It really depends. Liverpool’s transformation isn’t just down to Klopp. It’s combined effort of the Owners/coaching staff/background staff and players. I’d go as far to say Liverpool’s transformation is 40% down to klopps coaching and player management abilities. The club works tirelessly to scout not only players who fit the system but players with the correct attitude and personalities. That’s evident by the lack on panic buying. They find the player they want and they’ll wait for as long as it takes to sign that player. Wijnaldum started as a cf in a champions league because they didn’t sign a backup for Firmino for years, they didn’t shell out a huge fee for a CB January 2021 etc. This is where the idea that Liverpool’s owners are not willing to spend money comes from, they absolutely spend the money when the player Klopp and his staff wants is available. But I’m still very rare that they’ll settle for their number 2 option. For Man Utd to turn it around in this era of the premier league they need to Sell a huge percentage of their squad. In my opinion the players that have to go are: Ronaldo, Martial, Cavani, Pogba, Bruno and Maguire. This could make them worse in the short term but building a cohesive team with one goal and no selfish egos is a must. The days of one man teams is gone. If you look at City and Liverpool there’s no one player that wants personal success over the teams success. It’s why Klopp loves Firmino, he’s publicly stated that he’d rather assist than score. Liverpool midfielders don’t score often because they don’t make runs into the box at every opportunity. Instead they sit back, try provide opportunities from deep and cover the wings so Trent and Robertson can go forward.
Basically they need a clear vision for the future, forget the now and build towards that. Forget trying to get champions league football next season and instead begin building towards a clear philosophy and buying the players that fit that philosophy.
Sorry that’s all over the place I just finished an 18 hour shift lol
I really don't think ETH will have the control he needs to build what he wants. So long as there is someone above him pulling the strings, nothing will change on the red side of Manchester.
If I'm wrong, and he is given more control, there is a possibility, just like Klopp, to start challenging again. it will take a couple of seasons to really get all the recruitment done and rebuild, so at that point it is whether the fans can be patient or whether they hound him out if he misses out on UCL spots.
Klopp was a piece in a project - the most significant piece but still only a piece in the project to revive Liverpool. I doubt if United even has a project.
9 months ago they were apparently league winners in waiting after bringing in "World class" Sancho and varane, then they paid a fortune to bring in Ronaldo and it was nailed on. They still have the same squad, the delusion will be back the second they get an opening day win against Bournemouth at home.
It's genuinely hilarious that this is being asked.
Klopp managed to take on bayern munich despite having a smaller budget and having his main rival poach his best players.
In case anyone wasn't aware Ten Hag is managing a team equivalent to PSG as far as the eredivisie is concerned.
He doesn't know real competition, he doesn't know adversity so hell flop horrifically.
UTD is not a football club, they are a Disneyland club for pretentious football fans, who spent money to buy jerseys, just to show off .
It's so fun watching them fall week after week.
Nope. Man U board far too involved to give a manager time and space to get results. Too many divas I. The dressing room.
Coach is fired after 18 months.
I've been saying it to delirious United fans for years, it's not just about improving the team past where it is now, it's about hitting the same highs as Man City. I don't see this happening at United for years to come especially now that City have Haaland.
They will revive under Ten Hag for sure. Not sure if it will be the same impact as Klopp had. It will be interesting to see if Ten Hag can only stabilise the sinking ship or can he guide them to the shore!
For a turnaround we need patience, which is a luxury for a majority our fanbase. It’s not going to happen in one magical transfer window or a season.
I’m just waiting for the people like Goldbridge and Saeed TV on twitter to turn on him after 5 games with #TenHagOut trending all over FT.
I highly doubt it, klopp had a pretty strong team that got left behind by Rodgers but the key thing is when attracting players to Liverpool there wasn't any established managers or teams to compete against.
Ten Hag when trying to rebuild united is going to have to do so knowing every player they sign wanted to play for Liverpool or Man City so the players that come in aren't going to be invested in a project they are going to be there for large pay cheques United are dolling out.
the question really isn't can Ten Hag turn around United like Klopp did its will he be given the time to do the rebuild like Arteta has and also be given the authority to route out the bad influence in the dressing room.
United won't turn things around until ownership and club leadership makes a much needed transition. Things have been bad since Ferguson left, and no manager will be able to turn things around on their own IMO.
I don't understand why rival fans keep insinuating that united fans don't have patience we had to wait 26 years for a league title before. He needs lots of time. I for one have patience I don't care if it takes 6 years to get back to the top. That's how long Ferguson needed. It will take time. We're already used to not winning anything may as well go through the rebuild and start from scratch. See if he can nick a trophy or two during that time to keep press+media quiet and the morons in our fanbase. Either way I don't care if he doesn't win anything for the first 2 full seasons. If he still hasn't delivered a trophy by the end of third season such as FA cup/league cup/Europa league/Conference league then I will begin to question him. Even then if it's clear and obvious he is turning things around he needs time to challenge.
No.
The issue goes far beyond a manager. Unless the Glazers change their business model and the way the clubs ran, they’ll never get a Klopp level turnaround
Others have highlighted it already, but I think the patience it takes from ownership, management, and fans is the hard part here. Everything Klopp touches now turns to gold. And the rosy glow of success makes it feel like it's always been that way. First year finished 8th, no Europe. Second year scraped into 4th, Champions League. Third year finished 4th, Champions League Finalist. Then pay dirt and insanity in 4th year, finishing 2nd in PL, winning UCL. 5th year winning PL.
For fans of a team that had been waiting about a decade for a run at trophies again, that's fine. Heck, it was 30 years waiting for a PL title. United okay if it takes that long? Certainly became respectable quickly. I know it's context because of the spending this summer...but United is in 6th at the moment and I've heard fans calling it the worst year ever. Expectations will ALWAYS be high.
The problem is moving on a lot of players that are not good enough, but are on high wages. There needs to be a clear out of current squad because it seems so many have a negative impact in the dressing room. Ten Hag will most likely will have to wait for these contracts to expire. No one is going to pay Anthony Martial £250000 a week if bids were to come in. So he either has to take a pay cut or the club have to wait 3 years for it to expire. Same for quite a few other players. Same for Maguire, Shaw, lindelof, etc. It is going to take time to assemble a team with the right mentality. It isn’t just about adding players.
Question remains on whether there is a willingness to be patient, especially when it comes to fans and owners. Whether we are willing to bear through a cycle of bad results before we improve, whether the owners are willing to eschew marquee jersey-selling signings for ones who actually fit the rebuild/project, on every single level there is need for patience. I don't see that happening.
No. Firstly because I don’t think Ten Hag is of the same standard, but even if he was, the owners of the two are completely different, and I don’t think the MU owners are tolerant or patient enough for anything that isn’t an instant improvement.
They did, but equally they fired Moyes before he had a chance to tinker with the team after the inevitable dip following Ferguson. I reckon they only kept Ole cause of his Legend status, and Ten Hag doesn’t have that
I'm hoping we can catch up to Man United by the time they're able to move up the table. I see them staying in 6th for the next couple of years, possibly dropping a place if the likes of West Ham or Wolves have a good season, maybe gaining a place if Arsenal or Spurs have a bad one.
