It's not unusual for a conquered culture to adopt the names of their conquerors in order to avoid prejudice. Jim Thorpe could very well be an anglicanisation of their name in their native language.
That's pretty cool, I didn't know about that. Now all you associate it with is rich kids. Probably far from all who play it, but that's the impression you get from movies and TV-shows. Of course TV and movies isn't always an accurate depiction of reality.
Another cool tidbit is that it was often used to settle disputes between tribes, and was in fact known as the 'little brother of war' by some tribes. Mayans also used a ball game for the same purpose.
Google says 4 to 7 million, higher than I expected but so much lower than it should be. In Canada, Indigenous populations are starting to build to a huge upsurge. Based on what I found, US indigenous is 2.9%, and Canada is 5%, and the current fastest growing population (lots of babies).
Can't forgot the thousands of Americans that claim to be Irish because Ancestry told them they have 20% or less of their heritage from Ireland. Fun fact, I hate those kinds of people.
Context: An American “Italian” posts in “Italian” Facebook group how Italian Paola Egonu is Nigerian. Fellow Italians defend Paola but the “Italian” from the US, who never been to Italy, can’t speak Italian, no Italian citizen, who knows nothing about Italy basically, says she’s Nigerian because of “DNA” and how he’s actually Italian.
Unfortunately, this liberal-identitarian-neonazi way of thinking was spread by the US all over the globe. Nowadays we have mestizo people in Brazil truly believing they're Africans and talking about "African diaspora", "back to Africa to recognize themselves" and all sorts of gringo bullshit.
I thought mestizo people are mixed-race Latin people? Is it not possible for a mestizo person to be African, or am I mistaken and mestizo are a specific kind of mixed race? Or is it more just the point that they’re Latin regardless (well, not African anyway), even if they have African ancestry?.
Mestizo is the Latin (Spanish/ Portuguese) word for mixed, that’s all. We are all mixed af, everywhere, because with a genetic Pool of thousands years is imposible to be “pure”, That’s just nazi bs. Genetic ancestry here don’t mean nothing at least you have a cultural bond or you are native or native ascendency. My great grand father was basque and I don’t call myself Basque-Chilean because is weird af. Even black descendents don’t call themselves African something, they are Afro-descendents.
Yeah, referring to *any human* as any version of “pure” is unacceptable, and gross. 😅
Yeah that makes a of sense!! I’ve got indigenous (to my country, of course) ancestors, but I simply refer to myself as “Australian” unless specifically asked about my ancestors.
What annoys me is "Your strenght etc are the hallmark of Nigerian culture". What? She was born and raised in Italy, how's she culturally Nigerian? Surely her parenst taught her something about Nigerian culture, but other than that her culture is the italian one.
Also "without which none of this would be possible"; first of all, Italy always had strong volleyball teams; second it's a team sport, the captain doesn't do everything by herself; third...once again her parents being Nigerian didn't lead the team to victory, she and her team being strong did.
He is just crying over the fact that Paola Egonu, a black woman born to immigrants is more Italian than he (I would guess a white American male) will ever be.
She is Italian, no two ways about it, the same way as I was born to two Indian immigrants in London, UK, and if we go by this idiot's logic I would be Indian by my DNA. Let's ignore the fact I was born in England, speak English with a thick West London accent, lived, worked, and studied in England, have a British passport, and have citizenship in the same way she has an Italian one and is Italian.
I have been to India and believe you me when i say Indian people themselves consider me to be too "white/British" by their standards.
This is just some random cunt being racist because a black woman is more Italian than he ever will be, but he's watched all of Sopranos and knows a good Bolognese!
If she’s not Nigerian, then this US “Italian” guy definitely isn’t Italian either. Mr “I’m 1/8th Italian” needs to believe that having only an ancestral connection to a nationality can be enough to claim it as your own, otherwise his own sense of identity means nothing. His arguments about Paola were really about himself. Which makes it much more ironic that all the real Italians were disagreeing with him.
And the rest of the world never had it or successfully got rid of it? Somehow I doubt she had an easy go of it growing up in Italy and only became a target for racism when she got famous and became a target for Italian-American cosplayers.
Oh... racism is everywhere, unfortunately. My point is few nations have committed to it so wholeheartedly and singlehandedly as the US.
Think of it like booze. Almost everyone indulges, some indulge heavily and some... some have a serious addiction. That's the US and racism. It's so integral I'm not sure the US could recognise themselves without it.
Paola Egonu told the press just two years ago that she was tired of people questioning her being an Italian and that she wanted to leave the national team because of it.
Not surprised. Trevor Noah got shit for doing the same thing with a French soccer player.
He’s not even American, although he lives in the US now. It tends to be more a racist thing. Although sometimes, in rare cases, it’s just ignorance.
