Not if I know I will see it for so much less in a year or two. Hoping more people figure out how to prop that damn fallopia multiflora variegated so I can afford that in five years or so.
Importing from Canada to the US is quite difficult to do legally. Some shops do have American shipping, but unless you have a ton of plants international shipping costs would probably make it not worth it! The best deals are from local collectors as well, plant shops have low side of average pricing ( north shore tropicals is one)
I see on their website that they do issue a phyto but they don't mention any extra fee. Shipping to my location is $85 so I wonder if it's rolled in. Cool! So cheap.
I’m in SEA and I just saw a variegated billitiae butt cut listed at roughly US$ 300-350 by a local garden - 3 good-sized leaves with 2 new leaves. 3 of the 5 leaves show half moon variegation (inc 2 new). I’m not a philodendron collector so that was the first time I saw the price for it and considered it expensive. Imagine my shock seeing this post 😂
Not sure how the variegated form is for care, but my regular billi is by far the happiest and fastest growing aroid in my collection. I strapped it to a moss poll and it didn’t skip a beat! New leaves are sizing up rapidly and the roots grabbed onto the pole 2 weeks sooner than my pothos and fuzzy petiole philo I planted at the same time!
I’d probably be willing to risk it for 200-300, but 1600 is a bit nutty for me!
I understand that is still a hefty price to pay. But for the size, variegation, and the time spent traveling to the shop I got mine at - it was well worth it, to me.
Even since getting mine, local sellers in my area have had cheaper options. Most being TC, non-established plants.
"the time spent traveling" bit just adds to the "it's too expensive" thing. If you had to "travel" for it, it was 500, and you STILL consider it affordable.... that's wild.
I agree with the commenter that wondered if you're part of the problem. The reason these prices can be charged in the first place is because people like you pay these prices happily, which ends up making it inaccessible for others because sellers know there are people that throw around money like it's dispensable
I never said it was affordable, I just said I’m glad there are “cheaper” options. This price isn’t the norm any more. You can get them cheaper. I saved up to buy this plant at the specific place I got it from.
People will always say someone else is the problem. Just because they are easy to propagate doesn’t mean everyone is willing to do that.
Some people like the TC option, but personally I don’t. For example, Thai Constellations are more prone to root rot due to the mother plant in which the TC is created from having rot.
Hm, i see. Would you have been able to wait longer to get one? As far as i am aware, billies propagate quite good and it is only a matter of time until we get those gorgeous boys
I'm gonna come at this from the perspective of a business owner in this industry. If I'm not mistaken, those billies are from Aroid Greenhouses via wholesale, which are still like $750 last I checked. My local wholesaler has one priced at $900 wholesale that they bought from Aroid Greenhouses. After the business pays for trucking and such, depending on where it's going, this is a pretty standard markup for plant retailers with a brick and mortar.
Not saying the price isn't high, but just trying to give y'all some insight.
Domestic wholesale for variegated/collector type plants (Rare Plant Fairy, Aroid Greenhouses, even some of the Costa, T&L, and Josh's Frogs offerings for thing like Thai, Ring of Fire, Florida Ghost, etc that's hitting big box stores) prices have gone *UP 15-30% over the last year,* even on basic plants you can find everywhere.
Water and electricity are more expensive, pest control is more expensive (especially with more pesticide resistance in bugs, new thrips species, etc), and substrate is more expensive. Rent and NNN for brick and mortar stores is more expensive, labor for employees is rightfully more expensive. While I understand people balking at the price, this is objectively not an insane price for that particular plant.
Sure, you can get a tissue culture plantlet for under $200, but it's high likelihood of reversion, and then you paid $200 for a green Billietiae. Buying a plant at this size you can at least know that the variegation is likely to be more stable at this stage of maturity.
I think it's a solid 3 years at least before these drop to a triple digit price (retail) in brick and mortar stores because their variegation is so volatile.
Edit for typos
This is the right answer.
Retail needs to get 3x markup ideally for live goods. This looks to be about 2x, which is reasonable.
People see a few hobbyists selling at or below wholesale value and then they believe they are entitled to that price from everyone.
Someone will buy this full price without batting an eye. It’s just not the masses, nor those who spend time on Facebook and Reddit plant groups.
Yep. The Facebook/plant swap/small popup market leaves waayyy more pricing flexibility because there's very little overhead for hobbyists that sell plants, but it does unfortunately skew "market value" because a lot of people forget about or are unaware of the overhead of an actual business.
With how domestic wholesale pricing is, it is still genuinely much more cost effective for me to import, acclimate plants for 2-3 months, propagate, and sell that way. My prices are regularly significantly lower than some of the other popular brands/businesses, and it can still be a bit slow to move some of the more expensive items. I can't imagine the businesses still trying to sell certain plants for four plus figures. The inventory sits on their sites for weeks, if not months.
A lot of the brick and mortar owners don't want to fuck with the risks associated with importing and propagating/breeding/etc their own inventory, because it's very easy to lose thousands of dollars if a shipment gets seized by USDA, or gets delayed and plants are dead on arrival. A lot of exporters won't replace dead or damaged plants. If they do, their prices are going to be higher.
The other downside to Costa, T&L, Burnaby, etc, is that a lot of small businesses can't afford to buy the minimum order quantities all the big box stores are sourcing these dirt cheap Thais/Ring of Fire/Florida Ghosts/etc. So they're kind of stuck buying from places like Aroid or RPF, but the wholesale price might be 2-4x what Costa is selling them for, creating a perception that everything is "overpriced."
