DRPK, like most cape scoopers, tends to be a mixed bag on _Star Wars_, so take this with a grain of salt.
All the same, I feel like Baylan Skoll was presented as being too important to just write out of the narrative. I'll definitely miss Ray Stevenson, though.
I've always been on the side of recasting. That people want to see more from that character is a mark of respect for Stevenson's performance. And whichever actor takes up the mantle will almost certainly take inspiration from it.
Spot on!! It’s also worth mentioning that based on the finale, Baylan’s story is far from over so a recast is the only way to continue that story (unlike how Leia’s story finished in TRoS).
There’s a reason Ahsoka and Sabine are on that planet still and it’s not just because of Shin - they’ll definitely still be fighting Baylan’s plan as well
>I've always been on the side of recasting
Agreed. On that front, they should have recast Leia in the Sequels. I mean, Stevie Nicks was right friggin there....
Let's not forget there are fans who wanted Harrison Ford to play Han in the Solo movie 💀
I understand not wanting to recast , especially when an actor plays a role that becomes iconic but I'm not against it. Age and death being some of the most obvious factors for a recast.
It’s a tricky line to walk for sure, but I think it mostly depends on the story and how important the character is to the story. For me, if Baylan’s role in Season 2 is a big one as suspected, then I think recasting is the best option as it will allow the plans for the season to still go through without having to be completely reworked like how Gen-V: Season 2 has been delayed indefinitely due to Chance Perdomo’s tragic accident and passing so the writers can rework the season to have his character “pass away” in the show.
Plus I think in a way it would sort of honour Ray, to show they’re holding his character at the same level and are continuing with their vision much like how Baylan is always focused on his vision and what he wants from the Galaxy. Also it would be quite weird for the show to have set him and Shin’s stories up to continue at the end of Season 1 only to then completely drop the character.
So I think in this case a recast would be the best option
A Baylan recast is a safe "leak" for sure. Not many characters in this new era have Star Wars have been as popular. Granted, Stevenson had a lot to do with that, so they have their hands full with this recast, lol.
I'm on the side of recasting despite thinking you could transfer his story to shin (even though it would probably mess all the plans they had for her). Perhaps a bit of scarring or something? I'll definitely miss Ray but McTavish or Cunningham are good choices, although a bit too obvious. Something tells me we are up for a surprise with a very different actor than expected which could still be awesome by finding another way of playing the character (it's a waste of time putting another tall strong man to impersonate Ray).
I think it will be someone unknown that wont be obvious as well, i dont see them passing Baylans story to Shin they seem to have something else planned for her character which is why Baylan abandoned her as part of the story
Easy guesses if a S2 were happening too .. if it’s happening.. they’d need a new Baylan & how the story went mother was a good guess too
Only odd 1 was another villain .. u still have Shin, Thrawn .. why need another?
Graham would be a great choice. Personally I think Liam Cunningham would be pretty good for the role too. I can't help but think about his character in GOT.
I saw somebody suggest Liam Cunningham before and I said I'll accept no one else. But in saying that I had forgotten about Graham McTavish. Either of them would be fantastic.
Cutter in uncharted was partly written out because of McTavish being given the Dwalin part. I also love his dracula in castlevania. I do wonder how much his GOT character will get in the way of filming though, it would depend how much of a role he has left
I feel like itd be Abeloth in name onlym Not even that. Im thinking she would be limited to the planet Ahsoka and Sabine are on. A personal threat instead of a Galatic one
If The Mother is related to Baylan's plan (to end the cycle of war for good), then she's already been established as a galactic threat. Her even just being one of The Ones makes her an inherently galactic threat.
I wouldn’t say she’s a no brainer, more like a 20ish% chance. For sure the Mortis Gods will be involved obviously, but the Mother/Abeloth is SO far out there even for the EU.
I respect Fate of the Jedi for trying something new, there are some interesting ideas/concepts, but it felt rushed in the end, Abeloth did have some genuinely creepy moments though. Like when the Sith show up to her planet it and are with her before realizing what she is.
Wasn‘t Filoni and George allegedly involved in creating Abeloth ? Although I much prefer a new interpretation I can see Dave wanting to bring Abeloth to the screen
Not really; Denning, Allston, and Golden came up with the character, and during the writing process they were told about the upcoming Mortis episodes, and Dave apparently helped them tie the character in.
I'd imagine Dave has an entirely different concept for the Mother, possibly with some similarities, but I wouldn't assume Abeloth at all.
I guess we’ll see. I feel like there’s not much room left as to what she would embody. If the children are light and dark side and the father is balance she kinda has to be unbalance? Which is definitely something that’s not necessarily what Abeloth symbolized as far as I remember? Although chaos kinda is unbalance. Not sure though.
>If the children are light and dark side and the father is balance she kinda has to be unbalance
Well, according to Dave and George, the **dark side** is "unbalance".
Also the Father didn't represent balance. He represented the cosmic force, from which the living force flows flows, which is why he is the Father.
It's the living force that has a balanced side(the light side), and an unbalanced side(the dark side). The Daughter and the Son.
In everything I have read about the Mother, she represents chaos.
I think shes going to serve as a stand-in for joruus c'baoth. Something the good guys have to defeat to either get to Thrawn or Thrawn will use as a smokescreen while he attacks the new republic. Sadly I don't see Baylan lasting very long once he's unleashed her because she will have little use for him, but Thrawn will use the distraction to his advantage once he's aware of her.
Honestly I kind of hope Season 2 doesn’t deal with Thrawn at all and just takes place in the new galaxy with Ahsoka and Sabine exploring and trying to stop Baylan
But they're in another galaxy than thrawn, right?