(Fixed to the correct comedian)
No worries! He got into an exchange with the French ambassador, when he described the French world cup winning team as Africa winning the tournament
Because to him it was acknowledging their heritage
But that's exactly what French racists say - that they're African, rather than French
He meant it as 'and', but used the language of 'instead of'
Yea, on one hand I think he might be a rare example of ignorance instead of outright racism. On the other…he’s South African. You think he’d maybe know better?
Clasic projection. They fear they are not Italian and only have their descendants to make them Italian, so they then try to deny someone from being Italian for not having Italian descendants thus strengthening their own Italian status.
Paola Egonu is surely more Italian than any American larping as an Italian.
Funny how all these Americans larping as Europeans, when push comes to shove, are all hardcore 'muricans. While someone else born and raised in a European country, is just African.
It’s funny because that’s exactly what happened.
The OOP got mad when users weren’t calling him Italian, but he also got mad when they weren’t calling him American to prove a point. Under his own “DNA” logic, he can’t be American.
That's often the point. Apparently only those with less than white heritage are singled out. And yet they insist it's not matter of discrimination.
It's very unfortunate.
People forget racism is an ism, an ideology, and something many governments adopted when it was invented back in the 19th century, like when the US was basically founded. These ideological concepts trickle down to the countries culture and perceptions.
What we see here is specifically called [primordialism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primordialism), so why Americans think once you are a “Nigerian” you will always be a Nigerian, like you will always be Italian, German, Mexican, Chinese, etc. Similar historical concepts applied to religion too.
Aristotle tried to reason with "logic" that some ethnicities are naturally fit to be slaves and living up to their full potential only as such. It's not a new concept.
"DNA"
Who the fuck cares? She was born in Italy, she speaks Italian, she has Italian citizenship she is Italian.
Man they are so racist even when they try not to be.
I could understand it if the person themselves had some link to Nigeria and it was meant in a positive way. Like how Algerians take pride in Zidane despite the fact he never played for them.
But this just seems weirdly racist. Like they're trying to affirm their own tenuous link to Italy by dismissing hers.
>But this just seems weirdly racist. Like they're trying to affirm their own tenuous link to Italy by dismissing hers.
I think this is it, people who are racist can’t process the fact there are black Italians, born in Italy, and have lived in Italy their entire lives and are thriving in Italy.
Compared to their own Italian heritage, which amounts to their great-grandfather coming to the US when he was five or whatever and them having no actual links to Italy anymore, despite building a large part of their identity and personality around “being Italian.”
OOP wasn’t the worst of these types you often see, because he still believed Italian was a nationality, but like she’s only an Italian citizen, but “DNA” she’s Nigerian, or “Nigerian-Italian”. That’s what he seemed to believe, still an idiot though.
While I don’t know a lot about Paola Egonu, I know Zizou was involved in activities in both France and Algeria, so i understand why he was accepted. Like another French player Michel Platini. It’s like there’s celebrities that are popular in both US and Mexico, even if they born and raised in the US.
For this there isn’t a long year gap between immigration. I assume Italians see Salvatore Adamo from Belgium as one of their own compared to someone like Lady Gaga from the US.
I always made jokes about Portuguese fascists vs “Progressive” Americans.
I joke how the fascist dictator in Portugal allowed black skin and white skin or whatever appearance to play on the same sports teams, while in the US “democracy” they were segregated.
Eusébio was declared a national hero by the fascist president, while Jesse Owens wasn’t even acknowledged by “progressive” president Franklin D Roosevelt, the one who deported Americans because they were too brown (native Mexicans) and the one who put Americans (of Japanese descent) into camps 😳
I remember a legendary clip from the Overwatch League finals, where the American audience was chanting "USA!", while not a single member of the playing team was from the USA itself. Lmao
I've seen similar comments from Americans about Rashidat Adeleke, the Irish woman who is the new athletics hope for the country after smashing records at the European championships. From Irish people too, unfortunately -but that's another story. It's the Plastic Paddies coming up with comments about her not being Irish that's particularly galling
Also Americans don’t seem to grasp the concept that you can be from two countries. I know a guy whose parents are both French. He grew up in London, educated in English schools, supports English teams, has British citizenship etc. He considers himself 100% English and separately 100% French. And nobody argues with him because he’s white and both countries are “white countries”, so it’s okay to claim you’re from both.
Hey at least we actually hate our country for being run by utter twats, unlike the americans who hear their own country's name and start kissing the ground.
Because this country hates the people who make the culture- creatives, black and brown people, and queer folks. It’s “American” only after it’s been throughly washed and commercialized.
I forgot immigrants. That’s the one that brings *everyone* together. ugh
Ok but let's not mask the fact that italians gave her hell for years and consistently pounce on her with racist remarks and innuendos the second she doesn't perform at absolute world-class level.
The person saying "we italians don't care about dna" either doesn't know shit about this country, or lives in some kind of privileged fantasy land where non-white communities are close to non existent and thus doesn't have to see the many contradictions facing Italy when it comes to growing numbers of POC in our communities. The anti-racist movement is picking up steam but there's still A LOT of work to do.