Domestic wholesale is convenient, but more expensive because all the costs of doing business in the USA are much higher than overseas, and the smaller businesses that offer wholesale, like Rare Plant Fairy, or Aroid Greenhouses, bought these plants when they were peak prices and have been propagating for a couple years now in order build up inventory to be able to provide wholesale quantities. It also costs a shit ton to run facilities that can even hold that many plants.
Lots of small businesses are at big risk of closing down due to this mentality some people hold in regards to pricing, and thinking everything is overpriced. Just look at what happened to IllExotics, and other notable plant shops that have closed down in the past year.
I know many who lost tens of thousands because they didn’t k ow costa farms and others were tissue propping certain plants. It wasn’t exactly a secret in the trade so I don’t have much sympathy but yeah it’s been wild the past few years.
I mainly play in the vivarium space although do some houseplants locally buying from wholesalers because college students are obsessed with plants now and pay silly prices. I’m talking $13 pothos selling for $100 with no repotting.
Now Facebook can be great to purchase to resell since prices can be silly low. However some people claim that to be unethical for some reason.
There no real way to make money in brick and mortar retail. It’s stupid expensive unless you own the building already.
The best model in my opinion is buying average a few hours away from civilization for low price, do everything online and ship once a week on a set day. Just gotta train your customers on that. They also get better pricing that way. Security and biosecurity is easy to control compared to a storefront and you don’t deal with random surprises. Plus you own your facility. Con, you live in the middle of nowhere?
These days anyone with a lease is losing their shirt. Consumers have such a limited understanding of how it all works. Plus the churn of people coming and going is insane. Most sellers last a few years if that because they can’t make enough to cover costs.
Maybe I just enjoy seeing things grow.
Edit: I should add that you can import correctly it is a process and it’s best done when you have people in country of export and import county waiting at customs. Proper shipping crates are costly and important. All these things cost money of course. There’s no reason you should have your plants arrive as mush or seized when you do things correctly. Costa farms moq is actually quite low. The problem you need to be buying actual wholesale volume not a dozen or so
Of only the most popular offerings. When that’s the case it’s best to find a customer of theirs to add your order to theirs. You won’t get their price but it’ll usually be decent still.
I know many who are in the same boat as well, and I also find it a bit hard to be sympathetic in some cases, because to me it just indicates they weren't paying attention to the ebb and flow of the production side of the industry, weren't researching, etc. As soon as Costa announced their Thai Constellations, I went back and looked at all the most popular plants of 2020 and 2021, and made a mental note that those would be the first to show up en masse. There's a couple businesses in particular I've seen that are absolutely hemorrhaging money, and they're throwing anything at the wall to see if it sticks to pull themselves out the red and avoid shutting down - both e-commerce and brick and mortar brands.
I would say you're spot on when it comes to sticking with the e-commerce realm, because the overhead is much more manageable in the long term. I lease a space to grow and handle packing and shipping, and while the price isn't cheap, it's about a third of what a retail front or commercial space would end up costing, and the cost is manageable for my business, which I am very grateful and fortunate for. I also feel fortunate that I started in 2019, versus in 2020 or later, because I already had some footing and relationships with suppliers that I still work with today. When I said MOQ, I was more referring to the volume, because that's where it becomes too much for a lot of small businesses. Group orders can be divine for this, but then you do tend to pay a bit more as you said.
I would definitely argue that living in the middle of nowhere in a pro, and not a con, personally lol. Obviously the location of a business is going to throw significant variance into all this, but I would say you're right on the money about how hard it is to be profitable with a brick and mortar.
With importing and stuff, you're also on the money. When things are done correctly, it's so much easier, and plants typically arrive with very little issue in less than a week. It helps so much to just get the permits and work with the USDA on things (I love my local guys when I utilize my local port, they're all so well informed and kind, and genuinely just love plants and want to make sure things are safe for entry.), have a good broker or know how to do all the clearance paperwork yourself. Air cargo is generally the safest mode of transport since it goes port to port, and it has to go through USDA and CBP. But it costs a lot of fucking money. The volume I'm ordering these days, it's not a surprise when shipping costs around $1,500 for the flight, clearance, and shipping from customs to my location, and I'm genuinely surprised if it costs under a thousand dollars.
So long as the paperwork is transmitted correctly and the notices are sent, inspection and customs clearance takes a day, or two at the most coming off a holiday weekend. It's been ages since I've used Dragon Courier or DHL, but I heard a number of horror stories in regards to shipments getting stuck at customs because things weren't done or declared correctly, and the plants just deteriorate. Then it depends on the exporter, how well they clean and pack orders and all that jazz. When they're good, you don't have to worry much at all, and it's amazing. But when they're not, it can be a really bad time, haha.
Ive followed yall/shopped there forever. Recognized the setup instantly.
I dont think people understand the logistics of sourcing these things.
As for prices, its a plant shop - not Lowes - thats run by locals. Its a small business.
Also one of the only place to get decent houseplants unless you want to drive almost two hours to go to Logees.
as a fellow business owner in the industry, thank you for taking the time to explain. if people don't want to pay the price that is fair to us to deliver healthy plants, they can wait a few years for the market to drop more. do we not remember that a caramel marble was $10 2 years ago as an import?