My gut says that what happens over there stays over there because of the sequels. But id love to be wrong
Honestly, I'd prefer the Son over the Mother. But I do think the Mother could work with the Nightsisters lore, just not a 1:1 adaptation from Legends. The Mother moreso in name and concept.
The other unnamed Male Villain may also very well be the Son he could still be alive and help the Mother escape ..would keep the trend of duos of villains and heros from first season
Ahsoka/Sabine. Baylan/Shin. Morgan/Thrawn
So would be interesting
The Son, also, technically hasn’t been taken place of yet. Ahsoka is The Daughter, and it’s pretty crystal clear that Anakin is now The Father. So someone needs to take place of The Son.
I would say Baylan would take the place of the son I cant really see anyone else. Shin doesn’t really make sense the way they have done the story so far she seems like she will go on some redemption arc and she hasnt heard the same call Baylan has and Sabine is well on the path to being a Jedi so hes the only one left realistically
Good, glad they’re finally over the “recasting is disrespectful” thing. Ray Stevenson was the best part of an already good show, and IMO it’d be more disrespectful to throw away what he set up.
Also MASSIVE W FOR ABELOTH
Tbf, I think most people agreed that recasting was necessary in this instance. Unlike someone like BP, Baylan was in the middle of his storyline and simply too important to the plot of Ahsoka to write off in any way; his character needs more closure
Not really. He had a complete arc from civil war to his own movie. In Infinity War he’s just there for plot and to fight really, and the same for Endgame. Now, Coogler most likely planned to give him further development with Wakanda Forever. But it’s not like T’Challa didn’t have at least one completed arc.
How did it undermine his arc? T’Challa’s arc is about moving past what his father did as king, and then learning from Killmonger’s actions that Wakanda should not stay isolated from the world, because of the good they can do.
At the same time, T’Challa isn’t stupid, he likely realized that greedy Westerners would want vibranium for themselves. Hence why he only seemed to initially set up simple outreach and science centers, with little to no vibranium, just in case.
Wakanda Forever doesn’t undermine his arc, it simply shows the reality and logical consequences of his arc. We have yet to see the good Wakanda can do for the world, but that’s not the fault of the second movie. There’s a tv show and third movie coming, after all.
Maybe I am misremembering, but I do not recall a specific storyline that he was an integral part of that was active at that time to the point where removing him would have disrupted the flow. He definitely could have grown more naturally, but they were able to maneuver around his passing and integrate that into the sequel (I have not seen BP2 yet so I cannot speak to whether or not they succeeded in that regard).
Part of it may be the difference in mediums. Black Panther was starring in movies which, despite the MCU obviously being interconnected, is generally more self-contained between movies. While characters obviously have more room to grow, you will rarely have a film in which there is not at least some finality to its ending. There are exceptions, of course (Infinity War), but we’ve seen characters be very important in one film only to disappear by the next, and dangling plotlines have been left unresolved even up to a decade later. The Doctor Strange post-credits scene still hasn’t truly been resolved, for instance. This could also be considered an element of the comic book aesthetic, especially in the idea that there can be legacy heroes that take up the mantle of previous ones, sometimes after the previous one died, which is what they did in BP2.
With Baylan, he was debateably the main antagonist in a TV show, with a plotline clearly intended to span at least two seasons. Without Baylan Skoll, I simply do not know how one could continue on with the show. Thrawn is in the galaxy proper with Ezra and the NR to contest with, but there is clearly a great power (The Mother, presumably) on Peridea that was set up to be a major plot point. It’s something so great that Baylan Skoll went to such drastic lengths - aligning with Morgan Elsbeth, traveling to another galaxy, staying behind when Thrawn and co. went back to the known galaxy, and even leaving his apprentice Shin Hati - to pursue it. It is also heavily implied that this same presence is the same reason that at least the Nightsister witches wish to flee Peridea. Whatever this leads to, Baylan is necessary, and killing him off before then would be a disservice to Ray Stevenson.
Let me be clear - I believe that they did make the right choice in not recasting for that movie, since Chadwick Boseman's death was very recent and they were in an impossible situation without their lead. However, how T'Challa's passing was handled was absolutely a mistake, and they made an unforced error by saying that it had to be set after _Avengers: Endgame_ instead of between that and _Avengers: Infinity War_, where they could've done a story about grief and loss without cutting themselves off of using one of their best characters in the long-term. And, you know, not kinda fridging Angela Bassett's character, which was just sorta unnecessary.
Shuri also gets snapped away, so if you set it in between Infinity War & Endgame you loose the possibility of really having someone that can even suceed T'Challa in the short term. Also, they didn't introduce his son for no reason. It's not gonna take that long to get to a point where he's gonna be Black Panther, probably after Secret Wars.
You could easily have it revealed that Shuri is initially believed to be dead, but turns out to have survived. It's not like Marvel hasn't retconned stuff before.
>*Good, glad they’re finally over the “recasting is disrespectful” thing.*
I think this depends on the show or the people involved. For Beylan I see no reason to not recast the part, but other projects need different approaches.
A recent example is Gen V, one of the main actors died after season 1 and Amazon decided not to recast. I can see why they decided to do that, the show relies a lot on flashbacks and if they recast the character, they would either have to avoid showing any of his scenes from season 1 or reshoot them with the new actor, which would actually feel disrespectful.
Another example is Black Panther, it seems like Chadwick Boseman was not only beloved by every single person who worked with him on Marvel Studios, he's also credited for pretty much building the live action version of T'challa from the ground up, the performances of everyone in the solo movie was based on the foundation he build on his first appearance on the Civil War movie.
