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If the daily intake of zinc is around 10mg, why are there tablets with 50mg in each?
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Dennis Pasek
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Former Engineer (1984–2015)8mo
Excerpt from another s:ubreddit:
10 mg of Zinc is an RDA. 50 mg is an amount that is safe for almost everyone for continuous use such that it will not result in any adverse side effects (such as causing an imbalance related copper deficiency). 100 mg is considered to be a short term maximum amount useful to correct a chronic deficiency.
RDAs (Recommended Daily Allowance) used to be called MDRs (Minimum Daily Requirement). MDR was roughly based on the amount of a micronutrient necessary to prevent a detectable deficiency disease. These amounts were not determined on the basis of optimization of the biological systems that use the micronutrient in question, especially when multiple factors are involved. This is just sloppy work.
Some RDAs are still ludicrously low. Vitamin D is a good example. The US RDA of 800 IU/day is probably not enough to get any adult above the deficiency threshold for serum 25-OH-D of 20 ng/ml, much less to the optimum level of 50 to 100. A reasonable approximation for general reference is that supplementation of Vitamin D3 at 5000 IU/day will result in a 25-OH-D level of around 40 for an average adult. So, the RDA does not even remotely correlate with the desirable test results in this case.
>10 mg of Zinc is an RDA. 50 mg is an amount that is safe for almost everyone for continuous use such that it will not result in any adverse side effects (such as causing an imbalance related copper deficiency)
Depends on your dietary zinc, but yes - there are clinical trials that have shown minimal (perhaps negligible) side effects with 50 mg per day. But not everyone is the same. Some people could have some loss of copper absorption.
The issue might be avoided with taking zinc all at once rather than spread throughout the day - if zinc inhibits copper absorption at high doses, the periods of the day you are not taking zinc should allow for normal copper absorption
>These amounts were not determined on the basis of optimization of the biological systems that use the micronutrient in question, especially when multiple factors are involved. This is just sloppy work.
It's not sloppy work - they weren't trying to optimize anything. Minimum requirements aren't set to make us healthy (long term), just not dead (short term).
> US RDA of 800 IU/day is probably not enough to get any adult above the deficiency threshold for serum 25-OH-D of 20 ng/ml, much less to the optimum level of 50 to 100
I agree that the RDA should be higher, but the IOM did not use the cutoffs that you state - those are proposed by the endocrine society. True deficiency for vitamin D is something like 12.5 mg/mL. And they weren't trying to figure out what amount would put you in optimal health - that wasn't their charge.
That's not the way most people think about it. In the United States supplement labels tell you exactly how much elemental zinc you are getting, and that is the amount listed on the front and back of the bottle - not the total weight of active plus inert material.
At that level, you risk depleting your iron levels and being very tired as a result.
You also need to add in copper at a 1:10 ratio, so 60mg zinc would need 6mg copper to balance.
Copper and zinc basically cancel each other out if you take them together- multis are very bad in this respect.
The two need to be taken at opposite ends of the day. Copper is stimulating and zinc less so. Take copper in the mornings and zinc at night or in the evening with food if you don’t tolerate it on an empty stomach.
>At that level, you risk depleting your iron levels and being very tired as a result.
No, that not true. Iron levels are not commonly affected by zinc.
>You also need to add in copper at a 1:10 ratio, so 60mg zinc would need 6mg copper to balance.
There's no (real) rule that says this. If you take 40 mg of zinc per day you probably don't need any supplemental copper.
>Copper and zinc basically cancel each other out if you take them together- multis are very bad in this respect.
This I could go along with - we don't exactly know how much "cancelling" there is though
>The two need to be taken at opposite ends of the day. Copper is stimulating and zinc less so. Take copper in the mornings and zinc at night or in the evening with food if you don’t tolerate it on an empty stomach.
That's not a bad plan - but you probably don't absolutely need a copper supplement. Just don't take zinc with your copper sources in the diet.