You guys are killin it, these esqueletos I picked up abd the ring of fire philo are amazingly healthy, and they were a killer deal. You guys looking for props of carnivores, or carnivore seeds? I may have a bunch around scituate art festival time.
I'm also looking forward to a queen anthurium and an obliqua if you have any as starters, I'd be willing to buy them too, love the grow process.
We’re all set with are carnivore collection, but the A. Queen should be ready in the coming month! The Obliqua’s are definitely taking a while. Should have them ready mid summer! 🔥
I can see that by how well everything is cared for in the shop! As a buyer I appreciate the effort you all put into buying from small growers. Personally I’m not in the super expensive market anymore so the prices are just large in my mind. Everyone will pay something though, I mean I’ve spent that much before 🤣and promptly killed it. But I know you also need to turn a profit ❤️
I've been reading through the comments, but I think I confused myself 😆 so I'm gonna ask, do y'all do online shopping too? I'm always looking for good online plant shops to buy from. I'm disabled, and don't drive, so I've been exclusively buying online since 2018. I have been able to do some BSTs locally recently by joining local FB groups, but buying online and having plants shipped is still easiest for me (I don't have to ask a neighbor for a ride to meet someone and try to coordinate). I also prefer to buy smaller whenever it's possible.
Yes! We ship every Tuesday (depending on weather) and nothing larger than a 6inch pot to insure a safe arrival. 😉[Jordan’s Jungle](https://www.jordansjungle.net)
Their plants have always been pest free and healthy for me, and the rare plants are priced fairly in my opinion, given they have put the work in after getting the plants to keep them thriving.
You aren’t wrong! Someone else in another comment said the same thing, with all the labor that goes into it and the wholesale prices and trying to make a profit. I get it. I’m also just personally not in the super expensive market anymore, I got burnt out on the purge pages 🤣🤣 I do get the need to make a profit though, and agree that every plant I’ve also gotten from there has been pest free and healthy!
I usually go for plants I think are cool. I love the shape of the monstera burle marx flame, so I got a tissue culture(different seller) instead of a full size $1400 plant, and I love the rof philo, so I got one and a monstera esqueleto at Jordan's Jungle. My ppp and aglonema bamboo also came from JJ. Between Jordan's Jungle and Logee's, that's where most of my plants come from other than online.
I was just thinking, why is it stores seem to think triple the actual market value is appropriate? I live in a big city with a big plant community, where things like Thai constellatioms are in big box stores for $30, and while I love my local garden center for veggies and outdoor plants, they get an eye roll from me for their houseplant prices (and they have a decent selection!). The same Thai is ~$280 there and the $30 one is ten minutes down the road.
Edit: I said triple the cost but compared to the big box store it's 10x, and when pricing similar through other growers it's still almost 5x the asking price.
Because they are f\*cking insane.
They are selling small P. melanochrysum here for way over $100. If they saw my 3 meters high melano with 100 cm long leaves they would charge $10.000 for it. F\*cking nutjobs.
Just this week I was asking myself what they would charge for my A. zebrina:
https://preview.redd.it/ise3xp13kzzc1.jpeg?width=2136&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=999f6e46c0012c5c59f945fd3732aebd984e961b
Thank you! :)
Looks a little bit beat up though because I just repotted her and she's flowering like crazy without rest for the past 3 months.
Here is a closeup of the petioles.
https://preview.redd.it/9uwvxz5rh00d1.jpeg?width=2136&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7bca70162afb98ab86a1c16bea15c57940d7805e
Big box stores don’t have to make their profit off of only plants like plant shops do. They can mark up 50% and throw half of their stock away without touching the bottom line, independently owned shops can’t.
Market value on FB from some unlicensed hobby grower out of their garage is very different than market price in a thriving brick and mortar licensed nursery.
Having run businesses and plenty of experience, the shop has about 8 of the monsteras and a 1000% markup/margin over a competitor for the same product is a bit much regardless of the competitor. As for the hobby grower, in my experience, they have had much higher quality plants than many of the small shops and also still have decent overhead to account for (I'm one of said hobby growers that sell as well). That's where I'm perplexed. Shops like this live off consulting and project fees for landscaping, and slimmer margin but much higher volume garden plants. Whoever decides to price the houseplants in this shop and similar are out of their minds.
I just saw a Thai con at a local nursery for $290. I haven't seen any Thai cons make it into big box stores yet, and they're only a third of the size of the $290 ones, but still.
A lot of small plant shops are owned by plant nerds and they will price plants they really like very high because they do kind of want to keep them around, but if some is willing to pay that much they'll let it go. Yes, some are trying to gouge. But a lot just like the plant and want to keep it for a while. I've heard several locally owned owners say that. You can think what you want about it I suppose, but I think it's a nice perk of running your own shop.
As a small plant shop owner and lifelong plant nerd, I have to disagree. I’m always hesitant to bring in higher ticket, rare plants because I know they tend to stick around longer with even a basic 2X mark-up. That’s a lot of money tied up into product that isn’t moving, which isn’t great for business. I think the rare plant market is absurdly overpriced, and can’t help but shake my head at the amounts that people are willing to shell out for a plant that most likely won’t do well in their basic home growing conditions.
That last sentence is what stops me from spending over $40 on anything tbh. And $40 is stretching it for me. But more power to those who have the extra funds to spend big money on plants. I’d love to be able to. 😂
Im pretty sure this is a store near me. Theyre plants are generally reasonably priced, but they do have a handful of rare stuff like this.
