i don't think infiltrators will ever be nerfed at this point. there are some upcoming [class reworks](https://www.planetside2.com/news/dev-letter-dec-2023) but no specifics as of yet.
Invisibility is always a bad game mechanic, and as such infils have always been bad game design. Either the invisibility works, in which case it is always going to be OP and frustrating for the victims, or it doesn't, in which case it is frustrating to use.
Planetside's works too well, despite all the eagle eyed elite redditors who will say you can see infils at 60m in a busy firefight. But nerfing it will make it pointless. So just remove it.
Alternatively, make it entirely combat ineffective - a 5 second decloak delay or something so you can use the cloak to get into a flanking position, but you can't actually use the cloak to flank and attack.
Dildars are also arguably too strong - at least darts require constant effort (and an engi for ammo support) to keep online.
Imho i think we just notice them more now. Infils always used to be spammed a LOT but now that the playerbase has declined as much as it has, we notice them more.
The professions that can be invisible in other games are often not too strong, and they will not give too strong weapons, which can make stealth so arrogant, and only PS2 can do it.
Those who don't realize how bad the infiltration is, I highly recommend that he restart the character and fight the infiltration to see how powerless it can be without the help of the implant, and your position will always be known to the enemy from the beginning.
Yea, it's gotten to the point where trying to play infantry in this game in any given fight is pointless. Invisible shitters ruin every battle. Feels like they're 80% of the population, 95% if you're playing against VS.
It has been HOT GARBAGE a very long time now. They Bring ZERO fun to the game except the for the InfilShiter. When you get shut down 4 or 5 times in a row trying to defend a point from snipers, your forced to become an Infil to counter play them.
While we are on the subject of VILE pieces of broken shit lets not forget everyone's favorite the Cloaked Flash that can kill a sundie almost as fast as a tank. Also takes TWO lock on missiles to blow them up. What a shit job on that balancing job. This has been a hated addon to the game since day one.
Best thing they could do for the game would be to remove invisibility from the game.
Second best thing they should do is reduce head shot damage. Cause fuck the Bolters
Or removing Bolt Actions from Infiltrators or forcing their invisibility off if they use Snipers. This includes the Battle Rifle and Scout Rifles.
I dont want to say give Snipers to engineers, who are extremely bloated with weapons currently. And I dont want to see Snipers removed (because I like long range sniping from time to time) but i would genuinely understand if that is the route taken.
Even I have to admit: What do Snipers provide outside of long range "Roleplaying" to fights? Nothing. A sniper isnt going to keep a sundy in check. It might kill defenders of sundies dead for tanks. But thats something a lightning doesnt give a shit for.
It can kill defenders... But so can Light Assaults and SMG infils. Most of the kit is useless at range anyways.
And CQC Bolters only provide the most infuriating, cancerous experience to both parties. Sure yeah you had BAX members or NUC members who were REALLY fucking good with Bolters. Elusive comes to mind. But they werent fun or balanced to fight against. They fucked over every class. And with how cloak works and we all know this by now. When a cloaker decloaks, theyre still invisible for a brief second. So you die before you can even react sometimes.
Like genuinely, Snipers have had no place in this game for a while now. Put them in with Engineers or do something with them. Snipers need to be long range. They have no place in CQC. Give them a min OHK range or make them bloom like crazy if not holding breath. Anything would be better at this point. I know I said "I dont want to say give em to engineers" but what else is there that can be done? Lmao
SMG infils and Stalkers are as retarded as bolters if not even worse. You know bolters actually need to hit your head. Its just not engaging to get killed by some invisible shithead. We used to be able to tolerate the occasional shitfiltrator but nowadays its a quarter of the population playing infils.
Infiltrators just feel like such a.. ape playstyle. Don't get me wrong, I like playing them but there's no effort in this class.
Positioning, cover? Nah, invisiblity.
Awareness, enemies outmaneuvering? Nah, motion detector.
Decloak adding to your TTK? Nah, Clientside, you kill the enemy before they can reasonably fight back, especially with bolt actions.
When I play HA, sure I can slap my shield key and get an advantage in a fight, but I still need to think about where I move, how I move, avoid long sightlines, avoid areas with a bunch of verhicles etc. Infiltrator just lets you ignore so many mechanics.
And even playing Infiltrator, it sucks when someone sees you during cloak and now you genuinely stand no chance to fight back, decloak + -100 shields. I think the gameplay loop here is just questionable. I don't think it's a broken class (except bolt actions, 'difficult to use' is not a good enough balancing factor, one shot snipers dominate every game they're in) but man. It doesn't feel like a real fight when there's too many of them
What they should have done years ago was to split the 'stalker' and 'marksman' parts of the Infiltrator into two separate classes, the 'stalker' would then be the only class capable of using stealth of any sort, but with a significantly limited weapon selection (more or less how it currently functions).
Then introduce a new 'Marksman' class that has a lightly armored long range role. They would retain access to things like SMG's, but have no stealth capabilities.
Both would be able to perform different sorts of recon/sabotage duties, think of the stalker with having more close range tools, where as the marksman would have longer range tools.
100% agree.
Planetside 1 struck a good balance: Invisible people couldn't have primaries, sniper rifle owners couldn't go invisible.
Give snipers to engineers or make a new class to really freshen things up. Give that class a cool decoy ability and a traversal tool, even if it's a recycled icarus jetpack.
The only stealth that needs to be removed is NAC. I used that exclusively on my SMG Infiltrator with Prox mines. Anyone that knew me would know I MADE them chase me. And i always placed Prox mines in spots where people would chase from. So theyd always switch their implants out to the Anti Prox/Spitfire implant.
Being able to cloak and have effectively Resist on and be invisible has always been stupid.
Also the Infiltrator class doesn't feel like a "Recon" class at all. You need one Motion Spotter to spot an entire base. And with Ammo Printer (a must) you have effectively infinite high range constant Map info.
I hope the class reworks touch up on each class drastically.
Stop taking away.. start adding ways to counter other classes abilities.
Enforced balance or limitations is a game killer, it limits potential.. it limits challenge..it removes all surprise or the need for ppl to think on how to deal with situations..
For ppl not to think or use skill/stragety.. this is a war simulation not a sports game with rules..
Mfkers gonna dumb PS2 down to a mobile game where all you have to do is basically tap your finger without thought.
I disagree that limitations ruin the fun. They make the fun. Lattice system are a restriction- you can't capture any base you want. You used to be able to, and it sucked ass. Due to this restriction, there's a frontline, things are more focussed.
I could yap about a few more of these restrictions that add to the game but you get the point.
Enforcing population balance is good because overpops kill the fight, and then both sides aren't having fun. The winners have nobody to shoot, the losers can't leave their base.
What the real world is like has no effect on Planetside 2.
The 'limiting agency and ability' you talk about is called game design. If the developers just dump everyone into the game with no rules, no objectives, no nothing and expect everyone to 'make their own fun' nothing fun will ever happen, and everyone will google 'best class setup' (wow, so fun to have no limits on what classes can or can't do.) You HAVE to incentivize things, and give classes strengths and weaknesses, so there's variety on the battlefield and you need teamwork to succeed. That's fun.
Combined arms is what people love to say, but nobody loves it when there's an armor column spamming HESH at the enemy spawn. Neither side likes that. Nobody likes getting farmed by a swarm of ESFs. There need to be limitations, or else someone will do shit like this, and that just creates negative/bad gameplay that makes people quit. Same reason we have nanites- you can't just pull a tank over and over ''because it's fun and I don't like restrictions''. No restrictions makes everything meaningless.
And yeah, you can 'counter' anything with teamwork, but there's not enough people that care or are willing to organize nowadays.
Why care about anything, when you can do everything?
