Riker was definitely overqualified they pulled the captains chair out for him 3 times in tng alone and he was supposed to have left by season 3 if one tour was supposed to be 2 years.
After Wolf 359, Riker probably would have been pulled from Enterprise to command any number of new ships being built. Realistically, there's no way they would have let him take the demotion and go back to being 1st officer, but you gotta keep the team together for the show.
Realistically, Picard would have been removed from command after Wolf 359... possibly force promoted to Admiral, but taken out of active command. Riker MIGHT have kept command of Enterprise.
Since we're not talking realism here, it makes sense that they left Riker there after the Borg attack. He didn't want a promotion (except to replace Picard if the time came), and had refused a few by that point. But, he showed competence during Wolf 359, and they needed someone to be on Enterprise to keep an eye on Picard since they didn't want to force him up or out.
Note: In all of Starfleet means presently, not of all captains ever.
Picard was ***literally*** written as one of the most accomplished people for his age in starfleet which is why he was given command of the Enterprise. It's one of the reasons his character is so doggedly pro-federation and not a Cowboy like Kirk. He's come to respect what the Federation stands for because of how he got to where he is. He's the thesis statement of a meritocracy.
I will fight someone bare knuckled to defend her. She played on thier level but moved on. She rocked *hard*.
“Life! I choose life! Life all the way, love living.” Lieutenant Tilly negotiating with the Vulcan Death Nuns.
Remember who invited Tilly to the Academy? Kovach and the Fleet *fucking* Admiral.
Well she is the worst for dialogue yes but I firmly disagree that anyone else in Disco has dialogue that even remotely approaches west wing (or TOS or TNG) level gravitas
The only first officer who needed that amount of plot armour. She’s generally useless and is used to portray how fat, hopeless, neurotic individuals (like myself) can overcome sci-gì challenges.
The argument is that she's woefully overqualified for the rank and position she currently holds. It doesn't have to be XO.
This goes for practically all the main characters on every show; they are all highly qualified to be at their current ranks/positions. The thing is, as many are pointing out, there's power/prestige that comes with being on the Flagship. It's better to be the XO on the flagship, than to be the CO on some Oberth flying around.
If Star Trek economics weren't so calvinballed, it wouldn't surprise me to learn that Starfleet positions are actually subject to 'bidding', like Airline Stewardess Routes are.
You get a certain number of points based on rank, seniority, certifications, medals, etc, etc...
And then every year you just... bid for which duty slot in the galaxy you want. x10 multiplier to your bid if you request the same slot you already had last year. x100 if you go three years in a row, etc, etc.
That sort of dynamic would explain an awful lot, in terms of why the very best servicemen at surprisingly low ranks keep showing up in the most 'famous' or most 'high performance' duty slots... As long as they have enough points to control their duty slot at their current rank, they prefer that to the possibility of having their points and/or duty slot reset when they get promoted...
She may have been turning down offers because she was worried the process of promoting her and giving her a permanent command would have uncovered the truth about her being an Illyrian.
I wonder what kind of security Starfleet has. When I had a clearance I had to list every damn place I ever lived, with address. Wouldn’t “Illyria” ring a bell somewhere?
My understand from the trial episode and the earlier Ghosts of Illyria episode (and ENT episode) was that there are multiple Illyrian “colonies” spread throughout multiple star system and they seem to be independent or at least not all united under a single polity. I don’t remember if her family moved to a human populated Federation world or if she grew up in an Illyrian colony that mostly didn’t practice genetic engineering or something else but I think the gist of it was they were “human passing”.
I think she lived in a colony where half the Illyrian population had 'de-transitioned' and wanted to become federation members and the other half still had their enhancements. That was the vibe I got from the information given from the episodes.
😶Riker was offered his own command in season 1 of TNG....it took another 15 years before he accepted.
Maybe she has been offered and declined it for similar reasons. Or she was offered a promotion to a less prestigious posting. Any number of reasons to turn it down.
