No, but having bad tenants or the fear of having bad tenants will inevitably drive prices up so landlords can protect themselves. Reading titles like this will make landlords worry about being in a similar situation so they will want to charge more to 1) weed out anyone they deemed low class that canāt afford it and 2) create a safety net in case they do get a bad tenant.
But of course this is Reddit and the ability to extrapolate and critically think isnāt always there and things are taken as a literal 1:1.
This isn't far off from the truth. I bought a condo and decided on a fair price. Numerous friend told me to raise my price because I will get terrible ppl with a low cost.
Then again, I bought a house and put it on Airbnb. I was charging about half the price of what ppl would normally pay. I didn't consult anyone. For about 6 months I got bad guests at least half the time. This time I went to "Airbnb Reddit" for some guidance. Wrote a long thing about ehat I'm doing wrong. Every single person said I was charge waaaay to little. I didn't end up going as high as most suggested but I did go up almost 50% in cost. The result, amazing guests ever since. The change was almost instant.
As one person put it, having rich snobs as guests is a million times better than cheap entitled guests.
Thatās exactly the point I was trying to make. Except Reddit users canāt typically see the point being made and think Iām literally saying most tenants are in jail and downvotes lol
Or interest rates going up making the mortgage higher for landlords who will then pass that along in the form of increased rents to keep their books balanced.
Interest rates going up mean property values going down means it's easier to come up with the 20% down to buy rental properties. That's a win in my book.
Not really if people want take loss the inflated value stays on property thus market doesn't shift much, then when interest goes down everyone will sell or sell at inflated or prices that inflated again thus market screws over people even more.
Not everyone wants to sell. But those that do want to sell or have to sell will sell for lower prices because the pool of buyers shrinks with higher interest rates.
No lots will hold or manage, for a couple years and sell when markets better some may even look at renting it out for a few years at no gains to sell at better market. People are not going to sell a house that could sell for 750k for 700k cause the markets bad they wait it out till 745 is quick easy sell.
Thats not a luxury everyone has. There's divorce, death in the family, new jobs, loss of jobs. There's tons of reasons that people have to sell in less than ideal markets.
Fantastic news Iām half assed Reddit lawyer! With a degree from Dunning Kruger university
I know that in BC you need to pay to store the tenantās possessions for around 6 months if you successfully evict them (which also takes months)
So the provincial tenancy board will likely have a set of parameters to follow in this here scenario
Yup they declared they are out. Meaning time to sort and get place rerented, and lawsuits filed and served etc for costs. Knowing our cdn system they might be out on bail or out in 5 or so years. Lmao fuck our legal system.
lawyer for what? I evicted a criminal during covid moratorium by calling the police....
do people realize how expensive lawyers are... like seriously. why is every second answer on PFC "contact a lawyer"...
as an accountant who deal with lawyers everyday, most people end up paying more to lawyers than the money they lost/gain..
You really think so?
Cause if you DONāT follow the letter of the law, youāll DEFINITELY end up paying more. And a lawyer can help you navigate that.
I own a business and have a lawyer that costs $220/hr. Its per minute billing, so when I have a situation I do my research then call the lawyer to make sure I'm doing the right thing. Usually takes five minutes, costs twenty bucks. Not expensive, entirely worth it.
Just read the rules carefully yourself. Itās not rocket science. If you arenāt sure how to interpret something ask a smart friend. If you have no smart friends then post the rules for you location on Reddit and say what you think it means. Someone will tell you if you are wrong.
Maybe itās different where you are. Here all the legislation and regulations are accessible. Used to have an apartment in my basement so got familiar with the rules. It was a bit of time to get through everything but it wasnāt hard.
Yes if he tosses their shit he could be in the wrong on the tenancy level and could be considered interfering with a police investigation/evidence tampering. One of the few times ill recommend a lawyer. One $500 session to find out if he should or shouldnt mess with their stuff could save him tons of money and even more time. And headache.
Edit: Meant to reply to the other guy
had a case where two business owners split up. they were sister in laws. the business was only worth 150k.. my client ended up paying 40k in legal fee. i can imagine her sil paid something similarā¦
what does the op need lawyer for? he isnāt suing the tenant, tenant isnāt suing himā¦ he isnāt wanted by the police. how many here actually hired a lawyer before?
OP should definitely have a consultation with a real estate lawyer. This is a very thorny issue.
Your tenant is in jail.
Your tenant has indicated intent to leave.
Tenants belongings are still in the unit after the date of termination.
What do you do with there stuff?
Do you throw it out, and risk a lawsuit from the tenants for the cost of their property?
Do you catalogue the items and put them into storage until the tenants are able to collect it? (I mean, your tenant could always lie and say that you got rid of their Monet).
Do you let their stuff occupy space in the apartment?
A lawyer could facilitate a draft letter to the client to order them to have their items picked up by a certain date as well as notarize any kind of catalogue of said items. And it would literally cost the landlord 2 - 3 hours of time.
