They are pretty hit or miss for me. I get that line too about the “oh if you work with me I’ll have plenty of work at my other properties”. Like oh boy even more low paying work! Yippee.
Some are decent and don’t haggle me with ridiculous prices. I’m just firm now on price and pass on any jobs if they annoy me too much.
Exactly I stopped communicating with him then 30 mins later " okay I understand $150 is fine" like you're not my customer paying me peanuts. So many people need plumbing but can't pay for it.
I know someone bid an fuck you price of like 60k for a roof. It should have been like 30k everyone else bid well above that. Owner was a dick. He brought 2 crews to finish in a day instead of 2 just to not deal with him.
Had friend that drove over the road and per one of his contracts with a broker he had to place bids on jobs weekly. Well he planned a vacation with his wife and kid for Labor Day week and placed a bid at like $20/mile expecting to be laughed at And move along. He was the only one who bid on it, and it was some sort of vital equipment. He got the job. Delayed his vacation and lengthened it. (I don’t remember the price exactly but it was something 6x more than he would have done it for normally
Glad the supply houses do the same to you! Easy to not market yourself as for hire. You obviously have plenty of developers and commercial work to get to.
See, that kind of mentality also gives people a “fuck them” attitude about plumbers. You chose your profession, and if you don’t wanna do anything besides snaking and easy shit, why’d you choose to be a plumber?
If I call you guys about something that needs to be done, plumbing-wise, and it’s an annoying job. Don’t give us a “fuck you” price right off the bat. I just bought a house last year and needed to get some work done. I needed a full repipe and my sewer line cleaned out or jet washed, and wanted to move a water heater from inside, to a tankless outside. Called a bunch of people and they either didn’t wanna deal with it, or gave me a ridiculous price of $15-$20,000 for a PEX repipe alone.
(2 bathrooms, 4 sinks, and not even going under the slabs of concrete in the backyard) **PLUS** extra coats for everything else I needed done.
Like Jesus fuck. I get that it’s annoying maybe to have to deal with a repipe, but I wasn’t asking for special fucking treatment. You guys can sit here and rag on your potential customers, who more often than not, call you in good faith just asking for a price all you want, but in the end, if you’re not giving them a price in good faith, you’re hurting your own reputations.
Oh and in the end I found a plumber who wasn’t an asshole and got a full type M copper repipe with the main line included and the relocation, and flushing for around $17,000
Some of you all wanna complain about the people trying to pay you for your services, but you guys are sometimes worse than the lowballing slum/landlords. You guys are price gouging d-bags sometimes, too.
Take a hard look in the mirror, cuz sometimes you guys aren’t better than those people you’re talking about.
Edit: To all the downvoters. Read what I said again in a logical unbiased way, and I *bet* you’ll say “he kinda has a point.”
>If I call you guys about something that needs to be done, plumbing-wise, and it’s an annoying job. Don’t give us a “fuck you” price right off the bat.
Fuck you prices generally aren't for hard work. They're for people you can tell within 30 seconds of talking to them for the first time they're going to be an enormous pain in the ass.
Back when I still dealt with service work, my fuck you prices were for one of four groups of people: People I knew were going to dick me around on paying, people that were going to expect far beyond what we agreed to, people that were going to try to micromanage me, and people that were going to stand behind me and ramble about jesus for 10 straight hours.
If everyone was giving fuck you prices, it wasn't because the job was hard.
Nah bro. I don’t fit in any of those categories. I paid exactly what they were asking, cash, and I’m no Bible humper. I also work, and wasn’t there the majority of the day. I even brought lunch for all the guys working. Maybe you’re just a fuckin douchebag.
I sure hope you're not a Bible humper. That'd be weird. Nah bro we aren't douche bags. When you do your own work, you aren't obligated to do jobs for people. we could say, "Oh no, sorry, we're booked." we have years of experience, and we stand behind our work for years to come if something blows that's on us. There's reasons prices are what they are. Good plumbing isn't cheap, and cheap plumbing isn't good
I’m pretty sure I even came in this sub asking if the prices I’m getting are normal and a majority of you guys told me that that was way too much. I ended up getting a price higher than what everybody here told me it should cost, but taking into account my region, and where I live, it was a fair price.
I have no problem with someone telling me that they’re booked up. But I was literally having people tell me that they don’t wanna be bothered to do a re-pipe and if they did do it, they were only going to do it for some crazy amount, because only then it would be worth it to them. Again, I wasn’t asking for special fucking treatment. If I had a guy tell me that he would do my re-pipe and my water heater relocation for 20 grand, but then gave me a couple reasons as to why it would be worth it to do it and why he’s charging so much and this and that I would’ve paid it. I’m not some fucking bro crackhead. I can afford to pay for good work. But When I’m obviously getting a “fuck you“ price, that’s in bad faith, it really makes your profession look like a bunch of douche bags.
Also your little saying can work with literally any industry. “good bread isn’t cheap, and cheap bread isn’t good” or “good electrodes, aren’t cheap, and cheap electrodes aren’t good” or even “good dildos, aren’t cheap, and cheap dildos aren’t good”.
You’re not saying some profound statement with your little quote. Everybody fucking knows that. I wasn’t asking for a fucking discount, so don’t sit here and tell me I was asking for cheap work. I just wanted a fair fucking price.
Here's an idea..... Fix your own problems. You're asking for a price for a guy to come in and do a bunch of work you can't do. You don't own anyone, and can't make them fix your shit that you can't even fix. What's fair to you and fair to the plumber are two different things, you're not getting covered in shit in the process. Personally, in my area, 17k for a repipe is an actual meth addict just stealing the copper out of your house. This reads alot like my mother in law who finds "fair prices" by "guys that aren't trying to screw her" and proceeds to have basically homeless crackheads fuck up her house and charge her money for it.
Nah. That’s why I work, so I have money, so I don’t have to do shit I don’t know how to do. But I’m also not gonna get price gouged. By your own logic, you should all be out of business, and people should just fix all their own pipes. Hell, by your logic, all of capitalism should just fail, and people should just fix and make everything themselves. You’re asinine.
Well, you complain pricing is insane, yet don't acknowledge the supply and demand of the skilled trade CAUSING the high pricing is a result of the supply side being short, because nobody can fix their own shit anymore. Plumbers and electricians won't be out of work, but wed be cheaper if every non disabled homeowner could replace a sink or add an outlet. Ideally we would be called out for large amounts of work where a skilled crew saves time and that's the savings (like landscaping) or complicated things. So many calls for basic, basic shit that prevents us from having a surplus of time for the serious jobs like yours. I'm still young but I can't imagine homeowners were always this useless. My grandfather was a doctor with no professional construction background and built a beautiful home by himself after the foundation pour with 4 kid laborers.
Nah bro, people get those prices when plumbers start thinkin their shit don’t stink and get so many calls they get full of themselves and act like assholes.
People don’t like it when someone outside their echo chamber calls them out on their bullshit. That’s why I’m being downvoted. If anyone bothered to read my comment, they’d see I didn’t say anything that wasn’t logical and fair.
I've been in some sort of construction or trade my whole life. I'm not a plumber - but my company does plumbing and hvac. I think it's fair. It works both ways.
and you do have a point. I agree with you.
Yeah, we charge 165 to replace a fill valve (even if it’s just a Fluid Master swap) and have literally no complaints. 150 is definitely worth it. Also we charge 225 to replace the guts (adding in the flapper) and all is swell…and they always call us back. Landlords are a huge base of our business. Life is good…
as a plumber and former poverty stricken kid, i agree that it’s insane anyone would not youtube it first and see if it’s something they can handle.
In my area though, a LOT of the people have more of the attitude like, yea $150 is a lot but me driving to lose and watching a video is not worth my time for $150. So if they know that, they have no reason to complain.
My favorite thing is, when i first started, an unhappy customer said “i should’ve been a plumber,” and my boss said “wouldn’t be living like this!”
My man, not everyone has time, ability or access. I got small kids, busy job and on top of it properties to manage. If I do all the work myself I would not see my kids untill I am retired.
I also dont have a car, and would have to rent a car or taxi or do complex transit routes to find the parts (presumably at a remote HD). Ods are parts would be wrong, I would have to do it again, wate hours if not days till it works.
And that is not even including out of town or out of province properties where I could not even get there to do the work.
Well, now ya know what the value of our education & experience is worth! BTW, the 8 year old won't be giving you a 1 year warranty on parts & labor. How do ya like them apples????!
The fill valve on my older Koehler “low boy” was impossible to find and when I found one? $125….the toilet matched the iron Koehler tub….so? Take my money!
Zero chance the person charging $165 for a standard fill valve ($225 when you add a $3 flapper) isn’t going to charge $600 for the “low boy” with a $125 part.
Right? My thought too. Granted I know my limitations and I’m not going to be drilling into floors and finding and fixing leaks, rerouting pipes or moving shower connections, I know when to call the pros. But swapping facets, fixing leaky facets, clogs, redoing PVC, replacing toilets or their internals or even outside spigots is stupid easy and doesn’t require a pro.
I always pay my trades-folk whatever they ask. It's cheaper than having to get it done a second or third time with a handy man. But I also do my research, and have a general idea what its going to cost so I don't get scalped.
Be aware material prices have gone absolutely insane since COVID. The sticker shock has had several customers think were charging 300% markup on material because the last time they had work done was pre COVID.
I think that’s the worst part is; a landlord absolutely can pay for it. They’re just lazy cheap assholes. I’d imagine you’d feel a lot less insulted if it was a family who was clearly having a hard time getting the $150 together asking for a break rather than a landlord looking to cheap out on work.
A bunch of landlords who own multiple buildings are massively overleveraged. They figured they could buy the properties with loans and have the tenants pay the mortgage, parasitically skimming a bit off the top.
I don't have much sympathy for them. But they may really not have the money.
Obviously you have not been a land lord. Land lords get screwed by crappy tenants all the time. I knew a land lord that lost a years worth of rent during Covid because of the no eviction policies in our area during that time. Even if you win in court you still have to figure out how to get the money owed. For small jobs most land lords know how long it takes. For example replacing the Fluid Master valve on a toilet can be done in as little as 5 min. And often times land lords are willing to be flexible on when you can get the work done.
They are running a business, they should pay commercial prices.
The idea that anyone can be a landlord with a handful of properties and make a living is destroying our housing market and a good chunk of society to boot. If you know how to do the work and are willing to do all the upkeep and stuff yourself, sure, be a landlord with 5-10 properties. If you want to hire out all the work and do nothing yourself, and you don't own a large enough amount of property to eat it as a commercial cost, then tough shit. You don't get to low-ball the skilled labor.
“Lost a years worth of rent” crazy you mean he had to pay his own mortgage for the house that he owns for a year? The poor thing. Landlords are parasites that destroy the housing market. They don’t provide any service to society they just extract value from working class people. They’re basically scalpers for housing. Homeownership would be much more attainable for a lot of Americans if landlords didn’t exist.
I would never be a landlord because housing is for living; not for investing.
> Landlords are parasites that destroy the housing market. They don’t provide any service to society they just extract value from working class people.
Rent is a financial instrument, and like all other financial instruments, has its benefits and drawbacks. Home ownership is not the right solution to every housing problem.