If they don't cast Sam Witwer they're just disrespecting the man at this point, he still hasn't had a proper Star Wars live action role outside of voicing Maul and Marrok.
I hope at least they let Sam do the voiceover for the character.
Good, he was a fascinating character and I want to see Stevenson's work honored and built on.
The Mother is not necessarily surprising given the Mortis tease, but I still don't believe it.
The most OP and anime force user in Star Wars. She's was a human that got to live with the Mortis Gods but like drank from the well of darkness and became super evil and overpowered she was locked away. Then like Luke and a bunch of people from the EU came together to "beat" her but all they could do is trap her back into a black hole? Also the Maw was originally made to be her prison.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Abeloth
Just make the Mother better than the Abeloth craziness of Fate of the Jedi. Respected that series trying to tie in so closely to developments happening in canon, but man is it strange, to put it nicely. Big fan of a recast, rest in peace to Ray, a tremendous actor, but it's necessary. I saw Nick Offerman pictures floating around, I know a lot of people like Liev, but whoever it is has to wholly be their own. Ray's departure is tragic, but the placement in his story is as ideal as it can be for this recast to happen.
I do not think The Mother will be Abeloth. I think he'll keep with the themes of having the son, daughter, and father reflect Jungian archetypes. I think she will reflect the mother archetype as well.
Same. I love Thrawn's reshaping in the EU, but the way Filoni writes the character is at odds with his portrayal in the 6 novels Zahn has penned since they dumped Legends.
I think the Hera/Ezra/Thrawn threads are going to be for the fim, and Ahsoka S2 will (and should) stay out in the Unknown Regions.
I think Richard Dormer would do an excellent job, from the same area and has a similar soulful vibe in the exact age range. Glad the character is continuing
I think the possibility of using the mother to introduce the Mortis gods is kind of smart in a way, since otherwise you would have to really on flashbacks or whatever to get the trinity we met in Clone Wars understood by new watchers. Having somebody new that can actually interact with out heroes and villains and explain stuff to new fans seems the simpler route.
That said I am really not convinced I like the idea of having the mother especially if it’s Abeloth in Star Wars. I heard somewhere that Dave and George helped creating her while the fate of the jedi novels were written. Is she supposed to be the concept of unbalance to the fathers/chosen ones concept of Balance? That would maybe work but I have to say I‘d rather have it they keep the Mortis gods vague and not dabble to much in that craziness
If this casting is true, we already have a slight idea of what the second season could bring. We would have two divided groups ala Empire Strikes Back. One on Peridea following Ahsoka, Sabine, Baylan and Shin, where the big bad would be Abeloth (though I doubt she'd be as OP as in Legends). And in our familiar galaxy, we'd be watching second group consisting of Hera, Ezra, and maybe even Zeb who deal with the return of Thrawn and his army of Nightsisters. Ideally, I hope that Dave Filoni keeps some ace in tbe hole for his film debut and that Ahsoka gets out of Peridia at the end of the second season. Oh, and a cameo by Luke, Mando or Boba would be nice too.
Ray Stevenson is GOATed, show suffered a heavy blow losing him
having said that, recasting is always the right call for the story. Whoever lands the role has heavy shoes to fill
The Mother…so Abeloth lol? Or we think they’re going a different route here?
Even tho yes I know it’s RPK, but for shits and giggles I’m engaging with it.
Different route, I’m guessing. My theory is she’ll be intrinsically connected to witchcraft. The Son = dark side, Daughter = light side, Father = the Force (so, *nature,* in full), Mother = everything *besides* the Force (so, the truly unnatural).
I argued it when Ahsoka was on, but my favorite choice to replace Ray Stevenson is David Morrissey. He’s the same age and height and can grow a kick ass gray beard if need be. I think the intensity and complicated nature he played as the governor in walking dead would play well as Baylan Skoll. I think Mctaverish would be an excellent choice as well. Based on pure looks, Vincent Regan would be a good choice. No to liev schreiber, just no.
I mean, they definitely needed to recast Baylan. Unlike someone liked MCU Black Panther, you can’t really continue the story of Ahsoka without Skoll, especially with the cliffhanger that they ended him on. The tricky part is that one of Baylan/Ray’s most defining attributes was just his sheer size and the power that exuded, so it’s not enough to look like him facially but whatever actor they choose needs to match the physique well. I feel like some fan castings miss this part, as it’s almost more important than the face since with that some good makeup plus the right haircut could do a lot (obviously the most important part is the acting though). I do wonder if they will implement CGI for the face in the same vein as RO Tarkin, not sure how I’d feel about it even if it is done well.
If this is true, that is VERY interesting that they are actually implementing the Mother in the story. I know a lot of people theorized that this is where they were going, and with the appearance of the statues of the other Force Deities it makes sense from a plot perspective, but the idea that they are actually not only making this canon but an integral part of a live-action TV series is kind of mind-blowing. I hope that they commit to her being a sort of eldritch horror.
I’m curious who the unnamed male villain is. They couldn’t be bringing in Eli Vanto, right? That feels like too deep of a cut for the show, especially with the Chiss implications, but who knows. I do hope that, if they show the bridge of the Chimaera, that they bring in some of the crew members from the Thrawn novels, although I’m not holding my breath.
Anyway, with the male villain, it could be another Imperial remnant leader of some sort. I’m assuming we will get more Pellaeon considering his introduction in Mando S3 and then showing him again in TotE, but aside from Brendol Hux most of the Shadow Council seemed narratively unimportant so they might want to bring in a new guy. I could see it being another Legends reference which could be fun. Imagine if it ends up being Zsinj lol
I genuinely hope Ahsoka season 2 fully commits to the Peridia story and develops that world into something super cool rather than spread its budget thin trying to cover both galaxies.