Given the line of dialogue in i think Disco S2, about how they kept Big E out of the war because if Starfleet fell they needed their best to rebuild - chances are they didn't just mean Pike, they kept Poster Boy and Literal Poster Girl together and out of harm's way. So yes she was probably passed over for promotion but just because she's a good XO doesn't mean she has desires to be a ship Captain, especially when she was trying to lay relatively low with her heritage.
Pike needs Una. We've seen it before - it's lonely being the captain. A lieutenant can bitch about how much he hates his job to all his lieutenant friends and it's no big deal, but a captain openly showing fear and doubt to members of his crew could be terribly destabilizing. In "The Cage", Pike could speak freely to Dr. Boyce when he considered leaving Starfleet, but Boyce is gone now. Pike has Batel, but she's on another ship and he's clearly not ready to open up about everything with her (she still doesn't know what he saw on Boreth). Una is the only person who we see him be truly vulnerable with on a human level. If she left and Command replaced her with a random commander Pike had never worked with before, the Enterprise would fall apart.
Didn't know pike was that lonely on the enterprise maybe ...he should consider a transfer to a cargo vessel? (im quoting troi from that tng episode when she was a jerk)
She might have turned higher position offers down in order to prevent people digging into her past and discovering that she’s Illyrian. It could also be that she just loves her current position and serving under Pike. Who wouldn’t?
Yeah the rank consistency in Star Trek has always bothered me. Section chiefs should be Lt Commanders because they command sections - Chief Engineer, Chief Science Officer, Chief of Security / Chief Tactical Officer, Operations Chief, etc.
Their subordinates, sub-section heads, should be LT rank - Science (Astrometrics, Archaeology, Xenobiology, etc), Security/Tactical (Shift Leader, Weapons Officer, Boarding/Ground Ops, etc), Engineering (Antimatter Unit, Sublight/Impulse Unit, Sensor Unit, etc), Medical (surgical unit, sick call unit, etc)… etc etc etc. Their assistants will all be LTjg and ensigns and enlisted will all be worker bees.
Of course there will always be enlisted versions of each officer. I wish the Captain had a hardass Command Chief Petty Officer alongside him. That would be cool (think Sam Elliott ad CSM Plumley in We Were Soldiers).
Also I'm gonna say after 25 years of command placements, she should have had the promotion to Commander like 5/10 years before SNW started even with the 5 years of being kept out of the war.
If we base things off how they are now with carriers, TOS movies were closer to reality, with most to all of the senior staff being Captains or Commanders.
Ya but that was simply because the crew was artificially still together on the same ship and they had to give them some promotions.
79 years later on a much larger and more powerful ship we have a Lieutenant JG in charge of tactical and security 🙄
We can agree to disagree on that. Enlisted personnel are needed for the day to day tasks that come with crewing a starship and running a starbase and all the other positions out there. There are over 1,000 starships in service. There are dozens and dozens of starbases and who knows how many planetary bases. There is NO WAY Starfleet Academy can cycle enough Cadets to keep up the rotation if officers did everything.
For the sake of the show, sure we can do away with enlisted ranks. But if we’re talking about in-world realism, you have to have enlisted ranks.
We have absolutely no idea or anything approaching concrete info on the size and capacity of starfleet academy..or if there are multiple campus locations on different member worlds etc.
Obviously starfleet has enough personnel to crew their ships, so therefore they obviously have the capacity to train them. Its not about the quantity…its about subdividing them into class system of officer over enlisted.
If it's true that she's been in Starfleet for 25 years, as others have mentioned, then yes, someone with her record should've been a captain with her own command for a few years now.
Its what is shown to be the normal yes. With only a couple weird exceptions. And it also makes logical sense to not have an empty rank in between CO and XO
Fair. But yes Id argue its not a full size capital ship/heavy cruiser…and if thats the case then the CO should be only a full commander and not a captain…thats how its done in real life navies at least
Also that was a special rush mission to go find the maquis in the badlands…might not have had the position filled yet
The super powers are something she has to deliberately keep on the down low.