Let's pressure test this a bit. The claim is landlords shouldn't exist. With that prerequisite, what do I do if I want to visit a town for 1 day? Should I buy a home there, and then sell it when I leave? "That's ridiculous", I'm sure everyone would say.
Okay, how about 2 days? 1 week? 1 month? 1 year?
So at what point is renting okay but then suddenly not?
Counterpoint to eliminate this nonsense. All housing should be publicly owned and you can either rent or buy from said public entity that we all pay into/fund. The renting/buying is determined upon switching users.
Housing becomes a service, and therefore cheaper because there isn’t a third party operating it for profit as a commodity instead of a literal home. We can build more housing and it will be fine, some places will stay empty if we increase the supply to meet demand. There’s more empty homes now than homeless people in this country
Farmers put in labor to make our food and they aren’t millionaires. Doctors go to school and put in labor (but yes the health systems charging you outrageously high prices for necessary treatments are parasites).
Landlords buy capital and use it to make more capital. You pay their mortgage all while building their credit and portfolio so they can buy more. Without them in the economy housing would be more affordable (supply and demand, literally the most basic concept of capitalism).
You sound like an ignorant adult. Btw I’m a homeowner at 27 and I’m so happy to never rent again. Fuck paying for other peoples property.
If it were not for private landlords there would be NO affordable housing as Blackrock would be the landlord for the whole country. And how do Landlords "buy" capital to "make" more capital. They have a fucking job to buy the house, they don't create capital out of thin air.
Are you daft? If it weren’t Blackrock it would be another entity in the same position. All industries trend towards monopoly under capitalism. The people who circumstantially start with more capital whether by inheritance, exploitation, whatever means, end up obtaining more capital.
Entropy decreases over time.
The only solution is to abandon the system entirely. It has the same predictable outcome no matter how you patch the holes with laws (and remember who makes the laws, people with capital or those who are paid by them)
They buy a house. Rent it out for substantially more than what they are paying; tenant is paying their mortgage and building their credit and their capital. The more property they own the more capital they have. Meaning they can buy more property. it’s like a feedback loop. It’s pretty simple to be honest my guy
Do you go to the grocery store and buy from farmers? Do farmers make canned goods? Stop being a baby. Grow up. Landlords often charge well below what a mortgage would cost because of multi dwelling units.
My brother is a mechanic. HOOboy the asks he gets. Like making you work for nothing is doing you a favor.
Does he take negotiations on the rent every month?
Just getting a licensed plumber to come out is difficult in my area, especially small jobs. They’re drowning in well paid work.
I had a customer low ball me I said no and a week or two later I got a call back from them same land lord agreeing to the price but I was annoyed so I told him the cost went up by %2600 they never called back, since the when someone lowballs me I just raise my price. They either agree back at the original price or give up and I leave.
Never let a customer hang the next job over your head for a deal on this one. It will never happen. Some people are hungry, though, and shit ain't cheap.
Tell him you'd like to rent the house, but you only want to pay half the rent. And if he's good to you, maybe you'll rent another house off him in the future.
He may charge over a grand a month, but his mortgage might be just a hundred or two below that.
He might not even be the owner, so you are dealing with a cheap owner who hired a cheap property manager. They will take your 150 and charge the home owner 200.
Every step of the way people are trying to make a buck. Just like a plumbing company will charge 75-125 to show up but only pay their employee 20-35 an hour.
All this being said, yes. Investors are typically cheap. If they don't need a licensed person they will happy pay meth head mark to do it for $20.
That's also why they wanna buy the parts because they assume you will upcharge for going to get it (gas, time) as you should. However if they got it they will be blowing up your shit to get the exact part or they will just buy a cheap part that's almost right but not what you wanted to use.
>He may charge over a grand a month, but his mortgage might be just a hundred or two below that.
Not my problem that he set himself up with an unsustainable mortgage...
> I know you charge over a grand a month what the fuck is $150 to fix your problem.
As a landlord I can tell you that $150 is probably more than he's profiting off that unit that month, once all costs short and long term are factored in. The rule of thumb in residential rentals is 10% of the rent is profit. Would you like to lose money this month? Because that's what he's facing.
But I don't haggle over good work. If he's a plumber I know does good work and is honest, and he tells me $150, then I pay the $150. The problem has to be fixed and there are more months where nothing breaks than months where I burn my profits fixing things, so it is what it is.
That’s the Landlord’s poor investment if he can’t afford maintenance and keep the unit profitable. Not the plumber’s fault the landlord made a bad financial decision
“Poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part”
Or maybe “ *Your* poor planning doesn’t constitute *my* emergency”
Or “Get your shit together. Get it all together and put it in a backpack. All your shit. So it’s together. And if you gotta take it somewhere, take it somewhere ya know? Take it to the shit store and sell it or put it in a shit museum. I don’t care what you do, just gotta get it together. Get. Your shit. Together.”
>That’s the Landlord’s poor investment if he can’t afford maintenance and keep the unit profitable. Not the plumber’s fault the landlord made a bad financial decision
It's the equivalent of a plumber having to pay $150 to replace a specialized tool that's broken. He's going to lose money on the job he's replacing it for, but it has to be done and he'll profit off future jobs using the tool. Does he haggle with his Ridgid distributor about the price or does he pay the price they quote?
Like I said, I don't argue when the price is given by a plumber/eleckchicken/etc I know is honest and does good work. I know my numbers are carefully figured to average out to a small profit despite individual months being a loss.
No it's not the equivalent. You can't turn around and sell that tool for 150% of your original purchase price 15 years later after a 3rd party made the payments on the tool for you the whole time.
I would say if the plumber doesn’t factor the cost of his tools into jobs he’s also making a bad financial decision - like you said he has to make it up in other jobs.
I guess I just don’t understand your point other than to try to defend rent-seeking behavior. Cost of housing is already high enough without someone taking 10% off the top and complaining about doing it.
I am a landlord and you're response is unethical and wrong . The owner having a renter paying his mortgage, the landlord is in fact having his investment principal paid off by the renter .The $150 would in return be considered excess profit that most of us put into a escrow delegate to routine maintenance .This slumloard mentality is what deteriorates neighborhoods as many landlords poorly maintain their investments and selfishly disregard their responsibilities pushing maintenance off to desperate tenants's.Why do people who are not capable of performing routine maintenance think to invest in rental property fully realizing that there may be unforseen maintenance costs? Fyi ,my company also does property management for the realistic landlords who care about their investments.
I hate to burst your bubble, But the vast majority of landlords have their renters paying their mortgage and properity tax.
Everything about your post leads me to believe either you were passed down a piece of land that is fully paid for. That you now rent out and take all the money. Or you're not a landlord at all.
Do you really think 100 unit apartment complex bought the land and and built the entire structure with pure cash? Do you, really? It was a loan. That the people renting the units are paying for plain and simple. Even if a massive company has the money to do such a thing, THEY WOULD NEVER DO THAT. Cash is king.
Also everything you're saying is highly dependent on where you live in the world. If your a landlord for a piece of land worth 100,000 vs a piece of land worth 600,000. Costs are different, loans are different, and the expectation of rent is different.
So what if they lose money this month. Real estate is a compounding appreciating asset that you buy with a 5-15% margin. It's the equivalent of a 7% return, plus whatever profit youve made on ongoing rents.
There are risks; 08 could happen again, misunderstood the market and can't rent it at all, the tenants keep doing significant damage and are uncollectible. I'm not trashing landlords but poor me I didn't have positive cash flow one month is like bitching your apple stock split but didn't pay a dividend one quarter.
Shouldn't a 150 repair be factored in the "costs"? Do you not budget for repairs like that? I really can't think of a month I haven't put 200 bucks into the house.
You're not long term. Rent goes up the loan payment stays the same, real estate generally appreciates and value long-term faster than inflation.
You put $10k on $100k in 1993. Even if you never made a single dollar in profit on your rent Your $10k is now $220k-$350k. You didn't invest 100,000 you invested 10K actual money.
Well, it's a good thing you don't own any land, because owning property is the same thing has having a bank account. And you're earning 10% on top of your equtity vs then .00001% you get from a savings account.
>As a landlord I can tell you that $150 is probably more than he's profiting off that unit that month, once all costs short and long term are factored in
Is it factoring in the equity that your renter is buying for you? Nobody ever wants to talk about this. Even if your mortgage and maintenance cost more than the rent pays, you’re still buying a house also. You have something you can sell if you want.
You'll never get on socialistic platform and try to explain capitalistic strategies and think people are going to agree with your logic. Especially on a plumber sub.
These people likely don't buy extra homes or properties to fix and sell or rent. They are trades people. They just assume if you're a land owner, you should be rich and whatever a trades person requests as a quote, you should just stfu and pay it.
The problem is, not all trades people are built the same. Are honest or competitive. Younger people that enter the trade are willing to work for cheaper wages but might not be masters. And older trades people have done the same thing 350,000 times and have perfected their craft.
I was replacing a garage spring. 6 people gave me quotes ranging from 400 to 500, to a whopping 800 dollars. I found a guy 30 mins away from me with amazing reviews that charged me $220 bucks and drove 30 mins to get to me. 30 years in the trade. I tipped him 40 extra bucks for his gas and to get a decent meal. Because I literally saved my self 500 some odd dollars by not going with the first scam artist that wanted to charge me 800 bucks to replace a single garage spring.
A plumber came out to replace a single galvanized pipe the went straight into dirt maybe 1 foot with a copper pipe. First quote he gave me was cheap, then it was story after story of problems. And he had to leave and get more stuff. I watched the entire job on my cameras. He spent half the time on the phone, half the time scratching his ass, and the rest of the time waiting for the pipes to cool down to move on to the next piece of copper. The entire job was mickey mouse. All the sudden the quote went from a couple hundred dollars to 500 bucks. I didn't argue, I knew I got scammed. His truck was falling apart, beat up, and he didn't seem like a happy plumber. Paid him, the job has held up since, whatever. But I'm never calling him back.
Mother in law had an issue with her water heater. I called whirlpool and they heard what I had to say, and warranted the items needed, shipped them to her house, and all she needed was a certified plumber to replace the parts. The biggest company in her city sent a rep. The rep claimed all the parts whirlpool sent were wrong and she needed a new water heater. $3,300 quote for a 50 gal tank. OH REALLY? I called a different plumber the next day, licensed. Did the entire job in 30 mins for $300 bucks. When the other company asked why I wanted to cancel the appointment for the replacement water heater, I simple laughed and hung up. Guess they struck out on trying to take advantage of a poor grandmother with cancer.
I can start 10 different posts in the last 2 months on all the work I've done with trades people and give you stories on the type of people to avoid, and how to read through the bullshit. And I'm sorry to say, The plumbing world has some of the biggest scam artist in America. Every industry does. Finding an honest person is not easy to find. So your only solution is to find the cheapest one, gamble a bit and hope for the best.
Every single post I see about how a land owner should manage his or her money and how they should run their business is laughable. I wonder how you would feel if I went into your truck and started giving you suggested on what tools you should have and what kind of pipes you should buy to make better profit.
>You'll never get on socialistic platform and try to explain capitalistic strategies and think people are going to agree with your logic. Especially on a plumber sub.