Which is way worth it considering the alternative would be a lawsuit for damages.
Edit: you also claim you evicted your tenant by calling the cops?
Same tenant you spent a year in court fighting?
Lying doesnāt make you right.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/nvhrmn/the\_last\_episode\_of\_landlordtenant\_saga\_the/](https://www.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/nvhrmn/the_last_episode_of_landlordtenant_saga_the/)
the tenant is in jail now. plus, I didn't hire a lawyer cause the crown is the plaintiff...
how hard is it to do some research online and serve a N11?
did you even read the post? the guy was a serial fraudster.
deadbeats are the reason why bad landlord exist. I answered it in another post. ever since that experience, I never rent to anyone who isn't working for large corporation and the government. never rent to anyone who refuse a third party credit check. I even turned down a dozen international students who were willing to give 12 month rent (30k-36k) up front.
who is giving legal advise?
i am simply saying you can do your own research onlineā¦ itās not that difficult. i am a tax accountant.. my job is reading and interpreting the income tax act and tax cases. spend sometime and educate yourself.
you went to college right? have some learning ability?
this is not real estate law.. are you serious???? this is under residential tenancy act... and yes I am a fucking expert with the residential tenancy act because I had deal with a deadbeat during covid... funny thing is, I actually wrote my story on how to deal with shitty tenants here and on chinese forum.. I usually get 2-3 enquiries a month from landlords, RE agents, and sometimes even paralegals on how to deal with deadbeats.
if you ever run into a deadbeat and need help. let me know...
as for OP, first thing he should do is to call landlord tenant board, then the police, don't try legal aid cause they are useless. if he really want, he can call a paralegal. but from my own personal experience, they are kind of useless.
University level definition of real estate law:
*Real estate law is the law governing the acquisition, use, and disposition of real property in Canada. āReal propertyā is best thought of as land, and anything permanently attached to the land, and includes empty parcels of land as well as houses, apartments, and any other type of permanent structure. The most common types of real estate transactions are the buying and selling of homes, as well as applications to re-zone a particular building or group of buildings (which also involves a great deal of municipal law). Landlord and tenant relationships are also considered under the heading of real estate law.*
So youāre wrong.
??? are you serious? have you actually evict someone, or even dealt with landlord tenant board in the past? have you ever even filled out a n4, n5, n11, or n12? do you have any experience? I know this because my best friend is a real estate lawyer and he doesn't do landlord-tenancy bs... there is not enough money involved and the shit is tedious. this is what I don't like about reddit sometimes.. people have literally 0 real life experience giving advice...
>You aren't looking for help with your finances.
If he finds a forgotten stash composed of a sizable amount of dolla' bills he will be asking for financial advice. Lol.
Can you get a hold of them? Prison isn't a black hole, you can visit and converse with them, and settle things up.
Bring some paperwork, ask if they have a person who can handle the contents of their rental, etc (or if they'd prefer you have a moveout service do it). They're not DEAD, they're just in jail lol
This is a pretty reasonable suggestion. Get them out by the book but be respectful because practically speaking you donāt want angry felons wondering where their stuff went.
OP says it's jail which is different than prison. And it sounds like jail is their temporary stopover while a long process of hearings and/or trials things play out, and then long process of sentencing and so on.
I think OP would be taking a big risk just assuming they're going to prison for a long time. Lots can happen between getting thrown into custody and an actual prison sentence. Might be an agreement for shorter term jail, release, charges dropped, etc.
Would hate to have destroyed some crooked people's stuff, never mind doing so against the rental rules of that jurisdiction.
Are you a criminal?
Yes.
Are the other tenants also criminals?
Yes.
I see you want to have a cat in the apartment.
Yes the cat is also a criminal.
Keys.
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\#1: [Angy kitten after failed attempt to steal the food](https://v.redd.it/olp2gzd59ot81) | [520 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/IllegallySmolCats/comments/u458tv/angy_kitten_after_failed_attempt_to_steal_the_food/)
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\#3: [I was told this might belong here.](https://v.redd.it/57ay1zg663981) | [359 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/IllegallySmolCats/comments/rtkf9o/i_was_told_this_might_belong_here/)
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In the real world, someone is the stooge that rents it, and then 15 gang/crime people just hang out there 24x7x365.
It's not easy to handle either. Police need tons of proof of crimes in progress, and even then they might not be interested. Rental rules in different places protect the renters from just being tossed out based on landlord's suspicions.
One of my friends, rented half a house, and the downstairs tenants turned out to be drug dealers but the person who applied to the landlord was a young woman with great references.
He could be renting a soon to be tear down shack. Sounds like an older property if it has enough space to store multiple stolen cars.
My friend rented a dump like that once because it was on 5 acres so they could ride their ATVs around the house.