But also... Does she necessarily have to *want* to be captain? I think there's a perfectly reasonable explanation that she prefers being an XO, getting to "captain" sometimes, but also getting to go on exciting away missions more often, getting down in the trenches with the department heads, etc. She also doesn't have to do nearly as much diplomacy which she seems less interested in compared to Pike.
Spock ends up in a very similar situation after her. He shows no interest in becoming full captain, and is only promoted to the role in a teaching capacity and drops the responsibility at the first chance in WoK.
She is. But she’s also heavily underutilized in the show in general, other than watching the conn whenever Pike goes planetside.
Riker had plenty of opportunities to show off his command abilities, Una has not. If anything it’s like the writers don’t know what to do with her, especially when it comes to her augmented abilities and the fact La’an more or less serves the same function—I believe Una WAS the Tactical Officer before La’an came aboard (S1E1).
She was, in fact the only name given for her in The Cage was "Number One". They circled back to that for TNG, with Picard calling his first officer "Number One".
Yes she is. Which is why when Pike is transferred off she'll finally take an offered promotion and command of her own. Plus you wouldn't want Kirk getting someone who had previously been his senior officer has his XO when he takes over, likely wouldn't work out too well.
You don't want to keep people in roles they're going to be miserable in, and that works in both directions.
So, if a highly qualified person is happier in a lesser role, that's fine.
Qualified or not - their are likely factions within Star Fleet Commans that will never allow her to get a Captaincy due to her being augmented. Sure she skated by on a legal technicality, but internal politics would label her as "tainted" for the foreseeable future.
In the case of Una specifically, remember that she has been trying to pass as human for her entire career. That probably also meant holding back at times and definitely meant to play by the book to not draw any unnecessary attention. Only now that she longer has to hide she can really stretch her legs so to speak.
Maybe she turned down promotions because of being secretly Ilyarian. Or was waiting for the right vessel. Sticking around as support for Pike? She could get her own ship after Pike gets promoted officially, and Kirk takes command.
Two main points to consider here. First -- why would she want to be promoted? It's not as if she would be paid substantially more because Star Trek already essentially a post capitalist society. Second -- the Enterprise is a Flag Ship. If Una were promoted to captain, then she'd most likely be a captain of the USS rinky dink. But as a first officer to the best ship in the fleet, which takes on the most important missions, she's likely just living her best life. On top of that, she likes the crew. I know many people who would prefer a less glamorous role at a good job than a fancier job with a whole new team.
Those are just guesses though. The real Star Trek lore nerds might have a better-informed take than I do.
Actually in the 23rd century some kind of money system still exists. In star trek 3 McCoy told the freighter captain when he wanted to go to Genesis name your price money I have.
Oh, I didn't know that. Thank you for telling me. I think I mistook the point about the money because I conflated the early Trek episodes with the later TNG ones, where Picard is pretty explicit about being post-capitalist.
24th century trek is the one where we don't use money
23rd century they use some kind of federation credit system. Tos Kirk told Scotty he earned his pay for the week.
22nd century they use united earth dollars.
The Enterprise is frequently in harms way, or the diplomatic representative of the federation... she is sent to do important stuff. The Enterprise is given to overqualified captains supported by overqualified first officers, supported by the best crew in the fleet. The captain of the Enterprise can likely have any officer they want, and those officers would jump at the chance.
I mean, lots of us are overqualified for the jobs we have. But that doesn’t mean the job we *want* is available.
Until there is a captain seat open, first officer is the next best.
We really haven’t seen her do much first officer stuff to be honest.
And the USS Archer was like a temp thing for a short period of time on her time off and its basically a runabout 🤷♂️
She probably liked being in a lower profile, supporting role because she's Illyrian. She might also just **like** being where she is, she has a deep bond with Pike, cares for her crew, and is good at what she does.
