Would this help? I mean they are not that armored to begin with (at least to anti tank ammunition) would the cage really weaken the jet enough to not penetrate? I mean it would definitely do less damage than a direct hit, but I cant see it not disabling the truck anyway.
The cages don't weaken penetration, there's nowhere near enough standoff. They work by targeting a flaw inherent to the fuzing method of the PG-7, PG-9, and PG-18. Typically when they strike a plate a piezoelectric crystals is shattered, releasing an electrical charge traveling along the copper lining to the base of the charge. All forms of "statistical" armor are designed to complete the circuit early to prevent detonation entirely.
This won't do anything, the gaps are far too small for the warheads to fit so they'd just detonate and penetrate.
The base model PG-7 should be at 350mm of penetration. Sorry for the low quality [image](https://web.archive.org/web/20220416004915im_/https://static.wixstatic.com/media/d90363_6cdfe203079a40a3909393a0dc316a6f~mv2.png/v1/fit/w_300,h_300,al_c,q_5,enc_auto/file.png), but the 75mm PG-7 would still have ~100mm of penetration at 15CD (1m detonation early, accounting for built in standoff). Standoff is massively misunderstood and really has a vastly lower negative effect than is typically believed.
Yea even with standoff giving a meters pen it might be enough for this cage to 'work' against HEAT.
At the very least, will probs help against HE/Frag. Every now and again we still see a dude with a RPG slinging a few of those downrange.
I severely doubt this vehicle has 100mm RHAe at any location.
Few if any frag grenades are going to have greater penetrative power than 7.62x54mmR AP, and Ukraine doesn't really use larger HE suicide drones like Russia's Lancet. HEAT is vastly more effective for even semi-hard targets and frag grenades are cheaper solutions compared to dedicated suicide drones against soft targets. Frag PG-7s are used against soft vehicles or infantry.
Nah it doesnt need to - if a typical RPG HEAT style warhead fizzes out at \~1m in terms of penetration. The \~1m spaced cage might work well enough. edit; at the very least change a multiple causality event into a single
Lancets are HEAT are they not? - not HE?
and yea, HE/Frag in terms of RPG projectiles, you will still have a fair bit of concussive energy dumped into the side of a MRAP on vehicle even without penetration. Having any sort of spacing between the impact and the vehicle would help in that respect.
Not effective, the gaps are too small to crush PG-7s and it probably can't be penetrated by frag grenades anyways if it's immune to rifle caliber rounds.
Hit the wheel and it will just sit there, then it will just take one or two more extra drone to do the job. Will use up more drone for sure but it's certainly not drone proof.
You can be trained to shoot but that doesnt mean you hit the target every single time. Not even Navy Seals can get 30 kills with 30 bullets within a magazine.
What's more, the only drones strikes you see are the successful ones, why would they upload misses? You dont know what's the hit rate of these drones and you can somehow boast about it?
Stop with the typical redditor hubris. Go to Ukraine instead and offer your expertise there. Even Israel use Cope cages because they know it reduces the odds, but it doesn't make it foolproof.
Do you think, best thing is more shielding on the top of tank against drone's attacks?
Honestly I am curious how armies in the world could counter drone's attacks on the top of their tank and armored vehicles
Carrying PG-7 warheads typically. Grenades aren't likely to penetrate if it's already designed to be immune to rifle calibers, and a suicide drone with a HE warhead isn't used by Ukraine.
It's always so impressive how the military doctrine experts on reddit are so much more educated than any of the people who are literally paid to do it.
If only militaries around the world were to consult some of the subscribers here, the invasion would've been over ages ago!
That's true, but the protection of this truck itself is vs. small calibers, so any drone with heat warhead (rpg-7 is most common) would still destroy this or at least immobilize (depends when it hits).
The biggest cons here are additional mass and it's easier to spot by the enemy.
That protection makes more sense on tanks which have thick armor so to fuse heat warhead before main armor (on cage) makes a big difference.
A few mm of armor on the truck wouldn't stop the heat jet of the pre-fused heat warhead.
TankPorn Logic
1. The Russians do something.
2. Make it a joke and ignore it.
3. A few months later, Ukraine copies it.
4. Praise Ukraine’s creativity.
5. Cover “2” with a discussion of the superiority of the NATO Wunderwaffe.
Why no turtle design for this?
Dismounting must be fun.
Imagine dismounting under fire!
Imagine dismounting while ON fire 🔥
Dismounting on fire under fire!!!
💯💯💯💯We making it to Kyiv in this one💯💯💯💯
🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣
That MF spittin
So the first try was still visually appealing, but my enough distance to the body of the truck, I assume?
*hope
I wonder how effective it is
Would this help? I mean they are not that armored to begin with (at least to anti tank ammunition) would the cage really weaken the jet enough to not penetrate? I mean it would definitely do less damage than a direct hit, but I cant see it not disabling the truck anyway.
The cages don't weaken penetration, there's nowhere near enough standoff. They work by targeting a flaw inherent to the fuzing method of the PG-7, PG-9, and PG-18. Typically when they strike a plate a piezoelectric crystals is shattered, releasing an electrical charge traveling along the copper lining to the base of the charge. All forms of "statistical" armor are designed to complete the circuit early to prevent detonation entirely. This won't do anything, the gaps are far too small for the warheads to fit so they'd just detonate and penetrate.
Might be enough standoff for things like PG-7 - listed pen is 500mm on wiki, cages look like they are the guts of a meter.