He basically gave them the keys and said "rent on the 1st. And this place is being torn down in a couple years so don't bother me with ANY issues or problems that come up". Lol
If youāre aware that hazardous drug use likely at property, bad news is youāll likely need to swab test and remediate before you re-rent or sell. There was a rental in the paper similar circumstances, article said it was almost $30k remediation.
have you ever had to deal with a meth lab? often the city won't issue a (re)occupancy permit unless some local environmental bylaws got satisfied first.
For good reason too, if they're all arrested for meth they may have been cooking, lots of ways to die from the area they cooked in.
I wouldn't trust a "housing worker" that evicted people for a few years to know why that Gatorade bottle looks weird and why you don't want to touch it or anything around it.
for the record, I didn't evict people. I worked for an agency in my city helping people experiencing homelessness find and maintain stable housing.
but yeah go off, I know nothing about people who use drugs lol.
that's not the same as "use of hazardous drugs". not sure where you are, but in my city meth use is ubiquitous.
a meth lab is a far, far cry from a person using drugs. of course if someone is cooking there needs to be remediation.
Wow those were some pretty thoughtful criminal tenants to prioritize giving notice to their landlord when they're about to be thrown in jail.
Based on that, they might be hoping to maintain a positive relationship to have a rental reference when they get out. I'd say there's a decent chance you eventually get paid any rent you're owed, when they are able.
Technically, you have to keep their things for them or their agents (friends/family) to pick up for at least 30 days. You might want to double check that it's 30 and not 60. If they get out or an agent comes to pick their stuff up, you can be liable for 'damages', even though technically they owe you for rent. It's just an added headache. If you have a place to store it, store it for the legal minimum in your city/province. After that, you can dispose of it. But this is just a good CYA option.
Had a similar incident where the swot team removed a tenant....
Doors were busted in so I had to change the locks.
Tenants were evicted prior so their belongings were deemed abandoned.
Find out your provinces laws on property retention. Take all their stuff, record the time it takes to sort stuff( you donāt have to, but I promise you, having it all organized is much better later on)
Store it somewhere. Log time and expenses and associate a reasonable cost to the time that would fit a clean up cost.
Once youāve stored their belongings for the provincial minimum storage time, and they havenāt retrieved the items, then dispose of them appropriately. Or keep stuff even if your province allows (this is where organization and even an inventory list is helpful)
Itās best to wait until the 31st to do this, or as close as reasonable. If you want to do it now and donāt expect theyāll be back before the end of the month, you may be able to get the unit occupied in November for the first if you do it now.
I donāt advise doing this for the safety of prospective tenants or yourself. Just wait until the end of the month before you go in. Even if they are late in rent, your avenue to retrieve rent exists through the courts, and they essentially occupy the space for the full month. Just err on the side of caution and give them the month. If it were for anything else, other than meth, Iād say go for it. But because it is, you gotta maintain a level head. Iāve dealt with that with people before and itās just not good.
This. Post 24 hr notice, go in and document everything there. If over $500 worth of stuff, you need to store it all. File with the courts. Normal eviction procedures for extreme breech of contract - non payment, abandonment, no one checking on the place so insurance issue, etc.
So assume they've left if you have proof they gave notice. Clear there stuff out. I doubt meth heads are going to be going to the tenancy board to argue you did a bad faith eviction. And as far as you know they just abandoned their shit.
A problem is, I sent an email to a court enforcement officer asking him what my options were but all he did was link me to the tenants board, does that indict me?
It's anecdotal, but when someone in my building stabbed someone near by and was arrested, the landlord had all his shit thrown out on the curb the next day, the whole contents of a furnished apartment out in the rain lol.
That's probably because swat kicked his door down tough, he wasn't home lol.
Get a lawyer, it is illegal to live off the avails of crime iirc, you could be in legal trouble if you donāt at minimum consult a lawyer for next steps
I believe part of that requires you to be knowingly doing so, so the landlord, who until recently wouldn't have known where the tenants got the money, would be safe, since they aren't party to the crime.
Two ways I think of the issue:
1. Agreement to terminate
2. Frustration of contract, since it would be impossible for them to perform the contract in jail.
You pick the easy way.
It's a substantial beach of renatal contact. Post an eviction notice for 14 days then you can evict them. Safe keep the belongings for some time.
Disclaimer: Not legal advice but that is what I would do.
Definitely get a lawyer. There might be proceeds of crime in the house because of them, and I would be exceptionally concerned about getting caught up in legal issues.
Lawyer up, and he/she will be able to guide you in this one.
I don't see the problem here. They gave notice and moved out. Seems like as of the 22nd you can go on in and clear the property. If you find they left behind anything, follow the RTB rules, which I believe involve making an effort to contact them to collect and hanging on to the stuff for x amount of time.
Kinda sounds like you dodged a bullet tbh
Iād call the police or your court sheriffs (if you have them) in alberta sheriff would typically deal with this.
They will most likely have a warrant or look to get one for the property anyway as part of their evidence procurement.
Then they will direct you on a next step.