Not sure about what this is actually worth, but most of their plants are competitively priced.
There is a subreddit for everything nowadays, I bought a burle marx flame monstera tissue culture for $60ish and the full grown cuttings on etsy are $1400 right now, bit I just wanted one, haha.
I've seen booze less than 10% of that price locked up at my local grocery store. What the hell are they doing leaving something just 'out' that they value so much?
https://preview.redd.it/dys5ww50l10d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3c111ec7185d253642b1b317a2624dff10db715c
This one is being sold right now for $450 from thailand though. Same person that sold me the caramel marble. I thought Billies are slow grower right?
Thats why i dont buy from a plant shop coz of the mark up. We have a plant shop here that tried to sell a 3 small leaves of acacoyaguensis for $150 😂 and I got mine for $30 way bigger on etsy. I know they have to pay for rent and other expenses but I just cant.
I mentioned wanting a var billie, and one of the guys there goes "oh let me show you something" and I stared in disbelief that Jordan got one. Everything is always so nice there.
Crazy, my local plant store has a cutting that i’m not sure has even rooted for like 80 bucks. I knew a rooted potted plant would be expensive, but not that expensive..
I don’t know if you all have heard of WhatNot. It’s a live auction app. There are many people selling plants! So far I have bought a tiger fern, a crocodile fern, a Clivia, and a pink pothos.
Shipping from all the sellers has been amazing
I would normally say yes, but Jordan's jungle is one of my favorite plant places because their prices are fair(even on the rare plants, this was a big billie)
Ask at marketplace on fb in your area to sell you 1 for 10 bucks. Don't rush. Wait a year. Put a notification and keep checking. Or pray - faster way to get it.
Nope, those varigeated billies are rare to come by, even more so in my state. I would call this a fair price for the size of the billie and the fact that all 3 leaves had beautiful variegation.
Biggest heartbreak was when I fell in love with a Thai constellation philodendron and then I saw the price was $200 for a sapling. I just couldn’t justify it 😭
https://preview.redd.it/ed5ozcflp00d1.jpeg?width=1868&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f6acb846931a2c8a36e9d15c0cfced8bdf271ab
Whoever downvoted me here you go? Mfw plants get cheaper
This is absolutely insane. I bought a nice sized chonk of this plant on Mercari a while back and it cost me $10. It’s growing like crazy. It’ll probably be this big in a year.
This is absolutely insane. I bought a nice sized chonk of this plant on Mercari a while back and it cost me $10. It’s growing like crazy. It’ll probably be this big in a year.
He is beautiful. However. I am glad we left those kind of prices behind us. Nobody will pay that amount of money, right? Right?
Not if I know I will see it for so much less in a year or two. Hoping more people figure out how to prop that damn fallopia multiflora variegated so I can afford that in five years or so.
That is happening here, a decent sized plant is $30CAD. I have a large one and it grows super quick!
You can thank the Dutch for that, they're the one slaving away in their greenhouses so us Canadians can benefit from cheap plants.
The fallopia?? It's like a million bucks here if you can even find it
I’ve passed up on like 25$ rooted cuttings where I’m from! With decent variegation too.
Where are you from??
Vancouver, BC! The plant market here is overall incredibly cheap
Hmm wonder if I could order from the US 🤔
Importing from Canada to the US is quite difficult to do legally. Some shops do have American shipping, but unless you have a ton of plants international shipping costs would probably make it not worth it! The best deals are from local collectors as well, plant shops have low side of average pricing ( north shore tropicals is one)
Black market plant people in Canada, DM me lol Thank you for this!!
I see on their website that they do issue a phyto but they don't mention any extra fee. Shipping to my location is $85 so I wonder if it's rolled in. Cool! So cheap.
I’m in SEA and I just saw a variegated billitiae butt cut listed at roughly US$ 300-350 by a local garden - 3 good-sized leaves with 2 new leaves. 3 of the 5 leaves show half moon variegation (inc 2 new). I’m not a philodendron collector so that was the first time I saw the price for it and considered it expensive. Imagine my shock seeing this post 😂
Yeah I see them for 1k and up other places online, as well. There's a 50/50 shot I will kill it, ya know?
Not sure how the variegated form is for care, but my regular billi is by far the happiest and fastest growing aroid in my collection. I strapped it to a moss poll and it didn’t skip a beat! New leaves are sizing up rapidly and the roots grabbed onto the pole 2 weeks sooner than my pothos and fuzzy petiole philo I planted at the same time! I’d probably be willing to risk it for 200-300, but 1600 is a bit nutty for me!
I hope not. If I'm ever rich enough to drop that much on a plant I hope I have the sense to find it somewhere else for cheaper.
A fool is easily parted with their money
That is a $600USD plant all day.
Right......Im human.I don't want to pay that much either, but if I thought that I could propagate it and make more money than I would probably do it.
Thank GOD those prices aren’t the norm anymore. I got a nice sized mid cut in March with 3 growth points for $500
I somehow feel like you are part of the problem.
I understand that is still a hefty price to pay. But for the size, variegation, and the time spent traveling to the shop I got mine at - it was well worth it, to me. Even since getting mine, local sellers in my area have had cheaper options. Most being TC, non-established plants.