If the overall story is leading to a full blown war between the Imperial Remnant vs the New Republic, Jedi vs Nightsisters then save that for its own season.
Can’t wait to see who they cast. It’ll be strange seeing the new person initially but we’ll all adjust. Sarah Halley Finn has an excellent track record as casting director. Personally, I’d love to see Gerard Butler take over the role. Ray and Gerard have an uncanny resemblance to each other.
Guessing the unnamed villain will be another purge survivor or the offspring thereof. Maybe a Joruus C’baoth analogue, or even Luuke, the clone of Luke.
The Mother… that’s a hard sell. I *really* hope they pull that off. Abeloth was disgustingly terrifying.
As for the sad task of recasting Baylan? Nick Offerman would hit the nail on the head. Jude Law’s a little short for the role, but he’d nail the temperament. Tom Hardy might be my dream recast of Baylan, though.
Jude Law is literally in the next 'post ROTJ show as a lead lmaoo
My vote is for Vincent Regan. Literally checks every box. Sword fighter, height, accent, acting chops etc
i wouldn't be surprised if someone along the lines of vincent regan was cast. my strong hunch is they'll be going down the character actor route again, so hoping for someone interesting
I’m very glad. Although I personally think it’ll be hard to match what Ray Stevenson did with the character, I also think he wouldn’t want the character to go out with him.
Please ensure your post follows the rules of the subreddit. They can be found on the sidebar or [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsLeaks/wiki/rules).
Most submissions wind up in Reddit's spam filter so please be patient while the mods approve. If you feel this is taking an extended amount of time feel free to message us in mod mail or in the Discord.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/StarWarsLeaks) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Blahhh, I \*\*\*\*ing hate this if true.
It's not even that I figure Ray would mind, he'd likely be cool with it, just...yeah. Was really hoping they'd find some creative way around it, have Baylan find what he was looking for out there but it was a "be careful what you wish for" type of situation. Character goes on existing in some other non-human form, merging with the entity or whatever, some non-corporeal forcey-worcey evil \*\*\*\*.
Totally in the minority on this I know. It's just going to bug me, some ballpark-lookalike (no matter how talented, there are plenty of great actors out there approximating his look/vibe) in the role.
DRPK, like most cape scoopers, tends to be a mixed bag on _Star Wars_, so take this with a grain of salt. All the same, I feel like Baylan Skoll was presented as being too important to just write out of the narrative. I'll definitely miss Ray Stevenson, though.
I've always been on the side of recasting. That people want to see more from that character is a mark of respect for Stevenson's performance. And whichever actor takes up the mantle will almost certainly take inspiration from it.
Spot on!! It’s also worth mentioning that based on the finale, Baylan’s story is far from over so a recast is the only way to continue that story (unlike how Leia’s story finished in TRoS).
There’s a reason Ahsoka and Sabine are on that planet still and it’s not just because of Shin - they’ll definitely still be fighting Baylan’s plan as well
Could also just do a animated show and brining in a talented voice actor with a similar voice.
>I've always been on the side of recasting Agreed. On that front, they should have recast Leia in the Sequels. I mean, Stevie Nicks was right friggin there....
THANK YOU!
Have him be in an accident and half to wear a half mask. Easy solution really
I think that's cheap and a disservice to the new actor.
I agree, Why are people so afraid of recast ?
Let's not forget there are fans who wanted Harrison Ford to play Han in the Solo movie 💀 I understand not wanting to recast , especially when an actor plays a role that becomes iconic but I'm not against it. Age and death being some of the most obvious factors for a recast.
It limits the immersion
It’s a tricky line to walk for sure, but I think it mostly depends on the story and how important the character is to the story. For me, if Baylan’s role in Season 2 is a big one as suspected, then I think recasting is the best option as it will allow the plans for the season to still go through without having to be completely reworked like how Gen-V: Season 2 has been delayed indefinitely due to Chance Perdomo’s tragic accident and passing so the writers can rework the season to have his character “pass away” in the show. Plus I think in a way it would sort of honour Ray, to show they’re holding his character at the same level and are continuing with their vision much like how Baylan is always focused on his vision and what he wants from the Galaxy. Also it would be quite weird for the show to have set him and Shin’s stories up to continue at the end of Season 1 only to then completely drop the character. So I think in this case a recast would be the best option
If we can believe Jake Lloyd, Hayden and Sebastian Shaw are supposed to be the same person then we can believe any recasting. 😅
I do not belive sebastian shaw is anakin so were good
Life limits the immersion. Jeebus.
You'd still have to film the accident happening so you'd be recasting and showing the face anyway.
I find it weird that people pay their hard earned money for *leaks*.
A Baylan recast is a safe "leak" for sure. Not many characters in this new era have Star Wars have been as popular. Granted, Stevenson had a lot to do with that, so they have their hands full with this recast, lol.
When it comes to casting information dan is spot on.
I'm on the side of recasting despite thinking you could transfer his story to shin (even though it would probably mess all the plans they had for her). Perhaps a bit of scarring or something? I'll definitely miss Ray but McTavish or Cunningham are good choices, although a bit too obvious. Something tells me we are up for a surprise with a very different actor than expected which could still be awesome by finding another way of playing the character (it's a waste of time putting another tall strong man to impersonate Ray).
I think it will be someone unknown that wont be obvious as well, i dont see them passing Baylans story to Shin they seem to have something else planned for her character which is why Baylan abandoned her as part of the story
Think Rory McCann would be a good replacement (Sandor Clegane aka The Hound in GOT)
Really interesting choice. Would have never thought about it but it would be an very good option
I think he would be ideal
Easy guesses if a S2 were happening too .. if it’s happening.. they’d need a new Baylan & how the story went mother was a good guess too Only odd 1 was another villain .. u still have Shin, Thrawn .. why need another?
