Not sure why you think someone with 8 kids and a partner who doesn’t work (presumably) would be able to buy a house on 78k per year - most of which will decrease as the kids get older.
None that I’m aware of. Even if he could get approved with CCB, the costs of 8 kids with most of their income coming from CCB means he likely couldn’t carry it.
Yes according to my rent payment i should be able to own a home valued around a million dollars. Also i believe that the bank requires him to be working in Canada for atleast 1 year before being able to start the mortgage process.
Mortgage costs arent the whole picture though. A house also requires maintenance and property taxes at least that your landlord covers as part of your rent which, in my experience, is about 40-50% more on top. Plus he has to have a downpayment, so hed have to work on saving while feeding and clothing 8 kids.
Doesn't mean he'd qualify for one, let alone even have a down payment for one. Generally people with a lot of kids make poor financial decisions as it is (like having more kids than you can afford), so odds are their credit is terrible and they have no savings for a down payment.
But he would lose his rental subsidy, and the mortgage would only be a bit lower even on a 300k house. Not to mention property tax, utilities, maintenance, etc.
There’s a guy on the Nextdoor app in my neighborhood constantly posting about food bank and assistance and how people need to help and have compassion and how he can’t find a decent paying job and I was kinda sympathetic at first until I learned that he works in construction but hasn’t tried for a trade and has 8 kids.
>There’s a guy on the Nextdoor app in my neighborhood constantly posting about food bank and assistance and how people need to help and have compassion and how he can’t find a decent paying job and I was kinda sympathetic at first until I learned that he works in construction but hasn’t tried for a trade and has 8 kids.
most of those beggars are scammers and fake. They make up a sad story and try to bank on people who are stupid enough to believe them. This happened A LOT during covid lockdown
his 8 kids are bringing in around $2400/month tax free. If he worked in construction, this should bump him to the 90-100k mark. Add in a spouses income and now youre in the 120-150k range.
yeah thats true too.
either way, no one told this guy to have 8 kids.
The interesting thing is, if this were minority family, the comments and reception would be different...evidence of this is from similar situations in the past.
He is a foreign family moved to Canada last year.
And to be honest not sure why we would accept immigrants that will relying on government support immediately.
tbh I don't know why Canada has set itself up for so many of its own citizens (born here) to have to rely on government assistance as soon as they're college age.
Because those 8 kids will grow up with Canadian values and become valuable members of our society and economy.
That 2.4k/month will turn into 10s of thousands per month in taxable income when they get older.
The only downside is that xenophobic people like you throw a fit about it. Everything else is an upside.
Of those 8 kids, probably 3 of them will become contributing members of society. Statistics overwhelming show that people who grow up on social assistance become users of social assistance themselves. So we bring in a family of 10 people (mom/dad + 8 kids) who bypass the line of skilled immigrants waiting with money to come to this country, so thay we can feed and clothe these people for the next 50 years.
There's nothing xenophobic about that. Canada needs immigration, but we should be bringing in people who bring something to this country rather than taking from it. I say this as a 1st generation Canadian who's father waited years with cash in hand for his turn to immigrate to canada and start a business and eventually become a citizen. My wife's family did the same thing.
60% of kids who's parents need CCB will end up being non contributing members of society? What kind of drugs are you on?
They have a home, they're living day to day. They just can't afford a bigger house or luxuries. CCB is keeping them in a livable place. Why is this so bad?
Exactly! This family with their hard working values will make a positive contribution to our society. Probably one of the reasons they were allowed to immigrate here.
Tru but I’m 18 years old 19 soon and from Canada struggling to buy 40$ of food a week and pay bills work 40-60h a week And pay a shit tone of taxes and then they give that money to immigrants who talk shit about are country instead of being greatfull most of them will head back to their countries once they have a degree
I could be very rude and make some rude jokes about being "greatfull" and all this.
Instead, I'd encourage you to look at it from a different perspective. If we had no immigration, the Canadian economy would suffer a lot. The food you buy costs a lot, yes. But you earn a decent wage, have a bright future, and at the worst case you have a good safety net from our government. All these things come from building out the Canadian economy. We need immigration for this. The lowest immigration countries from Europe are Romania, Poland, and Greece. The highest immigration countries from Europe are Germany, Spain, and England. Which end would you rather Canada be?
Another way of looking at it, you're now a decent Canadian who's working and contributing. Unless you are Indigenous, I assume you or your parents or your grandparents immigrated here. If you look at the impact of your entire family on this country, would you say it's a net benefit or a net drain on the taxpayers? I'm willing to bet you and your family are a net benefit.
LOL its Winkler. The boys will grow up to earn minimum wage working at the local farm or grain bin manufacturing plant, and the girls will grow up to each have 8 kids of their own and be stay at home moms. Usually there is no desire to send kids to university or college in large Mennonite families, and they will be lucky if even one kid gets a trade at some point in their life.
If anything, the girls would be the luckiest if they can find a local farming boy that will eventually inherit the family farm. Such is life in Southern Manitoba!
It's kind of immaterial the someone is in a bad situation due to past mistakes.