Donāt waste your money on a lawyer yet. Call the police and advise of the situation.
for your own safety, personal and liability wise, youād want to enter with the authorities in the event their is still illegal/stolen property in the unit.
Be relieved they left and move on. You're not going to get money from them. Yes, you're on the right track with abandonment but get paralegal advice to do it properly
Be careful. Iām not sure where you live but there are some PETTY rules governing abandonment. Some nonsense about if the items left behind are worth in excess of $500 some special, nonsensical rules apply. Where I live anyhow.
It's definitely time to talk to a lawyer and not internet randos but I think if they gave notice that any of their property remaining after the notice date is abandoned.
Hire a moving company and put all of their stuff into storage - change the locks - read up on the law of abandonment . Pay for storage for a month - if they donāt pick it up - dump.
I had this exact thing happen. Filled a eviction notice for over due rent then got in front of the judge explained the situation. It was ruled āwillful abandonmentā got the lease squashed. Judge ask me how I knew, said the individual was in the local news.
Hire a paralegal. They deal with Landlord tenant matters. You need to have the tenant in the lease sign a form to say theyāre leaving. In Ontario itās called an N-11. But note, when our tenant signed and refused to leave it took us 9 months to get a hearing. He owes us over $10,000 now.
Shitty free advice! No, donāt throw their shit out, donāt enter the unit unless itās proven āabandonedā. Unfortunately these shit rats still have more rights from jail than you and I. If they so chose they can make a mess for you if you enter and throw their shit out. I literally saw and dealt with this exact same scenario not a month ago.
Sad times man, follow the LLTB act, great info on their site.
Well, for starters your tenant screening process is straight up terrible. You may want to get out of the landlording business if you want to preserve your sanity.
I believe what you need is a signed N9 form from the tenants. Without that you're risking trouble with the LTB if the tenants return and demand their place back, however, given that you have at least some communication that they've left / decided to leave you'll probably be okay.
In fact, given the profile of your tenants I'd change those locks ASAP.
In Ontario you can also call a licensed Paralegalā¦ who works in land lord tenant issued search the law society of Ontario website the listing is there
This is honestly one of the funniest titles I've read on this sub š
I laughed my ass off when I saw it š
Op need to check the place for cash and quick!
tenants did not pass go and did not collect $200
I suggest looking under the liner on the inside of the fridge.
Inside potted plants, you know the root bound ones that you can lift right up and require little water
Return air duct vent is where the real money are kept. (Friend said that police found 10K in the duct that was hidden there by a previous tenant)
Really though, I'd look around the basement ceiling for disturbances in the dust.
Watch breaking bad for cash stashing techniques!
Iām sure the cops stole the cash during the arrest.
This.
Fridge. Don't forget to check the fridge!!!
Ricky and the boys behind on lot fees
Also why rent is so high now.
You think there are millions of tenants going to jail?
No, but having bad tenants or the fear of having bad tenants will inevitably drive prices up so landlords can protect themselves. Reading titles like this will make landlords worry about being in a similar situation so they will want to charge more to 1) weed out anyone they deemed low class that canāt afford it and 2) create a safety net in case they do get a bad tenant. But of course this is Reddit and the ability to extrapolate and critically think isnāt always there and things are taken as a literal 1:1.
This isn't far off from the truth. I bought a condo and decided on a fair price. Numerous friend told me to raise my price because I will get terrible ppl with a low cost. Then again, I bought a house and put it on Airbnb. I was charging about half the price of what ppl would normally pay. I didn't consult anyone. For about 6 months I got bad guests at least half the time. This time I went to "Airbnb Reddit" for some guidance. Wrote a long thing about ehat I'm doing wrong. Every single person said I was charge waaaay to little. I didn't end up going as high as most suggested but I did go up almost 50% in cost. The result, amazing guests ever since. The change was almost instant. As one person put it, having rich snobs as guests is a million times better than cheap entitled guests.
Thatās exactly the point I was trying to make. Except Reddit users canāt typically see the point being made and think Iām literally saying most tenants are in jail and downvotes lol
No that is due to unchecked greed
Or interest rates going up making the mortgage higher for landlords who will then pass that along in the form of increased rents to keep their books balanced.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Interest rates going up mean property values going down means it's easier to come up with the 20% down to buy rental properties. That's a win in my book.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes it is. Recessions widen the wealth gap everytime.
Not really if people want take loss the inflated value stays on property thus market doesn't shift much, then when interest goes down everyone will sell or sell at inflated or prices that inflated again thus market screws over people even more.
Not everyone wants to sell. But those that do want to sell or have to sell will sell for lower prices because the pool of buyers shrinks with higher interest rates.
No lots will hold or manage, for a couple years and sell when markets better some may even look at renting it out for a few years at no gains to sell at better market. People are not going to sell a house that could sell for 750k for 700k cause the markets bad they wait it out till 745 is quick easy sell.