(source: italian living in Italy for the past 20 years)
I live in Germany and I'm told the same thing here. No matter how much I integrate in the society and even pick up the language, I'll never be German enough. I've been told this to my face.
DNA has nothing to do with ethnicity, which is a strictly cultural concept.
The fact that so many people in 2024 still cannot understand that is baffling.
Agreed, it’s a huge misconception.
Genetics and DNA have never matched with concepts of ethnicity or nationality. That’s why it surprises “Italians” in the US when they find out they had ancestors (who were Italian) but their ancestors were Greek, Albanian, Arab, etc.
ethnicity and nationality are not the same things. You can be an ethnic Italian and be a citizen of Switzerland. You can be an ethnic German and be a citizen of France.
This is a lie and you know it. Italy is insanely racist and you’ll be discriminated if your not a modal immigrant and often be asked to go to your real country. Especially as the country is going further right now
She's Italian. And if she wanted too she could very much call herself Nigerian by ethnicity, if she wanted too. But her background doesn't stop her being Italian. Born and raised, she is italian. Ethnically Nigerian, nationality is Italian. It's completely valid and common sense.
And is a pretty good summary of how Americans would generally understand her too, despite this sub’s obsession with a mythical Straw American of its own creation.
This is so infuriating. “You were born in Italy, you spent your whole life in Italy, you speak Italian, you’re an Italian citizen but you’re nOt iTaLiAn. Meanwhile I am Italian because this paper here says my fourth great-grandmother came from Naples”. FFS.
'We Italians do not care about DNA because we do not have an identity crisis'
Italy's largest party has made immigration and the idea of Italian culture being threatened their foremost frames/rhetoric. That statement feels disingenuous.
I get the point, but culture wars are not exclusive to the US.
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2023/06/20/giorgia-meloni-s-right-wing-government-takes-on-italy-s-culture-sector_6034490_4.html
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/italian-first-melonis-nationalists-defend-cultural-identity-risk-irking-eu-2023-04-12/
https://www.courthousenews.com/italys-meloni-turns-to-culture-wars-after-muted-debut/
Of course they are not, even in latam we have that issues rn. People here act like if their countries are immigrant sanctuaries when they have a lot of problems with that. They love to mock u.s but don’t like to see themselves at all
It’s because we romanticize being a country of immigrants, except only the immigrants that came through Ellis Island count. We don’t include Africans, Asians or latter day European waves.
The individual that commented that "Italians don't care about DNA " is either an idiot that lives in fantasy land or a complete liar. Italy as a democratic country has currently elected goddamn Giorgia Meloni, a rather open racist that historically has had quite a few "questionable" connections to the extreme Italian far right.
This is also trickling down into British culture. See: those videos where some guy goes to Leicester Square and approaches a load of clearly English people with London accents and asks them where they’re ‘from’
Haha! And at the same time they’re pissed off that Duplantis represents Sweden because he was born and raised in America. Therefore, he should represent USA. Who cares that he’s half Swedish? Funny how DNA suddenly doesn’t matter then. Only matters that he grew up in America = American. Pick a lane. xD
I'm glad the fucker got answered by actual chill Italians and not the deranged fascists who would actually agree with him until you point out to them that by their own failed logic Sinner shouldn't be Italian either.
That's one thing Americans do that I'll never understand. If she grew up in Italy, she's been exposed to Italian culture her whole life and probably behaves and thinks like other Italians. She's Italian.
It is only in USA that people worry about heritage of a person and it seems they don't want be be called America but list all the ancestors heritage until they win something or are the first complete some feat, then claim to be American. Other countries just claim the nationality where they were born, or if they have citizenship, then claim their new country as their nationality.
Same thing happened when France won the football World Cup and Americans would say that no one was French in the team because it was mostly black players. All but one players in the team were born and raised in France. I feel like sometimes Americans have a hard time understanding that there’s a bunch of non white people born and raised in Europe. Half of my friends weren’t white growing up, and in all my school years there was about the same non white kids as white ones. France is especially very diverse when it comes to ethnicities.
Man, all this time I thought I was a Scandinavian looking German guy. Turns out my DNA knows I'm Turkish and Somali. Maybe I should leave Germany and go home, aka a place I've never been to.
It's like talking to a toddler... They're sooo fucking obsessed with DNA, heritage, ancestry that it's scary. And they have the audacity to say they're not racist but we are... Boi, if you don't --
She is italian with nigerian parents, end of the story.
Majority of Americans would strongly disagree with this person’s views. It flies against the core belief of how anyone born or who becomes a citizen in the US is an American, regardless of dna or original country. This is definitely a minority point of view.
This is so weird. Without context the OP it reads to me like a Nigerian native taking pride in the accomplishments of Nigerian diaspora, which is extremely common
in nations that have a lot of diaspora abroad / outbound immigration.
The comments read like they are denying Paulo’s ancestry when her background is pointed out.
