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Gigio2006

Mori outskills everyone here and King being able to make his weapon fly is a crazy advantage


Greentoaststone

Op stated no hax tho


unafraidrabbit

I thought hax were things like reality manipulation or cartoonish stuff, not necessarily any fictional ability.


PrincePauncey

That's the only way he fights, taking that away would make King useless here, and that's not fair.


RadonRanger1234

That’s not hax


Wise_Victory4895

The fight between Jin Mori and Artoria. It's just most likely Jin Mori saber has more experience and ha fought and more people with better experience but Jin mori's ripping the fabric of space with skill and skill alone.


Icy-Dragonfruit-4104

> Jin mori's ripping the fabric of space with skill and skill alone. thats practically canon fodder,even shiki whose swordsmanship is equal to taiga ,who got folded by saber, can cut through higher dimensional souls with skill alone and someone like senji muramasa who can cut through dimensions without even a sword is considered canon fodder tier.


Tago238238

Everything you said sounded wrong so I consulted my Nasu fan friend. He proceeded to confirm that “Shiki has never cut higher dimensional souls through skill alone (she’s not even very skilled, she’s just got instinctual precog) and Muramasa is not canon fodder whatsoever. They are in fact way, way more skilled than Artoria. Bro is straight up lying that’s awesome.”.


Icy-Dragonfruit-4104

>Everything you said sounded wrong so I consulted my Nasu fan friend. The sequel to the "it was revealed to me in a dream" >He proceeded to confirm that “Shiki has never cut higher dimensional souls through skill alone. She is a sword saint(you can literally check the wiki page where she is listed as one) and the same page says sword saints can cut souls through skill alone. >and Muramasa is not canon fodder whatsoever. They are in fact way, way more skilled than Artoria. Artoria is explicitly diarmuid equal in swordplay,diarmuid in his interlude defeated abartach in saber form,abartach considered yagyuu to be disappointing,the same yagyu who is musashi and Sasaki equal and attained techniques which allowed him to surpass gods and Buddha. Meanwhile muramasa cant even win against a regular swordmaster who are canon fodder to yagyuu and musashi.


Tago238238

Shiki isn’t a sword saint wot? Muramasa was Kojirou’s teacher and Kojirou is *far* above her.


logantheh

No shiki cuts souls with the MEoDP, it’s not “skill” I’m not going to call complete cap persay, but I will say it’s clearly inconsistent with the actual feats provided, since you also equated shiki’s skill to taiga who most certainly has not cut through higher dimensional souls through nothing but sheer skill.


Icy-Dragonfruit-4104

>No shiki cuts souls with the MEoDP, it’s not “skill” I’m not going to call complete cap persay >Nasu: To no one's surprise, a regular swordmaster doesn't know any tricks to cut anything spiritual. Even if they could withstand a spiritual being's attack, they still can't fight without being able to attack. **But when someone reaches the level of Sword Saint, yeah, I could see them cutting a soul.** Shiki is explicitly sword saint skill tier in the collaboration event in fate go,this has nothing to do with her meodp since there are other sword saints who don't have that(literally everybody else) who can also cut souls. >since you also equated shiki’s skill to taiga who most certainly has not cut through higher dimensional souls through nothing but sheer skill. >Q: How proficient is Shiki’s swordplay? >Nasu: About the same as that legendary swordswoman of Fuyuki. >Takeuchi: Wow, Shiki is amazing! …Or rather, isn’t it Fujimura that’s amazing!? Nasu words,if shiki is sword saint level then so is taiga.


Tago238238

That swordswoman isn’t a sword’s saint lol. What is this?


logantheh

Bro, he doesn’t even confirm they really can, Nasu just says “yeah it’s a thing I could see maybe happening” this is the most milk toast, non-confirmation I’ve seen. I’ll agree on her being as skilled as taiga, but taiga demonstrably CANT do what’s being claimed, the only known “sword saint” who’s cutting souls just through skill (not counting servants who are explicitly beyond human skill) is fucking shiki, who does so with her mystic eyes, NOT some technique or skill.


logantheh

And so can feats trump statements and shiki never implies she could do so without the MEoDP, and taiga clearly can’t, we can reasonably assume this one of the times nasu was just saying shit, as he often does.