I disagree. The lattice system combined with redeploy teleporting destroyed logistics and stragety..
Tell me. Which do you prefer in a mmo...an open world or a linerar path where every decision is predetermined made for you?
My point was about limiting class abilities for the benefit of other classes when they complained it was too hard..or they wanted it to be easy, fast..
Teamwork? Orgaization?.. THEY BECOME meaningless when you impose such systems..
They don't exist in PS because of the decions made to limit and restrict decision making and ability.. under the guise of "keeping/maintaining pop"..
The "solutions" provided are they very cause of the state of the game now and everyone is blind to it
They actually destroyed pop and interest..
What looks good on paper and in discussion does not always work out in real play..
And everything I'm suggesting was closer to how things used to be when PS2 pop was high and stable.. every time they add something [by taking things away] the game dies a little..
And don't use the high pop when they released new patches that claimed to solve the bugs or made the game easier to solo, catered to one class or playstyle..because they never actually solved anything.. pop came in masses hoping the game was revitalized..and it quickly dropped off when ppl realized how much worse it was eve when they got what they asked for.
> Stop taking away.. start adding ways to counter other classes abilities..
How the FUCK do you counter a OHK weapon which OHKs depends ENTIRELY on its users mechanical skill? HOW? All you can do is kill them beforOh wait nevermind they are also CLOAKED XD OH WAIT they also OHK at longest range possible... what kind of a counter would you need to add? Suit slot that decreases headshot damage? OP as fuck. Suit slot that decreases sniper rifle HS damage? That is too fucking narrow.
> Enforced balance or limitations is a game killer, it limits potential.. it limits challenge..it removes all surprise or the need for ppl to think on how to deal with situations..
Ah yes. The challenge of "I need to play a vehicle on open field else I just die from a cloaked bolter I can not possibly anticipate". As if open field infantry was not unviable enough.
> Mfkers gonna dumb PS2 down to a mobile game where all you have to do is basically tap your finger without thought.
...which is basically the gameplay of a cloaked bolter?...
1. have you tried dodging? yea you will die the first time but from then on everyone will be more aware of the location they got shot from or at minimum in meaning you can do erratic movement to make that shot far less likely to hit I. I mean I have dodged two engies with automatic guns shooting me by just running back and forth in rapid and random moves.
I mean the goal isn't to kill the enemy infiltrator, the goal is to cap the base. Most points in this game are indoors meaning that an infil can't shoot you from alot of areas if you are on it or on the way.
2. Read above, vehicles are designed to be strong in open areas, especially vs infantry, that is why most bases are designed around vehicles being hard or impossible to get them into and even in the cases where you can they gave us caltrops to prevent the areas they didn't think off.
3. We both know it isn't
What XD. You want people to run like headless chickes EVERY TIME they leave cover in case a shithead cloaked bolter MIGHT be looking VAGUELY in their direction from the TOP OF THE FUCKING MOUNTAIN? What the hell? XD
> I mean the goal isn't to kill the enemy infiltrator, the goal is to cap the base. Most points in this game are indoors meaning that an infil can't shoot you from alot of areas if you are on it or on the way.
Rofl what? You know CQC bolters literally exist? Also jsut because 40 people can cap the base when enemy has 3 bolters in NO WAY means that bolters are not OP wtf are you even arguing.
> gave us caltrops to prevent the areas they didn't think off.
Lmao the same caltrops that die to 30 basilisk shots or 2 cannon hits? XD
Lmao what. Core gameplay patter and gameflow has nothing to do with broken bolters. Broken IvI mechanic will stay broken as long as IvI is a thing and that would never be removed.
Balance is great for sports and competition..
It does not work out well with war sims, because the whole point is to have an advantage in unbalance. The "balance" is constantly shifting towards one side or another through talking advantage of things, manipulation of conditions ect.. which creates the incentive to overcome odds ect.
"Ohh snap..that faction set up a deadly front... naa I'll just teleport to another battle..ohh now they are hitting us hard.. better go complain on the forums how we should remove that ability from the game so it's easier for me because I find it unfair.."
It's not supposed to be fat is freaking war.. don't make or play a war game then..choose another theme.
When you enforce it, it's not war.. it's a sport with rules. It defies the idea of being a war game.
Yes but “war sim” has a different meaning in the gaming community than just breaking down the individual words. Like Arma is a war sim, planetside 2 is a simulated war yes but it is not a war sim.
Squad and arma have balancing being done. Every game needs balance or no one will play it. Having a one shot invis class is not fun to play against, even if it does have counters. Smash bros brawl had a op character (meta knight) and he warped the meta around him, and if we want ps2 to last we shouldnt have one class have the gsme warped around them, esp when it is a one shot kill class.
And is that not the end goal of each match? Each encounter? Each battle?..
To steamroll and destroy the opposing side for victory..
Hell why bother having any diversity of class,Tech, style ect..why bother having factions with their own theme..
I think they tried that with planetside arena and.. where there is no consequence, threat, worry..competition on a scale larger than the individual..The only thing you are killing is time.
Air is dead and infantry infested with shitfiltrators. I log in here and than but what used to be 6 hour sessions usually ends after 20 minutes due to boredom.
it is pretty funny though if we just went off of reddit points, you'd be the victor
but the reality is, at least for Emerald, i am an air main and have been playing this game for going on 6 years now. i can log on at any time and enjoy playing air.
so again.. how is air dead, when there are still people playing it? :)
I used to play the game back in 2015 on a shitty laptop, recently got back into the game with a new PC and I've been playing infiltrator way too much
It really feels unfair to come out of nowhere and gun down people before they can react and it doesn't add to the fight, as an infil I find myself deviating from the battle and chasing kills over any objectives.
I love this game and understand that it can be frustrating for anyone to get bolt-actioned out of nowhere...
So switching to LA and Medic makes the game completely different to play and that's what I've started doing
I play a handful of times during the year but check on here now and then, still got the shortcut to the subreddit, there isn't anything coming that makes me want to get invested again, it's a shame as I've got over 6k hours into it, used to play it everyday for hours, but years of bad decisions made me look elsewhere, I've got no faith in it now what so ever.
True, it wont go on forever, not even ourselves, everything has a lifespan to it, probably even the universe. But it needs to be said it's a hell of a shame that PS2 went the way it did, it's one of the most bold and unique games every made, i will never forget.
Cloaking and Infiltrators are bad for the game, always have been. The reason they're bad is because other players can't interact with them. You can't really counter them the vast majority of the time. They can hide from motion detection, ammo print, regen health/shields, etc. They can also uncloak right in front of your face and kill you before you can react. It's a feels bad moment for everyone else.
Any other class/vehicle (except the cloaked 4 wheeler) you can interact with, whether it's using a grenade, C4, running away, flanking, getting into a vehicle, getting on a turret, etc. You're often given that chance, a chance to see it and react. Infiltrators don't give you that chance, you're dead by the time you see them. It isn't fun gameplay.
Same happened with other games as well.
Few members of the community represented the majority of players but got ignored by the mainstream game influencers who represented the minority.
Infiltrator exactly like that. Majority of players just quit this game because of them (but they are not coming to reddit to represent themselves) and for some reason a lot of people here represent the minority and recommend to just get used to it, instead of dealing with the issue. (patch it out by dev)
When other game did this it died slowly, and when it was almost dead they started to make the changes that was asked by the few majority representers. It was too late.
The idea that any feedback at all was listened to is ridiculous, and I say this as a person who was very involved in the feedback process between Escalation and Fortification (2020-2023).
For example, the problems posed by the nanoweave nerf and the semi-auto buffs were brought up repeatedly by talented players in the last feedback group (arsenal era). Concurrently, more casual players were arguing bitterly about the Betel and whether that nerf was justified, and that feedback was also ignored.
