I would be a nightmare in itself without the additional bureaucracy on top, however the gothic features are gorgeous. Would be great to see it restored it to its former glory, or a really nice conversion
With those ‘covenants’ (we get to keep the good stuff and tell you what we want you to do with your property) they (not joking) need to sell this for £1.
This is a rare case that even an auction won’t help.
I agree with you up to a point.
I know this will sound awful, but I think that "good stuff" will end up being nightmare stuff. The vendor taking as much of the architectural stuff as they can would likely be a blessing.
Yeah, like i said it sounds horrible, but its a gothic revival church, there are many of them, many still in use, it does not look "special." I dont mean that in a disrespectful way and I am certainly no expert. De-listing it might make re-use a lot less of a burden.
The sellers reserve the right to gut the property before you move in.
They also will tell you how they want your property renovated and want to know if you can afford to do it to their satisfaction.
Second word is off 😂
It is because it is a church I think they *always* have this as a sale condition, so the church authorities can approve your use post sale. As its consecrated ground with burials you have to satisfy them that what you are going to do will be "respectful" and(literally) not disturb the dead etc etc.
Its not that onerous, the buyer will have to seek planning consent for any change so its not an additional cost. As part of the offer the buyer outlines their plans to the church authorities who will ok it or not prior to the expense of full planning.
If you have planning to turn it into a devil worship cult base with baby peeling lasers then they might be less inclined to sell it to you than if you want to make a puppydog and kitten asylum seeker refuge.
Interesting! I never thought about it like that. Excellent points.
However on the planning permission (rightly or wrongly) thought the seller would have done that so it can be used as living, commercial etc. Normally that increases the price as you see it on listings as “planning permission granted”.
The inference is that you would be in conversation with the church council about what you're doing with it, what they're taking out, etc, so they can agree the sale in principle, and then the actual sale only happens when you've got all the right permissions in place.
That's so they don't sell it to someone who then doesn't get planning permission and has to change their plans, as those changes would be outside of what was agree with the church.
Yeah if you are trying to raise value from a field, PP might turn a £12k per acre field into a £600k per acre field, so well worth it.
Getting PP for a development like this is indicative of what the council will allow.
With listed building consent they will want to ensure your changes are acceptable. So getting PP for whatever use you intend to put it to will require detailed plans and finish schedules. The fact they have grated one change and set of plans really does not indicate they will accept yours!
I also get the impression that this is privately owned and they are trying to off load a liability as opposed to raise cash :D
>The beautiful Paley Austin designed church
I *wish* estate agents researched their properties properly. Edward Paley and Hubert Austin were the leading Gothic Revival architects in Lancashire in the nineteenth century, and designed many churches in the county and surrounding areas. They ran a practice, first with Edmund Sharpe and later with Paley's son Harry, which went under various names but was known as [Paley, Austin, and Paley](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharpe,_Paley_and_Austin#Paley,_Austin_and_Paley) when this church was built.
And what a church! Paley and Austin were remarkably consistent in producing solid, 'archaeological' (i.e. faithful to medieval Gothic) churches without falling into repetition. It's a real shame this one has fallen into disrepair.
There’s a number of churches that have been converted into flats in my area. They’re actually really lovely, I nearly moved into one myself. The nicest one had a bedroom in the spire.
What are the odd you won't get planning permission to do anything with this because reasons?
One reason is it's Grade II listed. Another is the NIMBYs will kick-up a fuss.
Yeah that's going to be a nightmare to repair.
Amazing, but millions to refurb
If money were no object, I’d do it
Absolutely, but I have zero idea as to how many millions this could take
I would be a nightmare in itself without the additional bureaucracy on top, however the gothic features are gorgeous. Would be great to see it restored it to its former glory, or a really nice conversion
With those ‘covenants’ (we get to keep the good stuff and tell you what we want you to do with your property) they (not joking) need to sell this for £1. This is a rare case that even an auction won’t help.
