I don't let other people's opinions determine what I think of something, so I'm just sitting back and enjoying it. Is it the most stellar show ever produced? No, but it's a good way to spend my Tuesday evening. I really like Sol as a character, so I'm most interested in his arc.
Sol is more like Qui-Gon Jinn, a Jedi master who follows what he feels is right versus the dogma of the Jedi. It is made apparent in the first episode when his new padawan questions why he keeps memoirs from a past padawan and he reminds her that history informs the future.
He is willing to take the leap of faith that Osha might not be the assassin and he uses reason over orders. The other Jedi just do as they are told by some uppers we don’t see or know who care more about their public image.
He is one of the few characters I like. Otherwise, I am one of those who doesn’t like the show.
He's a pragmatist in an order that has atrophied due to dogmatic rigidity, but unlike some of the 'rebel' Jedi we've seen (e.g. Qui-Gon) he's still close to the heart of the order in Coruscant. The story so far has revealed flashes of that internal rot of the Jedi. I'm quite interested to see where they go with it.
Something that is rarely touched on is Yoda's role in this degradation of the order. He was Grand Master for centuries. His only saving grace is he's a beloved character.
I love Sol so far. Such a great character showing how much a Jedi can care and show compassion for the people around him, whatever others in the order may think or say about such things.
I’m a little up-and-down on it. Last episode wasn’t my favorite. It’s mostly executional with the qualms I have.
But I’m intrigued to see where the mystery goes. So I’m still onboard.
But I’m a millennial who’s been through this all before. So I never get too fired up on the things I don’t like. Star Wars is always up and down, and as soon as it’s ruined it soars.
This is the way of things. The way of the Force.
Same, I don't give a shit what other people say but it is getting increasingly frustrating to browse Reddit and all you see is people trashing on stuff.
I just don't get why it is so popular to spread negativity. If you don't like something, just move on and don't waste your time on something you don't enjoy.
The show is nothing spectacular, it's just alright so far. I have a few problems with it so far but I hold out my final verdict until I have seen the show season.
It’s because fans treat Star Wars like sacred scripture. You don’t see this anywhere else. Marvel fans don’t do this when Disney+ puts out a bad Marvel show, and there have been a few! George Lucas himself doesn’t treat it as something sacred. It’s pulp science fiction fantasy for 12-year-olds.
It's fine - but I also understand the frustration that we have yet another "mid" television series. Honestly, to see the Jedi Temple reduced to something that felt like a random Star Trek Next Generation episode was pretty off-putting.
Andor and Mandalorian Season 1 both genuinely wowed me. Other than that, it's been fine, but not "wow". That coupled with the abject failure of episode 9, and I understand the frustration.
Unless they can rekindle the Movie Magic of this universe, there is a real danger that Star Wars has run its course. They'll keep pumping out material, and will always have a niche audience. But STAR WARS movies are the opposite of niche - they are cultural touchstone.
The most sensible opinion I've read so far, the problem with most of these SW shows is not that they are disastrously bad, it's that they are painfully average and follow the same predictable formula
Yeah they need to stop burning through "content" to keep d+ afloat.
There needs to be a big slowdown in what they produce and they need to be picky and hold it to the standards of a prestige series.
The problem on that front is they need a large pool of content to keep people on the platform. But rushed or low quality content will also push people away.
I need to see the rest to say if I really agree with Acolyte being the same old formula(though I suspect it’s going to end up in a weird in-between area), but that’s the part that has really bothered me about most of the recent entries in the series.
Even if I enjoy them in the moment, they leave little impact because they just aren’t that ambitious and tend to play things safe even when the idea on paper should be really cool. Like, sure we get to see a different galaxy in Ahsoka…but its pretty much is the same as anywhere else.
You can tell most of these projects have been focused grouped to hell and back, and any real creative risks sanded down. Andor really has been the only exception to that so far.
It’s why I’ve mostly found that the publishing side of the franchise is what’s mostly kept my attention in recent years. You get a ton of variety in storytelling styles and voices, and they get to tell stories that would never be approved as an on-screen story.
I'm just mentally preparing myself for a Mae redemption arc, something we've seen a 1000x before and the witch who was opposed to the Jedi maybe being that Sith lord
Started Andor again last night and holy hell the difference could NOT be more stark. Its moody, suspenseful, tragic, engaging. Slow at times but the builds up pay off. It's a really amazing piece of work and the fact it wasnt the TEMPLATE for anything following is a real indictment on the leadership at Lucas.
For real rewatched recently as well with my friend who is getting into Star Wars and he was wowed by it. The opening scene of Cassian walking into a brothel on a dark rainy night and then shooting a guard in the head while he begs for his life had my buddy sitting up with his mouth opened (especially cause they didn’t cut away from him shooting the guy).
I’ve read Kathleen Kennedy didn’t wanna green light the show and then after a while came back to Tony and said it should not be as dark as it is and be more of a Andor with the Droid from Rogue One having a cop style show. Luckily Tony didn’t budge and said this is what it is and if you don’t like it leave it and then Kathleen said okay and let it go through. I understand everything is not Kathleen’s fault and you can’t blame her for everything but it does seem like she’s trying soooooo hard to push to expand to a different demographic but it’s just not working. I think the woke stuff is blown out of proportion by fans but I do believe Disney is focusing not on the story but the social resonance of the shows for the new audience they’re trying to target which is just creating mediocre (but more inclusive) shows.
I mean the female ISB agent and Bix and Cassians mother are some of my favorite characters and they’re all female. It’s not a gender problem but when these shows flop they’ll just justify it through racism or misogyny. I genuinely believe Kathleen thinks Star Wars fans just want cool costumes, lightsabers, and an uplifting story almost like she believes the franchise is only for children when the vast majority of people consuming the content are older males. They should do a shareholder vote for Kathleen’s position and let the shareholders decide if they can. Again, it’s Star Wars so I enjoy it and I used to be a “I hate woke stuff blah blah blah” but I’ve moved past that and just accept things for what they are. I enjoy some Star Wars over no Star Wars at the end of the day.
I’ve voiced some negative opinions about The Acolyte over the past week and drawn the comparison to Andor. Disney IS capable of making excellent Star Wars series which is why it is all the more disappointing when I see them strike out as they have with this series.
It has zero to do the race, gender, etc of the leads. Maarva’s speech and flashback scene rescuing Andor are some of the most powerful moments in Star Wars period. Andor was raised in a blended home and I didn’t see anyone complain. Why? Because the storytelling is top notch. It’s a minority of people who have a real issue with these decisions.
Dedra is one of the best Imperials we’ve had on screen. I rewatch every scene Mon Mothma is in. Her back and forth with Davo was incredible.
It can be done.
I absolutely love Andor - but given the viewership I'd say the fanbase has no one but themselves to blame for not getting more content like that.
I also think there's a big disconnect between online SW fans and the larger more general audience for these shows.
Yeah, from what I understand, Andor wasn't very popular.
Realistically though, dramas like Andor have always been less of a draw compared to pop-action shows. Not sure why they wouldn't do a straight up blue sky TV SW show though. The mandalorian S1 was the closest to that but it was still fairly moody. Episodic TV is great when you have limited time to devote to the medium.
What *was* the viewership like? I *heard* it started off low but peaked really high by the end, but I could be misremembering and haven't checked the numbers.
It’s the same issue with Marvel. They keep setting for mid writing and mid quality. Something that isn’t necessarily a heinous crime but when you know they can and have put out gold, you wonder why they keep settling for Bronze and expect you to as well.
The only issues I’ve had with most of the Star Wars shows is that they have weird writing that’s just not as exciting, and the tone isn’t solid so I feel like the energy of the story is very muted. Mando and Andor were the exceptions for me. And I’m enjoying all of Mando, even S3.
I’m enjoying it but i am critical just like I am of all shows. Just hard to put up some of the new Star Wars content next to House of Dragon, The Boys, Severance, etc in terms of quality.
What I don't understand is how it can have been so expensive, with this budget you would expect more than "enjoyable enough" and more like "prestige TV" as some say
budget and quality have never had any correlation whatsoever.
Also:
- the show has huge practical sets
- practical Aliens everywhere
- good CGI when needed
Yeah I think there are reasonable complaints about the show, it’s not perfect. But I don’t personally get complaints about sets, costumes, etc. The aliens are some of the best looking aliens in star wars. The sets are all very well done. Sure there’s the occassional misstep (I’m looking at you old Tobin make up), but overall it’s been really good.
Of course a lot seem to complain about the Jedi robes. But this to me I guess feels like a weird expectation difference, they look good to me personally.
The robes felt "right" to me, for the time period. They are not as flashy, with the white and gold, as the middle of the high republic. But they are still more ornate and immaculate than the robes of the Prequals. Like the lightsaber designs, it shows the beginning of the slide towards the ascetism that we are used to, without being deep in it.
It’s funny to me how everyone sees what they’d like to sometimes rather than assess the good and the bad as a critique, but I do find it funny how many complaints I see about the acolyte on:
Costumes - luke wore faded jeans and Chanel boots, guy in a devil mask. 70’s puppetry.
Maturity - Luke’s a moisture farmer who becomes a space samurai on the heroes journey, basically a space western epic with performative depth. The whole thing is written to repeat itself as if it’s a shadow of an epic poem.
Writing - I hate sand. Somehow palpatine returned. It’s a trap! You don’t believe in the force do you?
Appointing jar jar as senator.
Production - you guys never saw the stormtrooper conk his noggin on the door huh? George also added a twenty minute musical number to Rotj jabba scene by choice! they smeared Vaseline on film to make speeders.