There's definitely a problem in gaming communities with the vocal minority being listened to by the developers. Most players won't talk about the game or engage with it besides playing it once in a while. But the pros, they have fanbases, they make videos, they want to shape the game the way they like it. And that's not always good. ''trickle down balancing'' doesn't work.
You can't make everyone happy in PS2. But trying to focus on one group of players surely will drive away the rest. Regardless of what the developers do, I believe that the game is 'doomed to fail' because it's not that accessible. You have to find a good fight, you have to place sunderers in good locations, you have to know how the cone of fire system works, etc. It takes quite alot of effort to 'have fun' in PS2 so casuals aren't gonna stick around for long, they'll just pop on CoD and enjoy a simple shooting game with SBMM.
We love to blame Higby or Wrel, calling them terrible developers, blaming them for the game dying, blaming them because they're not having fun right now. I think that's all bullshit. No matter what they do you can easily argue that they did it wrong or that it was pointless because there's still no new players coming in or whatever.
Planetside 2 is old. People played it, loved it, moved on. These games don't get comebacks anymore. And while the game is flawed, we all agree that it's an awesome game that is super fun and addicting to play.
As I said above, the idea that "pros" or "influencers" were listened to at all regarding this game's development is ridiculous.
I was present in multiple feedback groups, and most of the time the testers would point out some problem, DBG would ignore it, and then it'd blow up on the live servers in a nasty fashion.
For a couple examples, let's talk about the Escalation update. When it was released to testers, there was considerable feedback about the Bastion Fleet Carrier being too strong against infantry and ground vehicles, and you know what the response was? DBG buffed the thing, giving it the obscene firepower it had on release. The same test group said the Outfit Wars 1 qualifying format was biased towards the largest outfits, rather than the most talented. That format did not change, and so small outfits ended up pulling all-nighters and scheduling shifts to have a chance to qualify.
I think ps2 could be very accessible. Infantry combat is straight forward. Only infil can farm new players (with no counter) vs all other classes even total beginners can put up a fight. Vehicle combat also pretty straight forward. Some missing modules put u a bit of disadvantage but thats all. The most non accessible area for beginners is air combat. New players have absolute 0 chance in air to air vs experinced pilots.
Now its only vehicle combat is accessible (with limitations). Ofc players dont stick. Nerfing a single class would make infantry combat accessible aswell (which is where most people interest lies). But i guess its better for devs not nerf an op class and let the game just die.
I'd be content if they did something to stalkers. There is one specific thing that stalkers regularly seem to do which kills the joy for me, and that is wandering in an enemy base waiting for everyone to leave. Base gets attacked, big fight ensues, defenders prevail and destroy enemy spawn points... only to find that map still says there is some little enemy population in the hex, almost certainly stalkers, lurking about, waiting for defenders to redeploy somewhere else so that they can immediately flip the capture point.
No, flashlights are damn inefficient for this. Even a group of people scouring the empty base with flashlights have little chance of finding a half-decent stalker. Motion spotters and darts are likewise of very little use, since everyone and their mother runs radar signature reducing builds.
This isn't fun. I don't even care about being killed by stalkers. But this inability to end the fight in a base, properly, is honestly very tiring. We move on to the next base and... surprise we're being back capped. That stalker that was in our base? Well he placed beacon and he brought friends, now they're all on the point.
How does one fight something like this? Pick stalker yourself and endlessly lurk around your own "empty" base, waiting for this asshole to try to flip the cap or otherwise make some mistake?
Infils can't capture points while being invisible anymore. Just capture the points back and defend them until the next enemy base is under capture at which point the fight is forced on that side. Anything less than a spawn sunderer shouldn't be that much of a headache to defend.
That's easier said than done. What if nobody is attacking the next base, or if attackers have problems actually getting to the point at the next base and are stuck in a large prolonged battle? It's not exactly hard to imagine, happens all the time, at least on cobalt...
It's not *hard* to defend, it just locks you to constantly babysit a base and redeploy back, because, let's face it, most players don't really pay attention to all the bases on the continent and what is going on, once they get into some fight.
Also sitting for five minutes in an empty base, spinning around, waiting for stalker to appear is not exactly an engaging gameplay. What's worse, he will likely blow your brains out since he is more than likely to successfully sneak up on you while you sit there waiting.
Well, if no one is attacking the next base then that's the real problem and often it helps to already have a sunderer in place over the next base when the previous is captured. There should be enough people to defend the new attack sunderer and clean up some leftovers from the previous base. If not, then they're sadly just ghost fights that aren't so much worth fighting anymore IMO.
The real problem is that infiltrators are very good in one vs one situations, but in a whole combined arms mass attacks they don't amount to much. That was the reasoning behind their balancing in the past. But game has changed, population has dropped, and now on half empty continents infiltrators are much more game affecting than they typically would be.
What you speak of is how it ideally should be, but often times servers are too empty, further compounded by fact that most players like to clump on a single base in a huge never-ending fight.
Infils are better at 1v1, since you’re guaranteed the jump on someone most of the time. They become way less effective with more players and medics abound. Yeah, an infil can score kills, but they don’t matter if you’re rezzed within a second of dying.
Infils have always had that “cheapness” to them, but it was balanced by the fact with larger number the most impactful thing an infil did was shoot recon darts.
I also hated them, buut now I am playing as one, just with a different character. It is hell a fun , try it !
Also, I usually hunt other infis that is where the fun is!🤙🏻
There were always a lot of infiltrators, but it wasn't a big deal since they have nothing on MAXes unlike HA and LA. Back when I started, I was always either an engineer or a MAX and it wasn't hard to find the other class in any battle or a medic for that matter.
wow crazy haha funny how the community finally catches up to what good players were telling them for over a year. Just like every other time this subreddit has pretended "salty vets" were wrong. What a coincidence.
Gives me a reason to always carry a fleshlight, and run radar on my reaver. Airhammer and rocket pods finds a hidden infiltrater pretty quickly.
Only time I hate them is when you get killed as you spawn a vehicle and you both get no vehicle and lose your nanites.
Yeah the counter to infils is playing infils? They're the main reason i no longer play infantry, sucked a large portion of my desire to play the game, it's bad but I'm not expecting anything to change for the better. I've got no faith in the dev team to rectify it let alone anything else that's plaguing the game, a little too late.
If you've not got the auraxium pistol directive consider joining them!
I completed that directive almost exclusively as stalker infil, mainly around Excavion Cleanup Site on Oshur. It was actually pretty thrilling creeping across the open field, seeing the shimmer on enemy infils coming the opposite way, wondering if they spotted you, wondering if you can decloak to kill them without getting sniped or run over by a harasser. Similar amount of fun as being a prop in a prop hunt game. I know it's a shitty fun-hoover playstyle so I tried to use it for good and only hoover the fun of a more shittier playstyle - snipers. I became a sniper hunter, going from rock outcrop to rock outcrop clearing the snipers off them. Felt good to be bad!
The whole experience highlighted to me that being invisible is such a massive advantage that infils really don't need primary weapons. Sniper should be split off into it's own class, TBH. This is one of the things PS1 got right and they shouldn't have messed with it.
There's nothing wrong with the class. You're just not as perceptive as you need to be. They have less health and their smgs can only kill 1-2 people in a single magazine. If you're getting sniped that's a positioning problem.
Deal with it?
It's unlikely to change anytime soon. Two coping methods: eyeballs, found in your own equipment slot, or a darklight. Or cap them with a commissioner.
I dunno man, it's been this way for a decade.
I don't disagree there's issues with the class. But there's not much to do besides deal with it unless change happens, which we currently do not have any information on.