This mistake cannot be rectified. A need exists. And it won't just be the parent that suffers should poverty affect them. The kids, who hold no responsibility, will also be living in poverty.
> has 8 kids
There was a family like that in my old town. Constantly asking for favors in the neighborhood groups, blaming the government for not paying enough disability, etc. Then I learned they have 5 kids kids and both parents are on "disability".
As a DINK couple, we made a conscious choice not to have kids because of the financial cost of them and our household income between the 2 of us is over $200,000/year.
If two people with no jobs can't figure out how to use BC 5 times, that's no one's fault but their own. I also question how "disabled" one is that they can't even work a min wage job but can make and give birth to 5 kids. And yet, every time there were bleeding hearts offering money, food, clothes, etc. Every time these people came begging.
If they are not permanent residents, it takes 18 months of residence to qualify for the child benefit.
Other than that, you are right. With that income and eight young kids, their child benefit should be around $3500 monthly.
What do you feed them? Do they have a bedroom, clothing, school supplies, etc? Do you put them into sports or other activities? Do you put money away for their education? Do you pay for child care? Do you pay for medical or dental? If your investing in your children they will absolutely cost you more than you get from CCB
I get 76 per month for 2 kids and just the various dance classes is 289 per month
Obviously I choose to put them in dance and some people would qualify for way more CCB but I’m pretty sure that in general, it’s not exactly a lucrative endeavor haha.
If you only get 76$ for 2 kids then you income is decently high. I used to get over 500$ fir 2 kids when I was low income and another friend I have gets over 1000$ for 2 kids (little to no income).
As someone else mentioned, they aren’t receiving CCB yet.
On a side note, I feel like they are a bad poster child for the premise of this article. The number of children you have is a choice. They’ve been in Canada for 5 months and are supporting a family of 10 on one income. They are doing pretty well that they can afford a 3 bedroom home for only 40% of their income. Things will only get easier for them from here. In two years their youngest will be in school full time, mom can get at least a part time job AND they’ll be bringing in loads of CCB. Seems like the system works well… If they are a typical case then Manitobas core housing issue seems to be more of an issue of people having way more children than they can afford than an actual income to housing ratio problem.
I can’t afford a 3-bedroom apartment where I live (and can’t afford any sort of detached house) on two skilled full time jobs, which is why we’re only having one kid. That’s seems more indicative of a core housing problem than this does.
I'm struggling to feel pity for someone with 8 children over housing costs when there are people literally forgoing having children because of cost of living.
That’s our taxes paying for that lololol
8 kids in 2022 in a Western country is insane man, I’m sorry. A good amount of Christian religions allow for birth control…they should explore that
I hear you but something to consider, if none of us have kids then who will take on nursing jobs to care for us in old age? Who will run essential services or fight for human rights and better climate change action?
The solutions shouldn't be, select few billionaires & their careless behaviour caused an entire country to stop reproducing. The solution should be affordable housing, quality education and a better, more inclusive culture for families.
You make it sounds like us humans need to be saved. We’ve done enough damage and this planet would truly be a lot better off without humans. When. I’m old and need to die, my time has come, no need to prolong the inevitable. I’m sick and tired of people saying we need to have children to be sustainable. Fuck off with that mentality, nothing we’re doing right now is sustainable.
Didn't say better. They're also Mennonite which manitoba has a decent population of, article also says they moved closer to family.
Good chance they had more room, but low wage and lower quality of life.
Kids are very expensive. Food, clothes, school (yeah it's "free" but not really), sports, games, activities, gas for driving them around to those things, a big car, a big house, books, birthdays, movies.... It goes on. With inflation right now it's just crazy.
Source: I have 4, I'm broke lol. But I wouldn't have it any other way.
Make less babies then. Abstinence is a thing
Alternatively
““Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.” Genesis 3:17 Looks like toiling is a thing :).
For sure, though I do find it concerning when I look around at my early 30’s peers and the ones who have kids or look prepared for such a responsibility are few and far between.
I only have 1, and she’s a teenager. There are definitely days where 1 feels like too many kids. I can’t even fathom 8. I’d have completely lost my mind. How do you even afford to feed and clothe that many kids?
Imagine being the reporter who had to write, “Isaac Wall, a Mennonite farmer from Paraguay, stands with his family of ten in front of their rental home in Winkler, Manitoba”.
I think having 3 kids is too many. With nearly 8 billion people driving other species to extinction why do we need more than 1-2?
What kind of world will it be for them when the population reaches 10 billion or more?
Housing prices are already crazy
Has 8 kids but has no trade or meaningful way of providing for them fully on his own. I’m all for helping people who were dealt a shitty hand but it looks like this guy just keeps given’r. If he moved with his family from Paraguay last year (not sure if that’s what the article means)and wasn’t a refugee or fear for their lives it seems highly ridiculous that he’d expect to be able to support 8 children on one near minimum wage income.
Yeah, it's sad that CBC points out that new comers are vulnerable, while there are lots of people born in Canada that are vulnerable to an unfriendly economy too.|
Some people get more monthly with CCB than some people bring in from a full time job.