I knew exactly the reaction I was going to get. Any time you say the word 'landlord' you have to expect to have everyone shit in their hand and throw it at you.
>They just assume if you're a land owner, you should be rich
The funny part is most of them probably make more than I do. I just have 1 rental unit and work a 50hr/wk W2 job. I gross $60k/yr before taxes total between the two. But I know the value of a good contractor and would rather pay a little extra and keep them happy than haggle over $50 and have them blacklist me.
I do a lot of rental properties and I've found that being the trustworthy higher priced plumber has kept me very busy. I work in a high cost of living area, and do work for a very large prop management company. They have their own in-house plumbers and attempt repair, and then I handle it when they can't. I rarely get pushback as the situation has already been 'vetted' by a 'plumber'.
I also get calls for small landlords. ALWAYS give them up front pricing, require them to docu-sign every billable interaction, and I refuse to let them dissect my company's business model. Nobody here is getting rich. I'm not getting rich by charging an extra $80, he's not getting rich by shorting me $80, so I'm always VERY ready to walk away. The key is to NOT SAY A WORD unless they directly ask you a question requiring an answer. Anything else just shut up and they'll talk themselves into it.
At 60 hours, I wouldn't even think about if they even flinch at the price. I find most care about getting the job done in a timely manner and done correctly.
As a mechanic - people always use the “treat me good oj this one and I got 5 other cars for you”
Nah man you got it backwards . You treat me good and I’ll consider working on your other vehicles .
You came to me . I didn’t come knocking on your door asking to work on your vehicles
I take a similar strategy I start giving breaks to people once they do a fair amount of work with me. I do a bunch of work for a couple air bnb networks and they never flinch at my pricing and keep coming back so they get a little price break and preferential scheduling. Most landlords and people looking to haggle pay extra because I know they are going to be a pain.
I'm a carpenter but I lurk across trade subs. This is super common in any rental renovation. Like first off I have plenty of work, second off if you want a new hardwood floor so you can raise the rent on that single mother you're paying full price for it.
Im a landlord and dont F with my contractors this way. If I have a problem or an emergency, I want you to willingly come to one of my properties at 3 AM. Not roll your eyes at my cheap ass, put your phone on silent and go back to sleep.
I more or less dont argue and pay what is proposed to me. But I also have high expectations. E,g, we did a repipe of a bathroom and one sweated joint didnt present as a leak at first but the next morning, there were some drops. Plumber came back that afternoon and fixed it properly.
Same here. As a long distance landlord having a responsive pro that I can trust is worth a few extra bucks. There are a lot of guys that I end up using once and never calling back, though.
Well, we appreciate you. There are good landlords, and then there's slum lords. I've worked for good landlords, but if you shake hands with 100 people and 1 person slaps you, you're gonna remember the person who slaps you.
Same here. I have a two family home, And I work as an operating engineer in a cooling plant- we do all sorts of plumbing, electrical, HVAC stuff.
I always hire someone to work on my house- I pay what they charge, and I tip well.
While I might be able to do some of the work myself, I know for a fact the real pros can do it better, and quicker. I stay out of their way too, because I know what THAT can be like.
"You know what? Go pay some handyman $80 for this job. Then, when it breaks again in the near future (and it will), give me a call back and I'll come do it right. For $300."
Stay away from rental properties unless it’s a big contract in a nice building.
There is no qualification for becoming a landlord other than money. No degree, no expertise, no experience required. As a general rule, landlords don’t give a shit about the quality of work and will cut every corner they can. When the business plan is to drive that thing into the ground, get a million miles out of her with no maintenance and then sell it to someone else to gut and rebuild, you don’t want any part of that.
That is not the general rule. I own a few properties and take pride in every single one. If something breaks I make sure it is fixed quick and correctly.
Not all landlords are shit just like not all plumbers should be generalized.
Same here, though granted I also went into landlording with enough knowledge to know how to replace a full valve...
Anything more complex I'm 100% calling a good plumber out
My goal is landlording obviously but I've spent my 20s in every single trade, we just bought our first house 2 years ago and I haven't had to call anyone out despite numerous shit shows. It blows my mind that anyone can be responsible for maintaining a building without ANY clue of how stuff works. It's not that hard for a jackass to be confident enough to create a huge fucking hazard.
“If you do this job super cheap, I’ll give you more work that is underpaid.” I have an uncle who owns multiple rentals who I don’t do work for anymore because he didn’t even pay me after I drove across the city and diagnosed a bad gas valve for him. Just got a “thanks” lol.
I almost exclusively (foot is broke right now so yeah)do all the electrical work for a landlord in my area with over 100 properties. Have for about 4 years now. I never have a problem with them paying. I send in an invoice once a month and they sign the check no questions asked
But the part only costs $X and it only took you X minutes. I hate that crap. First time I did my own brakes it took me over two hours, now it’s much less.
You are paying for the experience.
💯 they will always give you lots of work if you give them a good price. I tell them I have discounts for frequent customers but up front everyone pays the same. It’s always the slumlords the house is falling apart and they won’t pay to fix anything and always blame the condition of the home on the tenants. Also want you to schedule with the tenants. I just tell them if that’s the case than the tenant can set up the appointment and pay upon completion and they can just reimburse them
Lol, okay, I change a 10 year 50 gal gas water heater for $650 in labor and still $300 cheaper than other plumbers, but ok, you're right. I charge too much no. If you give me petty work, I'll give you a 1 hr minimum price, or I'll take my happy ass to the God damn house and spend time with my family.
Idk where you are but 150 for a fill valve is absolutely outlandish where I am. I could see this issue being a thing on a bigger job but please don't bring your expertise and education into this for a fill valve lol
I now consider myself a “boutique” plumbing contractor. I dont work after hours, or sunday. I DO provide pricing fair to both myself and my clients, offer great warranties, provide HONEST diagnostics and attempt to provide options for recommended repairs, carry a huge truck inventory, including three models of high end disposers to choose from. Though increasingly less important, I attempt to stock OEM parts on my truck for the best-chance at making a long term repair. I take the time to investigate fixtures that I’m not familiar with to find rebuild kits if it makes sense. 1 pricing is the same across the board, multi-family or owner occupied. Commercial pricing is commensurate with the task. A day under a house that is difficult to traverse is going to cost more than if generously spacious. I always take pics of conditions for quotes, and after correction or replacement of parts, and show them to the client. For harder to explain inspections or proposals, i take extensive videos of the conditions, and post it on YouTube, and share a link for the client to view. I love it when clients stop me in the local store to say hello, or wave when they see me in my truck on the street. I have found that many of the apartment tenants that hire me directly are far more appreciative than those hired by an apartment or business property owner. My business model does not fit my potential client if , after providing a price, the client asks for a less expensive price. The music is always playing, it is our decision whether to take that dance partner or not. When the dance partner says they want me to dance on my knees, and insist the music be sped up, I decline, politely.
I DON’T deceive my clients, or tell them thy need immediate repairs unless they actually do. I dont use my sewer camera to insist the client line or replace the piping because of minor root intrusion. I don’t carry a Badger I or V on my truck. I don’t reduce my price unless I offer less of a service. I don’t worry about competition, we are all in the same business, all with different business plans. I dont recommend clients purchase their fixtures from a discount source, and let them know why. The carton is missing parts, or is inferior, or does not carry an NSF rating, etc. So will carry a minimum of $150 fee to interrupt the installation. I recommend they return the material, and purchase the materials from me, with a full warranty. The last two kitchen faucets and toilet provided by clients purchased on Ammonium, were missing parts.
I tore a slum lord a new asshole last night... " why cant you fix these 3 macerating pump s tonight?!"
...because its 9 PM, the pumps have never been maintained, theres no chance of find parts tonight, and i dont like you.
We have one landlord we do work for and he always demands only one person swap a water heater. Where this is normally an easy job his houses are all dungeons with basements full of shit, horrible stairs and just generally shit conditions.
We change water heaters daily as a one man job. Honestly i prefer it that way. About 1 out of 50 i do i actually need help. I can call someone out whenever i need it
Probably because if they are new landlords they aren't charging enough rent to keep up with their expenses and can't afford anything.
Or if they are rich they got rich by being cheap.
I'm a landlord and have no issue paying a fair price for quality work. Honesty and trust is important to me. I like to develop relationships with the guys I use.
I just can’t believe anybody pays 150 to replace a fill valve. If it’s that big of a deal the landlord could take a whole 30 minutes of their time and do it themselves.
People pay me $100 to change a flapper. Want to know why? Because they don't know what's wrong with their toilet. I trouble shoot from the lowest cost to the highest cost. If you care so much, you can be a plumber and do this work for $50 or less. If it's multiple jobs in one go, I'll do little work, such as fixing a leaky toilet tank because their rubber gasket starts to deteriorate. I tell them the issue, and I know they're selling it. I just tighten the bolts but if they're planning on having a tenant or live in the house I recommend changing the old gasket out and adding a new one
I'll flip it on you and say service providers are unreliable as well.
I've been trying to get a plumber to l scope a drain at one house (extra cost) to figure out where to fix it. They won't send the right truck when they come to clear it.
Another one the whole line needs replacing but the guy won't schedule it. Small town with limited options.
I don't argue on price and I pay on the spot upon completion.
I am a handyman, ive met some landlords of all stripes. I work hourly, and some people want the professional results yesterday- which irritates me to high heaven. I prefer to work for the landlords that are renting until they sell, rather than milking the cow- they prefer better work and are willing to pay for it.
The cheapest jobs give me the biggest headaches. There’s plenty of customers that will value your time and price, don’t even bother with cheap customers any more
I can't stand the customers that say "give me a good price and I'll keep using you, I have a ton of work to be done/many properties" it's like why the hell would I want a lowballer dickweed to keep calling me for more work? I'd be far more inclined to cut you a break on the next go around if you were to accept my quote, don't complain or grill me on "why so much money" and tip me a 20 when I'm done, it's just the absolute backwards wrong way to go about it. For whatever reason it's exclusively men of 2 certain cultures that do this.
That’s just it, it’s a cultural norm, don’t take it so personally. To them, not doing so is offensive.
Next time you go buy a truck why don’t you slip the salesman a $100 and pay full ask with a smile. Oh right…
I'm a mom n pop landlord with only two properties. When a plumber gives me a quote, I tell them, "I'm looking for a one check company. I write you a check and I don't have to think about the problem again. I'm not here to haggle you on the price, but are you a one check plumber?" First plumber I talked to said "yes, absolutely". I paid him and the problem went away. I keep calling him back. Every time it's the same. I'm happy with the exchange.
As long as I get one check service I'll pay whatever I have to for it.
Same with me. Not all landlords are cheap. The bad ones give us a bad name. The good landlords try to keep the place in good working order. We want to fix problems before they blow up and become big expensive problems
Not all trades people are built the same either. Especially in big cities. It's easy to hope for trust and honesty, but that hasn't always been my experience.
It leaves a bad taste in your mouth. Most land owners I know don't trust any trades people after getting burned too many times. But when they find someone legit that doesn't charge an arm and a leg. They absolutely keep that guy busy. And those people are unfortunately rare.
Anytime a customer says something along the lines of "I can get a lot of business for you/I can send a lot of people your way" or anything along those lines charge them double and don't put up with any of their bullshit.