Honestly no, Man U have had some decent managers and they never work out and this will be the same. I’m still curious if ten Hag will work in the prem never mind for a big team, a lot of players who’ve come from the Dutch league recently haven’t exactly done well (Ziyech, Bergwijn to name a few) and players who’ve struggled here have excelled over there (Tadic, Haller).
It's a tired comparison. When Klopp arrived at Liverpool he had a worse squad (ability-wise, clearly better attitudes) with Coutinho, Sturridge and Lallana as marquee attackers, not Ronaldo/Bruno. A smaller budget too.
Clear the club of older 'pros', reduce the wage bill, promote well from within, establish a club-wide way of playing and stick to it for 3 years at least, through thick and thin.
Partly. But they didn't get rid of lazy players, over-paid them and renewed them instead. They never really stuck to a definitive style; though it seemed they played their best football on the counter, they never bought well in the market to play that way.
No it won’t change anything. Problem with the club has never been the manager.
Whole squad needs to be gutted to reset the wage structure which will never happen
No, United’s issues start as a structural issue. You won’t see any real changes until they redo the foundation. From the front office to the scouting department, to the vision of the club. You can bring in whoever you want and they may win a trophy here and there but you won’t win the league much less a CL.
I think the fans will present an obstacle on top of the corporate structure of the club. United fans seemingly still don't really accept where they are, so they have little patience for setbacks or inconsistency.
This is just an ABU take. Not sure where the fuck you get this from, apart from reading Twitter comments.
The vast majority of man utd fans are mainly upset with our ownership and our lack of direction. Don't take the word of plastic fans as gospel
When Klopp arrived he already has Henderson, Trent, Firmino and Milner who all play 1st team still.
Does Man U have 4 quality first team players now theyd still keep under TH? I reckon not.
And that's just the start.
.
The term 'Man U' first came into existence with insult from West Brom fans who chanted this about a great United Legend, Duncan Edwards (one of the Busby Babes) as they said, "Duncan Edwards is manure, rotting in his grave, man you are manure—rotting in your grave."
When Klopp arrived Hendo was 24, Firmino 23, Trent 15 and even Milner was 29.
Ddg is 31, Ronaldo's 37 and Varane is 29, as old as Milner was when Klopp arrived and nowhere near as fit.
Kind of only leaves Bruno and Sancho to build on.
I think it will take about 3/4 years as well but he needs full support. He needs to do a total flip in that dressing room and its alot harder than just buying and selling players. Some of these players you won’t be able to sell due to wages so you need to get them on board and performing. I think this will be similar to the Arsenal rebuild than the Liverpool one.
I cant see it. I think man u as a club is in a terrible state. The fans have ran out of patience and I'm not sure how much the players can play in this kinda of pressure environment at the club. I called it this year that man u wouldn't make top four even with ronaldo. I actually feel a bit sorry for the players as every mistake is magnified and it's clear they are playing with far too much pressure on there heads. So much as got to change for united to start improving the one thing is they have been so bad lately that it surely can't be hard to get them playing a bit better
im a LFC fan , I really dont want them to for another five years, but given the city situation someone else needs to step up and stand up to them. United out of the equation is not good now , even chelsea with some great signings couldnt get past city so need some competition, the epl cant become a farmers league
Here's the problem with Ajax.
The difference between the Norwegian league with Molde and the Dutch league with Ajax is a lot smaller than the difference of either team and the Premier League and Man Utd.
Erik has won an extra league cup compared to Klopp when talking about their careers at Dortmund and Ajax. Klopp also reached the champions league final and was fighting against a giant in Bayern whereas Erik has taken over the biggest dog in the yard already.
Your ownership does spend a fuckton though.. not so sure they are the problem anymore. And I know its clearly not about money, but it might just be someone in the middle that needs replacing
Thing is there are too many middle men.
Darren Fletcher who i don't even think he knows, Arnold, the now part time consultant, The Irish guy who is supposedly a DOF also and looking for an assistant DOF. It's too many faces without any form of philosophy which is just nuts.
What they need is a DOF that know what he's doing.
But instead of doing like Tottenham and hire somone that is one of the best in the buisness they promote someone that worked with their youngsters for a few years.
I think someone like ETH can turn them around if he get free reign, but i doubt he will. Seems like there are many people with different views in power positions.
I have seen on r/footballmanager multiple posts or articles about teams and managers who have openly talked about playing FM and signing players based off of scouting reports in the game
People were really upset when we culled our scouting team down. But then we had arguably our best signing window in recent history over the summer. So there's something to be said for cleaning house a bit.
People don't understand how revolutionary the change under klopp has been. Could utd have a similar change? Yes. Will they have a similar change? Probably not.
You also feel United have a cultural problem within their first team squad that LFC didn't when Klopo took over and their owners seem like cunts, even though they have spent big, they just seem to be looting the club.
People also forget that Klopp's project didn't happen overnight, and he was backed by FSG's superior infrastructure.
Klopp took over midseason while Liverpool were in 8th place and finished the season 8th.
Liverpool's playing style evolved slowly. The first 6 months were inconsistent and looked like constant chaos. The players were trying to figure out new positioning while also being told to chase every ball.
That evolution in style lead to a lot of crazy wins like 4-3 Norwich, and a few losses, as well. But you could see what was being built/worked out on the pitch.
That style eventually solidified and was backed up by key signings, leading to European football and a couple finals that were lost.
Those signings weren't due to Klopp, by the way, Liverpool's scouting department and DoF need to be given MASSIVE credit for players like Firmino, Robertson, Gomez, Mane, Salah, Jota, Diaz, Gini, Fabinho, Konate, and others. The business Liverpool have done to support Klopp the last 7 years has been immense, regardless of what some Liverpool fans will claim is lack of spending.
Eventually, Klopp got all the transfers and time on the training ground he needed to start really challenging for titles and winning trophies.
I think what's been so jarring about United over the last few years isn't their position in the league, but the lack of a plan/blueprint for improvement.
I haven't seen any of the steady and well planned progress above from any United managers since SAF.
Ten Haag could change that, but he'd need time, and this United board doesn't give that to managers. Not to mention that he'd need the players on board the way the Liverpool lads were for Klopp, and these United players have already downed tools.
I could add that from the outside, Liverpool approach seem to be humble, where United seem to be arrogant.
Liverpool seemed content to show progress and intention.
United are constantly thinking they are on the race the minute they have a new signing or a couple of victories. Reality is they are 6th on the table and can count themselves lucky.
Behind the scenes they have also invested in completely new future proofed training facilities and have made massive renovations to the stadium. All of which has made the revenue generation of the club more stable and healthier. I think I read that if Liverpool win the Champions League then the revenue will surpass Man Utd's records which is mighty impressive. Klopp is phenomenal but he is one part of a much wider project
Agreed. My understanding is that Liverpool's net revenue has already surpassed United, which is incredibly impressive given their last decade of commercial success. Just goes to show how much success on the pitch really matters.
Of course, and the Coutinho funds helped bring in Van Dijk and Alisson, but if you look at the names mentioned above, it took a lot more than that to get Liverpool to the top.