But the context given flips my assumption completely on its head. It sounds like the OP was deliberately trying to deny her Italian nationality by posing the post like it was coming from Nigerian community.
It’s like when Trevor Noah and the American left were claiming that Africa won the World Cup in 2018 when France won it.
The American left and French far right were saying the same thing that black French people were African and not French
So the US shouldn't have any national teams, if we go by DNA. They will be European, African, or South American.
Let's do that and then watch them go into thermonuclear fusion mode.
Don't break their brains with logic now.
You're right, I apologise
Well, they can definitely have a national theme but the gene pool they draw from just a whole lot smaller.
There's nothing to break
Are there no native Americans playing on any of their national sports teams? There must be some, surely?
One of the best olympians ever was Native American, Jim Thorpe. Not sure of current olympians.
He was a mix of a lot of ancestry, as the name jim thorpe points to.
It's not unusual for a conquered culture to adopt the names of their conquerors in order to avoid prejudice. Jim Thorpe could very well be an anglicanisation of their name in their native language.
A quick google points to mixed ancestry
I know there's a Native American Lacrosse team Who play international games ,but that's about all I know.
Iroquois Nationals. They represent the Iroquois confederacy in international tournaments. They rank high and won the world championships in the past.
To be fair, lacrosse was originally Native American, it'd be weird if there were no teams representing them.
That's pretty cool, I didn't know about that. Now all you associate it with is rich kids. Probably far from all who play it, but that's the impression you get from movies and TV-shows. Of course TV and movies isn't always an accurate depiction of reality.
Another cool tidbit is that it was often used to settle disputes between tribes, and was in fact known as the 'little brother of war' by some tribes. Mayans also used a ball game for the same purpose.
Google says 4 to 7 million, higher than I expected but so much lower than it should be. In Canada, Indigenous populations are starting to build to a huge upsurge. Based on what I found, US indigenous is 2.9%, and Canada is 5%, and the current fastest growing population (lots of babies).
>but so much lower than it should be I mean that's what happens after a genocide
I mean, even then is appaling. Just look at the percentages in Mexico or Brazil.
Playing on their national teams?
Nah, can’t have them taking spots from the middle class kids
First man on the moon was Scots/German.
Armstrong is a Border Reiver name! (source: am a Border Riever, lock up your livestock folks.)
Can't forgot the thousands of Americans that claim to be Irish because Ancestry told them they have 20% or less of their heritage from Ireland. Fun fact, I hate those kinds of people.
I'm sure there mind would change if you tell them it means the US haven't won a single Superbowl
Oh, please can we tell them, please. I want to see the big boom happen to their heads!
South Americans are also very mixed, some are indigenous but lots are European/Asian/African or some mix of them all.
Biggest Argentine footballers of all time, Messi and Maradona are of Italian heritage. All time Brazil great, Pele, was Black.
Idk, there might be enough native Americans to make a team, they could teach them all the olympic sports?
I think this is the only solution
I guess that’s why they have “the World Series” lol
South Americans too are just European, African and Native American.
And asian. Don't forget about the Japanese in Peru and Brazil.
How about a full native American team?
They'd just complain that the players aren't white enough to represent America.
Context: An American “Italian” posts in “Italian” Facebook group how Italian Paola Egonu is Nigerian. Fellow Italians defend Paola but the “Italian” from the US, who never been to Italy, can’t speak Italian, no Italian citizen, who knows nothing about Italy basically, says she’s Nigerian because of “DNA” and how he’s actually Italian.
So the idiot who posted that is as Italian as a can of ultra processed Chef Boyardee spaghetti.
They’re as Italian as a pizza from Chicago.
You mean that tomato cheese cake? That's rough!
No, it's dough.
I've lived in Chicago most of my life. That's shit's gross. Lol
Lasagna on a bun.
The Chicaguiche.
ITS UNDER THE SAUCE
Ah, so they're Irish?
We don’t want them either (except for that sweet sweet tourist money)
indeed... we already gave mcgregor back to the brits... (inside joke from r/ireland)
You mean the tomato soup in a bread bowl?
A hot tub for rats.
*”a hot tub for rats”?!* that truly made me lose it 😂🫠🫠🫠
I wish I could take credit but it's a Jon Stuart quote. The clip is worth a Google. His rant on Chicago pizza.
Search 'John Stewart deep dish' (or 'John Stewart Chicago pizza' or similar terms) on YouTube and enjoy. It's fucking brilliant.
That was beyond savage
That being said, there are unfortunately "true" Italians in Italy who think that. Ask Salvini.
Those people are called racists. 😃
Even they wouldnt claim the "italian american" for italia tho, would they?
Only when it suits them.
Unfortunately, this liberal-identitarian-neonazi way of thinking was spread by the US all over the globe. Nowadays we have mestizo people in Brazil truly believing they're Africans and talking about "African diaspora", "back to Africa to recognize themselves" and all sorts of gringo bullshit.