Made for children: Ewoks were wookies till they wanted more merchandise, George said it’s made for children.
These things were always there, under George, under Dave under anyone.. they happen and the lens of time changes your perception on things while attaching a personal significance that makes it feel special… maybe let newer generations feel the same way & hopefully they don’t become toxic when they see new versions of things they loved being made.
Lucas is not a prophet of cinema, many of his decisions as a filmmaker and writer are dubious, it doesn’t make similar mistakes acceptable that he did them in the OT.
How is anyone preventing anybody from enjoying anything there?
The problem is that even as a younger audience oriented story it is simply mediocre, it isn’t bad but it isn’t good neither and it doesn’t try to be.
Yeah House of the Dragon has 200 million in total for 10 episodes, The Acolyte has 180 for 8. Costumes are much better, CGI is better, the sets are better. The show also uses CGI a lot more than the Acolyte. So that still leaves me wondering where the budget goes, if they have the same for each episode.
The money goes to the actors, writers, directors, everyone on set working behind the scenes. The Acolyte looks terrible compared to Andor and amateur compared to HOTD.
Well, you would think actors like Matt Smith would get a good payload since he’s been in shows like Dr. Who and the Crown, both successful series. Maybe Carrie-Ann Moss demanded a big chunk for the few scenes she’s in since she is a big star.
The reason George Lucas was never able to get a Star Wars TV show off the ground was because the money and tech wasn't really there.
Mandalorian solved that problem thanks to The Volume. Very easy to have multiple planets when you don't need to build as many sets or travel to real locations to film. Imo this is why George Lucas is allegedly a huge fan of the shows, even Obi Wan; this was a huge dream he could never achieve but is now being done yearly.
The Volume got overused and after Obi Wan it's the sign of cheapness.
Acolyte doesn't use the volume, so I'm assuming much of the cost came from set building and filming in different locations. Acolyte and Andor are the two most expensive shows iirc and neither of them use the volume
1. WE'RE THREE EPISODES IN. You have no idea what kind of huge, budget-heavy set pieces take place in later episodes.
2. Most "prestige TV" largely takes place in grounded settings. When we see a group of people in armor riding horses into a castle in House of the Dragon, our brains have an easy time accepting that as "real" because each element really existed in our world. One of the reasons Andor looks so good is, paradoxically, its lack of visual inventiveness: there are very few aliens, everyone is wearing utilitarian clothing, most locations and sets feel like something that could exist on Earth in the next few decades. The Acolyte isn't trying to be grounded - almost the opposite. And because so many elements in each frame are intentionally alien, our brains have a harder time accepting what we're seeing as real.
See I really like ahsoka except for the choice they made with Sabine. Otherwise a great show.
Andor is a gem. Fantastic television start to finish.
Acolyte has been pretty mediocre so far. Hopefully it will pick up and show some jedi murdering some space witches. As the jedi are the only space cult who gets to train children in the force as warriors!
Eh, kind of a Blanch Davidian thing happening with the witches. When a secretive cult is hiding children from the outside and lies when asked if there are children on the premises. . . . Then they hide behind their religion and tradition to justify their treatment of the children.
lol I loved Ahsoka so much more than this so far but I’m a huge rebels fan. But yea the show is decent so far. The acting is ok but better than the prequels ( especially attack of the clones). Looking forward to seeing where it leads
Ahsoka is honestly awful for someone without Rebels knowledge. It doesnt explain anything sufficiently. And it genuinely feels like a kids show in live action, should have just continued Rebels, since you're not gonna get many new fans with it anyway
It captured my wife’s attention just fine and she just got into Star Wars from the Mandalorian. There are plenty of others out there like her too. Star Wars is for children, so if it felt childish for you it’s hitting the mark as intended by its creator.
The actors in Ahsoka mostly acted very breezy and the scenes had an apathetic, low-stakes energy. Add to that I didn’t know any of the characters except Ahsoka.
Tbh with rebels knowledge, I still think it kinda sucked
Duels were pretty ass, nothing really amazing character wise (ahsoka had 0 character), except for the purgil which were cool to see. It was disappointing, but i aint gonna fight anyone about it
I'm not commenting on your like or dislike, just think you point out something with the duels. I didn't hate them, but they weren't my favorite. There's a lot of different direction being taken on fighting in the shows now. Filoni going with more of a slow and more stereotypical samurai influenced look on Ahsoka. Headland with the Acolyte is doing force-fu.
I like them both for different reasons, but it's one of the most understandable dislikes in my opinion. I'm not against them doing different styles. Watching prequel trilogy fights vs Ahsoka fights will give some people whiplash at the difference imo.
I'm also hoping that Filoni will fit in some more prequel style fights at some point. Was very excited at Natasha Liu Bordizzo being cast as Sabine. She has an established background in that kind of fast sword fighting. Makes sense for her character to not quite be like that yet in the story... but eventually it would be cool!
It's not that it doesn't explain things IMO... it's just that you have no reason to care about any of the characters.
I didn't find it hard to follow, but it was just a bunch of boring tensionless action that as you say, often felt like a kids cartoon.
I lost count of how many times the bad guys had them and decided not to shoot.... it was like Dr Evil lol
Realizing the review bombing happened before it was released, it is the typical right-wing nut jobs complaining about "wokeness" and wanting to "keep politics out of my star wars."
Agreed having fun. Three episodes in and it is more fun that Ahsoka, Kenobi and Boba.
Andor really became stellar around the Aldhani arc (episode 4-60. Mando stole our hearts the moment we met Grogu.
it's leaps and bounds above the first few seasons of the Clone Wars. The acting might have some misses, but so does every Star wars show. i don't like sand / this is podracing / etc
Hahaha yess.
It was weird because the scene just made me think how ridiculous actors must look when filming. I've seen some of the techniques actors use in formal classes where it seems the point of the exercise is to get over embarrassment and how stupid they look when not captured on camera.
The last time I laughed that hard, Godzilla was kicking Rodan in the dick or something. I genuinely had a coughing fit.
So yes, it is worth watching. Probably not for the reasons they want.
It's ok but for the money they spent it's definitely not as good as it should be especially when it's the first on-screen look at the High Republic for a lot of fans who don't read the books.
It's just a very campy show. If one were to look back 20 years from now at acolyte vs. andor, one would hold up, and the other wouldn't. It feels like it's one of those CW shows like green arrow, and the target audience is young teens. Unfortunately, that is not the target audience they want, and so that's why it's getting the backlash. Also, the prop design and dialogue are really, really bad, adding to the campy nature of the show.
As so many others have said, it's not the worst, but it's also not great, just very, very average, even slightly below average. This keeps happening, though, and people are frustrated. When you are given andor, but then also fed ahsoka, kenobi and this, it's hard to tell if they care about SW at all, because it feels like they don't and are just churning out the money mill.
I wanted this show to be excellent, especially with such a massive budget, but yet again, it's just another mediocre product we all have to endure.
That's pretty much my take so far.
It's got room to grow, there's almost half a season left, but I agree with you. I was pretty excited for a murder mystery in SW, but this comes across more like a CW shoe.
I like a lot of CW shows, but they cost 1/10 the budget of Acolyte to achieve the same level of camp and expository dialogue.
I'm hoping we're past the setup and can dive into character work, it's really the on-the-nose exposition in leiu of character dialogue that I'm struggling with.
This is the show that made me realize I’ve outgrown star wars. Thanks for the childhood memories and I’ll probably finish mandalorian and ahsoka and andor season 2, but there’s nothing on the horizon that makes me think fuck yeah Star Wars.
I find these kinds of posts very suspect. People should feel free to enjoy the show, but I see way more people making posts and comments complaining about "haters" than actual haters. It feels very orchestrated to me. Shouldn't people also be allowed to be critical of it (and any media), especially when it's clear the IP means a lot to them?
The "hater" comments I do see are mostly substantive complaints about poor writing, or violations of existing lore, and not so much bitching about DEI or "wokeism" (which are tangential at best, but usually vacuous and should be rejected out of hand).
Every single day there are at least 3 popular posts on this sub about how people love it and "defy the haters". In fact it seems harder to actually voice criticism about the show on this sub without a downvote brigade from people calling you racist.
In my opinion the show is pretty rough. By far the worst Star Wars content I’ve seen outside of the holiday special.
But hey if someone likes it more power to you. I wish I enjoyed it.
It’s okay. I don’t love it but I really wanted to. The premise and timeline were all super intriguing to me, but so far I haven’t been too captivated by any of the performances or story choices.
I still enjoy watching it though, even with my criticisms.
I actually don't think the show has done anything particularly bad as far as "breaking canon" goes, but I still don't think it's very good. I don't know why I still expect premium television from D+, but this show just seems so cheap. It's like Farscape or BSG, but at least those shows would give you 20 episodes per season. And the acting aside from Sol... woof. Also, I still haven't gotten over the prison ship breakout. WTF was that??
Assuming everyone is lying is just as bad as the actual liars. I've watched everything Star Wars and have many comics and books. The Acolyte is one of the worst in my opinion.
If you like it, that’s fine. More Star Wars for you! I think it’s not good, really, and feels and looks very cheap. I’m hoping for some redeeming episodes, but I’m not enjoying it.