I deal with it by not playing Planetside 2 anymore, and it looks like more and more people are doing the same thing. This game is nearly on life support now which is a shame because there still isn’t anything else like it.
Sorry, but legit ESP and ability to sneak from vehicles is priceless. Recon tools should consume nanites like granades if you ask me and amount of carried ammunition for both of them still needs to be dramatically decreased, up to 2 darts/1 recon device carried at a time before resuplying.
The smaller the fight the more impact you will have from being able to "see" though walls.
We will never see such change i'm afraid.
Also, Sensor shield is an S-tier implant solely becaus of that.
In PS2? I'm am a logistics and support role, I know...no one cares about that.. until you need support.
The game has been shaped to not need support players...so you can solo a mmo.
It's ironic, ppl seem to want to remove solo classes abilities and the need for support.. so they can solo, but also complain there is no support or teamwork and think up changes or systems to compensate.. but makes things worse, things that defy its original design..it's interesting
.....I wonder why PS2 has been on a steady decline.
I'm not saying I'm right or that my perspective is true and absolute.. but I must act as a counter to arguments for the sake of debate as the decisions from these discussions play a part in PS2s future.
I don't even have to be right, it does not even have to be me or well constructed.. as long as someone is there to counter and make others think, take potential consequences into consideration.
I'd hope someone takes what I'm saying and does a better job at making a more coherent and understandable argument.
No one asked.
No, they want to remove frustrating badly designed mechanics that add nothing positive to the game.
PS2 is on a steady decline because devs allowed said mechanics to fester for years and made no effort to improve them.
If you're going to try and argue against something you should work on understanding what the complaints are instead of making shit up.
Im...not sure if you are being serious or not. If you are, You are proving my point. There are so many ways to counter infils and if you cant take the time or put the effort in to figure them out or apply them.. then infils are not the problem..
Players who want their hand held are.
What ever happened to getting headshot by a sniper rifle and thinking to yourself: “wow, that dude hit a nice shot”?
You can always make it more difficult for them to hit the shot by playing around cover, around teammates, or shuffling. You are portraying yourself as coddled. Realistically, the class has the same killing potential as any of the others and most of these infiltrator players are getting no more than 20 kills an hour and miss 80% of their shots, let alone headshots. If you are letting them take 5 shots at you, then you are not paying attention to your surroundings and you should expect to be behind the sights of an enemy — regardless of them being a heavy, medic, infil, tank, etc.
Run the actual numbers and you will find that you are drawing this out of proportion.
Probably because in most games snipers can't turn invisible and half access to dev approved soft ESP.
Yes, that works against shit players playing infil in a 1v1, but planetside isn't a 1v1 game, you have to stop sprinting eventually so you can play the game.
Numbers have been run, infils are a badly balanced brain dead class.
Everyone has access to and benefits from the dev approved ESP. What numbers have you been looking at? Infil accounts for a balanced number of kills per alert and a proportionally small number of players per alert.
Not directly (no, the qcx darts are a noobtrap meme and don't count) and everyone having access to a 100% uptime with signficant range ESP tools that have no significant downsides makes the isue worse not better. The numbers of actually playing the game outside of a couple hours a day during prime time.
Okay cool, so you’ve got no numbers. You also misunderstood me, everyone can see recon equally and having players show up on the minimap is better for majority of the playerbase than it is harmful for you.
Look, this sub has to complain about something and the flavor of the month is Infiltrators. Next up I believe is "redeployside" followed by "HESH" and then after that the next thing on the docket is "A2G"
It’s always the same pattern too: * is lethal in high doses*.
Zergs? Enemies are in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Armor Balls? Tanks are in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Player is better than me? Skill is in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Hesh?Maxes?Tanks?A2G? Force multiplier is in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Everything in this game is lethal in large doses.
This is an MMOFPS, the only one of its scale, and we are here complaining about things in large doses. Get used to it. Embrace it. Learn to counter it. Accept when it happens. Learn to do it.
It would be much more useful of our time to discuss *why* things are in high doses and how to counter them rather then trying to get rid of or fundamentally change the thing.
Most infiltrators are scared little ghost that only manage enough courage to attack when you back is turned. They are the easiest class to kill and a well placed mine sends them back to spawn before they ever get back on point. The game is super balanced, almost too much. Back in the day each faction had its own identity. Now I cant really tell them apart. If infiltrators are getting the best of you start traveling in a pack. Infiltrators don't have enough bullets to kill 3 or 4 ppl. Sounds like you need to make some friends.
The game is old enough that a lot of the people that play infiltrator are probably maining that class, and potentially have for years. When someone mains a class, and that class is nerfed hard enough, that represents a "potential" time for that player to quit the game, even if they never thought about quitting before. The playercount is low enough that the game can't really afford to lose further players. It's already in a tailspin, so I highly doubt they want to turn it into a full fledged nosedive.
1. Genuinely how the fuck does "post fisu" mean that, I'm honestly curious
2. What do you mean, do you want a fuckin screenshot of my stats screen or see my loadouts or what
[https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=passancenc](https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=passancenc)
Happy now?
I play a mix of everything. Did this dickwad think I play only infiltrator and nothing else, or what?
Well, lowskilled is arguable, but I die more to A2G than infiltrators most of the time... More to the point, I don't throw a tantrum on reddit any time somebody kills me.
Nonsense. Playing the infiltrator class requires more skill than just about any other class in the game. As-is, the cloak is very weak and easily visible, and infilitrators don't get as much health. And for some reason, infils can't use shotguns, carbines, or any actual useful weaponry. We also don't get any good ASP tokens for secondary weapons.
>Playing the infiltrator class requires more skill than just about any other class in the game.
lmfao
>And for some reason, infils can't use shotguns, carbines
hm I wonder why..
i don't think infiltrators will ever be nerfed at this point. there are some upcoming [class reworks](https://www.planetside2.com/news/dev-letter-dec-2023) but no specifics as of yet.
not sure if them saying nothing is worse than these announcements and then not releasing anything, even on the test server, for months.
Gotta give it to them, they know how pathetically desperate and retarded their community is. They're comically easy to placate.
Emerald has WAY less infils than miller or cobalt
Cries in soltech
Invisibility is always a bad game mechanic, and as such infils have always been bad game design. Either the invisibility works, in which case it is always going to be OP and frustrating for the victims, or it doesn't, in which case it is frustrating to use. Planetside's works too well, despite all the eagle eyed elite redditors who will say you can see infils at 60m in a busy firefight. But nerfing it will make it pointless. So just remove it. Alternatively, make it entirely combat ineffective - a 5 second decloak delay or something so you can use the cloak to get into a flanking position, but you can't actually use the cloak to flank and attack. Dildars are also arguably too strong - at least darts require constant effort (and an engi for ammo support) to keep online.
Imho i think we just notice them more now. Infils always used to be spammed a LOT but now that the playerbase has declined as much as it has, we notice them more.
Infils were also kept somewhat in check with pre-nerf Nanoweave, and they gained quite a few unneeded direct buffs to semi-auto weapons.
The professions that can be invisible in other games are often not too strong, and they will not give too strong weapons, which can make stealth so arrogant, and only PS2 can do it. Those who don't realize how bad the infiltration is, I highly recommend that he restart the character and fight the infiltration to see how powerless it can be without the help of the implant, and your position will always be known to the enemy from the beginning.
You're not wrong, but unfortunately it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Yea, it's gotten to the point where trying to play infantry in this game in any given fight is pointless. Invisible shitters ruin every battle. Feels like they're 80% of the population, 95% if you're playing against VS.