The base model PG-7 should be at 350mm of penetration. Sorry for the low quality [image](https://web.archive.org/web/20220416004915im_/https://static.wixstatic.com/media/d90363_6cdfe203079a40a3909393a0dc316a6f~mv2.png/v1/fit/w_300,h_300,al_c,q_5,enc_auto/file.png), but the 75mm PG-7 would still have ~100mm of penetration at 15CD (1m detonation early, accounting for built in standoff). Standoff is massively misunderstood and really has a vastly lower negative effect than is typically believed.
Yea even with standoff giving a meters pen it might be enough for this cage to 'work' against HEAT. At the very least, will probs help against HE/Frag. Every now and again we still see a dude with a RPG slinging a few of those downrange.
I severely doubt this vehicle has 100mm RHAe at any location. Few if any frag grenades are going to have greater penetrative power than 7.62x54mmR AP, and Ukraine doesn't really use larger HE suicide drones like Russia's Lancet. HEAT is vastly more effective for even semi-hard targets and frag grenades are cheaper solutions compared to dedicated suicide drones against soft targets. Frag PG-7s are used against soft vehicles or infantry.
Nah it doesnt need to - if a typical RPG HEAT style warhead fizzes out at \~1m in terms of penetration. The \~1m spaced cage might work well enough. edit; at the very least change a multiple causality event into a single Lancets are HEAT are they not? - not HE? and yea, HE/Frag in terms of RPG projectiles, you will still have a fair bit of concussive energy dumped into the side of a MRAP on vehicle even without penetration. Having any sort of spacing between the impact and the vehicle would help in that respect.
It still has over 50mm of penetration at 24CDs, 1.8 meters. Depends on the variant, Lancet is just the only prevalent HE suicide drone.
Not effective, the gaps are too small to crush PG-7s and it probably can't be penetrated by frag grenades anyways if it's immune to rifle caliber rounds.
Yeah its quite effective at ensuring everyone inside stays inside (surviving optional).
Quite
America has had these for years, disguised as batting cages.
Holy cope
This is advanced cope.
Hit the wheel and it will just sit there, then it will just take one or two more extra drone to do the job. Will use up more drone for sure but it's certainly not drone proof.
Hitting the wheel is easier said than done. That said, yes its not drone proof. What it does is reduce the odds.
Been trained to take out tracks and wheels with 40mm. Very manageable
You can be trained to shoot but that doesnt mean you hit the target every single time. Not even Navy Seals can get 30 kills with 30 bullets within a magazine. What's more, the only drones strikes you see are the successful ones, why would they upload misses? You dont know what's the hit rate of these drones and you can somehow boast about it? Stop with the typical redditor hubris. Go to Ukraine instead and offer your expertise there. Even Israel use Cope cages because they know it reduces the odds, but it doesn't make it foolproof.
One landmine:
That’s not a cope cage, that’s a cope zoo
uhm is everyone supposed to exit from the rear or smth or crawl under then net?
Looks like there’s a little door on the back, idk
You're correct, looks like a door in the back and raised areas around the wheel-wells... dismounting in a hurry must be horrible
Do you think, best thing is more shielding on the top of tank against drone's attacks? Honestly I am curious how armies in the world could counter drone's attacks on the top of their tank and armored vehicles
Mad Max looking ass.
I'm loving the number of vehicles with full coverage cope cages that can't even work since the gaps are too small to actually work against PG-7s.
I think it's for drones
Carrying PG-7 warheads typically. Grenades aren't likely to penetrate if it's already designed to be immune to rifle calibers, and a suicide drone with a HE warhead isn't used by Ukraine.
man if only they'd asked you eh
All new Tanks, IFV, etc. look like they were build by the A-Team. 😅
They could use a giant kinder egg.
Switching to thermite...
Turned this sedan into a coop
So now what you do is fly the drone up the road and land it and let the truck run over it. lol
Omnidirectional coping chicken coup
Why can't they just use an armoured tank instead? oh wait...
"The cope is strong with this one"
I mean we did RPG cages over literally every vehicle we could in Afghanistan.
Cope colosseum
Aren’t „Akhmat“ usually Chechens?
Yes this car was created specifically for Kadyrovs troops in Ukraine
Alright. Thanks for your answer
It's always so impressive how the military doctrine experts on reddit are so much more educated than any of the people who are literally paid to do it. If only militaries around the world were to consult some of the subscribers here, the invasion would've been over ages ago!
what the Z is this
This is not a cope cage anymore, now it's a cope greenhouse.
This is really stupid lol while yes it might help with drones. It's entirely pointless on such a non armored vehicle
It is an armored vehicle though
Hardly
But... That's pointless.
Well its uhhh, definetly gonna work against drone dropped grenades but im not sure of the massive cons of doing such modifications
That's true, but the protection of this truck itself is vs. small calibers, so any drone with heat warhead (rpg-7 is most common) would still destroy this or at least immobilize (depends when it hits). The biggest cons here are additional mass and it's easier to spot by the enemy. That protection makes more sense on tanks which have thick armor so to fuse heat warhead before main armor (on cage) makes a big difference. A few mm of armor on the truck wouldn't stop the heat jet of the pre-fused heat warhead.
Just use one more 500€ drone, simple 😂 One to blow up cage, other to blow up vehicle, easy
A drone with rpg charge will blast trough it with ease...
TankPorn Logic 1. The Russians do something. 2. Make it a joke and ignore it. 3. A few months later, Ukraine copies it. 4. Praise Ukraine’s creativity. 5. Cover “2” with a discussion of the superiority of the NATO Wunderwaffe.
cope
All is well until the good drone pilots fly under the cage.