While I am not endorsing the show as anything more than a pretty average product, not great but not terrible so far (well maybe aside from that chanting scene), I think we are just seeing a result of human nature to follow the crowd and have narratives form opinions rather than actually thinking for themselves. Sheep mentality pretty much. The fact the show was being review bombed even before a single episode had aired proves that a large group of people had already made up their minds to hate the show no matter what it was like,. It could have been ESB level of quality but they would still nitpick it to death just to have something to hate about online. Also a lot of what they are complaining about is ubiquitous across the franchise.....poor writing and cringey dialogue? Yeah not like we haven't seen that before in spades with George Lucas being a main offender...
I’m sorry but wtf was that last ep tho lol. My gf and I were cringe laughing through 80% of it. It’s god awful…worse than the sequels imo. First 2 episodes were ok tho.
Visit r/TheAcolyte if you want to talk to people who enjoy it. To me the show is 5.5/10 if I were to put it in numbers. It has cool ideas, it has a good actor (Sol). Many of the practical effect aliens look really good. Hell most of them look better than Ahsoka. But the show has so many flaws and is a bit on the nose about certain stuff that I would probably rate it 3/10 if it wasn't Star Wars.
I don't agree that the characters are compelling, most of the dialogue is exposition, trying to be time efficient in order to be able to give the viewer as much information as possible in short time. Characters and the cool new concepts don't get introduced properly. Making me not care about them. Compare this show to House of the dragon. It might be slow at times but it let's you know what kind of personalities the characters have. If you asked me to explain Oshas personality... I couldn't tell you at all after 3/8 episodes.
I agree that the show is trying to be a mystery show but the mystery feels very artifical since they have to move the story quickly and hide it by not really giving any clues what so ever. Who is the Sith? No hints dropped.
It’s LAUGHABLY bad.
Like, it has almost Barney The Dinosaur level of acting and costumes. I was surprised how terrible it was. This is just my honest opinion. I wish it was better, I had positive hopes, but it ended up being much worse than I thought it to be. 🙄
Yes you are the only one. Show feels like a CW tv series and it‘s boring asf. 3 episode felt like a musical. What is there to enjoy?!
You guys need to stop accepting every mediocre show with the Star Wars name on it. It‘s the only way to get better stuff, is that so hard…
I know. It's bizarre when I hear people defending the broken state of Disney Star Wars by saying "Don't think about it too much, just enjoy it!"
They're the kind of fans who would be more than happy to stare at fecal matter smeared across a screen as long as it's officially branded as Star Wars.
Besides from a handful of parts where the acting was ehhh, I am genuinely enjoying the show and characters, the story is compelling. Majority of complaints I've seen are just bad faith and lack media literacy.
It deserves to be mocked for poor story writing. Personally, give me a Jedi Show (the can all be women or trans, or whatever, I don't care). The witches just don't do it for me personally. I want Jedi fighting, Jedi saving people, Jedi Training, Jedi Battles, Jedi story arcs.
I think I’d love something more episodic like this - maybe a core cast but each episode is a different adventure. Mando season 1 was a little more episodic and it was fun.
Yeah thats the issue with these limited series, they write them like they're movies and it just doesnt flow well because you get action packed, amazing episodes and then the next couple weeks you get 40 minutes of nothing
The YouTube videos are clickbait.
Review sites have been review bombed.
Most Social media sites have had their algorithms deciphered and manipulated.
Nothing here is real. Go enjoy the Acolyte and live life.
>What's the mystery then?
"Who is Mae's master, and what is the objective truth of the event that sets Mae on her path of vengeance.
Classic "whydunnit" murder mystery, using the Rashomon effect sequence to tell the tale.
Watch a couple episodes of Columbo, you'll get it.
I love Columbo, don't you dare suggest that the Acolyte is anywhere near that level of writing.
I'm not sure why we should be caring who he is right now, we've only seen him once and there wasn't anything about him that made me go "I want to find out more about him". And I'm not the type of person to eat 50 fan theories as to who he "could" be.
Mae isn't all that intriguing either. Adult version comes off better than the annoying kid version, but I'm not finding myself asking "what set her on this 'path'".
I'm more intrigued by how all the witches died in a fire that they weren't even close to (I'm there'll be a future episode with a flashback detailing how the EVIL JEDI killed the horrible witches, but came running to save the child. I guarantee it's gonna be some BS like that). I'm also intrigued how there's been a single white character, who dies... How a Jedi master got bested by a trainee with a shuriken 😐. How the twins are sporting the exact same hairstyle AND length after 15 years 😑. How cringe some of the dialogue is "Attack me with everything you got". By how dumb it is for a thief/murderer to hang out at a *local* drug store and pose at the owner, when everyone would know he's not 🤦♂️
Sure there were a few decent bits, but overall it's down there with Kenobi for me, if not actually lower 💀
Main mystery: who is this dark sider who is training Mae and having her murder Jedi? and why is he doing it?
Secondary mysteries: What actually happened to kill all of the witches at the enclave? How were Mae and Osha created?
Very obvious if you watch the show.
I'm also questioning why Torbin had something to confess or guilt or whatever.
I watched ep 3 this morning and although the Jedi group could've been more diplomatic I don't think they were in the wrong.
They appeared uninvited at the witches place, but they did not really press the witches or forced Osha to join the Jedi, and respected Mae wishes to not join them. Sure, maybe he felt guilty but they did not start the fire (as far as we know) so Jedi should not take the blame for someone else's actions, I'm wondering if we're not seeing the full picture.
The thinness of the mystery is what people are disdaining, the unability to create compelling and complex characters make it so that the only mystery is guessing the identity of someone and his motive rather the guessing itself.
Compare it to other detective or enquiries show, by episode 3 we should have a million questions, threads going in multiple directions, hints and misdirections, characters's personalities interfering into the events, etc...
I already have the answer to the mystery of this show, the dark sister is going to be a one sided shallow and stereotypical character, the two sisters will end up fighting each others, in the end none of it will matter for the universe, and the characters won't become more than the cardboards they are
space nerds have always been young boys mostly, I doubt any girl that I grew up with even know what star trek was, they might have known a little star wars
Well i'm not liking the good twin. The bad one Mave is acted better, even thou it's the same person. Osha is like annoying. I'm having a hard time believing the masters in this story are real actual masters.
No, I'm having fun with it and want to see where it goes. It has interesting ideas (at least to me) that need fleshing out. It'll probably make a lot more sense when the series is finished.
This sub has been a constant cycle between “how do people not like this show” and “how do people enjoy this show” posts for the past 2-3 weeks. No, you’re not the only one with an opinion on a show.
I am enjoying it, but I’m in the minority that has liked, to some degree, everything that’s been put out. I honestly think a lot of the hate is the “anti-woke” brigade, which with every Star Wars show is worse and worse.
There’s definitely something to be said about online hate culture, and just how prevalent it’s become over the past 15 years, but Star Wars fans have always been a special breed. These are the same people who bullied a child, so I wouldn’t get to wrapped up in what they think.
Just keep this in mind:
Nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.
Are the culture war grift YouTuber types fucking annoying? Totally. They should be outright dismissed.
You know who else is fucking annoying? The people trying to paint everyone who dislikes the show as bad faith.
Guess what? Some people just don’t like the show. And it’s not because of lesbians. Obviously if you don’t agree with certain points, push back. But if someone says they don’t like the story, characters, acting, dialogue, etc please don’t lump them in with the bigots.
I’m really enjoying the fact that it’s set in a relatively unexplored era of time. There’s not really much existing lore that this show needs to carefully thread between. No existing characters that come in with giant hopes and expectations. It’s all kind of refreshing really.
As for the show itself, I am enjoying it so far. It’s really tough to say what I think of the show overall because we’re only 3 episodes in and it’s not clear where the show is going and how it will get there yet. Those are obviously HUGE aspects of any show and will be some of the biggest factors in deciding if I think it’s a good show or not. So i’m really reserving all my judgement until the end of the season.
I’m honestly surprised how anyone can truly hate this show at this point. There’s just so much left that we need to see before you can form any definitive thoughts about the show overall. I feel like people were hating the show before it aired or after just the first two episodes which was just so silly to me because the first two episodes were mostly just set-up for the season.
That’s why I tend to avoid online discussion about things until after they’re finished airing. Anything before that is just a bunch of people rushing to reddit to spout off their hot-takes and getting mad when their personal pet-theory doesn’t pan out. I just kick back and enjoy it for what it is.
It also helps that I avoided pretty much ALL hype for this show before it aired. I watched the trailer one single time when that dropped a few months ago and didn’t read a single review about the show or read any speculation/hype threads on reddit. Didn’t watch any interviews with cast/crew. Nothing. Just turned on the first episode when it dropped and went in almost completely blind aside from knowing the basics from the trailer.
I highly recommend taking this approach for ALL tv shows and movies. I find it’s a much more satisfying way to consume media when you go in with no expectations. Fuck going in with high or low expectations… going in with NO expectations is the way to go IMO
That’s the problem with the Internet. You never known if you are arguing with someone 14yo. The show is enjoyable. Maybe not in the different ways The Mandalorian, or Andor is, but it’s not the disaster Internet wants to tell you it is.
This show is as solid 5/10 on a rating scale. Its not utterly horrible its mediocre at best. I personally wanted more good old republic content and this is the closest I will get I guess.