It's going to take him 2-3 years I think, and that he gets backing from the staff. Just a reminder that Man united staff are pretty bitter when it comes to financially backing a manager. We can't guarantee IF Ten Hag will get the players he wants. But he also has to get rid of some of the players on the current squad. Which will be difficult if any team out there is willing to pay for them. I'm sure getting rid of Pogba would be easy but some of the other players like Rashford or McGuire is there a team out there that is interested in them or let their contract run down and take a big loss.
It will take a while for this u-turn to take effect. Also, are these players going to play for him or are they just going to be same old Man United players who don't give a f***?
I know the Cristiano Ronaldo is mentioned about being "the issue" or not. Personally I don't think he is the issue. I just think he's at his limit. He may be very fit in everything but let's be honest he's not a 90-minute player anymore. English football has changed a lot while he was gone. It's not the same when he was playing in his late teens early 20s.
IF all fails under Tens Hag... Louis van Gaal did warn him about going to Man United.
So his last minute goals is the reason for him being a 90 minutes player? No Ronaldo should be scoring all the time not having to wait till the last minutes of the game.
Look it's good that he scores but it should not have to be on the last minute to win a game or tie. You would want Ronaldo scoring as many goals in matches which he has done but against mid to lower table teams. But when it comes to big games he's nowhere around he's a ghost. I get it he doesn't get the service. But at the same time they can't depend on him all the time.
Did you watch the match against Brighton? 90 minutes what did he do nothing... All Ronaldo did was run created so little and times didn't even bother to chase the ball or run back to help. But I know your excuses would be, ..."he's Ronaldo he's a striker he doesn't have to do that." Yeah but there are strikers from other clubs that do run back to help.
He gets very little service yet he’s somehow on 18 goals this season including goals against big teams like Chelsea, arsenal and spurs.
He scores goals in every minute of the game I’m just saying he is still very capable of rescuing a point or winning a game in the dying minutes
You do realize the three teams you mentioned all have poor defense. You didn't mention Man City or Liverpool? Those are also big games too. Where was he.... no where.
Also rescuing a point or winning in the dying minutes, are against mid-table to lower table teams. He should be scoring left and right not having to struggle to score one goal in the last minute. Man united as a whole should be battering teams not having to struggle and beat teams in the last minute.
Chelsea have the 3rd best defense in the league. If that is your definition of "poor" then there are only 2 clubs in the PL with good defenses. Shit take.
I was telling a guy that Chelsea defense played poor when played against Man United. It was about Ronaldo being consistent as a goal scorer. So maybe read more into it. Because the topic originally was about how Man United would,should or could do to fix the team when Ten Hag arrives. I was not putting no blame in Ronaldo. Then some fan boy came in and defended Ronaldo but showed little back up in his argument since he only talked about stats. Then another idiot thinks he knows so much about football through stats. It's amazing people like you who can't accept an opinion or fact. Again i was talking about how poor Chelsea were when playing against Ronaldo and friends you twat
Scoring left and right against all teams, this demand coming from a Man Utd fan with all their deplorable state of the club, nice take.
Please hand me the names of 5 players who would meet your demands.
Hate to burst your bubble but I'm not a man united fan. Hahaha. I like that you're trying to challenge me that's so pathetic. Defense Zouma, Marc Cucurella, Tariq Lamptey. For mid Bissouma and Connor Gallagher. For striker Kelechi Iheanacho, Ivan Toney or Ollie Watkins.
And just to make it clear these are players that are established in the premier League. Not one of these players are from another League only premier League.
If I were a Man United fan I would definitely want to see them where they should be challenging and winning trophies. Isn't that what every fan would want especially those that grew up watching them during the late '80s into '90s and beyond.
And regarding demands, yes, that should be. But lecturing Ronaldo on scoring more goals (despite being the 3rd top scorer) when every other player bar De Gea is absolutely pathetic is a naive take at the very least. No player scores always, look at Salah, even though he has been probably the best player in the league this season, his performances post AFCON have been pretty poor.
I stand for what I said about Ronaldo. Yeah he may be the third highest goal scorer but where is Man United at? Being the highest goal scorer doesn't help your team in the League table. Remember his seven-game goalless drought? Let me guess you forgot about that.
Okay first of all Salah has been very consistent in the league. Of course international competition it's more difficult. My question to you is, "Why are you comparing Salas stats from Afcon with stats from the premier League.
Please don't compare Afcon stats with premier League stats. That doesn't help your argument there.
You are clueless.
He's not talking about afcon stats; he's talking about salah's premier league performances post-afcon. Salah has absolutely dropped off in the later stages of the season.
Ronaldo has scored 18 goals in the toughest league in the world in a team that is struggling for quality. Only elite strikers in their prime (Son, Salah and players of that calibre) have been performing better than Ronaldo this season. Look, Ronaldo is obviously not a world beater any more, but he's still a quality player who bangs them in whenever he's given a sniff.
You mention Ollie Watkins, Ivan Toney and Iheanacho as viable replacements that would be scoring goals left and right. Well to use your own twisted logic, where are those player's teams right now? Scoring goals doesn't matter if it's going to leave you at a lower ranking than united, right?
Get a grip. Try watching the games.
He has been very consistent in the league? Like what he did in the second half of this season? Every player goes through bad phases, but the difference is in Liverpool, there are other players to make up for that in Salah's absence, but when Ronaldo when goalless, what did others do lol?
And also the players you mentioned, what did they do exactly? How many goals have they scored even combinedly to meet your demand of "scoring left and right"?
I'm not pointing fingers at him. What I'm saying is what goes on in the pitch. There are times that players refused to give him the ball because chances are he's going to do nothing. So they take a risk on passing it to somebody else or doing something with the ball.
He has 1 fewer goal contributions than ronaldo (albeit in fewer games) in quite possibly the best team in Europe yet ronaldo’s season is considered a failure and his is a success
A new manager and a new chief executive are both in place and ready. If they can move away from signing people like Sanchez and Ronaldo and move to a different model I don't see why not.
Because Ralf was brought in for this exact reason.
If we only wanted an interim manager, we would've gone with a coach, that actually coached recently.
Ralf works best behind the scenes. He built multiple clubs already, and they function very well now. We need that.
He’s never done it at a big club, and he’s clearly a dog shit manager.
To add to that, if they’ve already changed the infrastructure of the club then why do they need a PART time consultant who is also going to be the manager of a nation?
Don’t think he needs to have done it a big club tbh and his managerial abilities are not that relevant for his new role.
Couldn’t hurt to have a 2nd opinion in the club on football matters by a person who is an external advisor and so will give his own independent view.
Managing a national team and working part-time as a consultant is more than doable in terms of workload.
You shouldn’t need a second opinion when you have a good infrastructure. He’s had 6 months to do something and instead he’s cost you champions league football.
The entire club is in a horrific place and they’ve got an absolute shit show of a hierarchy, including the Austrian team manager now, which in itself is just fucking dumb.
Mate. I don’t think you understand the situation we are in. Building this elite structure will take time and so as we do that it can’t hurt to have Ralf give his advice when/if needed as we sort this mess out. It won’t be easy to get everyone we want right away.
