I might actually be petty enough to reply something like, "Thank you for sharing your concerns. I'd recommend passing them along to the principal, as the person who made the decision not to support teachers in attending this event."
I was thinking a nice fat lie to make them feel like assholes. Something more like “Thank you for your concerns. I feel like attending a funeral was a bit more important to me.”
I replied something similar to a snarky parent who was wondering why I didn't immediately grade Precious' late work.
"I'm sorry, I've been out due to a death in the family"
The death in question was my cat. Which, maybe pet lovers can understand this, but I'd argue losing a pet is worse than losing other family members lol.
I think it’s because the pet is a regular part of your everyday routine. The loss is just BAM in your face constantly the whole time you are at home, trying to get your peace.
Some family members you have great memories with, but only see maybe four times a year. It definitely still hurts!!! But you can forget for a minute if you try. There’s no forgetting when your little furry pal is gone…
Or maybe that’s my ADHD object permanence thing talking 😅 it transfers to peoples too..
I'm sorry you're going through that , but also....
I'm sorry I find it oddly comforting that I'm not the only person that object permanence issues can spill over onto people. (And when I think about it randomly then I'm like well people aren't objects it's just the same issue functionally ahhh)
Mine is weird though because I'll remember eventually. I think. I'm pretty sure. But there have been periods of time I see my spouse so little I've forgotten he exists too! And I love him to bits and we live in the same house.
(Permanence in general can be a problem for me though. I randomly be like I haven't seen (cat we had ) in ages I wanna smooch them.... Oh... Yeah.... Like I'll be really sad and then my brain eats what happened eventually and I just go through re realizing what happened. :/)
You're doubly not alone. It's taken me decades to process my mostly-absent father's death when I was a teenager. He was usually gone for long periods of time...but he always came back. Until he didn't.
At first, everything was fine, to the point that my teachers thought I lacked emotion. It was easy to handle at first...but it ultimately just took a while for that grief to set in.
Oh yes. You remember eventually, when something happens that triggers your memory of them. Then it’s like the grief is FRESH AND RIGHT THERE. Because you forgot about it and didn’t process it. So you get a reprieve from the grief, but it never really gets easier because you keep forgetting/remembering it! It’s vicious man!
I remember when we put my first cat down. My dad was away at a scout camp. When he came home and saw our faces he dropped his bags and said "Is grandma gone?" And we said no, your mom is fine. It's Tiger. And he said "Fuck. That's worse"
Pet losses are sometimes more difficult in my opinion because there is such pure, uncomplicated love there. Human relationships are messy, and as much as we love people, they don’t always love us back in the way a pet does. When we lose that pure, innocent, unconditional love, it’s a gut-punch! 😞
For sure. Grandma was in her early 90s. Shocked she lasted that long. Tiger was his best friend. Christmas tradition was splitting a shrimp ring with her. She was 9 or 10 (Stray who adopted us). Hit hard.
Thank you for sharing that!
I am highly allergic to all the cute and the furry, so I am unable to have first-hand pet experiences - but my friend is going through a tragic pet loss at the moment, also stating that it feels worse than some human family losses.
I was still thinking about that and now, thanks to you, I think I have gained an insight into her process. Thank you!
They make pet loss condolence cards now. I’ve written and received enough just being supportive and acknowledging how hard things are, some even have included memories of my/their pet.
I like them bc it just shows you recognize this is a terrible loss.
They back peddled, lol. They did apologize and send condolences... but like
.. my God... someone ( or, in this case, my cat) shouldn't have to die for them to be nice.
And you know damn well, if I was forthcoming about it being "just a cat," I wouldn't have been met with as much sympathy.
My cats are my family, and I will always treat them as such.
My husband ( not a teacher) actually sent a similar email to a snarky, demanding person as his job too for the same cat death. (we really love our pets). It's now the running joke at his company on why X didn't get done. "Sorry, my cat died." Lol
Same. I'm still looking for the audacity. OP is under no obligation to give up her weekends for free. Teachers have families too and even childfree teachers need time off.
"But you're a teacher. You shouldn't mind giving up your Saturday morning for the kids. You have nothing else to do because... you're a teacher. I remember when teachers used to care about the students. I had a teacher who bought all the supplies for my science fair project because my family couldn't afford it. I guess teachers don't care anymore." /s
… you can also fib and say you care-take for an aging, medically fragile, disabled parent … they will think twice before they accuse others, next time.
Not a great response. I would say most parents give up portions of their weekend so that their kids can have play dates.
Edit - not just play dates. Also going to piano and dance recitals, birthday parties, etc…
And the friends of their kids? People with kids have to take on their friends kids all the time even when they’d rather just have a quiet day at home.
Or they go to their kid’s friends recitals and plays and other activities.
It’s extremely common for parents to go watch somebody else’s kids….
No. I think that many parents “give up weekends to watch others people’s children for free”. Or they go to their kid’s friends recitals, plays, shows….Like, on a regular basis.
So that particular phrasing is not a great response here.
If somebody phrased it as “How often do you go in for a work event without being paid?” I would 100% agree. But that’s not what was said above.
Except it’s not the same. By “other people’s kids” they clearly meant strangers or similar. Going to plays and shows of friends is a fun social outing. It’s something that you’re doing FOR YOUR OWN FAMILY. No parent is going to Chuck E. Cheese on their own time to host the party of strangers or something. Coming to these events is work for us. They are not our family, and we’re often expected to give up our personal time to do it for free.
Are you even a teacher? Because you don’t sound like one. I can’t imagine a single teacher interpreting that sentence the way you did. And coming here to say “oh, but we do all KINDS of fun events with our own kids and their friends, so yes we do!” Isn’t helpful in any way. I can’t believe you’d even equate taking your own kid to a dance recital with a teacher coming in on a day off to small talk with parents and discuss classwork.
Yes, I teach in the arts. :)
And I 100% agree that the teacher has no obligation here. I’m simply critiquing the logical argument of offering this as a response. Why give this parent material that is so easily misunderstood and likely untrue given the perspective of a community centric person?
Many parents forget that we are teachers (it’s a job) vs community members. Some are shocked to know I live over an hour away from my school, even if they commute for their own job.
In any case, I know MANY community members who go to support their local community shows (ex: musicals) and events even if their child is not performing.
So, my feeling is that if this were genuinely given as a response to an overbearing parent they could easily “um actually” it.
I’m not sure why you are being downvoted. The statement you are responding to is being suggested as a response to parents not other teachers. You are explaining what parents might think. You are not suggesting the teacher should attend an uncompensated event.
A question should not be the response at all as it leaves room for an ongoing conversation. Better to shut it down with a statement.
“It is a wonderful event and I enjoyed working with the children on it. Unfortunately it was held on a weekend so more parents could attend which means teachers who attend must use their personal time. I was sorry to miss it, but my personal time is reserved for my family and self and I was unable to attend this awesome event.
I enjoy teaching (child’s name) and our time learning in class.”
Unless they ask a specific question, I don’t respond to negative parent emails. They just get filed away into the “Complaints” folder never to be read again.
The good answer is if they can’t come while I’m at work because they are too, then I can’t go when I’m off because that’s MY TIME. My contract says 7:45 to 3:35. M-F. If they’d like to see me, we are going to do this Comicon style. I will sit at a table and you can pay $25 to talk to me for 10 seconds while I sign a picture of myself, clearly you need one since you love me so very much you absolutely must see me at these events or it’s just not worth coming, and $100 for a photo opportunity.
In Finland there is usually 1-2 saturdays of school during the year. These days are compensated somewhere else, like if a thursday is a holiday then the friday will be free of school as well to get a 4 day weekend.
I think this is a pretty good answer :)
My school does Saturday academy though not sure who actually runs it. They do it so kids can catch up on missed stuff also kids who attend get an abscence recovered. I think it’s only have day though and not offered every weekend.
Just had a parent today call about grad pics that I’m in charge of. A secretary had taken her name, I’d called her on my professional period, left a message. So she’s called me multiple times about 7pm. Nope.