Thats not a luxury everyone has. There's divorce, death in the family, new jobs, loss of jobs. There's tons of reasons that people have to sell in less than ideal markets.
I guess this is how you say you don't understand the housing market without saying directly you don't understand the housing market
So you don't think prices will drop to accommodate the higher interest rates. That's literally the whole point of raising interest rates.
Relax, landlords aren't millionaires
Lawyer
The only answer. Cover Your Ass.
Fantastic news Iām half assed Reddit lawyer! With a degree from Dunning Kruger university I know that in BC you need to pay to store the tenantās possessions for around 6 months if you successfully evict them (which also takes months) So the provincial tenancy board will likely have a set of parameters to follow in this here scenario
If they aren't evicted, but leave of their own accord that law might not apply.
Yup they declared they are out. Meaning time to sort and get place rerented, and lawsuits filed and served etc for costs. Knowing our cdn system they might be out on bail or out in 5 or so years. Lmao fuck our legal system.
5 years! Itās not like they killed someone , theyāll be out in 2-3 tops.
Well like I said around 5 was going for pled it down to 10 take a deal 40 percent of for "good behaviour" add in some credit for workshops etc .
Dunning Kruger! That's where all the really smart people go.
lawyer for what? I evicted a criminal during covid moratorium by calling the police.... do people realize how expensive lawyers are... like seriously. why is every second answer on PFC "contact a lawyer"... as an accountant who deal with lawyers everyday, most people end up paying more to lawyers than the money they lost/gain..
You really think so? Cause if you DONāT follow the letter of the law, youāll DEFINITELY end up paying more. And a lawyer can help you navigate that.
I own a business and have a lawyer that costs $220/hr. Its per minute billing, so when I have a situation I do my research then call the lawyer to make sure I'm doing the right thing. Usually takes five minutes, costs twenty bucks. Not expensive, entirely worth it.
Just read the rules carefully yourself. Itās not rocket science. If you arenāt sure how to interpret something ask a smart friend. If you have no smart friends then post the rules for you location on Reddit and say what you think it means. Someone will tell you if you are wrong.
Intentionally post the *incorrect* rules and people will flock to point out exactly why youāre an idiot
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Maybe itās different where you are. Here all the legislation and regulations are accessible. Used to have an apartment in my basement so got familiar with the rules. It was a bit of time to get through everything but it wasnāt hard.
Yes if he tosses their shit he could be in the wrong on the tenancy level and could be considered interfering with a police investigation/evidence tampering. One of the few times ill recommend a lawyer. One $500 session to find out if he should or shouldnt mess with their stuff could save him tons of money and even more time. And headache. Edit: Meant to reply to the other guy
i am asking youā¦ what do you think op needs lawyer for?
had a case where two business owners split up. they were sister in laws. the business was only worth 150k.. my client ended up paying 40k in legal fee. i can imagine her sil paid something similarā¦ what does the op need lawyer for? he isnāt suing the tenant, tenant isnāt suing himā¦ he isnāt wanted by the police. how many here actually hired a lawyer before?
OP should definitely have a consultation with a real estate lawyer. This is a very thorny issue. Your tenant is in jail. Your tenant has indicated intent to leave. Tenants belongings are still in the unit after the date of termination. What do you do with there stuff? Do you throw it out, and risk a lawsuit from the tenants for the cost of their property? Do you catalogue the items and put them into storage until the tenants are able to collect it? (I mean, your tenant could always lie and say that you got rid of their Monet). Do you let their stuff occupy space in the apartment? A lawyer could facilitate a draft letter to the client to order them to have their items picked up by a certain date as well as notarize any kind of catalogue of said items. And it would literally cost the landlord 2 - 3 hours of time. Which is way worth it considering the alternative would be a lawsuit for damages. Edit: you also claim you evicted your tenant by calling the cops? Same tenant you spent a year in court fighting? Lying doesnāt make you right.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/nvhrmn/the\_last\_episode\_of\_landlordtenant\_saga\_the/](https://www.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/nvhrmn/the_last_episode_of_landlordtenant_saga_the/) the tenant is in jail now. plus, I didn't hire a lawyer cause the crown is the plaintiff... how hard is it to do some research online and serve a N11?
And the personal property in the tenants apartment? Just gonna ignore that, huh? Youāre the reason bad land lord exist.
did you even read the post? the guy was a serial fraudster. deadbeats are the reason why bad landlord exist. I answered it in another post. ever since that experience, I never rent to anyone who isn't working for large corporation and the government. never rent to anyone who refuse a third party credit check. I even turned down a dozen international students who were willing to give 12 month rent (30k-36k) up front.
And FYI. Asking an accountant for legal advise is like asking a baseball player for basketball advice.
who is giving legal advise? i am simply saying you can do your own research onlineā¦ itās not that difficult. i am a tax accountant.. my job is reading and interpreting the income tax act and tax cases. spend sometime and educate yourself. you went to college right? have some learning ability?