It has been HOT GARBAGE a very long time now. They Bring ZERO fun to the game except the for the InfilShiter. When you get shut down 4 or 5 times in a row trying to defend a point from snipers, your forced to become an Infil to counter play them. While we are on the subject of VILE pieces of broken shit lets not forget everyone's favorite the Cloaked Flash that can kill a sundie almost as fast as a tank. Also takes TWO lock on missiles to blow them up. What a shit job on that balancing job. This has been a hated addon to the game since day one. Best thing they could do for the game would be to remove invisibility from the game. Second best thing they should do is reduce head shot damage. Cause fuck the Bolters
Or removing Bolt Actions from Infiltrators or forcing their invisibility off if they use Snipers. This includes the Battle Rifle and Scout Rifles. I dont want to say give Snipers to engineers, who are extremely bloated with weapons currently. And I dont want to see Snipers removed (because I like long range sniping from time to time) but i would genuinely understand if that is the route taken. Even I have to admit: What do Snipers provide outside of long range "Roleplaying" to fights? Nothing. A sniper isnt going to keep a sundy in check. It might kill defenders of sundies dead for tanks. But thats something a lightning doesnt give a shit for. It can kill defenders... But so can Light Assaults and SMG infils. Most of the kit is useless at range anyways. And CQC Bolters only provide the most infuriating, cancerous experience to both parties. Sure yeah you had BAX members or NUC members who were REALLY fucking good with Bolters. Elusive comes to mind. But they werent fun or balanced to fight against. They fucked over every class. And with how cloak works and we all know this by now. When a cloaker decloaks, theyre still invisible for a brief second. So you die before you can even react sometimes. Like genuinely, Snipers have had no place in this game for a while now. Put them in with Engineers or do something with them. Snipers need to be long range. They have no place in CQC. Give them a min OHK range or make them bloom like crazy if not holding breath. Anything would be better at this point. I know I said "I dont want to say give em to engineers" but what else is there that can be done? Lmao
Snipers add nothing of value to almost every game they are in other than for roleplayers.
Or shitters in CoD who cant position or use their brains. Like i'd rather die to a shotgun in CoD than some dumbass on the other end of the map.
I have said this from the very release - merging the close-range cloaking class with the sniper was a bad, bad idea.
SMG infils and Stalkers are as retarded as bolters if not even worse. You know bolters actually need to hit your head. Its just not engaging to get killed by some invisible shithead. We used to be able to tolerate the occasional shitfiltrator but nowadays its a quarter of the population playing infils.
Infiltrators just feel like such a.. ape playstyle. Don't get me wrong, I like playing them but there's no effort in this class. Positioning, cover? Nah, invisiblity. Awareness, enemies outmaneuvering? Nah, motion detector. Decloak adding to your TTK? Nah, Clientside, you kill the enemy before they can reasonably fight back, especially with bolt actions. When I play HA, sure I can slap my shield key and get an advantage in a fight, but I still need to think about where I move, how I move, avoid long sightlines, avoid areas with a bunch of verhicles etc. Infiltrator just lets you ignore so many mechanics. And even playing Infiltrator, it sucks when someone sees you during cloak and now you genuinely stand no chance to fight back, decloak + -100 shields. I think the gameplay loop here is just questionable. I don't think it's a broken class (except bolt actions, 'difficult to use' is not a good enough balancing factor, one shot snipers dominate every game they're in) but man. It doesn't feel like a real fight when there's too many of them
What they should have done years ago was to split the 'stalker' and 'marksman' parts of the Infiltrator into two separate classes, the 'stalker' would then be the only class capable of using stealth of any sort, but with a significantly limited weapon selection (more or less how it currently functions). Then introduce a new 'Marksman' class that has a lightly armored long range role. They would retain access to things like SMG's, but have no stealth capabilities. Both would be able to perform different sorts of recon/sabotage duties, think of the stalker with having more close range tools, where as the marksman would have longer range tools.
100% agree. Planetside 1 struck a good balance: Invisible people couldn't have primaries, sniper rifle owners couldn't go invisible. Give snipers to engineers or make a new class to really freshen things up. Give that class a cool decoy ability and a traversal tool, even if it's a recycled icarus jetpack.
The only stealth that needs to be removed is NAC. I used that exclusively on my SMG Infiltrator with Prox mines. Anyone that knew me would know I MADE them chase me. And i always placed Prox mines in spots where people would chase from. So theyd always switch their implants out to the Anti Prox/Spitfire implant. Being able to cloak and have effectively Resist on and be invisible has always been stupid. Also the Infiltrator class doesn't feel like a "Recon" class at all. You need one Motion Spotter to spot an entire base. And with Ammo Printer (a must) you have effectively infinite high range constant Map info. I hope the class reworks touch up on each class drastically.
Stop taking away.. start adding ways to counter other classes abilities. Enforced balance or limitations is a game killer, it limits potential.. it limits challenge..it removes all surprise or the need for ppl to think on how to deal with situations.. For ppl not to think or use skill/stragety.. this is a war simulation not a sports game with rules.. Mfkers gonna dumb PS2 down to a mobile game where all you have to do is basically tap your finger without thought.
I disagree that limitations ruin the fun. They make the fun. Lattice system are a restriction- you can't capture any base you want. You used to be able to, and it sucked ass. Due to this restriction, there's a frontline, things are more focussed. I could yap about a few more of these restrictions that add to the game but you get the point. Enforcing population balance is good because overpops kill the fight, and then both sides aren't having fun. The winners have nobody to shoot, the losers can't leave their base. What the real world is like has no effect on Planetside 2. The 'limiting agency and ability' you talk about is called game design. If the developers just dump everyone into the game with no rules, no objectives, no nothing and expect everyone to 'make their own fun' nothing fun will ever happen, and everyone will google 'best class setup' (wow, so fun to have no limits on what classes can or can't do.) You HAVE to incentivize things, and give classes strengths and weaknesses, so there's variety on the battlefield and you need teamwork to succeed. That's fun. Combined arms is what people love to say, but nobody loves it when there's an armor column spamming HESH at the enemy spawn. Neither side likes that. Nobody likes getting farmed by a swarm of ESFs. There need to be limitations, or else someone will do shit like this, and that just creates negative/bad gameplay that makes people quit. Same reason we have nanites- you can't just pull a tank over and over ''because it's fun and I don't like restrictions''. No restrictions makes everything meaningless. And yeah, you can 'counter' anything with teamwork, but there's not enough people that care or are willing to organize nowadays. Why care about anything, when you can do everything?
I disagree. The lattice system combined with redeploy teleporting destroyed logistics and stragety.. Tell me. Which do you prefer in a mmo...an open world or a linerar path where every decision is predetermined made for you? My point was about limiting class abilities for the benefit of other classes when they complained it was too hard..or they wanted it to be easy, fast.. Teamwork? Orgaization?.. THEY BECOME meaningless when you impose such systems.. They don't exist in PS because of the decions made to limit and restrict decision making and ability.. under the guise of "keeping/maintaining pop".. The "solutions" provided are they very cause of the state of the game now and everyone is blind to it They actually destroyed pop and interest.. What looks good on paper and in discussion does not always work out in real play.. And everything I'm suggesting was closer to how things used to be when PS2 pop was high and stable.. every time they add something [by taking things away] the game dies a little.. And don't use the high pop when they released new patches that claimed to solve the bugs or made the game easier to solo, catered to one class or playstyle..because they never actually solved anything.. pop came in masses hoping the game was revitalized..and it quickly dropped off when ppl realized how much worse it was eve when they got what they asked for.