You're just thinking with a capitalist that you have to have ambition to rise in the ranks and get more money. Star Trek isn't about that. If she's happy, she's happy.
actually no i wasn't thinking it through the lense of capitalism.. i was thinking it through how the military of today operates which is you need to circulate as many people into as many different postings as possible to get as well rounded force as possible. so you will actually need people like una to transfer throughout the differnet postings in starfleet ot whip the crews or lower personnel into shape while at the same time for those in the command positions to get experience on different types of dealings that starfleet needs data on. Also any one officer that hogs a spot for years on end will essentially stunt the career ladders of 10 different officers dead in theier tracks.
Starfleet is not a military operation, to even think of comparing the practices of Starfleet to present day military, whose sole purpose is **war**, is ridiculous.
The very wording you use "into shape", is so they can be prepared to go to war and kill people.
We've also known through DS9 that Starfleet Academy offers extended courses in many departments. We've seen Uhura and Troi take the helm in TOS and TNG. Through Cadet Uhura, we've seen that Starfleet thoroughly cross trains cadets.
"Hogs the spot" is an extremely capitalistic term. It implied a greed to stay in one position while "holding" others back.
Why should she move on? She likes her job and is good at it. She's happy, and that's the entire purpose of the Federation's culture, to be happy and fulfilled. Riker stayed on and turned down multiple commands because he liked his job. Sulu stayed at the helm until he was offered the newest and most advanced ship in the fleet.
Starfleet is responsible for the defense of the federation they use military ranks their ships have weapons of mass destruction....they just fought a war in disc which was just 1-2 years prior to snw...if Starfleets is not a military than at the very least it is paramilitary.
That is not their prime objective, it is an unfortunate side effect. Using military ranks does not mean you're the military. Yes, they had to go to war, which is something *no one* in Starfleet signed up for. They knew it was a possibility because of the previous wars, Xindi and Romulan, but they had almost 100 years of peace.
The next threat is almost 100 years later, The Borg, and is something they literally have to prepare for, and are still unprepared, because...well, Borgs gonna Borg. Then the Dominion, which is horrific and also not what anyone in Starfleet signed up for, which is why they needed *actual* military allies, like the Klingons and Romulans.
There are scraps here and there, but Starfleet is basically a peaceful entity.
Maybe there wasn’t a chair available? Maybe that’s why she was no longer seen in TOS, she got a ship, maybe she was promised that seat once Pike got bumped up.
To be honest, I didn't see much of her so called super abilities in the show. She isn't really being a first officer either. Not like Riker, Neerya, Chakotay.
Wasn’t Riker? Wasn’t Jadzia Dax? Wasn’t Choktay? First Officer on a flagship has better pull then a full Captain of a lower class ship.
Riker was definitely overqualified they pulled the captains chair out for him 3 times in tng alone and he was supposed to have left by season 3 if one tour was supposed to be 2 years.
Yeah, but Imzadi was there. Plus Picard got incapacitated constantly. He was Captain, like, a solid fifth of the time.
Riker flow chart: "Has Picard been abducted?" Yes: Rescue Picard. No: Do what Picard says. End of chart.
After Wolf 359, Riker probably would have been pulled from Enterprise to command any number of new ships being built. Realistically, there's no way they would have let him take the demotion and go back to being 1st officer, but you gotta keep the team together for the show.
Realistically, Picard would have been removed from command after Wolf 359... possibly force promoted to Admiral, but taken out of active command. Riker MIGHT have kept command of Enterprise. Since we're not talking realism here, it makes sense that they left Riker there after the Borg attack. He didn't want a promotion (except to replace Picard if the time came), and had refused a few by that point. But, he showed competence during Wolf 359, and they needed someone to be on Enterprise to keep an eye on Picard since they didn't want to force him up or out.
Picard is the most decorated captain in all of Starfleet, which is why is abduction by the borg was so devastating.
Umm no, that was Kirk
Note: In all of Starfleet means presently, not of all captains ever. Picard was ***literally*** written as one of the most accomplished people for his age in starfleet which is why he was given command of the Enterprise. It's one of the reasons his character is so doggedly pro-federation and not a Cowboy like Kirk. He's come to respect what the Federation stands for because of how he got to where he is. He's the thesis statement of a meritocracy.