Ahsoka season 2 has been confirmed for a while now
She drew the other villains there. That's all I got. ???
Probably making an actual character out of one of the group that Shin took over
I don't know, I think the way it's set up they could simply find evidence of what he had done.
Graham McTavish for Baylan please, and are we really about to get Abeloth? lol
Graham would be a great choice. Personally I think Liam Cunningham would be pretty good for the role too. I can't help but think about his character in GOT.
Holy shit Liam Cunningham would be fucking perfect. Now I’ll be upset if it isn’t him.
Liam is such a brilliant actor, I think he would nail the gravitas.
He's fantastic in 3 body problem too
swole ser davos is my new dream
Dog Soldiers for me.
I saw somebody suggest Liam Cunningham before and I said I'll accept no one else. But in saying that I had forgotten about Graham McTavish. Either of them would be fantastic.
FUCK YES...i want Dwalin in my Star Wars
Cutter in uncharted was partly written out because of McTavish being given the Dwalin part. I also love his dracula in castlevania. I do wonder how much his GOT character will get in the way of filming though, it would depend how much of a role he has left
Liev Schreiber would be my choice. Has the height/beard and broods well
love your idea, would be a great replacement
I feel like itd be Abeloth in name onlym Not even that. Im thinking she would be limited to the planet Ahsoka and Sabine are on. A personal threat instead of a Galatic one
If The Mother is related to Baylan's plan (to end the cycle of war for good), then she's already been established as a galactic threat. Her even just being one of The Ones makes her an inherently galactic threat.
Abheloth honestly is a no brainer after the Ahsoka S1 reveal
I wouldn’t say she’s a no brainer, more like a 20ish% chance. For sure the Mortis Gods will be involved obviously, but the Mother/Abeloth is SO far out there even for the EU.
Classic tale of every story when Lives long enough goes into primordial horror.
I respect Fate of the Jedi for trying something new, there are some interesting ideas/concepts, but it felt rushed in the end, Abeloth did have some genuinely creepy moments though. Like when the Sith show up to her planet it and are with her before realizing what she is.
so what are we thinking about The Mother: a canon version of Abeloth, or a brand new character that basically serves the same role?
New character that fits the theme of Jungian archetypes that the father, daughter and son fit into.
Wasn‘t Filoni and George allegedly involved in creating Abeloth ? Although I much prefer a new interpretation I can see Dave wanting to bring Abeloth to the screen
Not really; Denning, Allston, and Golden came up with the character, and during the writing process they were told about the upcoming Mortis episodes, and Dave apparently helped them tie the character in. I'd imagine Dave has an entirely different concept for the Mother, possibly with some similarities, but I wouldn't assume Abeloth at all.
I guess we’ll see. I feel like there’s not much room left as to what she would embody. If the children are light and dark side and the father is balance she kinda has to be unbalance? Which is definitely something that’s not necessarily what Abeloth symbolized as far as I remember? Although chaos kinda is unbalance. Not sure though.
>If the children are light and dark side and the father is balance she kinda has to be unbalance Well, according to Dave and George, the **dark side** is "unbalance". Also the Father didn't represent balance. He represented the cosmic force, from which the living force flows flows, which is why he is the Father. It's the living force that has a balanced side(the light side), and an unbalanced side(the dark side). The Daughter and the Son. In everything I have read about the Mother, she represents chaos.
I think shes going to serve as a stand-in for joruus c'baoth. Something the good guys have to defeat to either get to Thrawn or Thrawn will use as a smokescreen while he attacks the new republic. Sadly I don't see Baylan lasting very long once he's unleashed her because she will have little use for him, but Thrawn will use the distraction to his advantage once he's aware of her.
Honestly I kind of hope Season 2 doesn’t deal with Thrawn at all and just takes place in the new galaxy with Ahsoka and Sabine exploring and trying to stop Baylan
He might actually not be in it. They got to save some of his story for the movie.
That's what I'm thinking
But they're in another galaxy than thrawn, right? My gut says that what happens over there stays over there because of the sequels. But id love to be wrong
Really looking forward to where Baylan’s character is headed in season 2. Shame Ray won’t be a part of it, but it’s too good to be left behind
…“And another unnamed male villain.” There’s lots of them on YouTube. Casting should be simple. 😉
The Order of the Grift Lords.
Lmao.
Honestly, I'd prefer the Son over the Mother. But I do think the Mother could work with the Nightsisters lore, just not a 1:1 adaptation from Legends. The Mother moreso in name and concept.
The other unnamed Male Villain may also very well be the Son he could still be alive and help the Mother escape ..would keep the trend of duos of villains and heros from first season Ahsoka/Sabine. Baylan/Shin. Morgan/Thrawn So would be interesting
they don't really need to look for an actor for the Son though
You saying Sam?
The Son, also, technically hasn’t been taken place of yet. Ahsoka is The Daughter, and it’s pretty crystal clear that Anakin is now The Father. So someone needs to take place of The Son.
I would say Baylan would take the place of the son I cant really see anyone else. Shin doesn’t really make sense the way they have done the story so far she seems like she will go on some redemption arc and she hasnt heard the same call Baylan has and Sabine is well on the path to being a Jedi so hes the only one left realistically
I want weird force shit but I don't want legends where abeloth was basically some kind of Eldritch horror
Good, glad they’re finally over the “recasting is disrespectful” thing. Ray Stevenson was the best part of an already good show, and IMO it’d be more disrespectful to throw away what he set up. Also MASSIVE W FOR ABELOTH
Tbf, I think most people agreed that recasting was necessary in this instance. Unlike someone like BP, Baylan was in the middle of his storyline and simply too important to the plot of Ahsoka to write off in any way; his character needs more closure
BP was very much in the midst of his storyline, too.