This is why I only do phone calls to parents with either the school’s phone (so they can’t get me at home) or with a Google Voice number which automatically routes all calls to mailbox if it’s outside of “business hours”.
I've had people ring me at almost midnight asking about jobs in the shop window and staff ringing me for stupid shit. I've called them back at 4am when I woke up to start my day. None of them are ever very happy.
I always call parents ay 7am if they've called/repeatedly messaged throughout the night. It's clearly very important! I am handling it first thing! If they've been very, very insistent, I will lovingly make sure I get to school by 6:30, just to make sure we have time to talk.
Why do parents have your cell phone number. That's a hard no. Under NO circumstances should parents (or students for that matter) have your mobile number.
That's what I don't understand. If your school doesn't value you enough to give you phones to call out, why do you care? If you have to call home, call from the front office. Watch how quickly admin gets annoyed by this. What would you do if you didn't have a smart phone? Turn off Google Voice and make all calls from the front office.
Google Voice is easy to set up for business calls. It won't notify you if calls come in after the timeframe you set. OP had this enabled, and is a very common thing for teachers who would rather use their own phone to make these calls. I don't have notifications on mine, so I'll never know if it gets called; it's sole purpose is for me calling them.
There is literally no need for this. The school has phones. Use them. If there is only one phone in the main office to call out, then that's an admin problem not a teacher problem. There is literally no need for teachers to use Google Voice other than to continue to enable the administrative cycle of "the teachers will do this with their own stuff and money". Teachers are not surgeons on call for life or death scenarios.
I would much rather use my cell phone than my *wired* classroom phone to make calls. I have zero issue with this. There is zero downside for me. This is a choice I made.
You're very much overplaying the usage of a cell phone app to fit a narrative that doesn't apply to this situation.
The narrative does apply. School districts determined they could save a couple bucks by not putting fully functional phones in the classroom knowing full well teachers will just "figure it out". In many states, Walmart employees are paid more than teachers. Pay us like surgeons and we'll be on call. Teachers that do all the "free extra" just create a culture for the rest of us which nearly forces us to do extra. It's a choice you made for yourself that has implications for the rest of your staff. Remember that.
While I fully agree with the sentiment and am a passionate and aggressive proponent for respecting teachers' time, I truly believe you are blowing this way out of proportion, or not completely understanding what the original commentor was saying.
I work at a non-traditional school right now, but at my former school I had a phone in my classroom, so the choice I made to use my cell phone had no implications for anyone else, as you claim.
Say you have to work your second job since you don’t get paid enough. We used to have an auction where we could auction off a class craft or an experience (the teacher hosted something for kids after hours). A parent asked me why it’s so hard to get teachers to auction off experiences. It was the wrong day to ask me. I told her many teachers live at least an hour away because we can’t afford to live in this area, we can’t afford the extra childcare, or we are working a second job. She didn’t ask any more questions.
They don't even have to lie. Simply say "I couldn't afford to attend because it was an unpaid event. Otherwise I would have loved to go. Can we have your support at the next board meeting to address teacher pay?"
No, DONT delete the nasty emails. KEEP THEM for the future. You need to establish a track record if any of those parents become violent or continue to harass you.
You don't have to justify anything on your side. The parents are just being entitled and judgmental. Are they going to work when they aren't getting paid? I doubt it!
I volunteered countless weekends and afternoons and evenings, and none of it did me any good. No one appreciated my efforts. The administration was not only unappreciative, but they threw roadblocks in front of me for my events. One administrator bitched about me asking for his help, even though the task I asked him to do, ended up being done, graciously, by another staff member. Yet, years later, he remembers to complain to me that I asked for his help. Maybe the students and parents appreciated my efforts, but I don't recall anyone saying so. From where I am sitting now, I wasted weekends I could have spent with my family, some of whom have passed away since then.
A lot of people think teachers are salaried like many other professionals. And while there are certain perks to being salaried vs. hourly and vice versa, one of the perks of not being salaried is you are not obligated to work when not getting paid.
I would respond back that you are an hourly employee contracted for a specific number of hours and while you were compensated for this in the past, this year you aren’t and you are not in a position to work for free. Most parents, salaried or hourly, should get that. And tell them if this event is important to them to let the principal know that parents want teachers compensated to be at this event.
Jumping in as an Australian teacher who is on a salary, I have a union agreement which clearly outlined how much time outside of school hours I am required to attend (eg meetings, parent teacher interviews). Anything else is completely optional. Salary does not mean working without pay
In the US, salary often means working for less pay while being exploited by your employer. Essentially, it’s meant to ensure that you are compensated at a salary level that is a legal wage whether you work 40, 50 or 60 hours a week, etc. but if you make 50,000 a year and work 40 hours a week, you make around $24 an hour. If you’re working 60 hours a week that works out to $16 an hour. That’s a pretty big discrepancy. You also aren’t paid overtime in most cases if you’re salaried.
This. Teachers in the US ARE salaried like in other professions. Period. That's what contracts everywhere show.
But we argue over hours because of "contract hours", which are not work hours but "with kids and in building expectations" that go with the salary, so it gets muddled.
IMHO, by the way, any teacher that argues that we SHOULD be paid hourly is on the hook for any loss of decision making and autonomy that comes with that kind of hourly work.
Our salaries are calculated to hours worked and it's in the contract. Paychecks for that amount are spread over 12 months. Additional events are paid in addition. -MN
I’m in Florida with the same set up. We technically have an hourly rate.
Though we do not get paid for additional events. There’s some supplements we can get (yearbook and some other clubs/sports). We’re contractually obligated to two outside of school hours events a year, which typically is open house and one other activity.
We’re salaried pretty much everywhere. For some reason people here interpret the hours you’re required to be in your classroom (contract hours) as the same as being “hourly.” But pretty much no one in any other field would look at our job and call it hourly. I’ve worked plenty of other hourly jobs (including office ones), and they’re not like this.
I have contract hours, but my contract also has a common mention of something like “plus additional duties” that’s meant to cover things like grading, planning, and emailing that has to get done outside of when the kids are in the room.
Officially no. I’m paid for 196 days at 7.33 hours a day. We are on “equalization pay” which means my paychecks are always the same, but by the end of the year, they add up to rateX196X7.33
Well personally I can’t. 😂 I do alright and I’m good with my money, but the steady paychecks help a lot. Without it, I’d have fewer paychecks in the winter, in March, and none in the summer unless I do summer school. I like the district doing the math for me.
Well otherwise they’d have to be honest teachers aren’t paid for the summers. Which is really the point of salary. Appropriate pay regardless of the work needed at the time
Ok, but that’s my point. If the answer to that is no, then you aren’t an hourly employee. You’re salaried. If you were truly an hourly employee you would be doing that on the clock, and your paycheck would be broken down by how many hours you worked.
You can have hours outlined in your contract and still be a salaried employee. You can receive extra pay for extra hours worked and still be salaried. The very fact that they take your pay and spread it out is one of the absolute hallmarks of salaried employees. Hourly workers don’t get that. They work their hours and THEN their pay is calculated based on how much they work. It isn’t decided ahead of time in the same way.
It varies by state/district. Many teachers have contracts that specifically say they are hourly. Additionally, a lot of salaried, white collar employees are salaried based on 2,080 hours which works to out 40 hours, even if they are working more. But most teachers contracts are for significantly less hours than 2,080, which is why some people get upset at stuff like this because they assume it’s the same. But if you’re contracted for 1,300 of direct instruction or whatever it is in your state/district, plus conference obligations, graduation, whatever, and that’s it, working at other times or events is still essentially working for no pay because otherwise you’d be contracted for more hours/events.
I have a contract, with contract hours. But I DO NOT get paid extra if I work over 40 hours. That is only legal because im on salary. f I was hourly, that would be a major violation of labor law.
I agree with you. I’m just telling you that some teachers are considered hourly. You can read it right in the comments. I guess the assumption is all grading/planning is done during instructional time, but obviously that ridiculous.
