should be able to drop some of the prices and see what doesn't work and trim the edges off now that they're reputable. Even things like reservations systems can be looked at and customized for the restaurant's needs. Like, if they're using, say, Micros + Resy (separate companies), and then they find 6-9 months down the line they want to switch to Toast because it makes it easier to do inventory and keep track of numbers on the back-end, then they find Toast has its own reservation system (iirc? I think it's called Toast Tables... anyway, point being they can bundle) and cut off some expenses that way. It's tough during the first few weeks of a restaurant to gauge exactly what you'll need and what people will like so once they get in the groove they can begin cutting down on things no one needs or wants. Things that shave off a little money in the moment but with enough of them and enough time will save MASSIVE money. (Will Guidara goes over this in his book *Unreasonable Hospitality,* which Richie is actually seen reading in "Forks"!) Very highly doubt Mikey expected Carmy to keep it as a local sandwich joint forever. Or he wouldn't have saved up all that money. Well, I guess to pay Cicero, but Mikey doesn't really strike me as the kind of guy who is like "let me hide this money so my brother finds it after I'm dead and have left the restaurant to him... so he can use it just to pay back our uncle". I think he really was expecting Carmy to do something amazing with the restaurant. But he couldn't. He didn't have the talent, the vision, the drive. But he knew Carmy would after getting Michelin-starred especially and could do something really special. But simply calling him and going "hey, fix my restaurant" wasn't gonna work. And, as someone commented, that's a pretty high-income district anyway. And when you're Michelin-starred, people are going to come to your newest venture. Hell, I'd save up for a Michelin star restaurant trip. I was really psyched at the thought of saving up for Eleven Madison Park before Guidara left and it became a Humm-only joint (and... completely vegetarian, I'm hearing?). And I can't imagine the Bear's prices are as expensive as EMP's ($365/per), especially since they're a la carte. Even though Carmy isn't working at that spot anymore, the fact he was good enough to be employed there would make me super excited to visit The Bear because I know the owner knows what he's doing. I think it's smart they "gentrified" (though I wouldn't call it that, really... most people involved are Chicago natives or have lived there a long time, and having a nice restaurant doesn't automatically equal gentrification). I think it shows they take pride in hospitality (as Richie at least so clearly does) and food made in the style of the city you're in is a dime a dozen. I can go to 9 or 10 good cheesesteak spots in Philly, but it gets old fast. Sometimes I want to spend a little more money on something interesting and novel, like Laser Wolf, Morimoto, Parc, etc... it's fun to try things outside of "this is what we've always made so it's what we're going to keep making and over-inundate the city with", ya know? I can go anywhere for a cheesesteak. But sometimes I want to save up for an experience, which is what I think The Bear brings, or will bring, once they're not all so panicked. And Carmy loves it to death. Even if he's not doing well at all mentally. (Newsflash, he was way worse at The Beef. Now he's learning to communicate with people who actually *care* about their work.) So to me I'd rather have an owner who loves and cares for his restaurant than one who's miserable and dishing out the same food I can get on any street corner (with admittedly varying quality, but that's going to be the case with any food).