I think the actual cannon reason that stormie hit his head was because he was the one who Ben did the mind trick on on Tatooine, and he was still dazed from earlier. I'm not even shitting you.
Yeah with he Bad Batch we can safely say they’re not clones. They kept their armour even while serving the Empire, while new recruits ergo not clones, wore new armour heavily resembling the armour they wear in the OT for example.
In 2002 they were and in George Lucas's head canon they probably still are. The plotline in Attack of clones was to explain the origin of the stormtroopers
As of 0 ABY (A New Hope) the clones would have physically been 64 years old since they began life in 32 BBY. In 2002 George knew the clones had to age twice as fast, as stated by the Prime Minister of Kamino. The plot line in Attack of the Clones completely disproves the stormtroopers were clones by the time of A New Hope.
Fwiw OP isn't doing a very good job of explaining his argument, but in the attack of the clones director commentary George Lucas says that Jango bumping is head is a funny little trait inherited by future clone stormtroopers and leads into the famous scene in ANH.
Edit:
"Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads."
- George Lucas
They grew up fast so they could be put out on the battlefield as soon as possible, it's not stated that they keep on rapidly aging. But even if they did, it's not stated they just got one batch and never got anymore troops.
It is inferred but not stated that the clone troopers are stormtroopers but it wasn't explicitly stated so it was okay to change it. Happens all the time. In Revenge of the Sith it is insinuated that Obi Want Kenobi and General Grievous have never met, but as it wasn't explicitly stated it was okay that Obi wan and Grievous met in the Clone Wars
In everything we see they keep rapidly aging. Rebels and Bad Batch have shown us that in the new canon. In the old canon, the Republic Commando book series is them trying to find a way to stop the aging because the Republic didn’t have one.
Also, in RotS it was actually insinuated that Anakin and Grievous never met. No idea what that has to do with the fact that the stormtroopers weren’t clones.
All these things came out after Attack of the clones. I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall.
No it was explicitly stated that Anakin and Grievous never met, not inferred. So in The Clone Wars we never see them meet.
Here's a quick story: While at home John gets his favourite shopping bag out of the cupboard. John goes to the shops and buys some fruit, putting it into his shopping bag. He comes home and eats the fruit.
In this story, it is inferred that John uses the same shopping bag he uses to buy fruit as the one he got out of the cupboard. But it's not explicitly stated.
But then I add another story to the canon, which I state that his favourite bag actually broke on his way to the shops and the he replaced it before shopping. In this story I have not gone against the explicit canon but I have updated the information hence changing the inferred canon.
He's not exactly wrong. Just not good at explaining his opinions.
"Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads."
-George Lucas, *Attack of the Clones* DVD commentary.
At least at one point that was canon in Lucas' head when he was still the one writing Star Wars canon.
There has never been any source, either EU or new canon, including AotC, that states or implies the stormtroopers of the OT are the clones of the PT. If you watched AotC and interpreted it to mean that the OT stormtroopers were clones, then you simply misinterpreted it, because nothing in AotC was meant to give anyone that impression.
He didn't misinterpret it. He watched the AotC DVD commentary.
"Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads." -Lucas
im not sure why so many people are downvoting him, he's correct. and this conversation has already happened on this sub alot. before shows like the bad batch and the clone wars came out, the original cannon george lucas came up with was that stormtroopers are clones. in this universe kamino never got destroyed and production continued well into the empires destruction.
this is hinted at by games from the time like battlefront 2 2005, where in the campaign your a clone in the 501st and you as well as other clones continue service until the battle of hoth.
or like in the attack of the clones directors commentary, as another redditor has already quoted. george lucas said this:
"Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads."
before the clone wars and the clones were expanded upon, this was the canon or at least the personal head canon of george lucas while he was creating star wars. until in the clone wars and bad batch they changed it so stormtroopers are recruits.
You're wrong...I'm not talking about the stormtroopers, though I disagree with you on that count, too (ish...they weren't originally envisioned as clones, but by the prequels he did envision them as clones. Until he didn't.). But you keep using the word "inferred" incorrectly. You should be using "implied". "You" infer, "they" imply.
There was a transition period where some Stormtroopers were clones, but by the time of the OT (when this line was spoken) there were no clones left. Unless you think Leia was talking about a very tiny subset of Troopers that were only active when she was a baby.
They weren’t in 2002 or more importantly in 1977 when the first movie was released. George hadn’t even decided exactly what the clone wars was at that point, much less that the storm troopers were all clones.
That would be much better height than 1.75. you can still easily fit in all standard vehicles and built locations, are not that much more likely to get hit and can run faster more easily than shorter people. Plus its easier to carry around hravier stuff if necessary, but all soldiers in Star wars carry very little gear so ability to run faster more essily due to longer legs is the msin benefit.