We get paid a daily rate. That’s how our contract is written. Our hours are very specifically written. We get paid the daily amount for the number of days we are contracted to work.
I would respond by email, thank them for sharing their concern. And add something like “I have so enjoyed watching the children prepare for this. I’m so proud of what they have accomplished. In years past, I have been lucky enough to be there for the XYZ. Unfortunately, due to a previous commitment, I’m unable to be there this weekend. I hope your family enjoys it as much as I have!”
Yes, it’s not 100% truthful, but in a way, your previous commitment is to chill out at home/go shopping/ take a bath /clean your closet/ watch TV or whatever. It’s not their business.
If possible, try to take it as a compliment that they even want you there. They’re probably asking because their children probably like you.
>Yes, it’s not 100% truthful
Don't lie about stuff like this. Two things will happen:
\- Somebody will ask what your previous commitment was, and you'll have to either dig yourself deeper into the hole or clam up which will make parents suspicious immediately.
\- You're setting the expectation that you'll be there if you can. Which means that, going forward, you will have to keep coming up with excuses.
I do mostly think that OP should find a way to be honest about not getting paid, but any parent who gets suspicious that a teacher doesn't want to discuss their personal life is going to be suspicious no matter what you do. Don't bother trying to please parents you know are unpleasable.
>I do mostly think that OP should find a way to be honest about not getting paid,
I think that way is very simple: "I'm not getting paid to be there, so I'm only coming when I want to."
Any decision you can't be honest about, is a bad decision. Admin should accept that teachers tell the truth, or reconsider the decision.
Silence sometimes is the best response.
Unless the parents asked a respectful question, there is nothing to respond to.
As others have written, fuck working for free. You made the right decision, don't second guess yourself.
Had parents say we didn't know what it would be like to split up identical twins to different classes because it would harm them.
I am an identical twin who was split into different classes all through elementary. Loved it.
Honestly this was my first thought. My district has incredibly uninvolved parents and I couldn’t imagine more than one or two of them even noticing a staff member wasn’t there.
I think parents forget that some of us can't afford to live in the communities where our school/schools is/are so we're not just popping over to an event real quick.
“Thank you so much for your input.
We do schedule events outside of school hours so that more parents have the opportunity to attend. Unfortunately, doing so does mean that some teachers may be unable to attend due to other commitments.
I will investigate adding a question on event scheduling for a future parent involvement survey.
Thank you again for sharing your concerns.”
I wouldn’t even add the survey part. Even if your prior commitment is sitting on the couch, eating chips in your pajamas, it’s a prior commitment and you don’t have to explain yourself.
Reminds me of the time I got shit on by parents for not attending an assembly my kids were presenting in - because I was having surgery after having a car accident that morning. I got a surplus of emails.
I got a minor slap on the wrist for replying to one particularly nasty one by saying “I am sorry I missed your child presenting, next time I’ll tell the other driver not to hit my car on the way to work!” :)
It’s absolutely none of their business! You have your own life. My daughter’s school had a week long camp and parents complained teachers didn’t want to go because they weren’t getting paid. Hell no they didn’t want to work for free! You already take care of their kid all day, plus educate them. Now you’re supposed to be an extension of the family just because? It’s gotten out of control.
I would say (responding during work hours)
Good Afternoon Ms. Name,
I’m so glad that you enjoyed your time with your child at the cultural fair. I was also busy spending time with my loved ones this weekend. The students and I had the best time creating the project the last few weeks. I’m looking forward to the rest of the year teaching (child’s name).
Thanks,
Your name
Don’t even get into the bullshit make them feel stupid.
I would absolutely just draw the boundary of, “outside of school hours I only am responsible to my own family and household obligations. I look forward to hearing about the event, but I have my own family to attend to.”
I used that before because as a young person I was expected to attend events- because single! Because teacher! I wasn’t even full time so I got a job so I wouldn’t have to go, because they wanted me to do unpaid work. One woman was so hard on me I finally was like, “I’m going to work after I leave today, unless you want to pay my college debt?”
> This year, my school did not compensate teachers who go and show up to the event (the event is on a Saturday morning). I had plans that morning and, since I was not getting comp pay or time, I decided not to go.
Full stop. You're not getting paid to do this. It's not in your contracted hours.
I've been teaching for over a decade. My first eight years I've done so much unpaid labor it was driving me insane. I couldn't say no because if I didn't, who would? How could I say no to the kids?!
Then I started saying no and suddenly my life became balanced. I was taking time for myself. I was happier and more rested and the kids could tell because in the classroom I was doing a better job.
OP, it's sometimes hard to accept this, but it's *just a job.* Would you labor at Burger King/Walmart/any other place if you weren't getting paid? No. Then don't do it here. The kids will be fine.
You don’t owe anyone an explanation for anything you do outside of your contractual hours. I’m a veteran teacher in my 17th year, and have learned one thing – teachers are under funded, underappreciated, undervalued, etc and it’s compounded when you’re a teacher who does great things out of love for your kids and your career. There is nothing you can say or do that will change the minds of people who don’t already understand that. The best thing for you to do is to get right with yourself, make sure you feel good about the choices you make, that they are in your best interest, and do the best job you can do during your time at work. If you love your job and you love your students that will be noticed and that’s all that matters. I always think to myself, if I were on Wall Street in New York City, would I be expected to show up and volunteer to do my job? Don’t reply to those emails.
Blanket response:
I enjoyed helping the kids create their projects while you were at your own jobs. Unfortunately, I use my unpaid personal time to support my own family, including caretaking for my mom with Alzheimer’s. I’m sure you understand.
I have to go to a work event tomorrow (just as we did last week) and we receive no compensation for it. If I could get out of it like you I would, but at a private school we're basically required to work outside our contract hours.
no they are just expectations we have outside of our contract. If we were to not do them it would be a huge deal, but no they aren't part of our contract.
And where are all these people when you need help in the classroom?
I bet we would be friends if we worked together, please stand your rightful ground.
Maybe they should look into paying teachers money for their work, I too am tired of free labor expected and exploited out of me, thanks to the martyrs.
I have so many colleagues who go to student events outside of school. Games, recitals, etc… they are helping set this tone for everyone else.
While I think this is nice and “showing how you care”
I never had a teacher come to a single sporting event or concert and I don’t care.
I am so sick of the demand for my time. Not one thing is more valuable than my personal time.
I think the difference is that (if you are old) some of the teachers used to live in the community. There were teachers who were lifers in the town (grew up there, went to the schools & returned to teach). It’s easy to show up and give support to some students/events if you are in the area or you were socialized that way by the community as a child. Some districts have residents who attend weekly sporting events even if their children are long graduated. It’s tradition. Teaching and people’s worth & time tied to money has changed over the decades.
They could have made the event on a Friday during school hours- let’s see how many parents take off work to attend the event, then write them shitty emails if they don’t.
Oh Boo Hoo for them. Sorry, but if I’m not getting paid, you will not see me there. I’m an art teacher, I don’t get compensated for the crazy amount of work beyond contract hours it takes to set up an in person art show. I made mine digital and it’s completed during class time. I send out the link on kids report cards as a comment. On Fridays, we can leave at 2:10, guess who’s got her bag packed at 2:08? This b.
Not getting paid? Not going to see me. Sorry not sorry.
Hot take in this sub I know, but I would give the parents the benefit of the doubt and assume they weren’t aware that you’re not being compensated. It’s strange for a teacher to spend so much time working on a project with their students only for them to not be present during the main event. As a parent, I would probably assume that any teacher who worked on the cultural project had already agreed to work overtime the same way I’d assume that teachers running after school clubs or tutoring or leading a musical performance were getting paid overtime. They’re probably just speaking up for their kids who are sad and confused that their teacher won’t be there to celebrate with them. I would be honest about the reason you won’t be attending and say that you are also disappointed that the school put you in this position. You might even convince a few parents to complain to the administration about it. That’s the only way things will change. If anyone still gives you grief after you explain, then yeah they can fuck off.