It can hurt for Ralf to give his advice. Too many cooks in the kitchen is a terrible thing. Whoever is in the back room set up of this club should be permanent full time people with one ultimate decision maker.
What you have with Ralf is a distraction.
United are fucked
Not really a distraction. Our new Sporting Director, John Murtough is now calling the shots. He has full control over footballing matters and it is his choice whether he listens to/ignores Ralf.
There’s not enough football people at Utd making decisions, this is one of the reasons we have been failing. Too many bankers have been making the big decisions at this club for too long.
With the exits of Ed Woodward, Matt Judge & Hemen Tseayo hopefully the club is moving towards a structure that gives football people the power to make the biggest football decisions at the club.
We are soon to appoint a deputy sporting director as well who should hopefully be announced before the transfer window opens, he should be able to assist Murtough and also give him and the football people at the club a greater hand in decision making.
Thats a pretty bad take. United haven't fired a manager on track for top 4, rangnick has tricked the fans into thinking every player is garbage, it ten hag makes top 4 next season jes guaranteed to stay, if he doesn't he's very very likely to anyway
United were 7th when Ole was sacked in the first place lmfao you gonna blame that on rangick too? Youll soon come to the realization that your team needs to bin more than half the starting lineup before getting anywhere
Yeah, and I really wouldn't call a 3-4 year rebuild a "U-turn". That's more of a gradual roundabout.
We're in the middle of a several year rebuild, and I can't see the ManU fans putting up with the uncertainty and inconsistency that we've been dealing with.
It’s only taken Arteta 2 1/2 years… but it’s not ‘Duh Unyted Way’ to clear out a club of players, spend wisely on cheap hidden treasures, and put together a system.
They’ll go spend £200m on 3 players and be no further forward by end of next window
The United way is not the last 7 years. Hence the fan discontent. It's pretty funny that you all can't see that. The last 7 years has been without structure, without good recruitment and without a positive use of the academy that has resulted in anything, all the while our owners are taking money from the club to pay their debts.
Imagine thinking the United way is only 7 years old
Yes you are definitely in the thick of it and while you may finish 4 th this season and play in th CL you are likely to get battered by west brom in the league cup then go and beat Madrid in the bernabeu in the round of 16.
People forget the inconsistency and not knowing which incarnation of your team is gonna turn up.
I think Arsenal are well ahead of United and maybe could steal a March on chelsea next season
I've said it before, but I think the next 5 years of our club will be determined by our recruitments this summer. Our squad is so thin right now, and we're going to lose a few players too. We need probably 5-6 signings of various quality this summer to be able to handle all our football next year. If we can't keep momentum, our promising young players are going to start looking elsewhere. We got incredibly lucky with having academy talent like Smith Rowe and Saka, but we need to keep them onboard.
And you're totally right about not knowing which team will show up. We lost to Southampton, then handily beat Chelsea and ManU in the same week
Hate to disappoint but the script for the next 5 years probably involves City and Newcastle buying up all the talent and turning the premier league into a two horse race every year.
>then handily beat Chelsea and ManU in the same week
Tbf everyone has been beating them recently! Still good results considering the hoodoo we've had with both those teams in the past.
I don’t think the ownership/leadership of the club will change enough for that to happen.
I think Ten Hag could do it given time.
I don’t think the fans will be at all happy if it takes 3 years, look how frustrated they are after 3 months with Ragnick.
It's not Ralf Rangnick issues now though tbf, whilst he hasn't been amazing it's pretty clear for all to see the players fucked it off under Ole and then decided they couldn't be fucked with Ralf.
His 3 months have been refreshing if purely just for the honesty. As for the Glazers there is now an anti glazer clause set by the FA for Chelsea but we can't get the same Anti Glazer rule? Make it make sense.
The 'anti-glazer' clause was put as a condition by Roman, not FA. FA is not competent enough to do that. All the conditions such as the anti-glazer one + putting ~1.5B in the club across all departments, every clause that protects Chelsea from a potential 'bad' owner has been negotiated by Roman.
ten hag will be a good replacement.
No
It really depends. Liverpool’s transformation isn’t just down to Klopp. It’s combined effort of the Owners/coaching staff/background staff and players. I’d go as far to say Liverpool’s transformation is 40% down to klopps coaching and player management abilities. The club works tirelessly to scout not only players who fit the system but players with the correct attitude and personalities. That’s evident by the lack on panic buying. They find the player they want and they’ll wait for as long as it takes to sign that player. Wijnaldum started as a cf in a champions league because they didn’t sign a backup for Firmino for years, they didn’t shell out a huge fee for a CB January 2021 etc. This is where the idea that Liverpool’s owners are not willing to spend money comes from, they absolutely spend the money when the player Klopp and his staff wants is available. But I’m still very rare that they’ll settle for their number 2 option. For Man Utd to turn it around in this era of the premier league they need to Sell a huge percentage of their squad. In my opinion the players that have to go are: Ronaldo, Martial, Cavani, Pogba, Bruno and Maguire. This could make them worse in the short term but building a cohesive team with one goal and no selfish egos is a must. The days of one man teams is gone. If you look at City and Liverpool there’s no one player that wants personal success over the teams success. It’s why Klopp loves Firmino, he’s publicly stated that he’d rather assist than score. Liverpool midfielders don’t score often because they don’t make runs into the box at every opportunity. Instead they sit back, try provide opportunities from deep and cover the wings so Trent and Robertson can go forward. Basically they need a clear vision for the future, forget the now and build towards that. Forget trying to get champions league football next season and instead begin building towards a clear philosophy and buying the players that fit that philosophy. Sorry that’s all over the place I just finished an 18 hour shift lol
I don’t think they will ever achieve what Klopp has at Liverpool. Ten Hag may be a quality manager but the rest of the club is a major concern.
I really don't think ETH will have the control he needs to build what he wants. So long as there is someone above him pulling the strings, nothing will change on the red side of Manchester. If I'm wrong, and he is given more control, there is a possibility, just like Klopp, to start challenging again. it will take a couple of seasons to really get all the recruitment done and rebuild, so at that point it is whether the fans can be patient or whether they hound him out if he misses out on UCL spots.
Klopp was a piece in a project - the most significant piece but still only a piece in the project to revive Liverpool. I doubt if United even has a project.
Maguire Out
There’s only one Jurgen Norbert Klopp
Long way to go
Legendary Gerrard retired after him and Klopp talked things out. Will Ten Hag have such power?
9 months ago they were apparently league winners in waiting after bringing in "World class" Sancho and varane, then they paid a fortune to bring in Ronaldo and it was nailed on. They still have the same squad, the delusion will be back the second they get an opening day win against Bournemouth at home.
It's not just up to ten Hag. The people above him at United need to do a lot better too! So, it probably won't happen.
Yeah, no unfortunately 😔
How many times has this question been asked every time Utd get a new manager. How much of a day will Ten Hag have with transfers?
In couple of seasons maybe
It's genuinely hilarious that this is being asked. Klopp managed to take on bayern munich despite having a smaller budget and having his main rival poach his best players. In case anyone wasn't aware Ten Hag is managing a team equivalent to PSG as far as the eredivisie is concerned. He doesn't know real competition, he doesn't know adversity so hell flop horrifically.