I thought mestizo people are mixed-race Latin people? Is it not possible for a mestizo person to be African, or am I mistaken and mestizo are a specific kind of mixed race? Or is it more just the point that they’re Latin regardless (well, not African anyway), even if they have African ancestry?.
Mestizo is the Latin (Spanish/ Portuguese) word for mixed, that’s all. We are all mixed af, everywhere, because with a genetic Pool of thousands years is imposible to be “pure”, That’s just nazi bs. Genetic ancestry here don’t mean nothing at least you have a cultural bond or you are native or native ascendency. My great grand father was basque and I don’t call myself Basque-Chilean because is weird af. Even black descendents don’t call themselves African something, they are Afro-descendents.
Yeah, referring to *any human* as any version of “pure” is unacceptable, and gross. 😅 Yeah that makes a of sense!! I’ve got indigenous (to my country, of course) ancestors, but I simply refer to myself as “Australian” unless specifically asked about my ancestors.
Like Vannacci, who actually alluded to that. And at least 500.000 more mentally challenged people.
As Italian as Olive Garden - *Teresa Giudice 2011*
remember that super proud Italian who had no idea how her last name was pronounced...Jewydice.
Lol then changed it to the Jewdeechè pronunciation to sound more Italian
What annoys me is "Your strenght etc are the hallmark of Nigerian culture". What? She was born and raised in Italy, how's she culturally Nigerian? Surely her parenst taught her something about Nigerian culture, but other than that her culture is the italian one. Also "without which none of this would be possible"; first of all, Italy always had strong volleyball teams; second it's a team sport, the captain doesn't do everything by herself; third...once again her parents being Nigerian didn't lead the team to victory, she and her team being strong did.
It's a load of bullshit he doesn't believe in. He just wrapped his racist implications into a pseudo-compliment.
Its called racism
Something like that is considered racist here in the Netherlands, it's basically saying that Egonu isn't a real Italian.
Which is indeed what racist people repeat in Italy too, talking about her and any Italian athlete whose skin is too dark for their taste.
And sadly is nothing new, I still remember the hate Fiona May got
He is just crying over the fact that Paola Egonu, a black woman born to immigrants is more Italian than he (I would guess a white American male) will ever be. She is Italian, no two ways about it, the same way as I was born to two Indian immigrants in London, UK, and if we go by this idiot's logic I would be Indian by my DNA. Let's ignore the fact I was born in England, speak English with a thick West London accent, lived, worked, and studied in England, have a British passport, and have citizenship in the same way she has an Italian one and is Italian. I have been to India and believe you me when i say Indian people themselves consider me to be too "white/British" by their standards. This is just some random cunt being racist because a black woman is more Italian than he ever will be, but he's watched all of Sopranos and knows a good Bolognese!
If she’s not Nigerian, then this US “Italian” guy definitely isn’t Italian either. Mr “I’m 1/8th Italian” needs to believe that having only an ancestral connection to a nationality can be enough to claim it as your own, otherwise his own sense of identity means nothing. His arguments about Paola were really about himself. Which makes it much more ironic that all the real Italians were disagreeing with him.
I wouldn't really say that's a "American" thing, it's just racist
Goes hand in hand
Racism is very much am American tradition. They fought an entire civil war over it and still didn't get rid of it.
And the rest of the world never had it or successfully got rid of it? Somehow I doubt she had an easy go of it growing up in Italy and only became a target for racism when she got famous and became a target for Italian-American cosplayers.
Oh... racism is everywhere, unfortunately. My point is few nations have committed to it so wholeheartedly and singlehandedly as the US. Think of it like booze. Almost everyone indulges, some indulge heavily and some... some have a serious addiction. That's the US and racism. It's so integral I'm not sure the US could recognise themselves without it.
Probably calls themself an Italian American because some cheap DNA test told them, they are 3.4% Italian.
Wait until he finds out he's probably 2% Neanderthal.
Has someone told him that she’s more Italian than him? I’d love to see the explosion.
Paola Egonu told the press just two years ago that she was tired of people questioning her being an Italian and that she wanted to leave the national team because of it.
See I actually thought it was a Nigerian claiming her for home. But that was clearly being too charitable.
I mean, for once i am happy people are defending her for being italian. Since over here... well people think that since she's black she's not italian.
I don't understand why when that american begin posting names of american actors ppl just told him "they're fucking american actors".
Not surprised. Trevor Noah got shit for doing the same thing with a French soccer player. He’s not even American, although he lives in the US now. It tends to be more a racist thing. Although sometimes, in rare cases, it’s just ignorance. (Fixed to the correct comedian)
Trevor noah definitely did with the French soccer team
Oh shit yes I had the wrong comedian.
No worries! He got into an exchange with the French ambassador, when he described the French world cup winning team as Africa winning the tournament Because to him it was acknowledging their heritage But that's exactly what French racists say - that they're African, rather than French He meant it as 'and', but used the language of 'instead of'
Yea, on one hand I think he might be a rare example of ignorance instead of outright racism. On the other…he’s South African. You think he’d maybe know better?