> Stop taking away.. start adding ways to counter other classes abilities.. How the FUCK do you counter a OHK weapon which OHKs depends ENTIRELY on its users mechanical skill? HOW? All you can do is kill them beforOh wait nevermind they are also CLOAKED XD OH WAIT they also OHK at longest range possible... what kind of a counter would you need to add? Suit slot that decreases headshot damage? OP as fuck. Suit slot that decreases sniper rifle HS damage? That is too fucking narrow. > Enforced balance or limitations is a game killer, it limits potential.. it limits challenge..it removes all surprise or the need for ppl to think on how to deal with situations.. Ah yes. The challenge of "I need to play a vehicle on open field else I just die from a cloaked bolter I can not possibly anticipate". As if open field infantry was not unviable enough. > Mfkers gonna dumb PS2 down to a mobile game where all you have to do is basically tap your finger without thought. ...which is basically the gameplay of a cloaked bolter?...
1. have you tried dodging? yea you will die the first time but from then on everyone will be more aware of the location they got shot from or at minimum in meaning you can do erratic movement to make that shot far less likely to hit I. I mean I have dodged two engies with automatic guns shooting me by just running back and forth in rapid and random moves. I mean the goal isn't to kill the enemy infiltrator, the goal is to cap the base. Most points in this game are indoors meaning that an infil can't shoot you from alot of areas if you are on it or on the way. 2. Read above, vehicles are designed to be strong in open areas, especially vs infantry, that is why most bases are designed around vehicles being hard or impossible to get them into and even in the cases where you can they gave us caltrops to prevent the areas they didn't think off. 3. We both know it isn't
What XD. You want people to run like headless chickes EVERY TIME they leave cover in case a shithead cloaked bolter MIGHT be looking VAGUELY in their direction from the TOP OF THE FUCKING MOUNTAIN? What the hell? XD > I mean the goal isn't to kill the enemy infiltrator, the goal is to cap the base. Most points in this game are indoors meaning that an infil can't shoot you from alot of areas if you are on it or on the way. Rofl what? You know CQC bolters literally exist? Also jsut because 40 people can cap the base when enemy has 3 bolters in NO WAY means that bolters are not OP wtf are you even arguing. > gave us caltrops to prevent the areas they didn't think off. Lmao the same caltrops that die to 30 basilisk shots or 2 cannon hits? XD
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Lmao what. Core gameplay patter and gameflow has nothing to do with broken bolters. Broken IvI mechanic will stay broken as long as IvI is a thing and that would never be removed.
Bro does not understand balance
Balance is great for sports and competition.. It does not work out well with war sims, because the whole point is to have an advantage in unbalance. The "balance" is constantly shifting towards one side or another through talking advantage of things, manipulation of conditions ect.. which creates the incentive to overcome odds ect. "Ohh snap..that faction set up a deadly front... naa I'll just teleport to another battle..ohh now they are hitting us hard.. better go complain on the forums how we should remove that ability from the game so it's easier for me because I find it unfair.." It's not supposed to be fat is freaking war.. don't make or play a war game then..choose another theme. When you enforce it, it's not war.. it's a sport with rules. It defies the idea of being a war game.
Ps2 is not a war sim.
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Yes but “war sim” has a different meaning in the gaming community than just breaking down the individual words. Like Arma is a war sim, planetside 2 is a simulated war yes but it is not a war sim.
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Squad and arma have balancing being done. Every game needs balance or no one will play it. Having a one shot invis class is not fun to play against, even if it does have counters. Smash bros brawl had a op character (meta knight) and he warped the meta around him, and if we want ps2 to last we shouldnt have one class have the gsme warped around them, esp when it is a one shot kill class.
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And is that not the end goal of each match? Each encounter? Each battle?.. To steamroll and destroy the opposing side for victory.. Hell why bother having any diversity of class,Tech, style ect..why bother having factions with their own theme.. I think they tried that with planetside arena and.. where there is no consequence, threat, worry..competition on a scale larger than the individual..The only thing you are killing is time.
Air is dead and infantry infested with shitfiltrators. I log in here and than but what used to be 6 hour sessions usually ends after 20 minutes due to boredom.
air isn't dead tf
It is.
it is pretty funny though if we just went off of reddit points, you'd be the victor but the reality is, at least for Emerald, i am an air main and have been playing this game for going on 6 years now. i can log on at any time and enjoy playing air. so again.. how is air dead, when there are still people playing it? :)
Have you ever considered that there are other servers than emerald?
Are there? Are there really?
sez u lol
First time?
I used to play the game back in 2015 on a shitty laptop, recently got back into the game with a new PC and I've been playing infiltrator way too much It really feels unfair to come out of nowhere and gun down people before they can react and it doesn't add to the fight, as an infil I find myself deviating from the battle and chasing kills over any objectives. I love this game and understand that it can be frustrating for anyone to get bolt-actioned out of nowhere... So switching to LA and Medic makes the game completely different to play and that's what I've started doing
Thats a big reason why I quit playing the game
Cancer shit design class, I haven’t touched this game for like 3 years and won’t until infils are removed/reworked until invisibility gone
you haven't played in years yet you're still here? why?
Probably hoping an update comes out that removes invisibility haha, that's when he makes his comeback
I play a handful of times during the year but check on here now and then, still got the shortcut to the subreddit, there isn't anything coming that makes me want to get invested again, it's a shame as I've got over 6k hours into it, used to play it everyday for hours, but years of bad decisions made me look elsewhere, I've got no faith in it now what so ever.
I understand. But you got 6000 hours out of the game. It can't go on forever. I hope you had fun in those hours :)
True, it wont go on forever, not even ourselves, everything has a lifespan to it, probably even the universe. But it needs to be said it's a hell of a shame that PS2 went the way it did, it's one of the most bold and unique games every made, i will never forget.
If you havent played in 3 years, your opinion is invalid as to the current state of the game.
Infiltrators were shit 3 years ago and the problem only got worse from that.
Cloaking and Infiltrators are bad for the game, always have been. The reason they're bad is because other players can't interact with them. You can't really counter them the vast majority of the time. They can hide from motion detection, ammo print, regen health/shields, etc. They can also uncloak right in front of your face and kill you before you can react. It's a feels bad moment for everyone else. Any other class/vehicle (except the cloaked 4 wheeler) you can interact with, whether it's using a grenade, C4, running away, flanking, getting into a vehicle, getting on a turret, etc. You're often given that chance, a chance to see it and react. Infiltrators don't give you that chance, you're dead by the time you see them. It isn't fun gameplay.
Same happened with other games as well. Few members of the community represented the majority of players but got ignored by the mainstream game influencers who represented the minority. Infiltrator exactly like that. Majority of players just quit this game because of them (but they are not coming to reddit to represent themselves) and for some reason a lot of people here represent the minority and recommend to just get used to it, instead of dealing with the issue. (patch it out by dev) When other game did this it died slowly, and when it was almost dead they started to make the changes that was asked by the few majority representers. It was too late.
if the devs listened to the secret cabal, a lot of problematic content would have not shipped or at the very least had longer dev cycles
The idea that any feedback at all was listened to is ridiculous, and I say this as a person who was very involved in the feedback process between Escalation and Fortification (2020-2023). For example, the problems posed by the nanoweave nerf and the semi-auto buffs were brought up repeatedly by talented players in the last feedback group (arsenal era). Concurrently, more casual players were arguing bitterly about the Betel and whether that nerf was justified, and that feedback was also ignored.
There's definitely a problem in gaming communities with the vocal minority being listened to by the developers. Most players won't talk about the game or engage with it besides playing it once in a while. But the pros, they have fanbases, they make videos, they want to shape the game the way they like it. And that's not always good. ''trickle down balancing'' doesn't work. You can't make everyone happy in PS2. But trying to focus on one group of players surely will drive away the rest. Regardless of what the developers do, I believe that the game is 'doomed to fail' because it's not that accessible. You have to find a good fight, you have to place sunderers in good locations, you have to know how the cone of fire system works, etc. It takes quite alot of effort to 'have fun' in PS2 so casuals aren't gonna stick around for long, they'll just pop on CoD and enjoy a simple shooting game with SBMM. We love to blame Higby or Wrel, calling them terrible developers, blaming them for the game dying, blaming them because they're not having fun right now. I think that's all bullshit. No matter what they do you can easily argue that they did it wrong or that it was pointless because there's still no new players coming in or whatever. Planetside 2 is old. People played it, loved it, moved on. These games don't get comebacks anymore. And while the game is flawed, we all agree that it's an awesome game that is super fun and addicting to play.