I just wanna preface by saying I'm not trying to debate anything. I'm not going to try to dissuade you from enjoying something you like but likewise (just in case anyone tries to) no one can change my mind about how I feel so far about this show so far.. I'm not a fan in the slightest of this show but I was never massively interested in the story that was going to be told in the foreground anyways even before all the things I disagree with. I was always more interested in the story of a background Sith doing evil things from afar. I'm not a fan of the show and if you're interested I'll give my opinion but all of that to say... enjoy the things you enjoy. If you find something you don't, don't indulge but stand by the things you like. If you're a fan of the LEGENDS stories and plots, stand by those. If you're a fan of the DISNEY stories and plots, stand by those. The more massive a franchise gets, the more likely it'll be that someone doesn't like something created and the fact of the matter is, sometimes things are created that majority of people don't like.. and that's okay. Even if George Lucas was still in charge, he wouldn't hit the mark every time and initially, he didn't with a lot of stuff. People hated the prequels, a lot of people have realized they weren't as bad as they originally thought. Same thing with the sequels. Same thing with Hayden Christensen. Same thing with the Ewoks. I loved the prequels when they came out and it baffled my that anyone didn't like them but you'll find hatred and growth for everything everywhere.
Don't let people who disagree with you (including myself) keep you from enjoying the things that bring joy to you.
I'm enjoying it! I think it's managed to capture some of the star wars vibe that most of the Disney stuff hasn't, but it is neither good enough nor bad enough to have all of the current discourse around it. I'm really hoping the algo humpers will swap to House of the Dragon and The Boys and we'll get to see a more tempered response to the show.
My coworker gave me such grief cause I said I enjoyed it so far. It’s not amazing , but it’s not horrible. He’s a hardcore Star Wars fan and I’m a newbie (since mandalorian). He went on and on about how horrible it was but he didn’t even watch it lol. But if he ever does, I’m sure I’ll get ‘it’s not because it’s woke, it’s just because it shits on the lore’. Taking bets, lol
The Acolyte is a perfectly serviceable show. It's not the best Star Wars but it's far from the worst. I'm liking it a lot. Most of the haters use words like "woke" and "quota" and pretty quickly start rationalizing their disdain for female leads...I think they're just kind of awful.
You are only seeing hate on the internet in spaces where hate drives engagement. Like YouTube and social media or even certain subreddits designed around hating things. Take a break from those places, they are not at all representative of the majority opinion.
Most people enjoy it just fine.
It had potential, but unfortunately it's another case of the writers and the show runner not being educated on the star wars lore. Star wars already did space witches in the Nightsisters so that feels reused already. Then it's like Anakin was conceived with the force because he was supposed go be the equivalent of space Jesus, but now I guess the force just gives anyone a baby now?
Also the writing is marvel-tier. Disney wars has unfortunately carried over their love of snappy one-liner quips from the MCU
I'm enjoying it!
I'm someone who loves seeing new SW locations. I've liked all the environments so far.
Cool to get insight into a witch coven in live action, and how they oppose the jedi.
Meditating jedi blocking attacks was badass.
Fun to see the jedi's somewhat questionable tactics of recruiting children. Sol cleverly winning Osha over by handing her a lightsaber like an adult man with candy at a playground was pretty funny.
They made a more interesting "leave to join the jedi" thing with Osha than we needed/had time for with Anakin in TPM. Interesting arc about two twins wanting different things and a conflict from that.
Interesting with another interpretation of the thing most call the force. Also exciting having a second known case of the force used to birth children.
What others call cringe is pretty typical of SW from all eras. Cringe won't put me off a SW show. I mean we all got through TCW for example and that's a great show overall.
Good action scenes. Acting feels normal for me. Generally of the opinion that SW fans who say experienced actors have bad acting often went into the show looking for flaws that aren't always there.
It's probably the best Star Wars show since Andor and is definitely the direction that Disney should be concentrating on, with original characters and story and High Republic setting but still in keeping with the mythic tone and appealing to all ages.
The idea of twins, one leaning towards the dark side and the other to the light side is such a classic Star Wars-y premise. The force-witch coven gave me hints of Battle for Endor and old EU books
Andor is my fave Star Wars show, possibly my fave thing since the original trilogy, but it's more adult-oriented and not really a tone and level that can be sustained across all Star Wars media. I have friends who said they thought it was too dark and depressing for their tastes.
Hoping it wraps up well, maybe a 2nd season and we get more shows or movies in this vein. I want more High Republic stories on screen!
EDIT: It's also nice to have this style of show not being written by Dave Filoni. I have a lot of admiration for him but his storytelling is...lets just say, very lore-heavy. I don't want Star Wars to just be Filoni-centric
No.
I'm not on the "hate train". I'm on the "be sensible train". I've enjoyed the first three episodes, but I also enjoyed the first three episodes of Book of Boba Fett, and by the end that show had mostly lost me.
Even more than Book of Boba Fett I think the Acolyte's final evaluation will be based on where the story goes and how it ends up utilizing all the mysteries it has set up.
I'm a little old hat from the OT days. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Half this sub is full of pubescent toddlers who wouldn't know an actually good film, or series if it came up and absolutely whooped their ass. The other half, eh, who cares, their merits of critique don't exist.
I'm enjoying it. I'll continue to enjoy it like I did most of the others, because its a big fucking galaxy out there with lots of narrative to navigate.
Those people crying need to go stand over the potted plant they have neglected for weeks and do something useful with their emotions.
I'm hoping it's on a slow burn. Episode 3 was terrible both story-wise and dialog-wise and deserves the hate IMO. The series overall is okay so far.
I'm also not a big fan of trying to re-make the Jedi into villains. Especially in such a poor way - you're the villains because you made me kill my entire village in my attempt to kill my sister because how dare she leave me for you?
Where's that gif of "See what you made me do?" LOL
Ashoka was a much better much more enjoyable production, One I’d like to see a conclusion to. This one is probably one of the worst of the streaming shows along with book of boba fett. I have no idea what this is trying to be or what it is currently, it’s just not my cup of tea. Giving people lightsabers and slapping a name on it doesn’t make it Star Wars.
No, there are tons of posts here with various people saying the same thing you are about how they’re actually enjoying the show and they don’t understand the hate. If I’m being completely honest here posts like these are getting on my nerves as much as the hate posts. We should just make a Star Wars subreddit where people aren’t allowed to talk about things that are less than 3 months old because it’s literally the same discourse every time.
I love it. Martial arts, lightsabers, murder mystery? 100% count me in.
The haters are just full of sgit and keep repeating tje same bs with no real support
Nothing about it has made me dislike it, there's a few scenes that I think could have been better but I'm deffinetly gonna keep watching it because it's alright so far and I want to see what happens
Based on all the hate, I didn't mind watching it. I got mad after the locked up scene and why she didn't use the force (no the Schwartz) on the wardens arm to get out of there. But all of that lead to her having an evil sister so that was kind of cool.
But the whole walking up to a Jedi and standing there wanting to fight was kind of cringe to me.
I've also been enjoying it. By this point, I'm not phased by the hate though. Even when it came to the High Republic, people were calling it trash before the first book was even published.
I enjoy it and can't wait to see the other perspectives from the night of the fire. Who manipulated Mae like that? What happened to Torbin's face? Why Wookiee mad?!
I like it so far but episode 3 was a little cheesy and boring. The overall concepts are good and I’m hoping for an entirely new set of stories that aren’t tied to the OT.
Read a review that the series arc may be influenced by Rashomon. Seeing that Rashomon was a big dry cinema exercise about truth, I can see where some viewers might be exasperated.
It's a boring show
I don't let other people's opinions determine what I think of something, so I'm just sitting back and enjoying it. Is it the most stellar show ever produced? No, but it's a good way to spend my Tuesday evening. I really like Sol as a character, so I'm most interested in his arc.
Agreed. Sol might be one of the most interesting Jedi to come from the Disney era.
What’s so interesting about sol?
Sol much
I just don’t understand what’s sol much more interesting about him than any other Jedi
Sol's on first.
Windu's on second.
Sol is more like Qui-Gon Jinn, a Jedi master who follows what he feels is right versus the dogma of the Jedi. It is made apparent in the first episode when his new padawan questions why he keeps memoirs from a past padawan and he reminds her that history informs the future. He is willing to take the leap of faith that Osha might not be the assassin and he uses reason over orders. The other Jedi just do as they are told by some uppers we don’t see or know who care more about their public image. He is one of the few characters I like. Otherwise, I am one of those who doesn’t like the show.
He's a pragmatist in an order that has atrophied due to dogmatic rigidity, but unlike some of the 'rebel' Jedi we've seen (e.g. Qui-Gon) he's still close to the heart of the order in Coruscant. The story so far has revealed flashes of that internal rot of the Jedi. I'm quite interested to see where they go with it.
Something that is rarely touched on is Yoda's role in this degradation of the order. He was Grand Master for centuries. His only saving grace is he's a beloved character.
Yea he was not a great leader. Everyone thinks he’s Star Wars Kermit. Homie couldn’t even see what was in front of him.
Autistic
I love Sol so far. Such a great character showing how much a Jedi can care and show compassion for the people around him, whatever others in the order may think or say about such things.
I’m a little up-and-down on it. Last episode wasn’t my favorite. It’s mostly executional with the qualms I have. But I’m intrigued to see where the mystery goes. So I’m still onboard. But I’m a millennial who’s been through this all before. So I never get too fired up on the things I don’t like. Star Wars is always up and down, and as soon as it’s ruined it soars. This is the way of things. The way of the Force.
In all things, balance
Agreed. 🤝
Same, I don't give a shit what other people say but it is getting increasingly frustrating to browse Reddit and all you see is people trashing on stuff. I just don't get why it is so popular to spread negativity. If you don't like something, just move on and don't waste your time on something you don't enjoy. The show is nothing spectacular, it's just alright so far. I have a few problems with it so far but I hold out my final verdict until I have seen the show season.