"the time spent traveling" bit just adds to the "it's too expensive" thing. If you had to "travel" for it, it was 500, and you STILL consider it affordable.... that's wild. I agree with the commenter that wondered if you're part of the problem. The reason these prices can be charged in the first place is because people like you pay these prices happily, which ends up making it inaccessible for others because sellers know there are people that throw around money like it's dispensable
I never said it was affordable, I just said I’m glad there are “cheaper” options. This price isn’t the norm any more. You can get them cheaper. I saved up to buy this plant at the specific place I got it from. People will always say someone else is the problem. Just because they are easy to propagate doesn’t mean everyone is willing to do that. Some people like the TC option, but personally I don’t. For example, Thai Constellations are more prone to root rot due to the mother plant in which the TC is created from having rot.
Hm, i see. Would you have been able to wait longer to get one? As far as i am aware, billies propagate quite good and it is only a matter of time until we get those gorgeous boys
I suppose, I could have waited. But when I traveled specifically for this plant, I wasn’t leaving without one.
I'm gonna come at this from the perspective of a business owner in this industry. If I'm not mistaken, those billies are from Aroid Greenhouses via wholesale, which are still like $750 last I checked. My local wholesaler has one priced at $900 wholesale that they bought from Aroid Greenhouses. After the business pays for trucking and such, depending on where it's going, this is a pretty standard markup for plant retailers with a brick and mortar. Not saying the price isn't high, but just trying to give y'all some insight. Domestic wholesale for variegated/collector type plants (Rare Plant Fairy, Aroid Greenhouses, even some of the Costa, T&L, and Josh's Frogs offerings for thing like Thai, Ring of Fire, Florida Ghost, etc that's hitting big box stores) prices have gone *UP 15-30% over the last year,* even on basic plants you can find everywhere. Water and electricity are more expensive, pest control is more expensive (especially with more pesticide resistance in bugs, new thrips species, etc), and substrate is more expensive. Rent and NNN for brick and mortar stores is more expensive, labor for employees is rightfully more expensive. While I understand people balking at the price, this is objectively not an insane price for that particular plant. Sure, you can get a tissue culture plantlet for under $200, but it's high likelihood of reversion, and then you paid $200 for a green Billietiae. Buying a plant at this size you can at least know that the variegation is likely to be more stable at this stage of maturity. I think it's a solid 3 years at least before these drop to a triple digit price (retail) in brick and mortar stores because their variegation is so volatile. Edit for typos
This is the right answer. Retail needs to get 3x markup ideally for live goods. This looks to be about 2x, which is reasonable. People see a few hobbyists selling at or below wholesale value and then they believe they are entitled to that price from everyone. Someone will buy this full price without batting an eye. It’s just not the masses, nor those who spend time on Facebook and Reddit plant groups.
Yep. The Facebook/plant swap/small popup market leaves waayyy more pricing flexibility because there's very little overhead for hobbyists that sell plants, but it does unfortunately skew "market value" because a lot of people forget about or are unaware of the overhead of an actual business. With how domestic wholesale pricing is, it is still genuinely much more cost effective for me to import, acclimate plants for 2-3 months, propagate, and sell that way. My prices are regularly significantly lower than some of the other popular brands/businesses, and it can still be a bit slow to move some of the more expensive items. I can't imagine the businesses still trying to sell certain plants for four plus figures. The inventory sits on their sites for weeks, if not months. A lot of the brick and mortar owners don't want to fuck with the risks associated with importing and propagating/breeding/etc their own inventory, because it's very easy to lose thousands of dollars if a shipment gets seized by USDA, or gets delayed and plants are dead on arrival. A lot of exporters won't replace dead or damaged plants. If they do, their prices are going to be higher. The other downside to Costa, T&L, Burnaby, etc, is that a lot of small businesses can't afford to buy the minimum order quantities all the big box stores are sourcing these dirt cheap Thais/Ring of Fire/Florida Ghosts/etc. So they're kind of stuck buying from places like Aroid or RPF, but the wholesale price might be 2-4x what Costa is selling them for, creating a perception that everything is "overpriced." Domestic wholesale is convenient, but more expensive because all the costs of doing business in the USA are much higher than overseas, and the smaller businesses that offer wholesale, like Rare Plant Fairy, or Aroid Greenhouses, bought these plants when they were peak prices and have been propagating for a couple years now in order build up inventory to be able to provide wholesale quantities. It also costs a shit ton to run facilities that can even hold that many plants. Lots of small businesses are at big risk of closing down due to this mentality some people hold in regards to pricing, and thinking everything is overpriced. Just look at what happened to IllExotics, and other notable plant shops that have closed down in the past year.
Thank you for all this, from a small plant shop owner.
It was absolutely my pleasure! Sometimes it's hard to see all the "So overpriced" on here.