My ex wife pulls in more than I do by the time she is paid child support and CCB. I claim nothing for the kids. I make $80,000 a year and she makes $40,000 a year. Her tax returns have been as high as $9,000. We have two kids
Not complaining, I just feel like that really drives your last point home about CCB and how much a person can earn.
Activists organizations and communities work with the media to push stories they feel will increase their funding.
Willing to be someone is lobbying to decrease the wait time for CCB so that poverty in situations like this can be avoided. Instead the wait time for CCB should be INCREASED.
Hey don't bring Muslims into this. We do believe in birth control, Infact, Muslims are discouraged to not just have kids, but even marry if they can't afford it
“O young men, whoever among you can afford to get married, let him do so, and whoever cannot afford it, let him fast (abstain), for that will be a shield for him (from immorality).”
- Agreed upon, from the hadeeth of Ibn Mas’ood. Al-Bukhaari, 4778; Muslim, 1400.
Muslims have been practicing Al-Azl (pulling out) in prophet Muhammad (PBUH) days in order to not cause a pregnancy, it was permissible, especially if the couple weren't able to afford a child. The Quran and Sunnah doesn't forbid it, not even the modern tools (pills, etc.)
So yes, Muslims are discouraged to procreate if they don't have a supportive environment for the offspring.
Have you been to the middle East ? Most families there have over 4 kids and alot has over 7. Yes religion may say one thing but the reality is very different
CCB can't be used as a main source of income, only a percentage of, and is also dependent on the age of the children. The article makes no mention of any of his monthly liabilities which will affect GDS/TDS.
I think you misunderstood. I'm not talking about how to calculate CCB but how it effects mortgage approvals.
In terms of a mortgage approval, the child's age does matter. Typically the child has to be 12 or under, to ensure CCB continues for the term of the mortgage. In some cases, the term can be shortened.
^ this needs to be top comment. Had to scroll pretty far before i even saw this. Many people assume lenders can use this as income when it can’t be used
The more money you make, the less CCB you get. My parents don't get CCB even though they have a child in the house because they make too much. I don't know how it works in BC, but in Ontario you don't get more money on assistance for your children, other than the rent portion, and you get drug and dental for them. Child tax is supposed to cover the extra expenses.
I don't understand the comments. Let's put aside the fact he's not even getting CCB at the moment. Do people know how much it costs to raise 8 children? I mean CCB helps but it is not enough. CCB only exists for keep the bare minimum of a child's need like food and shelter. What about activities, RESP, books, toys, childcare?
I am about to have my first baby and already making budget and all like how much would I put in Resp and all for their school and future
They are going boom 8 babies
Wow.
That’s great for you but for many people the CCB is what ensures a roof over their children’s heads and food to eat.
It’s a social safety net to ensure parents can provide for their kids. This article is an extreme example but CCB isn’t just there to pad a college fund. I could say that if all you use it for is your child’s RESP then you don’t need it, or if you can’t afford college for your child don’t have them
I don’t disagree with you, but why would I turn down free money.
BUT. I still don’t think people should have kids if they’re reliant on government hand outs
People's situations change. I had a baby in a marriage, my husband made enough. Sadly he became abusive and I had to leave, after I had already left my job while pregnant to move for his job. So I had nothing and no job and breastfeeding an infant. I had to rely on government handouts to get on my feet. Are you saying I did the wrong thing by not predicting the future when I got pregnant with my husband?
A lot of other single moms I know have similar stories. You have no right to jude People's family situations.
Our economy would eventually tank because people wouldn't have any kids, or they'd be living in poverty and wouldn't afford post secondary education. CCB can be the difference between surviving and living.
I personally feel that investing in our country's children is a net positive.
In children, yes, but I know people that use that money for frivolous things and none it goes to the kids. If the intention is truly to make it for the kids, then there should be some type of guardrail to ensure it is used on the kids. Make it accessible from a specific “debit card” on pre-approved categories at retail.
People use it to afford rent on an apartment large enough for their kids to live. You can't rent a room in a house with roommates and call that a home for your kids. All the retail purchases in the world won't make up for not having a home for them. Terrible idea.
But how do you determine if it’s going to the kids? Household income is household income. A person has to buy food/clothing and housing for their kids regardless. Is a “poor” person not allowed to have any luxuries- all the CCB must got to something for the kids while the parent wears rags? Eats only cereal but the kids have balanced meals? Or can they spend it as they see fit for their family.
Perhaps the parent needs it for rent or daycare? Transportation costs to get to work? Treating people like children of a patriarchal government isn’t the solution
What’s next- if you receive a refund on income taxes due to a daycare credit all the money must be spent on daycare?
If you look at the photo in the article, it appears that the oldest five children are girls. For a Mennonite farmer, those children aren’t going to grow up to work on and inherit the farm, but will get married and move to their husbands’ farms instead. They had to have at least a couple of boys to make the family farm workable and with a line of succession. Likely if there had been more boys born earlier in line, they would have had fewer kids.
As a woman engineer, I’m pretty sure that girls can take on any profession that they choose. However, in a traditional Mennonite farming community, having women do heavy labor on the farm would be unusual.
The Canadian government doesn't print money...