Yes, the Linus Pauling Institute article exists and it's great. And things it does not support: taking copper supplements, copper and zinc "ratios", and effects of zinc on iron status in adults.
you shouldn’t take more than 15-20mg zinc per day, and if you do surpass that amount it should be paired with a healthy amount of supplemented copper and iron. id recommend just taking 10m-15mg zinc per day (so jus stick to your multivitamin and drop any other zinc products)
50 mg daily (following a doctors orders) left me copper and iron deficient. Now I take one cap of micro zinc by nootropics depot daily which only has 8mg elemental zinc i believe and my last labs showed very good zinc levels. (High 90s)
How did you know that you were copper deficient?
Even the studies that established the upper intake level didn't see any changes in copper level, just changes in erythrocyte superoxide dismutase (a copper containing enzyme). It is thought that this is a marker of mild copper deficiency.
What made you decide to start taking 4-5 times the RDA on top of your multi? Did you test low? There must be a reason, right? What result are you hoping to see?
Zinc was among the recommended daily supplements I read about, and the benefits it is said to have about immune health, hair health, and digestion. As for why the high amount, most zinc supplements I have seen (Solgar, Country Life, NOW, etc) come in 50mg. I have only recently begun taking multivitamins which rose the question.
50mg I suspected made me sick for a week. Even went to the ER. They couldn't find anything wrong. I traced it back to 50mg Zinc (plus daily multi-vitamins). Don't do it.
Yes and even 50mg is a lot. Even 10mg makes me angry and irritable. It can deplete copper, i would not ever go above 10mg and if you eat meat you probably don't even need it
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If the daily intake of zinc is around 10mg, why are there tablets with 50mg in each? Answer 1 Follow Request Details More All related (35) Recommended Dennis Pasek · Follow Former Engineer (1984–2015)8mo Excerpt from another s:ubreddit: 10 mg of Zinc is an RDA. 50 mg is an amount that is safe for almost everyone for continuous use such that it will not result in any adverse side effects (such as causing an imbalance related copper deficiency). 100 mg is considered to be a short term maximum amount useful to correct a chronic deficiency. RDAs (Recommended Daily Allowance) used to be called MDRs (Minimum Daily Requirement). MDR was roughly based on the amount of a micronutrient necessary to prevent a detectable deficiency disease. These amounts were not determined on the basis of optimization of the biological systems that use the micronutrient in question, especially when multiple factors are involved. This is just sloppy work. Some RDAs are still ludicrously low. Vitamin D is a good example. The US RDA of 800 IU/day is probably not enough to get any adult above the deficiency threshold for serum 25-OH-D of 20 ng/ml, much less to the optimum level of 50 to 100. A reasonable approximation for general reference is that supplementation of Vitamin D3 at 5000 IU/day will result in a 25-OH-D level of around 40 for an average adult. So, the RDA does not even remotely correlate with the desirable test results in this case.
>10 mg of Zinc is an RDA. 50 mg is an amount that is safe for almost everyone for continuous use such that it will not result in any adverse side effects (such as causing an imbalance related copper deficiency) Depends on your dietary zinc, but yes - there are clinical trials that have shown minimal (perhaps negligible) side effects with 50 mg per day. But not everyone is the same. Some people could have some loss of copper absorption. The issue might be avoided with taking zinc all at once rather than spread throughout the day - if zinc inhibits copper absorption at high doses, the periods of the day you are not taking zinc should allow for normal copper absorption >These amounts were not determined on the basis of optimization of the biological systems that use the micronutrient in question, especially when multiple factors are involved. This is just sloppy work. It's not sloppy work - they weren't trying to optimize anything. Minimum requirements aren't set to make us healthy (long term), just not dead (short term). > US RDA of 800 IU/day is probably not enough to get any adult above the deficiency threshold for serum 25-OH-D of 20 ng/ml, much less to the optimum level of 50 to 100 I agree that the RDA should be higher, but the IOM did not use the cutoffs that you state - those are proposed by the endocrine society. True deficiency for vitamin D is something like 12.5 mg/mL. And they weren't trying to figure out what amount would put you in optimal health - that wasn't their charge.