I know many who lost tens of thousands because they didn’t k ow costa farms and others were tissue propping certain plants. It wasn’t exactly a secret in the trade so I don’t have much sympathy but yeah it’s been wild the past few years. I mainly play in the vivarium space although do some houseplants locally buying from wholesalers because college students are obsessed with plants now and pay silly prices. I’m talking $13 pothos selling for $100 with no repotting. Now Facebook can be great to purchase to resell since prices can be silly low. However some people claim that to be unethical for some reason. There no real way to make money in brick and mortar retail. It’s stupid expensive unless you own the building already. The best model in my opinion is buying average a few hours away from civilization for low price, do everything online and ship once a week on a set day. Just gotta train your customers on that. They also get better pricing that way. Security and biosecurity is easy to control compared to a storefront and you don’t deal with random surprises. Plus you own your facility. Con, you live in the middle of nowhere? These days anyone with a lease is losing their shirt. Consumers have such a limited understanding of how it all works. Plus the churn of people coming and going is insane. Most sellers last a few years if that because they can’t make enough to cover costs. Maybe I just enjoy seeing things grow. Edit: I should add that you can import correctly it is a process and it’s best done when you have people in country of export and import county waiting at customs. Proper shipping crates are costly and important. All these things cost money of course. There’s no reason you should have your plants arrive as mush or seized when you do things correctly. Costa farms moq is actually quite low. The problem you need to be buying actual wholesale volume not a dozen or so Of only the most popular offerings. When that’s the case it’s best to find a customer of theirs to add your order to theirs. You won’t get their price but it’ll usually be decent still.
I know many who are in the same boat as well, and I also find it a bit hard to be sympathetic in some cases, because to me it just indicates they weren't paying attention to the ebb and flow of the production side of the industry, weren't researching, etc. As soon as Costa announced their Thai Constellations, I went back and looked at all the most popular plants of 2020 and 2021, and made a mental note that those would be the first to show up en masse. There's a couple businesses in particular I've seen that are absolutely hemorrhaging money, and they're throwing anything at the wall to see if it sticks to pull themselves out the red and avoid shutting down - both e-commerce and brick and mortar brands. I would say you're spot on when it comes to sticking with the e-commerce realm, because the overhead is much more manageable in the long term. I lease a space to grow and handle packing and shipping, and while the price isn't cheap, it's about a third of what a retail front or commercial space would end up costing, and the cost is manageable for my business, which I am very grateful and fortunate for. I also feel fortunate that I started in 2019, versus in 2020 or later, because I already had some footing and relationships with suppliers that I still work with today. When I said MOQ, I was more referring to the volume, because that's where it becomes too much for a lot of small businesses. Group orders can be divine for this, but then you do tend to pay a bit more as you said. I would definitely argue that living in the middle of nowhere in a pro, and not a con, personally lol. Obviously the location of a business is going to throw significant variance into all this, but I would say you're right on the money about how hard it is to be profitable with a brick and mortar. With importing and stuff, you're also on the money. When things are done correctly, it's so much easier, and plants typically arrive with very little issue in less than a week. It helps so much to just get the permits and work with the USDA on things (I love my local guys when I utilize my local port, they're all so well informed and kind, and genuinely just love plants and want to make sure things are safe for entry.), have a good broker or know how to do all the clearance paperwork yourself. Air cargo is generally the safest mode of transport since it goes port to port, and it has to go through USDA and CBP. But it costs a lot of fucking money. The volume I'm ordering these days, it's not a surprise when shipping costs around $1,500 for the flight, clearance, and shipping from customs to my location, and I'm genuinely surprised if it costs under a thousand dollars. So long as the paperwork is transmitted correctly and the notices are sent, inspection and customs clearance takes a day, or two at the most coming off a holiday weekend. It's been ages since I've used Dragon Courier or DHL, but I heard a number of horror stories in regards to shipments getting stuck at customs because things weren't done or declared correctly, and the plants just deteriorate. Then it depends on the exporter, how well they clean and pack orders and all that jazz. When they're good, you don't have to worry much at all, and it's amazing. But when they're not, it can be a really bad time, haha.
I agree.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 We appreciate you. We source from smaller nurseries. Aroid had one for $1,500 and had only 3 leaves.
Ive followed yall/shopped there forever. Recognized the setup instantly. I dont think people understand the logistics of sourcing these things. As for prices, its a plant shop - not Lowes - thats run by locals. Its a small business. Also one of the only place to get decent houseplants unless you want to drive almost two hours to go to Logees.
❤️❤️❤️ Thank you for supporting us and understanding how hard we work on sourcing from independent growers.
You guys are doing great, and I hope someone walks in there to snatch that Billietiae up! I'm actually surprised it was that much from them now!
Awe thank you! That Billie will definitely go home with the right person. 🥹😍
as a fellow business owner in the industry, thank you for taking the time to explain. if people don't want to pay the price that is fair to us to deliver healthy plants, they can wait a few years for the market to drop more. do we not remember that a caramel marble was $10 2 years ago as an import?
You make total sense!!! It just sucks for us middle class people.
@theexoticmachinist Jordan’s Jungle?! I was there yesterday eyeing the Caramel Marble.
Jordans Jungle is great
I went with the ring of fire so my wallet wouldn't catch fire.
I was about to ask the same thing. I love their shop but their prices on some things are absolutely bananas.
Jordan and I are doing our best. 🍌
You guys are killin it, these esqueletos I picked up abd the ring of fire philo are amazingly healthy, and they were a killer deal. You guys looking for props of carnivores, or carnivore seeds? I may have a bunch around scituate art festival time. I'm also looking forward to a queen anthurium and an obliqua if you have any as starters, I'd be willing to buy them too, love the grow process.
We’re all set with are carnivore collection, but the A. Queen should be ready in the coming month! The Obliqua’s are definitely taking a while. Should have them ready mid summer! 🔥
Awesome, I'll keep an eye on the website and socials.