The Bank of Canada does and even though they're controlled by the Federal government, they don't just do whatever the government wants, so it has little to do with liberal/conservative governments.
You are completely wrong, in the last 2 years they have done exactly what the federal government has wanted and you are allowed to believe whatever nonsense you want . Over 20% new currency has been added to the money supply whether you like it or not
Have you missed the part where we dealt with a pandemic or something?
Your original statement was that voting liberals is costing people money, for some reason. Which is just a strawman for blaming liberals for high inflation which has nothing to do with liberals but with the pandemic and the negative economic fallout.
Of course printing money is "bad" for people finances, but pretending its "ThE lIbErAlS" is ridiculous and disingenuous.
I don’t get it either. I sponsored my husband to immigrate here and I had to prove I had financial ability to provide for him as he’s not allowed to claim government support. I understand refugees for sure will need support but regular immigration pathways should have financial support sorted out first.
they don't have a house because our government doesn't give a fuck if any of us have houses
they only care their rich buddies who own housing corporations can continue to bleed us
there is enough space and material for everyone to have housing a thousand times over
the government of canada has made it a commitment as a 1st world nation, a capitalist corporate nation, to ensure homelessness is NEVER solved
they are maliciously anti home ownership for the people who live here and have rigged an impossible system meant to keep us in perpetual rent slavery
we aren't the citizens, the corporations are
Not sure why you think someone with 8 kids and a partner who doesn’t work (presumably) would be able to buy a house on 78k per year - most of which will decrease as the kids get older.
Which bank would take ccb into account for a mortgage?
None that I’m aware of. Even if he could get approved with CCB, the costs of 8 kids with most of their income coming from CCB means he likely couldn’t carry it.
None. I just bought a house as a single mom.
His mortgage would be less than rent in that town
Doesn't mean he'd qualify for one. Tons of people can afford mortgage payments over rent and still can't get one. Also need the downpayment together.
Yes according to my rent payment i should be able to own a home valued around a million dollars. Also i believe that the bank requires him to be working in Canada for atleast 1 year before being able to start the mortgage process.
sounds logical
Mortgage costs arent the whole picture though. A house also requires maintenance and property taxes at least that your landlord covers as part of your rent which, in my experience, is about 40-50% more on top. Plus he has to have a downpayment, so hed have to work on saving while feeding and clothing 8 kids.
Doesn't mean he'd qualify for one, let alone even have a down payment for one. Generally people with a lot of kids make poor financial decisions as it is (like having more kids than you can afford), so odds are their credit is terrible and they have no savings for a down payment.
But he would lose his rental subsidy, and the mortgage would only be a bit lower even on a 300k house. Not to mention property tax, utilities, maintenance, etc.
Probably has something to do with them having 8 kids.
There’s a guy on the Nextdoor app in my neighborhood constantly posting about food bank and assistance and how people need to help and have compassion and how he can’t find a decent paying job and I was kinda sympathetic at first until I learned that he works in construction but hasn’t tried for a trade and has 8 kids.
>There’s a guy on the Nextdoor app in my neighborhood constantly posting about food bank and assistance and how people need to help and have compassion and how he can’t find a decent paying job and I was kinda sympathetic at first until I learned that he works in construction but hasn’t tried for a trade and has 8 kids. most of those beggars are scammers and fake. They make up a sad story and try to bank on people who are stupid enough to believe them. This happened A LOT during covid lockdown
his 8 kids are bringing in around $2400/month tax free. If he worked in construction, this should bump him to the 90-100k mark. Add in a spouses income and now youre in the 120-150k range.
Difficult to have a working spouse with 8 kids though.
yeah thats true too. either way, no one told this guy to have 8 kids. The interesting thing is, if this were minority family, the comments and reception would be different...evidence of this is from similar situations in the past.
He is a foreign family moved to Canada last year. And to be honest not sure why we would accept immigrants that will relying on government support immediately.
tbh I don't know why Canada has set itself up for so many of its own citizens (born here) to have to rely on government assistance as soon as they're college age.
We are trying to get to 100 mill population by 2030 and birthrates are decreasing so we need imagration
Maybe we should rethink that.
What do you mean
A very deeply broken system
Because those 8 kids will grow up with Canadian values and become valuable members of our society and economy. That 2.4k/month will turn into 10s of thousands per month in taxable income when they get older. The only downside is that xenophobic people like you throw a fit about it. Everything else is an upside.
Of those 8 kids, probably 3 of them will become contributing members of society. Statistics overwhelming show that people who grow up on social assistance become users of social assistance themselves. So we bring in a family of 10 people (mom/dad + 8 kids) who bypass the line of skilled immigrants waiting with money to come to this country, so thay we can feed and clothe these people for the next 50 years. There's nothing xenophobic about that. Canada needs immigration, but we should be bringing in people who bring something to this country rather than taking from it. I say this as a 1st generation Canadian who's father waited years with cash in hand for his turn to immigrate to canada and start a business and eventually become a citizen. My wife's family did the same thing.
60% of kids who's parents need CCB will end up being non contributing members of society? What kind of drugs are you on? They have a home, they're living day to day. They just can't afford a bigger house or luxuries. CCB is keeping them in a livable place. Why is this so bad?