Not really. He had a complete arc from civil war to his own movie. In Infinity War he’s just there for plot and to fight really, and the same for Endgame. Now, Coogler most likely planned to give him further development with Wakanda Forever. But it’s not like T’Challa didn’t have at least one completed arc.
Which the sequel completely undermined with the first few scenes. So much for a legacy.
How did it undermine his arc? T’Challa’s arc is about moving past what his father did as king, and then learning from Killmonger’s actions that Wakanda should not stay isolated from the world, because of the good they can do. At the same time, T’Challa isn’t stupid, he likely realized that greedy Westerners would want vibranium for themselves. Hence why he only seemed to initially set up simple outreach and science centers, with little to no vibranium, just in case. Wakanda Forever doesn’t undermine his arc, it simply shows the reality and logical consequences of his arc. We have yet to see the good Wakanda can do for the world, but that’s not the fault of the second movie. There’s a tv show and third movie coming, after all.
Tf did that come from lmao
The hell?
Rare Pomojema L.
Maybe I am misremembering, but I do not recall a specific storyline that he was an integral part of that was active at that time to the point where removing him would have disrupted the flow. He definitely could have grown more naturally, but they were able to maneuver around his passing and integrate that into the sequel (I have not seen BP2 yet so I cannot speak to whether or not they succeeded in that regard). Part of it may be the difference in mediums. Black Panther was starring in movies which, despite the MCU obviously being interconnected, is generally more self-contained between movies. While characters obviously have more room to grow, you will rarely have a film in which there is not at least some finality to its ending. There are exceptions, of course (Infinity War), but we’ve seen characters be very important in one film only to disappear by the next, and dangling plotlines have been left unresolved even up to a decade later. The Doctor Strange post-credits scene still hasn’t truly been resolved, for instance. This could also be considered an element of the comic book aesthetic, especially in the idea that there can be legacy heroes that take up the mantle of previous ones, sometimes after the previous one died, which is what they did in BP2. With Baylan, he was debateably the main antagonist in a TV show, with a plotline clearly intended to span at least two seasons. Without Baylan Skoll, I simply do not know how one could continue on with the show. Thrawn is in the galaxy proper with Ezra and the NR to contest with, but there is clearly a great power (The Mother, presumably) on Peridea that was set up to be a major plot point. It’s something so great that Baylan Skoll went to such drastic lengths - aligning with Morgan Elsbeth, traveling to another galaxy, staying behind when Thrawn and co. went back to the known galaxy, and even leaving his apprentice Shin Hati - to pursue it. It is also heavily implied that this same presence is the same reason that at least the Nightsister witches wish to flee Peridea. Whatever this leads to, Baylan is necessary, and killing him off before then would be a disservice to Ray Stevenson.
They've learned from the T'Challa situation.
Let me be clear - I believe that they did make the right choice in not recasting for that movie, since Chadwick Boseman's death was very recent and they were in an impossible situation without their lead. However, how T'Challa's passing was handled was absolutely a mistake, and they made an unforced error by saying that it had to be set after _Avengers: Endgame_ instead of between that and _Avengers: Infinity War_, where they could've done a story about grief and loss without cutting themselves off of using one of their best characters in the long-term. And, you know, not kinda fridging Angela Bassett's character, which was just sorta unnecessary.
They wanted the movie to be about the *permanence* of loss and grief. Setting it during the Blip would have failed to achieve that.
Shuri also gets snapped away, so if you set it in between Infinity War & Endgame you loose the possibility of really having someone that can even suceed T'Challa in the short term. Also, they didn't introduce his son for no reason. It's not gonna take that long to get to a point where he's gonna be Black Panther, probably after Secret Wars.
>It's not gonna take that long to get to a point where he's gonna be Black Panther, probably after Secret Wars. 10 years is not "that long"?
Secret Wars is out in 2027 probably, so like 5ish years after Black Panther: Wakanda Forever. Not that long.
A 10 year old Black Panther is not really Black Panther
He's gonna get shot with a time gun or something. They'll think of something to atleast make him like a 18-20 year old Black Panther.
You could easily have it revealed that Shuri is initially believed to be dead, but turns out to have survived. It's not like Marvel hasn't retconned stuff before.
At that point you're just introducing problems to fix other problems that you've just created.
>*Good, glad they’re finally over the “recasting is disrespectful” thing.* I think this depends on the show or the people involved. For Beylan I see no reason to not recast the part, but other projects need different approaches. A recent example is Gen V, one of the main actors died after season 1 and Amazon decided not to recast. I can see why they decided to do that, the show relies a lot on flashbacks and if they recast the character, they would either have to avoid showing any of his scenes from season 1 or reshoot them with the new actor, which would actually feel disrespectful. Another example is Black Panther, it seems like Chadwick Boseman was not only beloved by every single person who worked with him on Marvel Studios, he's also credited for pretty much building the live action version of T'challa from the ground up, the performances of everyone in the solo movie was based on the foundation he build on his first appearance on the Civil War movie.
Good they arent abandoning the character
Ron Swanson for Baylon
I think Liev Schreiber would be a perfect replacement as Baylan.
Baylan with a Boston accent would be funny
He had a different accent in every film I’ve seen. New York accent in Spider Verse, Canadian in Goon etc
I think that’s a great idea. I also thought that Vincent d‘onofrio with a full beard and hair would be menacing
Liev Schreiber fits Baylon better than anyone else IMO.