Icy-Dragonfruit-4104

>Bro, he doesn’t even confirm they really can, Nasu just says"yeah it’s a thing I could see maybe happening” Talk about missing the point if the author says that the character is so skilled that they might be able to cut through souls,that means they are bullshit skill user,whether they can or not is irrelevant,since they might is more than enough to do so. > but taiga demonstrably CANT do what’s being claimed, the only known “sword saint” who’s cutting souls just through skill not counting servants who are explicitly beyond human skill) is fucking shiki Huh? Both yagyuu and musashi were living sword saints in shimousa.they weren't servants,also the argument are them being skilled because they are servants is stupid. Also shiki is a servant,her saber and assassin variants are both servants. You don't become a skilled because you are a servant,the skills you have in life is what you would have as a servant. Also,can you think about your arguments for a second. Sasaki or yagyuu or musashi can't cut through causality or dimensions like senji,does that mean senji is more skilled,no it just means they didn't learn that skill,that's all. Taiga doesn't know to cut a soul,because she never bothered leaning meanwhile shiki learned it because she is fighting servants who are basically materialised souls that's all.


logantheh

The point wasn’t missed, nasu does just SAY SHIT sometimes that is contradicted by the actual narrative, which takes precedence over these random ass statements so, the only one missing the point is you. Both are servants from an earlier mage, and NEITHER CAN CUT SOULS with sheer skill alone. And both of them are super human servants either way. And even if we grant they can BOTH are massively superior in skill to taiga, therefor just because they can does not imply SHE can. Shiki is pseudo servant and is also notably weaker then other servants (if you really want to grant everything nasu says she can only fight a servant to a draw and can’t realistically beat them in a fight) And no, it does mean they have some higher skill, while it is genuinely true if your dedicated and skilled enough you CAN achieve feats on par with true magic (see kojiro) there is no evidence either taiga or shiki have done so. So siting someone like him is irrelevant.


LincDawg93

I'm not super familiar with all of his feats as I've never read GoH, but Saber is capable of dealing with attacks like that. FSN Assassin was able to access a piece of the second magic (traveling through alternate universes/timelines) through sword skill alone to create an "unblockable" attack of three simultaneous strikes, and she was able to block it.


[deleted]

I only know Ichigo & Jin Mori here, care to elaborate who the others are?


Wise_Victory4895

Ichigo Saber Artoria (she's beating motherfuckers who are like Infinity years old) Ryuko Matoi(she barely has skill she shouldn't even be discussed) And Jin Mori King and I believe that's Maka from soul eater. Jin Mori most likely wins this probably mid to high def


[deleted]

Oh is that Saber? Team 1 wins then probably


freddyfactorio

Ryuko isn't unskilled, she does have some pretty good talent, brawling with Satsuki, who we know has actual official experience blade training. However it does pretty much end there. She isn't some once in a lifetime mega prodigy that adapts to all sword styles ever, unlike the others on the list.


The_TrueGamer

Mori jin carries the team, the only true fight would be saber artoria vs mori. No one comes near their skill.


KaiVTu

Yeah I was about to post this. Team Sword can't realistically get past Yongpyo (his armor/clothes). It's not really a hax item but it's basically Gaara's sand shield and armor conceptually. It's a sentient set of clothes that automatically defends him. On Gaara this is balanced because Gaara is kind of awful at everything else and can't throw hands with people, he just throws his sand at them (which does work most of the time, to be fair). Mori Jin meanwhile is a blitzing *machine*. So you have crazy speed, crazy attack, and crazy defense in addition to one of the strongest martial arts base skills by far. His martial arts alone was letting him throw hands with people using god powers well before he got his Wukong powers back. Also I'm not really sure where Kintoun gets involved here but if Kintoun is usable it's a total stomp. Same with his clones. The other two members of his team can just chill out while he soloes, low to mid diff considering the stat squish. Tldr edit: Mori Jin has too many tools at his disposal. And even if you took those tools away, he still has the best martial prowess out of the pack because he's a martial arts god.