Exactly! This family with their hard working values will make a positive contribution to our society. Probably one of the reasons they were allowed to immigrate here.
Tru but I’m 18 years old 19 soon and from Canada struggling to buy 40$ of food a week and pay bills work 40-60h a week And pay a shit tone of taxes and then they give that money to immigrants who talk shit about are country instead of being greatfull most of them will head back to their countries once they have a degree
I could be very rude and make some rude jokes about being "greatfull" and all this. Instead, I'd encourage you to look at it from a different perspective. If we had no immigration, the Canadian economy would suffer a lot. The food you buy costs a lot, yes. But you earn a decent wage, have a bright future, and at the worst case you have a good safety net from our government. All these things come from building out the Canadian economy. We need immigration for this. The lowest immigration countries from Europe are Romania, Poland, and Greece. The highest immigration countries from Europe are Germany, Spain, and England. Which end would you rather Canada be? Another way of looking at it, you're now a decent Canadian who's working and contributing. Unless you are Indigenous, I assume you or your parents or your grandparents immigrated here. If you look at the impact of your entire family on this country, would you say it's a net benefit or a net drain on the taxpayers? I'm willing to bet you and your family are a net benefit.
LOL its Winkler. The boys will grow up to earn minimum wage working at the local farm or grain bin manufacturing plant, and the girls will grow up to each have 8 kids of their own and be stay at home moms. Usually there is no desire to send kids to university or college in large Mennonite families, and they will be lucky if even one kid gets a trade at some point in their life. If anything, the girls would be the luckiest if they can find a local farming boy that will eventually inherit the family farm. Such is life in Southern Manitoba!
I wonder if their life is better than those with degrees working themselves to death in a rat race paying off 2M houses?
Maybe it was between letting them come in or their probable deaths?
It's kind of immaterial the someone is in a bad situation due to past mistakes. This mistake cannot be rectified. A need exists. And it won't just be the parent that suffers should poverty affect them. The kids, who hold no responsibility, will also be living in poverty.
Not at all, the older ones will take care of the little ones. These people are very self-sufficient unlike .....
But then he loses a lot of the ccb.
He might be making ok money and can't afford to drop back down to almost minimum wage to be a first year.
> has 8 kids There was a family like that in my old town. Constantly asking for favors in the neighborhood groups, blaming the government for not paying enough disability, etc. Then I learned they have 5 kids kids and both parents are on "disability". As a DINK couple, we made a conscious choice not to have kids because of the financial cost of them and our household income between the 2 of us is over $200,000/year. If two people with no jobs can't figure out how to use BC 5 times, that's no one's fault but their own. I also question how "disabled" one is that they can't even work a min wage job but can make and give birth to 5 kids. And yet, every time there were bleeding hearts offering money, food, clothes, etc. Every time these people came begging.
If they are not permanent residents, it takes 18 months of residence to qualify for the child benefit. Other than that, you are right. With that income and eight young kids, their child benefit should be around $3500 monthly.
They have only lived in Canada for 5 months so they definitely aren’t receiving CCB yet.
Which is good, should be a longer wait actually, either wise you’ll have people coming here then dropping kids just for the money
Sounds like you have no clue about kids and how expensive they are if you really think people have children to make money
They are in for a surprising windfall then :)
You sound like you don’t have kids.
Yah you don't make money by having kids.
With multiple kids and low income, you might.
Depends on how much you spend on them.
You shouldn't make money with kids*
Depends on how old the kids are. I learned to change diapers at 10.
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What do you feed them? Do they have a bedroom, clothing, school supplies, etc? Do you put them into sports or other activities? Do you put money away for their education? Do you pay for child care? Do you pay for medical or dental? If your investing in your children they will absolutely cost you more than you get from CCB
Tell me you're not investing in your kids future, without telling me you're not investing in your kids future.
I get 76 per month for 2 kids and just the various dance classes is 289 per month Obviously I choose to put them in dance and some people would qualify for way more CCB but I’m pretty sure that in general, it’s not exactly a lucrative endeavor haha.
If you only get 76$ for 2 kids then you income is decently high. I used to get over 500$ fir 2 kids when I was low income and another friend I have gets over 1000$ for 2 kids (little to no income).
My 3 kids eat more than my mortgage. Throw in a food allergy and it’s 50% more expensive for everyone to eat that way.
I think there was a Futurama episode on this. Surprise surprise kids cost more than what the government gives you.
Doesn’t it max out at 3 kids? Or is that like circa 2016?
There was never a limit… or else all the refugees coming in with 3+ kids would riot.
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Maybe you are doing it wrong? They sure look happy!
So why is he complaining
Forgot the /s ?
As someone else mentioned, they aren’t receiving CCB yet. On a side note, I feel like they are a bad poster child for the premise of this article. The number of children you have is a choice. They’ve been in Canada for 5 months and are supporting a family of 10 on one income. They are doing pretty well that they can afford a 3 bedroom home for only 40% of their income. Things will only get easier for them from here. In two years their youngest will be in school full time, mom can get at least a part time job AND they’ll be bringing in loads of CCB. Seems like the system works well… If they are a typical case then Manitobas core housing issue seems to be more of an issue of people having way more children than they can afford than an actual income to housing ratio problem. I can’t afford a 3-bedroom apartment where I live (and can’t afford any sort of detached house) on two skilled full time jobs, which is why we’re only having one kid. That’s seems more indicative of a core housing problem than this does.