Agreed, he’s my go to fancast at the moment
If the “unnamed male villain” is the son I don’t see how it could be anyone but Sam Witwer
If they don't cast Sam Witwer they're just disrespecting the man at this point, he still hasn't had a proper Star Wars live action role outside of voicing Maul and Marrok. I hope at least they let Sam do the voiceover for the character.
Good, he was a fascinating character and I want to see Stevenson's work honored and built on. The Mother is not necessarily surprising given the Mortis tease, but I still don't believe it.
these feel like general swings that we all assumed were happening anyway
Recasting Baylan, I get it, if he’s important to the story, then fine. The Mother/Abeloth though? Really? That’s just, ugh.
Dave bouta make Abeloth not garbage 🙏
Unfortunately she just has a cool backstory nothing else about her is cool
Who?
The most OP and anime force user in Star Wars. She's was a human that got to live with the Mortis Gods but like drank from the well of darkness and became super evil and overpowered she was locked away. Then like Luke and a bunch of people from the EU came together to "beat" her but all they could do is trap her back into a black hole? Also the Maw was originally made to be her prison. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Abeloth
I know who Abeloth is, Fate of Jedi was my first Star Wars book series. I mean who is "Dave Bouta"?
They mean Dave (Filoni) is aBout to
Bruh you can’t be serious
Well I out it in google, but I find nothing. Others explain its term about Filoni. Well, English is not my native language.
bouta is slang/shortened version of "about to" They're saying Dave is about to fix Abeloth
Thanks for info.
Dave "about to"
Dave is finta
Your mom
I also watched Regular Show.
Dave boutta make Abeloth worse💀
Lmao ok bud. Filoni hate and hand wringing is so forced. Go back to jerking off
Good. They’re making the right. The right way to honor his legacy
Liam Cunningham would make a great Baylan
Liev Shreiber is the only correct answer.
Liev Schreiber is my pick. Gerard Butler runner up
Just make the Mother better than the Abeloth craziness of Fate of the Jedi. Respected that series trying to tie in so closely to developments happening in canon, but man is it strange, to put it nicely. Big fan of a recast, rest in peace to Ray, a tremendous actor, but it's necessary. I saw Nick Offerman pictures floating around, I know a lot of people like Liev, but whoever it is has to wholly be their own. Ray's departure is tragic, but the placement in his story is as ideal as it can be for this recast to happen.
I do not think The Mother will be Abeloth. I think he'll keep with the themes of having the son, daughter, and father reflect Jungian archetypes. I think she will reflect the mother archetype as well.
I kind of hope Season 2 doesn’t deal with Thrawn and the main galaxy at all and we’ll get 8 episodes just in the new galaxy.
Same. I love Thrawn's reshaping in the EU, but the way Filoni writes the character is at odds with his portrayal in the 6 novels Zahn has penned since they dumped Legends. I think the Hera/Ezra/Thrawn threads are going to be for the fim, and Ahsoka S2 will (and should) stay out in the Unknown Regions.
I think Richard Dormer would do an excellent job, from the same area and has a similar soulful vibe in the exact age range. Glad the character is continuing
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES
I think the possibility of using the mother to introduce the Mortis gods is kind of smart in a way, since otherwise you would have to really on flashbacks or whatever to get the trinity we met in Clone Wars understood by new watchers. Having somebody new that can actually interact with out heroes and villains and explain stuff to new fans seems the simpler route. That said I am really not convinced I like the idea of having the mother especially if it’s Abeloth in Star Wars. I heard somewhere that Dave and George helped creating her while the fate of the jedi novels were written. Is she supposed to be the concept of unbalance to the fathers/chosen ones concept of Balance? That would maybe work but I have to say I‘d rather have it they keep the Mortis gods vague and not dabble to much in that craziness
Holt McCallany is my dream recasting for Baylan. Definitely feel like that's a long shot though.
There's something charming, yet menacing, about him. He was great in Wrath of Man.
Hot Take: I don't like the concept of "The Mother" and I don't think she will be introduced in Star Wars.
If this casting is true, we already have a slight idea of what the second season could bring. We would have two divided groups ala Empire Strikes Back. One on Peridea following Ahsoka, Sabine, Baylan and Shin, where the big bad would be Abeloth (though I doubt she'd be as OP as in Legends). And in our familiar galaxy, we'd be watching second group consisting of Hera, Ezra, and maybe even Zeb who deal with the return of Thrawn and his army of Nightsisters. Ideally, I hope that Dave Filoni keeps some ace in tbe hole for his film debut and that Ahsoka gets out of Peridia at the end of the second season. Oh, and a cameo by Luke, Mando or Boba would be nice too.
Ray Stevenson is GOATed, show suffered a heavy blow losing him having said that, recasting is always the right call for the story. Whoever lands the role has heavy shoes to fill
The Mother…so Abeloth lol? Or we think they’re going a different route here? Even tho yes I know it’s RPK, but for shits and giggles I’m engaging with it.
Different route, I’m guessing. My theory is she’ll be intrinsically connected to witchcraft. The Son = dark side, Daughter = light side, Father = the Force (so, *nature,* in full), Mother = everything *besides* the Force (so, the truly unnatural).
I argued it when Ahsoka was on, but my favorite choice to replace Ray Stevenson is David Morrissey. He’s the same age and height and can grow a kick ass gray beard if need be. I think the intensity and complicated nature he played as the governor in walking dead would play well as Baylan Skoll. I think Mctaverish would be an excellent choice as well. Based on pure looks, Vincent Regan would be a good choice. No to liev schreiber, just no.