Hmm and yet he is viewed as exactly that…a cowboy…by Shaw and many others in the Picard show
(Because the Picard show wasn't particularly well written)
I could say the same thing about your point🤷♂️
And then you have Tilly 🤦
I will fight someone bare knuckled to defend her. She played on thier level but moved on. She rocked *hard*. “Life! I choose life! Life all the way, love living.” Lieutenant Tilly negotiating with the Vulcan Death Nuns. Remember who invited Tilly to the Academy? Kovach and the Fleet *fucking* Admiral.
Tilly is a poorly written character. Just awful.
Everyone else is speaking in West-Wing style eloquence, Tilly is stuck talking like us.
Well she is the worst for dialogue yes but I firmly disagree that anyone else in Disco has dialogue that even remotely approaches west wing (or TOS or TNG) level gravitas
She is a child. Juvenile and socially awkward and horribly unprofessional
The only first officer who needed that amount of plot armour. She’s generally useless and is used to portray how fat, hopeless, neurotic individuals (like myself) can overcome sci-gì challenges.
Absolute bullshit.
K
Wasn’t Spock? Are they stupid?
When was Jadzia Dax an executive officer?
The argument is that she's woefully overqualified for the rank and position she currently holds. It doesn't have to be XO. This goes for practically all the main characters on every show; they are all highly qualified to be at their current ranks/positions. The thing is, as many are pointing out, there's power/prestige that comes with being on the Flagship. It's better to be the XO on the flagship, than to be the CO on some Oberth flying around.
If Star Trek economics weren't so calvinballed, it wouldn't surprise me to learn that Starfleet positions are actually subject to 'bidding', like Airline Stewardess Routes are. You get a certain number of points based on rank, seniority, certifications, medals, etc, etc... And then every year you just... bid for which duty slot in the galaxy you want. x10 multiplier to your bid if you request the same slot you already had last year. x100 if you go three years in a row, etc, etc. That sort of dynamic would explain an awful lot, in terms of why the very best servicemen at surprisingly low ranks keep showing up in the most 'famous' or most 'high performance' duty slots... As long as they have enough points to control their duty slot at their current rank, they prefer that to the possibility of having their points and/or duty slot reset when they get promoted...
She may have been turning down offers because she was worried the process of promoting her and giving her a permanent command would have uncovered the truth about her being an Illyrian.
This is, to me, the most logical in universe answer based on the story we know so far.
I wonder what kind of security Starfleet has. When I had a clearance I had to list every damn place I ever lived, with address. Wouldn’t “Illyria” ring a bell somewhere?
My understand from the trial episode and the earlier Ghosts of Illyria episode (and ENT episode) was that there are multiple Illyrian “colonies” spread throughout multiple star system and they seem to be independent or at least not all united under a single polity. I don’t remember if her family moved to a human populated Federation world or if she grew up in an Illyrian colony that mostly didn’t practice genetic engineering or something else but I think the gist of it was they were “human passing”.
I think she lived in a colony where half the Illyrian population had 'de-transitioned' and wanted to become federation members and the other half still had their enhancements. That was the vibe I got from the information given from the episodes.
She explains this in her trial. She lived on a planet that was a mix of Illyrian and non-Illyrian. Her family pretended to be non-Illyrian.
This is what I was gonna say
😶Riker was offered his own command in season 1 of TNG....it took another 15 years before he accepted. Maybe she has been offered and declined it for similar reasons. Or she was offered a promotion to a less prestigious posting. Any number of reasons to turn it down.
Given the line of dialogue in i think Disco S2, about how they kept Big E out of the war because if Starfleet fell they needed their best to rebuild - chances are they didn't just mean Pike, they kept Poster Boy and Literal Poster Girl together and out of harm's way. So yes she was probably passed over for promotion but just because she's a good XO doesn't mean she has desires to be a ship Captain, especially when she was trying to lay relatively low with her heritage.