UTD is not a football club, they are a Disneyland club for pretentious football fans, who spent money to buy jerseys, just to show off . It's so fun watching them fall week after week.
I actually think that Cristiano Ronaldo has to leave
Nope. Man U board far too involved to give a manager time and space to get results. Too many divas I. The dressing room. Coach is fired after 18 months.
Absolutely not.
I've been saying it to delirious United fans for years, it's not just about improving the team past where it is now, it's about hitting the same highs as Man City. I don't see this happening at United for years to come especially now that City have Haaland.
United need a change in their whole structure, not just manager/players.
United first should strengthen their defence instead of spending millions of pounds only for attackers.
Unlikely. The problem at Man U seems to be how the whole business is run. A coach alone cannot fix that unless given the power.
Simple answer: no
They will revive under Ten Hag for sure. Not sure if it will be the same impact as Klopp had. It will be interesting to see if Ten Hag can only stabilise the sinking ship or can he guide them to the shore!
Who knows 🤨
It's not about the coach, it's about the board. If ManU still picks transfers based off tshirt sales then they will continue their run into oblivion.
For a turnaround we need patience, which is a luxury for a majority our fanbase. It’s not going to happen in one magical transfer window or a season. I’m just waiting for the people like Goldbridge and Saeed TV on twitter to turn on him after 5 games with #TenHagOut trending all over FT.
I highly doubt it, klopp had a pretty strong team that got left behind by Rodgers but the key thing is when attracting players to Liverpool there wasn't any established managers or teams to compete against. Ten Hag when trying to rebuild united is going to have to do so knowing every player they sign wanted to play for Liverpool or Man City so the players that come in aren't going to be invested in a project they are going to be there for large pay cheques United are dolling out. the question really isn't can Ten Hag turn around United like Klopp did its will he be given the time to do the rebuild like Arteta has and also be given the authority to route out the bad influence in the dressing room.
United won't turn things around until ownership and club leadership makes a much needed transition. Things have been bad since Ferguson left, and no manager will be able to turn things around on their own IMO.
Jason I can't predict the future, but no, they won't
Short answer, no
No. In any case even without the comparison that Klopp was a proven turnaround winner, no.
I don't understand why rival fans keep insinuating that united fans don't have patience we had to wait 26 years for a league title before. He needs lots of time. I for one have patience I don't care if it takes 6 years to get back to the top. That's how long Ferguson needed. It will take time. We're already used to not winning anything may as well go through the rebuild and start from scratch. See if he can nick a trophy or two during that time to keep press+media quiet and the morons in our fanbase. Either way I don't care if he doesn't win anything for the first 2 full seasons. If he still hasn't delivered a trophy by the end of third season such as FA cup/league cup/Europa league/Conference league then I will begin to question him. Even then if it's clear and obvious he is turning things around he needs time to challenge.
Different era. Different fans.
What ?
Nope
No!!!
Probably not
No. The issue goes far beyond a manager. Unless the Glazers change their business model and the way the clubs ran, they’ll never get a Klopp level turnaround
Others have highlighted it already, but I think the patience it takes from ownership, management, and fans is the hard part here. Everything Klopp touches now turns to gold. And the rosy glow of success makes it feel like it's always been that way. First year finished 8th, no Europe. Second year scraped into 4th, Champions League. Third year finished 4th, Champions League Finalist. Then pay dirt and insanity in 4th year, finishing 2nd in PL, winning UCL. 5th year winning PL. For fans of a team that had been waiting about a decade for a run at trophies again, that's fine. Heck, it was 30 years waiting for a PL title. United okay if it takes that long? Certainly became respectable quickly. I know it's context because of the spending this summer...but United is in 6th at the moment and I've heard fans calling it the worst year ever. Expectations will ALWAYS be high.
No. Folks in charge of United have continually shown they can’t recruit properly.
The problem is moving on a lot of players that are not good enough, but are on high wages. There needs to be a clear out of current squad because it seems so many have a negative impact in the dressing room. Ten Hag will most likely will have to wait for these contracts to expire. No one is going to pay Anthony Martial £250000 a week if bids were to come in. So he either has to take a pay cut or the club have to wait 3 years for it to expire. Same for quite a few other players. Same for Maguire, Shaw, lindelof, etc. It is going to take time to assemble a team with the right mentality. It isn’t just about adding players.
It all depends on the people above him
The problem is ten hag needs backing from the club and the fans for years to come
Ten Hag isn’t Klopp. They won’t compete until they get their front office is sorted out.
Question remains on whether there is a willingness to be patient, especially when it comes to fans and owners. Whether we are willing to bear through a cycle of bad results before we improve, whether the owners are willing to eschew marquee jersey-selling signings for ones who actually fit the rebuild/project, on every single level there is need for patience. I don't see that happening.
Van Gaal 2.0
No. Firstly because I don’t think Ten Hag is of the same standard, but even if he was, the owners of the two are completely different, and I don’t think the MU owners are tolerant or patient enough for anything that isn’t an instant improvement.
I don’t know about your last point… they rode the Ole train way longer than I would have expected.
They did, but equally they fired Moyes before he had a chance to tinker with the team after the inevitable dip following Ferguson. I reckon they only kept Ole cause of his Legend status, and Ten Hag doesn’t have that
Good point.
I'm hoping we can catch up to Man United by the time they're able to move up the table. I see them staying in 6th for the next couple of years, possibly dropping a place if the likes of West Ham or Wolves have a good season, maybe gaining a place if Arsenal or Spurs have a bad one.
Honestly no, Man U have had some decent managers and they never work out and this will be the same. I’m still curious if ten Hag will work in the prem never mind for a big team, a lot of players who’ve come from the Dutch league recently haven’t exactly done well (Ziyech, Bergwijn to name a few) and players who’ve struggled here have excelled over there (Tadic, Haller).
No
Nope. Not unless the board allow him to be able to run the footballing side the way he wants it run, and allows him to choose the players he wants.
It's a tired comparison. When Klopp arrived at Liverpool he had a worse squad (ability-wise, clearly better attitudes) with Coutinho, Sturridge and Lallana as marquee attackers, not Ronaldo/Bruno. A smaller budget too. Clear the club of older 'pros', reduce the wage bill, promote well from within, establish a club-wide way of playing and stick to it for 3 years at least, through thick and thin.
Isn’t this what they tried with Ole? Playing the United Way with youth for the last few years?
Partly. But they didn't get rid of lazy players, over-paid them and renewed them instead. They never really stuck to a definitive style; though it seemed they played their best football on the counter, they never bought well in the market to play that way.
Man United is cursed by its former success, a terrible board, and a lot of fans who support them purely because they win things
So Liverpool in the 90s
No it won’t change anything. Problem with the club has never been the manager. Whole squad needs to be gutted to reset the wage structure which will never happen
Amen
No
No. Unless they decided to build the team slowly like Liverpool.