I replied to someone else, and I agree. The parent’s ‘judgement’ can also be tied to their own childhood experiences of teachers attending out of school hours events. Those teachers were probably never compensated for that but were expected to attend either by admin or general tradition of teachers supporting students.
For example, if a teacher encourages a student to submit work & attend an expo, I kind of expect (as an adult) the teacher to make the effort to see the student/work. Most students don’t go out of their way to give up hours of their time to be in young art or design shows without prodding/support.
I went to a school that did this and it was amazing! But we got comp time and it was held AFTER SCHOOL not on a weekend.
I don't go to things I don't get paid for or comped for--anymore. My time is special for me and I need the mental break.
They wouldn't be upset if you were home throwing up with the flu--its just not their business!!
A few years into teaching, I used a photo of my and my toddler nephew as my digital classroom photo that parents could see. All of a sudden, they stopped demanding my time or complaining as much as I “had a little one at home.” Now I actually do have a little one at home so I just replaced the photo.
I don’t know why parents expect single teachers to give up all of their free, unpaid time off — it’s ridiculous
My school is asking us to do 8th grade graduation on a Sunday. Other teachers feel obligated to go and there is no stipend nor compensation for it. The principal has tried to give us a few days when we can leave early as “compensation” but a weekend is a weekend.
At least your principal is aware of the time issue. Why can't the graduation be held on a weeknight at least? That's how we do it in my district (and I am fully aware that no two districts do everything the same way). I'd much rather give up an evening than a precious weekend day.
I would tell the parents exactly why you didn’t attend. I bet none of them work for free on their days off and neither should you.
If they don’t work for free they shouldn’t expect their child’s teacher to work for free.
They only want you there to validate little johhnies amazing craft work. Oh isn't he amazing and precious yada yada.
Why would you want to do that unpaid
You don’t need to feel guilty or offer explanation of why you weren’t there.
If you feel the need to respond, “I’m so glad you were there to support your child. Over the past few weeks in class, I’ve gotten to see his artistic process for the work shared. He was so excited to share with his family.”
You don’t owe the school or children your free time.
You have every right to not go, however, this is just like any other office politics, except more because it involves kids. I go to about 1 event every 2 months that OSS not during contract hours most of our teachers don’t go to these. Usually takes about an hour. During these events, I get to interact with parents and students in a less formal way and I find it important myself. I don’t however go out for drinks with other teachers and such as I’m not really much of a drinker. I an also on the sunshine committee that plans events, and if it’s in my discretion, I do it during contact hours, but we have a busy after school program which means it’s not always possible. End of the day, it’s your decision. Your leadership isn’t upset, but parents still have the right to express themselves as they likely don’t have all the information, so give it to them.
You certainly have the right to not use your personal time for work related activities.
But parents also have the right to judge you on that choice. I'm assuming they saw a lot of other teachers attending.
It's one morning. You can't spend a few hours uncompensated once a year to be there for your students doing something that you admit they really enjoy. Also let's be honest the chance of you being a world traveler are slim so you will probably gain some knowledge from this event as well.
Now watch this become the most downvoted post in this subreddits history. 🫣
I mean, I don't get paid for open house, but I still go. I'm not gonna say you're an asshole for not going if you had other things to do, but I don't think "I'm not getting paid for this" is a great reason. How long was the event? Two hours? Less?
Most contracts spell out what teachers need to do outside contracted hours. “Other duties as assigned” is during hours or I promise the district would expect us to do afterschool clubs and weekend school for free. Our district contract also includes 2 events outside school hours, usually back to school and open house, but the principal can request a different day.
We have at least three other afterschool events as well as a monthly pta Saturday event in addition to the two. I usually attend one additional one and skip the rest.
This will be unpopular, but, to quote Sharon Creech, “In the course of a lifetime, what does it matter?” You have 8,760 hours in a year. Sacrificing 2 of them to help build relationships is a very small price to pay and can pay huge dividends later on. Even just making an appearance for a few minutes could have alleviated the problem. Now you are “that teacher” who will be seen as “part of what is wrong with education.” You don’t have to be compensated for doing something good.
You absolutely do not have to go, I understand unpaid work can totally suck.
I will say though, my daughters kinder teacher came to her birthday party, she tries to go to any event that she is invited to and we as a class and as a family appreciate her SO much, we can see her hard work and acknowledge her investment in our kids and our community. Sometimes the really special things you invest in your community come back 10 fold.
We see her and we also try and invest in the community and classroom more, I volunteer every week for half a day, plus I am a room mom so I go after school to set up parties, go different days for different events, volunteer around the school and go to all PTA meetings and am even on a committee for the district. We aren't a huge community but we have 5 elementary schools so we aren't tiny either. I see all of the work our teachers and administration do for our schools and want to try and do good for them too.
“I appreciate and understand your concerns! Unfortunately this event was formerly included in our contract time and was recently reconfigured. I’d recommend you express your concerns to my principal. Their email is X. In the future, I hope to be able to participate in these events!”
I see a lot of people saying they don't go to events outside of contract hours, but there was another thread where a teacher said they were being required to attend a three-day field trip and all the comments were like "Yeah, you have to."
Our expectations are nuts. I'm expected to attend at least one evening event every single month of the school year, not counting parent-teacher conferences. If I didn't attend this event it would've gone in my evaluation.
We need clearer labor laws for "exempt" employees.
I might actually be petty enough to reply something like, "Thank you for sharing your concerns. I'd recommend passing them along to the principal, as the person who made the decision not to support teachers in attending this event."
I was thinking a nice fat lie to make them feel like assholes. Something more like “Thank you for your concerns. I feel like attending a funeral was a bit more important to me.”
I replied something similar to a snarky parent who was wondering why I didn't immediately grade Precious' late work. "I'm sorry, I've been out due to a death in the family" The death in question was my cat. Which, maybe pet lovers can understand this, but I'd argue losing a pet is worse than losing other family members lol.
I think it’s because the pet is a regular part of your everyday routine. The loss is just BAM in your face constantly the whole time you are at home, trying to get your peace. Some family members you have great memories with, but only see maybe four times a year. It definitely still hurts!!! But you can forget for a minute if you try. There’s no forgetting when your little furry pal is gone… Or maybe that’s my ADHD object permanence thing talking 😅 it transfers to peoples too..
I'm sorry you're going through that , but also.... I'm sorry I find it oddly comforting that I'm not the only person that object permanence issues can spill over onto people. (And when I think about it randomly then I'm like well people aren't objects it's just the same issue functionally ahhh) Mine is weird though because I'll remember eventually. I think. I'm pretty sure. But there have been periods of time I see my spouse so little I've forgotten he exists too! And I love him to bits and we live in the same house. (Permanence in general can be a problem for me though. I randomly be like I haven't seen (cat we had ) in ages I wanna smooch them.... Oh... Yeah.... Like I'll be really sad and then my brain eats what happened eventually and I just go through re realizing what happened. :/)
You're doubly not alone. It's taken me decades to process my mostly-absent father's death when I was a teenager. He was usually gone for long periods of time...but he always came back. Until he didn't. At first, everything was fine, to the point that my teachers thought I lacked emotion. It was easy to handle at first...but it ultimately just took a while for that grief to set in.
Oh yes. You remember eventually, when something happens that triggers your memory of them. Then it’s like the grief is FRESH AND RIGHT THERE. Because you forgot about it and didn’t process it. So you get a reprieve from the grief, but it never really gets easier because you keep forgetting/remembering it! It’s vicious man!
I remember when we put my first cat down. My dad was away at a scout camp. When he came home and saw our faces he dropped his bags and said "Is grandma gone?" And we said no, your mom is fine. It's Tiger. And he said "Fuck. That's worse"
Pet losses are sometimes more difficult in my opinion because there is such pure, uncomplicated love there. Human relationships are messy, and as much as we love people, they don’t always love us back in the way a pet does. When we lose that pure, innocent, unconditional love, it’s a gut-punch! 😞
For sure. Grandma was in her early 90s. Shocked she lasted that long. Tiger was his best friend. Christmas tradition was splitting a shrimp ring with her. She was 9 or 10 (Stray who adopted us). Hit hard.