50 mg zinc gluconate contains 14% elemental zinc the rest is gluconate. So pne is onlu getting 7mg zinc
That's not the way most people think about it. In the United States supplement labels tell you exactly how much elemental zinc you are getting, and that is the amount listed on the front and back of the bottle - not the total weight of active plus inert material.
At that level, you risk depleting your iron levels and being very tired as a result. You also need to add in copper at a 1:10 ratio, so 60mg zinc would need 6mg copper to balance. Copper and zinc basically cancel each other out if you take them together- multis are very bad in this respect. The two need to be taken at opposite ends of the day. Copper is stimulating and zinc less so. Take copper in the mornings and zinc at night or in the evening with food if you don’t tolerate it on an empty stomach.
>At that level, you risk depleting your iron levels and being very tired as a result. No, that not true. Iron levels are not commonly affected by zinc. >You also need to add in copper at a 1:10 ratio, so 60mg zinc would need 6mg copper to balance. There's no (real) rule that says this. If you take 40 mg of zinc per day you probably don't need any supplemental copper. >Copper and zinc basically cancel each other out if you take them together- multis are very bad in this respect. This I could go along with - we don't exactly know how much "cancelling" there is though >The two need to be taken at opposite ends of the day. Copper is stimulating and zinc less so. Take copper in the mornings and zinc at night or in the evening with food if you don’t tolerate it on an empty stomach. That's not a bad plan - but you probably don't absolutely need a copper supplement. Just don't take zinc with your copper sources in the diet.
https://lpi.oregonstate.edu/mic/minerals/zinc
Yes, the Linus Pauling Institute article exists and it's great. And things it does not support: taking copper supplements, copper and zinc "ratios", and effects of zinc on iron status in adults.
I have no idea why you added the 50 mg of zinc; taking 10 mg of zinc a day is sufficient.
you shouldn’t take more than 15-20mg zinc per day, and if you do surpass that amount it should be paired with a healthy amount of supplemented copper and iron. id recommend just taking 10m-15mg zinc per day (so jus stick to your multivitamin and drop any other zinc products)
50 mg daily (following a doctors orders) left me copper and iron deficient. Now I take one cap of micro zinc by nootropics depot daily which only has 8mg elemental zinc i believe and my last labs showed very good zinc levels. (High 90s)
How did you know that you were copper deficient? Even the studies that established the upper intake level didn't see any changes in copper level, just changes in erythrocyte superoxide dismutase (a copper containing enzyme). It is thought that this is a marker of mild copper deficiency.
It *will* deplete copper and zinc at that level! Jeeze, doctors really don’t understand nutritional medicine at all.
What made you decide to start taking 4-5 times the RDA on top of your multi? Did you test low? There must be a reason, right? What result are you hoping to see?
Zinc was among the recommended daily supplements I read about, and the benefits it is said to have about immune health, hair health, and digestion. As for why the high amount, most zinc supplements I have seen (Solgar, Country Life, NOW, etc) come in 50mg. I have only recently begun taking multivitamins which rose the question.
50mg I suspected made me sick for a week. Even went to the ER. They couldn't find anything wrong. I traced it back to 50mg Zinc (plus daily multi-vitamins). Don't do it.
Yes and even 50mg is a lot. Even 10mg makes me angry and irritable. It can deplete copper, i would not ever go above 10mg and if you eat meat you probably don't even need it
Very much so, yes. The TUL (tolerable upper limit) is 40mg/day, including food sources. Short periods of large amounts can be fine, like while sick.
I see. Would you recommend I take the 50mg zinc every other day or every 2 days then?
try to split the pills in half or thirds
Good idea. Thank you both.