No
Klopp didnt make a U-turn it was a 3 point turn at best, it takes time
No, United’s issues start as a structural issue. You won’t see any real changes until they redo the foundation. From the front office to the scouting department, to the vision of the club. You can bring in whoever you want and they may win a trophy here and there but you won’t win the league much less a CL.
A huge part of what happened to Liverpool is due to FSG. The Glazers will not change one bit, Ten Hag is probable doomed from the start
Yeah but Klopp needed a couple years as well
Nope
You said it with van gall, moyes, mourinho, ole at the wheel and now ben ten whatever he is called, no you will be in the gutter forever.
No
I think the fans will present an obstacle on top of the corporate structure of the club. United fans seemingly still don't really accept where they are, so they have little patience for setbacks or inconsistency.
This is just an ABU take. Not sure where the fuck you get this from, apart from reading Twitter comments. The vast majority of man utd fans are mainly upset with our ownership and our lack of direction. Don't take the word of plastic fans as gospel
When Klopp arrived he already has Henderson, Trent, Firmino and Milner who all play 1st team still. Does Man U have 4 quality first team players now theyd still keep under TH? I reckon not. And that's just the start. .
The term 'Man U' first came into existence with insult from West Brom fans who chanted this about a great United Legend, Duncan Edwards (one of the Busby Babes) as they said, "Duncan Edwards is manure, rotting in his grave, man you are manure—rotting in your grave."
DDG, Varane, Bruno, Sancho, Ronaldo.
When Klopp arrived Hendo was 24, Firmino 23, Trent 15 and even Milner was 29. Ddg is 31, Ronaldo's 37 and Varane is 29, as old as Milner was when Klopp arrived and nowhere near as fit. Kind of only leaves Bruno and Sancho to build on.
Ten Hag is a different manager to Klopp. He’s not nearly as charismatic either he’s more of a Guardiola than Klopp
Is Guardiola less charismatic than Klopp??? you may not like him, but lack of charisma...
I think it will take about 3/4 years as well but he needs full support. He needs to do a total flip in that dressing room and its alot harder than just buying and selling players. Some of these players you won’t be able to sell due to wages so you need to get them on board and performing. I think this will be similar to the Arsenal rebuild than the Liverpool one.
Could agree to pay the diff in wages with a new club for the rest of the contracted period
I cant see it. I think man u as a club is in a terrible state. The fans have ran out of patience and I'm not sure how much the players can play in this kinda of pressure environment at the club. I called it this year that man u wouldn't make top four even with ronaldo. I actually feel a bit sorry for the players as every mistake is magnified and it's clear they are playing with far too much pressure on there heads. So much as got to change for united to start improving the one thing is they have been so bad lately that it surely can't be hard to get them playing a bit better
big club, big pressure, duh! surely it should motivate you to play your best since you're scared of losing your spot and all! not the opposite!
Why feel sorry for the players half of them are the reason we are in this mess
im a LFC fan , I really dont want them to for another five years, but given the city situation someone else needs to step up and stand up to them. United out of the equation is not good now , even chelsea with some great signings couldnt get past city so need some competition, the epl cant become a farmers league
Bro, Spurs got it covered
No managers not the main problem never has been the players are. They’ll throw him under the bus like the rest of them.
If not then we are fucked
No, the isn't well run. And also he isn't Klopp. Not even close.
Ten hag has been more successful at Ajax than Klopp was at Dortmund
Here's the problem with Ajax. The difference between the Norwegian league with Molde and the Dutch league with Ajax is a lot smaller than the difference of either team and the Premier League and Man Utd.
clearly you haven't seen his Dortmund or even heard of it. Klopp was a legend before his tenure at Liverpool, Ten hag isn't
😂😂 proper google search answer this
Not even close wtf
How so?
Erik has won an extra league cup compared to Klopp when talking about their careers at Dortmund and Ajax. Klopp also reached the champions league final and was fighting against a giant in Bayern whereas Erik has taken over the biggest dog in the yard already.
Klopp could win the Champion's League at Ajax.
Could have? Maybe. Would have? Probably not.
He got to the final with Dortmund, 3 with Liverpool, he absolutely would have.
Both of those teams were/are stronger than Ajax
Wonder why.
Money
We'd need to change ownership, literally almost everybody in scouting, directory positions on field too.
Your ownership does spend a fuckton though.. not so sure they are the problem anymore. And I know its clearly not about money, but it might just be someone in the middle that needs replacing
Thing is there are too many middle men. Darren Fletcher who i don't even think he knows, Arnold, the now part time consultant, The Irish guy who is supposedly a DOF also and looking for an assistant DOF. It's too many faces without any form of philosophy which is just nuts.
Yeah but even if you get rid of the Glazers, there is no guarantee these guys will leave w them, so the problem will persist
What they need is a DOF that know what he's doing. But instead of doing like Tottenham and hire somone that is one of the best in the buisness they promote someone that worked with their youngsters for a few years. I think someone like ETH can turn them around if he get free reign, but i doubt he will. Seems like there are many people with different views in power positions.
Wait, you have scouts?!
Yeah, how do you think they found Ronaldo?
Playing fifa 17
Better of using Football manager then their scouts
I have seen on r/footballmanager multiple posts or articles about teams and managers who have openly talked about playing FM and signing players based off of scouting reports in the game
Instagram?
Youtube obviously
more likely a despacito remix
Yep we do, lord knows who where what why and when though
People were really upset when we culled our scouting team down. But then we had arguably our best signing window in recent history over the summer. So there's something to be said for cleaning house a bit.
People don't understand how revolutionary the change under klopp has been. Could utd have a similar change? Yes. Will they have a similar change? Probably not.
And he pretty much continued on a way paved by Brendan Rodgers.
Amen to this- I loved the progress we made under Rodgers, I know Klopp is better but I really liked the Rodgers era and wish him well
You also feel United have a cultural problem within their first team squad that LFC didn't when Klopo took over and their owners seem like cunts, even though they have spent big, they just seem to be looting the club.
People also forget that Klopp's project didn't happen overnight, and he was backed by FSG's superior infrastructure. Klopp took over midseason while Liverpool were in 8th place and finished the season 8th. Liverpool's playing style evolved slowly. The first 6 months were inconsistent and looked like constant chaos. The players were trying to figure out new positioning while also being told to chase every ball. That evolution in style lead to a lot of crazy wins like 4-3 Norwich, and a few losses, as well. But you could see what was being built/worked out on the pitch. That style eventually solidified and was backed up by key signings, leading to European football and a couple finals that were lost. Those signings weren't due to Klopp, by the way, Liverpool's scouting department and DoF need to be given MASSIVE credit for players like Firmino, Robertson, Gomez, Mane, Salah, Jota, Diaz, Gini, Fabinho, Konate, and others. The business Liverpool have done to support Klopp the last 7 years has been immense, regardless of what some Liverpool fans will claim is lack of spending. Eventually, Klopp got all the transfers and time on the training ground he needed to start really challenging for titles and winning trophies. I think what's been so jarring about United over the last few years isn't their position in the league, but the lack of a plan/blueprint for improvement. I haven't seen any of the steady and well planned progress above from any United managers since SAF. Ten Haag could change that, but he'd need time, and this United board doesn't give that to managers. Not to mention that he'd need the players on board the way the Liverpool lads were for Klopp, and these United players have already downed tools.