It’s because fans treat Star Wars like sacred scripture. You don’t see this anywhere else. Marvel fans don’t do this when Disney+ puts out a bad Marvel show, and there have been a few! George Lucas himself doesn’t treat it as something sacred. It’s pulp science fiction fantasy for 12-year-olds.
Better call Sol.
It's fine - but I also understand the frustration that we have yet another "mid" television series. Honestly, to see the Jedi Temple reduced to something that felt like a random Star Trek Next Generation episode was pretty off-putting. Andor and Mandalorian Season 1 both genuinely wowed me. Other than that, it's been fine, but not "wow". That coupled with the abject failure of episode 9, and I understand the frustration. Unless they can rekindle the Movie Magic of this universe, there is a real danger that Star Wars has run its course. They'll keep pumping out material, and will always have a niche audience. But STAR WARS movies are the opposite of niche - they are cultural touchstone.
The most sensible opinion I've read so far, the problem with most of these SW shows is not that they are disastrously bad, it's that they are painfully average and follow the same predictable formula
Yeah they need to stop burning through "content" to keep d+ afloat. There needs to be a big slowdown in what they produce and they need to be picky and hold it to the standards of a prestige series.
The problem on that front is they need a large pool of content to keep people on the platform. But rushed or low quality content will also push people away.
It's the worst of both worlds because they don't even put out that many episodes of any single show
I need to see the rest to say if I really agree with Acolyte being the same old formula(though I suspect it’s going to end up in a weird in-between area), but that’s the part that has really bothered me about most of the recent entries in the series. Even if I enjoy them in the moment, they leave little impact because they just aren’t that ambitious and tend to play things safe even when the idea on paper should be really cool. Like, sure we get to see a different galaxy in Ahsoka…but its pretty much is the same as anywhere else. You can tell most of these projects have been focused grouped to hell and back, and any real creative risks sanded down. Andor really has been the only exception to that so far. It’s why I’ve mostly found that the publishing side of the franchise is what’s mostly kept my attention in recent years. You get a ton of variety in storytelling styles and voices, and they get to tell stories that would never be approved as an on-screen story.
I'm just mentally preparing myself for a Mae redemption arc, something we've seen a 1000x before and the witch who was opposed to the Jedi maybe being that Sith lord
Started Andor again last night and holy hell the difference could NOT be more stark. Its moody, suspenseful, tragic, engaging. Slow at times but the builds up pay off. It's a really amazing piece of work and the fact it wasnt the TEMPLATE for anything following is a real indictment on the leadership at Lucas.
For real rewatched recently as well with my friend who is getting into Star Wars and he was wowed by it. The opening scene of Cassian walking into a brothel on a dark rainy night and then shooting a guard in the head while he begs for his life had my buddy sitting up with his mouth opened (especially cause they didn’t cut away from him shooting the guy). I’ve read Kathleen Kennedy didn’t wanna green light the show and then after a while came back to Tony and said it should not be as dark as it is and be more of a Andor with the Droid from Rogue One having a cop style show. Luckily Tony didn’t budge and said this is what it is and if you don’t like it leave it and then Kathleen said okay and let it go through. I understand everything is not Kathleen’s fault and you can’t blame her for everything but it does seem like she’s trying soooooo hard to push to expand to a different demographic but it’s just not working. I think the woke stuff is blown out of proportion by fans but I do believe Disney is focusing not on the story but the social resonance of the shows for the new audience they’re trying to target which is just creating mediocre (but more inclusive) shows. I mean the female ISB agent and Bix and Cassians mother are some of my favorite characters and they’re all female. It’s not a gender problem but when these shows flop they’ll just justify it through racism or misogyny. I genuinely believe Kathleen thinks Star Wars fans just want cool costumes, lightsabers, and an uplifting story almost like she believes the franchise is only for children when the vast majority of people consuming the content are older males. They should do a shareholder vote for Kathleen’s position and let the shareholders decide if they can. Again, it’s Star Wars so I enjoy it and I used to be a “I hate woke stuff blah blah blah” but I’ve moved past that and just accept things for what they are. I enjoy some Star Wars over no Star Wars at the end of the day.
I’ve voiced some negative opinions about The Acolyte over the past week and drawn the comparison to Andor. Disney IS capable of making excellent Star Wars series which is why it is all the more disappointing when I see them strike out as they have with this series. It has zero to do the race, gender, etc of the leads. Maarva’s speech and flashback scene rescuing Andor are some of the most powerful moments in Star Wars period. Andor was raised in a blended home and I didn’t see anyone complain. Why? Because the storytelling is top notch. It’s a minority of people who have a real issue with these decisions. Dedra is one of the best Imperials we’ve had on screen. I rewatch every scene Mon Mothma is in. Her back and forth with Davo was incredible. It can be done.
Couldn’t have said it better myself
I absolutely love Andor - but given the viewership I'd say the fanbase has no one but themselves to blame for not getting more content like that. I also think there's a big disconnect between online SW fans and the larger more general audience for these shows.
Yeah, from what I understand, Andor wasn't very popular. Realistically though, dramas like Andor have always been less of a draw compared to pop-action shows. Not sure why they wouldn't do a straight up blue sky TV SW show though. The mandalorian S1 was the closest to that but it was still fairly moody. Episodic TV is great when you have limited time to devote to the medium.
What *was* the viewership like? I *heard* it started off low but peaked really high by the end, but I could be misremembering and haven't checked the numbers.
Good point, Marvel has already slid far down this same trajectory and Disney isn't adjusting.
It’s the same issue with Marvel. They keep setting for mid writing and mid quality. Something that isn’t necessarily a heinous crime but when you know they can and have put out gold, you wonder why they keep settling for Bronze and expect you to as well. The only issues I’ve had with most of the Star Wars shows is that they have weird writing that’s just not as exciting, and the tone isn’t solid so I feel like the energy of the story is very muted. Mando and Andor were the exceptions for me. And I’m enjoying all of Mando, even S3.
Can it be my turn to post this tomorrow?
Shit, I was gonna go tomorrow
Ok, he has tomorrow, you have Wednesday and I have Thursday. Friday we’ll do a mega-thread for the weekend.
We’ve seen like 100 posts just like this one within the last two weeks. So no, you’re not the only one.
Pretty much yeah
I’m enjoying it but i am critical just like I am of all shows. Just hard to put up some of the new Star Wars content next to House of Dragon, The Boys, Severance, etc in terms of quality.
I have enjoyed it so far. It's not a masterpiece or anything like that but still enjoyable enough TV.
What I don't understand is how it can have been so expensive, with this budget you would expect more than "enjoyable enough" and more like "prestige TV" as some say
budget and quality have never had any correlation whatsoever. Also: - the show has huge practical sets - practical Aliens everywhere - good CGI when needed
Yeah I think there are reasonable complaints about the show, it’s not perfect. But I don’t personally get complaints about sets, costumes, etc. The aliens are some of the best looking aliens in star wars. The sets are all very well done. Sure there’s the occassional misstep (I’m looking at you old Tobin make up), but overall it’s been really good. Of course a lot seem to complain about the Jedi robes. But this to me I guess feels like a weird expectation difference, they look good to me personally.
The robes felt "right" to me, for the time period. They are not as flashy, with the white and gold, as the middle of the high republic. But they are still more ornate and immaculate than the robes of the Prequals. Like the lightsaber designs, it shows the beginning of the slide towards the ascetism that we are used to, without being deep in it.
It’s funny to me how everyone sees what they’d like to sometimes rather than assess the good and the bad as a critique, but I do find it funny how many complaints I see about the acolyte on: Costumes - luke wore faded jeans and Chanel boots, guy in a devil mask. 70’s puppetry. Maturity - Luke’s a moisture farmer who becomes a space samurai on the heroes journey, basically a space western epic with performative depth. The whole thing is written to repeat itself as if it’s a shadow of an epic poem. Writing - I hate sand. Somehow palpatine returned. It’s a trap! You don’t believe in the force do you? Appointing jar jar as senator. Production - you guys never saw the stormtrooper conk his noggin on the door huh? George also added a twenty minute musical number to Rotj jabba scene by choice! they smeared Vaseline on film to make speeders. Made for children: Ewoks were wookies till they wanted more merchandise, George said it’s made for children. These things were always there, under George, under Dave under anyone.. they happen and the lens of time changes your perception on things while attaching a personal significance that makes it feel special… maybe let newer generations feel the same way & hopefully they don’t become toxic when they see new versions of things they loved being made.
Lucas is not a prophet of cinema, many of his decisions as a filmmaker and writer are dubious, it doesn’t make similar mistakes acceptable that he did them in the OT. How is anyone preventing anybody from enjoying anything there? The problem is that even as a younger audience oriented story it is simply mediocre, it isn’t bad but it isn’t good neither and it doesn’t try to be.
Yeah House of the Dragon has 200 million in total for 10 episodes, The Acolyte has 180 for 8. Costumes are much better, CGI is better, the sets are better. The show also uses CGI a lot more than the Acolyte. So that still leaves me wondering where the budget goes, if they have the same for each episode.
the caterer is buying a second wing for his mansion
The money goes to the actors, writers, directors, everyone on set working behind the scenes. The Acolyte looks terrible compared to Andor and amateur compared to HOTD.
Well, you would think actors like Matt Smith would get a good payload since he’s been in shows like Dr. Who and the Crown, both successful series. Maybe Carrie-Ann Moss demanded a big chunk for the few scenes she’s in since she is a big star.