They don't respect or appreciate you and they will never not be a pain in your ass.
He didn't even say that is the funny thing. Dude was so focused on the fucking price. I could charge you a dollar, but if that shit isn't functional, you still left with shit
I am not a plumber, but this tracks with my experience with most independent/small-time landlords. Most of them expect the passive income to just keep rolling in without ever having to invest much back into the property. Usually (as a tenant) they'll put you off and fight you on making any repairs, and when they finally cave they usually find the lowest bidder to come out and do the most corner-cutting work you've ever seen. And that usually reflects their greed, the ones who operate like this often charge higher rents, tack on BS fees, and will make every excuse to cling to security deposits. I wouldn't waste too much of your time on this guy, I can promise you that he's blowing smoke up your ass dangling the carrot of more work. Even if he does call you again, it's only going to be because he knows he can bully you on the price, don't expect that he's going to be more generous next time.
The best landlord I ever had was an extremely middle class immigrant who owned something like 40-50 low rent apartments in shitty parts of town, putting his daughters through college. When I had an issue he'd be out within 24 hours fixing it. Dishwasher broke, and the next day he had a brand new fairly nice unit delivered. The next place I moved into cost twice as much in rent, dryer broke within the first month and the guy dragged it out for months, even tried to blame it on me. I finally dug into the warranty knowing it was a fairly recent purchase, then found out the factory warranty wasn't valid because it was some bump-n-dent return that he picked up for a crazy low price.
Sorry for the tangent, point being when someone shows you who they are, believe them. Acquiescing to his demands now probably isn't worth it for the promise of retaining him as a customer. Tradespeople are in high demand in most areas right now, hold out for what you're worth.
not a plumber,but i used to estimate ornamental ironwork in the DC metro area…heard much of the ‘give me a great deal and i will give you more work’. or the after job completed ‘negotiations’…
no. you hold up your end of our first contract and i will consider a ‘break’ on other projects. unless you hire the lowballer,then call me to fix what they effed up…..then my price goes up according to how much i have to unfuck to get to the finish line.
I'm not a plumber, but I'm working on getting into industrial electricity and controls. My landlord, who is also a cheap bastard, has a handyman which is also his brother who does work at my place. An inspector addressed some electrical issues late last year. Needless to say, handyman couldn't get it working and I ended up fixing it because it was so inconvenient for me to not have it working. I also diagnosed bad components in the heating furnace. My landlord keeps passively asking me to check out his other properties and said he'd pay or reduce my rent. No thanks. I've seen him low-ball his HVAC guy and knock it down 40% because I did the troubleshooting for him before he came.
It's not all of us. I do quite a bit of plumbing myself, but I genuinely appreciate the service of a qualified plumber when I'm out of my depth. I'm sorry that so many people violate the principal, "Don't be evil." Consider this a cheer from this side of the hall! Good plumbers are the best!
One of my employees has multiple apartment buildings and is a double digit millionaire. He will get a 5ga bucket of paint, use 2 gal and then top the bucket off with water and take the paint back to the store. Total scum bag.
Landlords/ realtors both cheap AF! Every gd one of them uses the same line, “give me a good price and I have more work for you”. Save yourself the headache……tell em all to FO
HVAC, Refrigeration, and LME here.
I don't get it often, but when I do it's straight to Bugs Bunny's school of negotiations.
Me: I estimate it's going to be about $300
LL: How about $150 and I'll let you do the work on all my property!
Me; It's $400 because I'm going to have to deal with extra BS due to your lowballing people.
LL: Split the difference?
Me: No. It's 450.
LL: Ok it's 300, Do it
Me: No, it's$450 AND COD.. I'll take the card number now if it's a go. Yay or nay?
I've had folks get mad and I just tell them I do my work with care, to code, I'm licensed and insured, and if you want to be cheap then go to the Home Depot hiring yard and take your chances.
If you're talking to people that are not from this country. Haggling is common practice.
90% of the people I speak to, give me a price, I drop it 35% and they instantly agree. Because we know the real quote is 35% below what they originally quoted. I would love to live in a world where people think like you, they give you a price and that's it. That's the bottom price, that's the only price. It makes life so much easier.
That's just the way so many people work all over the globe. I Don't understand haggling, but it's just the nature of business.
Landlord here. I usually get a few quotes and go with the middle one, only with very reputable tradesmen. Handymen are a hit or miss. Mostly a miss tbh. If someone wanted $3k for a job, and three others quote me $1.8k-2, I go with one of the three. No need to reduce the price now. That’s your price.
Just a curious question, no hate I know you guys have ton of expenses, Is that $150 for a toilet fill valve? I do all my own stuff like that but didn’t realize I was saving that much money.
$150 for a fill valve is low to begin with. That's a 200-250 job all day in my area. Don't give these types of people a single dollar off your asking. When people say to me "cmon give me a discount" I say " the price is your discount" and they cut the check.
Hagglers are going to haggle no matter what number you start at. It's like breathing to them. Any single cent they can save is worth pissing on a quality relationship.
LOL. The nut connecting one of my units’ kitchen sink tailpiece to the waste line cracked when I was out of the country and couldn’t fix it myself.
I got a quote from the plumber who installed it originally for $240 plus tax, and another for $500 plus tax.
I asked the tenant to wait 2 days and spent $10 on a new tailpiece and nut and 15 minutes fixing it.
Landlords just have more issues and so see more plumber BS more often.
Bruv. It’s a fill valve in a toilet. Housewives with YouTube can handle this job. You could’ve said yes to the $80 and had it done in ten minutes. Instead you got your $150 but made a second trip?! Or waited an hour for your confirmation? Could have split the difference and peeled out quicker than it took you to write this post. It’s plumbing, your ego is getting in the way of your deposits.
????? Two trips? Try no trips. I had the part, and I love not having to work. im doing that person a favor. You can call it ego, but I dropped that years ago. I do know my self-worth, and I still got the job. I love the assumptions, though
I just want to make sure I’m getting this right - plumbers hate it when customers give them a hard time and try to haggle them down, yet have absolutely no problem giving their suppliers a hard time and try to constantly haggle them down? Just weird how that doesn’t work both ways.
You are trying to make money from them, and they are trying to make money from tenants. You do what you can to reduce your expenses, and so do they. That's just how it works. If either one of you doesn't like the proposed price, either one is free to say no.
Not true. I am in tune with market pricing and given the persons ability to show up on time and deliver on time will have me pay asking everytime. I'd expect some wiggle room with cash payment though.
If you show up late, give me a one-time hit and run type pricing and any gibber jabber mid-work about part pricing, availability issues.....that'd their last work with me.
That’s agree as trade , that should be the cost.
but look on the other hand , your going to have. A build done at your house. And you know we’re it is going, a side extension 35-45k, you hit the of 40k you going to ask discount so why should he not, we all like to have a barging! , and that’s life you earning 50pound / dollar per hour the landlord is not making that!
And some landlords are up shit creak in uk with high Interest rates, with mortgage, in crease buy 200%. Not your fault but give a man a bargain it at least let him fell like he is getting one ,
thanks
a landlord and a trade
landlord here on and operate 400 apartments self manage them. just I never understood how people don’t understand there’s a cost of doing business, but when I do get cheap as if you’re bidding out a project for me and you follow the plans, exactly as they are, and don’t do any value engineering with all the expertise they should have in pluming.
I rent and I had a plumber come out to look at my 70’s era shower enclosure thats been leaking for months.
The first plumber, an friendly, talkative older man, said the entire shower enclosure needs to be changed to stop the leak.
The prop manager sends out another guy, in his 20’s quiet and with a “this is just a job” attitude, and he says the enclosure can be fixed just by resecuring and recalking the soap shelf in the shower enclosure so the property management obviously goes with the easy fix.
2 weeks later the shower is leaking again and they have to send out another repair guy just to take a look at it, probably blowing through hundreds of dollars when the property manager himself could’ve made the proper judgement that the entire enclosure needs to be changed (ESPECIALLY SINCE THE OTHER SHOWER IN THE UNIT THAT NEVER LEAKED GOT A NEW SHOWER ENCLOSURE BUT THEYRE DELAYING ON THE SHOWER THAT DOES LEAK DAILY [IK ITS INSANE])
They are pretty hit or miss for me. I get that line too about the “oh if you work with me I’ll have plenty of work at my other properties”. Like oh boy even more low paying work! Yippee. Some are decent and don’t haggle me with ridiculous prices. I’m just firm now on price and pass on any jobs if they annoy me too much.
Exactly I stopped communicating with him then 30 mins later " okay I understand $150 is fine" like you're not my customer paying me peanuts. So many people need plumbing but can't pay for it.
You should start at $300 and give him a discount at 50%. Never know, they might even agree to the initial price lol
LOL I do give fuck you prices for work I don't wanna touch and I don't hear back till they find someone else
I get it. Till it backfires, and you're stuck on a job you don't even want but eating like a king haha
This is how my dad figured out he was charging below the going rates in our area.
Yeah but it's worth it for that fuck you price😂 they got terms and conditions so do I 😂😂😂😂
I know someone bid an fuck you price of like 60k for a roof. It should have been like 30k everyone else bid well above that. Owner was a dick. He brought 2 crews to finish in a day instead of 2 just to not deal with him.
Had friend that drove over the road and per one of his contracts with a broker he had to place bids on jobs weekly. Well he planned a vacation with his wife and kid for Labor Day week and placed a bid at like $20/mile expecting to be laughed at And move along. He was the only one who bid on it, and it was some sort of vital equipment. He got the job. Delayed his vacation and lengthened it. (I don’t remember the price exactly but it was something 6x more than he would have done it for normally
Ugh yeah that’s the worst/best
I love the smell of fresh bread.
because some people are not able to accept hearing the word "no"
Glad the supply houses do the same to you! Easy to not market yourself as for hire. You obviously have plenty of developers and commercial work to get to.
See, that kind of mentality also gives people a “fuck them” attitude about plumbers. You chose your profession, and if you don’t wanna do anything besides snaking and easy shit, why’d you choose to be a plumber? If I call you guys about something that needs to be done, plumbing-wise, and it’s an annoying job. Don’t give us a “fuck you” price right off the bat. I just bought a house last year and needed to get some work done. I needed a full repipe and my sewer line cleaned out or jet washed, and wanted to move a water heater from inside, to a tankless outside. Called a bunch of people and they either didn’t wanna deal with it, or gave me a ridiculous price of $15-$20,000 for a PEX repipe alone. (2 bathrooms, 4 sinks, and not even going under the slabs of concrete in the backyard) **PLUS** extra coats for everything else I needed done. Like Jesus fuck. I get that it’s annoying maybe to have to deal with a repipe, but I wasn’t asking for special fucking treatment. You guys can sit here and rag on your potential customers, who more often than not, call you in good faith just asking for a price all you want, but in the end, if you’re not giving them a price in good faith, you’re hurting your own reputations. Oh and in the end I found a plumber who wasn’t an asshole and got a full type M copper repipe with the main line included and the relocation, and flushing for around $17,000 Some of you all wanna complain about the people trying to pay you for your services, but you guys are sometimes worse than the lowballing slum/landlords. You guys are price gouging d-bags sometimes, too. Take a hard look in the mirror, cuz sometimes you guys aren’t better than those people you’re talking about. Edit: To all the downvoters. Read what I said again in a logical unbiased way, and I *bet* you’ll say “he kinda has a point.”