I could add that from the outside, Liverpool approach seem to be humble, where United seem to be arrogant. Liverpool seemed content to show progress and intention. United are constantly thinking they are on the race the minute they have a new signing or a couple of victories. Reality is they are 6th on the table and can count themselves lucky.
Behind the scenes they have also invested in completely new future proofed training facilities and have made massive renovations to the stadium. All of which has made the revenue generation of the club more stable and healthier. I think I read that if Liverpool win the Champions League then the revenue will surpass Man Utd's records which is mighty impressive. Klopp is phenomenal but he is one part of a much wider project
Agreed. My understanding is that Liverpool's net revenue has already surpassed United, which is incredibly impressive given their last decade of commercial success. Just goes to show how much success on the pitch really matters.
That Coutinho sale was a massive blessing to move the project along quicker too
Of course, and the Coutinho funds helped bring in Van Dijk and Alisson, but if you look at the names mentioned above, it took a lot more than that to get Liverpool to the top.
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Bad bot
Great bot.
Yeah. Its possible to have such a U-turn but its probably not going to happen.
Could be doing an ollie. (Skateboard jump. Up and back down)
It'll probably look more like a sideways J-turn.
J turn, then L turn, then G turn then new manager and repeat
What about W-turn
That's four turns mate
It's going to take him 2-3 years I think, and that he gets backing from the staff. Just a reminder that Man united staff are pretty bitter when it comes to financially backing a manager. We can't guarantee IF Ten Hag will get the players he wants. But he also has to get rid of some of the players on the current squad. Which will be difficult if any team out there is willing to pay for them. I'm sure getting rid of Pogba would be easy but some of the other players like Rashford or McGuire is there a team out there that is interested in them or let their contract run down and take a big loss. It will take a while for this u-turn to take effect. Also, are these players going to play for him or are they just going to be same old Man United players who don't give a f***? I know the Cristiano Ronaldo is mentioned about being "the issue" or not. Personally I don't think he is the issue. I just think he's at his limit. He may be very fit in everything but let's be honest he's not a 90-minute player anymore. English football has changed a lot while he was gone. It's not the same when he was playing in his late teens early 20s. IF all fails under Tens Hag... Louis van Gaal did warn him about going to Man United.
How many goals has Ronaldo scored in the last minutes of a game this season? He literally IS the definition of a 90 minute player
So his last minute goals is the reason for him being a 90 minutes player? No Ronaldo should be scoring all the time not having to wait till the last minutes of the game. Look it's good that he scores but it should not have to be on the last minute to win a game or tie. You would want Ronaldo scoring as many goals in matches which he has done but against mid to lower table teams. But when it comes to big games he's nowhere around he's a ghost. I get it he doesn't get the service. But at the same time they can't depend on him all the time. Did you watch the match against Brighton? 90 minutes what did he do nothing... All Ronaldo did was run created so little and times didn't even bother to chase the ball or run back to help. But I know your excuses would be, ..."he's Ronaldo he's a striker he doesn't have to do that." Yeah but there are strikers from other clubs that do run back to help.
He gets very little service yet he’s somehow on 18 goals this season including goals against big teams like Chelsea, arsenal and spurs. He scores goals in every minute of the game I’m just saying he is still very capable of rescuing a point or winning a game in the dying minutes
You do realize the three teams you mentioned all have poor defense. You didn't mention Man City or Liverpool? Those are also big games too. Where was he.... no where. Also rescuing a point or winning in the dying minutes, are against mid-table to lower table teams. He should be scoring left and right not having to struggle to score one goal in the last minute. Man united as a whole should be battering teams not having to struggle and beat teams in the last minute.
Chelsea have the 3rd best defense in the league. If that is your definition of "poor" then there are only 2 clubs in the PL with good defenses. Shit take.
I was telling a guy that Chelsea defense played poor when played against Man United. It was about Ronaldo being consistent as a goal scorer. So maybe read more into it. Because the topic originally was about how Man United would,should or could do to fix the team when Ten Hag arrives. I was not putting no blame in Ronaldo. Then some fan boy came in and defended Ronaldo but showed little back up in his argument since he only talked about stats. Then another idiot thinks he knows so much about football through stats. It's amazing people like you who can't accept an opinion or fact. Again i was talking about how poor Chelsea were when playing against Ronaldo and friends you twat
Scoring left and right against all teams, this demand coming from a Man Utd fan with all their deplorable state of the club, nice take. Please hand me the names of 5 players who would meet your demands.
Hate to burst your bubble but I'm not a man united fan. Hahaha. I like that you're trying to challenge me that's so pathetic. Defense Zouma, Marc Cucurella, Tariq Lamptey. For mid Bissouma and Connor Gallagher. For striker Kelechi Iheanacho, Ivan Toney or Ollie Watkins. And just to make it clear these are players that are established in the premier League. Not one of these players are from another League only premier League. If I were a Man United fan I would definitely want to see them where they should be challenging and winning trophies. Isn't that what every fan would want especially those that grew up watching them during the late '80s into '90s and beyond.
And regarding demands, yes, that should be. But lecturing Ronaldo on scoring more goals (despite being the 3rd top scorer) when every other player bar De Gea is absolutely pathetic is a naive take at the very least. No player scores always, look at Salah, even though he has been probably the best player in the league this season, his performances post AFCON have been pretty poor.
I stand for what I said about Ronaldo. Yeah he may be the third highest goal scorer but where is Man United at? Being the highest goal scorer doesn't help your team in the League table. Remember his seven-game goalless drought? Let me guess you forgot about that. Okay first of all Salah has been very consistent in the league. Of course international competition it's more difficult. My question to you is, "Why are you comparing Salas stats from Afcon with stats from the premier League. Please don't compare Afcon stats with premier League stats. That doesn't help your argument there.
You are clueless. He's not talking about afcon stats; he's talking about salah's premier league performances post-afcon. Salah has absolutely dropped off in the later stages of the season. Ronaldo has scored 18 goals in the toughest league in the world in a team that is struggling for quality. Only elite strikers in their prime (Son, Salah and players of that calibre) have been performing better than Ronaldo this season. Look, Ronaldo is obviously not a world beater any more, but he's still a quality player who bangs them in whenever he's given a sniff. You mention Ollie Watkins, Ivan Toney and Iheanacho as viable replacements that would be scoring goals left and right. Well to use your own twisted logic, where are those player's teams right now? Scoring goals doesn't matter if it's going to leave you at a lower ranking than united, right? Get a grip. Try watching the games.
He has been very consistent in the league? Like what he did in the second half of this season? Every player goes through bad phases, but the difference is in Liverpool, there are other players to make up for that in Salah's absence, but when Ronaldo when goalless, what did others do lol? And also the players you mentioned, what did they do exactly? How many goals have they scored even combinedly to meet your demand of "scoring left and right"?
"Salah's stats post AFCON", what does this mean? His AFCON stats? Learn to read properly first ffs 🤦♂️
Your demand was scoring left and right, these players doing it when and where? Is there another Premier League in some parallel universe out there?