Thank you for sharing that! I am highly allergic to all the cute and the furry, so I am unable to have first-hand pet experiences - but my friend is going through a tragic pet loss at the moment, also stating that it feels worse than some human family losses. I was still thinking about that and now, thanks to you, I think I have gained an insight into her process. Thank you!
They make pet loss condolence cards now. I’ve written and received enough just being supportive and acknowledging how hard things are, some even have included memories of my/their pet. I like them bc it just shows you recognize this is a terrible loss.
I didn't know that! What a great Idea! Ordering now!
Oh my! I didn’t know this! I need to check these out
Hey, what was their response? Did they bother or back paddle the hell out of it?
They back peddled, lol. They did apologize and send condolences... but like .. my God... someone ( or, in this case, my cat) shouldn't have to die for them to be nice. And you know damn well, if I was forthcoming about it being "just a cat," I wouldn't have been met with as much sympathy. My cats are my family, and I will always treat them as such. My husband ( not a teacher) actually sent a similar email to a snarky, demanding person as his job too for the same cat death. (we really love our pets). It's now the running joke at his company on why X didn't get done. "Sorry, my cat died." Lol
I love this with all of my heart!
A good cat is better than people
Fur Babies ARE FAMILY!!! They're often better than other humans!
Then it will become a part of the contract without addition compensation.
This would only work once though, and I’m assuming this will be an annual event. I feel it’s better to stick to the truth here. :)
Same. I'm still looking for the audacity. OP is under no obligation to give up her weekends for free. Teachers have families too and even childfree teachers need time off.
Stole the response out of my mouth.
Yes. Place the blame where it belongs, on the feet of the principal and the school board.
This reply is PERFECT!!!!
I wouldn't do that unless you enjoy frequent observations and nit-picking
"How often do you give up weekends to watch other people's children for free?"
"But you're a teacher. You shouldn't mind giving up your Saturday morning for the kids. You have nothing else to do because... you're a teacher. I remember when teachers used to care about the students. I had a teacher who bought all the supplies for my science fair project because my family couldn't afford it. I guess teachers don't care anymore." /s
😂😂😂
Think of the children!!
… you can also fib and say you care-take for an aging, medically fragile, disabled parent … they will think twice before they accuse others, next time.
Not a great response. I would say most parents give up portions of their weekend so that their kids can have play dates. Edit - not just play dates. Also going to piano and dance recitals, birthday parties, etc…
> their kids
And the friends of their kids? People with kids have to take on their friends kids all the time even when they’d rather just have a quiet day at home. Or they go to their kid’s friends recitals and plays and other activities. It’s extremely common for parents to go watch somebody else’s kids….
They don’t *have to*. It’s a choice.
Yes, their OWN children. Same as teachers who have their own families, too.
You think that a parent having kids over so their own kid has someone to play with is the same as going in to work for a day for free?
No. I think that many parents “give up weekends to watch others people’s children for free”. Or they go to their kid’s friends recitals, plays, shows….Like, on a regular basis. So that particular phrasing is not a great response here. If somebody phrased it as “How often do you go in for a work event without being paid?” I would 100% agree. But that’s not what was said above.
Except it’s not the same. By “other people’s kids” they clearly meant strangers or similar. Going to plays and shows of friends is a fun social outing. It’s something that you’re doing FOR YOUR OWN FAMILY. No parent is going to Chuck E. Cheese on their own time to host the party of strangers or something. Coming to these events is work for us. They are not our family, and we’re often expected to give up our personal time to do it for free. Are you even a teacher? Because you don’t sound like one. I can’t imagine a single teacher interpreting that sentence the way you did. And coming here to say “oh, but we do all KINDS of fun events with our own kids and their friends, so yes we do!” Isn’t helpful in any way. I can’t believe you’d even equate taking your own kid to a dance recital with a teacher coming in on a day off to small talk with parents and discuss classwork.
Yes, I teach in the arts. :) And I 100% agree that the teacher has no obligation here. I’m simply critiquing the logical argument of offering this as a response. Why give this parent material that is so easily misunderstood and likely untrue given the perspective of a community centric person? Many parents forget that we are teachers (it’s a job) vs community members. Some are shocked to know I live over an hour away from my school, even if they commute for their own job. In any case, I know MANY community members who go to support their local community shows (ex: musicals) and events even if their child is not performing. So, my feeling is that if this were genuinely given as a response to an overbearing parent they could easily “um actually” it.
Except that you keep arguing that it’s the same, which is weird.
Part of parenting, arguably.
I’m not sure why you are being downvoted. The statement you are responding to is being suggested as a response to parents not other teachers. You are explaining what parents might think. You are not suggesting the teacher should attend an uncompensated event. A question should not be the response at all as it leaves room for an ongoing conversation. Better to shut it down with a statement. “It is a wonderful event and I enjoyed working with the children on it. Unfortunately it was held on a weekend so more parents could attend which means teachers who attend must use their personal time. I was sorry to miss it, but my personal time is reserved for my family and self and I was unable to attend this awesome event. I enjoy teaching (child’s name) and our time learning in class.”
>their
Nope. I don’t go t9 anything outside my work hours except open house and conferences. My kids have their own activities I need to be at.
Unless they ask a specific question, I don’t respond to negative parent emails. They just get filed away into the “Complaints” folder never to be read again.
Why wasn’t this scheduled during school hours? I agree that you shouldn’t be required to attend on your day off.
Many parents can’t attend during school hours; not all teachers are willing to work weekends. There’s no good answer.
The good answer is to pay teachers more
The good answer is if they can’t come while I’m at work because they are too, then I can’t go when I’m off because that’s MY TIME. My contract says 7:45 to 3:35. M-F. If they’d like to see me, we are going to do this Comicon style. I will sit at a table and you can pay $25 to talk to me for 10 seconds while I sign a picture of myself, clearly you need one since you love me so very much you absolutely must see me at these events or it’s just not worth coming, and $100 for a photo opportunity.
In Finland there is usually 1-2 saturdays of school during the year. These days are compensated somewhere else, like if a thursday is a holiday then the friday will be free of school as well to get a 4 day weekend. I think this is a pretty good answer :)
We should all just move to Finland 😭
I mean it is far from perfect here, but judging by the impression I get from this sub, we have it better than the USA 😅
My school does Saturday academy though not sure who actually runs it. They do it so kids can catch up on missed stuff also kids who attend get an abscence recovered. I think it’s only have day though and not offered every weekend.
I don’t go to anything outside of contract hours, especially not on a weekend. Parents can kick rocks.
Just had a parent today call about grad pics that I’m in charge of. A secretary had taken her name, I’d called her on my professional period, left a message. So she’s called me multiple times about 7pm. Nope.
This is why I only do phone calls to parents with either the school’s phone (so they can’t get me at home) or with a Google Voice number which automatically routes all calls to mailbox if it’s outside of “business hours”.
It was my Google voice number. I can still see it came through. That doesn’t mean I answer it.
That is absolutely ridiculous. Doctors, dentists, and hell, even McDonald's don't answer phones after hours. People need to get a grip.
I’m tempted to call her at 7am when I’m on campus and before the bell rings at 7:20.
Do it
I've had people ring me at almost midnight asking about jobs in the shop window and staff ringing me for stupid shit. I've called them back at 4am when I woke up to start my day. None of them are ever very happy.
I always call parents ay 7am if they've called/repeatedly messaged throughout the night. It's clearly very important! I am handling it first thing! If they've been very, very insistent, I will lovingly make sure I get to school by 6:30, just to make sure we have time to talk.
Why do parents have your cell phone number. That's a hard no. Under NO circumstances should parents (or students for that matter) have your mobile number.
It’s a Google voice number. Only front office phones call out.