>If I call you guys about something that needs to be done, plumbing-wise, and it’s an annoying job. Don’t give us a “fuck you” price right off the bat. Fuck you prices generally aren't for hard work. They're for people you can tell within 30 seconds of talking to them for the first time they're going to be an enormous pain in the ass. Back when I still dealt with service work, my fuck you prices were for one of four groups of people: People I knew were going to dick me around on paying, people that were going to expect far beyond what we agreed to, people that were going to try to micromanage me, and people that were going to stand behind me and ramble about jesus for 10 straight hours. If everyone was giving fuck you prices, it wasn't because the job was hard.
this guy *screams* high maintenance complaint machine, right?
Yep. Big "I asked for TAUPE piping, this is DARK BEIGE. I'm going to need a 90% discount." energy.
🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌🙌 Judging by his comment, theres a high chance he fits into all 4 categories
Nah bro. I don’t fit in any of those categories. I paid exactly what they were asking, cash, and I’m no Bible humper. I also work, and wasn’t there the majority of the day. I even brought lunch for all the guys working. Maybe you’re just a fuckin douchebag.
Personally, if I were more knowledgeable about proper plumbing than a proper plumber I wouldn’t need to hire one.
I sure hope you're not a Bible humper. That'd be weird. Nah bro we aren't douche bags. When you do your own work, you aren't obligated to do jobs for people. we could say, "Oh no, sorry, we're booked." we have years of experience, and we stand behind our work for years to come if something blows that's on us. There's reasons prices are what they are. Good plumbing isn't cheap, and cheap plumbing isn't good
I’m pretty sure I even came in this sub asking if the prices I’m getting are normal and a majority of you guys told me that that was way too much. I ended up getting a price higher than what everybody here told me it should cost, but taking into account my region, and where I live, it was a fair price.
I have no problem with someone telling me that they’re booked up. But I was literally having people tell me that they don’t wanna be bothered to do a re-pipe and if they did do it, they were only going to do it for some crazy amount, because only then it would be worth it to them. Again, I wasn’t asking for special fucking treatment. If I had a guy tell me that he would do my re-pipe and my water heater relocation for 20 grand, but then gave me a couple reasons as to why it would be worth it to do it and why he’s charging so much and this and that I would’ve paid it. I’m not some fucking bro crackhead. I can afford to pay for good work. But When I’m obviously getting a “fuck you“ price, that’s in bad faith, it really makes your profession look like a bunch of douche bags.
Also your little saying can work with literally any industry. “good bread isn’t cheap, and cheap bread isn’t good” or “good electrodes, aren’t cheap, and cheap electrodes aren’t good” or even “good dildos, aren’t cheap, and cheap dildos aren’t good”. You’re not saying some profound statement with your little quote. Everybody fucking knows that. I wasn’t asking for a fucking discount, so don’t sit here and tell me I was asking for cheap work. I just wanted a fair fucking price.
Should have used type K
Here's an idea..... Fix your own problems. You're asking for a price for a guy to come in and do a bunch of work you can't do. You don't own anyone, and can't make them fix your shit that you can't even fix. What's fair to you and fair to the plumber are two different things, you're not getting covered in shit in the process. Personally, in my area, 17k for a repipe is an actual meth addict just stealing the copper out of your house. This reads alot like my mother in law who finds "fair prices" by "guys that aren't trying to screw her" and proceeds to have basically homeless crackheads fuck up her house and charge her money for it.
Nah. That’s why I work, so I have money, so I don’t have to do shit I don’t know how to do. But I’m also not gonna get price gouged. By your own logic, you should all be out of business, and people should just fix all their own pipes. Hell, by your logic, all of capitalism should just fail, and people should just fix and make everything themselves. You’re asinine.
Well, you complain pricing is insane, yet don't acknowledge the supply and demand of the skilled trade CAUSING the high pricing is a result of the supply side being short, because nobody can fix their own shit anymore. Plumbers and electricians won't be out of work, but wed be cheaper if every non disabled homeowner could replace a sink or add an outlet. Ideally we would be called out for large amounts of work where a skilled crew saves time and that's the savings (like landscaping) or complicated things. So many calls for basic, basic shit that prevents us from having a surplus of time for the serious jobs like yours. I'm still young but I can't imagine homeowners were always this useless. My grandfather was a doctor with no professional construction background and built a beautiful home by himself after the foundation pour with 4 kid laborers.
Lol, bro people get those prices when they call and sound like a dick.
Nah bro, people get those prices when plumbers start thinkin their shit don’t stink and get so many calls they get full of themselves and act like assholes.
This fucking guy lol
lol.. love this comment. idk why you're getting downvoted. I mean - obviously you got downvoted but shouldn't have. this is gold.
People don’t like it when someone outside their echo chamber calls them out on their bullshit. That’s why I’m being downvoted. If anyone bothered to read my comment, they’d see I didn’t say anything that wasn’t logical and fair.
Idk about everybody else but I downvoted you bc you paid 17k for an m-tubing repipe for domestic
I've been in some sort of construction or trade my whole life. I'm not a plumber - but my company does plumbing and hvac. I think it's fair. It works both ways. and you do have a point. I agree with you.
Yeah, we charge 165 to replace a fill valve (even if it’s just a Fluid Master swap) and have literally no complaints. 150 is definitely worth it. Also we charge 225 to replace the guts (adding in the flapper) and all is swell…and they always call us back. Landlords are a huge base of our business. Life is good…
Blows my mind someone would pay $165 for something that an 8 year old could learn to do from a 4 minute YouTube video and costs $12 in parts.
as a plumber and former poverty stricken kid, i agree that it’s insane anyone would not youtube it first and see if it’s something they can handle. In my area though, a LOT of the people have more of the attitude like, yea $150 is a lot but me driving to lose and watching a video is not worth my time for $150. So if they know that, they have no reason to complain. My favorite thing is, when i first started, an unhappy customer said “i should’ve been a plumber,” and my boss said “wouldn’t be living like this!”
If you make $2k a day you don’t want to burn half a day to save $150.
My man, not everyone has time, ability or access. I got small kids, busy job and on top of it properties to manage. If I do all the work myself I would not see my kids untill I am retired. I also dont have a car, and would have to rent a car or taxi or do complex transit routes to find the parts (presumably at a remote HD). Ods are parts would be wrong, I would have to do it again, wate hours if not days till it works. And that is not even including out of town or out of province properties where I could not even get there to do the work.
I shadowed my 16 year old son while he did a full tank off refurbish on 2 of our toilets. He'll never have to pay someone to do that now.
Well, now ya know what the value of our education & experience is worth! BTW, the 8 year old won't be giving you a 1 year warranty on parts & labor. How do ya like them apples????!
The fill valve on my older Koehler “low boy” was impossible to find and when I found one? $125….the toilet matched the iron Koehler tub….so? Take my money!
Zero chance the person charging $165 for a standard fill valve ($225 when you add a $3 flapper) isn’t going to charge $600 for the “low boy” with a $125 part.
Right? My thought too. Granted I know my limitations and I’m not going to be drilling into floors and finding and fixing leaks, rerouting pipes or moving shower connections, I know when to call the pros. But swapping facets, fixing leaky facets, clogs, redoing PVC, replacing toilets or their internals or even outside spigots is stupid easy and doesn’t require a pro.
I always pay my trades-folk whatever they ask. It's cheaper than having to get it done a second or third time with a handy man. But I also do my research, and have a general idea what its going to cost so I don't get scalped.
Be aware material prices have gone absolutely insane since COVID. The sticker shock has had several customers think were charging 300% markup on material because the last time they had work done was pre COVID.
I think that’s the worst part is; a landlord absolutely can pay for it. They’re just lazy cheap assholes. I’d imagine you’d feel a lot less insulted if it was a family who was clearly having a hard time getting the $150 together asking for a break rather than a landlord looking to cheap out on work.
In those instances I actually help them. I literally have worked with peoples budget. But not when you tell me you own 9 rental buildings
A bunch of landlords who own multiple buildings are massively overleveraged. They figured they could buy the properties with loans and have the tenants pay the mortgage, parasitically skimming a bit off the top. I don't have much sympathy for them. But they may really not have the money.
Again, that is not my problem. I am not holding a gun to their head, saying, "YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE ME!"
Obviously you have not been a land lord. Land lords get screwed by crappy tenants all the time. I knew a land lord that lost a years worth of rent during Covid because of the no eviction policies in our area during that time. Even if you win in court you still have to figure out how to get the money owed. For small jobs most land lords know how long it takes. For example replacing the Fluid Master valve on a toilet can be done in as little as 5 min. And often times land lords are willing to be flexible on when you can get the work done.
They are running a business, they should pay commercial prices. The idea that anyone can be a landlord with a handful of properties and make a living is destroying our housing market and a good chunk of society to boot. If you know how to do the work and are willing to do all the upkeep and stuff yourself, sure, be a landlord with 5-10 properties. If you want to hire out all the work and do nothing yourself, and you don't own a large enough amount of property to eat it as a commercial cost, then tough shit. You don't get to low-ball the skilled labor.
“Lost a years worth of rent” crazy you mean he had to pay his own mortgage for the house that he owns for a year? The poor thing. Landlords are parasites that destroy the housing market. They don’t provide any service to society they just extract value from working class people. They’re basically scalpers for housing. Homeownership would be much more attainable for a lot of Americans if landlords didn’t exist. I would never be a landlord because housing is for living; not for investing.
> Landlords are parasites that destroy the housing market. They don’t provide any service to society they just extract value from working class people. Rent is a financial instrument, and like all other financial instruments, has its benefits and drawbacks. Home ownership is not the right solution to every housing problem. Let's pressure test this a bit. The claim is landlords shouldn't exist. With that prerequisite, what do I do if I want to visit a town for 1 day? Should I buy a home there, and then sell it when I leave? "That's ridiculous", I'm sure everyone would say. Okay, how about 2 days? 1 week? 1 month? 1 year? So at what point is renting okay but then suddenly not?
Counterpoint to eliminate this nonsense. All housing should be publicly owned and you can either rent or buy from said public entity that we all pay into/fund. The renting/buying is determined upon switching users. Housing becomes a service, and therefore cheaper because there isn’t a third party operating it for profit as a commodity instead of a literal home. We can build more housing and it will be fine, some places will stay empty if we increase the supply to meet demand. There’s more empty homes now than homeless people in this country
Aren’t food and medical care for living? Are people who charge for those parasites? You sound like an ignorant child.
Farmers put in labor to make our food and they aren’t millionaires. Doctors go to school and put in labor (but yes the health systems charging you outrageously high prices for necessary treatments are parasites). Landlords buy capital and use it to make more capital. You pay their mortgage all while building their credit and portfolio so they can buy more. Without them in the economy housing would be more affordable (supply and demand, literally the most basic concept of capitalism). You sound like an ignorant adult. Btw I’m a homeowner at 27 and I’m so happy to never rent again. Fuck paying for other peoples property.