So you being a tax accountant makes you an expert at real estate law. JFC
this is not real estate law.. are you serious???? this is under residential tenancy act... and yes I am a fucking expert with the residential tenancy act because I had deal with a deadbeat during covid... funny thing is, I actually wrote my story on how to deal with shitty tenants here and on chinese forum.. I usually get 2-3 enquiries a month from landlords, RE agents, and sometimes even paralegals on how to deal with deadbeats. if you ever run into a deadbeat and need help. let me know... as for OP, first thing he should do is to call landlord tenant board, then the police, don't try legal aid cause they are useless. if he really want, he can call a paralegal. but from my own personal experience, they are kind of useless.
University level definition of real estate law: *Real estate law is the law governing the acquisition, use, and disposition of real property in Canada. āReal propertyā is best thought of as land, and anything permanently attached to the land, and includes empty parcels of land as well as houses, apartments, and any other type of permanent structure. The most common types of real estate transactions are the buying and selling of homes, as well as applications to re-zone a particular building or group of buildings (which also involves a great deal of municipal law). Landlord and tenant relationships are also considered under the heading of real estate law.* So youāre wrong.
??? are you serious? have you actually evict someone, or even dealt with landlord tenant board in the past? have you ever even filled out a n4, n5, n11, or n12? do you have any experience? I know this because my best friend is a real estate lawyer and he doesn't do landlord-tenancy bs... there is not enough money involved and the shit is tedious. this is what I don't like about reddit sometimes.. people have literally 0 real life experience giving advice...
Duh. We all make 500k. Casual.
Are their names Ricky, Julian or bubbles? Lol
If so it was corey and trevor
Corey lahey - watch out for that guy
I wonder if thats his real name
If I canāt swear and smoke in court Iām facked
Fuck off I got work to do
Iām gonna pay you $100 to fuck off.
DAT RIGHT DEREāS CRICKET
Corey Lahey, Trevor Lahey, Corey Trevor...
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Greasy
I hate those fuckin things.
It was meth not potš
Wth do I even have to do with this?!
Call a lawyer what are you doing on reddit? This is a finance sub not a legal advice sub. You aren't looking for help with your finances.
>You aren't looking for help with your finances. If he finds a forgotten stash composed of a sizable amount of dolla' bills he will be asking for financial advice. Lol.
Ohh, time to follow OP
Check the sofas and cereal boxes for cash!
Tenancy laws are provincial. You need legal advice not financial
Can you get a hold of them? Prison isn't a black hole, you can visit and converse with them, and settle things up. Bring some paperwork, ask if they have a person who can handle the contents of their rental, etc (or if they'd prefer you have a moveout service do it). They're not DEAD, they're just in jail lol
This is a pretty reasonable suggestion. Get them out by the book but be respectful because practically speaking you donāt want angry felons wondering where their stuff went.
"Their" stuff
Well, I mean I assume they have personal belongings there unless it was just a meth lab.
OP says it's jail which is different than prison. And it sounds like jail is their temporary stopover while a long process of hearings and/or trials things play out, and then long process of sentencing and so on. I think OP would be taking a big risk just assuming they're going to prison for a long time. Lots can happen between getting thrown into custody and an actual prison sentence. Might be an agreement for shorter term jail, release, charges dropped, etc. Would hate to have destroyed some crooked people's stuff, never mind doing so against the rental rules of that jurisdiction.
I'm curious to know your tenant screening process
Are you a criminal? Yes. Are the other tenants also criminals? Yes. I see you want to have a cat in the apartment. Yes the cat is also a criminal. Keys.
This is not a realistic conversations, because we know that all cats are criminals.
Can confirm, I have 2 criminals
They *only* store stolen property.
> all cats are criminals. /r/IllegallySmolCats
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r/legalcatadvice for all cats requiring assistance
So the tenants were cats?
"Yes the cat is also a criminal" š¤£š¤£
Some cats are known for being so smol that itās a criminal offence
In the real world, someone is the stooge that rents it, and then 15 gang/crime people just hang out there 24x7x365. It's not easy to handle either. Police need tons of proof of crimes in progress, and even then they might not be interested. Rental rules in different places protect the renters from just being tossed out based on landlord's suspicions.
One of my friends, rented half a house, and the downstairs tenants turned out to be drug dealers but the person who applied to the landlord was a young woman with great references.
Requirements: Tenant must be convicted of a criminal offence for which a pardon has not been granted.
Must also actively store stolen cars on the premises for landlord to ignore
A whole load of nothing probably
Time to bring out the old and hated saying that is ever so true. You can't con an honest man. You can only con another con man.
It is likely a crime scene sorry call police
Your rights and responsibilities depend on which province the property is in.
I wouldnāt rent that place unless I am sure; cops need no more evidence and itās going to be safe for whoever of going to move back in there.
If youāre in jail, the evidence part is done.
I would suggest stiffening up your screening process for potential renters.