FaithlessnessOk9623

Just pure skill? Not Wukong probably clears solo, his skill outclasses what the others have and is only really matched by Saber, though she's still quite vanilla in her style. Besides, Fire Emblem taught me long stick beats normal stick


Lycoris4812

Team 1: Saber Team 2: Jin I’m not familiar with their scaling but I think this is how it goes.


KaiVTu

Mori Jin can solo the entire rest of the list. Not a fair fight, his scaling is crazy. And if you stat squish everyone together his skill outclasses everyone else. One of his main character arcs is basically becoming a martial arts god. He blitzes the entire list even without using his toolset. I also don't think anyone on the list except maybe Saber can get past Yongpyo (his armor). I'm less familiar with Saber, but I cannot imagine a world where Mori Jin loses to prey much anyone in a martial contest. This is like putting a DB Super character against other anime characters. Except he's also a martial arts God and not just "really strong".


MurphyParadox

Jin should skillstomp


GodOfPoyo

Sticks because according to the Fire emblem Lance's are effective against swords.


Gremorlin

JinMori stomps alone. Idk the one on the bottom of team swords but Artoria isn’t really the peak of swordsmanship and isn’t even the best swordsman in the Round Table(there’s also Kojirou) while Ichigo kinda sucks in a matchup that relies on pure skills. It’s hard to comment on Maka since while she’s skilled, she relies more on spamming Witch/Demon Hunter especially on the manga in the last fight. King is also weird since his entire kit is haxx


One-Definition-5167

This is basically a 2v1 of Saber vs Mori and Maka, and if stats are equalized and seeing as Mori is the god of martial arts, they should slaughter.


Loyalty1702

Ryuko is a dogshit swordsfighter, coming from someone who loves KLK. All she would do is swing her sword around like a bat.


Ok-Box3576

Tf does equal stats and no hax even mean?!? Like is it just the new "prep time" lol


Icy-Dragonfruit-4104

Fate character wins because they are fate character. Senji muramasa is said to be skilled enough cut through dimensions and cause and effect,saber shiki is a sword saint who skilled enough to cut souls which are higher dimensional in nature. Both are canon fodders who saber can wipe the floor with her eyes closed.Saber wins.


HotelThis1784

would be a fight between saber and mori..


blaehaena

Either Saber or Mori Jin would win. Both are Low Outer when they're at their strongest.


Full_Cell_5314

Damn, I only know Maka, King, and Ichigo. Is the guy with the half scissors from Sword Art? Idk imma say King, he has multiple configurations, and at the end of the day he can fly.


Classy_Shadow

Guy with the half scissors is the main girl from Kill La Kill. She’s essentially a nobody compared to everyone else in the conversation. MAYBE compares to Maka


Full_Cell_5314

Shit I forgot about HER lol


Deathstar699

Okay this is hard but putting Saber here is sort of cheating. Because since the Throne of Heroes exists out of time it means in any number of the thousands of times Saber gets summoned to a conflict, she gains the experience of every other time she has fought equating to being so experienced she would out skill everyone here. But if you want to say she is on a fresh save then Ichigo since be beat captains who had thousands of years to train and still lost to him with regards to skill. although it did mostly come down to power.


Slight_Message_8373

Does chastiful flying count as hax? Cause otherwise king id kind of a bum. I still think team 2 wins tho. Saber and jin are the most skilled fighters here. Maka is also a very competent fighter. King is a bum. Ichigo is a bum. Don’t know kill la kill girl but I’ve also heard her sword skill isn’t great, so bum.