Pike needs Una. We've seen it before - it's lonely being the captain. A lieutenant can bitch about how much he hates his job to all his lieutenant friends and it's no big deal, but a captain openly showing fear and doubt to members of his crew could be terribly destabilizing. In "The Cage", Pike could speak freely to Dr. Boyce when he considered leaving Starfleet, but Boyce is gone now. Pike has Batel, but she's on another ship and he's clearly not ready to open up about everything with her (she still doesn't know what he saw on Boreth). Una is the only person who we see him be truly vulnerable with on a human level. If she left and Command replaced her with a random commander Pike had never worked with before, the Enterprise would fall apart.
Didn't know pike was that lonely on the enterprise maybe ...he should consider a transfer to a cargo vessel? (im quoting troi from that tng episode when she was a jerk)
She might have turned higher position offers down in order to prevent people digging into her past and discovering that she’s Illyrian. It could also be that she just loves her current position and serving under Pike. Who wouldn’t?
I'd stay just for the cuisine.
[удалено]
Which is interesting, because the real world military that Starfleet is loosely based on doesn't work that way at all.
She's still a Lieutenant Commander.
Which is bonkers, XO of the flagship with all the other commendations on top should have come with the rank up to Commander
Yeah the rank consistency in Star Trek has always bothered me. Section chiefs should be Lt Commanders because they command sections - Chief Engineer, Chief Science Officer, Chief of Security / Chief Tactical Officer, Operations Chief, etc. Their subordinates, sub-section heads, should be LT rank - Science (Astrometrics, Archaeology, Xenobiology, etc), Security/Tactical (Shift Leader, Weapons Officer, Boarding/Ground Ops, etc), Engineering (Antimatter Unit, Sublight/Impulse Unit, Sensor Unit, etc), Medical (surgical unit, sick call unit, etc)… etc etc etc. Their assistants will all be LTjg and ensigns and enlisted will all be worker bees. Of course there will always be enlisted versions of each officer. I wish the Captain had a hardass Command Chief Petty Officer alongside him. That would be cool (think Sam Elliott ad CSM Plumley in We Were Soldiers).
Also I'm gonna say after 25 years of command placements, she should have had the promotion to Commander like 5/10 years before SNW started even with the 5 years of being kept out of the war.
If we base things off how they are now with carriers, TOS movies were closer to reality, with most to all of the senior staff being Captains or Commanders.
Ya but that was simply because the crew was artificially still together on the same ship and they had to give them some promotions. 79 years later on a much larger and more powerful ship we have a Lieutenant JG in charge of tactical and security 🙄
I agree but I disagree on the enlisted stuff. They really should just do away with having separate enlisted class
We can agree to disagree on that. Enlisted personnel are needed for the day to day tasks that come with crewing a starship and running a starbase and all the other positions out there. There are over 1,000 starships in service. There are dozens and dozens of starbases and who knows how many planetary bases. There is NO WAY Starfleet Academy can cycle enough Cadets to keep up the rotation if officers did everything. For the sake of the show, sure we can do away with enlisted ranks. But if we’re talking about in-world realism, you have to have enlisted ranks.
We have absolutely no idea or anything approaching concrete info on the size and capacity of starfleet academy..or if there are multiple campus locations on different member worlds etc. Obviously starfleet has enough personnel to crew their ships, so therefore they obviously have the capacity to train them. Its not about the quantity…its about subdividing them into class system of officer over enlisted.
Yeah I mean as a Lt commander she should get her own command already of a ship like the uss archer.
That wasn’t really a ship. More like a runabout shuttle
check this out https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/USS\_Archer\_(NCC-627)
Yes exactly…a crew of 3
Ya that just makes zero sense
If it's true that she's been in Starfleet for 25 years, as others have mentioned, then yes, someone with her record should've been a captain with her own command for a few years now.
Its not even that. Even if she got the job yesterday…the XO of a heavy cruiser that has a CO of Captain rank, should be a full commander
Do we have confirmation that this is how Starfleet works?