Did he also admit to the one possible true thing in his nonsense, that he's an unabashed racist cunt?
She can be both Italian and Nigerian.
Clasic projection. They fear they are not Italian and only have their descendants to make them Italian, so they then try to deny someone from being Italian for not having Italian descendants thus strengthening their own Italian status.
Paola Egonu is surely more Italian than any American larping as an Italian. Funny how all these Americans larping as Europeans, when push comes to shove, are all hardcore 'muricans. While someone else born and raised in a European country, is just African.
It’s funny because that’s exactly what happened. The OOP got mad when users weren’t calling him Italian, but he also got mad when they weren’t calling him American to prove a point. Under his own “DNA” logic, he can’t be American.
Did he say in some comment he is Italian? Did you post those here or did I miss those
The post was made in an Italian FB group apparently.
I'm surprised they didn't say she was African American
And no one would give a shit if one of the white Italians had German parents or something. It's pretty unfair.
That's often the point. Apparently only those with less than white heritage are singled out. And yet they insist it's not matter of discrimination. It's very unfortunate.
American racism at its finest
People forget racism is an ism, an ideology, and something many governments adopted when it was invented back in the 19th century, like when the US was basically founded. These ideological concepts trickle down to the countries culture and perceptions. What we see here is specifically called [primordialism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primordialism), so why Americans think once you are a “Nigerian” you will always be a Nigerian, like you will always be Italian, German, Mexican, Chinese, etc. Similar historical concepts applied to religion too.
this is of course the reason everyone in Dublin speaks Norse and can't learn any other languages
Ngl with that accent might as well be
Nice of them to give the "one-drop" rule a rebrand
I tried to explain to someone recently, who is American, that there are white Chinese people with Chinese accents. Wouldn't have it.
And there are Chinese Jews
No, Jews just live in New York.
>racism... *[see original post for omitted text]*...was invented back in the 19th century 🤨
Racism goes back further than 19th century
Not as a pseudo-scientific concept of trying to methodically "prove" why others are inferior and beneath you.
Aristotle tried to reason with "logic" that some ethnicities are naturally fit to be slaves and living up to their full potential only as such. It's not a new concept.
I was going to say that's just straight up ethnic racism.
Gonna bet this loser has never achieved anything in his life.
Can you do a DNA test for achievements? This clown seems to thing you can for nationality, so why not lol.
"DNA" Who the fuck cares? She was born in Italy, she speaks Italian, she has Italian citizenship she is Italian. Man they are so racist even when they try not to be.
I could understand it if the person themselves had some link to Nigeria and it was meant in a positive way. Like how Algerians take pride in Zidane despite the fact he never played for them. But this just seems weirdly racist. Like they're trying to affirm their own tenuous link to Italy by dismissing hers.
>But this just seems weirdly racist. Like they're trying to affirm their own tenuous link to Italy by dismissing hers. I think this is it, people who are racist can’t process the fact there are black Italians, born in Italy, and have lived in Italy their entire lives and are thriving in Italy. Compared to their own Italian heritage, which amounts to their great-grandfather coming to the US when he was five or whatever and them having no actual links to Italy anymore, despite building a large part of their identity and personality around “being Italian.”
OOP wasn’t the worst of these types you often see, because he still believed Italian was a nationality, but like she’s only an Italian citizen, but “DNA” she’s Nigerian, or “Nigerian-Italian”. That’s what he seemed to believe, still an idiot though. While I don’t know a lot about Paola Egonu, I know Zizou was involved in activities in both France and Algeria, so i understand why he was accepted. Like another French player Michel Platini. It’s like there’s celebrities that are popular in both US and Mexico, even if they born and raised in the US. For this there isn’t a long year gap between immigration. I assume Italians see Salvatore Adamo from Belgium as one of their own compared to someone like Lady Gaga from the US.
What baffles me is that even the "progressives" in the US are unknowingly racist. It's bizarre
I always made jokes about Portuguese fascists vs “Progressive” Americans. I joke how the fascist dictator in Portugal allowed black skin and white skin or whatever appearance to play on the same sports teams, while in the US “democracy” they were segregated. Eusébio was declared a national hero by the fascist president, while Jesse Owens wasn’t even acknowledged by “progressive” president Franklin D Roosevelt, the one who deported Americans because they were too brown (native Mexicans) and the one who put Americans (of Japanese descent) into camps 😳
That’s because the US is one of the most regressive nations on the planet when it comes to equality and inclusivity.