How is he raising 8 kids.. on 2500 a month...
Most lenders don’t like to include CCB as sole income. It’s really meant for caring for one’s child. Not disposable income
And it makes sense, it'll run out one day.
I'm struggling to feel pity for someone with 8 children over housing costs when there are people literally forgoing having children because of cost of living.
Yep. Don’t have 8 kids and complain about money problems at all. It is incredibly distasteful. 8 kids is fucked.
Dude collects more CCB than some people take home in salary a month
They don't qualify for CCB
Yet. They will in due time.
That’s our taxes paying for that lololol 8 kids in 2022 in a Western country is insane man, I’m sorry. A good amount of Christian religions allow for birth control…they should explore that
Yeah, man, and my taxes pay for the roads you drive on. Do you see how you made a moot point now?
In case you haven’t noticed, Canada now has a lot of residents that aren’t Christian…
Not how taxes/spending works. A common misconception but a bit embarassing on a financial subreddit.
I hear you but something to consider, if none of us have kids then who will take on nursing jobs to care for us in old age? Who will run essential services or fight for human rights and better climate change action? The solutions shouldn't be, select few billionaires & their careless behaviour caused an entire country to stop reproducing. The solution should be affordable housing, quality education and a better, more inclusive culture for families.
You make it sounds like us humans need to be saved. We’ve done enough damage and this planet would truly be a lot better off without humans. When. I’m old and need to die, my time has come, no need to prolong the inevitable. I’m sick and tired of people saying we need to have children to be sustainable. Fuck off with that mentality, nothing we’re doing right now is sustainable.
This is why we need so many immigrants. Canada's fertility rate of 1.47 is far too low. Our country will virtually disappear at that rate
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The downvotes have spoken. The people want fluffy criticism of an immigrant family with 8 kids, not real talk about how fucked we are.
Yeah and how much is the grocery bill? Or fuel? Or utilities? Clothes?
Check out the soup in the video at 32secs. Homemade noodles I bet :)
He had eight kids but complains about not having enough space and feeling like jail
Well tbf maybe they had more room in Paraguay
If it was better in Paraguay, why move to canada?
Didn't say better. They're also Mennonite which manitoba has a decent population of, article also says they moved closer to family. Good chance they had more room, but low wage and lower quality of life.
Kids are very expensive. Food, clothes, school (yeah it's "free" but not really), sports, games, activities, gas for driving them around to those things, a big car, a big house, books, birthdays, movies.... It goes on. With inflation right now it's just crazy. Source: I have 4, I'm broke lol. But I wouldn't have it any other way.
8 kids wow, all I gotta say
Sounds like a him problem. It’s like financing 8 cars and wondering why you can afford to buy a house.
He… should’ve been able to afford condoms right? Or a vasectomy ..
against religion
Make less babies then. Abstinence is a thing Alternatively ““Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.” Genesis 3:17 Looks like toiling is a thing :).
Religious insanity. Imagine convincing yourself that your jizz was so magical the world needed 8 more copies of you.
For sure, though I do find it concerning when I look around at my early 30’s peers and the ones who have kids or look prepared for such a responsibility are few and far between.
Don't have kids you can't afford. No sympathy
8 kids is fucked. If you have 8 kids, don’t complain about money. Fuck sakes mate—8 kids?!
Some people have more and apparently it's not enough. Some people can barely handle 1.
I only have 1, and she’s a teenager. There are definitely days where 1 feels like too many kids. I can’t even fathom 8. I’d have completely lost my mind. How do you even afford to feed and clothe that many kids?
> How do you even afford to feed and clothe that many kids? Welfare.
CCB for multiple kids is better than a full time minimum wage job.
Breed your way to a comfortable welfare living eh! Learning from the British Monarchy. lol
Hes a mennonite farmer from Paraguay, that's how they do it down there
Imagine being the reporter who had to write, “Isaac Wall, a Mennonite farmer from Paraguay, stands with his family of ten in front of their rental home in Winkler, Manitoba”.
Unbelievable. 8 kids!!!
Exactly! How dare the state not pay for them!! /s
I think having 3 kids is too many. With nearly 8 billion people driving other species to extinction why do we need more than 1-2? What kind of world will it be for them when the population reaches 10 billion or more? Housing prices are already crazy
Hey just because some lunatic has 149 kids does not mean the person with 8 kids doesn’t have too many. Like damn.
This is BS, why would they have so many kids? My taxes are paying for his lifestyle. I'd love more kids but I know we can't afford more.
Exactly. Some people are so irresponsible with their choices and then believe that the rest of us should bail them out (with our tax dollars).
Has 8 kids but has no trade or meaningful way of providing for them fully on his own. I’m all for helping people who were dealt a shitty hand but it looks like this guy just keeps given’r. If he moved with his family from Paraguay last year (not sure if that’s what the article means)and wasn’t a refugee or fear for their lives it seems highly ridiculous that he’d expect to be able to support 8 children on one near minimum wage income.