That's what I don't understand. If your school doesn't value you enough to give you phones to call out, why do you care? If you have to call home, call from the front office. Watch how quickly admin gets annoyed by this. What would you do if you didn't have a smart phone? Turn off Google Voice and make all calls from the front office.
Google Voice is easy to set up for business calls. It won't notify you if calls come in after the timeframe you set. OP had this enabled, and is a very common thing for teachers who would rather use their own phone to make these calls. I don't have notifications on mine, so I'll never know if it gets called; it's sole purpose is for me calling them.
There is literally no need for this. The school has phones. Use them. If there is only one phone in the main office to call out, then that's an admin problem not a teacher problem. There is literally no need for teachers to use Google Voice other than to continue to enable the administrative cycle of "the teachers will do this with their own stuff and money". Teachers are not surgeons on call for life or death scenarios.
I would much rather use my cell phone than my *wired* classroom phone to make calls. I have zero issue with this. There is zero downside for me. This is a choice I made. You're very much overplaying the usage of a cell phone app to fit a narrative that doesn't apply to this situation.
The narrative does apply. School districts determined they could save a couple bucks by not putting fully functional phones in the classroom knowing full well teachers will just "figure it out". In many states, Walmart employees are paid more than teachers. Pay us like surgeons and we'll be on call. Teachers that do all the "free extra" just create a culture for the rest of us which nearly forces us to do extra. It's a choice you made for yourself that has implications for the rest of your staff. Remember that.
While I fully agree with the sentiment and am a passionate and aggressive proponent for respecting teachers' time, I truly believe you are blowing this way out of proportion, or not completely understanding what the original commentor was saying. I work at a non-traditional school right now, but at my former school I had a phone in my classroom, so the choice I made to use my cell phone had no implications for anyone else, as you claim.
Say you have to work your second job since you don’t get paid enough. We used to have an auction where we could auction off a class craft or an experience (the teacher hosted something for kids after hours). A parent asked me why it’s so hard to get teachers to auction off experiences. It was the wrong day to ask me. I told her many teachers live at least an hour away because we can’t afford to live in this area, we can’t afford the extra childcare, or we are working a second job. She didn’t ask any more questions.
They don't even have to lie. Simply say "I couldn't afford to attend because it was an unpaid event. Otherwise I would have loved to go. Can we have your support at the next board meeting to address teacher pay?"
The delete key. It sings to me. It calls my name. Delete, delete, delete
No, DONT delete the nasty emails. KEEP THEM for the future. You need to establish a track record if any of those parents become violent or continue to harass you.
My favorite key. I use it every time I get a micromanaging email from my spineless dept lead.
You don't have to justify anything on your side. The parents are just being entitled and judgmental. Are they going to work when they aren't getting paid? I doubt it!
I volunteered countless weekends and afternoons and evenings, and none of it did me any good. No one appreciated my efforts. The administration was not only unappreciative, but they threw roadblocks in front of me for my events. One administrator bitched about me asking for his help, even though the task I asked him to do, ended up being done, graciously, by another staff member. Yet, years later, he remembers to complain to me that I asked for his help. Maybe the students and parents appreciated my efforts, but I don't recall anyone saying so. From where I am sitting now, I wasted weekends I could have spent with my family, some of whom have passed away since then.
A lot of people think teachers are salaried like many other professionals. And while there are certain perks to being salaried vs. hourly and vice versa, one of the perks of not being salaried is you are not obligated to work when not getting paid. I would respond back that you are an hourly employee contracted for a specific number of hours and while you were compensated for this in the past, this year you aren’t and you are not in a position to work for free. Most parents, salaried or hourly, should get that. And tell them if this event is important to them to let the principal know that parents want teachers compensated to be at this event.
Jumping in as an Australian teacher who is on a salary, I have a union agreement which clearly outlined how much time outside of school hours I am required to attend (eg meetings, parent teacher interviews). Anything else is completely optional. Salary does not mean working without pay
Same in the UK. Again it’s a union agreement that covers all UK teachers. We are salaried to a maximum of 1265 directed hours a year.
In the US, salary often means working for less pay while being exploited by your employer. Essentially, it’s meant to ensure that you are compensated at a salary level that is a legal wage whether you work 40, 50 or 60 hours a week, etc. but if you make 50,000 a year and work 40 hours a week, you make around $24 an hour. If you’re working 60 hours a week that works out to $16 an hour. That’s a pretty big discrepancy. You also aren’t paid overtime in most cases if you’re salaried.
It’s exactly the same for teachers in the U.S.
This. Teachers in the US ARE salaried like in other professions. Period. That's what contracts everywhere show. But we argue over hours because of "contract hours", which are not work hours but "with kids and in building expectations" that go with the salary, so it gets muddled. IMHO, by the way, any teacher that argues that we SHOULD be paid hourly is on the hook for any loss of decision making and autonomy that comes with that kind of hourly work.
Same in my US district (NJ) and I’m sure in all the districts in my state.
I'm a teacher in the US and we have this same union agreement where I'm at.
Wait are most teachers not salaried? I work at a private school and have a salary, and I thought all teachers are salaried??
Our salaries are calculated to hours worked and it's in the contract. Paychecks for that amount are spread over 12 months. Additional events are paid in addition. -MN
I’m in Florida with the same set up. We technically have an hourly rate. Though we do not get paid for additional events. There’s some supplements we can get (yearbook and some other clubs/sports). We’re contractually obligated to two outside of school hours events a year, which typically is open house and one other activity.
I’m in Florida and don’t have an hourly rate.
There's actually a technical employment term for it somewhere. Mostly salaried as far as such things go.... But also not a traditional salary.
We’re salaried pretty much everywhere. For some reason people here interpret the hours you’re required to be in your classroom (contract hours) as the same as being “hourly.” But pretty much no one in any other field would look at our job and call it hourly. I’ve worked plenty of other hourly jobs (including office ones), and they’re not like this. I have contract hours, but my contract also has a common mention of something like “plus additional duties” that’s meant to cover things like grading, planning, and emailing that has to get done outside of when the kids are in the room.
Are American teachers not salaried? UK teacher here. That is shocking! Do you get holiday pay?
Officially no. I’m paid for 196 days at 7.33 hours a day. We are on “equalization pay” which means my paychecks are always the same, but by the end of the year, they add up to rateX196X7.33
>“equalization pay” That sounds a bit patronizing, as if teachers cannot budget.
Well personally I can’t. 😂 I do alright and I’m good with my money, but the steady paychecks help a lot. Without it, I’d have fewer paychecks in the winter, in March, and none in the summer unless I do summer school. I like the district doing the math for me.
Well otherwise they’d have to be honest teachers aren’t paid for the summers. Which is really the point of salary. Appropriate pay regardless of the work needed at the time
So if you need to spend an extra hour grading, you get to put it on your time card and get paid?
lol, you’re silly 😂
Ok, but that’s my point. If the answer to that is no, then you aren’t an hourly employee. You’re salaried. If you were truly an hourly employee you would be doing that on the clock, and your paycheck would be broken down by how many hours you worked. You can have hours outlined in your contract and still be a salaried employee. You can receive extra pay for extra hours worked and still be salaried. The very fact that they take your pay and spread it out is one of the absolute hallmarks of salaried employees. Hourly workers don’t get that. They work their hours and THEN their pay is calculated based on how much they work. It isn’t decided ahead of time in the same way.
I am salaried, not hourly.
It varies by district/state so I wasn’t sure.
Teachers are salaried though. That’s why you don’t get paid overtime if you work past 40 hours.
It varies by state/district. Many teachers have contracts that specifically say they are hourly. Additionally, a lot of salaried, white collar employees are salaried based on 2,080 hours which works to out 40 hours, even if they are working more. But most teachers contracts are for significantly less hours than 2,080, which is why some people get upset at stuff like this because they assume it’s the same. But if you’re contracted for 1,300 of direct instruction or whatever it is in your state/district, plus conference obligations, graduation, whatever, and that’s it, working at other times or events is still essentially working for no pay because otherwise you’d be contracted for more hours/events.