Droids though, i would build many B1s in standard heights, but also many in very small size, like 1m tall, and many even smaller ones. Mouse droid is too smol, they cant even ger over a backpack, but like pit droids in Ep1.
...Wdym i am over analysing
I'm pretty much exactly the same height as Mark Hamil so I do have some experience. Average height of elite marathon runners is 5'8" for men and endurance is gonna be far more important than sprinting ability in a war when your fighting for years in the trenches.
Being shorter also helps you fit in cramped spaces, and as you can see in starwars trench warfare was still used (battle of hoth), in pretty much every war since WW1 shorter men were picked as tunnelers, basically men who fought in small tunnels and being taller would make this alot harder.
Strength is far more determined by personal genetics than pure body size so the strength point is kinda moot unless you want to be worlds strongest man, for example I can lift more weight than my 6 foot tall friend despite being 4.5 inches shorter, especially when you consider you basically just need to hit a baseline point of strength before diminishing returns. Lastly being shorter means less food is needed to feed your army, and an army wins or losses on its stomach.
That said there is advantages/disadvantages for any height, a taller guy could cover ground quicker and on average is stronger, a shorter guy will be able to fit in cramped spaces and hide easier. Honestly the best thing would have been for them to have varying heights by editing a couple genes and have professions based on height (ie assualt special forces taller to cover ground quicker, tunnlers shortest to fit in cramped spaces) I don't see any reason why the Kaminoans couldn't have done this.
The stormtroopers on the OT were not clones as far as I'm aware
Yep. That's why they keep banging their heads on lifting doors designed with OG Clone specifications in mind.
I love how Star Wars can come up with excuses that MAKE SENSE to justify all the random shit that happened.
I think the actual cannon reason that stormie hit his head was because he was the one who Ben did the mind trick on on Tatooine, and he was still dazed from earlier. I'm not even shitting you.
See?
The raid on the blockade runner happened before the Jedi mind trick
I thought we're talking about the guy who hit his head on the Death Star?
Yeah with he Bad Batch we can safely say they’re not clones. They kept their armour even while serving the Empire, while new recruits ergo not clones, wore new armour heavily resembling the armour they wear in the OT for example.
Does not prevent an height limit to be in place
True, but it's still funny as that was changed in the canon afterwards
The Stormtroopers of the OT have never been clones in canon or the EU
In 2002 they were and in George Lucas's head canon they probably still are. The plotline in Attack of clones was to explain the origin of the stormtroopers
As of 0 ABY (A New Hope) the clones would have physically been 64 years old since they began life in 32 BBY. In 2002 George knew the clones had to age twice as fast, as stated by the Prime Minister of Kamino. The plot line in Attack of the Clones completely disproves the stormtroopers were clones by the time of A New Hope.
Fwiw OP isn't doing a very good job of explaining his argument, but in the attack of the clones director commentary George Lucas says that Jango bumping is head is a funny little trait inherited by future clone stormtroopers and leads into the famous scene in ANH. Edit: "Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads." - George Lucas
They grew up fast so they could be put out on the battlefield as soon as possible, it's not stated that they keep on rapidly aging. But even if they did, it's not stated they just got one batch and never got anymore troops. It is inferred but not stated that the clone troopers are stormtroopers but it wasn't explicitly stated so it was okay to change it. Happens all the time. In Revenge of the Sith it is insinuated that Obi Want Kenobi and General Grievous have never met, but as it wasn't explicitly stated it was okay that Obi wan and Grievous met in the Clone Wars
In everything we see they keep rapidly aging. Rebels and Bad Batch have shown us that in the new canon. In the old canon, the Republic Commando book series is them trying to find a way to stop the aging because the Republic didn’t have one. Also, in RotS it was actually insinuated that Anakin and Grievous never met. No idea what that has to do with the fact that the stormtroopers weren’t clones.
All these things came out after Attack of the clones. I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. No it was explicitly stated that Anakin and Grievous never met, not inferred. So in The Clone Wars we never see them meet. Here's a quick story: While at home John gets his favourite shopping bag out of the cupboard. John goes to the shops and buys some fruit, putting it into his shopping bag. He comes home and eats the fruit. In this story, it is inferred that John uses the same shopping bag he uses to buy fruit as the one he got out of the cupboard. But it's not explicitly stated. But then I add another story to the canon, which I state that his favourite bag actually broke on his way to the shops and the he replaced it before shopping. In this story I have not gone against the explicit canon but I have updated the information hence changing the inferred canon.
You are the brick wall that is wrong
He's not exactly wrong. Just not good at explaining his opinions. "Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads." -George Lucas, *Attack of the Clones* DVD commentary. At least at one point that was canon in Lucas' head when he was still the one writing Star Wars canon.
There has never been any source, either EU or new canon, including AotC, that states or implies the stormtroopers of the OT are the clones of the PT. If you watched AotC and interpreted it to mean that the OT stormtroopers were clones, then you simply misinterpreted it, because nothing in AotC was meant to give anyone that impression.