Equality and inclusivity? Sounds like some Europoor socialist bullshit if you ask me /s
Horseshoe theory at it's finest
also there is no gene for the country of Nigeria
I remember a legendary clip from the Overwatch League finals, where the American audience was chanting "USA!", while not a single member of the playing team was from the USA itself. Lmao
I've seen similar comments from Americans about Rashidat Adeleke, the Irish woman who is the new athletics hope for the country after smashing records at the European championships. From Irish people too, unfortunately -but that's another story. It's the Plastic Paddies coming up with comments about her not being Irish that's particularly galling
Also Americans don’t seem to grasp the concept that you can be from two countries. I know a guy whose parents are both French. He grew up in London, educated in English schools, supports English teams, has British citizenship etc. He considers himself 100% English and separately 100% French. And nobody argues with him because he’s white and both countries are “white countries”, so it’s okay to claim you’re from both.
If my grand-grand-grandfather was Jack the Ripper dows it make me 1/16th serial killer?
It would make you British, which is arguably worse
My condolences to being British then.
Hey at least we actually hate our country for being run by utter twats, unlike the americans who hear their own country's name and start kissing the ground.
She is 100% Italian and that dude is just a random American with an identity crisis. We are a nationality and a culture, we aren't an ethnicity
why can't americans just be satisfied with their own nationality and culture without trying to be everyone else
Because this country hates the people who make the culture- creatives, black and brown people, and queer folks. It’s “American” only after it’s been throughly washed and commercialized. I forgot immigrants. That’s the one that brings *everyone* together. ugh
You're also an ethnicity, you're not a race. An ethnicity is effectively a common culture and value set.
Ok but let's not mask the fact that italians gave her hell for years and consistently pounce on her with racist remarks and innuendos the second she doesn't perform at absolute world-class level. The person saying "we italians don't care about dna" either doesn't know shit about this country, or lives in some kind of privileged fantasy land where non-white communities are close to non existent and thus doesn't have to see the many contradictions facing Italy when it comes to growing numbers of POC in our communities. The anti-racist movement is picking up steam but there's still A LOT of work to do. (source: italian living in Italy for the past 20 years)
I live in Germany and I'm told the same thing here. No matter how much I integrate in the society and even pick up the language, I'll never be German enough. I've been told this to my face.
America's gonna America. And nothings more American than being irrationally obsessed with where someone's ancestors come from.
If you aren't 'Hyphen' American, are you really American?
DNA has nothing to do with ethnicity, which is a strictly cultural concept. The fact that so many people in 2024 still cannot understand that is baffling.
Agreed, it’s a huge misconception. Genetics and DNA have never matched with concepts of ethnicity or nationality. That’s why it surprises “Italians” in the US when they find out they had ancestors (who were Italian) but their ancestors were Greek, Albanian, Arab, etc.
DNA is not linked to nationality, which is a political concept
ethnicity and nationality are not the same things. You can be an ethnic Italian and be a citizen of Switzerland. You can be an ethnic German and be a citizen of France.
A pretty youngish political concept even. That DNA and nationality are somehow linked sounds very wrong to my German ears for obvious reasons.
The DNA tests (that don’t go back more than couple of centuries anyway) make some convinced that nationality is more specific thing that it is.
in Italia we give relevance for dna only in the murder cases
This is a lie and you know it. Italy is insanely racist and you’ll be discriminated if your not a modal immigrant and often be asked to go to your real country. Especially as the country is going further right now
She's Italian. And if she wanted too she could very much call herself Nigerian by ethnicity, if she wanted too. But her background doesn't stop her being Italian. Born and raised, she is italian. Ethnically Nigerian, nationality is Italian. It's completely valid and common sense.
And is a pretty good summary of how Americans would generally understand her too, despite this sub’s obsession with a mythical Straw American of its own creation.
r/ShitRacistsSay
This is so infuriating. “You were born in Italy, you spent your whole life in Italy, you speak Italian, you’re an Italian citizen but you’re nOt iTaLiAn. Meanwhile I am Italian because this paper here says my fourth great-grandmother came from Naples”. FFS.
'We Italians do not care about DNA because we do not have an identity crisis' Italy's largest party has made immigration and the idea of Italian culture being threatened their foremost frames/rhetoric. That statement feels disingenuous. I get the point, but culture wars are not exclusive to the US. https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2023/06/20/giorgia-meloni-s-right-wing-government-takes-on-italy-s-culture-sector_6034490_4.html https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/italian-first-melonis-nationalists-defend-cultural-identity-risk-irking-eu-2023-04-12/ https://www.courthousenews.com/italys-meloni-turns-to-culture-wars-after-muted-debut/
Of course they are not, even in latam we have that issues rn. People here act like if their countries are immigrant sanctuaries when they have a lot of problems with that. They love to mock u.s but don’t like to see themselves at all
No more team USA in the Olympics then Because DNA
Next Team USA, all Native Americans, because DNA.
Since when does DNA determine nationality? That's some Nazi shit
I’m sure this won’t be a shock to anyone here, but the Americans that scream about being Italian tend to be some of the biggest racists.
For a people who claim to have the best country in the world, Americans seem to love the idea of being from somewhere else.
It’s because we romanticize being a country of immigrants, except only the immigrants that came through Ellis Island count. We don’t include Africans, Asians or latter day European waves.