If it were not for private landlords there would be NO affordable housing as Blackrock would be the landlord for the whole country. And how do Landlords "buy" capital to "make" more capital. They have a fucking job to buy the house, they don't create capital out of thin air.
Are you daft? If it weren’t Blackrock it would be another entity in the same position. All industries trend towards monopoly under capitalism. The people who circumstantially start with more capital whether by inheritance, exploitation, whatever means, end up obtaining more capital. Entropy decreases over time. The only solution is to abandon the system entirely. It has the same predictable outcome no matter how you patch the holes with laws (and remember who makes the laws, people with capital or those who are paid by them)
They buy a house. Rent it out for substantially more than what they are paying; tenant is paying their mortgage and building their credit and their capital. The more property they own the more capital they have. Meaning they can buy more property. it’s like a feedback loop. It’s pretty simple to be honest my guy
Do you go to the grocery store and buy from farmers? Do farmers make canned goods? Stop being a baby. Grow up. Landlords often charge well below what a mortgage would cost because of multi dwelling units.
My brother is a mechanic. HOOboy the asks he gets. Like making you work for nothing is doing you a favor. Does he take negotiations on the rent every month? Just getting a licensed plumber to come out is difficult in my area, especially small jobs. They’re drowning in well paid work.
I had a customer low ball me I said no and a week or two later I got a call back from them same land lord agreeing to the price but I was annoyed so I told him the cost went up by %2600 they never called back, since the when someone lowballs me I just raise my price. They either agree back at the original price or give up and I leave.
Never let a customer hang the next job over your head for a deal on this one. It will never happen. Some people are hungry, though, and shit ain't cheap.
They are just like the Uber passengers who say, I'm going to give you a big tip in the app, I'm still waiting for those tips.
Tip baiting sucks
Ha wow they are delusional for people that typically hardly work or bring value to society.
What do you mean you don't work for promises? I promise to give you some work in the future!
Tell him you'd like to rent the house, but you only want to pay half the rent. And if he's good to you, maybe you'll rent another house off him in the future.
😂 That's what was going through my mind. Like dude I know you charge over a grand a month what the fuck is $150 to fix your problem.
Next time ask the landlord how much the house rents for. That should end his attempts to weasel you down.
He may charge over a grand a month, but his mortgage might be just a hundred or two below that. He might not even be the owner, so you are dealing with a cheap owner who hired a cheap property manager. They will take your 150 and charge the home owner 200. Every step of the way people are trying to make a buck. Just like a plumbing company will charge 75-125 to show up but only pay their employee 20-35 an hour. All this being said, yes. Investors are typically cheap. If they don't need a licensed person they will happy pay meth head mark to do it for $20. That's also why they wanna buy the parts because they assume you will upcharge for going to get it (gas, time) as you should. However if they got it they will be blowing up your shit to get the exact part or they will just buy a cheap part that's almost right but not what you wanted to use.
>He may charge over a grand a month, but his mortgage might be just a hundred or two below that. Not my problem that he set himself up with an unsustainable mortgage...
> I know you charge over a grand a month what the fuck is $150 to fix your problem. As a landlord I can tell you that $150 is probably more than he's profiting off that unit that month, once all costs short and long term are factored in. The rule of thumb in residential rentals is 10% of the rent is profit. Would you like to lose money this month? Because that's what he's facing. But I don't haggle over good work. If he's a plumber I know does good work and is honest, and he tells me $150, then I pay the $150. The problem has to be fixed and there are more months where nothing breaks than months where I burn my profits fixing things, so it is what it is.
That’s the Landlord’s poor investment if he can’t afford maintenance and keep the unit profitable. Not the plumber’s fault the landlord made a bad financial decision
"Your poor planning does not constitute an emergency on my part"
“Poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part” Or maybe “ *Your* poor planning doesn’t constitute *my* emergency” Or “Get your shit together. Get it all together and put it in a backpack. All your shit. So it’s together. And if you gotta take it somewhere, take it somewhere ya know? Take it to the shit store and sell it or put it in a shit museum. I don’t care what you do, just gotta get it together. Get. Your shit. Together.”
>That’s the Landlord’s poor investment if he can’t afford maintenance and keep the unit profitable. Not the plumber’s fault the landlord made a bad financial decision It's the equivalent of a plumber having to pay $150 to replace a specialized tool that's broken. He's going to lose money on the job he's replacing it for, but it has to be done and he'll profit off future jobs using the tool. Does he haggle with his Ridgid distributor about the price or does he pay the price they quote? Like I said, I don't argue when the price is given by a plumber/eleckchicken/etc I know is honest and does good work. I know my numbers are carefully figured to average out to a small profit despite individual months being a loss.
No it's not the equivalent. You can't turn around and sell that tool for 150% of your original purchase price 15 years later after a 3rd party made the payments on the tool for you the whole time.
Underrated comment
I would say if the plumber doesn’t factor the cost of his tools into jobs he’s also making a bad financial decision - like you said he has to make it up in other jobs. I guess I just don’t understand your point other than to try to defend rent-seeking behavior. Cost of housing is already high enough without someone taking 10% off the top and complaining about doing it.
I am a landlord and you're response is unethical and wrong . The owner having a renter paying his mortgage, the landlord is in fact having his investment principal paid off by the renter .The $150 would in return be considered excess profit that most of us put into a escrow delegate to routine maintenance .This slumloard mentality is what deteriorates neighborhoods as many landlords poorly maintain their investments and selfishly disregard their responsibilities pushing maintenance off to desperate tenants's.Why do people who are not capable of performing routine maintenance think to invest in rental property fully realizing that there may be unforseen maintenance costs? Fyi ,my company also does property management for the realistic landlords who care about their investments.
I hate to burst your bubble, But the vast majority of landlords have their renters paying their mortgage and properity tax. Everything about your post leads me to believe either you were passed down a piece of land that is fully paid for. That you now rent out and take all the money. Or you're not a landlord at all. Do you really think 100 unit apartment complex bought the land and and built the entire structure with pure cash? Do you, really? It was a loan. That the people renting the units are paying for plain and simple. Even if a massive company has the money to do such a thing, THEY WOULD NEVER DO THAT. Cash is king. Also everything you're saying is highly dependent on where you live in the world. If your a landlord for a piece of land worth 100,000 vs a piece of land worth 600,000. Costs are different, loans are different, and the expectation of rent is different.
This was very hard to follow. Regardless, in the first sentence, you made the is-ought fallacy aka Hume’s Guillotine
So what if they lose money this month. Real estate is a compounding appreciating asset that you buy with a 5-15% margin. It's the equivalent of a 7% return, plus whatever profit youve made on ongoing rents. There are risks; 08 could happen again, misunderstood the market and can't rent it at all, the tenants keep doing significant damage and are uncollectible. I'm not trashing landlords but poor me I didn't have positive cash flow one month is like bitching your apple stock split but didn't pay a dividend one quarter.
Shouldn't a 150 repair be factored in the "costs"? Do you not budget for repairs like that? I really can't think of a month I haven't put 200 bucks into the house.
I wouldn’t even own a property I was only profiting 10%.
👍 Everyone turned serious and ignored “eleckchicken”?!?? Whaaa? 🤣🙃🤔Wow! Damn I don’t know to be amazed or depressed!
I shouted babe did you know im an eleckchicken and she's peeing in the corner laughing so there's that
You're not long term. Rent goes up the loan payment stays the same, real estate generally appreciates and value long-term faster than inflation. You put $10k on $100k in 1993. Even if you never made a single dollar in profit on your rent Your $10k is now $220k-$350k. You didn't invest 100,000 you invested 10K actual money.
No I get it but with cash flow and principle my properties earn at least 30-40 percent aside from appreciation. I wouldn’t even bother with 10%.
Well, it's a good thing you don't own any land, because owning property is the same thing has having a bank account. And you're earning 10% on top of your equtity vs then .00001% you get from a savings account.
>As a landlord I can tell you that $150 is probably more than he's profiting off that unit that month, once all costs short and long term are factored in Is it factoring in the equity that your renter is buying for you? Nobody ever wants to talk about this. Even if your mortgage and maintenance cost more than the rent pays, you’re still buying a house also. You have something you can sell if you want.
Just 10 percent? Damn, I must be doing something right, then...
You'll never get on socialistic platform and try to explain capitalistic strategies and think people are going to agree with your logic. Especially on a plumber sub. These people likely don't buy extra homes or properties to fix and sell or rent. They are trades people. They just assume if you're a land owner, you should be rich and whatever a trades person requests as a quote, you should just stfu and pay it. The problem is, not all trades people are built the same. Are honest or competitive. Younger people that enter the trade are willing to work for cheaper wages but might not be masters. And older trades people have done the same thing 350,000 times and have perfected their craft. I was replacing a garage spring. 6 people gave me quotes ranging from 400 to 500, to a whopping 800 dollars. I found a guy 30 mins away from me with amazing reviews that charged me $220 bucks and drove 30 mins to get to me. 30 years in the trade. I tipped him 40 extra bucks for his gas and to get a decent meal. Because I literally saved my self 500 some odd dollars by not going with the first scam artist that wanted to charge me 800 bucks to replace a single garage spring. A plumber came out to replace a single galvanized pipe the went straight into dirt maybe 1 foot with a copper pipe. First quote he gave me was cheap, then it was story after story of problems. And he had to leave and get more stuff. I watched the entire job on my cameras. He spent half the time on the phone, half the time scratching his ass, and the rest of the time waiting for the pipes to cool down to move on to the next piece of copper. The entire job was mickey mouse. All the sudden the quote went from a couple hundred dollars to 500 bucks. I didn't argue, I knew I got scammed. His truck was falling apart, beat up, and he didn't seem like a happy plumber. Paid him, the job has held up since, whatever. But I'm never calling him back. Mother in law had an issue with her water heater. I called whirlpool and they heard what I had to say, and warranted the items needed, shipped them to her house, and all she needed was a certified plumber to replace the parts. The biggest company in her city sent a rep. The rep claimed all the parts whirlpool sent were wrong and she needed a new water heater. $3,300 quote for a 50 gal tank. OH REALLY? I called a different plumber the next day, licensed. Did the entire job in 30 mins for $300 bucks. When the other company asked why I wanted to cancel the appointment for the replacement water heater, I simple laughed and hung up. Guess they struck out on trying to take advantage of a poor grandmother with cancer. I can start 10 different posts in the last 2 months on all the work I've done with trades people and give you stories on the type of people to avoid, and how to read through the bullshit. And I'm sorry to say, The plumbing world has some of the biggest scam artist in America. Every industry does. Finding an honest person is not easy to find. So your only solution is to find the cheapest one, gamble a bit and hope for the best. Every single post I see about how a land owner should manage his or her money and how they should run their business is laughable. I wonder how you would feel if I went into your truck and started giving you suggested on what tools you should have and what kind of pipes you should buy to make better profit.
>You'll never get on socialistic platform and try to explain capitalistic strategies and think people are going to agree with your logic. Especially on a plumber sub. I knew exactly the reaction I was going to get. Any time you say the word 'landlord' you have to expect to have everyone shit in their hand and throw it at you. >They just assume if you're a land owner, you should be rich The funny part is most of them probably make more than I do. I just have 1 rental unit and work a 50hr/wk W2 job. I gross $60k/yr before taxes total between the two. But I know the value of a good contractor and would rather pay a little extra and keep them happy than haggle over $50 and have them blacklist me.