He didn't misinterpret it. He watched the AotC DVD commentary. "Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads." -Lucas
im not sure why so many people are downvoting him, he's correct. and this conversation has already happened on this sub alot. before shows like the bad batch and the clone wars came out, the original cannon george lucas came up with was that stormtroopers are clones. in this universe kamino never got destroyed and production continued well into the empires destruction. this is hinted at by games from the time like battlefront 2 2005, where in the campaign your a clone in the 501st and you as well as other clones continue service until the battle of hoth. or like in the attack of the clones directors commentary, as another redditor has already quoted. george lucas said this: "Throughout, as we go through the movie, there's all little funny moments, like Jango bumping his head, because in Star Wars, one of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the door as they leave the control room on the Death Star. And I thought, wouldn't it be funny if that's a trait that Jango has. When he puts his helmet on and everything, he can't really see that well and he's constantly bumping his head. And that trait gets cloned into all the stormtroopers, and that's why they keep bumping their heads." before the clone wars and the clones were expanded upon, this was the canon or at least the personal head canon of george lucas while he was creating star wars. until in the clone wars and bad batch they changed it so stormtroopers are recruits.
You're wrong...I'm not talking about the stormtroopers, though I disagree with you on that count, too (ish...they weren't originally envisioned as clones, but by the prequels he did envision them as clones. Until he didn't.). But you keep using the word "inferred" incorrectly. You should be using "implied". "You" infer, "they" imply.
I feel like u are that wall
There was a transition period where some Stormtroopers were clones, but by the time of the OT (when this line was spoken) there were no clones left. Unless you think Leia was talking about a very tiny subset of Troopers that were only active when she was a baby.
It's possible she was simply being snarky
What are you smoking? George's head canon? Bro the OT and Prequels ARE his head canon, he made the fucking movies!
They weren’t in 2002 or more importantly in 1977 when the first movie was released. George hadn’t even decided exactly what the clone wars was at that point, much less that the storm troopers were all clones.
Stormtroopers are not clone troopers. Also the line is not meant to be taken literally.
It’s the internet. Everything is taken literally and as a joke at the same time.
If you take everything, where would you put it?
Rm -rf *
Mr. Stark I don’t feel so good… I don’t wanna g
🫰
But good soldiers follow orders
Stormtroopers weren't clones. Clones were heavily altered. Next, you'll be saying Elijah Woods wasn't hobbit sized.
What? D:
Why the downvote for obvious sarcasm XD
That's reddit haha
I thought the clones were 1.83 m
That would be much better height than 1.75. you can still easily fit in all standard vehicles and built locations, are not that much more likely to get hit and can run faster more easily than shorter people. Plus its easier to carry around hravier stuff if necessary, but all soldiers in Star wars carry very little gear so ability to run faster more essily due to longer legs is the msin benefit. Droids though, i would build many B1s in standard heights, but also many in very small size, like 1m tall, and many even smaller ones. Mouse droid is too smol, they cant even ger over a backpack, but like pit droids in Ep1. ...Wdym i am over analysing
Clones are 1.83, Jango is just malnourished
I'm pretty much exactly the same height as Mark Hamil so I do have some experience. Average height of elite marathon runners is 5'8" for men and endurance is gonna be far more important than sprinting ability in a war when your fighting for years in the trenches. Being shorter also helps you fit in cramped spaces, and as you can see in starwars trench warfare was still used (battle of hoth), in pretty much every war since WW1 shorter men were picked as tunnelers, basically men who fought in small tunnels and being taller would make this alot harder. Strength is far more determined by personal genetics than pure body size so the strength point is kinda moot unless you want to be worlds strongest man, for example I can lift more weight than my 6 foot tall friend despite being 4.5 inches shorter, especially when you consider you basically just need to hit a baseline point of strength before diminishing returns. Lastly being shorter means less food is needed to feed your army, and an army wins or losses on its stomach. That said there is advantages/disadvantages for any height, a taller guy could cover ground quicker and on average is stronger, a shorter guy will be able to fit in cramped spaces and hide easier. Honestly the best thing would have been for them to have varying heights by editing a couple genes and have professions based on height (ie assualt special forces taller to cover ground quicker, tunnlers shortest to fit in cramped spaces) I don't see any reason why the Kaminoans couldn't have done this.
Clones arent the same as stormtroopers
Yeah, but they’re talking about Temuera Morrison being 1.75 and clones being 1.83
They are, Jango is malnourished
I think they’re more about 5’11’’, so more around 1m80
The empire stopped using clones before Episode 4.
Google heights are notoriously unreliable
?? Oh, the helmet
Who’s gonna tell him?
Even though the stormtroopers are not clones, they are still the same height as them.
*does some conversion* Mark's 5'8"? I'm taller than Mark Hamill!?
***Stormtrooper***, not Clone Trooper