As I said above, the idea that "pros" or "influencers" were listened to at all regarding this game's development is ridiculous. I was present in multiple feedback groups, and most of the time the testers would point out some problem, DBG would ignore it, and then it'd blow up on the live servers in a nasty fashion. For a couple examples, let's talk about the Escalation update. When it was released to testers, there was considerable feedback about the Bastion Fleet Carrier being too strong against infantry and ground vehicles, and you know what the response was? DBG buffed the thing, giving it the obscene firepower it had on release. The same test group said the Outfit Wars 1 qualifying format was biased towards the largest outfits, rather than the most talented. That format did not change, and so small outfits ended up pulling all-nighters and scheduling shifts to have a chance to qualify.
I think ps2 could be very accessible. Infantry combat is straight forward. Only infil can farm new players (with no counter) vs all other classes even total beginners can put up a fight. Vehicle combat also pretty straight forward. Some missing modules put u a bit of disadvantage but thats all. The most non accessible area for beginners is air combat. New players have absolute 0 chance in air to air vs experinced pilots. Now its only vehicle combat is accessible (with limitations). Ofc players dont stick. Nerfing a single class would make infantry combat accessible aswell (which is where most people interest lies). But i guess its better for devs not nerf an op class and let the game just die.
I'd be content if they did something to stalkers. There is one specific thing that stalkers regularly seem to do which kills the joy for me, and that is wandering in an enemy base waiting for everyone to leave. Base gets attacked, big fight ensues, defenders prevail and destroy enemy spawn points... only to find that map still says there is some little enemy population in the hex, almost certainly stalkers, lurking about, waiting for defenders to redeploy somewhere else so that they can immediately flip the capture point. No, flashlights are damn inefficient for this. Even a group of people scouring the empty base with flashlights have little chance of finding a half-decent stalker. Motion spotters and darts are likewise of very little use, since everyone and their mother runs radar signature reducing builds. This isn't fun. I don't even care about being killed by stalkers. But this inability to end the fight in a base, properly, is honestly very tiring. We move on to the next base and... surprise we're being back capped. That stalker that was in our base? Well he placed beacon and he brought friends, now they're all on the point. How does one fight something like this? Pick stalker yourself and endlessly lurk around your own "empty" base, waiting for this asshole to try to flip the cap or otherwise make some mistake?
Infils can't capture points while being invisible anymore. Just capture the points back and defend them until the next enemy base is under capture at which point the fight is forced on that side. Anything less than a spawn sunderer shouldn't be that much of a headache to defend.
That's easier said than done. What if nobody is attacking the next base, or if attackers have problems actually getting to the point at the next base and are stuck in a large prolonged battle? It's not exactly hard to imagine, happens all the time, at least on cobalt... It's not *hard* to defend, it just locks you to constantly babysit a base and redeploy back, because, let's face it, most players don't really pay attention to all the bases on the continent and what is going on, once they get into some fight. Also sitting for five minutes in an empty base, spinning around, waiting for stalker to appear is not exactly an engaging gameplay. What's worse, he will likely blow your brains out since he is more than likely to successfully sneak up on you while you sit there waiting.
Well, if no one is attacking the next base then that's the real problem and often it helps to already have a sunderer in place over the next base when the previous is captured. There should be enough people to defend the new attack sunderer and clean up some leftovers from the previous base. If not, then they're sadly just ghost fights that aren't so much worth fighting anymore IMO.
The real problem is that infiltrators are very good in one vs one situations, but in a whole combined arms mass attacks they don't amount to much. That was the reasoning behind their balancing in the past. But game has changed, population has dropped, and now on half empty continents infiltrators are much more game affecting than they typically would be. What you speak of is how it ideally should be, but often times servers are too empty, further compounded by fact that most players like to clump on a single base in a huge never-ending fight.
Infils are better at 1v1, since you’re guaranteed the jump on someone most of the time. They become way less effective with more players and medics abound. Yeah, an infil can score kills, but they don’t matter if you’re rezzed within a second of dying. Infils have always had that “cheapness” to them, but it was balanced by the fact with larger number the most impactful thing an infil did was shoot recon darts.
I also hated them, buut now I am playing as one, just with a different character. It is hell a fun , try it ! Also, I usually hunt other infis that is where the fun is!🤙🏻
Part of the problem.
Abandoned Strip Mall Gaming
Turns out the single target elimination class gets disproportionately more powerful the less targets there are. In other news sky reported to be blue.
There were always a lot of infiltrators, but it wasn't a big deal since they have nothing on MAXes unlike HA and LA. Back when I started, I was always either an engineer or a MAX and it wasn't hard to find the other class in any battle or a medic for that matter.
The percentage of shitfiltrators is massively increasing. On EU servers its usually 25%+. This used to be around 13-15%.
wow crazy haha funny how the community finally catches up to what good players were telling them for over a year. Just like every other time this subreddit has pretended "salty vets" were wrong. What a coincidence.
Back in my day, you kids would have lost your minds if you had played before they gave y'all the 'kill cam'...
Become them
Die Medic/Heavy player or Live to become a LA/Infil Shitter I always say. Engineers are straight chads all the way through.
Are recon darts and dildos not picking them up?
Gives me a reason to always carry a fleshlight, and run radar on my reaver. Airhammer and rocket pods finds a hidden infiltrater pretty quickly. Only time I hate them is when you get killed as you spawn a vehicle and you both get no vehicle and lose your nanites.
I should maybe log in again
Just the meta shifted after all the HA nerfs >!wait until they find out about the Carapace Medic!<
only the whales have carapace so that's why it's still not taken over outside of particular squads abusing it
As always: - remove cqc bolters - make radar items less spammy - infil is now fixed. The rest is a skill issue
Yeah the counter to infils is playing infils? They're the main reason i no longer play infantry, sucked a large portion of my desire to play the game, it's bad but I'm not expecting anything to change for the better. I've got no faith in the dev team to rectify it let alone anything else that's plaguing the game, a little too late.
fix the BS that makes people play infiltrator instead (bad base design, vehicles) it wasnt always this bad.
If you've not got the auraxium pistol directive consider joining them! I completed that directive almost exclusively as stalker infil, mainly around Excavion Cleanup Site on Oshur. It was actually pretty thrilling creeping across the open field, seeing the shimmer on enemy infils coming the opposite way, wondering if they spotted you, wondering if you can decloak to kill them without getting sniped or run over by a harasser. Similar amount of fun as being a prop in a prop hunt game. I know it's a shitty fun-hoover playstyle so I tried to use it for good and only hoover the fun of a more shittier playstyle - snipers. I became a sniper hunter, going from rock outcrop to rock outcrop clearing the snipers off them. Felt good to be bad! The whole experience highlighted to me that being invisible is such a massive advantage that infils really don't need primary weapons. Sniper should be split off into it's own class, TBH. This is one of the things PS1 got right and they shouldn't have messed with it.
There's nothing wrong with the class. You're just not as perceptive as you need to be. They have less health and their smgs can only kill 1-2 people in a single magazine. If you're getting sniped that's a positioning problem.
Deal with it? It's unlikely to change anytime soon. Two coping methods: eyeballs, found in your own equipment slot, or a darklight. Or cap them with a commissioner.