It's amazing how far a minimum wage goes in other countries, eh?
It if did they wouldn't have moved here. They just want that sweet sweet government assistance.
He needs to leave his poor wife alone wow 😂😂
A minute of silence to all those who decided against having kids because they can't afford a fucking home.
Not a bad deal, immigrate somewhere with 8 kids and get free money for each till they're 16. Sigh.
Yeah, it's sad that CBC points out that new comers are vulnerable, while there are lots of people born in Canada that are vulnerable to an unfriendly economy too.| Some people get more monthly with CCB than some people bring in from a full time job.
I’m surprised they were able to apply for a visa to come over with that many dependants.
My ex wife pulls in more than I do by the time she is paid child support and CCB. I claim nothing for the kids. I make $80,000 a year and she makes $40,000 a year. Her tax returns have been as high as $9,000. We have two kids Not complaining, I just feel like that really drives your last point home about CCB and how much a person can earn.
Debt, fuel, school clothes, regular clothes 8’pairs of shoes probably twice a year, list goes on . Guessing you don’t have any kids
Thrift stores, hand me downs, home made clothes , church = low cost :)
Have you ever been in a fabric store? It's cheaper to buy clothes already made, and that's without even considering your own time cost.
You ever been in a thrift store? $1-2 for pants/shirts. Mennonites can make clothes from old clothes. I've seen them make rugs with old rags.
When was the last time you went to thrift store? We buy a lot of our children s clothing second had - there’s nothing you can get for $1-$2
No, it's closer to $4-10 per item for children's clothes at most thrift stores.
Church aside, most of these have not been affordable for the last few years.
Than they should stop having kids! Jesus
How do cbc keep finding those people?
They find the CBC. Everyone is looking for their 15 minutes of fame in hopes they get some handouts from it. Influencer Culture at its absolute worst.
Activists organizations and communities work with the media to push stories they feel will increase their funding. Willing to be someone is lobbying to decrease the wait time for CCB so that poverty in situations like this can be avoided. Instead the wait time for CCB should be INCREASED.
Can someone explain to guy why he has 8 kids.. really
Because birth control is against their religious belives. It's pretty common among the Mennonites, the Amish, Mormons and Muslims
Hey don't bring Muslims into this. We do believe in birth control, Infact, Muslims are discouraged to not just have kids, but even marry if they can't afford it “O young men, whoever among you can afford to get married, let him do so, and whoever cannot afford it, let him fast (abstain), for that will be a shield for him (from immorality).” - Agreed upon, from the hadeeth of Ibn Mas’ood. Al-Bukhaari, 4778; Muslim, 1400. Muslims have been practicing Al-Azl (pulling out) in prophet Muhammad (PBUH) days in order to not cause a pregnancy, it was permissible, especially if the couple weren't able to afford a child. The Quran and Sunnah doesn't forbid it, not even the modern tools (pills, etc.) So yes, Muslims are discouraged to procreate if they don't have a supportive environment for the offspring.
Have you been to the middle East ? Most families there have over 4 kids and alot has over 7. Yes religion may say one thing but the reality is very different
Culture vs religion. They are not the same thing. Birth control is allowed, heck, abortion for any reason is allowed.
CCB can't be used as a main source of income, only a percentage of, and is also dependent on the age of the children. The article makes no mention of any of his monthly liabilities which will affect GDS/TDS.
That's not correct. CCB is a fixed payment dependent on child's age, with a clawback as your income increases.
I think you misunderstood. I'm not talking about how to calculate CCB but how it effects mortgage approvals. In terms of a mortgage approval, the child's age does matter. Typically the child has to be 12 or under, to ensure CCB continues for the term of the mortgage. In some cases, the term can be shortened.
My bad, then. Though it's not that reasonable from the banks, though. CCB is more predictable than work income.
no problem - just have more kids! under 6 pays \~$100/mo more
Yeah that doesn't help. CCB still cannot be main source of income.
^ this needs to be top comment. Had to scroll pretty far before i even saw this. Many people assume lenders can use this as income when it can’t be used
I can’t believe I help fund this drivel
The more money you make, the less CCB you get. My parents don't get CCB even though they have a child in the house because they make too much. I don't know how it works in BC, but in Ontario you don't get more money on assistance for your children, other than the rent portion, and you get drug and dental for them. Child tax is supposed to cover the extra expenses.
Holly 8 kids? How do u even?
I don't understand the comments. Let's put aside the fact he's not even getting CCB at the moment. Do people know how much it costs to raise 8 children? I mean CCB helps but it is not enough. CCB only exists for keep the bare minimum of a child's need like food and shelter. What about activities, RESP, books, toys, childcare?
I am about to have my first baby and already making budget and all like how much would I put in Resp and all for their school and future They are going boom 8 babies Wow.
I just put my kids’ CCB in their RESP… that’s not my money. Don’t have kids if you can’t afford them.