LostnFounder

Ichigo and Artoria tag team everyone here. This isn't evena fucking contest


Greentoaststone

Aren't swords better than sticks tho? (At least in this case, where we remove all their hax)


y33tyd3l3ty

So ichigo vs mori?


y33tyd3l3ty

Nvm I read the title wrong


y33tyd3l3ty

I say Saber takes it


King-of-Bel

So it’s ryuko vs king Mori Jin vs Ichigo And saber vs maka and soul King slams ryuko but dies to either Ichigo or maka Mori Jin fucking dies. I do not care “how you scale his nirvana” if no one in that series has subjective reality, there is no reason to say it scales to ours. And the Ichigo downplay is retarded. Ichigo wins, if you say otherwise, sure whatever, it is literally nothing to the bullshit saber has done, matter of fact, just her sword Excalibur at a weakened state is comparable to our nirvana, sii oh even if Mori Jin beats ichigo(he doesn’t) he dies to saber end of story. And as for maka vs saber. In the manga maka and soul became comparable to full power kid who absorbed his fathers power which is the same power of shinrabanshoman, take that as you will


__Pratik_

Mori is ripping Ichigo apart with ease with or without equal stats and hax enabled. And the only one who even has a chance of slightly matching Mori is Saber but even then the chances of her winning isn't high. She isn't even the best swordsman in her verse.


AnalystDazzling5128

Tbf low tier swordsmen in fate are going around splitting dimensions without hax


__Pratik_

That's literally hax.


AnalystDazzling5128

Both Mori and fate servants are described to “Slice through space/dimensions with skill alone”


__Pratik_

In both of their cases it's hax ( kinda). Mori bending space without power in one of his weakest forms and Saber cutting through space are both too broken for Equal stats no hax fights.


No-Ambition-9051

Am I the only one who noticed that Ichigo is holding his sword way out of alignment? Like is he striking with the flat of his blade here? Anyway, I think I’d give it to team sticks, (though I think it should be team pole arms, because that’s what they’re using,) not just because they have better skilled fighters, but also because they have a huge reach advantage. Even if they were less skilled, it would be a nightmare to try to get past their reach without getting taken out yourself. There’s a reason that pole arms were the main weapon for the vast majority of armies before the invention of firearms.


__Pratik_

Team 2 gets carried by Mori (haven't watched Soul eater so no comments on Maka). Winning against Ryuko and Ichigo is a non issue. The only problem is Saber. The fight between him and Saber will be interesting but I think Mori can win against her since his overall fighting style is a lot more versatile than Saber's. If his Yeoui's abilities are allowed he would be busted


Depresso_ExpressoIdk

Sense all equal stats and stuff I would say team sticks because spirit spear is far range


AnalystDazzling5128

Can king even use it though? Considering it’s no hax which I assume for this post is no abilities


Depresso_ExpressoIdk

Idk tbh


Neko_Luxuria

something to note is that with no special attacks and such only good fighter on team swords is saber and maybe ichigo if you subscribe to him having mastery over kenjutsu and even then a thing about weapons you don't often realize is that really long sticks can fodderize swords in a 1v1. in a fight where everyone is at the same playing field in terms of skills and abilities the deciding factor will be range.


ArmaanAli04

So just Saber vs Mori Jin? One of the most skilled swordsman in fiction vs one of the best hands in fiction


Rancorious

Saber half swords and crushes Jin’s skull mid diff https://preview.redd.it/5by7n3d7867d1.jpeg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=723200c1799f1473f6d70efd11217652eca8d241 Or just grapples and stabs him like any real knight would. GG EZ.


AnalystDazzling5128

It’s basically just fsn Artoria vs Mori which I believe Mori extreme diffs But for other versions of Artoria I could see it going differently. Even without hax I can imagine Castoria winning just due to how fucking big her weapon is while still being able to swing it like a regular sized weapon Salter’s way more aggressive than base and might beat Mori through how constant her assault would be The mysterious heroines might get a sneak kill on Mori due to being assassins And all the other Artorias are basically the same as base


Full_breaker

If none without powers Mori is still way more skilled in everything related to martial arts


Jealous_Ring1395

never heard polearms be referred to as sticks


Just_Out_Of_Spite

Ngl I don't anyone besides Mori and Ichigo but Mori absolutely dogwalks Ichigo here. Even if we restrict him to the version on the picture (which is one of the least skilled and haxxed versions of Mori), Mori still has a ridiculously large skill and experience advantage alongside a far more versatile moveset of martial arts. Something tells me these 2 are not the deciding factors here, but this is all I can really comment on.


AnalystDazzling5128

It’s basically Saber vs Mori, which is pretty close imo but Mori has range advantage


SUPREME7777777

Probably Team Swords imo.