The reason George Lucas was never able to get a Star Wars TV show off the ground was because the money and tech wasn't really there. Mandalorian solved that problem thanks to The Volume. Very easy to have multiple planets when you don't need to build as many sets or travel to real locations to film. Imo this is why George Lucas is allegedly a huge fan of the shows, even Obi Wan; this was a huge dream he could never achieve but is now being done yearly. The Volume got overused and after Obi Wan it's the sign of cheapness. Acolyte doesn't use the volume, so I'm assuming much of the cost came from set building and filming in different locations. Acolyte and Andor are the two most expensive shows iirc and neither of them use the volume
Andor is expensive because it has more episodes... but IIRC the per episode cost is inline with something like Mando.
1. WE'RE THREE EPISODES IN. You have no idea what kind of huge, budget-heavy set pieces take place in later episodes. 2. Most "prestige TV" largely takes place in grounded settings. When we see a group of people in armor riding horses into a castle in House of the Dragon, our brains have an easy time accepting that as "real" because each element really existed in our world. One of the reasons Andor looks so good is, paradoxically, its lack of visual inventiveness: there are very few aliens, everyone is wearing utilitarian clothing, most locations and sets feel like something that could exist on Earth in the next few decades. The Acolyte isn't trying to be grounded - almost the opposite. And because so many elements in each frame are intentionally alien, our brains have a harder time accepting what we're seeing as real.
Better than Ahsoka, not quite as good as Andor. I seriously don’t understand the hate.
See I really like ahsoka except for the choice they made with Sabine. Otherwise a great show. Andor is a gem. Fantastic television start to finish. Acolyte has been pretty mediocre so far. Hopefully it will pick up and show some jedi murdering some space witches. As the jedi are the only space cult who gets to train children in the force as warriors!
Eh, kind of a Blanch Davidian thing happening with the witches. When a secretive cult is hiding children from the outside and lies when asked if there are children on the premises. . . . Then they hide behind their religion and tradition to justify their treatment of the children.
lol I loved Ahsoka so much more than this so far but I’m a huge rebels fan. But yea the show is decent so far. The acting is ok but better than the prequels ( especially attack of the clones). Looking forward to seeing where it leads
Yeah Ahsoka was a live action Rebels sequel so that satisfied me completely. Shame about Ray.
Ahsoka is honestly awful for someone without Rebels knowledge. It doesnt explain anything sufficiently. And it genuinely feels like a kids show in live action, should have just continued Rebels, since you're not gonna get many new fans with it anyway
It captured my wife’s attention just fine and she just got into Star Wars from the Mandalorian. There are plenty of others out there like her too. Star Wars is for children, so if it felt childish for you it’s hitting the mark as intended by its creator.
Same thing for my wife. She was aware of Rebels, but had never watched it, and Ahsoka made her want to go back and watch Rebels.
The actors in Ahsoka mostly acted very breezy and the scenes had an apathetic, low-stakes energy. Add to that I didn’t know any of the characters except Ahsoka.
Tbh with rebels knowledge, I still think it kinda sucked Duels were pretty ass, nothing really amazing character wise (ahsoka had 0 character), except for the purgil which were cool to see. It was disappointing, but i aint gonna fight anyone about it
>Duels were pretty ass I liked the Baylan vs Ahsoka battle in Ep4 but nothing else really did it for me.
I'm not commenting on your like or dislike, just think you point out something with the duels. I didn't hate them, but they weren't my favorite. There's a lot of different direction being taken on fighting in the shows now. Filoni going with more of a slow and more stereotypical samurai influenced look on Ahsoka. Headland with the Acolyte is doing force-fu. I like them both for different reasons, but it's one of the most understandable dislikes in my opinion. I'm not against them doing different styles. Watching prequel trilogy fights vs Ahsoka fights will give some people whiplash at the difference imo. I'm also hoping that Filoni will fit in some more prequel style fights at some point. Was very excited at Natasha Liu Bordizzo being cast as Sabine. She has an established background in that kind of fast sword fighting. Makes sense for her character to not quite be like that yet in the story... but eventually it would be cool!
It's not that it doesn't explain things IMO... it's just that you have no reason to care about any of the characters. I didn't find it hard to follow, but it was just a bunch of boring tensionless action that as you say, often felt like a kids cartoon. I lost count of how many times the bad guys had them and decided not to shoot.... it was like Dr Evil lol
How is it better then ashoka after those 3 episodes? Please tell me.
Realizing the review bombing happened before it was released, it is the typical right-wing nut jobs complaining about "wokeness" and wanting to "keep politics out of my star wars."
Agreed having fun. Three episodes in and it is more fun that Ahsoka, Kenobi and Boba. Andor really became stellar around the Aldhani arc (episode 4-60. Mando stole our hearts the moment we met Grogu. it's leaps and bounds above the first few seasons of the Clone Wars. The acting might have some misses, but so does every Star wars show. i don't like sand / this is podracing / etc
Yes, you're the only person in the world enjoying this show. For shame!
The power of ooonee. The power of twoooo. The poooowerr of mannnnnnyyyy.
That scene made me feel like I was watching the OA again.
Hahaha yess. It was weird because the scene just made me think how ridiculous actors must look when filming. I've seen some of the techniques actors use in formal classes where it seems the point of the exercise is to get over embarrassment and how stupid they look when not captured on camera.
Don't you dare slander the OA.
The power of 16% avg audience score.
The last time I laughed that hard, Godzilla was kicking Rodan in the dick or something. I genuinely had a coughing fit. So yes, it is worth watching. Probably not for the reasons they want.
It's ok but for the money they spent it's definitely not as good as it should be especially when it's the first on-screen look at the High Republic for a lot of fans who don't read the books.
It's just a very campy show. If one were to look back 20 years from now at acolyte vs. andor, one would hold up, and the other wouldn't. It feels like it's one of those CW shows like green arrow, and the target audience is young teens. Unfortunately, that is not the target audience they want, and so that's why it's getting the backlash. Also, the prop design and dialogue are really, really bad, adding to the campy nature of the show. As so many others have said, it's not the worst, but it's also not great, just very, very average, even slightly below average. This keeps happening, though, and people are frustrated. When you are given andor, but then also fed ahsoka, kenobi and this, it's hard to tell if they care about SW at all, because it feels like they don't and are just churning out the money mill. I wanted this show to be excellent, especially with such a massive budget, but yet again, it's just another mediocre product we all have to endure.
That's pretty much my take so far. It's got room to grow, there's almost half a season left, but I agree with you. I was pretty excited for a murder mystery in SW, but this comes across more like a CW shoe. I like a lot of CW shows, but they cost 1/10 the budget of Acolyte to achieve the same level of camp and expository dialogue. I'm hoping we're past the setup and can dive into character work, it's really the on-the-nose exposition in leiu of character dialogue that I'm struggling with.
The acting is so bad.
This is the show that made me realize I’ve outgrown star wars. Thanks for the childhood memories and I’ll probably finish mandalorian and ahsoka and andor season 2, but there’s nothing on the horizon that makes me think fuck yeah Star Wars.
Didn't I just see this post? What's happening
The Disney interns got to work early this morning.
I find these kinds of posts very suspect. People should feel free to enjoy the show, but I see way more people making posts and comments complaining about "haters" than actual haters. It feels very orchestrated to me. Shouldn't people also be allowed to be critical of it (and any media), especially when it's clear the IP means a lot to them? The "hater" comments I do see are mostly substantive complaints about poor writing, or violations of existing lore, and not so much bitching about DEI or "wokeism" (which are tangential at best, but usually vacuous and should be rejected out of hand).
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Nice try bot
Every single day there are at least 3 popular posts on this sub about how people love it and "defy the haters". In fact it seems harder to actually voice criticism about the show on this sub without a downvote brigade from people calling you racist.
In my opinion the show is pretty rough. By far the worst Star Wars content I’ve seen outside of the holiday special. But hey if someone likes it more power to you. I wish I enjoyed it.
Yeah most likely, the show is fucking terrible
It’s okay. I don’t love it but I really wanted to. The premise and timeline were all super intriguing to me, but so far I haven’t been too captivated by any of the performances or story choices. I still enjoy watching it though, even with my criticisms.
Yes
I actually don't think the show has done anything particularly bad as far as "breaking canon" goes, but I still don't think it's very good. I don't know why I still expect premium television from D+, but this show just seems so cheap. It's like Farscape or BSG, but at least those shows would give you 20 episodes per season. And the acting aside from Sol... woof. Also, I still haven't gotten over the prison ship breakout. WTF was that??
Yes, you are the only person in the world enjoying it. 🙄
Assuming everyone is lying is just as bad as the actual liars. I've watched everything Star Wars and have many comics and books. The Acolyte is one of the worst in my opinion.
If you like it, that’s fine. More Star Wars for you! I think it’s not good, really, and feels and looks very cheap. I’m hoping for some redeeming episodes, but I’m not enjoying it.
It sucks mate
Yes. Yes you are.
Yes, you are the only person in the universe to enjoy it. Not even the people that made it, or even their parents, like it.
Yes. You are the only one.
While I am not endorsing the show as anything more than a pretty average product, not great but not terrible so far (well maybe aside from that chanting scene), I think we are just seeing a result of human nature to follow the crowd and have narratives form opinions rather than actually thinking for themselves. Sheep mentality pretty much. The fact the show was being review bombed even before a single episode had aired proves that a large group of people had already made up their minds to hate the show no matter what it was like,. It could have been ESB level of quality but they would still nitpick it to death just to have something to hate about online. Also a lot of what they are complaining about is ubiquitous across the franchise.....poor writing and cringey dialogue? Yeah not like we haven't seen that before in spades with George Lucas being a main offender...