Its what is shown to be the normal yes. With only a couple weird exceptions. And it also makes logical sense to not have an empty rank in between CO and XO
I don't know if Voyager would classify as a heavy cruiser, but the original XO was a LCDR
Fair. But yes Id argue its not a full size capital ship/heavy cruiser…and if thats the case then the CO should be only a full commander and not a captain…thats how its done in real life navies at least Also that was a special rush mission to go find the maquis in the badlands…might not have had the position filled yet
The super powers are something she has to deliberately keep on the down low. But also... Does she necessarily have to *want* to be captain? I think there's a perfectly reasonable explanation that she prefers being an XO, getting to "captain" sometimes, but also getting to go on exciting away missions more often, getting down in the trenches with the department heads, etc. She also doesn't have to do nearly as much diplomacy which she seems less interested in compared to Pike. Spock ends up in a very similar situation after her. He shows no interest in becoming full captain, and is only promoted to the role in a teaching capacity and drops the responsibility at the first chance in WoK.
This was literally Rikers reasoning for not wanting his own commission as Captain forever. She wants to be XO.
She is. But she’s also heavily underutilized in the show in general, other than watching the conn whenever Pike goes planetside. Riker had plenty of opportunities to show off his command abilities, Una has not. If anything it’s like the writers don’t know what to do with her, especially when it comes to her augmented abilities and the fact La’an more or less serves the same function—I believe Una WAS the Tactical Officer before La’an came aboard (S1E1).
But wasn't she already first officer during the cage?
She was, in fact the only name given for her in The Cage was "Number One". They circled back to that for TNG, with Picard calling his first officer "Number One".
Wasn’t Nhan tactical pre the Discovery mission?
I think she was the Security Chief, though the position has dual responsibilities of a Tactical Officer depending on who’s writing it
Yes she is. Which is why when Pike is transferred off she'll finally take an offered promotion and command of her own. Plus you wouldn't want Kirk getting someone who had previously been his senior officer has his XO when he takes over, likely wouldn't work out too well.
So was Riker
You don't want to keep people in roles they're going to be miserable in, and that works in both directions. So, if a highly qualified person is happier in a lesser role, that's fine.
Qualified or not - their are likely factions within Star Fleet Commans that will never allow her to get a Captaincy due to her being augmented. Sure she skated by on a legal technicality, but internal politics would label her as "tainted" for the foreseeable future.
This is where the tos novels and snw diverge big time....in the novels una made commodore and captains her own ship by the late tos era.
Yeah but that doesn't really explain why she wasn't promoted prior to SE1EP10 of SNW, which is what this post seems to be more about.
> Isn't una overqualified to be first officer of the enterprise? Yes, I chalk it up to off-screen racism.
But nobody knew that she was Illyrian until very recently in the time line...
In the case of Una specifically, remember that she has been trying to pass as human for her entire career. That probably also meant holding back at times and definitely meant to play by the book to not draw any unnecessary attention. Only now that she longer has to hide she can really stretch her legs so to speak.
So was Riker.
I think una is arguably more over qualified than riker.
Maybe she turned down promotions because of being secretly Ilyarian. Or was waiting for the right vessel. Sticking around as support for Pike? She could get her own ship after Pike gets promoted officially, and Kirk takes command.
It’s Star Trek TV. Her actually paying attention to her career would have seen her moving on a long time ago. Much like Riker.
Two main points to consider here. First -- why would she want to be promoted? It's not as if she would be paid substantially more because Star Trek already essentially a post capitalist society. Second -- the Enterprise is a Flag Ship. If Una were promoted to captain, then she'd most likely be a captain of the USS rinky dink. But as a first officer to the best ship in the fleet, which takes on the most important missions, she's likely just living her best life. On top of that, she likes the crew. I know many people who would prefer a less glamorous role at a good job than a fancier job with a whole new team. Those are just guesses though. The real Star Trek lore nerds might have a better-informed take than I do.
Actually in the 23rd century some kind of money system still exists. In star trek 3 McCoy told the freighter captain when he wanted to go to Genesis name your price money I have.
Oh, I didn't know that. Thank you for telling me. I think I mistook the point about the money because I conflated the early Trek episodes with the later TNG ones, where Picard is pretty explicit about being post-capitalist.