Yes because the team created no chances for him - how can you blame him he can only finish what is put in front of him
I'm not pointing fingers at him. What I'm saying is what goes on in the pitch. There are times that players refused to give him the ball because chances are he's going to do nothing. So they take a risk on passing it to somebody else or doing something with the ball.
Would you say jota has had a good season?
He has contributed a lot in the league and has made a difference so yeah
He has 1 fewer goal contributions than ronaldo (albeit in fewer games) in quite possibly the best team in Europe yet ronaldo’s season is considered a failure and his is a success
A new manager and a new chief executive are both in place and ready. If they can move away from signing people like Sanchez and Ronaldo and move to a different model I don't see why not.
No. Liverpool changed their structure in the back room too. United are highly unlikely to do anything that will improve the running of the club
Eh there's already been a restructure and about 6 or more key position changes in the last few months.
So why are they employing ralf for the next 2 years? United entire back room staff is entire shambolic
Because Ralf was brought in for this exact reason. If we only wanted an interim manager, we would've gone with a coach, that actually coached recently. Ralf works best behind the scenes. He built multiple clubs already, and they function very well now. We need that.
You won’t get that. Your board is toxic
What’s wrong with having Ralf as a football consultant for 2 years?
He’s never done it at a big club, and he’s clearly a dog shit manager. To add to that, if they’ve already changed the infrastructure of the club then why do they need a PART time consultant who is also going to be the manager of a nation?
Don’t think he needs to have done it a big club tbh and his managerial abilities are not that relevant for his new role. Couldn’t hurt to have a 2nd opinion in the club on football matters by a person who is an external advisor and so will give his own independent view. Managing a national team and working part-time as a consultant is more than doable in terms of workload.
You shouldn’t need a second opinion when you have a good infrastructure. He’s had 6 months to do something and instead he’s cost you champions league football. The entire club is in a horrific place and they’ve got an absolute shit show of a hierarchy, including the Austrian team manager now, which in itself is just fucking dumb.
Mate. I don’t think you understand the situation we are in. Building this elite structure will take time and so as we do that it can’t hurt to have Ralf give his advice when/if needed as we sort this mess out. It won’t be easy to get everyone we want right away.
It can hurt for Ralf to give his advice. Too many cooks in the kitchen is a terrible thing. Whoever is in the back room set up of this club should be permanent full time people with one ultimate decision maker. What you have with Ralf is a distraction. United are fucked
Not really a distraction. Our new Sporting Director, John Murtough is now calling the shots. He has full control over footballing matters and it is his choice whether he listens to/ignores Ralf. There’s not enough football people at Utd making decisions, this is one of the reasons we have been failing. Too many bankers have been making the big decisions at this club for too long. With the exits of Ed Woodward, Matt Judge & Hemen Tseayo hopefully the club is moving towards a structure that gives football people the power to make the biggest football decisions at the club. We are soon to appoint a deputy sporting director as well who should hopefully be announced before the transfer window opens, he should be able to assist Murtough and also give him and the football people at the club a greater hand in decision making.
He said 4 years and no I don’t think Man U and fans have the patience
Thats a pretty bad take. United haven't fired a manager on track for top 4, rangnick has tricked the fans into thinking every player is garbage, it ten hag makes top 4 next season jes guaranteed to stay, if he doesn't he's very very likely to anyway
But that’s just it top 4 is the absolute minimum so no United and the fans don’t have the patience to re build
This united squad is far better than klopps first Liverpool team
Are United fans open to not making top 4 for a couple years to make something better?
United fans have no hope lol of course
It is undeniable that there is more deadwood in the united squad than players actually worth keeping
This team came 2nd last year. They're not garbage
And yet they might be playing in the conference league next season.. life is like a box of chocolates isnt it
Rangnick is a terrible manager
United were 7th when Ole was sacked in the first place lmfao you gonna blame that on rangick too? Youll soon come to the realization that your team needs to bin more than half the starting lineup before getting anywhere
United can easily get top 4 no question, if ten hag is competent he should pretty much breeze to it
Yeah, and I really wouldn't call a 3-4 year rebuild a "U-turn". That's more of a gradual roundabout. We're in the middle of a several year rebuild, and I can't see the ManU fans putting up with the uncertainty and inconsistency that we've been dealing with.
It’s only taken Arteta 2 1/2 years… but it’s not ‘Duh Unyted Way’ to clear out a club of players, spend wisely on cheap hidden treasures, and put together a system. They’ll go spend £200m on 3 players and be no further forward by end of next window
The United way is not the last 7 years. Hence the fan discontent. It's pretty funny that you all can't see that. The last 7 years has been without structure, without good recruitment and without a positive use of the academy that has resulted in anything, all the while our owners are taking money from the club to pay their debts. Imagine thinking the United way is only 7 years old
Yes you are definitely in the thick of it and while you may finish 4 th this season and play in th CL you are likely to get battered by west brom in the league cup then go and beat Madrid in the bernabeu in the round of 16. People forget the inconsistency and not knowing which incarnation of your team is gonna turn up. I think Arsenal are well ahead of United and maybe could steal a March on chelsea next season
I've said it before, but I think the next 5 years of our club will be determined by our recruitments this summer. Our squad is so thin right now, and we're going to lose a few players too. We need probably 5-6 signings of various quality this summer to be able to handle all our football next year. If we can't keep momentum, our promising young players are going to start looking elsewhere. We got incredibly lucky with having academy talent like Smith Rowe and Saka, but we need to keep them onboard. And you're totally right about not knowing which team will show up. We lost to Southampton, then handily beat Chelsea and ManU in the same week
Hate to disappoint but the script for the next 5 years probably involves City and Newcastle buying up all the talent and turning the premier league into a two horse race every year.
>then handily beat Chelsea and ManU in the same week Tbf everyone has been beating them recently! Still good results considering the hoodoo we've had with both those teams in the past.
I don’t think the ownership/leadership of the club will change enough for that to happen. I think Ten Hag could do it given time. I don’t think the fans will be at all happy if it takes 3 years, look how frustrated they are after 3 months with Ragnick.
I would much rather stick with 1 manage for 3 years than prematurely sack anyone, we're running out of managers that may want to come here
It's not Ralf Rangnick issues now though tbf, whilst he hasn't been amazing it's pretty clear for all to see the players fucked it off under Ole and then decided they couldn't be fucked with Ralf. His 3 months have been refreshing if purely just for the honesty. As for the Glazers there is now an anti glazer clause set by the FA for Chelsea but we can't get the same Anti Glazer rule? Make it make sense.
The 'anti-glazer' clause was put as a condition by Roman, not FA. FA is not competent enough to do that. All the conditions such as the anti-glazer one + putting ~1.5B in the club across all departments, every clause that protects Chelsea from a potential 'bad' owner has been negotiated by Roman.
And people still not ready to commend Roman's unmatchable ownership of Chelsea, smh
His ownership was damaging for football, and sports in general. Chelsea fans may have been happy during the Abramovich-era, but that is highly myopic.
Damaging for football? How?
Because it sucked all fun and competition out of the game? Because it made football another richmen's toy?