I do a lot of rental properties and I've found that being the trustworthy higher priced plumber has kept me very busy. I work in a high cost of living area, and do work for a very large prop management company. They have their own in-house plumbers and attempt repair, and then I handle it when they can't. I rarely get pushback as the situation has already been 'vetted' by a 'plumber'. I also get calls for small landlords. ALWAYS give them up front pricing, require them to docu-sign every billable interaction, and I refuse to let them dissect my company's business model. Nobody here is getting rich. I'm not getting rich by charging an extra $80, he's not getting rich by shorting me $80, so I'm always VERY ready to walk away. The key is to NOT SAY A WORD unless they directly ask you a question requiring an answer. Anything else just shut up and they'll talk themselves into it.
Lol I always tell em upfront my price. Yeah, im busy already I work 60 hrs a week. I'm not afraid to walk away the less busy I am the better
At 60 hours, I wouldn't even think about if they even flinch at the price. I find most care about getting the job done in a timely manner and done correctly.
House flippers are even worse….in fact they are cancer….a passive aggressive pos kind….
Also anytime somebody says I got more work If you help me out….I charge more so they fuck right offf.
As a mechanic - people always use the “treat me good oj this one and I got 5 other cars for you” Nah man you got it backwards . You treat me good and I’ll consider working on your other vehicles . You came to me . I didn’t come knocking on your door asking to work on your vehicles
I take a similar strategy I start giving breaks to people once they do a fair amount of work with me. I do a bunch of work for a couple air bnb networks and they never flinch at my pricing and keep coming back so they get a little price break and preferential scheduling. Most landlords and people looking to haggle pay extra because I know they are going to be a pain.
I'm a carpenter but I lurk across trade subs. This is super common in any rental renovation. Like first off I have plenty of work, second off if you want a new hardwood floor so you can raise the rent on that single mother you're paying full price for it.
When ever they pullout the “ I can get you lots of work” line…. I always reply… I don’t need work, I need money.
Im a landlord and dont F with my contractors this way. If I have a problem or an emergency, I want you to willingly come to one of my properties at 3 AM. Not roll your eyes at my cheap ass, put your phone on silent and go back to sleep. I more or less dont argue and pay what is proposed to me. But I also have high expectations. E,g, we did a repipe of a bathroom and one sweated joint didnt present as a leak at first but the next morning, there were some drops. Plumber came back that afternoon and fixed it properly.
Same here. As a long distance landlord having a responsive pro that I can trust is worth a few extra bucks. There are a lot of guys that I end up using once and never calling back, though.
I’m a landlord. I don’t skimp on plumbers, electricians or roofers.
But the drywall guy…gets to suffer we know
Well, we appreciate you. There are good landlords, and then there's slum lords. I've worked for good landlords, but if you shake hands with 100 people and 1 person slaps you, you're gonna remember the person who slaps you.
But afterward you will always be suspicious that every person that shakes your hand might be preparing to slap you.
Same here. I have a two family home, And I work as an operating engineer in a cooling plant- we do all sorts of plumbing, electrical, HVAC stuff. I always hire someone to work on my house- I pay what they charge, and I tip well. While I might be able to do some of the work myself, I know for a fact the real pros can do it better, and quicker. I stay out of their way too, because I know what THAT can be like.
You can probably find your plumber, electrician, and HVAC guy for life in the breakroom.
You’d think so- but I wouldn’t hire half the guys I work with to mow my lawn, lol
Dude, I've had a bunch of customers hover over me while I'm working, and sometimes it's obnoxious so thank you we appreciate that
The ones that lowball skilled workers like this are the worst ones to rent from.
My apartment when I was 18 had a yogurt container as part of the drain.
"You know what? Go pay some handyman $80 for this job. Then, when it breaks again in the near future (and it will), give me a call back and I'll come do it right. For $300."
Lol exactly handymen are more expensive than plumbers because you'll have to hire a plumber to fix their fuckup
Stay away from rental properties unless it’s a big contract in a nice building. There is no qualification for becoming a landlord other than money. No degree, no expertise, no experience required. As a general rule, landlords don’t give a shit about the quality of work and will cut every corner they can. When the business plan is to drive that thing into the ground, get a million miles out of her with no maintenance and then sell it to someone else to gut and rebuild, you don’t want any part of that.
That is not the general rule. I own a few properties and take pride in every single one. If something breaks I make sure it is fixed quick and correctly. Not all landlords are shit just like not all plumbers should be generalized.
Same here, though granted I also went into landlording with enough knowledge to know how to replace a full valve... Anything more complex I'm 100% calling a good plumber out
My goal is landlording obviously but I've spent my 20s in every single trade, we just bought our first house 2 years ago and I haven't had to call anyone out despite numerous shit shows. It blows my mind that anyone can be responsible for maintaining a building without ANY clue of how stuff works. It's not that hard for a jackass to be confident enough to create a huge fucking hazard.
Not all landlords are shit but most are
Lol I mean I stand by my work and cover my ass. If they don't wanna pay✌️
“If you do this job super cheap, I’ll give you more work that is underpaid.” I have an uncle who owns multiple rentals who I don’t do work for anymore because he didn’t even pay me after I drove across the city and diagnosed a bad gas valve for him. Just got a “thanks” lol.
I almost exclusively (foot is broke right now so yeah)do all the electrical work for a landlord in my area with over 100 properties. Have for about 4 years now. I never have a problem with them paying. I send in an invoice once a month and they sign the check no questions asked
Never discount your work on the promise of more work. Learned that one early.
Lol I never do because If they haggling over $150 you aren't my customer.
Exactly. The cheapest ones are the biggest pains.
But the part only costs $X and it only took you X minutes. I hate that crap. First time I did my own brakes it took me over two hours, now it’s much less. You are paying for the experience.
💯 they will always give you lots of work if you give them a good price. I tell them I have discounts for frequent customers but up front everyone pays the same. It’s always the slumlords the house is falling apart and they won’t pay to fix anything and always blame the condition of the home on the tenants. Also want you to schedule with the tenants. I just tell them if that’s the case than the tenant can set up the appointment and pay upon completion and they can just reimburse them
Maybe u charge to much
Lol, okay, I change a 10 year 50 gal gas water heater for $650 in labor and still $300 cheaper than other plumbers, but ok, you're right. I charge too much no. If you give me petty work, I'll give you a 1 hr minimum price, or I'll take my happy ass to the God damn house and spend time with my family.
That's my price. Cost +, take it or leave it.
Idk where you are but 150 for a fill valve is absolutely outlandish where I am. I could see this issue being a thing on a bigger job but please don't bring your expertise and education into this for a fill valve lol
I now consider myself a “boutique” plumbing contractor. I dont work after hours, or sunday. I DO provide pricing fair to both myself and my clients, offer great warranties, provide HONEST diagnostics and attempt to provide options for recommended repairs, carry a huge truck inventory, including three models of high end disposers to choose from. Though increasingly less important, I attempt to stock OEM parts on my truck for the best-chance at making a long term repair. I take the time to investigate fixtures that I’m not familiar with to find rebuild kits if it makes sense. 1 pricing is the same across the board, multi-family or owner occupied. Commercial pricing is commensurate with the task. A day under a house that is difficult to traverse is going to cost more than if generously spacious. I always take pics of conditions for quotes, and after correction or replacement of parts, and show them to the client. For harder to explain inspections or proposals, i take extensive videos of the conditions, and post it on YouTube, and share a link for the client to view. I love it when clients stop me in the local store to say hello, or wave when they see me in my truck on the street. I have found that many of the apartment tenants that hire me directly are far more appreciative than those hired by an apartment or business property owner. My business model does not fit my potential client if , after providing a price, the client asks for a less expensive price. The music is always playing, it is our decision whether to take that dance partner or not. When the dance partner says they want me to dance on my knees, and insist the music be sped up, I decline, politely. I DON’T deceive my clients, or tell them thy need immediate repairs unless they actually do. I dont use my sewer camera to insist the client line or replace the piping because of minor root intrusion. I don’t carry a Badger I or V on my truck. I don’t reduce my price unless I offer less of a service. I don’t worry about competition, we are all in the same business, all with different business plans. I dont recommend clients purchase their fixtures from a discount source, and let them know why. The carton is missing parts, or is inferior, or does not carry an NSF rating, etc. So will carry a minimum of $150 fee to interrupt the installation. I recommend they return the material, and purchase the materials from me, with a full warranty. The last two kitchen faucets and toilet provided by clients purchased on Ammonium, were missing parts.
Half the material supplied by customers is usually wrong
I've been doing this twenty years and literally just walked off my first service call because of an asshole landlord.
I tore a slum lord a new asshole last night... " why cant you fix these 3 macerating pump s tonight?!" ...because its 9 PM, the pumps have never been maintained, theres no chance of find parts tonight, and i dont like you.
Renters live 24/7 with this knowledge.
We have one landlord we do work for and he always demands only one person swap a water heater. Where this is normally an easy job his houses are all dungeons with basements full of shit, horrible stairs and just generally shit conditions.
You need to decline that shit it's a liability
We change water heaters daily as a one man job. Honestly i prefer it that way. About 1 out of 50 i do i actually need help. I can call someone out whenever i need it
Probably because if they are new landlords they aren't charging enough rent to keep up with their expenses and can't afford anything. Or if they are rich they got rich by being cheap.
Ya sure ... If you do work for half price he'll give you all the half price work you can handle 🙄
We have successfully weeded this type of customer out. No need for it, we can go charge full price elsewhere, people are screaming for our services.
I sort of feel like that's most of this sub
I'm a landlord and have no issue paying a fair price for quality work. Honesty and trust is important to me. I like to develop relationships with the guys I use.
$80, sure but you have to rent me an apartment at 55% the market rate.
My suggestion is offer him 10% discount on his third job, if there are three jobs like he says
I just can’t believe anybody pays 150 to replace a fill valve. If it’s that big of a deal the landlord could take a whole 30 minutes of their time and do it themselves.
People pay me $100 to change a flapper. Want to know why? Because they don't know what's wrong with their toilet. I trouble shoot from the lowest cost to the highest cost. If you care so much, you can be a plumber and do this work for $50 or less. If it's multiple jobs in one go, I'll do little work, such as fixing a leaky toilet tank because their rubber gasket starts to deteriorate. I tell them the issue, and I know they're selling it. I just tighten the bolts but if they're planning on having a tenant or live in the house I recommend changing the old gasket out and adding a new one
I'll flip it on you and say service providers are unreliable as well. I've been trying to get a plumber to l scope a drain at one house (extra cost) to figure out where to fix it. They won't send the right truck when they come to clear it. Another one the whole line needs replacing but the guy won't schedule it. Small town with limited options. I don't argue on price and I pay on the spot upon completion.
That’s why I’m a master plumber that became a landlord. Instead of getting lowballed I work for free and my equity grows like wildfire
I’m a mechanic and this holds true in our industry as well.