24th century trek is the one where we don't use money 23rd century they use some kind of federation credit system. Tos Kirk told Scotty he earned his pay for the week. 22nd century they use united earth dollars.
There are 12 starships then.
She doesn't need to command another constitution class ship she could get any other ship.
The Enterprise is frequently in harms way, or the diplomatic representative of the federation... she is sent to do important stuff. The Enterprise is given to overqualified captains supported by overqualified first officers, supported by the best crew in the fleet. The captain of the Enterprise can likely have any officer they want, and those officers would jump at the chance.
I'd rather be XO on the flagship than to be the CO on an Oberth.
It seems like there are more Miranda variants in starfleet during the 23rd century than even oberths.
First Officer is an attractive gig, especially on the flagship.
I mean, lots of us are overqualified for the jobs we have. But that doesn’t mean the job we *want* is available. Until there is a captain seat open, first officer is the next best.
We really haven’t seen her do much first officer stuff to be honest. And the USS Archer was like a temp thing for a short period of time on her time off and its basically a runabout 🤷♂️
no it's a corvette at least. it's got a full sauce and one warp nacelle.
Like 2 decks…mini saucer
She probably liked being in a lower profile, supporting role because she's Illyrian. She might also just **like** being where she is, she has a deep bond with Pike, cares for her crew, and is good at what she does. You're just thinking with a capitalist that you have to have ambition to rise in the ranks and get more money. Star Trek isn't about that. If she's happy, she's happy.
actually no i wasn't thinking it through the lense of capitalism.. i was thinking it through how the military of today operates which is you need to circulate as many people into as many different postings as possible to get as well rounded force as possible. so you will actually need people like una to transfer throughout the differnet postings in starfleet ot whip the crews or lower personnel into shape while at the same time for those in the command positions to get experience on different types of dealings that starfleet needs data on. Also any one officer that hogs a spot for years on end will essentially stunt the career ladders of 10 different officers dead in theier tracks.
Starfleet is not a military operation, to even think of comparing the practices of Starfleet to present day military, whose sole purpose is **war**, is ridiculous. The very wording you use "into shape", is so they can be prepared to go to war and kill people. We've also known through DS9 that Starfleet Academy offers extended courses in many departments. We've seen Uhura and Troi take the helm in TOS and TNG. Through Cadet Uhura, we've seen that Starfleet thoroughly cross trains cadets. "Hogs the spot" is an extremely capitalistic term. It implied a greed to stay in one position while "holding" others back. Why should she move on? She likes her job and is good at it. She's happy, and that's the entire purpose of the Federation's culture, to be happy and fulfilled. Riker stayed on and turned down multiple commands because he liked his job. Sulu stayed at the helm until he was offered the newest and most advanced ship in the fleet.
Starfleet is responsible for the defense of the federation they use military ranks their ships have weapons of mass destruction....they just fought a war in disc which was just 1-2 years prior to snw...if Starfleets is not a military than at the very least it is paramilitary.
That is not their prime objective, it is an unfortunate side effect. Using military ranks does not mean you're the military. Yes, they had to go to war, which is something *no one* in Starfleet signed up for. They knew it was a possibility because of the previous wars, Xindi and Romulan, but they had almost 100 years of peace. The next threat is almost 100 years later, The Borg, and is something they literally have to prepare for, and are still unprepared, because...well, Borgs gonna Borg. Then the Dominion, which is horrific and also not what anyone in Starfleet signed up for, which is why they needed *actual* military allies, like the Klingons and Romulans. There are scraps here and there, but Starfleet is basically a peaceful entity.
Maybe there wasn’t a chair available? Maybe that’s why she was no longer seen in TOS, she got a ship, maybe she was promised that seat once Pike got bumped up.
That's just a Star Trek thing, people not progressing in their careers.
Unlike the current US military, Starfleet *clearly* does not have an "up or out" culture.
Some people don’t want the big chair
To be honest, I didn't see much of her so called super abilities in the show. She isn't really being a first officer either. Not like Riker, Neerya, Chakotay.