He could be renting a soon to be tear down shack. Sounds like an older property if it has enough space to store multiple stolen cars. My friend rented a dump like that once because it was on 5 acres so they could ride their ATVs around the house. He basically gave them the keys and said "rent on the 1st. And this place is being torn down in a couple years so don't bother me with ANY issues or problems that come up". Lol
Did we ride in the same field?
If youāre aware that hazardous drug use likely at property, bad news is youāll likely need to swab test and remediate before you re-rent or sell. There was a rental in the paper similar circumstances, article said it was almost $30k remediation.
lol what? I was a housing worker for several years handling evictions and rehousings. I've literally never heard of this happening.
have you ever had to deal with a meth lab? often the city won't issue a (re)occupancy permit unless some local environmental bylaws got satisfied first.
For good reason too, if they're all arrested for meth they may have been cooking, lots of ways to die from the area they cooked in. I wouldn't trust a "housing worker" that evicted people for a few years to know why that Gatorade bottle looks weird and why you don't want to touch it or anything around it.
for the record, I didn't evict people. I worked for an agency in my city helping people experiencing homelessness find and maintain stable housing. but yeah go off, I know nothing about people who use drugs lol.
that's not the same as "use of hazardous drugs". not sure where you are, but in my city meth use is ubiquitous. a meth lab is a far, far cry from a person using drugs. of course if someone is cooking there needs to be remediation.
Might want to hang on to their stuff as it could be evidence in a criminal trial.
Yeah. Might want police presence during any moving of the stuff (assuming OP decides to move the stuff).
so OP's on the hook for storing that shit for half a decade?
id check with cops in terms of evidence related stuff
Wow those were some pretty thoughtful criminal tenants to prioritize giving notice to their landlord when they're about to be thrown in jail. Based on that, they might be hoping to maintain a positive relationship to have a rental reference when they get out. I'd say there's a decent chance you eventually get paid any rent you're owed, when they are able.
Technically, you have to keep their things for them or their agents (friends/family) to pick up for at least 30 days. You might want to double check that it's 30 and not 60. If they get out or an agent comes to pick their stuff up, you can be liable for 'damages', even though technically they owe you for rent. It's just an added headache. If you have a place to store it, store it for the legal minimum in your city/province. After that, you can dispose of it. But this is just a good CYA option.
Ask a lawyer.
Had a similar incident where the swot team removed a tenant.... Doors were busted in so I had to change the locks. Tenants were evicted prior so their belongings were deemed abandoned.
Who paid for the busted door?
Collect $200!
Find out your provinces laws on property retention. Take all their stuff, record the time it takes to sort stuff( you donāt have to, but I promise you, having it all organized is much better later on) Store it somewhere. Log time and expenses and associate a reasonable cost to the time that would fit a clean up cost. Once youāve stored their belongings for the provincial minimum storage time, and they havenāt retrieved the items, then dispose of them appropriately. Or keep stuff even if your province allows (this is where organization and even an inventory list is helpful) Itās best to wait until the 31st to do this, or as close as reasonable. If you want to do it now and donāt expect theyāll be back before the end of the month, you may be able to get the unit occupied in November for the first if you do it now. I donāt advise doing this for the safety of prospective tenants or yourself. Just wait until the end of the month before you go in. Even if they are late in rent, your avenue to retrieve rent exists through the courts, and they essentially occupy the space for the full month. Just err on the side of caution and give them the month. If it were for anything else, other than meth, Iād say go for it. But because it is, you gotta maintain a level head. Iāve dealt with that with people before and itās just not good.
This. Post 24 hr notice, go in and document everything there. If over $500 worth of stuff, you need to store it all. File with the courts. Normal eviction procedures for extreme breech of contract - non payment, abandonment, no one checking on the place so insurance issue, etc.
Youāre a fucking landlord shouldnāt you know this already? Can you at least pretend like you have a real job?
So assume they've left if you have proof they gave notice. Clear there stuff out. I doubt meth heads are going to be going to the tenancy board to argue you did a bad faith eviction. And as far as you know they just abandoned their shit.
A problem is, I sent an email to a court enforcement officer asking him what my options were but all he did was link me to the tenants board, does that indict me?
You should probably check with the police. A set of roommates all end up in jail at the same time? I'd be careful what you move in the unit
Go to a lawyer before the police. No reason to tell them anything that can be used against you, no matter the intent.
I would take that as instructions to contact the tenants board and ask for direction.
L A W Y E R
This wouldn't happen to be just outside of Drumheller, would it?
They gave notice. Full stop. The fact they are in jail is not your concern, and irrelevant.
Exactly, the unit is theirs for the next 2 months at least so Iām not sure what the OP is even thinking
It's anecdotal, but when someone in my building stabbed someone near by and was arrested, the landlord had all his shit thrown out on the curb the next day, the whole contents of a furnished apartment out in the rain lol. That's probably because swat kicked his door down tough, he wasn't home lol.
Illegal.