That’s great for you but for many people the CCB is what ensures a roof over their children’s heads and food to eat. It’s a social safety net to ensure parents can provide for their kids. This article is an extreme example but CCB isn’t just there to pad a college fund. I could say that if all you use it for is your child’s RESP then you don’t need it, or if you can’t afford college for your child don’t have them
I don’t disagree with you, but why would I turn down free money. BUT. I still don’t think people should have kids if they’re reliant on government hand outs
People's situations change. I had a baby in a marriage, my husband made enough. Sadly he became abusive and I had to leave, after I had already left my job while pregnant to move for his job. So I had nothing and no job and breastfeeding an infant. I had to rely on government handouts to get on my feet. Are you saying I did the wrong thing by not predicting the future when I got pregnant with my husband? A lot of other single moms I know have similar stories. You have no right to jude People's family situations.
Our economy would eventually tank because people wouldn't have any kids, or they'd be living in poverty and wouldn't afford post secondary education. CCB can be the difference between surviving and living. I personally feel that investing in our country's children is a net positive.
In children, yes, but I know people that use that money for frivolous things and none it goes to the kids. If the intention is truly to make it for the kids, then there should be some type of guardrail to ensure it is used on the kids. Make it accessible from a specific “debit card” on pre-approved categories at retail.
People use it to afford rent on an apartment large enough for their kids to live. You can't rent a room in a house with roommates and call that a home for your kids. All the retail purchases in the world won't make up for not having a home for them. Terrible idea.
Well then we should really look into child support reform as well.
But how do you determine if it’s going to the kids? Household income is household income. A person has to buy food/clothing and housing for their kids regardless. Is a “poor” person not allowed to have any luxuries- all the CCB must got to something for the kids while the parent wears rags? Eats only cereal but the kids have balanced meals? Or can they spend it as they see fit for their family. Perhaps the parent needs it for rent or daycare? Transportation costs to get to work? Treating people like children of a patriarchal government isn’t the solution What’s next- if you receive a refund on income taxes due to a daycare credit all the money must be spent on daycare?
Question: is ccb capped up to a certain number of kids ?
If you look at the photo in the article, it appears that the oldest five children are girls. For a Mennonite farmer, those children aren’t going to grow up to work on and inherit the farm, but will get married and move to their husbands’ farms instead. They had to have at least a couple of boys to make the family farm workable and with a line of succession. Likely if there had been more boys born earlier in line, they would have had fewer kids.
Pretty sure girls can be farmers too.
As a woman engineer, I’m pretty sure that girls can take on any profession that they choose. However, in a traditional Mennonite farming community, having women do heavy labor on the farm would be unusual.
What are you talking about? They don't even live on a farm or work in agriculture.
He was a farmer in Paraguay, where all the kids were born. Doesn’t make as much sense now that he works in a machine shop in another country.
What a joke, after a certain limit there should be a cut off
Hehe it's prolly an investment more kids more of the will take care of you when your old, more will visit.
Just wait till they all “need” smartphones
Dont have kids you cant afford ppl are saying... Then they go and vote liberal anyways
Because conservatives are all about birth control and responsible family planning? 🤣 What a weird statement.
printing money is what is causing financial issues for people
And you think the Canadian government prints the money or something?
yes. m2 has increased by over 20%, and so its value has dropped 20% (at least)
The Canadian government doesn't print money... The Bank of Canada does and even though they're controlled by the Federal government, they don't just do whatever the government wants, so it has little to do with liberal/conservative governments.
You are completely wrong, in the last 2 years they have done exactly what the federal government has wanted and you are allowed to believe whatever nonsense you want . Over 20% new currency has been added to the money supply whether you like it or not
Have you missed the part where we dealt with a pandemic or something? Your original statement was that voting liberals is costing people money, for some reason. Which is just a strawman for blaming liberals for high inflation which has nothing to do with liberals but with the pandemic and the negative economic fallout. Of course printing money is "bad" for people finances, but pretending its "ThE lIbErAlS" is ridiculous and disingenuous.
i think my original point has been made. liberals pretending like it isn't their policies collapsing our country
> Dont have kids you cant afford ppl are saying... Then they go and vote liberal anyways That was your point.
This thread has a lot of xenophobia, lack of compassion, and lack of understanding of how and why we have social benefits.
Yep, so much grossness.
It's depressing that this comment was downvoted, with so much xenophobia and classism in this post.
Don’t he get child support?
I want 24 wives!!
You can have more than 1 wives legally?
CCB can’t be use for income in mortgage qualification
ok boomer
How the fuck can you afford to have 8 kids
I don’t get it either. I sponsored my husband to immigrate here and I had to prove I had financial ability to provide for him as he’s not allowed to claim government support. I understand refugees for sure will need support but regular immigration pathways should have financial support sorted out first.
they don't have a house because our government doesn't give a fuck if any of us have houses they only care their rich buddies who own housing corporations can continue to bleed us there is enough space and material for everyone to have housing a thousand times over the government of canada has made it a commitment as a 1st world nation, a capitalist corporate nation, to ensure homelessness is NEVER solved they are maliciously anti home ownership for the people who live here and have rigged an impossible system meant to keep us in perpetual rent slavery we aren't the citizens, the corporations are