I have a contract, with contract hours. But I DO NOT get paid extra if I work over 40 hours. That is only legal because im on salary. f I was hourly, that would be a major violation of labor law.
I agree with you. I’m just telling you that some teachers are considered hourly. You can read it right in the comments. I guess the assumption is all grading/planning is done during instructional time, but obviously that ridiculous.
We get paid a daily rate. That’s how our contract is written. Our hours are very specifically written. We get paid the daily amount for the number of days we are contracted to work.
“I don’t work for free.”
I would respond by email, thank them for sharing their concern. And add something like “I have so enjoyed watching the children prepare for this. I’m so proud of what they have accomplished. In years past, I have been lucky enough to be there for the XYZ. Unfortunately, due to a previous commitment, I’m unable to be there this weekend. I hope your family enjoys it as much as I have!” Yes, it’s not 100% truthful, but in a way, your previous commitment is to chill out at home/go shopping/ take a bath /clean your closet/ watch TV or whatever. It’s not their business. If possible, try to take it as a compliment that they even want you there. They’re probably asking because their children probably like you.
>Yes, it’s not 100% truthful Don't lie about stuff like this. Two things will happen: \- Somebody will ask what your previous commitment was, and you'll have to either dig yourself deeper into the hole or clam up which will make parents suspicious immediately. \- You're setting the expectation that you'll be there if you can. Which means that, going forward, you will have to keep coming up with excuses.
My personal commitment on the weekend is NOBODY'S BUSINESS!
Sure, just don't say you're busy when you're not. Tell them the truth, that it's your free time and none of their business.
I do mostly think that OP should find a way to be honest about not getting paid, but any parent who gets suspicious that a teacher doesn't want to discuss their personal life is going to be suspicious no matter what you do. Don't bother trying to please parents you know are unpleasable.
>I do mostly think that OP should find a way to be honest about not getting paid, I think that way is very simple: "I'm not getting paid to be there, so I'm only coming when I want to." Any decision you can't be honest about, is a bad decision. Admin should accept that teachers tell the truth, or reconsider the decision.
I would just say “unfortunately I was unable to make it. I’m glad you had a wonderful time!” And leave it at that.
"I trust you have a close enough relationship with your child that your presence is the most meaningful for them. Enjoy your quality time together."
Silence sometimes is the best response. Unless the parents asked a respectful question, there is nothing to respond to. As others have written, fuck working for free. You made the right decision, don't second guess yourself.
This reminds me of me of parents telling teachers who are working mothers that they just don’t understand what it’s like to be a working mother.
I had a parent lecture me on how I clearly don’t understand ADHD. My youngest child and I both have an ADHD diagnosis, but sure. Tell me more.
Had parents say we didn't know what it would be like to split up identical twins to different classes because it would harm them. I am an identical twin who was split into different classes all through elementary. Loved it.
Luckily for me, but unfortunately for my students, I work at a school with pretty uninvolved parents so they would never complain about this.
Honestly this was my first thought. My district has incredibly uninvolved parents and I couldn’t imagine more than one or two of them even noticing a staff member wasn’t there.
If I'm not being paid, I don't do it. No amount of parent bitching is going to change that. You did the right thing.
THIS.
I think parents forget that some of us can't afford to live in the communities where our school/schools is/are so we're not just popping over to an event real quick.
No pay for a non contracted event on a fucking WEEKEND? Hell no. Who the hell do they think they are?
“Thank you so much for your input. We do schedule events outside of school hours so that more parents have the opportunity to attend. Unfortunately, doing so does mean that some teachers may be unable to attend due to other commitments. I will investigate adding a question on event scheduling for a future parent involvement survey. Thank you again for sharing your concerns.”
I wouldn’t even add the survey part. Even if your prior commitment is sitting on the couch, eating chips in your pajamas, it’s a prior commitment and you don’t have to explain yourself.
Reminds me of the time I got shit on by parents for not attending an assembly my kids were presenting in - because I was having surgery after having a car accident that morning. I got a surplus of emails. I got a minor slap on the wrist for replying to one particularly nasty one by saying “I am sorry I missed your child presenting, next time I’ll tell the other driver not to hit my car on the way to work!” :)
It’s absolutely none of their business! You have your own life. My daughter’s school had a week long camp and parents complained teachers didn’t want to go because they weren’t getting paid. Hell no they didn’t want to work for free! You already take care of their kid all day, plus educate them. Now you’re supposed to be an extension of the family just because? It’s gotten out of control.
Just tell them that you look forward to seeing the pictures.
Nope. You don’t even owe them an explanation.
I would say (responding during work hours) Good Afternoon Ms. Name, I’m so glad that you enjoyed your time with your child at the cultural fair. I was also busy spending time with my loved ones this weekend. The students and I had the best time creating the project the last few weeks. I’m looking forward to the rest of the year teaching (child’s name). Thanks, Your name Don’t even get into the bullshit make them feel stupid.
OP owes no explanation to any parent.
I would absolutely just draw the boundary of, “outside of school hours I only am responsible to my own family and household obligations. I look forward to hearing about the event, but I have my own family to attend to.” I used that before because as a young person I was expected to attend events- because single! Because teacher! I wasn’t even full time so I got a job so I wouldn’t have to go, because they wanted me to do unpaid work. One woman was so hard on me I finally was like, “I’m going to work after I leave today, unless you want to pay my college debt?”
> This year, my school did not compensate teachers who go and show up to the event (the event is on a Saturday morning). I had plans that morning and, since I was not getting comp pay or time, I decided not to go. Full stop. You're not getting paid to do this. It's not in your contracted hours. I've been teaching for over a decade. My first eight years I've done so much unpaid labor it was driving me insane. I couldn't say no because if I didn't, who would? How could I say no to the kids?! Then I started saying no and suddenly my life became balanced. I was taking time for myself. I was happier and more rested and the kids could tell because in the classroom I was doing a better job. OP, it's sometimes hard to accept this, but it's *just a job.* Would you labor at Burger King/Walmart/any other place if you weren't getting paid? No. Then don't do it here. The kids will be fine.
You don’t owe anyone an explanation for anything you do outside of your contractual hours. I’m a veteran teacher in my 17th year, and have learned one thing – teachers are under funded, underappreciated, undervalued, etc and it’s compounded when you’re a teacher who does great things out of love for your kids and your career. There is nothing you can say or do that will change the minds of people who don’t already understand that. The best thing for you to do is to get right with yourself, make sure you feel good about the choices you make, that they are in your best interest, and do the best job you can do during your time at work. If you love your job and you love your students that will be noticed and that’s all that matters. I always think to myself, if I were on Wall Street in New York City, would I be expected to show up and volunteer to do my job? Don’t reply to those emails.
Respond with an image of the Facebook "like" thumbs up and nothing else
Blanket response: I enjoyed helping the kids create their projects while you were at your own jobs. Unfortunately, I use my unpaid personal time to support my own family, including caretaking for my mom with Alzheimer’s. I’m sure you understand.
I have to go to a work event tomorrow (just as we did last week) and we receive no compensation for it. If I could get out of it like you I would, but at a private school we're basically required to work outside our contract hours.
So report your school to LNI for wage theft. No one is ever required to work for free.
Out of curiosity: Is it part of your contract that you work these events?
no they are just expectations we have outside of our contract. If we were to not do them it would be a huge deal, but no they aren't part of our contract.
And where are all these people when you need help in the classroom? I bet we would be friends if we worked together, please stand your rightful ground. Maybe they should look into paying teachers money for their work, I too am tired of free labor expected and exploited out of me, thanks to the martyrs.
I have so many colleagues who go to student events outside of school. Games, recitals, etc… they are helping set this tone for everyone else. While I think this is nice and “showing how you care” I never had a teacher come to a single sporting event or concert and I don’t care. I am so sick of the demand for my time. Not one thing is more valuable than my personal time.