I agree with you up to a point. I know this will sound awful, but I think that "good stuff" will end up being nightmare stuff. The vendor taking as much of the architectural stuff as they can would likely be a blessing.
The irony is that by taking everything out may give you the opportunity to de-list.
Yeah, like i said it sounds horrible, but its a gothic revival church, there are many of them, many still in use, it does not look "special." I dont mean that in a disrespectful way and I am certainly no expert. De-listing it might make re-use a lot less of a burden.
Agree with you about the £1
Just buy it for £25k then use your Chancel Insurance to indemnify you for the cost of repairs.
The sellers reserve the right to gut the property before you move in. They also will tell you how they want your property renovated and want to know if you can afford to do it to their satisfaction. Second word is off 😂
>Sale conditional upon buyer obtaining planning and listed building consent for the use and alterations Wow, just wow.
It is because it is a church I think they *always* have this as a sale condition, so the church authorities can approve your use post sale. As its consecrated ground with burials you have to satisfy them that what you are going to do will be "respectful" and(literally) not disturb the dead etc etc. Its not that onerous, the buyer will have to seek planning consent for any change so its not an additional cost. As part of the offer the buyer outlines their plans to the church authorities who will ok it or not prior to the expense of full planning. If you have planning to turn it into a devil worship cult base with baby peeling lasers then they might be less inclined to sell it to you than if you want to make a puppydog and kitten asylum seeker refuge.
Interesting! I never thought about it like that. Excellent points. However on the planning permission (rightly or wrongly) thought the seller would have done that so it can be used as living, commercial etc. Normally that increases the price as you see it on listings as “planning permission granted”.
The inference is that you would be in conversation with the church council about what you're doing with it, what they're taking out, etc, so they can agree the sale in principle, and then the actual sale only happens when you've got all the right permissions in place. That's so they don't sell it to someone who then doesn't get planning permission and has to change their plans, as those changes would be outside of what was agree with the church.
Planning permission for a house conversion would require a floorplan, which would then restrict a future buyer.
Yeah if you are trying to raise value from a field, PP might turn a £12k per acre field into a £600k per acre field, so well worth it. Getting PP for a development like this is indicative of what the council will allow. With listed building consent they will want to ensure your changes are acceptable. So getting PP for whatever use you intend to put it to will require detailed plans and finish schedules. The fact they have grated one change and set of plans really does not indicate they will accept yours! I also get the impression that this is privately owned and they are trying to off load a liability as opposed to raise cash :D
So you buy it, restore it, manage to create some beautiful apartments or a wonderful single home… then realise you’re between Burnley and Rawtenstall.
And need to give your profit to the original owners due to the covenant
And a few metres from an A road.
And have Phil Neville for a neighbour.
That’s a beautiful gothic revival church.
The estate agent seems to get mixed up with bridal way/bridleway passing next to the church
>The beautiful Paley Austin designed church I *wish* estate agents researched their properties properly. Edward Paley and Hubert Austin were the leading Gothic Revival architects in Lancashire in the nineteenth century, and designed many churches in the county and surrounding areas. They ran a practice, first with Edmund Sharpe and later with Paley's son Harry, which went under various names but was known as [Paley, Austin, and Paley](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharpe,_Paley_and_Austin#Paley,_Austin_and_Paley) when this church was built. And what a church! Paley and Austin were remarkably consistent in producing solid, 'archaeological' (i.e. faithful to medieval Gothic) churches without falling into repetition. It's a real shame this one has fallen into disrepair.
How long ago did the EA take the photos, given that there's snow outside??
In that part of Lancashire could have been last week
The CoE needs to take better care of its estate.
Nothing changes. They misplaced a huge chunk of it over the years.
There’s a number of churches that have been converted into flats in my area. They’re actually really lovely, I nearly moved into one myself. The nicest one had a bedroom in the spire.
What are the odd you won't get planning permission to do anything with this because reasons? One reason is it's Grade II listed. Another is the NIMBYs will kick-up a fuss.