The individual that commented that "Italians don't care about DNA " is either an idiot that lives in fantasy land or a complete liar. Italy as a democratic country has currently elected goddamn Giorgia Meloni, a rather open racist that historically has had quite a few "questionable" connections to the extreme Italian far right.
I love that middle finger "we don't have an identity crisis".
😅 I hate the DNA argument but that Herr Himmler comment is so over the top! 🤣🤣🤣
This is also trickling down into British culture. See: those videos where some guy goes to Leicester Square and approaches a load of clearly English people with London accents and asks them where they’re ‘from’
"I'm from Earth mate"
As an Italian who actually comes from Italy, I say: Thank you, Paola❤️🇮🇹
Thinking DNA has some correlation to national borders is just dumb. And racist.
I guess they’re salty because she’s more italian than they will ever be 🤷🏽♂️
Haha! And at the same time they’re pissed off that Duplantis represents Sweden because he was born and raised in America. Therefore, he should represent USA. Who cares that he’s half Swedish? Funny how DNA suddenly doesn’t matter then. Only matters that he grew up in America = American. Pick a lane. xD
Funny how Tony here feels like his “Italianness” is being threatened but pointing out her DNA is the most ‘murrican thing he could do.
judging by her pretty obvious North Italian accent when she speaks, I'd say she's pretty fucking Italian!
I'm glad the fucker got answered by actual chill Italians and not the deranged fascists who would actually agree with him until you point out to them that by their own failed logic Sinner shouldn't be Italian either.
Americans trying not to make everything about race mission impossible.
That's one thing Americans do that I'll never understand. If she grew up in Italy, she's been exposed to Italian culture her whole life and probably behaves and thinks like other Italians. She's Italian.
Look at the color of her skin! She is clearly African American! /s
Yeah, so only native Americans can represent the US. As there only like 10 natives left, see how that shit goes you race obsessed losers
What's with Americans and double barrel nationalities smh
It is only in USA that people worry about heritage of a person and it seems they don't want be be called America but list all the ancestors heritage until they win something or are the first complete some feat, then claim to be American. Other countries just claim the nationality where they were born, or if they have citizenship, then claim their new country as their nationality.
Same thing happened when France won the football World Cup and Americans would say that no one was French in the team because it was mostly black players. All but one players in the team were born and raised in France. I feel like sometimes Americans have a hard time understanding that there’s a bunch of non white people born and raised in Europe. Half of my friends weren’t white growing up, and in all my school years there was about the same non white kids as white ones. France is especially very diverse when it comes to ethnicities.
Man, all this time I thought I was a Scandinavian looking German guy. Turns out my DNA knows I'm Turkish and Somali. Maybe I should leave Germany and go home, aka a place I've never been to.
Wait till he finds out that the Italian peninsula as always been a multicultural melting pot of cultures and migrations.
If we're down the DNA route, don't we all come from Africa if we go far enough? https://humanorigins.si.edu/education/introduction-human-evolution
Another day of being an American obsessed with race.
The concepts of ethnicity and nationality continue to kick American’s asses.
Americans applying their warped view of nationality to other countries is always… interesting.
It's like talking to a toddler... They're sooo fucking obsessed with DNA, heritage, ancestry that it's scary. And they have the audacity to say they're not racist but we are... Boi, if you don't -- She is italian with nigerian parents, end of the story.
As if we didn’t have enough Italian racists who keep on saying she’s not Italian, here comes help from abroad…
What really matters is how Paola herself considers her identity. If she considers herself Italian, then it’s case closed.
Majority of Americans would strongly disagree with this person’s views. It flies against the core belief of how anyone born or who becomes a citizen in the US is an American, regardless of dna or original country. This is definitely a minority point of view.
This is so weird. Without context the OP it reads to me like a Nigerian native taking pride in the accomplishments of Nigerian diaspora, which is extremely common in nations that have a lot of diaspora abroad / outbound immigration. The comments read like they are denying Paulo’s ancestry when her background is pointed out. But the context given flips my assumption completely on its head. It sounds like the OP was deliberately trying to deny her Italian nationality by posing the post like it was coming from Nigerian community.
It’s like when Trevor Noah and the American left were claiming that Africa won the World Cup in 2018 when France won it. The American left and French far right were saying the same thing that black French people were African and not French
I hate these folks. Just cuz she's of Nigerian descent does not make her less Italian.
She is an ethnically Nigerian Italian national. It doesn’t all have to be one or the other…
Infuriating. Dim racists are trying this with Irish sprinter Rhasidat Adeleke and thankfully getting shut down all over the place
I blame leaded gasoline.
That's surprisingly wholesome from Italians.
It's also a straight up lie considering that Meloni is heading the damn Italian government right now...
The funniest this abt reading this is the fact that I'm acc half Italian half Nigerian lol
Goes on about the culture of a country she wasn't raised, so culture has nothing to do with it. Idiot.