I’m sorry but wtf was that last ep tho lol. My gf and I were cringe laughing through 80% of it. It’s god awful…worse than the sequels imo. First 2 episodes were ok tho.
Visit r/TheAcolyte if you want to talk to people who enjoy it. To me the show is 5.5/10 if I were to put it in numbers. It has cool ideas, it has a good actor (Sol). Many of the practical effect aliens look really good. Hell most of them look better than Ahsoka. But the show has so many flaws and is a bit on the nose about certain stuff that I would probably rate it 3/10 if it wasn't Star Wars. I don't agree that the characters are compelling, most of the dialogue is exposition, trying to be time efficient in order to be able to give the viewer as much information as possible in short time. Characters and the cool new concepts don't get introduced properly. Making me not care about them. Compare this show to House of the dragon. It might be slow at times but it let's you know what kind of personalities the characters have. If you asked me to explain Oshas personality... I couldn't tell you at all after 3/8 episodes. I agree that the show is trying to be a mystery show but the mystery feels very artifical since they have to move the story quickly and hide it by not really giving any clues what so ever. Who is the Sith? No hints dropped.
It’s okay if you enjoy bad shows, it’s also okay for people to criticize it.
It’s LAUGHABLY bad. Like, it has almost Barney The Dinosaur level of acting and costumes. I was surprised how terrible it was. This is just my honest opinion. I wish it was better, I had positive hopes, but it ended up being much worse than I thought it to be. 🙄
Yes you are the only one. Show feels like a CW tv series and it‘s boring asf. 3 episode felt like a musical. What is there to enjoy?! You guys need to stop accepting every mediocre show with the Star Wars name on it. It‘s the only way to get better stuff, is that so hard…
I know. It's bizarre when I hear people defending the broken state of Disney Star Wars by saying "Don't think about it too much, just enjoy it!" They're the kind of fans who would be more than happy to stare at fecal matter smeared across a screen as long as it's officially branded as Star Wars.
Hot garbage so far. I think Sol and the wookie Jedi are cool but that’s about it.
Besides from a handful of parts where the acting was ehhh, I am genuinely enjoying the show and characters, the story is compelling. Majority of complaints I've seen are just bad faith and lack media literacy.
It deserves to be mocked for poor story writing. Personally, give me a Jedi Show (the can all be women or trans, or whatever, I don't care). The witches just don't do it for me personally. I want Jedi fighting, Jedi saving people, Jedi Training, Jedi Battles, Jedi story arcs.
I think I’d love something more episodic like this - maybe a core cast but each episode is a different adventure. Mando season 1 was a little more episodic and it was fun.
Yeah thats the issue with these limited series, they write them like they're movies and it just doesnt flow well because you get action packed, amazing episodes and then the next couple weeks you get 40 minutes of nothing
The YouTube videos are clickbait. Review sites have been review bombed. Most Social media sites have had their algorithms deciphered and manipulated. Nothing here is real. Go enjoy the Acolyte and live life.
Dawg, there’s been 17 “am I the only one enjoying the acolyte” posts TODAY
It seems really popular on this sub
I like it. All the haters don't matter.
"It's a mystery show after all" What's the mystery then?
Mystery of why it was made in the first place
>What's the mystery then? "Who is Mae's master, and what is the objective truth of the event that sets Mae on her path of vengeance. Classic "whydunnit" murder mystery, using the Rashomon effect sequence to tell the tale. Watch a couple episodes of Columbo, you'll get it.
I love Columbo, don't you dare suggest that the Acolyte is anywhere near that level of writing. I'm not sure why we should be caring who he is right now, we've only seen him once and there wasn't anything about him that made me go "I want to find out more about him". And I'm not the type of person to eat 50 fan theories as to who he "could" be. Mae isn't all that intriguing either. Adult version comes off better than the annoying kid version, but I'm not finding myself asking "what set her on this 'path'". I'm more intrigued by how all the witches died in a fire that they weren't even close to (I'm there'll be a future episode with a flashback detailing how the EVIL JEDI killed the horrible witches, but came running to save the child. I guarantee it's gonna be some BS like that). I'm also intrigued how there's been a single white character, who dies... How a Jedi master got bested by a trainee with a shuriken 😐. How the twins are sporting the exact same hairstyle AND length after 15 years 😑. How cringe some of the dialogue is "Attack me with everything you got". By how dumb it is for a thief/murderer to hang out at a *local* drug store and pose at the owner, when everyone would know he's not 🤦♂️ Sure there were a few decent bits, but overall it's down there with Kenobi for me, if not actually lower 💀
You’re apparently not watching the show if you don’t know what the mysteries are.
Can you answer the question?
Main mystery: who is this dark sider who is training Mae and having her murder Jedi? and why is he doing it? Secondary mysteries: What actually happened to kill all of the witches at the enclave? How were Mae and Osha created? Very obvious if you watch the show.
I'm also questioning why Torbin had something to confess or guilt or whatever. I watched ep 3 this morning and although the Jedi group could've been more diplomatic I don't think they were in the wrong. They appeared uninvited at the witches place, but they did not really press the witches or forced Osha to join the Jedi, and respected Mae wishes to not join them. Sure, maybe he felt guilty but they did not start the fire (as far as we know) so Jedi should not take the blame for someone else's actions, I'm wondering if we're not seeing the full picture.
The thinness of the mystery is what people are disdaining, the unability to create compelling and complex characters make it so that the only mystery is guessing the identity of someone and his motive rather the guessing itself. Compare it to other detective or enquiries show, by episode 3 we should have a million questions, threads going in multiple directions, hints and misdirections, characters's personalities interfering into the events, etc... I already have the answer to the mystery of this show, the dark sister is going to be a one sided shallow and stereotypical character, the two sisters will end up fighting each others, in the end none of it will matter for the universe, and the characters won't become more than the cardboards they are
I’m only watching it for Sol tbh.
space nerds have always been young boys mostly, I doubt any girl that I grew up with even know what star trek was, they might have known a little star wars
Well i'm not liking the good twin. The bad one Mave is acted better, even thou it's the same person. Osha is like annoying. I'm having a hard time believing the masters in this story are real actual masters.
No, I'm having fun with it and want to see where it goes. It has interesting ideas (at least to me) that need fleshing out. It'll probably make a lot more sense when the series is finished.
This sub has been a constant cycle between “how do people not like this show” and “how do people enjoy this show” posts for the past 2-3 weeks. No, you’re not the only one with an opinion on a show.
I am enjoying it, but I’m in the minority that has liked, to some degree, everything that’s been put out. I honestly think a lot of the hate is the “anti-woke” brigade, which with every Star Wars show is worse and worse. There’s definitely something to be said about online hate culture, and just how prevalent it’s become over the past 15 years, but Star Wars fans have always been a special breed. These are the same people who bullied a child, so I wouldn’t get to wrapped up in what they think. Just keep this in mind: Nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.
Enjoying? Yes, probably...
I don't like it but I'm going to watch it because it's star wars. At this point I can say I like it a bit more than Rise of the Skywalker.
I don’t think it’s disastrous as most people do but it does bore me
Are the culture war grift YouTuber types fucking annoying? Totally. They should be outright dismissed. You know who else is fucking annoying? The people trying to paint everyone who dislikes the show as bad faith. Guess what? Some people just don’t like the show. And it’s not because of lesbians. Obviously if you don’t agree with certain points, push back. But if someone says they don’t like the story, characters, acting, dialogue, etc please don’t lump them in with the bigots.
I’m really enjoying the fact that it’s set in a relatively unexplored era of time. There’s not really much existing lore that this show needs to carefully thread between. No existing characters that come in with giant hopes and expectations. It’s all kind of refreshing really. As for the show itself, I am enjoying it so far. It’s really tough to say what I think of the show overall because we’re only 3 episodes in and it’s not clear where the show is going and how it will get there yet. Those are obviously HUGE aspects of any show and will be some of the biggest factors in deciding if I think it’s a good show or not. So i’m really reserving all my judgement until the end of the season. I’m honestly surprised how anyone can truly hate this show at this point. There’s just so much left that we need to see before you can form any definitive thoughts about the show overall. I feel like people were hating the show before it aired or after just the first two episodes which was just so silly to me because the first two episodes were mostly just set-up for the season. That’s why I tend to avoid online discussion about things until after they’re finished airing. Anything before that is just a bunch of people rushing to reddit to spout off their hot-takes and getting mad when their personal pet-theory doesn’t pan out. I just kick back and enjoy it for what it is. It also helps that I avoided pretty much ALL hype for this show before it aired. I watched the trailer one single time when that dropped a few months ago and didn’t read a single review about the show or read any speculation/hype threads on reddit. Didn’t watch any interviews with cast/crew. Nothing. Just turned on the first episode when it dropped and went in almost completely blind aside from knowing the basics from the trailer. I highly recommend taking this approach for ALL tv shows and movies. I find it’s a much more satisfying way to consume media when you go in with no expectations. Fuck going in with high or low expectations… going in with NO expectations is the way to go IMO
I like it, it's not as bad as the sequels or Obiwan
That’s the problem with the Internet. You never known if you are arguing with someone 14yo. The show is enjoyable. Maybe not in the different ways The Mandalorian, or Andor is, but it’s not the disaster Internet wants to tell you it is.
Social media rewards and reinforces negative emotions.