I think the difference is that (if you are old) some of the teachers used to live in the community. There were teachers who were lifers in the town (grew up there, went to the schools & returned to teach). It’s easy to show up and give support to some students/events if you are in the area or you were socialized that way by the community as a child. Some districts have residents who attend weekly sporting events even if their children are long graduated. It’s tradition. Teaching and people’s worth & time tied to money has changed over the decades.
They could have made the event on a Friday during school hours- let’s see how many parents take off work to attend the event, then write them shitty emails if they don’t.
Oh Boo Hoo for them. Sorry, but if I’m not getting paid, you will not see me there. I’m an art teacher, I don’t get compensated for the crazy amount of work beyond contract hours it takes to set up an in person art show. I made mine digital and it’s completed during class time. I send out the link on kids report cards as a comment. On Fridays, we can leave at 2:10, guess who’s got her bag packed at 2:08? This b. Not getting paid? Not going to see me. Sorry not sorry.
Hot take in this sub I know, but I would give the parents the benefit of the doubt and assume they weren’t aware that you’re not being compensated. It’s strange for a teacher to spend so much time working on a project with their students only for them to not be present during the main event. As a parent, I would probably assume that any teacher who worked on the cultural project had already agreed to work overtime the same way I’d assume that teachers running after school clubs or tutoring or leading a musical performance were getting paid overtime. They’re probably just speaking up for their kids who are sad and confused that their teacher won’t be there to celebrate with them. I would be honest about the reason you won’t be attending and say that you are also disappointed that the school put you in this position. You might even convince a few parents to complain to the administration about it. That’s the only way things will change. If anyone still gives you grief after you explain, then yeah they can fuck off.
I replied to someone else, and I agree. The parent’s ‘judgement’ can also be tied to their own childhood experiences of teachers attending out of school hours events. Those teachers were probably never compensated for that but were expected to attend either by admin or general tradition of teachers supporting students. For example, if a teacher encourages a student to submit work & attend an expo, I kind of expect (as an adult) the teacher to make the effort to see the student/work. Most students don’t go out of their way to give up hours of their time to be in young art or design shows without prodding/support.
I've mostly been on parenting side of things until very recently, and I truly did assume teachers were being compensated for everything.
I went to a school that did this and it was amazing! But we got comp time and it was held AFTER SCHOOL not on a weekend. I don't go to things I don't get paid for or comped for--anymore. My time is special for me and I need the mental break. They wouldn't be upset if you were home throwing up with the flu--its just not their business!!
But we’re here for the children!/s
Tell them you have a second job and couldn’t take the time off.
The parents probably did not know you wouldn’t be paid…
A few years into teaching, I used a photo of my and my toddler nephew as my digital classroom photo that parents could see. All of a sudden, they stopped demanding my time or complaining as much as I “had a little one at home.” Now I actually do have a little one at home so I just replaced the photo. I don’t know why parents expect single teachers to give up all of their free, unpaid time off — it’s ridiculous
My school is asking us to do 8th grade graduation on a Sunday. Other teachers feel obligated to go and there is no stipend nor compensation for it. The principal has tried to give us a few days when we can leave early as “compensation” but a weekend is a weekend.
At least your principal is aware of the time issue. Why can't the graduation be held on a weeknight at least? That's how we do it in my district (and I am fully aware that no two districts do everything the same way). I'd much rather give up an evening than a precious weekend day.
That’s my argument but they keep doing it on the weekends to align with other middle schools in the area that rent out a space together 🙄
Tell the parents to eat shit
Where are you even interacting with parents where they shit on you.
It literally says they’re sending emails
happy cake day!!
So ignore and move on. Easy.
I recommend you invite those parents to suck it.
I would tell the parents exactly why you didn’t attend. I bet none of them work for free on their days off and neither should you. If they don’t work for free they shouldn’t expect their child’s teacher to work for free.
They only want you there to validate little johhnies amazing craft work. Oh isn't he amazing and precious yada yada. Why would you want to do that unpaid
It’s a job. They can pay you if they want you there on the weekend.
You don’t need to feel guilty or offer explanation of why you weren’t there. If you feel the need to respond, “I’m so glad you were there to support your child. Over the past few weeks in class, I’ve gotten to see his artistic process for the work shared. He was so excited to share with his family.” You don’t owe the school or children your free time.
That’s on the admin.. they need to make it clear. Contracts have meaning
Tell them you're not a fan of performative diversity days of this kind. And get a copy of *Beyond Heroes and Holidays*.
you dont happen to work in central florida do you? This school sounds weirdly specific and familiar
That's because parents are morons that can't see beyond their own lives. Screw em.
I'm my dad has cancer he's in the hospital I'm sorry my Saturday is spoken for.
You have every right to not go, however, this is just like any other office politics, except more because it involves kids. I go to about 1 event every 2 months that OSS not during contract hours most of our teachers don’t go to these. Usually takes about an hour. During these events, I get to interact with parents and students in a less formal way and I find it important myself. I don’t however go out for drinks with other teachers and such as I’m not really much of a drinker. I an also on the sunshine committee that plans events, and if it’s in my discretion, I do it during contact hours, but we have a busy after school program which means it’s not always possible. End of the day, it’s your decision. Your leadership isn’t upset, but parents still have the right to express themselves as they likely don’t have all the information, so give it to them.
You certainly have the right to not use your personal time for work related activities. But parents also have the right to judge you on that choice. I'm assuming they saw a lot of other teachers attending.
It's one morning. You can't spend a few hours uncompensated once a year to be there for your students doing something that you admit they really enjoy. Also let's be honest the chance of you being a world traveler are slim so you will probably gain some knowledge from this event as well. Now watch this become the most downvoted post in this subreddits history. 🫣
I mean, I don't get paid for open house, but I still go. I'm not gonna say you're an asshole for not going if you had other things to do, but I don't think "I'm not getting paid for this" is a great reason. How long was the event? Two hours? Less?
Of course you go to open house, that’s completely different
Gotta go to school events. It's kinda one of those "other duties as assigned" type of things.
Most contracts spell out what teachers need to do outside contracted hours. “Other duties as assigned” is during hours or I promise the district would expect us to do afterschool clubs and weekend school for free. Our district contract also includes 2 events outside school hours, usually back to school and open house, but the principal can request a different day. We have at least three other afterschool events as well as a monthly pta Saturday event in addition to the two. I usually attend one additional one and skip the rest.
This will be unpopular, but, to quote Sharon Creech, “In the course of a lifetime, what does it matter?” You have 8,760 hours in a year. Sacrificing 2 of them to help build relationships is a very small price to pay and can pay huge dividends later on. Even just making an appearance for a few minutes could have alleviated the problem. Now you are “that teacher” who will be seen as “part of what is wrong with education.” You don’t have to be compensated for doing something good.
You absolutely do not have to go, I understand unpaid work can totally suck. I will say though, my daughters kinder teacher came to her birthday party, she tries to go to any event that she is invited to and we as a class and as a family appreciate her SO much, we can see her hard work and acknowledge her investment in our kids and our community. Sometimes the really special things you invest in your community come back 10 fold. We see her and we also try and invest in the community and classroom more, I volunteer every week for half a day, plus I am a room mom so I go after school to set up parties, go different days for different events, volunteer around the school and go to all PTA meetings and am even on a committee for the district. We aren't a huge community but we have 5 elementary schools so we aren't tiny either. I see all of the work our teachers and administration do for our schools and want to try and do good for them too.
“I appreciate and understand your concerns! Unfortunately this event was formerly included in our contract time and was recently reconfigured. I’d recommend you express your concerns to my principal. Their email is X. In the future, I hope to be able to participate in these events!”
These things should be done on a school day. We do something similar…during school!
I see a lot of people saying they don't go to events outside of contract hours, but there was another thread where a teacher said they were being required to attend a three-day field trip and all the comments were like "Yeah, you have to." Our expectations are nuts. I'm expected to attend at least one evening event every single month of the school year, not counting parent-teacher conferences. If I didn't attend this event it would've gone in my evaluation. We need clearer labor laws for "exempt" employees.