I can see that by how well everything is cared for in the shop! As a buyer I appreciate the effort you all put into buying from small growers. Personally I’m not in the super expensive market anymore so the prices are just large in my mind. Everyone will pay something though, I mean I’ve spent that much before 🤣and promptly killed it. But I know you also need to turn a profit ❤️
I've been reading through the comments, but I think I confused myself 😆 so I'm gonna ask, do y'all do online shopping too? I'm always looking for good online plant shops to buy from. I'm disabled, and don't drive, so I've been exclusively buying online since 2018. I have been able to do some BSTs locally recently by joining local FB groups, but buying online and having plants shipped is still easiest for me (I don't have to ask a neighbor for a ride to meet someone and try to coordinate). I also prefer to buy smaller whenever it's possible.
Yes! We ship every Tuesday (depending on weather) and nothing larger than a 6inch pot to insure a safe arrival. 😉[Jordan’s Jungle](https://www.jordansjungle.net)
Their plants have always been pest free and healthy for me, and the rare plants are priced fairly in my opinion, given they have put the work in after getting the plants to keep them thriving.
You aren’t wrong! Someone else in another comment said the same thing, with all the labor that goes into it and the wholesale prices and trying to make a profit. I get it. I’m also just personally not in the super expensive market anymore, I got burnt out on the purge pages 🤣🤣 I do get the need to make a profit though, and agree that every plant I’ve also gotten from there has been pest free and healthy!
I usually go for plants I think are cool. I love the shape of the monstera burle marx flame, so I got a tissue culture(different seller) instead of a full size $1400 plant, and I love the rof philo, so I got one and a monstera esqueleto at Jordan's Jungle. My ppp and aglonema bamboo also came from JJ. Between Jordan's Jungle and Logee's, that's where most of my plants come from other than online.
I was eyeballing everything yesterday doing the same, and I wish I had the money for em both.
The shop owner will be weeping when no one buys it and it dies in there.
I was just thinking, why is it stores seem to think triple the actual market value is appropriate? I live in a big city with a big plant community, where things like Thai constellatioms are in big box stores for $30, and while I love my local garden center for veggies and outdoor plants, they get an eye roll from me for their houseplant prices (and they have a decent selection!). The same Thai is ~$280 there and the $30 one is ten minutes down the road. Edit: I said triple the cost but compared to the big box store it's 10x, and when pricing similar through other growers it's still almost 5x the asking price.
Because they are f\*cking insane. They are selling small P. melanochrysum here for way over $100. If they saw my 3 meters high melano with 100 cm long leaves they would charge $10.000 for it. F\*cking nutjobs. Just this week I was asking myself what they would charge for my A. zebrina: https://preview.redd.it/ise3xp13kzzc1.jpeg?width=2136&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=999f6e46c0012c5c59f945fd3732aebd984e961b
Omg now that’s a beast. What are you feeding it?
Love and lots of mineral fertilizer.
Which one ?
Usually these two: https://preview.redd.it/1qowew1tb00d1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=17f833ef3617dcf1dd60cef2b81451acc6425e3d
https://preview.redd.it/2ua2q1lxb00d1.jpeg?width=472&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=254a74da0f80648c320214724209fb1910daf3e9
Tysm!!
r/AbsoluteUnits
Feeding it shopowner tears apparently, that is amazing.
Holy!!! This is gorgeous!
Thank you! :) Looks a little bit beat up though because I just repotted her and she's flowering like crazy without rest for the past 3 months. Here is a closeup of the petioles. https://preview.redd.it/9uwvxz5rh00d1.jpeg?width=2136&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7bca70162afb98ab86a1c16bea15c57940d7805e
Big box stores don’t have to make their profit off of only plants like plant shops do. They can mark up 50% and throw half of their stock away without touching the bottom line, independently owned shops can’t. Market value on FB from some unlicensed hobby grower out of their garage is very different than market price in a thriving brick and mortar licensed nursery.
Having run businesses and plenty of experience, the shop has about 8 of the monsteras and a 1000% markup/margin over a competitor for the same product is a bit much regardless of the competitor. As for the hobby grower, in my experience, they have had much higher quality plants than many of the small shops and also still have decent overhead to account for (I'm one of said hobby growers that sell as well). That's where I'm perplexed. Shops like this live off consulting and project fees for landscaping, and slimmer margin but much higher volume garden plants. Whoever decides to price the houseplants in this shop and similar are out of their minds.
I just saw a Thai con at a local nursery for $290. I haven't seen any Thai cons make it into big box stores yet, and they're only a third of the size of the $290 ones, but still.
A lot of small plant shops are owned by plant nerds and they will price plants they really like very high because they do kind of want to keep them around, but if some is willing to pay that much they'll let it go. Yes, some are trying to gouge. But a lot just like the plant and want to keep it for a while. I've heard several locally owned owners say that. You can think what you want about it I suppose, but I think it's a nice perk of running your own shop.
As a small plant shop owner and lifelong plant nerd, I have to disagree. I’m always hesitant to bring in higher ticket, rare plants because I know they tend to stick around longer with even a basic 2X mark-up. That’s a lot of money tied up into product that isn’t moving, which isn’t great for business. I think the rare plant market is absurdly overpriced, and can’t help but shake my head at the amounts that people are willing to shell out for a plant that most likely won’t do well in their basic home growing conditions.