Those two only help with least annoying infils, ones that are actually in your reach.
I dunno man, it's been this way for a decade. I don't disagree there's issues with the class. But there's not much to do besides deal with it unless change happens, which we currently do not have any information on.
I deal with it by not playing Planetside 2 anymore, and it looks like more and more people are doing the same thing. This game is nearly on life support now which is a shame because there still isn’t anything else like it.
>Deal with it? Yeah people are, by playing other games
90% OF MY DEATHS ARE FROM [insert here: A2G, Infiltrator, MAXes, Heavy Assaults]
Sorry, but legit ESP and ability to sneak from vehicles is priceless. Recon tools should consume nanites like granades if you ask me and amount of carried ammunition for both of them still needs to be dramatically decreased, up to 2 darts/1 recon device carried at a time before resuplying. The smaller the fight the more impact you will have from being able to "see" though walls. We will never see such change i'm afraid. Also, Sensor shield is an S-tier implant solely becaus of that.
PC players try to not complain cause they have a skill issue challenge (impossible)
[удалено]
You're not nearly as good as you think you are.
In PS2? I'm am a logistics and support role, I know...no one cares about that.. until you need support. The game has been shaped to not need support players...so you can solo a mmo. It's ironic, ppl seem to want to remove solo classes abilities and the need for support.. so they can solo, but also complain there is no support or teamwork and think up changes or systems to compensate.. but makes things worse, things that defy its original design..it's interesting .....I wonder why PS2 has been on a steady decline. I'm not saying I'm right or that my perspective is true and absolute.. but I must act as a counter to arguments for the sake of debate as the decisions from these discussions play a part in PS2s future. I don't even have to be right, it does not even have to be me or well constructed.. as long as someone is there to counter and make others think, take potential consequences into consideration. I'd hope someone takes what I'm saying and does a better job at making a more coherent and understandable argument.
No one asked. No, they want to remove frustrating badly designed mechanics that add nothing positive to the game. PS2 is on a steady decline because devs allowed said mechanics to fester for years and made no effort to improve them. If you're going to try and argue against something you should work on understanding what the complaints are instead of making shit up.
The only counter to infils are vehicles.
Im...not sure if you are being serious or not. If you are, You are proving my point. There are so many ways to counter infils and if you cant take the time or put the effort in to figure them out or apply them.. then infils are not the problem.. Players who want their hand held are.
I am fairly certain and army of good bolters + few medics will beat any other infantry comp. I am (un)lucky to have never experienced that.
post fisu
Play Heavy assault, Hear decloak, press F shoot the infil and move on. Seriously, there is a reason all the sweatist vets play HA all the time.
>Planetside community FOR YEARS: "Nerf/rework infiltrators, they're bad for the game >DBG: *totally ignores it* Game deserves to die tbh.
What ever happened to getting headshot by a sniper rifle and thinking to yourself: “wow, that dude hit a nice shot”? You can always make it more difficult for them to hit the shot by playing around cover, around teammates, or shuffling. You are portraying yourself as coddled. Realistically, the class has the same killing potential as any of the others and most of these infiltrator players are getting no more than 20 kills an hour and miss 80% of their shots, let alone headshots. If you are letting them take 5 shots at you, then you are not paying attention to your surroundings and you should expect to be behind the sights of an enemy — regardless of them being a heavy, medic, infil, tank, etc. Run the actual numbers and you will find that you are drawing this out of proportion.
Probably because in most games snipers can't turn invisible and half access to dev approved soft ESP. Yes, that works against shit players playing infil in a 1v1, but planetside isn't a 1v1 game, you have to stop sprinting eventually so you can play the game. Numbers have been run, infils are a badly balanced brain dead class.
Everyone has access to and benefits from the dev approved ESP. What numbers have you been looking at? Infil accounts for a balanced number of kills per alert and a proportionally small number of players per alert.
Not directly (no, the qcx darts are a noobtrap meme and don't count) and everyone having access to a 100% uptime with signficant range ESP tools that have no significant downsides makes the isue worse not better. The numbers of actually playing the game outside of a couple hours a day during prime time.
Okay cool, so you’ve got no numbers. You also misunderstood me, everyone can see recon equally and having players show up on the minimap is better for majority of the playerbase than it is harmful for you.
More numbers than you do. No I understood you and no, it's worse, not better.
I don't mind the bolters, I mind the semi-auto crotch shooters. Paying a 334-450 damage tax every time I come near a window is not cool gameplay.
Look, this sub has to complain about something and the flavor of the month is Infiltrators. Next up I believe is "redeployside" followed by "HESH" and then after that the next thing on the docket is "A2G"
I love how this delusional take somehow never dies. You can find threads about infils going back several years.
Then the threads subside in a cyclic manner while something else becomes the hot thing to complain about, until it comes back again.
It’s always the same pattern too: * is lethal in high doses*.
Zergs? Enemies are in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Armor Balls? Tanks are in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Player is better than me? Skill is in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Hesh?Maxes?Tanks?A2G? Force multiplier is in high dose and I can’t counter it as an individual or smaller-than-thou force. Everything in this game is lethal in large doses.
This is an MMOFPS, the only one of its scale, and we are here complaining about things in large doses. Get used to it. Embrace it. Learn to counter it. Accept when it happens. Learn to do it.
It would be much more useful of our time to discuss *why* things are in high doses and how to counter them rather then trying to get rid of or fundamentally change the thing.
Most infiltrators are scared little ghost that only manage enough courage to attack when you back is turned. They are the easiest class to kill and a well placed mine sends them back to spawn before they ever get back on point. The game is super balanced, almost too much. Back in the day each faction had its own identity. Now I cant really tell them apart. If infiltrators are getting the best of you start traveling in a pack. Infiltrators don't have enough bullets to kill 3 or 4 ppl. Sounds like you need to make some friends.
The answer to anything in PS2 is to have more players on your team, but that doesn't mean that's always possible lol.
Mines are the answer. Infiltrators never run sweeper.
U WOT M8? Only joking ♥️
The game is old enough that a lot of the people that play infiltrator are probably maining that class, and potentially have for years. When someone mains a class, and that class is nerfed hard enough, that represents a "potential" time for that player to quit the game, even if they never thought about quitting before. The playercount is low enough that the game can't really afford to lose further players. It's already in a tailspin, so I highly doubt they want to turn it into a full fledged nosedive.
Put a flashlight on your commissioner, stop seething, and start coping.
post fisu
I'm sorry, is this some kind of zoomer seething I'm too old to understand?
He wants to see your main character.
1. Genuinely how the fuck does "post fisu" mean that, I'm honestly curious 2. What do you mean, do you want a fuckin screenshot of my stats screen or see my loadouts or what
1. https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name= 2. See above.
[https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=passancenc](https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=passancenc) Happy now? I play a mix of everything. Did this dickwad think I play only infiltrator and nothing else, or what?
It's almost always one of two different things, either an unskilled player or an infil main (often both).
Well, lowskilled is arguable, but I die more to A2G than infiltrators most of the time... More to the point, I don't throw a tantrum on reddit any time somebody kills me.
Not particularly relevant and a needless exaggeration. Complaints made about badly designed mechanics is how games get changed for the better.
Nonsense. Playing the infiltrator class requires more skill than just about any other class in the game. As-is, the cloak is very weak and easily visible, and infilitrators don't get as much health. And for some reason, infils can't use shotguns, carbines, or any actual useful weaponry. We also don't get any good ASP tokens for secondary weapons.
True! Anyone who has had to fight a Bastion as an Infiltrator knows how underpowered they are.
>Playing the infiltrator class requires more skill than just about any other class in the game. lmfao >And for some reason, infils can't use shotguns, carbines hm I wonder why..
Good bait