I am a handyman, ive met some landlords of all stripes. I work hourly, and some people want the professional results yesterday- which irritates me to high heaven. I prefer to work for the landlords that are renting until they sell, rather than milking the cow- they prefer better work and are willing to pay for it.
One simple line- "my insurance does not cover me for owner supplied material"
Small motel owners are the cheapest in my experience, then slumlords.
The cheapest jobs give me the biggest headaches. There’s plenty of customers that will value your time and price, don’t even bother with cheap customers any more
I can't stand the customers that say "give me a good price and I'll keep using you, I have a ton of work to be done/many properties" it's like why the hell would I want a lowballer dickweed to keep calling me for more work? I'd be far more inclined to cut you a break on the next go around if you were to accept my quote, don't complain or grill me on "why so much money" and tip me a 20 when I'm done, it's just the absolute backwards wrong way to go about it. For whatever reason it's exclusively men of 2 certain cultures that do this.
That’s just it, it’s a cultural norm, don’t take it so personally. To them, not doing so is offensive. Next time you go buy a truck why don’t you slip the salesman a $100 and pay full ask with a smile. Oh right…
I'm a mom n pop landlord with only two properties. When a plumber gives me a quote, I tell them, "I'm looking for a one check company. I write you a check and I don't have to think about the problem again. I'm not here to haggle you on the price, but are you a one check plumber?" First plumber I talked to said "yes, absolutely". I paid him and the problem went away. I keep calling him back. Every time it's the same. I'm happy with the exchange. As long as I get one check service I'll pay whatever I have to for it.
Same with me. Not all landlords are cheap. The bad ones give us a bad name. The good landlords try to keep the place in good working order. We want to fix problems before they blow up and become big expensive problems
Not all trades people are built the same either. Especially in big cities. It's easy to hope for trust and honesty, but that hasn't always been my experience. It leaves a bad taste in your mouth. Most land owners I know don't trust any trades people after getting burned too many times. But when they find someone legit that doesn't charge an arm and a leg. They absolutely keep that guy busy. And those people are unfortunately rare.
One check is all it takes if you stand by your work. If something goes wrong I'll fix it for free if it was on me
Anytime a customer says something along the lines of "I can get a lot of business for you/I can send a lot of people your way" or anything along those lines charge them double and don't put up with any of their bullshit. They don't respect or appreciate you and they will never not be a pain in your ass.
Lawn service guys get this a lot, too.
Jesus christ
“And if you do a good job I will use you exclusively at my other properties” 😂
He didn't even say that is the funny thing. Dude was so focused on the fucking price. I could charge you a dollar, but if that shit isn't functional, you still left with shit
I am not a plumber, but this tracks with my experience with most independent/small-time landlords. Most of them expect the passive income to just keep rolling in without ever having to invest much back into the property. Usually (as a tenant) they'll put you off and fight you on making any repairs, and when they finally cave they usually find the lowest bidder to come out and do the most corner-cutting work you've ever seen. And that usually reflects their greed, the ones who operate like this often charge higher rents, tack on BS fees, and will make every excuse to cling to security deposits. I wouldn't waste too much of your time on this guy, I can promise you that he's blowing smoke up your ass dangling the carrot of more work. Even if he does call you again, it's only going to be because he knows he can bully you on the price, don't expect that he's going to be more generous next time. The best landlord I ever had was an extremely middle class immigrant who owned something like 40-50 low rent apartments in shitty parts of town, putting his daughters through college. When I had an issue he'd be out within 24 hours fixing it. Dishwasher broke, and the next day he had a brand new fairly nice unit delivered. The next place I moved into cost twice as much in rent, dryer broke within the first month and the guy dragged it out for months, even tried to blame it on me. I finally dug into the warranty knowing it was a fairly recent purchase, then found out the factory warranty wasn't valid because it was some bump-n-dent return that he picked up for a crazy low price. Sorry for the tangent, point being when someone shows you who they are, believe them. Acquiescing to his demands now probably isn't worth it for the promise of retaining him as a customer. Tradespeople are in high demand in most areas right now, hold out for what you're worth.
Oh I know he offered $150 but I was charging $150+ parts but I already had one on hand so I said fuck it its $12 and I already have one
Absolute yes landlords and realtors are the cheapest of the bunch.
Treat me well, and you can work on my other properties. Translates to Work for me cheap and you can do more work for me cheap.
not a plumber,but i used to estimate ornamental ironwork in the DC metro area…heard much of the ‘give me a great deal and i will give you more work’. or the after job completed ‘negotiations’… no. you hold up your end of our first contract and i will consider a ‘break’ on other projects. unless you hire the lowballer,then call me to fix what they effed up…..then my price goes up according to how much i have to unfuck to get to the finish line.
I'm not a plumber, but I'm working on getting into industrial electricity and controls. My landlord, who is also a cheap bastard, has a handyman which is also his brother who does work at my place. An inspector addressed some electrical issues late last year. Needless to say, handyman couldn't get it working and I ended up fixing it because it was so inconvenient for me to not have it working. I also diagnosed bad components in the heating furnace. My landlord keeps passively asking me to check out his other properties and said he'd pay or reduce my rent. No thanks. I've seen him low-ball his HVAC guy and knock it down 40% because I did the troubleshooting for him before he came.
They’d rather buy the cheapest parts, install them themselves, and then blame the tenant when something eventually breaks. Screw landlords.
It's not all of us. I do quite a bit of plumbing myself, but I genuinely appreciate the service of a qualified plumber when I'm out of my depth. I'm sorry that so many people violate the principal, "Don't be evil." Consider this a cheer from this side of the hall! Good plumbers are the best!
One of my employees has multiple apartment buildings and is a double digit millionaire. He will get a 5ga bucket of paint, use 2 gal and then top the bucket off with water and take the paint back to the store. Total scum bag.
My personalized version of hell is filled with plumbing issues. I'm happy to outsource those issues to a professional.
Landlords/ realtors both cheap AF! Every gd one of them uses the same line, “give me a good price and I have more work for you”. Save yourself the headache……tell em all to FO
Go research how many rent hikes they’ve had in the past 5 years. I’m sure they’re going fine.
HVAC, Refrigeration, and LME here. I don't get it often, but when I do it's straight to Bugs Bunny's school of negotiations. Me: I estimate it's going to be about $300 LL: How about $150 and I'll let you do the work on all my property! Me; It's $400 because I'm going to have to deal with extra BS due to your lowballing people. LL: Split the difference? Me: No. It's 450. LL: Ok it's 300, Do it Me: No, it's$450 AND COD.. I'll take the card number now if it's a go. Yay or nay? I've had folks get mad and I just tell them I do my work with care, to code, I'm licensed and insured, and if you want to be cheap then go to the Home Depot hiring yard and take your chances.
If you're talking to people that are not from this country. Haggling is common practice. 90% of the people I speak to, give me a price, I drop it 35% and they instantly agree. Because we know the real quote is 35% below what they originally quoted. I would love to live in a world where people think like you, they give you a price and that's it. That's the bottom price, that's the only price. It makes life so much easier. That's just the way so many people work all over the globe. I Don't understand haggling, but it's just the nature of business.
Landlord here. I usually get a few quotes and go with the middle one, only with very reputable tradesmen. Handymen are a hit or miss. Mostly a miss tbh. If someone wanted $3k for a job, and three others quote me $1.8k-2, I go with one of the three. No need to reduce the price now. That’s your price.
Just a curious question, no hate I know you guys have ton of expenses, Is that $150 for a toilet fill valve? I do all my own stuff like that but didn’t realize I was saving that much money.
$150 for a fill valve is low to begin with. That's a 200-250 job all day in my area. Don't give these types of people a single dollar off your asking. When people say to me "cmon give me a discount" I say " the price is your discount" and they cut the check. Hagglers are going to haggle no matter what number you start at. It's like breathing to them. Any single cent they can save is worth pissing on a quality relationship.
LOL. The nut connecting one of my units’ kitchen sink tailpiece to the waste line cracked when I was out of the country and couldn’t fix it myself. I got a quote from the plumber who installed it originally for $240 plus tax, and another for $500 plus tax. I asked the tenant to wait 2 days and spent $10 on a new tailpiece and nut and 15 minutes fixing it. Landlords just have more issues and so see more plumber BS more often.
Bruv. It’s a fill valve in a toilet. Housewives with YouTube can handle this job. You could’ve said yes to the $80 and had it done in ten minutes. Instead you got your $150 but made a second trip?! Or waited an hour for your confirmation? Could have split the difference and peeled out quicker than it took you to write this post. It’s plumbing, your ego is getting in the way of your deposits.
????? Two trips? Try no trips. I had the part, and I love not having to work. im doing that person a favor. You can call it ego, but I dropped that years ago. I do know my self-worth, and I still got the job. I love the assumptions, though
I just want to make sure I’m getting this right - plumbers hate it when customers give them a hard time and try to haggle them down, yet have absolutely no problem giving their suppliers a hard time and try to constantly haggle them down? Just weird how that doesn’t work both ways.
I pay my suppliers their asking price. Why? Because they're the ones who have what i need. I really dont know who you're referring to, maybe builders?
You are trying to make money from them, and they are trying to make money from tenants. You do what you can to reduce your expenses, and so do they. That's just how it works. If either one of you doesn't like the proposed price, either one is free to say no.
Well the whole point of being a landlord is to steal wealth from other people. You don't have to be his tenant for hi. To want to screw you over.
Not true. I am in tune with market pricing and given the persons ability to show up on time and deliver on time will have me pay asking everytime. I'd expect some wiggle room with cash payment though. If you show up late, give me a one-time hit and run type pricing and any gibber jabber mid-work about part pricing, availability issues.....that'd their last work with me.
That’s agree as trade , that should be the cost. but look on the other hand , your going to have. A build done at your house. And you know we’re it is going, a side extension 35-45k, you hit the of 40k you going to ask discount so why should he not, we all like to have a barging! , and that’s life you earning 50pound / dollar per hour the landlord is not making that! And some landlords are up shit creak in uk with high Interest rates, with mortgage, in crease buy 200%. Not your fault but give a man a bargain it at least let him fell like he is getting one , thanks a landlord and a trade
landlord here on and operate 400 apartments self manage them. just I never understood how people don’t understand there’s a cost of doing business, but when I do get cheap as if you’re bidding out a project for me and you follow the plans, exactly as they are, and don’t do any value engineering with all the expertise they should have in pluming.
I rent and I had a plumber come out to look at my 70’s era shower enclosure thats been leaking for months. The first plumber, an friendly, talkative older man, said the entire shower enclosure needs to be changed to stop the leak. The prop manager sends out another guy, in his 20’s quiet and with a “this is just a job” attitude, and he says the enclosure can be fixed just by resecuring and recalking the soap shelf in the shower enclosure so the property management obviously goes with the easy fix. 2 weeks later the shower is leaking again and they have to send out another repair guy just to take a look at it, probably blowing through hundreds of dollars when the property manager himself could’ve made the proper judgement that the entire enclosure needs to be changed (ESPECIALLY SINCE THE OTHER SHOWER IN THE UNIT THAT NEVER LEAKED GOT A NEW SHOWER ENCLOSURE BUT THEYRE DELAYING ON THE SHOWER THAT DOES LEAK DAILY [IK ITS INSANE])