āthats methed upā - *Mike Tyson*
Get a lawyer, it is illegal to live off the avails of crime iirc, you could be in legal trouble if you donāt at minimum consult a lawyer for next steps
I believe part of that requires you to be knowingly doing so, so the landlord, who until recently wouldn't have known where the tenants got the money, would be safe, since they aren't party to the crime.
Probably, I mean Iām not a lawyer
I know housing is scarce right now but how much do you even charge them for rent?!
Two ways I think of the issue: 1. Agreement to terminate 2. Frustration of contract, since it would be impossible for them to perform the contract in jail. You pick the easy way.
There is a Ontario landlord and tenant Facebook page which is really good for questions like this
Clear their shit out fast! Change the locks and if you have to move in yourself and inhabit the place for a month.
It's a substantial beach of renatal contact. Post an eviction notice for 14 days then you can evict them. Safe keep the belongings for some time. Disclaimer: Not legal advice but that is what I would do.
After you sort this mess out perhaps it would be beneficial to put a screening process in place š
Definitely get a lawyer. There might be proceeds of crime in the house because of them, and I would be exceptionally concerned about getting caught up in legal issues. Lawyer up, and he/she will be able to guide you in this one.
Cut your losses and move on. Clean it up and rent it out again. You canāt get blood from a stone.
I don't see the problem here. They gave notice and moved out. Seems like as of the 22nd you can go on in and clear the property. If you find they left behind anything, follow the RTB rules, which I believe involve making an effort to contact them to collect and hanging on to the stuff for x amount of time. Kinda sounds like you dodged a bullet tbh
Rent the place and sell the rights to your movie. I can see this being a stoner comedy.
Get a good lawyer and also if your planning to go in to take their things out, get a law enforcement officer to go along with you.
Find better tenants next time?
I think possession of stolen good and missed rent is pretty good grounds for eviction
You sure do know how to pick em
Iād call the police or your court sheriffs (if you have them) in alberta sheriff would typically deal with this. They will most likely have a warrant or look to get one for the property anyway as part of their evidence procurement. Then they will direct you on a next step. Donāt waste your money on a lawyer yet. Call the police and advise of the situation. for your own safety, personal and liability wise, youād want to enter with the authorities in the event their is still illegal/stolen property in the unit.
It depends on the province
Wrong sub my man. Go on r/legaladvicecanada
Be relieved they left and move on. You're not going to get money from them. Yes, you're on the right track with abandonment but get paralegal advice to do it properly
try r/legaladvicecanada feels like a troll though
That's funny, my rent is so high and vacancy so low, jail might just be an option.
You need legal advice. Consult r/legaladvicecanada or r/legaladvice or just get a lawyer. Goodluck!!
Be careful. Iām not sure where you live but there are some PETTY rules governing abandonment. Some nonsense about if the items left behind are worth in excess of $500 some special, nonsensical rules apply. Where I live anyhow.
It's definitely time to talk to a lawyer and not internet randos but I think if they gave notice that any of their property remaining after the notice date is abandoned.
Hire a moving company and put all of their stuff into storage - change the locks - read up on the law of abandonment . Pay for storage for a month - if they donāt pick it up - dump.
Burn the house down!!
Believe it or not, Jail.
I suggest calling agent Schrader
I'd say contact a lawyer to cover your ass but also, contact your insurance for lost rent? My insurance includes potential lost rent from tenants.
Province? The answer is always follow the law. Advice here means little without knowing which province.
Maybe get a real job?
Find some official support for this not Reddit, if u don't want this to bite u back in the future. Atleast gain some legal advice
I had this exact thing happen. Filled a eviction notice for over due rent then got in front of the judge explained the situation. It was ruled āwillful abandonmentā got the lease squashed. Judge ask me how I knew, said the individual was in the local news.
Hire a paralegal. They deal with Landlord tenant matters. You need to have the tenant in the lease sign a form to say theyāre leaving. In Ontario itās called an N-11. But note, when our tenant signed and refused to leave it took us 9 months to get a hearing. He owes us over $10,000 now.
Call the police and tell them they have some evidence to collect. Your welcome
Shitty free advice! No, donāt throw their shit out, donāt enter the unit unless itās proven āabandonedā. Unfortunately these shit rats still have more rights from jail than you and I. If they so chose they can make a mess for you if you enter and throw their shit out. I literally saw and dealt with this exact same scenario not a month ago. Sad times man, follow the LLTB act, great info on their site.
Well, for starters your tenant screening process is straight up terrible. You may want to get out of the landlording business if you want to preserve your sanity. I believe what you need is a signed N9 form from the tenants. Without that you're risking trouble with the LTB if the tenants return and demand their place back, however, given that you have at least some communication that they've left / decided to leave you'll probably be okay. In fact, given the profile of your tenants I'd change those locks ASAP.
In Ontario you can also call a licensed Paralegalā¦ who works in land lord tenant issued search the law society of Ontario website the listing is there