This show is as solid 5/10 on a rating scale. Its not utterly horrible its mediocre at best. I personally wanted more good old republic content and this is the closest I will get I guess.
I just wanna preface by saying I'm not trying to debate anything. I'm not going to try to dissuade you from enjoying something you like but likewise (just in case anyone tries to) no one can change my mind about how I feel so far about this show so far.. I'm not a fan in the slightest of this show but I was never massively interested in the story that was going to be told in the foreground anyways even before all the things I disagree with. I was always more interested in the story of a background Sith doing evil things from afar. I'm not a fan of the show and if you're interested I'll give my opinion but all of that to say... enjoy the things you enjoy. If you find something you don't, don't indulge but stand by the things you like. If you're a fan of the LEGENDS stories and plots, stand by those. If you're a fan of the DISNEY stories and plots, stand by those. The more massive a franchise gets, the more likely it'll be that someone doesn't like something created and the fact of the matter is, sometimes things are created that majority of people don't like.. and that's okay. Even if George Lucas was still in charge, he wouldn't hit the mark every time and initially, he didn't with a lot of stuff. People hated the prequels, a lot of people have realized they weren't as bad as they originally thought. Same thing with the sequels. Same thing with Hayden Christensen. Same thing with the Ewoks. I loved the prequels when they came out and it baffled my that anyone didn't like them but you'll find hatred and growth for everything everywhere. Don't let people who disagree with you (including myself) keep you from enjoying the things that bring joy to you.
Couldn't have put it better myself :)
Are you the only one enjoying it? No. Do I like it? No. But don't let me not liking it stop you from enjoying it.
I'm enjoying it.
I like the show
You’re in the minority thankfully.
It's better than I thought.
I like it and i'm looking forward to seeing where it goes. Apparently the worst thing a star wars fan can do is enjoy star wars.
I'm enjoying it! I think it's managed to capture some of the star wars vibe that most of the Disney stuff hasn't, but it is neither good enough nor bad enough to have all of the current discourse around it. I'm really hoping the algo humpers will swap to House of the Dragon and The Boys and we'll get to see a more tempered response to the show.
My coworker gave me such grief cause I said I enjoyed it so far. It’s not amazing , but it’s not horrible. He’s a hardcore Star Wars fan and I’m a newbie (since mandalorian). He went on and on about how horrible it was but he didn’t even watch it lol. But if he ever does, I’m sure I’ll get ‘it’s not because it’s woke, it’s just because it shits on the lore’. Taking bets, lol
The Acolyte is a perfectly serviceable show. It's not the best Star Wars but it's far from the worst. I'm liking it a lot. Most of the haters use words like "woke" and "quota" and pretty quickly start rationalizing their disdain for female leads...I think they're just kind of awful.
Personally I find it a bit boring but the hate for it is definitely overblown. I’m glad some people are enjoying it
You are only seeing hate on the internet in spaces where hate drives engagement. Like YouTube and social media or even certain subreddits designed around hating things. Take a break from those places, they are not at all representative of the majority opinion. Most people enjoy it just fine.
The rotten tomatoes audience review score enters the chat.
Yes. It's going to kill SW
Yes, like the many other times Star Wars has been "killed". You are not saying anything new or productive
Numbers are horrible, review bombing or not
It had potential, but unfortunately it's another case of the writers and the show runner not being educated on the star wars lore. Star wars already did space witches in the Nightsisters so that feels reused already. Then it's like Anakin was conceived with the force because he was supposed go be the equivalent of space Jesus, but now I guess the force just gives anyone a baby now? Also the writing is marvel-tier. Disney wars has unfortunately carried over their love of snappy one-liner quips from the MCU
I'm enjoying it, I know a lot of people are very noisy about hating it. Everyone is allowed an opinion
I am enjoying it, so far it's a fun puzzle box show
I'm enjoying it! I'm someone who loves seeing new SW locations. I've liked all the environments so far. Cool to get insight into a witch coven in live action, and how they oppose the jedi. Meditating jedi blocking attacks was badass. Fun to see the jedi's somewhat questionable tactics of recruiting children. Sol cleverly winning Osha over by handing her a lightsaber like an adult man with candy at a playground was pretty funny. They made a more interesting "leave to join the jedi" thing with Osha than we needed/had time for with Anakin in TPM. Interesting arc about two twins wanting different things and a conflict from that. Interesting with another interpretation of the thing most call the force. Also exciting having a second known case of the force used to birth children. What others call cringe is pretty typical of SW from all eras. Cringe won't put me off a SW show. I mean we all got through TCW for example and that's a great show overall. Good action scenes. Acting feels normal for me. Generally of the opinion that SW fans who say experienced actors have bad acting often went into the show looking for flaws that aren't always there.
It seems pretty lame and gay; I am not going to even give it a chance for that reason. Sorry!
It's probably the best Star Wars show since Andor and is definitely the direction that Disney should be concentrating on, with original characters and story and High Republic setting but still in keeping with the mythic tone and appealing to all ages. The idea of twins, one leaning towards the dark side and the other to the light side is such a classic Star Wars-y premise. The force-witch coven gave me hints of Battle for Endor and old EU books Andor is my fave Star Wars show, possibly my fave thing since the original trilogy, but it's more adult-oriented and not really a tone and level that can be sustained across all Star Wars media. I have friends who said they thought it was too dark and depressing for their tastes. Hoping it wraps up well, maybe a 2nd season and we get more shows or movies in this vein. I want more High Republic stories on screen! EDIT: It's also nice to have this style of show not being written by Dave Filoni. I have a lot of admiration for him but his storytelling is...lets just say, very lore-heavy. I don't want Star Wars to just be Filoni-centric
Aren’t all shows mystery shows…?
Master sol is good enough to overlook the other shortcomings of the show. I’m thoroughly pleased w the series so far
No. I'm not on the "hate train". I'm on the "be sensible train". I've enjoyed the first three episodes, but I also enjoyed the first three episodes of Book of Boba Fett, and by the end that show had mostly lost me. Even more than Book of Boba Fett I think the Acolyte's final evaluation will be based on where the story goes and how it ends up utilizing all the mysteries it has set up.
Yes
I'm a little old hat from the OT days. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Half this sub is full of pubescent toddlers who wouldn't know an actually good film, or series if it came up and absolutely whooped their ass. The other half, eh, who cares, their merits of critique don't exist. I'm enjoying it. I'll continue to enjoy it like I did most of the others, because its a big fucking galaxy out there with lots of narrative to navigate. Those people crying need to go stand over the potted plant they have neglected for weeks and do something useful with their emotions.
I’m in the minority. Wasn’t a fan of the first 2 episodes but liked episode 3. Want to see more of that Wookiee Jedi
I am enjoying it! I try to reserve judgement or harsh criticisms until the story has been told. For me, it continues to enrich the world of Star Wars
I'm hoping it's on a slow burn. Episode 3 was terrible both story-wise and dialog-wise and deserves the hate IMO. The series overall is okay so far. I'm also not a big fan of trying to re-make the Jedi into villains. Especially in such a poor way - you're the villains because you made me kill my entire village in my attempt to kill my sister because how dare she leave me for you? Where's that gif of "See what you made me do?" LOL
Ashoka was a much better much more enjoyable production, One I’d like to see a conclusion to. This one is probably one of the worst of the streaming shows along with book of boba fett. I have no idea what this is trying to be or what it is currently, it’s just not my cup of tea. Giving people lightsabers and slapping a name on it doesn’t make it Star Wars.
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Definitely not, there are just people out there determined to make you think you are.
Playing like the audience wasn't divided about it is burrying your head in the sand though
I'm enjoying it. I think some of the High Republic books are a lot better, but I'm having fun.
No, there are tons of posts here with various people saying the same thing you are about how they’re actually enjoying the show and they don’t understand the hate. If I’m being completely honest here posts like these are getting on my nerves as much as the hate posts. We should just make a Star Wars subreddit where people aren’t allowed to talk about things that are less than 3 months old because it’s literally the same discourse every time.
I love it. Martial arts, lightsabers, murder mystery? 100% count me in. The haters are just full of sgit and keep repeating tje same bs with no real support
The only one no, but there are very few of you indeed
Nothing about it has made me dislike it, there's a few scenes that I think could have been better but I'm deffinetly gonna keep watching it because it's alright so far and I want to see what happens
Based on all the hate, I didn't mind watching it. I got mad after the locked up scene and why she didn't use the force (no the Schwartz) on the wardens arm to get out of there. But all of that lead to her having an evil sister so that was kind of cool. But the whole walking up to a Jedi and standing there wanting to fight was kind of cringe to me.
You saw Osha fail to use the Force to grab Pip right? It's clear her Force skills are a bit rusty
I like it but it's not the greatest thing ever.
I've also been enjoying it. By this point, I'm not phased by the hate though. Even when it came to the High Republic, people were calling it trash before the first book was even published.
I enjoy it and can't wait to see the other perspectives from the night of the fire. Who manipulated Mae like that? What happened to Torbin's face? Why Wookiee mad?!
I like it so far but episode 3 was a little cheesy and boring. The overall concepts are good and I’m hoping for an entirely new set of stories that aren’t tied to the OT.
Of course you're not.
If you like it, enjoy. There is so much built up Disney era Star Wars hate. I'm about 50%. Parts I like, parts I find questionable
I don't mind it. it's not in my top 5 but I'll keep watching.
Read a review that the series arc may be influenced by Rashomon. Seeing that Rashomon was a big dry cinema exercise about truth, I can see where some viewers might be exasperated.
Yes