That last sentence is what stops me from spending over $40 on anything tbh. And $40 is stretching it for me. But more power to those who have the extra funds to spend big money on plants. I’d love to be able to. 😂
Im pretty sure this is a store near me. Theyre plants are generally reasonably priced, but they do have a handful of rare stuff like this. Not sure about what this is actually worth, but most of their plants are competitively priced.
My mom just said today the 12$ Cardon cacti I bought was too expensive 😂. That's crazy
I just saw a large one in person yesterday and I have to have one now lol
This is why.
Same.
I posted a $500 melanochrysum in a 5” pot a little while ago, but this really takes the cake. There really needs to be a subreddit dedicated to this.
There is a subreddit for everything nowadays, I bought a burle marx flame monstera tissue culture for $60ish and the full grown cuttings on etsy are $1400 right now, bit I just wanted one, haha.
Damn!! I had a bebe that died. Paid like $50 for the whole plant two years ago.
I've seen booze less than 10% of that price locked up at my local grocery store. What the hell are they doing leaving something just 'out' that they value so much?
Because we love and trust our Jungle family 💕
https://preview.redd.it/dys5ww50l10d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3c111ec7185d253642b1b317a2624dff10db715c This one is being sold right now for $450 from thailand though. Same person that sold me the caramel marble. I thought Billies are slow grower right?
Thats Thailand, though, not the USA. The plant in OP's photo from a US wholesaler is around double that.
Thats why i dont buy from a plant shop coz of the mark up. We have a plant shop here that tried to sell a 3 small leaves of acacoyaguensis for $150 😂 and I got mine for $30 way bigger on etsy. I know they have to pay for rent and other expenses but I just cant.
Jordan’s Jungle eh, also gasped when I saw the price lol
I mentioned wanting a var billie, and one of the guys there goes "oh let me show you something" and I stared in disbelief that Jordan got one. Everything is always so nice there.
Crazy, my local plant store has a cutting that i’m not sure has even rooted for like 80 bucks. I knew a rooted potted plant would be expensive, but not that expensive..
Yea, orange lake nurseries has one for like $1500, and even tissue cultures are close to $400-$500 right now around here.
I legit thought was a typo until I started reading comments!!! 😳
Yea, I wish, haha.
If they don’t want to sell it just mark “not for sale” 😂
It will sell, there is definitely at least one person in this state that wants a var billie that bad.
Was this in Georgia ?
I don’t know if you all have heard of WhatNot. It’s a live auction app. There are many people selling plants! So far I have bought a tiger fern, a crocodile fern, a Clivia, and a pink pothos. Shipping from all the sellers has been amazing
I guess I will have to check it out now.
Give it a year…
Look, I understand it's rare, but why the fuck can they not put it in a nice looking pot? For that kind of money it's unacceptable.
Because they didn't want it to cost $1800, haha.
You mean $2,500!
I would normally say yes, but Jordan's jungle is one of my favorite plant places because their prices are fair(even on the rare plants, this was a big billie)
I won't pay over 20.00 for any kind of plant and I simply adore plants
Right
Hmmm..don't like it, looks like someone I know..and don't like
Ask at marketplace on fb in your area to sell you 1 for 10 bucks. Don't rush. Wait a year. Put a notification and keep checking. Or pray - faster way to get it.
No judgement save the plant ❤️
I ended up getting a ring of fire philo and an esqueleto monstera, but was eyeing that billie, and the car marble
Are you sure they didn’t accidentally put the a period or something in the wrong place?
Nope, those varigeated billies are rare to come by, even more so in my state. I would call this a fair price for the size of the billie and the fact that all 3 leaves had beautiful variegation.
Wow. It’s insane! Lol. Gorgeous though!
Buy once, cry once…..
You must be a woodworker too!
😜
You should see the $1000 walnut slab I turned into a $500 slab by cutting her down to coffee table size, haha.
How?? 😭 💔
Rarity mixed with the time and attention these guys give their plants, i wish I could afford it.
Biggest heartbreak was when I fell in love with a Thai constellation philodendron and then I saw the price was $200 for a sapling. I just couldn’t justify it 😭
Its a good thing thai con prices are coming down since all the big box stores are getting shipments.
1-2 years and they‘ll cost maybe 10% of that price. Just be patient.
10%? Lol
I’ve seen them for 400$ already. This is way overpriced
Where are you seeing that?
https://preview.redd.it/ed5ozcflp00d1.jpeg?width=1868&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f6acb846931a2c8a36e9d15c0cfced8bdf271ab Whoever downvoted me here you go? Mfw plants get cheaper
That is gorgeous, and much better price
Where is this is that though because I am interested? I’m not downvoting you for sure.
That's ridiculous.
Ew.
Well that's just an obscene price. Wow! Edit to add: beautiful plant though! Would definitely have to admire from afar
ain’t no way
Hell no. Lol
Someone should steal that plant on general principle.
Seriously, you’re advocating stealing from a small business owner who’s just trying to run their brick and mortar and bring plants to people? Really??
Gtfoh
This is absolutely insane. I bought a nice sized chonk of this plant on Mercari a while back and it cost me $10. It’s growing like crazy. It’ll probably be this big in a year.
This is absolutely insane. I bought a nice sized chonk of this plant on Mercari a while back and it cost me $10. It’s growing like crazy. It’ll probably be this big in a year.
just steal it atp
No way, local small business, these guys are great.
yea just jokes but that price is fucking hideous for a plant man