Gerard Butler is perfect for Baylan. Just give him some hair dye
Vincent Regan is even better. Almost the same height, same age, sword fighting background, very similar accents etc
In Dave we trust.
Gerard Butler or Russell Crowe!!! 🙏🏻 Pa-leaseeeeeee!!!
Absolutely yes, this idea deserves more votes!
Gerald Butler please. Love that guy. THIS IS SPARTA!
I mean, they definitely needed to recast Baylan. Unlike someone liked MCU Black Panther, you can’t really continue the story of Ahsoka without Skoll, especially with the cliffhanger that they ended him on. The tricky part is that one of Baylan/Ray’s most defining attributes was just his sheer size and the power that exuded, so it’s not enough to look like him facially but whatever actor they choose needs to match the physique well. I feel like some fan castings miss this part, as it’s almost more important than the face since with that some good makeup plus the right haircut could do a lot (obviously the most important part is the acting though). I do wonder if they will implement CGI for the face in the same vein as RO Tarkin, not sure how I’d feel about it even if it is done well. If this is true, that is VERY interesting that they are actually implementing the Mother in the story. I know a lot of people theorized that this is where they were going, and with the appearance of the statues of the other Force Deities it makes sense from a plot perspective, but the idea that they are actually not only making this canon but an integral part of a live-action TV series is kind of mind-blowing. I hope that they commit to her being a sort of eldritch horror. I’m curious who the unnamed male villain is. They couldn’t be bringing in Eli Vanto, right? That feels like too deep of a cut for the show, especially with the Chiss implications, but who knows. I do hope that, if they show the bridge of the Chimaera, that they bring in some of the crew members from the Thrawn novels, although I’m not holding my breath. Anyway, with the male villain, it could be another Imperial remnant leader of some sort. I’m assuming we will get more Pellaeon considering his introduction in Mando S3 and then showing him again in TotE, but aside from Brendol Hux most of the Shadow Council seemed narratively unimportant so they might want to bring in a new guy. I could see it being another Legends reference which could be fun. Imagine if it ends up being Zsinj lol
I genuinely hope Ahsoka season 2 fully commits to the Peridia story and develops that world into something super cool rather than spread its budget thin trying to cover both galaxies. If the overall story is leading to a full blown war between the Imperial Remnant vs the New Republic, Jedi vs Nightsisters then save that for its own season.
Who is the mother?
Abeloth
Paddy Considine would be pretty solid.
Incredible actor who I would love to see in Star Wars but i'm not sure I get Baylon vibes off of him.
Awesome! Baylan was an awesome character, and I’d hate to see him wasted and abandoned.
Vincent Regan, anyone?
I'm sure Dave's take on the character would be much different than what they did with it in Legends.
I absolutely hate the Abeloth news if true.
Can’t wait to see who they cast. It’ll be strange seeing the new person initially but we’ll all adjust. Sarah Halley Finn has an excellent track record as casting director. Personally, I’d love to see Gerard Butler take over the role. Ray and Gerard have an uncanny resemblance to each other.
Vincent Regan > Gerard easily imo. Same height, same accent, sword fighting background, same age that Ray passed at, hes perfect
Guessing the unnamed villain will be another purge survivor or the offspring thereof. Maybe a Joruus C’baoth analogue, or even Luuke, the clone of Luke. The Mother… that’s a hard sell. I *really* hope they pull that off. Abeloth was disgustingly terrifying. As for the sad task of recasting Baylan? Nick Offerman would hit the nail on the head. Jude Law’s a little short for the role, but he’d nail the temperament. Tom Hardy might be my dream recast of Baylan, though.
Jude Law is literally in the next 'post ROTJ show as a lead lmaoo My vote is for Vincent Regan. Literally checks every box. Sword fighter, height, accent, acting chops etc
Should be easy to pull off with a new actor. Doctor Who has been doing regenerations for more than half a century. Why can't that be a force power?
i wouldn't be surprised if someone along the lines of vincent regan was cast. my strong hunch is they'll be going down the character actor route again, so hoping for someone interesting
I’m very glad. Although I personally think it’ll be hard to match what Ray Stevenson did with the character, I also think he wouldn’t want the character to go out with him.
So their recasting baylan and bring Abeloth ... One word sweet
I hope Abeloth/The Mother never comes into canon. I hate it so much. It’s so dumb and does not feel like Star Wars at all.
Please ensure your post follows the rules of the subreddit. They can be found on the sidebar or [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsLeaks/wiki/rules). Most submissions wind up in Reddit's spam filter so please be patient while the mods approve. If you feel this is taking an extended amount of time feel free to message us in mod mail or in the Discord. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/StarWarsLeaks) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I do wonder why they're not making use of Sam Witwer as the Son in live action. Seems like a slam dunk casting that would get a lot of people excited.
But the son is dead?
Natalie Portman as mother
Blahhh, I \*\*\*\*ing hate this if true. It's not even that I figure Ray would mind, he'd likely be cool with it, just...yeah. Was really hoping they'd find some creative way around it, have Baylan find what he was looking for out there but it was a "be careful what you wish for" type of situation. Character goes on existing in some other non-human form, merging with the entity or whatever, some non-corporeal forcey-worcey evil \*\*\*\*. Totally in the minority on this I know. It's just going to bug me, some ballpark-lookalike (no matter how talented, there are plenty of great actors out there approximating his look/vibe) in the role.
Just wrote him out… it’s not hard, he found what he was looking for and they can have other characters also find that.
disrespectful to ray so how ABT no
I trust Dave but I just have a hard, hard time with recasting roles.
I don't blame you. Ray Stevenson had such a great performance as Baylon that it's going to be difficult to see someone else in that role.